Busted, Rejected........Screwed

[Samantha X]

Hey y’all. I’m brand new to this forum. I have only started posting here in the last day or so, but I have been a faithful reader of all your comments for about 4 years now. I appreciate the bond I feel to all of you as you have shared your thoughts openly and candidly. I never felt the need to talk to anyone about my desire to crossdress until now. I was content to just keep my little hobby quiet and live the life of the closet crossdresser, keeping the secret from wife through 12 years of marriage. Well that worked great until a couple of weeks ago when the wheels fell off. Now I just need a place to vent my feelings. I truly have no one to talk to about this. This post might be a little long so be forewarned. I’m not looking for sympathy, I just thought that writing my thoughts might be somewhat cathartic and I might feel a little peace amidst my turmoil.

I should’ve known when my wife called to say we needed to talk that I was in trouble. I have been very careful over the years as I looked on the web at sites like this one-careful to always delete the browser history. My online shopping went through my PO Box. Well one day I forgot to delete after spending a few minutes with you all. When my wife found the site she freaked out to say the least. I always wanted to tell her about it but was afraid of her reaction. Well let’s just say I underestimated how bad it would be. As she asked me about it I didn’t have a clue how to respond. I thought seriously about lying, saying it was something I was just curious about. But then she gave me a glimmer of hope. She told me “Look, I don’t care if that’s what you’re into, I just want to know.” I really should’ve seen that ambush before I jumped into it, but I foolishly hoped she could see my desire to dress for what it is. Just a fantastic hobby that I love.

But alas, it was a trap. “I don’t care if that’s what you’re into” roughly translated into “I care bigtime and no matter what you say going forward I’m going to use this as leverage and blackmail to hold over your head forever.”

I jumped in hoping for acceptance-even a little bit. I told her the truth. I told her about how these desires had started when I was 4 or 5 years old. I loved the feel of my mom’s satin slips- I’d wrap them around my waist under my shirt and just walk around loving the silky feel. How every once in a while all through my teenage years, I’d sneak a slip out of her drawer and hide in the bathroom wearing it and loving how good it felt. I talked about my teenage years when the sexual feelings started while I was dressed. How I stole a pair of my sister’s nylon pantyhose and instantly fell in love with how good it felt to wear those under a satin slip. I admitted to masturbating a lot when I was a teenager (who didn’t), sometimes when I was dressed but not always.

I shared my internal struggle to figure out who or what I was during those hard teenage years. How I’d heard repeatedly that only perverts and homos engaged in such a disgusting behavior. And how if I liked dressing in women’s clothes then I must be gay or want to become a woman. But I knew a couple of things for certain. I didn’t feel like a pervert, I just loved wearing silky things. After accepting the “fact” that if I liked to dress then I had to be gay. I came to realize there was one problem with this “fact”. I was incredibly attracted to girls and never felt any attraction to males. So then I must want to become a girl. Another problem. I loved being a guy. I loved all the things that guys did. I love football, basketball, hunting, fishing, John Wayne movies, etc. I knew I was man plain and simple. With, of course, our little secret, that I love being able to slide into a silky pair of pantyhose and shimmy into a soft satin slip.

I told her how I started to buy my own things after I moved out of my parents home. I started wearing panties and a long satin nightgown to bed everynight. I thought that once I got married things would change. They did. After I met and fell in love with my wife, I lost interest in dressing and for the first 6 or 7 years of marriage I was content to just be in close relationship and proximity to someone who got to wear the things I love. During that time I never dressed once. But I could never shake how good it felt, how good I felt when I dressed up. So in secret I started again. Started to slowly build my wardrobe. At first it just started with a full slip and nylons but then I thought “what the hell let’s try it all.” A skirt, then a blouse, then a dress. Great, great, and great. I knew I had to try a garter belt and stockings. What a rush that was! I’m 6’6” 240 with size 14 shoes so I never even thought they made women’s shoes in my size. I was excited to find some on ebay. So I bought some black pumps and even some black knee high boots. I just felt awesome the more and more I got into playing dress up. I had never worn a bra before so I bought one. Then two, then three. Stuffing socks in my bra never felt right so a pair of breastforms were ordered. Good choice. Over the next few years I would buy 2 or 3 items per year. I would only dress up when my wife and 3 kids were away visiting relatives or when I traveled on business. Sometimes late at night after everyone was asleep I would go downstairs, slip into a silky nightie and watch TV for a while.

I didn’t think all of this was a big deal. How could I bring it up to my wife. I thought after six years of marriage that the desire had left me. I was wrong. I still love dressing up. Who was getting hurt? I never dressed when the boys were around. Being the size I am I knew I could never pass on the outside as a female so I was always discreet about it at home or while travelling. Our house is in the country so the chances of me being seen by neighbors was extremely remote. Over time it has lost the sexual excitement it had many years ago. To me it seemed like a harmless hobby, like golf, an escape from a mundane life. (Although not a hobby I share with my buddies) I would get dressed 8 or 10 times a year. Spend $100-$200 a year on clothes. I really didn’t think it was a huge deal. My wife thought differently.
After I told her some of this history (I didn’t go into nearly as much detail as I’ve shared here) she went ballistic. Asked me if I was gay. No matter how I present the truth about me not being gay she still doesn’t believe me. Or the fact that I have zero interest in transitioning to female or try to pass in public. She either doesn’t believe it or can’t see past the stereotypes. I was told that I need to see a therapist to cure me of this evil sexual addiction. She then accused me of a porn addiction. I never really got into porn, my time spent online I shopped! I never looked at porn online. She wouldn’t believe this one either. Or that I wasn’t involved in some online affair with someone. Up until the last day or so I had never made a post on a forum like this one before. My entire interest in crossdressing is just to be able to dress up once in a while cause it feels great. Why does it have to be made into a major thing?

Well, she holds all the cards now. Heaven knows who in her family knows my secret. I don’t think she’s told anyone in the community yet. In a extremely religious small community like ours rumors would have been like wildfire by now but that hasn’t happened yet. My neighbors would view crossdressing as one step above (or below) necrophilia. But unless I agree to get “cured” of this sexual deviance then she’s kicking me out. And threatening to use this secret to take my boys away from me. And ruin my career.

My marriage was going along just fine, I thought. We weren’t blissfully happy or anything. But we were content. I was devoted as husband and father. Dressing never got in the way of other more important things. It’s funny how a decade and a half of fulfilling my responsibilities at work, home, in the community mean absolutely ZERO in light of my desire to wear women’s clothes from time to time.

I still fail to see a big issue here. Other than offending everyone’s delicate sensibilities about the subject-is it that big of a deal? They are just clothes. Clothes that 50% of the population get to wear no questions asked. (Which, by the way, really pisses me off to hear women complain about having to wear dresses and bras and pantyhose and heels. I want to wear them and can’t.) I’m not asking my wife to accept my dressing anytime, anyplace no questions asked. But in the great scheme of things, I just don’t understand it being a huge issue. I mean really, should the reality of my life and marriage change just by having the truth of this out there instead of simply hidden. I’m still me. Or does the label “crossdresser" now erase every good thing I’ve done in my life and marriage? Will my accomplishments be viewed through people’s extremely narrowminded lens from now on? Like I said---Screwed.



I love to wear pantyhose and other silky things. So sue me.

[ziggie]

I don't really know what to say except that this is still a very fresh issue between you and your wife and things can change when there has been time to process information. I hope they change for the better.

[Fab Karen]

You could ask her if she'd see a therapist with you to discuss it. She may say no,"you need to "cured" " but you can ask. Then talk to a lawyer about the situation.

[Amanda22]

SO sorry to hear this, Samantha, but two things jump out at me. First, going to see a therapist might be the best thing that ever happened to you. I strongly advise having her choose the therapist, so she can't claim you set her up when the therapist (hopefully) explains that this is a harmless behavior, and doesn't mean you're cheating or deviant or anything else. Also, I wonder how good your marriage was before you were caught. Would you say you were both in love? I wonder how she could fly off the handle like this if she loves you. That doesn't seem logical. I'm not trying to make you feel worse than you already do, but your relationship sounds adversarial, as though she was just waiting for "evidence" to let the everything break loose.

[Jorja]

Well Samantha, if you have been lurking for 4 years, I am sure you have seen the many threads about telling your wife/SO. She is feeling betrayed and lied to at the moment. She finds it unimaginable that you did not share this with her sooner. She is embarrassed. You should also understand that she may not share this with anyone even her family at this point.

With a lot of hard work your marriage might even be able to survive this. Give her some time to understand this and she may come to realize it is not as bad as she thinks it is right now.

P.S. Going to see a therapist would be advisable

[Eryn]

...I was told that I need to see a therapist to cure me of this evil sexual addiction....

I think that this is a good idea. Make sure that she goes along with you. Unless the therapist is really out there he is likely to say to your wife "Why are you making so much of this?"

It's very unlikely to fix the overall problem, but at least it would put it in proper perspective.

I feel for you.

Eryn

[Katesback]

I have a perspective one that a TS has to go through and if she is succesful will find inner peace.

I suggest you be STRONG and say flat out this is who I am to her. I suggest you NEVER show shame and NOT hide nor justify who you are.

See a lot of trans people that fall into this position dont realize that they betray a perspective of shame which others will feed off of. If you are proud of who you are and have the take it or leave it mentality you will be far better off.

Thats my two cents.

[sandra-leigh]

Letting her choose the therapist could be a problem, if she chooses a therapist associated with a more fundamentalist branch of a religion. There are still "Christian therapists" out there who believe strongly that this is something to be "cured" and who ignore the large body of evidence that the "cures" don't work very well and are often psychologically harmful. You need the pool of therapists to choose from to be the neutral therapists.

[BRANDYJ]

I always hate hearing stories like this Samantha. Others are right. She feels betrayed, lied to and that you have kept a very big secret from her. She now wonders what else you have kept from her. Hopefully, if the marriage is strong and the both of you sincerely love one another, you can slowly begin talking about it in a calmer mood. Give her time to think, to reflect on the marriage and all you two have been through together with raising the kids and all. I am one of those that does believe love can conquer all. But it's gonna take a lot of patience on your part. Give her time and space. But every chance you can, remind her how much you love her and how much you appreciate her in your life.

I do wish you and your wife the best and hope time, communication and love will keep you together.

[SamanthaS]

I'm sorry your going through this. You are so right, what you do in your home is NOT Illeagal! They are just clothes. I'm not in your shoes, but feel your pain and hope better things are in store for you. If this were me I'd tell her to tell whoever you want I'm a crossdressers; because I'm still the same person and if people I know want to look at me differently, then they were never really my friends in the first place! Be ready to take back control and power from her, or lay still for the steam-roller she's driving. And she may want to bear something else in mind; THERE ARE CROSSDRESSERS IN EVERY FAMILY! Just like gays have hidden in the closet all these years, there is a secret "sissy" in many familes ;)

[Tanya83]

It amazes me how some of the reactions are so bad when it is found out. That must be a tough thing to deal with, jeeze I can't believe she would threaten you with your kids! That's not very smart of her. Compromises must be made here.
I can't say I've experienced this because I shared my secret early in the relationship. I'm sure it's more about having a "Secret" than it is about wearing panties.
Good luck.

[Lucy_Bella]

Hi and welcome ,

Support is needed from both sides lets not forget, you have been lurking as you said on this site for four years..I am sure you began searching for both support and information as to why you are dressing.

I can understand the desire to dress is hard to share and enbarrassing, but lets not forget all that you have learned about yourself. Now lets take that knowledge and help your wife get some understanding... I would give her time to let it soak in then when it brought up explain the best you can about it to her in a calm and careing way.

Try not in anyway to get offended and be confident in who you are, who you have always been and ensure her she is losing no one ..Slowly and only when asked explain to her that this isn't nothing you just choose to do and is as natural as breathing . We can not choose to be WHO WE ARE.. We can choose to be who we are not.

Most of all support her if you choose to remain a couple, from the sounds of it you do not wish to live your life full time dressed and is some what compared as a shall I say a "hobby" .You do not sound selfish and will put your family first ..

I wish you luck , you do have some control in what is left of your marriage depends on how well she is willing to understand the Cder's world..Most of all you are the same guy she met and fell in love with except she knows a little more about you...

[Misty G]

I can feel your pain as this sounds exactly what I went through several years ago. My I let my ex choose a therapist and I insisted that she go with me. She went until the therapist said that she was the one with the problem not me and that there was no magic cure. That it was something we had to learn to deal with and accept. Needless to say that wasn't what she wanted to hear. We ended up getting a divorce after a few months. She did all she could to destroy my reputation but after a little while most people payed little or no attention to what they were hearing. After grieving over the divorce for a short time I began to live life to its fullest and discovered that if you would hold your head high no one cared.

Now I have a wife that is not only accepting but very supportive. I see my ex every few weeks and she seems to no longer have any problems with it. I will not drag this out. But what I am saying is it is not the end of the world because she found out even if there is a D in the making. There is a whole world out there just waiting on you.

[RachelOKC]

After twelve years of marriage your wife finds out that you've been hiding a fairly large aspect of your personality from her. If she did the same to you, would you not feel angry and betrayed? That this is "just" crossdressing doesn't really matter. You've been living a lie - not necessarily one of deception, but one of omission. Wouldn't that be difficult for any partner to accept under any circumstances?

You may be busted and rejected, but you're not screwed unless you choose to be. It may be hard to see it this way now, but this revelation may be an opportunity to be more open and free in your life after years of hiding.

Start by seeing a therapist who is knowedgeble of TG issues and go with your wife. If she won't go, then go without her. If you see a therapist who insists you can be cured or converted then see a proper therapist with a real education and real ethics. In any case...talk about it, don't avoid it further.

If your marriage is fundamentally sound, then crossdressing is hardly the thing to wreck it.

[gwenbeth]

Samantha
I really feel for you. I got a very similar reaction from my wife when I came out to her. After I told her we went to the therapist both of us had been seeing and when I told the therapist she has a stunned bunny look on her face. she had no experience dealing with cross-dressers and recommended that we find someone with more experience. The therapist we found has been helping me come to terms with my issues, of which crossdressing was just one. And it has been by embracing my feminine side that is helping me deal with my depression.

I do understand how it hurts to hear your wife throw wild accusations at you. My wife doesn't understand why I want to do this. She throws out snide remarks about my crossdressing. She has accused me of having affairs. She has said that she never would have married me if she knew I was a crossdresser. Now our marriage was not in good shape before and I feel like it is falling apart around me. Hopefully yours was in a better place to start with.

But I want you to know that you are not the only one going through this and that there are people out there who will accept you for what you are.

Gwen

[ninapuella]

1. If she really loves you she will get over it. If she not get over it she will just use it as an excuse for her own uncomfy lifesituation. I cant see how crossdressing would be the major factor of why a couple gets a divorce. I mean a divorce is a big thing and nothing you do just because of clothes. Women are very good to find these "problems" that give them the excuse to "run away" from a relation.

2. Why are she sneaking on you? I wouldnt like at all if someone check my browser history.

3. You should use Firefox. :)

[JamieG]

Samantha, I just wanted to add my voice of support. You and your wife are going through a difficult time right now, but with some work, I think things can get better between you. I agree that you should see a therapist (but be sure the therapist has credentials, and isn't some nutjob that thinks you can be cured). I agree that you should not act guilty for crossdressing, but perhaps you should atone for keeping the secret from her. It's important at this time not to withdraw emotionally from your wife. Try to keep the lines of communication open, and if she seems receptive to some education then point her to a few websites or books. Heck, you might even consider "accidentally" leaving a copy of "My Husband Wears my Clothes" somewhere she could find it. I wish both of you all the best.

[JohnH]

I think where you did wrong was to keep your crossdressing a secret from your wife. When the dust settles, and hopefully your marriage stays intact, don't hide a thing from your wife about your crossdressing.

Of course this kind of admonition does not help you right now. Be kind to her but do not act ashamed as others have advised.

A warning for others who continue to keep their crossdressing activities a secret - you better come clean with your significant other before she discovers those activities.

I keep my feminine clothes and shoes in plain view in the master bedroom closet and I wear my femme clothes around the house. Sometimes I go for walks wearing dresses and there are times that my wife comes along, wearing pants or shorts.

My wife did look at my activities on crossdressers.com, and now a lot of the time she calls me Johanna.

Johanna

[Cynthia Anne]

I feel for you! Been there done that and it still bothers me to talk about it. That was twenty some years ago! I agree with every one else get help with her if at all possible! I didn't have anyone to talk to back then and ended up with only the blouse on my back! I wish I had a computer back then. But my ordeal is not whats important here. Yours is and if she loves you she will not leave over this! Give her time to cool down what ever time it takes! Then I say, tell, don't ask her that we are going to a Therapist! I hope the best for you! And don't be a stranger to this site PLEASEEEE!

[erica12b]

my hart go's out to you , im sorry , i hope she see the light and truth of how it can and will hurt you , and excepts you ,

[WandaRae2009]

As many have said before. I feel your pain. I came out after nearly 25 years, and it didn't go that well. I thought it was all over until we met with a therapist. After that meeting she understood more and knows this isn't likely going away. By no means is she accepting, but I would say tolerant. We have agreed to a lot of limits and the kids do not know or anyone else. Make sure that you find a therapist experienced in gender issues, not one that thinks they are going to fix you. Good luck and best wishes our prayers are with your and hope you succeed at reparing your relationship.

[kathie225]

You're the same person she fell in love with and married 12 yrs ago . There was some quality about you that she liked and cared about. I would suggest that you continue to be that person and stress to her you are her husband and care about her. As was pointed out, the emotions are making meaningful talks difficult. Not many persons who marry for the right reasons, will throw away a relationship that has endured as long as yours. She is hurt and has more questions bouncing around her head than you may imagine. Reinforce the positives from the past 12 yrs. and hopefully she will come to some sense of understanding. Acceptance and tolerance may be out of the question as many others on this forum experience with their SOs. However. you might get lucky. The best to you.

[KristaE]

You could ask her if she'd see a therapist with you to discuss it.

ABSOLUTELY! See a therapist, both of you... NOW!

[Roberta Marie]

Samantha,

I agree with many of the other posts that it is somewhat understandable that your wife would react in this manner. Her trust in you has been broken. In her eyes you have deceived her, not just once, but consonantly for the past 12 years. It may take a while for her to start believing you when you tell her that you're not gay, that you don't want to transition, that you're not into porn. And yes, when a bomb like this is dropped, all of the good things that you've been in that 12 years becomes a bit harder to see, a bit more fuzzy. That's human nature.

In addition to that, you' have, in a brief conversation, changed her image of the man that she has known for the past 12 years. You've been painting this picture, "I loved being a guy. I loved all the things that guys did. I love football, basketball, hunting, fishing, John Wayne movies, etc.", of yourself, and it is what she has come to know as you. Now that image is being shaken and changed, and she's may be frightened by what she thinks may be reveled. Anger is a common and understandable, if not irrational, reaction to fear. I suspect that her looking for a cure is her way of saying, "Give me back the John Wayne husband that I've known for the past 12 years."

I suspect, too, that she was not intentionally laying a trap for you with her "I don't care if that's what you're into" comment. I suspect that with the understanding of the situation that she had at that moment, it probably was not a big deal to her. But, as soon as she realized that it was much more than what she initially realized, it became a big deal. All of a sudden this was not just a whim, it was something that you had been doing your entire life, and hiding from her for 12 years.

I also think that the advise of seeing a professional is valid, although if you go with the attitude that it will show her the light and force her to accept you, it will probably fail. It sound like there is, in the current state of the relationship, a lack of communication. She's not listening to you, and you're not quite understanding her reaction. A therapist will help you work through this by helping to open the lines of communication.

[giuseppina]

Hello Samantha X

There's a lot of good advice posted.

Your wife is feeling betrayed, and is making it very plain by her actions. I think her feelings are justified, but threats and abuse are not necessary to make this plain.

If she wants to find a therapist, fine, as long as you have veto rights. The therapist must be duly educated and licensed as a therapist, not a member of the clergy as they don't have significant training in this regard, and must have experience with gender variance beyond judging and derogation. If she refuses and doesn't back off on her threats and judgements, my inclination would be to see a lawyer.

My feelings about judging therapists is they are unable to help their clients in the long term.

[MaryAnn40c]

So sad to hear whats going on with you. You could use that your wife wears your t-shirts and such against her you know stuff like that....it might work. Keep your head up and keep smiling.

[suchacutie]

I will only add my voice to many good suggestions:

See a therapist, one you both agree to, and both of you should go. I'm sure she'll understand that the therapist will want to speak with her no matter what, so this should not be an issue.

Secondly, this is a major trust issue, beyond all the stereotype and belief issues. It will be hard for a few days.

Third, you have been threatened. In my opinion you should see a lawyer sooner rather than later, simply to protect yourself from her threats.

Lastly, it would be positive to remind her that the qualities of the person she married are still there, and your CDing is a part of that. A feminine perspective can only be positive to a marriage!

All my hopes for a good settlement.

tina

[Christy_M]

I am so sorry that you are going through this. I have had similar experiences in the past. My first wife threatened me during our divorce although she had initially accepted and participated in my dressing. My current wife doesn't understand. she found out over five years ago and told me I needed to seek therapy to get cured. I started with a therapist with no experience in the TG issues but even she told my wife that the problem was not the dressing but the way we communicated with each other. After a few more visits, we stopped seeing her and I told my wife I would stop. It was a promise I couldn't keep and when I came out to her last August I created a script to follow so I made sure I gave her all the information I felt was important from my perspective. I let her ask as many questions but told her that if she asked I would tell her the truth and she would have to trust that I was not lying. I said that if she wasn't interested in moving forward under those guidelines that we would never be able to get past this. If the trust is gone, so is the respect. I say all this to say that if the foundation of the relationship is sound, she will come around to try and get better understanding. It has been painful for me these past few months becasue my wife gets overloaded on this topic easily and the discussions stop until she can process what we talked about. She really wants to understand but she is still dealing with the stigma that her "man" wears pretty clothes and will never overcome that need.

Be available for her to ask these questions. Try not to pressure her into discussing it. See if she will do some research on her own either through this site or other sites. There are a number of books available on the subject, as well.
...leaving a copy of "My Husband Wears my Clothes" somewhere she could find it.

Unfortunately, you are right that she is in the driver's seat. Knowing what is at risk should help you make decisions moving forward. You can't un-ring the bell but you can mitigate the impact by determining what you can and cannot live with. If your wife refuses to "play nice," you won't be able to control that. The wife leaving and taking the kids seems pretty harsh but since crossdressing is not illegal, you can fight for joint custody and frequent visitation. If she does choose to stick around you will have to set the groundrules for future conversations and potentially even boundries for when and where you are able to satisfy your need to express this side of you.

Finding a qualified therapist for you both to talk with would be beneficial but you can't force her to participate and do any work on her own to make this easier. If she loves and respects you, she should be willing to figure out how your realtionship moves forward with you.

I apologize for the long post. I had just a bit more than two cents. I do wish you and your wife the best. It is very hard but any good relationship takes hard work on both parties.

:hugs:
Christy

[Pythos]

Okay. YOur wife is being a manipulative B**ch. The whole saying "I don't care..." and using that as a "trap" is absolute BS, and you should call her on that. YOu can now tell her because of that you will never trust her again. You can also (why do I find myself harping on this) tell her that her reaction is EXACTLY the reason you hid this aspect of yourself. Irrational behavior on HER part.

I wish you luck and hope you can work things out, though I have a feeling that will not be the case. When you use terms like "she holds all the cards" you are admitting defeat in an unfair "fight"

[Patty B.]

I can relate to your situation, but you both need to see a therapist and you need a lawyer. Your wifes foundation has been destroyed and she sounds like she is going to get even if you're not cured. My wife after 28+ years was understanding for the first year and since last august has been at my throat almost every day. Our lives have been miserable since and I still hope to make our marriage work and stay together. But she doesn't hesitate to tell me it's not the cd'ing it's not telling her. Anything you say to your wife can and will be used against you at any time so choose your words wisely. At least our children are grown if yours aren't it makes your home life much more difficult. As for work, my wife has outed me to family and in our small town work also which is causing me some problems that hopefully do not become a huge issue, loss of job. Just protect yourself as much as you can and put your family first and dont forget to look at this from your wife's perspective. Reine and MiamiMarie have great posts, pay attention to them, they are on the money in my opinion. Reine always has great insight.

[GingerLeigh]

Samantha,

Wow! A mirror of my life as a crossdresser. Well, except for the part of her finding out.

You're right, what's the harm in it. It's only dressing up. However, you mentioned that it took YEARS for you to wrestle with your crossdessing. She has only known of it for days. She needs time to absorb it and understand that she will be very upset initially. She may never get over it. The ball is in her court, wait for her next move and be prepared for anything!

Good-luck

Ginger

[Tara Jordan Campbell]

IF you give in and see a therapist then what? Will she forgive you, love you the same as before? Will you promise to never dress again? I would play it like cool hand Luke..........if she doesn't budge then you need to make your stand or move on.
This one sounds like she was looking for an out anyway , unless there is more to what happened. Sorry to be so cold.

[shesadvl]

Samantha,

you should be ashamed of yourself, taking 12 years to tell your wife you thought about it at the 6 year mark,

as some of the other posts have said ,..... How did you expect her to react after all this time,

why do you men,... dont think about your wife or partners feelings,..oh ill keep it hidden wont hurt....oh yeh...like that saying what a tangled web we weave when we practice to decieve....
when you are either caught out, or busted ,....like in your case through your web browser. You have been reading here for 4 years ,....what part of reading here did you not comprehend that wifes of CD'ers react when they are not told of the so called "hobby" ...

she has much to get her head around. She is hurt, all those things that have been mentioned...even some posts have stipulated how did you expect her to react.

I am damned lucky I knew way before I got into this relationship as I was friends first with my SO, but if it had happened to me... I wouldve kicked his arse then given him the questions,.. why lie hide and its like cheating yes..... (by the way I am fully, accepting of my SO doesnt bother me he does crossdress.) hes happy where he is with himself and his femme self.
we are open and communicate all the time ,....I actually read over his shoulders for 6 months before I joined here...

so no 1. I think you need to get into some major dialogue with your wife, point out that there is a section here for wifes GG's here, she needs to get 10posts and can get in here
and perhaps help herself to understand what is going on and YOU.

She may not be able to talk to anyone for not wanting to feel ashamed of herself....dont assume what she has/hasnt done...damned well talk to her.... no heated discussions ,..t all calm , answer all her questions,

also as I have read there are others that have recommended you go to a therepist for counselling... I believe you both can go together which will also be seperate consultations.... You have to be prepared as to what may come of this... all is solveable... but you have to quit being sneeky and lay it all out on the table honestly.....

I know that its just the clothes and how you all enjoy the feel of them or are happy with your femme side....

Man wish some of you no matter how you tell your wifes or partners would be open and honest..".fear" of reaction is a bad thing,.. yes as to how one will react....
yes I do know,... not all of you have accepting wifes.... I fully understand that... so If you want to protect what you have...
damned well be up front open and honest.....

I applaude those of you who are and have gone through your situations.... keep the dialogue and treat your wife how you would like to be treated....

I know if us women did what you guyz do or have done,... we wouldnt have the same accord,... the reaction would be far worse and this i know...;)
I think i also read one of the posters mention this as well...

samantha you have had some good advice in parts...

the journey is to not only finding yoursel,..its also acknowledging your femme side,.......... also in caring how &
what you do affects your relationship and your wife....

at present i would say shes feeling really bad,.. feeling being cheated on, lied to. Raging like a women
with fury, ...... start a dialogue with out kids around..... you can show her this forum and post. tell her shes not alone...by any stance...

and from me

stop feeling busted, rejected and screwed,...to sum it up ,.... by not being open or truthful you did this to yourself... find a way to fix it.... you have read here for 4 years
and I am pretty sure that other GG's will put their 2cents worth in...;)

EDIT A question you need tio ask yourself... do you want to save your marriage???? also as others have saidyou need to see therapist as well.

[Sandra]

Firstly your wife needs to know that you can't be cured.....maybe put it on hold but cured not a cat in hells chance.


She is probably feeling betrayed, lied to and not really knowing where she stands in all of this, and after all this time together I am not surprised. How would you feel if the boot was on the other foot?


As for those who have said "if she loves you" I get so sick and tried of hearing this, most seem to use this as a cop out putting it all on the SO. I'll put it another way to those who are still hidden " If you loved her"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[CaitlynRenee]

Samantha,

I think Mandy said it right. I'll add that my ex was pretty much the same at being reactionary in any discussion where she wanted to get the 'upper hand', felt her own position was a bit weak or worse still, was totally ignorant about the subject of the discussion. Defensive is a word that comes to mind. And she never even knew of Caitlyn since Caitly didn't exist at the time.

Some people are just that way and you'll never be able to change them. They'll have to be convinced some other way. Hopefully she'll get educated and accept that education.

Good Luck

I'll add that I won custody in my divorce and SHE was the one to get 'frequent visitation rights'. No reason why YOU can't get custody and remember, no matter what, don't EVER move out of the house. That's seen as 'abandonment' and will go against you in a court of law.

[Mary Morgan]

I can understand your wife being angry, I can understand her fears and concerns. I cannot understand how she could be so hurtful toward you if as you say your relationship "was going along just fine". I suggest that you agree to counselling as a couple, and with someone who is familiar with transgender issues. As for a cure, right! Hopefully she will calm down and the two of you can begin to work on your relationship. Just my two cents.

[Traci Elizabeth]

I can certainly feel for you. But you can not expect your wife to accept your cross-dressing. If in the end she does than that needs to be her choice alone. As far as her seeing a therapist - why should she? You wife not accepting is a common response as that is not who or what she fell in love with. So I am afraid that you are at her mercy. It is her choice not yours if she can accept this or not. But I do hope the best for you as this was not the response you were hoping for from your wife.

[cordgrass]

If I were your wife I would freak out. I wouldn't threaten your job--surely she must see how stupid that is. Point out to her that the more money you make, the better you can take care of your children, even if there is a divorce. But the other stuff, yeah, I probably would react that way or worse. Of course I know that crossdressing can't be cured, so I wouldn't suggest that, but what a devastating betrayal, keeping such a secret from her for so long.

[Emily Ann Brown]

Been there !!! You have my prayers.

Girls, grow up. Wifes can go off the deep end (in our opinion) and we are at their mercy. When you have a marriage fight neither party has to "be reasonable". Sometimes we aren't either.

Best advise is to try to please her, but don't lie and make promises you know you can't keep.


Em

[Kitty Sue]

Very sad story. I wish you and your family all the best.

[kimdl93]

Someone told me once during a difficult time that the sun will rise again. I hope that over time you'll have opportunity for calm and reflective conversation with your wife - mediated if need be. The trust issue may be the biggest thing to get over. I don't know how, but it may be possible to impress upon her that after a lifetime of denying and hiding, its difficult to find the courage to tell a loved one. It took many years for you to first realize that the desire had not gone away, and second many more years to realize that you couldn't keep it a secret from her forever. You found the courage to tell her, at last. That should count for something.

[RACH99]

I applaud the wonderful advise you've already received here so I will try not to just repeat.

First off even your explanation proves it's not just clothes. It never really is. At the very least it's how you feel or respond to the clothes. If it is "no big deal + just clothes" as many imply you wouldn't be fighting or hiding it so long to keep it in your life like a secret lover. Again this is just my POV having found myself on the opposite of this coin. It feels very much like your SO has a new love in his life or he's cheated you somehow when he fights so hard to keep this new [to you] she in his life. It's never just clothes and even as a newer member here I find it insulting when so many imply CD is just that...clothes. Even I have tried to believe this but even my limited learned has proven this a rather simple statement for a complex issue. :confused: So why do so many use this argument then get upset when the SO doesn't see the need to have it be a part of her live via yours. [For better or worse when you share your life with another everything they are, everything they do affects you]

I found out the hard way. I found his stash and he let me believe he was having an affair rather than admit the truth...he assumed I might be a little pissed by an affair but I'd get over it. :eek: It broke my heart in two. I was shattered. See what assumption gets a guy? :brolleyes:

It took my leaving and filing for a divorce before he admitted the real truth. Not the truth as to who he was when we met or in the many years of marriage or even the who he said he was when I found his stash...but now he was giving me the "real truth" :noidea2::confused3::tantrum::guns

By that time I was so hurt and confused I didn't know what to think or do. I started trying to sort through all the lies and misdirection. I loved him so much but on the other hand who was he really? I mean you cannot hide a rather large part of who you are and pretend to be someone you aren't then be surprised when your SO finds out you were pretending in part to be the very one she fell in love with.

Yet I found this site, joined it to learn and heal whilst we were separated. I rejoined my husband with very little understanding and lots of uncertainty so don't ya'll go preachin' about "if she loves you she'll accept this" That's just BS. If she loves you she'll try to find some peace in her own heart and then go from there. You've hurt her a great deal [fear and hurt often hide under a mask of anger] so give her time, space and lots of patience. If you love her you'll do that.

[Samantha X]

I appreciate everybody's response. I'm grateful for the good advice. I have spent a long time looking at it through my wife's eyes. I understand her being scared. I know that it was a very large bomb I dropped on her. She's afraid that her whole life will now come apart because of this. I can respect that. I don't want that to happen. I still love my wife deeply. I have never stopped loving her, even for a minute through all of this. I just feel like I can't win here. I feel like this is part of who I am. Do I give that up just to make peace? A war between two things I love. I mean if comes down to it I would give up dressing to save my family. I am still hoping that it won't come to that. How do you change who you are? Other than by living a different lie.

I have made an attempt to communicate with her more about everything. She really isn't trying to understand my need to dress, she just doesn't want to talk about that. She only says this is something she doesn't want and it needs to be cured. But I have made an attempt to be more open about everything else.

I think I will try to go to a therapist with her. Although I am very skeptical about finding a good one. I have visions of how those sessions would be with both barrels pointed directly at me by her and the therapist. But I think it might be good for both of us.

I have always been envious of those of you that have a SO that is accepting. And very jealous of those of you that have a SO that is supportive and allows cding to bring another level to your relationship. I don't even know what to hope for in my situation right now. I guess just that my marriage will survive, I won't put my kids through a divorce over this.

Thanks again for your responses.

Samantha X




I love to wear pantyhose and other silky things. So sue me.

[JulieC]

(moving things around a bit)


I thought that once I got married things would change. They did. After I met and fell in love with my wife, I lost interest in dressing and for the first 6 or 7 years...

You are not alone. There are many, many crossdressers that believe that once they have a wife, they'll be cured of crossdressing. It's a common mistake. It has a sad outcome, but it is a very common mistake.


Over time it has lost the sexual excitement it had many years ago.

This is common too. Many crossdressers who start young and experience crossdressing through their youth, puberty, and young adulthood experience a strong tie between sex drive and crossdressing. It's no surprise really then that young men think they'll be cured once they have a wife, or at least a very regular sex partner. If the urges are taken care of by other means, no need, right?

(and now merging elements through the post)

So in secret I started again...I didn’t think all of this was a big deal. To me it seemed like a harmless hobby.... I really didn’t think it was a huge deal. My wife thought differently....No matter how I present the truth about me not being gay she still doesn’t believe me. Or the fact that I have zero interest in transitioning to female or try to pass in public. She either doesn’t believe it or can’t see past the stereotypes. ... She then accused me of a porn addiction. ... She wouldn’t believe this one either. Or that I wasn’t involved in some online affair with someone. ... It’s funny how a decade and a half of fulfilling my responsibilities at work, home, in the community mean absolutely ZERO in light of my desire to wear women’s clothes from time to time.
I still fail to see a big issue here.

It's an absolutely ENORMOUS issue. What I think you're not seeing is that you spent a decade and a half with this woman, and so far as she knows you've been lying to her the entire time. You withheld absolutely critical information from her. What reason you withheld it is immaterial. To many (most?) women, withholding important information is a lie, pure and simple. She most likely now looks back on all the time she's spent with you as a sham, one giant lie. You're mad she won't believe you about not being gay, not cheating, not addicted to porn. She certainly has one hell of a right to think you're lying about those things. You've lied about crossdressing all these years.

Every time you put on a pair of hose, a slip, anything crossdressing...you were lying to her. Every time you bought something online, and had it delivered to your secret PO box, you were lying to her. Every time you stashed things in your secret storage area, you were lying to her. Every time you purged your browser history, you were lying to her. Every time you crossdressed when she couldn't discover you, you were lying to her. Over and over and over again you have lied to her.

And you wonder why she doesn't trust you now? I don't mean to be harsh. I'm not trying to tear you down; the opposite actually. You need to look in the mirror as the first step towards reconciliation. This woman's life is in tatters because of your years over years over years pattern of lying. She is shaken to the very foundations of the understanding of what her world is supposed to be.

This isn't some little deal, some harmless little secret that wasn't hurting anyone else. This was fundamental, base core foundation of your relationship.

Trust is both incredibly strong and very fragile. It will tolerate all sorts of abuse, but then there can come a moment when it all comes crashing down. Once its destroyed, it can take years to rebuild...if it ever rebuilds at all.

You have shattered your wife's trust in you.

I agree; counseling is in order - for both of you, with a marriage counselor, to help figure out ways forward towards rebuilding the trust she took for granted.



I was told that I need to see a therapist to cure me of this evil sexual addiction.

There of course is no cure. Crossdressing isn't a disease, or psychosis.



But unless I agree to get “cured” of this sexual deviance then she’s kicking me out. And threatening to use this secret to take my boys away from me. And ruin my career.

Modern day courts won't take your kids away from you because of this. In fact, it may very well backfire on your wife in any custody hearings. A good lawyer can manage this quite well, and if she has a halfway decent lawyer their side won't even bring it up.



I hope for the best for you. You've got a very long road ahead of you. :(

[Katie in Canada]

Upon reading your submission, I began thinking, hey...this is my life word for word!

My conclusion to date and this conclusion takes in a far bigger picture than just dressing, lying to those who are closest to us or any level of relationships, is that maybe the majority of those who are not accepting to anything other than what they are told to believe are afraid to be themselves fearing rejection as others may be publicly critical of them (...?).

Is there ever a right answer? One can only do what your think is your best and we learn from there.

cheers,
K.

[ReineD]

I always wanted to tell her about it but was afraid of her reaction.

I'm sorry, but this is pure rationalization. I appreciate the difficulty you're in and I'm sorry it has come to this, but don't blame your wife for your own inability to tell her. You say it is no big deal. You're wrong. On a monthly basis, you engaged in an activity that brought you a great deal of pleasure and in which you had absolutely no interest in involving your wife, I suspect because it might have ruined it for you more than because you felt your wife would not have understood. You won't be the first CD who doesn't want his male image diminished in his wife's eyes and to blame it all on her shows a lack of accurate self-evaluation.


I didn’t think all of this was a big deal. How could I bring it up to my wife. I thought after six years of marriage that the desire had left me. I was wrong. I still love dressing up. Who was getting hurt?

If it wasn't such a big deal, then why couldn't you bring it up? Who was getting hurt? Your wife. You robbed her of something that women prize most in their relationships, which is emotional intimacy. Don't you think she felt at some level that something was amiss? You don't think she sensed that you were doing things online that you didn't want her to know? If she told you that she just wanted to know the truth a few weeks ago, it is because she knew there was a secret you were keeping from her. I can't emphasize enough that this, more than the CDing, is what has eroded your marriage in the last few years.

You say that you weren't blissfully happy in your marriage. There's no telling what stories your wife has told herself to explain your distance, as much as you like to think that she never would have sensed how much you love your "hobby". Maybe she thought you were having an affair. Maybe she thought you weren't attracted to her like before. Frankly, it is only natural that she grew resentful to the point of being less than open-minded about the CDing now.

The issue to discuss with a marital counselor is not the CDing so much as relearning how to build up the trust that has been severely eroded in your marriage.

If your wife thinks that she wants the CDing cured, it may be because she thinks it takes away from the emotional intimacy she craves with you. You can't blame her for seeing it as the cause for the rift in your relationship, since you kept it from her for so long. She has no idea what it's all about. She thinks it is something that you prefer over her. I mean, really ... you treated the CDing just as you would have an affair. You kept it from her.

If my post sounds like I'm berating you, please know that I'm not. I'm just trying to point out that you won't move forward in your marriage until you give up the idea that the CDing is "no big deal".

[Jorja]

Well said Renine

[MiamiMarie]

Samantha X - be careful. Be very careful. I completely agree with the other GGs on this board, but if your wife actually threatened to blackmail you or wreck your career (and lest we forget, my fellow GGs, some of those VERY angry and vindictive women do exist), take any necessary steps to protect yourself.

But, in line with the other GGs I gotta say, nothing makes my skin crawl more than CDs who hold these secrets for decades, and then act as if their secret is no big deal. If it's no big deal, then why the secret? You can't have it both ways. And you can't take a whole lifetime to accept your own CDing and then expect her to accept it quickly.

I'll bet your wife thought she knew everything about you and your sexuality. I bet she thought she knew you better than you knew yourself. Now, she finds herself married to a fantastic liar who's sexuality she has no clue about (and she can't trust what you tell her yet). And there are spouses out there (sorry, but there are) who have no interest in learning about what CDing is because it enables them to stay angry and hate you. And if your marriage was not very strong before, then this can present an opportunity for her to lash out and break out of the marriage.

In my case, I've never once had a problem with CD and was actually kind of a fan of it, and my husband still kept it a secret for 18 years. People that know me will generally refer to me as laid back and very even tempered. I've never once been called psycho, or even irrational. But for at least one month after I found out the truth, I was pyscotically, recklessly angry. I screamed, I vomited, I threw pillows at my husband at 4 am, I punched walls, and cried hysterically for days. But from the get go, I was ready to accept. I just needed to overcome the rage from being lied to, and I had to mourn the idea of what I thought my marriage was.

On one hand, your wife may be expressing rage. She may be lobbying empty threats right now because she feels powerless. she may be very afraid that you have more revelations for her - that the other shoe can drop any moment. Threats may make her feel like she is not a fool - because I promise you that right now she feels incredibly stupid and powerless.

On the other hand, she may actually attempt to do these things. Many CDs on this board have ex wives who let the whole world their secret. So sleep with one eye open for a while.

[KristyPa]

I feel for you so much. I don't think she would be in anyway acceptable or understanding even if you told her upfront. I understand totally any partner not excepting a crossdresser, thats why we hide it from them and everyone else. My girlfriend of 20 years and I went to a therapist several years ago about another issue. The therapist found that she needed to change after six months of seeing him. She said he was a total quack and we never went back. I could never tell my girlfriend about this part of me. She would go crazy, tell everyone we know and remind me of it every time she was in a bad mood.
Your going to have to play this out and hope time helps. Most of our mates will react somewhat differently and you can see that from the responses here.
I've always had the fear of being caught and have so since I was very young. The fact that I did this always made me wonder why I do. I have since I was very young like the rest of everyone here, so how could you explain this to someone who doesn't.

[girlalex]

After twelve years of marriage your wife finds out that you've been hiding a fairly large aspect of your personality from her. If she did the same to you, would you not feel angry and betrayed? That this is "just" crossdressing doesn't really matter. You've been living a lie - not necessarily one of deception, but one of omission. Wouldn't that be difficult for any partner to accept under any circumstances?


I agree, if she really loves you then she's not pissed of about the the crossdressing but the fact that you've been keeping a secret for so long thats such a mojor part of who you are.
Which means that she over reacted and will get over it. you should probably introduce her to this website so she will see on her own that we are all people just like everyone else.

[NicoleScott]

I went back and re-read the OP and some of you should, too. The wife's issue isn't that she was betrayed for so many years, but that her husband crossdresses.
She assumed he was gay, wanted to be woman, and is a sexual deviant, a sickness that needs curing. Sure, there were many years of living a secret life, but assuming that the lie is the main problem is reading into the OP something that wasn't there. I think the wife is one of those who cannot tolerate a crossdressing husband. Most of her assumptions about crossdressing are incorrect, but that's her reality, and Samantha's.
What good is it doing to remind Samantha that the wife should have been told long ago? Samantha is seeking advise on where to go from here. This forum is full of testimonies of cd's who thought that marriage would cure them. OK, we were all wrong. We don't get a do-over. Must go forward.
I prefer "counselor" to "therapist". Therapy suggests that there is something wrong with you and a therapist can fix it. Counseling suggests working on a relationship between people who don't see eye to eye and need help getting there. Just my perception.
Whatever you call it, why would a couple go to counseling or therapy? My guess is that she wants him cured, and he wants her acceptance. Without a common goal to work towards, how can it succeed? If you don't know where you're going, how are you going to get there?

[ReineD]

I feel for you so much. I don't think she would be in anyway acceptable or understanding even if you told her upfront. I understand totally any partner not excepting a crossdresser, thats why we hide it from them and everyone else.

This is so sad. No wonder you believe that the OP's wife will never accept (which, btw, you cannot say for sure since you don't know her or the OP). There are many wives who do accept. It's also very sad that you might allow your girlfriend to browbeat and blackmail you if she should find out about the CDing. :sad: Why would you allow yourself to be treated this way?

I strongly recommend you look inside yourself to see if it is not perhaps your own difficulties with self-acceptance that are getting in the way of being honest with your girlfriend. Still, even if you do tell her now it will be difficult after having hid the CDing for 20 years. But, wouldn't it be better to face the music now than continue to live the way you do? Just wondering.



She assumed he was gay, wanted to be woman, and is a sexual deviant, a sickness that needs curing.

Nicole, surely you must have read time and time again here, these are the questions that most GGs, parents, siblings, and friends ask when they first find out. Heck, these are the very same questions CDs ask of themselves when they first start their exploration. Am I gay? Do I want to be a woman? Am I sick?

The wife just found out! Have you read MiamiMarie's post #48?

[Presh GG]

Hello Samantha,

Do you really think your wife hasn't noticed something amiss in your relationship over the last 6-7-8-years? Give her a little more credit than that.
I'd like to ask you just EXACTLY how much have you exagerated her response?

Now is the time to stop lying. The truth is. IT IS NOT JUST CLOTHES AND YOU ARE NOT ABLE TO QUIT. Now, the sooner you tell your wife the truth, the sooner you can get on with the healing.

From your first post, you asked yourself the same questions she is now asking you. What's the differance.
Can you not see how much your wife is hurt, sometimes pain is expressed in anger. I suggest you find a way to reasure her she is the best thing that ever happened to you.. and if you don't feel that way, I feel very sorry for you both.

12 years is a terrible thing to waist.

Presh GG

[Sarah Plumber]

This sounds so familiar.

[SweetPea_GG]

1. If she really loves you she will get over it. If she not get over it she will just use it as an excuse for her own uncomfy lifesituation. I cant see how crossdressing would be the major factor of why a couple gets a divorce. I mean a divorce is a big thing and nothing you do just because of clothes. Women are very good to find these "problems" that give them the excuse to "run away" from a relation.

This could be said 2 ways.. if he really loved her he would of told her years ago about his CDing..instead he was making excuses of why he couldnt tell her and lied to her for their whole relationship about who he is and what he likes instead of making a false image of himself and who he thinks she wants him to be. never allowing her to fall in love with the real him. divorce is a BIG thing and lying to your SO about something so major as who you are and who you portray yourself to be in a BIG thing..Its more then just the "clothes" if it was "just the clothes" then you all would be satisfied with wearing mens clothes that is made up of the same fabric to get that "feeling" sensation


Okay. YOur wife is being a manipulative B**ch. The whole saying "I don't care..." and using that as a "trap" is absolute BS, and you should call her on that. YOu can now tell her because of that you will never trust her again. You can also (why do I find myself harping on this) tell her that her reaction is EXACTLY the reason you hid this aspect of yourself. Irrational behavior on HER part.


Ok so I wanted to kinda reply to a similar comment you made before Pythos in my husbands post when he first posted that I found his "stash" and found out after 15yrs of marriage and a total of 19yrs together.. you called me a irrational B*itch then.. cause why I was scared and afraid of my future.. I was uncertain of the man that I married and the man I thought I knew.. I am sure you would act the same way if someone pulled the wool over your eyes too.. love .. love makes us do crazy things and say crazy things especially when we get scared and are unsure. in no way does that just make us b*itches.. seems like a common reply with you when you respond to posts which involve wives or SOs who just find out the secret their loved one has been keeping from them.. maybe you should grow a heart a bit and look deep inside that there is alot of hurt there and the couple now needs all the support they can get.. both the man and the WOMAN..Sure it may be "just clothes" but from those "just clothes" formed the lie which has infected their relationship.




I'll bet your wife thought she knew everything about you and your sexuality. I bet she thought she knew you better than you knew yourself. Now, she finds herself married to a fantastic liar who's sexuality she has no clue about (and she can't trust what you tell her yet). .


I must completely agree with this.. and its something I myself have felt/feels too.

Samantha..

you did make the mistake of not being honest with your wife and hiding this part of you from her and lying to her about who you are.. that is something you will have to deal with and you will have to show her how much you love her.. you will have to rebuild that trust in her which as we all know wont happen over night. she deserves you now to be 100% honest with everything.. nows the time not to hide anything. She still needs you.. she fell in love with you you need to show her that the man she fall in love with and married and had a beautiful family with is not gone..you need to set your desires aside for a bit and focus on her.. focus on the both of you..

Coming from expirence and me finding my husbands stash only a few months ago.. it hurts.. i told him i would rather have learned that he had cheated on me cause thats easier for my brain to wrap around not that its better.. but i had no real knowledge of CDing..so a lot of things and words rush out of a wives mouth.. but the furthest thing from my mind was telling anyone.. i was ashamed and embarrassed and still am a bit inside I really dont want anyone to know..but back to the point..when a wives first finds out on her own there are a big rush of emotions that run through her head and it becomes over whelmed with hurt and anger.. which isnt a good combination.. which could possibly be why she said the threats.. shes scared.. we all usually say things we dont mean in the heat of the moment.. but i agree you both need to talk to someone and start the lines of communication..

if you wife is willing sometime I think that her joining the forums here would be good for her.. I joined and i love the GG's here they have helped me so very much and it gives me a great place to vent.

good luck to you!

[Allsteamedup]

"I fail to see the big issue"

"They are just clothes"

Samantha, if you would take some time to read the stickies concerning how to tell a partner, what the GGs would say and the top of Loved Ones you may, after some reflection, have some idea how women/wives feel about all the issues you have raised.
I dont' want to sound trite but everything you are going through is so commonplace-we've all been ther, as cders or spouses.
Why is it such a big deal? Your deception has ruined your wife's respect for you. It's not the clothes, it's the deception. How would you feel if she had been carrying on an online affair for 6years 'Oh, it's just words, honey...' I don't think so.
If you don't want to loose your family and particularly your wife, read those words in the stickies, apologise for what you have done, (we're suckers for an apology) and offer to see a counsellor if your wife will agree.
DO NOT UNDERESTMATE HOW MUICH YOU HAVE HURT HER. IT WILL TAKE YEARS TO PUT THIS RIGHT. SO HOW BIG A DEAL IS THAT?

[Amanda22]

This is a really thought-provoking thread which touches some important aspects of communication and telling or not telling. I've read some responses that are quite wise. I especially appreciate the responses pointing out the issue of lost trust. I do agree with those who say that an SO is liable to react in any way imaginable, and understandably so. It is a big deal to tell someone this information!! Yes, we can say it is just about clothes, but at least for me, it is so much more than that. I don't want to speak for anyone else, because for some perhaps it is only about clothing. For me, clothing is simply an outer indicator of my true gender identity, and I know that isn't a small deal to drop on a spouse!

Last year before I actually came out to my wife, I knew I was risking our marriage, and there were times I said to myself it was just about clothes and why would she have a problem with that? But I knew that the discussion of clothing would quickly lead to other questions about sexuality and gender. My wife, who is the most amazing person I've ever met, accepted this information and understood that I needed to dress and also understood that I identify as a female in a male body. She loves me, and didn't see this as a threat to our relationship, because it isn't. I'm extremely lucky to be married to her, and to have a wife who not only accepts, but encourages my girly side.

Having said all that, I want to touch on the topic of deception or lying. I do think there are some people who keep a secret and sneak around with their dressing, trying to keep it hidden from their SO. That just isn't right. A person doing this needs to have a discussion ASAP to get it out in the open, because it's going to come out sooner or later. There are others, however, whose motivation isn't to deceive. In my case, I had never been in love before meeting my wife. Yes, I new that I crossdressed since an early age, but I illogically thought that being in love would make it go away. I have no idea why I thought that; it seems so silly. So we got married, and after two years of marriage with NO crossdressing on my part, I realized that the desire to crossdress wasn't going to go away because I was in love. So I initiated a discussion with my wife and disclosed to her this lifelong desire to crossdress. I think it's important that I wasn't dressing in secret. Yet I had some new information to share with her. I think there is a difference between participating in a secret activity and realizing that a desire isn't going to go away and talking about it openly.

Please everyone, if you're secretly dressing, have a talk with your SO. You know your SO is going to find out at some point and it isn't going to go well if she/he finds out by accident.

[ikthys]

"Other than offending everyone’s delicate sensibilities..."

I'm so sorry for the hard time you're going through. I'm sure many of us have been there in some form. I believe you will not make it far in this ordeal unless you are willing to rethink this quote. This is not just about people (your wife) being picky. Others have pointed out the hard truth of the issue of deception by omision, but I also remind you that the idea of her man in nylons, heels, bras, panties, dresses, lingerie, etc. is not at all attractive. In fact it is revolting precisely the way you might find it revolting if she strapped on a dildo and chest hair, and confessed to having lived her whole life with a serious "manly" side. Not cool. It is also very much as if you have been getting your "woman" on the side, even though there is no other woman in actuality. You have been involved with getting close to a female persona that is not her and quite pleased with it. Most crossdressers never think about this side of the coin. It's just as confusing and different as our side of the coin, only more helpless for the others because they aren't the one's who decided to act the way you acted all these years. I plead with you to find it in your heart to fogive your wife for her misunderstandings and to compassionately go to her to be reconciled, even if it means giving this up. I ask the reverse question- does 12 years of being a faithful wife and mother to your kids mean so little that you will let it end so that you can go on wearing nylons? There may be the possibility of compromise, there may not. But I don't believe much can be well accomplished while people are locked into their defenses.

[dominique]

It seems that the main theme of this thread is tell all before. What if you don't want to tell her. I know that it will be not popular. But each person has their own reason for not telling. Mine was that I was not that a confident person when meeting women at first. This continued when I first met my wife I didn't want to do anyting that would drive her away and had many rejections before her. I know I should've told her, but I didn't and nearly paid the ultimate price.

[Melody Moore]

Keeping this secret from your wife was your biggest mistake.

You went to great lengths to hide this from her so naturally she will feel very deceived.
So if there is any reason not to trust you again then you only have yourself to blame.

Honesty is the best policy and you should have come out about it rather than her finding out because you screwed up.
If you are honest you have the best hope of retaining your dignity, in this case you weren't so I am afraid to tell you
that your dignity has gone completely out the door. No use trying to close the gate now, the horse has already bolted.

You just have to find the best way to deal with it now.

Good luck :hugs:

[NicoleScott]

Nicole, surely you must have read time and time again here, these are the questions that most GGs, parents, siblings, and friends ask when they first find out. Heck, these are the very same questions CDs ask of themselves when they first start their exploration. Am I gay? Do I want to be a woman? Am I sick?

The wife just found out! Have you read MiamiMarie's post #48?\\

I've not just read it, I've lived it. As a youngster, I asked myself those questions. My wife asked me the same questions.
Before the information age, many of us dealt wth our crossdressing desires alone. As we know from many testimonies, many of us thought that marriage would cure our crossdressing, so no need to tell the fiance. When we realized we were wrong, we were already in deep. It wasn't intentional, but the deceit happened out of our own ignorance. Most of us who have been through this agree that it would have been better to tell, but we don't get another chance. We have no choice to take it from here.
I lost my first wife because she could not tolerate a crossdressing husband. Before anyone tells me they know more about my marriage than I did, and that the real issue was the deceit, yes, the deceit was an issue at first. She was reasonable in listening to me explain my history, my desires, and my fears requiring me to keep my secret, and she ended up understanding. She loved me still, and respected that I was a good husband and father. But, she just couldn't stomach a crossdressing husband.
When I told my second wife, she asked the same questions (are you gay, want to be a woman). She accepts my crossdressing.
It is my observation and opinion that crossdressers and their wives/SO's tend to downplay the issue of cd-ing being unacceptable to some women, and that all the problems are about the deceit. While the deceit is the major issue in many cases, it is simply an assumption in Samantha's case. The wife expressed serious concerns about the crossdressing (gay? want to be a woman? sexual pervert) but Samantha's post raised no issue the wife had with the deceit.
My history is similar to Samantha's. I won't presume to speak for Samantha, but if I had it to do all over again, I would have told I was a cd before marriage. But that was my ignorance. Speaking of ignorance, the wife's views on crossdressing stem from ignorance. We're not necessarily gay, don't want to be a woman, and aren't perverts. In an instant of revealing a very private and personal part of himself, a good responsible husband, father, and citizen suddenly became an ogre.
Let's stop beating Samantha up for selflishly not telling the wife sooner, and start trying to help get through this difficult ordeal.

[Lorileah]

Hey y’all.
Hey yourself, glad you came to us. Sorry you were busted but some psychologists will tell you it wasn't an accident. You see when you hide something it gets easier to "forget" when you are putting things away. But that's all water under the dam.

I’m not looking for sympathy Not sympathy but you will get a lot of empathy I am sure


Well one day I forgot to delete after spending a few minutes with you all. When my wife found the site she freaked out to say the least. She read the title and quit. If she had taken the time to search the site she would have been surprised. Here is where you could have actually helped by saying "let me show you some of what we talk about here".


I always wanted to tell her about it but was afraid of her reaction. Funny how that works. We are afraid of a reaction that most likely will happen anyway. Deceit grows with time and reactions get worse.

I am not going to quote the next few lines and paragraphs but I will say that it was TMI too fast. But I understand the flood of hopeful emotion


Who was getting hurt? As it turned out you AND your wife because you were sneaking and hiding. That in and of itself screams "I think I am doing something wrong!!!"
To me it seemed like a harmless hobby, like golf, an escape from a mundane life. You don't sneak around to golf or fish I would guess


Asked me if I was gay. No matter how I present the truth about me not being gay she still doesn’t believe me. Or the fact that I have zero interest in transitioning to female or try to pass in public. She either doesn’t believe it or can’t see past the stereotypes.
all the questions that get asked right off. And again...see this site and there are many many posts about not being any of those things which you could at least educate her with.


I was told that I need to see a therapist to cure me of this evil sexual addiction. Seeing a therapist to come to grips with who you are is a good idea. Curing you is impossible. Getting her to understand who you are...good. Hoping you will quit and go on living Ward Cleaver's life....not so much


Well, she holds all the cards now. Then you either bluff or fold. But she doesn't hold all the cards, you just need to play what you have been dealt (after you threw away pocket aces of being truthful earlier). You can own who you are, be ready to explain in concise and logical arguments how cross dressing affects the people who do it, how it isn't every little stereotypic image they think it is. You may need to even "come out" to certain people before she outs you because you can say how you are still the same person and how you always do the best for your family and job. Whereas she is going to call you a pervert and mentally unstable. You with good arguments vs her with emotional. Pre-emptive strike


Heaven knows who in her family knows my secret. I don’t think she’s told anyone in the community yet. In a extremely religious small community like ours rumors would have been like wildfire by now but that hasn’t happened yet. My neighbors would view crossdressing as one step above (or below) necrophilia. But unless I agree to get “cured” of this sexual deviance then she’s kicking me out. And threatening to use this secret to take my boys away from me. And ruin my career. And blackmail is a very respectable crime in your community? Emotional blackmail is worse than hiding dressing up. So two wrongs will make a very bad relationship. If she is threatening these things she was one step out the door to start with. This may have been a tipping point but you were on that edge to start. There is little love left in this relationship and you didn't see that coming. She is refusing to try and understand and come to a reasonable conclusion. Maybe when she gets past the hiding, sneaking and lying you have done for 12 years she can be more reasonable. After all you weren't a bad person before this right?


I still fail to see a big issue here. lying, sneaking behind her back, breach of trust...fairly big issues I think.


Other than offending everyone’s delicate sensibilities see your comment about religious small community above...yes it is ignorant of them but you fed it by believing (and I think you still believe) that it is wrong and that you are somehow wrong in your feelings. You aren't wrong.


really pisses me off to hear women complain about having to wear dresses and bras and pantyhose and heels. I want to wear them and can’t.) Life sucks doesn't it? That is an issue you really need to come to grips with, you don't need that anger especially right now


does the label “crossdresser" now erase every good thing I’ve done in my life and marriage? Nope


Will my accomplishments be viewed through people’s extremely narrowminded lens from now on? Yep, but more from the trust stand point.

There are several paths you can take now. One you can purge and fight to never do this again. The trust issue will need to be mended. You won't be any more happy in your marriage than you were and will probably be less so, which leads to anger issues and fighting. Two, you can see a therapist (and she should also as was mentioned many times above) where you can work out ALL your issues and maybe make a compromise. If you still have love this can work out. Three you can ignore everything and hope it will go away until one day she plays the blackmail card (not a good option, you don't have enough outs for that to work). or four, take control of who you are, be who you are, work to mend the breaches, show how you really are not anyone different than you were, work toward a compromise yourselves.

Or you can move on with your life and she can move on with hers.

Sorry, no sympathy, just empathy and hope

[JulieC]

I went back and re-read the OP and some of you should, too. The wife's issue isn't that she was betrayed for so many years, but that her husband crossdresses.
She assumed he was gay, wanted to be woman, and is a sexual deviant, a sickness that needs curing. Sure, there were many years of living a secret life, but assuming that the lie is the main problem is reading into the OP something that wasn't there. I think the wife is one of those who cannot tolerate a crossdressing husband. Most of her assumptions about crossdressing are incorrect, but that's her reality, and Samantha's.
What good is it doing to remind Samantha that the wife should have been told long ago? Samantha is seeking advise on where to go from here. This forum is full of testimonies of cd's who thought that marriage would cure them. OK, we were all wrong. We don't get a do-over. Must go forward.

The OP appears to be upset that his wife won't believe him. The OP didn't have the perspective to understand a strong possibility as to why that is. Now, the OP does. Identifying a serious failing in the OP's perspective, that of thinking of this massive lie as 'no big deal', and the dichotomy that if it's no big deal, then telling should have been easy...but it wasn't, is a good thing.

That lesson provides a basis for moving forward, at least in part. The wife has every right to be angry, every right to not believe the OP now. The OP needs to step back and begin to realize the very serious role they had in creating this problem in the first place if they are to ever find their way forward.

Yes, I agree, the wife is likely one that will be very strongly unaccepting. But that doesn't mean that is the only reason for her being so upset.

Bridging a gap requires admittance of error on both parts, and a slow process of reconciliation based on honesty, openness, and commitment. The OP can't hope to accomplish that by feeling the error is all hers, the blow up is because she's narrow minded, and what he is doing is 'no big deal'.

[Avana]

There are some very wise replies in there, especially from the GGs, which make me proud to be a member of this forum.

And then there are some that make me downright embarrassed!

I'm siding with the wife here. I simply cannot imagine being in a relationship with someone and hiding something of this magnitude from her (or him). As others have said, ultimately it comes down to a selfish desire for self preservation, to have your cake and eat it too. No wonder there is a school of feminism that despises us (http://www.amazon.com/Transsexual-Empire-Making-She-Male-Athene/dp/0807762725). Also, I think explaining your dressing in origin as some type of sexual gratification did not help your case with your wife, who seems to be fairly conservative on that front. (though if it really was, its good that the truth about your sexuality is out there too)

[Nicole Erin]

Ahh from the responses I skimmed, seems a lot of them talk about how you betrayed your wife or whatever.

She will get over it. thing is, if your marriage was unstable enough that this disrupts things, maybe it is time to move on. My wife and I divorced partially cause of who I am and while it does suck sometimes not having a partner, at least I can move on in life as I see fit without someone nagging.

See here is the problem - You can't tell a potential girlfriend/wife cause she won't like you. But then when you wait, all the sudden you "betrayed" or some crap.
Well then, when the hell you suppose to explain this?

And in your case, so you like to dress in private and try to not involve others. How the hell they suppose to hold that against you? Is a person not suppose to have a private life at all?

When an unaccepting wife finds out, I find it interesting how they are not upset by the dressing, but by the "betrayal" Oh bull, they are upset by the dressing more than anything. If she had found out you had a gambling problem say, that would be a different story.

You dressed in private, you didn't try to force it on anyone, you didn't write off responsibility like work or family for this. You did nothing wrong.

[Lorileah]

I went back and re-read the OP and some of you should, too. The wife's issue isn't that she was betrayed for so many years, but that her husband crossdresses.


No the OP's perception is that the cross dressing was the issue. All the "are you gay, want to be a woman, want a man" questions are not about the clothing but about about what the wife thinks the clothing represents. The fact that it was a hiiden and subversive hobby seems to be tha issue with the OP. Harmless, in their view, undermining the relationship in mine (and I would say hers too). If it was just the clothes taht bothered her, then she would have saidn "Get rid of the clothes and everything will be OK".

[Alice Torn]

Sam, I am very sorry and saddened to hear of this trouble. My heart goes out to you. I am single, so can't really understand your situation that well. I am not going to "SHOULD ON YOU" about not telling her earlier. I would agree, that seeing a therapist/counsellor, that is neutral, may be best, if you can afford one, and that both of you go. I wish she would get some education on crossdressing, and also realize, that women were considered crossdressing, when they started wearing pants, and other mens clothes, decades ago.If counselling doesn't help, making some kind of compromise, may work, but, its true, that some of these things end in seperation. A neutral therapist with some knowledge of gender issues may be a good start, if she is willing.

[ReineD]

Before the information age, many of us dealt wth our crossdressing desires alone. As we know from many testimonies, many of us thought that marriage would cure our crossdressing, so no need to tell the fiance.

I know this. I really do understand how difficult it must have been for CDers to understand about themselves prior to the internet. But, the OP has been lying to his wife even after forums such as this one were online.



Let's stop beating Samantha up for selflishly not telling the wife sooner, and start trying to help get through this difficult ordeal.

The last thing I want to do is to beat Samantha up as I said in my first post in this thread. But, Samantha will not be able to move forward in her marriage if she persists in saying "it is no big deal", and if she doesn't look inside herself to determine what the CDing fundamentally means to her. If it wasn't such a big deal, if it was only about wearing silky things, it wouldn't be an issue since I'm sure Samantha could wear silky male clothes and she wouldn't feel the need to hide this from her wife. I am attempting to inject a dose or reality by encouraging Samantha to be real with helself and eventually with her wife, to hopefully help them overcome their current impasse.

Samantha can choose to look at it however she wants to. But, IMO she will not do herself or her marriage any favors if she disregards what most people in this thread are telling her. :sad: At this point it's not about looking back at the lies. It's about moving realistically forward, hopefully with a marital counselor to first tackle the trust issues.

[kimdl93]

The fundemental issue here is that Samantha and her wife are in trouble. Both of them may have made mistakes and may have unrealistic expectations of the other. But this conflict cannot and will not be resolved unless both parties are willing to take responsibility for their own actions. For the purposes of resolving this conflict, they need to be able to put aside what each may feel is justification of their position. If they can't do that, there's little hope for a reconcilliation.

[NicoleScott]

Reine, I understand that you're not beating up on Samantha but rather trying to get her to take responsibility for her role in this mess. I believe that both of us and many others want to help any way we can by giving our views (but see post #60 for "it's all your fault" finger-pointing with nothing positive to contribute). Yes, we know we screwed up when we didn't tell when we should have.
I have read and re-read the OP. Samantha's "no big deal" comments refer to the dressing, not the wife's reaction to finding out. Obviously, Samantha knows that this is a big deal and is very distressed about it. But Samantha is right about "no big deal" dressing. It was done in private, at little expense, not very often, and did not detract from any responsibilities as a husband or father. Are we not entitled to a little privacy, private thoughts and activities that don't affect anybody else? Would the wife had gone ballistic if he had been, in his private time and place, reading Harlequin Romances or working crossword puzzles? No, it wasn't just the deceit, it was the crossdressing. And what is so horrible about crossdressing, Samantha asks. What's the big deal?
Let's not let the wife off the hook. She lied by saying she didn't care what he's into, she just wanted to know. So Samantha told all, the whole story, and got clobbered. When Samantha came clean, she gets screwed. When the wife deceived, she's the victim.
Lorileah, I believe that like others, you want the best outcome for Samantha, and want her to understand her blame in the deal. I must disagree with you on one point, though, the pre-emptive strike. It looks to me like the wife, among other things, is afraid of her own embarrassment of being married to a crossdresser. So despite the threats of telling others, I wouldn't bet that she will. Coming out as a pre-emptive strike could be exactly what the wife wouldn't want to see. Just my opinion.
Counseling could help, but going to counseling to get the other spouse to see things your way won't work. They have to be working for the same thing. Where counseling could do the best is to open up the dialogue between Sam and wife. They really need to talk, but if it's going to work, the wife is going to have to start believing the truth instead of her own foregone conclusions about crossdressers. Samantha has opened up and needs to see the damage done by the years of hiding, but the wife must start thinking, talking, and acting rationally. And honestly.
Samantha, don't give in to extortion, or it will never end. I wish you the best, and I hope you'll keep us informed.

[Sandra]

When an unaccepting wife finds out, I find it interesting how they are not upset by the dressing, but by the "betrayal" Oh bull, they are upset by the dressing more than anything. If she had found out you had a gambling problem say, that would be a different story.




BS I think a lot of the GGs on here would beg to differ with you

[Avana]

When an unaccepting wife finds out, I find it interesting how they are not upset by the dressing, but by the "betrayal" Oh bull, they are upset by the dressing more than anything.

If that were the case, wouldn't someone be equally upset about seeing a random crossdresser on television or the street?

Someone might have an opinion about it, but it is the attachment to the person and the subsequent revealing of that person's true and previously concealed nature that causes the hurt feelings.

The key is that beyond the dressing there is the deep feeling of 'you are not who you led me to believe you were'. And this particular person seems to be relatively conservative in terms of values, which, coupled with what seems like a general ignorance about what crossdressing is, can lead to a lot of pain and confusion.

[ReineD]

But Samantha is right about "no big deal" dressing. It was done in private, at little expense, not very often, and did not detract from any responsibilities as a husband or father. Are we not entitled to a little privacy, private thoughts and activities that don't affect anybody else?

There is a huge difference between a harmless hobby such as reading Harlequin romances or doing crosswords (using your examples), and hiding a fundamental part of one's gender ID and sexuality,

I'm assuming when you say it is harmless, you see Samantha's CDing as being similar to your own, which you occasionally explain here as being a fetish. (Just to be clear, I do not put down fetish dressers). But, I would be heartbroken if I found out that my husband got off on things that he hid from me for years and that did not involve me. I would liken this to wanting to be with another woman and checking his email every so often to see if she had written (as compared to logging in here), and it would be a "big deal" to me. Even if my husband was in the room with me in body most of the time, he would not be 100% present since I'm sure there is an element of looking forward to "private time" and internet time that men who do not CD in hiding do not experience. Why is this so difficult to understand?

If on the other hand the CDing is not fetish or sexual for Samantha, then it must surely have a gender ID component, and this is also a "big deal". Does this make sense?

I don't blame Samantha's wife for insisting on knowing the truth. She wants an emotionally intimate and honest relationship with her husband. It's a pity he doesn't want the same, or that he may believe it is "no big deal" to bring an activity into his marriage that is a barrier to an emotionally honest and intimate relationship as long as it is hidden.

As previously said, the hiding is a moot point now. But to believe it is harmless to keep this from a wife is not OK, whether it is fetish or not.

At this point I've contributed all I can on this topic and I will not post more in this thread.

[SweetPea_GG]

The key is that beyond the dressing there is the deep feeling of 'you are not who you led me to believe you were'. And this particular person seems to be relatively conservative in terms of values, which, coupled with what seems like a general ignorance about what crossdressing is, can lead to a lot of pain and confusion.

I think you hit it spot on.. atleast for me this was one of the major issues that I felt when I first discovered on my own.

[Melody Moore]

When an unaccepting wife finds out, I find it interesting how they are not upset by the dressing, but by the "betrayal" Oh bull, they are upset by the dressing more than anything. If she had found out you had a gambling problem say, that would be a different story.

You dressed in private, you didn't try to force it on anyone, you didn't write off responsibility like work or family for this. You did nothing wrong.

I totally disagree, the OP did everything wrong by being so deceitful & dishonest!

Lorileah is right onto it here....


No the OP's perception is that the cross dressing was the issue. All the "are you gay, want to be a woman, want a man" questions are not about the clothing but about about what the wife thinks the clothing represents. The fact that it was a hidden and subversive hobby seems to be the issue with the OP. Harmless, in their view, undermining the relationship in mine (and I would say hers too). If it was just the clothes that bothered her, then she would have said, "Get rid of the clothes and everything will be OK".

I totally agree.... Its one thing to expect a wife to understand about the cross-dressing aspect of things here, but its a completely separate & more serious situation when it come to expecting the wife to get over the betrayal aspect of this situation while her cross-dressing husband is not willing to even address the problem & remedy the situation.

Here is a true story & it's nothing about cross-dressing, but its all about faith & trust. I kicked my son out of home after I found out he was stealing from me and lied about it. Sure I wouldn't have been happy to find out he stole from me, but he had a better chance of maintaining his dignity if he was honest about it, then tried to rectify & remedy the problem. I kicked my son out because he was in total denial of the problem when I knew differently. His own girlfriend called me up & told me that he stole from me & what he did with the goods that he took from me. If my son wasn't willing to acknowledge the mistake he made & remedy the situation, how could I trust him enough to ever want to give him another chance? The bottom-line is that my son completely destroyed all the faith & trust I ever had in him - now he is on his own until he learns to be accountable & take responsibility for his own actions.

[Alice Torn]

I see you are six foot six, 240. Almost exactly my size, so I can empathize with you not feeling passable in public. It is extra humiliating for you being so tall. It would be for me, but i have gone out several times a year. again, I hope the conflict can be resolved one way or another, in peace.

[NicoleScott]

Reine, it's not difficult to understand why you don't think fetish dressing is harmless when you equate it with cheating on a spouse. I don't think it is, and neither does my wife, who knows about my dressing activities but chooses not to participate but allows me my privacy. That may not work for you, but it works for us.

Sure, Samantha's wife wanted to know the truth but lied to get it. Sam chose to come clean instead of lie. That was met with hostility and threats instead of any desire to repair a badly damaged marriage due to his deceit. Samantha is not blowing off as no big deal her reaction, but only the act of wearing silky things because she likes it. In the OP, Samantha never mentions that the wife went ballistic because of the lie, but only because of the crossdressing. Yet many of you insist that the deceit is the major issue, without any evidence.

Samantha continues to get thrown under the bus.

[cordgrass]

Even if my husband was in the room with me in body most of the time, he would not be 100% present since I'm sure there is an element of looking forward to "private time" and internet time that men who do not CD in hiding do not experience. Why is this so difficult to understand?



I think that's drawing a distinction that's a little too unrealistic. Almost all men have "private time" and Internet time, even happily married men. That's just the way of the world. The difference is that ostensibly the porn men watch is on some level similar to the relations they are having with their wives--sure the wives probably don't have the bodies of the women in porn and things are racier, but on a general level it's the same sort of thing. An SO hearing about it for the first time is going to assume it's a fetish. So rather than comparing it to gambling, compare it to a fetish like spanking or something like that. A wife is going to feel like it is retroactively making the history of vanilla marital relations a lie.

Of course in addition there are plenty of women who think crossdressing is a sin or a mental illness or whatever, and that's at the very least misinformed. But even someone as accepting as I am would feel it a blow below the belt to find out after years of marriage.

[Valerie Nova]

There is another lesson to be learned from this story, and that is how to use the "incognito window" function of Google Chrome. Press Ctrl-Shift-N to get a new window that won't save any of your search terms or browsing history onto your computer. In Internet Explorer, it's Ctrl-Shift-P. Just make sure to close these windows when you get up from the computer!

Honesty is certainly preferable when it comes to wives and girlfriends, but I'm sure most if not all of us share computers with relatives or friends or co-workers that we'd rather not expose this stuff to. Actually, scratch co-workers. They usually manage your browsing history at work through their servers anyway, so these tools won't help you much there. It's kind of sad, but I've become very good at being dishonest and hiding things from people I'm close to, thanks to crossdressing in some form or another since early grade school and having a super-religious mom. I was never caught though, so all that practice paid off. :straightface:

[sometimes_miss]

OP, I was going to reply personally, but for some reason cannot send you any message. So.....
What upsets the vast majority of women most, is the destruction of the image she had of you as her 'masculine' husband. We fall in love with the image we create of our mate, based on what we know of them. That image has now been destroyed, and replaced by a feminine guy. Most women have absolutely no sexual attraction to that, in fact most are a bit repulsed at the idea of a guy acting like a female in any way. She has also lost any image of you as her reliable, stable mate, or even the strong guy she could count on no matter what, because to her, you've been deceiving her for a long time so everything you now say will be suspect as a possible lie. Feminine men are also considered potential liabilities should she need protection in any way, and you're also saddled with that problem because even if you're a professional wrestler, she's gonna think that there's now always the possibility you could 'wimp out' and be more sissy than guy when the chips are down.
I went through all that, did everything I could to convince my ex that I was still the same guy she married. Nothing worked. I don't know how to fix it. All I can say, is, Good luck.

[EllieOPKS]

So I know I will probably catch the wrath of the forum for my comments I am about to make. They are not intended as antagonistic but more so just a different view and discussion points.

Samantha, question for you. If you had told your wife about your hobby on your wedding night, do you think she would have bolted out the door or stayed with you?

Has she stated what the "wrong" thing is with what you have done (and might I add to this point in total privacy)?

If she had never found out about your hobby, do you think your marriage would happily last for decades to come?

It appears to me, that your initial instincts to make CDing a private thing was the right thing. Maybe not right for everyone, but for you and a lot of others.

I have stated before on this forum and I will say it again, even though the masses disagree - I believe a relationship is more healthy if both parties maintain a private life, as well as a shared one. Why not keep things that are not outside of your marital commitments but just the same, something you would prefer to kept to yourself.

Samantha, final questions - If you had it all to do over again, knowing what you know now - would you still have CD'd over the years? Would you have ever told your wife of your hobby had she not found your computer on?

I hope you both find happiness and peace, I am not judgemental of you or your wife but I am rooting from the sidelines that you find happiness and peace together.
Ellie

[ReineD]

I think that's drawing a distinction that's a little too unrealistic. Almost all men have "private time" and Internet time, even happily married men. That's just the way of the world.

I can't stay out of this thread. lol

I agree with what you're saying, and if CDers could turn it on and off at will, like a guy who's not addicted to porn but who enjoys the occasional foray, there wouldn't be a problem. But judging from the posts I read here, endulging in a feminine expression is akin to having an obsession for many CDers, even more so when it is hidden. There's no telling whether Samantha has minimized her desires described in her OP though. But I did say what I said based on reading descriptions of the oft discussed "pink fog", the sheer high that CDers experience when they can express themselves where everything else in their lives pales by comparison.

Maybe members here exaggerate how they feel when dressed and how much they look forward to private time, I don't know.

I have personal experience with keeping secrets and with wanting to be elsewhere than the now. It does prevent partners from being fully present in relationships. And it does erode trust, especially if the other partner has no understanding of what is going on.

[Lorileah]

Samantha, question for you. If you had told your wife about your hobby on your wedding night, do you think she would have bolted out the door or stayed with you?

If she had never found out about your hobby, do you think your marriage would happily last for decades to come?

It appears to me, that your initial instincts to make CDing a private thing was the right thing.

Why not keep things that are not outside of your marital commitments but just the same, something you would prefer to kept to yourself.

I was so ready to answer this but now I am dumbfounded. The wedding night is really well beyond the telling your spouse stage. This is something that no matter what you think is important for your future partner to know. It isn't something where you roll over, smile and say "gee that was fun and now that we are committed forever, let me tell you a few secrets." Is this so hard to grasp for some here? This is a commitment you all say that, it isn't just a let's see how it goes for a few weeks and then make a decision. Let's try something here. You get married you have visions of 2.3 kids, white picket fence, vacations in Disneyworld and on your wedding night your wife says she cannot have children and does not even like children, hates New England cottages or anything that has to do with picket fences and is afraid of Goofy. Yes I know that is over simplistic. What if she fails to disclose a marriage she is in? Her religious tenets that preclude you from doing certain things together. There are a myriad of possibilities. Yes you can say we will get counseling but that may never change her mind on any of it (just like you can never "cure" being transgendered). You make it worse by hiding all this for years. Years you cannot get back. Years that you could have had those children or house or visited the Magic Castle. Your whole concept seems to be reinforcing self centeredness in marriage. It is, last time I checked except in some rigid religions, an equal partnership, even Steven, good for goose and gander.

While I agree that there should be some interests that are not shared, say fly fishing or movies or using a metal detector on the beach, if it will in any way affect your relationship it should be revealed. And being a CD will affect your relationship. And you KNOW this before you get married, you know what she thinks of most things in life, yet you remain silent...fear of never finding someone?? Fear that no one will ever love you for who you are??? Willing to hide for your sake, not theirs. I hear so often here that people hide this to protect the marriage, the children, the job. No you are protecting what YOU want to protect. You are not considering your spouse. If she does not like cross dressers and you know it you hurt her chance at happiness because she will find out. And it is easier to get on with life if you don't have all the "things" you gather as you live together.

Ok I know I am yelling into the wind here. I know that 90% of the members here are just like Clark Kent. You don't have to announce it from the mountain top but you have to tell the ones who rely on the image you are projecting. The have a vested interest in this life.


Samantha, final questions - If you had it all to do over again, knowing what you know now - would you still have CD'd over the years? Would you have ever told your wife of your hobby had she not found your computer on?

Well duh, you know the answer. If you knew the stove was on would you have touched the burner? Samantha had a real good idea that stove was hot but kept almost touching the burner, how close can I get before I get burned. That may have been part of the thrill, how bad can I be and still get away with it? Maybe even thinking it is easier to apologize than to ask permission. If Samantha could turn back the clock, I am sure she would have.

I still think there is a deeper problem here and cross dressing is just a convienent excuse and as long as Samatha remains afraid od being exposed it will be a fulcrum in the separation, one that even though not a legal issue will be an issue in who gets what and when. I think honestly that snooping in someone's history in the browser is very low and really an indication of the morality of the snooper as much as the snoopie. There was a trust problem long before the computer was left on

[DonnaT]

I suggest you be STRONG and say flat out this is who I am to her. I suggest you NEVER show shame and NOT hide nor justify who you are.
I agree.

You aren't screwed, in a blackmail way, if you don't let her have any leverage. If she threatens to tell, say, "go ahead. I'm not ashamed of being who I am. I didn't ask for this to happen to me, but since it did, I accept who I am. In time, I hope you can to."

Maybe the marriage will last, maybe it won't, but don't live in fear.

[Tina2]

Do not let her kick you out of the house. Refuse to leave. If you move out the courts will consider it abandonment and it will make it easier for your wife to take your kids away.

[Hope]

I know this. I really do understand how difficult it must have been for CDers to understand about themselves prior to the internet. But, the OP has been lying to his wife even after forums such as this one were online.

No. Quite frankly you don't have any idea what it is like. You don't have any idea what it is like to be a guy and have to pretend to be super macho, and defend your masculinity even while being taunted for doing it by the people you would love nothing more than to be with. You have no idea what it is like to live in a society that is so afraid of what you are that it openly mocks, ridicules, and murders others like you who are found out. And suggesting that you do know what it like is arrogant and offensive beyond measure. Like all privileged people you are completely ignorant of your own privilege, and you honestly believe that you know what those who are not fortunate enough to be like you feel. You really have no idea.

But perhaps if you did you would stop trying so hard to justify a wife's anger around this issue.


Do not let her kick you out of the house. Refuse to leave. If you move out the courts will consider it abandonment and it will make it easier for your wife to take your kids away.

This


You aren't screwed, in a blackmail way, if you don't let her have any leverage. If she threatens to tell, say, "go ahead. I'm not ashamed of being who I am. I didn't ask for this to happen to me, but since it did, I accept who I am. In time, I hope you can to."

Maybe the marriage will last, maybe it won't, but don't live in fear.

And a double dose of this.

[kitchenette]

Samantha, I am sorry for your troubles. So much has been said here, but I didn't see anything direct about education. When I was first learning about my SOs femme side, I knew almost NOTHING of the trans world. I had a couple of gender queer acquaintances, but I knew nothing of their personal experiences and journeys. So even though you have a deeper understanding of what it means and four years of experience on this (awesome) forum, remember that she knows almost nothing about what CDing is. So of course she is going to have a skewed horrible perception of it (most people do bc it's so often hidden, in the closet and seen as not normal - not my feeling, but most of society's). Of course she's freaked about the CDing itself, how could she not be? It's completely foreign to her. She is going to be the Spanish Inquisition of Gender until she learns and understands what it means to be you. So, yes, go to therapy. Answer her questions. Try to get her to come here - the FAB forum is a great, safe space for her. It's going to take months, years, even. GO SLOWLY. Someone else said it was TMI all at once. Open your heart. Tell her about your personal journey. You won't win her over by saying, "I don't see that harm in what I'm doing." (even though you might feel that way.) That will piss her off because you are not affirming her feelings. She feels harmed by this because she was lied to and has missed out on a huge part of your life.

Just keep talking. It works. I have said (and thought) some crazy stuff to my SO. I'm glad he was able to see that it was coming from a scared place and could hear the feeling behind it more than the actually meaning of the words. Your wife is scared. She's throwing everything she can at you, she is trying to take control of the situation. She feels out of control. The only thing she can actually control is herself. Not you.

Good luck.

[Tamara Croft]

Wow... I couldn't let this one go...


No. Quite frankly you don't have any idea what it is like.

How do you know Reine doesn't know what it's like, do you actually live in her home, do you actually know anything about Reines life? no? oh right... silly me, thought you did :rolleyes:


You don't have any idea what it is like to be a guy and have to pretend to be super macho, and defend your masculinity even while being taunted for doing it by the people you would love nothing more than to be with.

Wow and I guess you have every idea of what it's like to be a woman living in a MANS world do you? Defending our rights to wear trousers many years ago, defending the right to equal pay etc etc...


You have no idea what it is like to live in a society that is so afraid of what you are that it openly mocks, ridicules, and murders others like you who are found out. And suggesting that you do know what it like is arrogant and offensive beyond measure.

Wow, this had me gobsmacked, now you're just being plain rude and ignorant yourself. What gave you the right to speak to Reine like that? I know Reine will defend herself regarding this, but this statement is just pure :BS: and you know it!! Do you think people just openly mock, ridicule and murder the TS community? You really must live a sheltered life if you think that :rolleyes:


Like all privileged people you are completely ignorant of your own privilege, and you honestly believe that you know what those who are not fortunate enough to be like you feel. You really have no idea.

And you're just simply an ignorant fool who needs to get a clue :Angry3:


But perhaps if you did you would stop trying so hard to justify a wife's anger around this issue.

Oh puh-lease, you have NO idea what it's like to be the woman who's partner has lied for a number of years about dressing in womens clothes, no idea how a woman feels inside about being betrayed and not being able to talk to anyone because their man is so ashamed, they don't want to be outed by the woman... if you had any idea how that feels, then you'd have a clue, but you don't... :thumbsdn:

[ErikaLeigh]

Well being from the pre-computer generation myself, I too went through a similar situation. I thought this would all go away when I got married, and like Samantha, it DID go away for several years. I had thought about telling my then fiance, and almost did, but changed my mind at the last minute. In hind sight for ME it was the right thing to do. I wasnt trying to lie to my wife, I was just an uneducated CD at the time trying to figure out what was going on, and trying to deal with this coming back after I thought otherwise. I have been married for 18 years and my wife has now known for 4 of those years. She told me if I HAD told her before we were married she would have went the other direction. When she found out she had all the usual questions asked in the OP, I told the truth and it took quite awhile, a several months in fact before she understood my situation. She still has hopes of this going away, but it isnt a deal breaker. Samantha is in a little different situation that I was in, in the fact the her wife is dead set against it. My best advice is to give her what she wants, go to therapy and by all means BOTH of you need to agree on a therapist. Have her pick a handful of possibilities and then you set down and agree upon one. This will probably mean she may have to "shelf" Samantha for an indefinate amount of time, and maybe forever. Will this stop Samantha from being a real part of HIS life? No! But one thing is for sure Samanthas wife needs to take the wheel and drive on this one until things get figured out. Taking the stance of "Prove It" is not the right thing to do, it will just piss her off and divorce is a good possible ending if you go this direction.

Samantha, Tread lightly, dont plead your case of being right. You are at your wifes mercy right now, the threats of blackmail could be real threats and you need to treat them as such. Let her ask the questions and just go with flow. Dont just try to give more info that is needed right now, it can come accross as pleading your case, let her ask the questions and answer them directly and honsetly!!

PM me if you need to talk or need advice from another CD.

[Nicole Erin]

Your wife can threaten or whatever but if she does, THEN what is she gonna try to hold over your head?

But yeah do not act shameful. some people love nothing more than to threaten or have some sort of sick control.

You don't get popular by being proud and shameless but it is easier than hiding.

[ReineD]

And suggesting that you do know what it like is arrogant and offensive beyond measure. Like all privileged people you are completely ignorant of your own privilege, and you honestly believe that you know what those who are not fortunate enough to be like you feel.

That was totally uncalled for. You have no idea who I am or what my life is like.

If I were you, I'd save the vitriol for the people who, in your words, openly mock, ridicule, and murder CDers and TSs. Not the people who empathize and who are supportive.

[SHINY-J]

This is my first post here. I've cruised the forums for awhile, but this particular story made me want to join in.

I had a similar situation. I was crossdressing a lot when my now ex-wife and I first met. Suddenly, the desire went away. I was enthralled with her and lost the desire to altogether. When we decided to move in together, I purged all of my wigs, clothes, boots, shoes, etc... Several thousands of dollars of clothes just tossed out. I obviously regret it now. I'd love to have some of those outfits/shoes/boots back. I never told her about my CDing because I (just like many others have) felt like it was something I had outgrown and that my new found relationship was the answer to filling the void I had felt before. Crossdressing was just something I did to try to fill that void. Although, I would help her go shop and I spent a massive amount of money on lingerie , clothes, panties, bras, outfits, shoes, boots, etc. for her as I just loved the way they looked and loved the way they looked and felt on her body. Still, I wasn't dressing.

Her friends when we first met were all into the Rave/club scene and were big on "E" and the entire dance scene as was she. I myself, was take it or leave it with the entire idea, but I was friendly and fun and it was never a problem. Many of her friends had various "social stigmas" (for lack of a better word) attached to them... Gay, Bi, Swingers, Adulterers, Strippers, etc.. DISCLAIMER - I'M NOT SAYING THERE'S ANYTHING WRONG WITH THOSE THINGS. I'm merely making a point that a lot of society has not embraced most of those lifestyles and many think that some are taboo or reckless. Case-and-point... This is a forum for advice on Crossdressing. Argument made-point proven. Now, back to the story.

Although she wasn't really into any of those things/lifestyles, she never held any of it against those she was friends with and appreciated them for the person that they were and the way they treated her. Which is the way I've always been. She accepted them entirely and had a very laissez faire attitude in regards to everyone. We stopped doing those things for the most part after tying the knot. We had been married for about 2 years when we got invited out with her old crew. We went out to a party and rolled. We were back home, getting along, and laying in bed- all was good with the world and just like many times when on "E", you begin to talk and have extremely in-depth conversations about life. So, as our talks got more and more intimate, and I began to think about how accepting she was of everyone else and their lifestyles, I thought mentioning that I had crossdressed before would take us to a new level of honesty and trust and that I had completely overlooked all-along the fact that she was so accepting of everyone else that this wouldn't be a problem. Well, I couldn't have been more wrong. I let it the cat out of the bag about my prior crossdressing. I hadn't even gone in depth regarding makeup, shaving legs, wigs, breast forms, how much money I had spent on my femme clothes, practicing femme walk, and the late night walks/drives for thrill. Immediately she had a repulsed look on her face and the entire mood of the room changed. a countless number of questions followed... How long? Are you still doing it? What types of clothes? Did you talk like a girl? Who else knows? and of course, ... Are you gay? Which was followed by Have you ever been with a man? Are you lying to me? Have you ever kissed another man? etc...

Immediately, my manhood and character where tried and convicted without any chance to give an explanation. The woman who accepted ALL of her friends and their lifestyles, was suddenly the most obtuse and critical person I had ever encountered. It was awkward for a few days and we just sort of never talked about it or brought it up, but her view of me had changed. Our sex life started to suffer. It was then that I started dressing again using her clothes. I would steal a panty here, a panty there, etc.. and my stress and anxiety started to diminish. Eventually, I sat down and tried to explain why I dressed and how much I loved the feel of satin, vinyl, leather, etc.. Hence my name Shiny-J. So, she begrudgingly accepted it and as I spent hours reiterating my love for her, she came around.. kind of.... She said that I could wear panties and said she would take me shopping to find them. Well, I picked out the ones with bows and bikini/thong style, etc.. She said they were too femme and she chose some that were just a blah brief but at least they still the satin/nylon/lycra feel.

I would still take her shopping for lingerie and she would see some that were really ****ty and shiny and say "I'll bet you love these right?" and she would roll her eyes and smile with an annoyed, but endearing expression and toss them in the basket. When she wasn't looking, I would throw some in there too that I wanted and then carry the basket around the store. When it was time to pay, I would tell her I was thirsty and ask her to run to the mall food court and grab me a soda. Then, I could get my things along with hers without her knowing. I stashed them and kept it well-hidden from her. Although things were going better, they still weren't quite right. And I always felt like something was a little off. As time went on, it did gradually get better but whenever we had a normal married couple argument, the CDing always came up if it got too heated.

Also, when we did make love, I always wanted to wear the panties which bothered her immensely. I just loved the feel of them against my skin. The sex was the same as always, it was just panties I wanted to throw in. I tried to back of off it, but I noticed that sexually, she became more and more distant and reserved and just not that into it. Fights were getting more and more frequent and the fire started to fade. When we did have sex, it was usually drunken makeup sex after a fight. In fact, the only time I've ever CD in front of anyone was during one of those drunken sexcapades. I stumbled into the other room where she kept her clothes and put on a vinyl teddy, thigh highs, opera gloves, a red vinyl thong, and red thigh high boots and walked into the room and we had some of the wildest, longest sex ever. She was ecstatic and so was I. When we were done, she told me she loved it and rubbed her hands all over the me in the clothes and we drifted off to sleep very much in love. Well, passed out is more like it. When she woke up the next morning and saw me laying next to her in the outfit, she flipped out. So, there's my lone experience of being dressed around someone. Sorry to ramble, but I needed to get it off my chest... I apologize.

Now, to the point. We separated and eventually got the divorce. Within a few months of living on my own, I was in need of a new closet for my femme wardrobe. Now, I CD and it feels good, but it's just to fill up that void again. We get along and try to stay friends, but anytime there is an argument, she threatens to tell about my CDing. Luckily, we didn't have children, but in the beginning I did get the threats of her telling friends and family and telling coworkers. It was blackmail. Same as you. She actually tried to say it to some friends early on in the split, but I blew it off and just said she was nuts. If nobody has any proof, then it just looks like she's crazy making accusations against you to try to gain leverage in a battle for mutual friends. She comes off looking like the one with a "problem".

Personally, she's in the wrong. Since I was a small child, I was taught to appreciate people for what they were on the inside and not the outside. I was taught as a small child to not make fun of others because their clothes were different or not made by an expensive designer. As a ****ing child I was taught this! What's more superficial than clothes? I can't count how many times I heard women in person, on TV, in books, movies, magazine articles, etc. complain that "their man doesn't look at them the same way because they got older, gained some weight, got a few gray hairs, etc. and "Why can't he love me for who I am on the inside?" After my situation and hearing yours and many others like it, I would love to see the reactions of every woman that has ever asked those questions if they saw their hubby/boyfriend walk out in full drag and say that they were a crossdresser. My guess is that at LEAST 90% would get the same reaction the OP and myself had.

I hope you find peace and that both of you find your way back to each other. I hope that if it doesn't work out, that you view it as her that caused it all to end. That may sound like some odd advice, but I just look at it in terms of my own situation. My marriage was happy and good and I tried to open up and just tell her about something I had DONE. I wasn't dressing at the time... I just told her I had done it before and it was essentially a dealbreaker for her. It just took a few years for it to break all the way. If she would've been more understanding, she could've had her dream marriage.

Crossdressing is completely superficial and innocuous. at least in my case. I never did anything that deserved her level of disgust and I don't think that you did either.

[Persephone]

Whew! Everyone seems to have weighed in on this, but one thing seems to have gone unsaid so far.

Samantha, you need to know that a whole lot of us, CD's, GG's, and whatever, feel for you and care about you at this difficult time.

Please consider this to be a virtual hug, delivered over the miles that may lie between us.

You and your wife and your family will be in our thoughts and in our prayers.

Persephone.

[JulieC]

SHINY-J I don't agree with some of what you posted, and I do agree with some of what you posted. Regardless, I just wanted to say THANK YOU for such a long, well thought out post. Welcome to the forum!

[robin1991]

wow Samantha

i really hope everything will turn out good eventually.
your wife might just need sometime to think and help just give her that time.
therapy for her might help but yea it all wil take time.

i havent been in these kind of situations because iam only 19
but yea i did read many of these kind of problems and most of them they all just needed some time to accept it.
but i do see her side that she feel betrayed she trusted you for 12 years of marrige and yet you just now she needs to come with it.
but yea i know its very hard i still didnt find a way to tell my parent but thats my problem not your.

i hope everything will be ok

robin.

[ReineD]

SHINY-J I don't agree with some of what you posted, and I do agree with some of what you posted.

I'd like to say the same thing.

Welcome to the forum, Shiny. :) What I'm about to say may seem harsh, but as an outsider, it is objective. I do want to tell you that I have been fully supportive of my SO in and out of the bedroom since the beginning and we go out everywhere together when she's herself. But, she was honest with me from the very start, so I went into the relationship with my eyes wide open.

From your story, I gather that your ex was OK with the concept of alternative lifestyles and also CDing as long as it wasn't in her backyard, but she didn't take it well when you told her about yourself some years into the marriage. I want to point out this is natural for most people, no matter the issue. It's easier to adopt a laissez-faire attitude when issues don't impact us directly. It's also difficult to deal with broken trust when the truth comes out after some years.

You chose to use the time immediately after she found out, when she was coming to terms with being married to a CDer, to sneak behind her back and wear her clothes. She eventually came around and tried to be supportive, yet you insisted on resorting to subterfuge and sneaking panties into your shopping cart for example. I'm not putting you down for wanting the panties, but this is a passive way of dealing with it and it would have been best for the two of you to deal with it differently. Your actions eroded her trust further. And last, you say she threatened and blackmailed you during arguments. Did she ever follow through, since you are prepared to deny who you are to anyone she *may* tell and try to make her out to be crazy? And did you ever say things in anger to her as well? Just wondering.

I don't want to take away from your pain and your frustration. The situation wasn't easy for you either. But, there are always two sides to every story.

[Lucy_Bella]

Shiny,
Here we have a case of meeting someone, someone to the eye because of acceptance to alternative lifestyles you would think could be more understanding to yours.. Then the hammer goes down to find it is not the case, being single myself that type of person in my search raises a flag to rather I choose to see her or move to the next .. Was I ever mistaken!!

Just because someone shows a tolerance to an alternative lifestyle does not mean she will choose one a partner. Many GG's here will be upset to hear that for most the only choice is to hide the dressing urges and allow the partner to fall in love with you ..
I agree it is a terrible way to find a partner ,one I will not do but many others do.. The best way to getting a accepting partner would be slowly intrudcing your desires and being honest from the start.. I am preaching to the choir I know and this isn't meant to beat up on you either . I will not settle for any GG who will not accept me wholely believe me there are some out there who do find an attraction to us but very few and in between are willing to ..

Why? Because GG's have other concerns ,Family and friends and what they may think, Thier children it may seem they would rather put a alcoholic above you because of perception .Isn't that sad? Whats really sad is most of us are decent hard working level headed ,family oriented, understanding,careing indulviduales who do not wish to be exposed to no other than our partner.

[Thalia]

I was not "discovered"; I told my wife after 15 1/2 years of marriage. It too did not go well. My story is, like so many others on this site, similar to yours. I only told her about my c/ding because I realized it was only a matter of time before she discovered my hidden wardrobe. We've been in therapy for two years - w/o therapy I'm fairly certain we would have been divorced by now. After talking about this endlessly together and with the therapist, it boils down to her feeling betrayed. If I had told her up front, it would have been a deal breaker for her and we both would have moved on. However, by creating the situation I did, she feels trapped. Divorce would be at great sacrifice. She feels that in addition to the feeling of betrayal she has lost the physical attraction which was so important to her. She has seen me dressed and pictures of my enfemme. Also, she has visited c/ding websites and has seen postings by crossdressers that profess to occasionally fanticizing they're female during sex. That raises questions about "lesbianism" in her mind. Actually, I get it. I went to great length to look, dress, act, walk, talk and feel female. I cannot convince her that I don't do that during sex.....especially when some other crossdressers have posted that they sometimes wear articles of womens' clothing during sex with their SOs. She acknowledges that it may be okay for some women but, like religion and politics, everyone has their own feelings about these things. It's okay for them but don't tell her how to believe in God, who to vote for and what to accept regarding sex and crossdressing. I guess I get that too.

[laurajade]

Over 2 years ago, I voluntarily told my wife after 16 years of marriage. I most definitely should have told her sooner, but I think I was still unsure if it was just a phase or if I wanted to fully dress or just wear hose and heels occasionally or what. Alot of binging and purging during that time for sure.

I know the frustration you are going through first hand. The best advice I have ever been given is take it very slow. If you have to, let her set the pace of acceptance. Baby steps. Because, as I like to say, my wife always dreamed of marrying her knight in shining armor, but now she finds out her knight likes to be a princess in 3-inch heels from time-to-time. Understandably quite a shock to her.

[ReineD]

You know ... this has been mentioned in many other threads, but not in this one yet (I think :p).

We do have GGs who, when finding out after years of marriage (for some, decades), who don't automatically scream *divorce* due to the broken trust. A lot of it has to do with the state of the marriage to begin with. With a 50% divorce rate in this country, it is not surprising there are many other marital issues that come into play when a wife discovers after some years that her husband CDs. But for some reason, these other issues are seldom discussed when a CDer comes in here and speaks of his wife's non-support.

Just saying. It might not be a bad strategy to work on all the other marital issues first and get the marriage in good shape before tackling the additional issues surrounding the CDing.

[kimdl93]

Just saying. It might not be a bad strategy to work on all the other marital issues first and get the marriage in good shape before tackling the additional issues surrounding the CDing.

I can speak to this from first hand experience. As I have mentioned before, even though my first wife initially accepted and encouraged my CDing, other problems festered and a ten year long marriage collapsed. The CDing didn't cause the break up - poor communications, issues of trust, an inability to discuss problems calmly, and low self esteem (I'm talking about both parties) are all things that were problems. The CDing only became an issue when the marriage was falling apart.

[msginaadoll]

To the original poster I hope that things are able to work out with your wife, for both of your sakes. I also want to apologize for the at times meanspirited comments(IMHO) that have been made. I guess I was taught to focus on the positive and be an encourager. I do believe that overall this forum is meant to be supportive and does a fairly good job of that. For some reason this posting has just taken on a judgemental and at times angry tone. Or Maybe its my imagination.

[melina]

WOW what a pickle! I have postponed "telling" for 24 years, 35% sure she knows but not to the extent of the rabbit hole. Yours, sounds vindictive, the dreaded spurned female, I am so sorry for you. I know it could happen to me at any time.. stay strong, could be something more positive.

[Areyan]

Quote by: JulieC

You need to look in the mirror as the first step towards reconciliation. This woman's life is in tatters because of your years over years over years pattern of lying. She is shaken to the very foundations of the understanding of what her world is supposed to be.

This isn't some little deal, some harmless little secret that wasn't hurting anyone else. This was fundamental, base core foundation of your relationship.

:yt:

why is this all about you and why are you still not purging atm? trust me if you continue to put yourself before your wife after she BUSTED you then you really aren't looking for advice or empathy but permission from others here to keep on making it go your way.


Quote by: ikthys

I ask the reverse question- does 12 years of being a faithful wife and mother to your kids mean so little that you will let it end so that you can go on wearing nylons?

yeah, how about that? does this also not matter one iota to you? or are you one of the selfish type who believe your marriage is an inconvenience to your dressing which YOU chose to hide from her all these years. :facepalm:


Quoted by: Lorileah

While I agree that there should be some interests that are not shared, say fly fishing or movies or using a metal detector on the beach, if it will in any way affect your relationship it should be revealed. And being a CD will affect your relationship. And you KNOW this before you get married, you know what she thinks of most things in life, yet you remain silent...fear of never finding someone?? Fear that no one will ever love you for who you are??? Willing to hide for your sake, not theirs. I hear so often here that people hide this to protect the marriage, the children, the job. No you are protecting what YOU want to protect. You are not considering your spouse. If she does not like cross dressers and you know it you hurt her chance at happiness because she will find out. And it is easier to get on with life if you don't have all the "things" you gather as you live together.

Ok I know I am yelling into the wind here. I know that 90% of the members here are just like Clark Kent. You don't have to announce it from the mountain top but you have to tell the ones who rely on the image you are projecting. The have a vested interest in this life.

thanks Lorileah for voicing what a lot of GGs try to get their CDing/TG partners to understand. investing so much into their relationships and marriages is also a huge part of their lives completely wasted all of a sudden on being lied to about what they love to begin with.

i'm sorry, Samantha, but after 4 years of reading at this website it seems you must have learned something in this time about coming clean with your wife, yet you purposely chose to continue hiding it, thinking you were getting away with it, not out of concern for her feelings.

there are two possible outcomes here and i don't feel sorry for you in either one:

1. your marriage is over and it's only a matter of time before the divorce comes.

2. your marriage will survive this for quite some time while your wife attempts to accept it and may even have a chance at happiness again if you can learn to compromise your needs with hers enough so that you can keep Samantha in your life.

the first outcome is most likely based on the amount of time you have been hiding this from her like a dirty secret - really, you've already done the damage there. and the other CDs here are being honest - if she has loved you all her life as her very masculine partner she will never appreciate a whole part of you "changing" to feminine in her eyes. just as you would not accept her becoming a masculine identity and behaving like a male, this is disgusting to her. as for outing you, typical of you to think of yourself in this crisis, not how much you have hurt her by this omission of an integral part of your entire persona.

you need a smack upside the head for trying the "it's just the clothes" line on lying about this for 12 years! if it wasn't that big of a deal then your fears would not have taken precedence over your natal male logic ;) lol.

[SHINY-J]

I'd like to say the same thing.

Welcome to the forum, Shiny. :) What I'm about to say may seem harsh, but as an outsider, it is objective. I do want to tell you that I have been fully supportive of my SO in and out of the bedroom since the beginning and we go out everywhere together when she's herself. But, she was honest with me from the very start, so I went into the relationship with my eyes wide open.

From your story, I gather that your ex was OK with the concept of alternative lifestyles and also CDing as long as it wasn't in her backyard, but she didn't take it well when you told her about yourself some years into the marriage. I want to point out this is natural for most people, no matter the issue. It's easier to adopt a laissez-faire attitude when issues don't impact us directly. It's also difficult to deal with broken trust when the truth comes out after some years.

You chose to use the time immediately after she found out, when she was coming to terms with being married to a CDer, to sneak behind her back and wear her clothes. She eventually came around and tried to be supportive, yet you insisted on resorting to subterfuge and sneaking panties into your shopping cart for example. I'm not putting you down for wanting the panties, but this is a passive way of dealing with it and it would have been best for the two of you to deal with it differently. Your actions eroded her trust further. And last, you say she threatened and blackmailed you during arguments. Did she ever follow through, since you are prepared to deny who you are to anyone she *may* tell and try to make her out to be crazy? And did you ever say things in anger to her as well? Just wondering.

I don't want to take away from your pain and your frustration. The situation wasn't easy for you either. But, there are always two sides to every story.

Well, in my defense, I had CDed prior to meeting her and we had been together for two years and I hadn't dressed at all during that time. It wasn't until 1. I told her, 2. she flipped out, and 3. the relationship suffered for several months (without any sex might I add) that I started dressing again to fill that "void" inside of me. Not immediately... Bear in mind also, that I told her specifically that I USED to, but that I didn't anymore. I made it very clear that it wasn't something that I was doing behind her back. And she wasn't married to a CDer... maybe a former CDer, but I wasn't at the time and hadn't been for over two years.

Also, and I should have included this in my initial post..., when we were having this in depth talk the night I told her, she revealed quite a bit to me. Many things that I could've claimed the same level of dishonesty from her and responded with the same level of disgust. But I was hoping to expel the skeletons in our closets and cathartically work our way through our "demons" by being honest and communicating. And as for eroding her trust, she never had any idea that I was dressing again until I finally sat her down after almost a year of avoiding the subject and had a long talk with her. It was only after I basically kissed her ass for a solid 3-4 hours non-stop, that she finally gave an inch.

As far as blackmailing me during arguments, she did try to tell some friends once, but that blew over as I dismissed it. As far as if I said anything in anger to her... Anyone who's married or been married knows that things are going to be said in anger at some point.

Bottom line - I feel for the OP as my situation was similar.

This part from his original post especially hit home for me....

"I was devoted as husband and father. Dressing never got in the way of other more important things. It’s funny how a decade and a half of fulfilling my responsibilities at work, home, in the community mean absolutely ZERO in light of my desire to wear women’s clothes from time to time."

It was never a problem until she found out. She never had any complaints about the type of person that he was until she found out that he liked to wear femme clothes on occasion. Same thing with me. My ex saw me swim through a school of Mako sharks... she saw me jump in front of a pit bull to save her tiny dog... she saw me jump from airplanes... etc. I was all man in her eyes until I told her that I USED to CD. Then, I slowly became the point of blame for anything wrong with our relationship.

It reminds me of this shallow girl I went out with a few months ago. We ordered wine and the server asked if we would like to see the wine list. I worked in the service industry and I know that many servers know best as far as what wines/dishes they have to offer and I told her to choose her favorite and bring us that. So she brings it over two glasses of red and we drink away. Well, my date was into her third glass and I was into my 4th (as she was deep as a birdbath and nothing more than a great body) when the server came back by with the bottle to top off our glasses as she only had a little left and it wasn't enough for a full glass. I asked what it was and she told me (I can't remember the name now) and then the server stated that it was actually a local winery that they had just brought in and it happened to be the cheapest on the menu too, but it was the favorite of herself and the staff. My date, bitch that she was, immediately got a disgusted look on her face, and pushed the glass aside. Point being, she was fine with everything until she found out it wasn't brand name/very expensive. To me, it's the same situation. Here I was handling all of my responsibilities at work and at home and being the manliest SOB she'd ever seen, and the lone statement that I USED to CD was enough to have her change her entire perspective of me. Don't believe me? Ask Rick Astley... Everyone loved his song until they found out he was a lanky white dude with red hair. Well, she loved me until she found out I had worn panties.

[cordgrass]

hmm... from reading that last post, I'm suspecting that your ex was the one type of woman that would never accept CDing. I may be wrong, but I believe a high maintenance woman, the type who gets hair extensions and breast implants, who spends a lot of time shopping for clothes and getting manicures, whose goal in life is to look like a Victoria's Secret model, is going to be the type of woman with the hardest time accepting crossdressing in a man, even if she is very liberal in her other opinions. For a woman like that, being femme is a competition against other women and she is winning. Saying that you CD is turning yourself from the prize into the competition.

It's ironic, since I assume the more femme the woman, the more a typical crossdresser would be attracted to her, but I might be wrong about that.

[ReineD]

Here I was handling all of my responsibilities at work and at home and being the manliest SOB she'd ever seen, and the lone statement that I USED to CD was enough to have her change her entire perspective of me. Don't believe me? Ask Rick Astley... Everyone loved his song until they found out he was a lanky white dude with red hair. Well, she loved me until she found out I had worn panties.

I hear you.

Anxiety about the CDing runs deep in our society, especially when it hits close to home. Have a look at this thread:

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?147901-A-Simple-Question...

You and other CDers have lived with the feelings inside yourselves for years, some of you for most of your lives, and you know first hand that you are OK, even though for some of you it was a struggle to gain self-acceptance and further, for some of you it took years. Other people need to overcome the same barriers in order to understand or even accept and even more so, since they have no first-hand knowledge of what it's like to be trans. And all these barriers are difficult to overcome because most things trans are still so deep in societal closets.

And if there are other issues in the marriage, if the couples don't have well-developed relationship skills, sadly the barriers are even more difficult to overcome.

[Gocaps14]

I am going through the exact same thing but my history is a little different. She was supportive at first, but that waned. About 10 years ago, I told her I wanted to wear panties 24/7. From that conversation we formed a dont ask, dont tell policy. We continued on, I know she knew what I did but never said anything until she found 2 pair of panties in my drawer. Ha! Most wives probably would have thought they were souvenirs...........she knew they were mine. Well, we were going to talk about it and never did and I threw away the offending items. We have other issues in our relationship and after one particularly bad fight I retreated to my room and poured my heart heart out in a letter to her, pretty much saying the same thing you did. I should mention here that my wife has a special affection to gay men, she says she always roots for the underdog. We basicly developed another dont ask, dont tell policy. SHe told me to be honest with myself, she didnt want to be a hypocrite. After over 20 years of wearing things when I can, I am beginning to understand who I am, and where I fit into the world. And really, I just want to be me, I am fine living within the stated boundries, for now. I dont want to be selfish but I want to talk about this with her and that is out of bounds. So I guess I pour my heart out here........

[Marcia63]

I'm sorry to read about your situation. very similar to that of mine and my first wife's.

We did go to councilling for a couple of sessions, but that stopped, when the councillor said that the problem was hers and not mine, needless to say that soon stopped!

I hope you can come out the other end intact.

Marcia

[Areyan]

geez, if you're transsexual you don't deserve to be in a heterosexual marriage, fooling a partner. i will say this time and again. you do not deserve to be in this situation UNLESS your partner knows. i dun care what your excuses are. they are never enough for putting your partner in what looks like a "gay" situation to them. if you're a cross dresser, not transsexual, this can still be worked on within a marriage but get your heads out of the pink clouds and try to accept that straight women who do not go specifically for CDs and transgirls are NOT lesbians and don't appreciate you making their relationship into something that resembles it.

don't foist this down a straight woman's throat as something she needs to accept. if you are stupid enough to hide it from her for years you do not deserve acceptance, really. if you get it you are lucky and should damn well treat it that way. if you are unlucky and your wife doesn't accept after hiding it from her for all the years you've been together, go suck on a lemon. really.

if your wife was hiding the EXACT same thing that would make most natal males angry and sick about having what looks like a gay relationship to them. natal males, get out of the pink fog and try to imagine your wife in a blue one. would you then be sitting here whinging and whining poor me or would you flat out dump her manly self and move on to a more femme thing? oh yes you would because that's how you guys operate. really, you expect far too much from natal women when you are expecting acceptance in the same situation.

that's all you CDs and transgirls need to get and you'll find the right one. honest. it's that simple. look for a partner who ENJOYS this kind of thing and stop wasting straight women's lives on your problem. you are ruining their lives by wasting their time on someone as screwed up about gender and sex as you are when they'd rather be with someone more masculine and "together" in his head as a man. and dun tell me you've got it together if you have gender issues because you really don't when you are putting others in situations like this - it's a clear indication that you have a problem, not that you have it together. i know some women here would disagree because they are into this sort of thing, but there are plenty who are not and this is the cold hard truth you "gurls" dun want to hear.

[CherryZips]

that's all you CDs and transgirls need to get and you'll find the right one. honest. it's that simple. look for a partner who ENJOYS this kind of thing and stop wasting straight women's lives on your problem.

I think it might be a bit more complicated than that.

[ReineD]

Areyan, you don't pull any punches, do you? :)

I hear what you're saying too, but there are GGs who aren't into and have never been into natal women (like me), who not only are OK with this, but who support their partners' right or wishes, or whatever, to be whoever they are. In the beginning I took the notion of gender out of the equation entirely. Now it's back in and everything's good, but it is doable.

People can be flexible if everything else in the relationship is going right. :) It's not one rule fits all.

[Krystyna_Marie]

This is the best thread ever. Samantha, you just told much of my own story, my wife found me out when she discovered panties in my underwear drawer. I too went through a several year period before marriage, and 6-8 year period after marriage when I did not crossdress, but as I hit 40 it hit me like a wave. I am who I am, I've felt these urges and my feminine side first came out when I was 5-6 years old. I have contemplated therapy for me, and hopefully for the two of us. I haven't done it yet, because I know it is going to be a difficult process. Best wishes to you, we are both strong enough to talk about this aspect of our lives, we will get through it, I promise you -

KM

[SHINY-J]

I hear you.


And if there are other issues in the marriage, if the couples don't have well-developed relationship skills, sadly the barriers are even more difficult to overcome.


I think that's what the most frustrating thing was. Our relationship was fantastic and we were BOTH very much in love. I was very accepting of not only the things I knew already knew about her past, but also the things she revealed to me that she had not brought up because she was ashamed or embarrassed. She specifically said she wanted to have that in depth conversation to open up and really get even closer in touch with each other than we already were. I didn't really have anything to tell her about other than the CDing that I HAD done (not at the time and not for 2 years). And, I repeat, I did not start CDing again until after the discussion and our sex life was essentially at a stand-still for months. Couple that with the fact that she accepted so many of her friends with their lifestyle choices and supported their choices AND that the things she told me were not exactly minor omissions... She told me that she had once gotten pregnant about 2 years before we met and had an abortion. She told me that her ex had cheated on her and she had gotten Gonorrhea. She told me that her and her ex had a threesome at one time. These aren't things that I held or would ever hold against her, but maybe they should have been mentioned somewhere within the first 2 years of marriage?

Plus, it's not like I was pining away to CD. Truthfully, I only Cd'd before I met her to enhance masturbation. It was an aide to help counter the fact that I did not have a woman to be with. It went something like this ; 1. Dress 2. Masturbate 3. Undress. As far as questioning my gender, that was never a problem. I may be in the minority here, but It's strictly a sexual fetish with me.

Did I still have thoughts of it when I was with her? Sure. Every time she wore something satin, vinyl, leather, heels, etc. It added to my excitement. Still, I don't think that my Cding years prior really warranted her reaction. The only thing that had remained for me since that time my my particular fetish for her to wear those types of clothes.

Still, I wonder what her reaction would have been if I had other things to tell her about my past. It's pointless now as the marriage is over. It's still the same situation for me now though. I still don't have a gender confusion issue. I still don't question my sexuality. I still use the femme clothes to enhance my "private" time and that's about it.

Even if I found a woman and she liked that sort of thing, I still don't think it's something that I would feel comfortable doing with her day in and day out. I would want to dress occasionally during sex and then be done with it. Just like anything else, I think it's different for everyone. For some it's only sexual and for others, it's anything but sexual and all points in between. For some, it's something they want to do on a rare occasion, and for others, they want to CD 24/7 and all points in between.

Still, no matter where one fits in the spectrums I mentioned, the majority of society does not approve or would mock them. I guess I would just think that for someone like her to have embraced her friends with all of their life choices/lifestyles and with the things I knew about her past paired with the a few extra "secrets" she had revealed to me that night, that my lone admission of one past transgression should not have caused the implosion of my marriage

[Babeba]

... I think honestly that snooping in someone's history in the browser is very low and really an indication of the morality of the snooper as much as the snoopie. There was a trust problem long before the computer was left on

I know this is a slightly older thread I was reading through, but...I've noticed in both firefox and IE that websites will pop up as 'suggestions' in a menu under the address bar when you start typing. Someone doesn't need to be suspicious and snooping at your history to have where you've been spending your time shoved up in their face. Just something to think about when using a computer others get to see.

[Jessie0276]

Sorry to hear about this, hope everything works out for the best. keep that head up, Jessie

[dawnmarrie1961]

Dearest Sam,
(Please take note: I am not a doctor. I have no diplomas to establish myself as an absolute authority on any given subject matter. )
As I read your post I noticed similarities to what I myself, and probably other members, have experienced.
Your spouse’s response to your revelations is typical. Please do not fault her for that because most people are not well informed about this type of behavior. Information they have comes from questionable sources, such as TV shows or the internet. People tend to believe everything they hear or see.
Firstly let me state unequivocally that you are a “NORMAL” human being. No doubts about that.
What you are experiencing is a “behavior”.
Some behaviors are simple in and have a well-defined purpose while others are more complex .Cross-dressing and other gender related mental issues fall into the more complex category because the clear purpose and dynamics are often clouded and difficult to define. But take heart; there is always a reason for a behavior to manifest.
I can only speak for myself.
“The catalyst for me was the experience of a traumatic series of events in my life. The resulting triple whammy threw me into a state of severe depression from which I had extreme difficulty recovering. Being a typical average everyday stubborn male I scoffed at seeking out any professional medical help and figured I could fix me. So I reached back into my past, remembering how wonderful and soothing wearing woman’s cloths was for me growing up. I opened the preverbal Pandora’s Box, not once stopping to think about how this would affect my wife, daughters, son, friends and all the people who knew me.
I didn’t care about them. All I was thinking about was me….me…ME! I was selfish and being self-centered. (I regret that now.)
Sometimes when things are really bad, people have a tendency to use “dumb” logic in order to figure out what to do. At the time I was hurting bad and needed something to feel better and be able to function again. Everything in my life seemed to be collapsing and suffocating me. I couldn’t breathe.
In my desperation I even had brief thoughts of suicide.
So I put on a dress and suddenly, like magic, I started feeling better.
At this point I should have seen the writing on the wall and bolted like an Olympic runner straight to the nearest hospital for a hefty dose of Prozac, or some other wonder drug.
No! Not me. I figured I was too smart for that. Yeah right?
My wife and children were accepting of me on the” outside”. What I couldn’t see, or didn’t want to see, was that the whole situation was tearing them apart from” within”.
The first thing that a “behavior” wants is: ACKNOWLEDGEMENT.
I was getting “acknowledgement” because….well…there I was standing in front of them in all my feminine glory and being kind of hard to overlook.
The second, and most crucial, thing a “behavior” wants is: ACCEPTANCE. (Giving a “behavior” acceptance is like feeding it a steady supply of steroids.)
In order to spare mine and forsake their own feelings, my wife and children feed me all kinds of nice compliments. They told me exactly what I wanted to hear. (I don’t fault them for that. They didn’t know what they were doing.)
The third, and final, thing a “behavior” wants is: EVERYTHING ELSE.
I’m not going to go into the details about what I’ve lost. Use your own imagination to fill in the blanks.
At some point you have to ask yourself: Was it worth it?
The answer should be: No.
I can only encourage you to seek help while you have the opportunity. Don’t be an arrogant SOB like I was.
You will save yourself a lot of regrets in the many years ahead of you.
Make the RIGHT choices NOW!

[Emme]

Unless you let her! You have done nothing wrong. as you go thru this you will soon learn to accept yourself. It takes a while for that. Birthdays help.

Allowing yourself to be embarrased is a handicap (IMOHO) YOU are YOU! "Don't retreat, reload!"....to quote a good friend of mine in Alaska!

If you will not let this be embarrasing...she has no power over you!

Your post really touched this old gal and If I am to blunt sorry!