A question for those who transitioned at work

[subaru_forster]

Hi. I have ambitions of transitioning at my job, but I want to make sure I do it as safely and sanely as I can. For those here who have done it, what was it like? Was your company supportive? Discriminatory? Pretending to be the former while being the latter in ways you can't prove?

Did your work surprise you? Full support at an auto body shop? Illegally fired at an office that "takes pride in its diversity?"

Finally, in any worst case scenarios, how did things shake out? If you took legal action, did you succeed? If you had to find a new job, how long did it take?

Thank you all very much in advance!

[subaru_forster]

Oops, there was already another thread on this topic. Sorry.

[Katesback]

It is a challenge without a doubt. I have just a few recomendations for you.

1. If you do transition perhaps after letting everyone know what is going to happen I would QUICKLY resist the urge to talk for to people about your transition. It simply prolongs your label of being a tranny. If you are a woman then simply be a woman and save the tranny talk for here or with other trans people.

2. Start applying for a new job once you get your female presentation and paperwork done. Why? Because the people at the current job knew the guy and will NEVER re-program to the woman. It is priceless to start a new job as the woman.

3. If you got past the second step DONT NOT TALK ABOUT TRANS stuff with your coworkers. DONT TELL them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! IF they know that is fine but dont tell them and keep your mouth shut!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now you might get some other input from others that would say it's ok to talk about tranny stuff with people. These people probably have not gotten past step 1 let alone step 2. They might even have some feeling that it is a responsibility to go and teach acceptance to the world. They might use examples of so called heros like Donna Rose or Chloie Prince. The problem is that when you go down that road you pay a HUGE price being forever labeled at a tranny. I myself learned that when I took the job working with trans people and I quickly learned that I was paying a huge price and not evolving. The day I lost my job (due to budget cuts) I celebrated and knew it was the day I could just be the woman.

Finally if you had a missing hand would you walk aroung talking to people about your handicap? I cannot say I have seen someone in that position do that, so why would you talk about tranny stuff with people?

Katie

[Stephenie S]

Amen and bravo!!!!!!!!!!!

Kate's message is one of the most important ones you will ever learn.

You will ALWAYS be "that tranny" unless YOU insist that you are a woman. It's that simple. Oh I know, in the beginning you are so proud to finally be out and yourself. But PLEASE resist the temptation to talk about it. KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT. Eventually you will want to just be left alone to live your life as the woman you want to be.

Stephie

[pamela_a]

Kate is spot on.

I'm sure I'll catch hell for this but IMHO being "the Tranny" ANYWHERE in your life should end shortly after it's begun. I view being trans as a part of who I am and not the center of my world. I am NOT a "tranny", I am a woman and that's how I live and expect to be perceived.

For me at work they took a "hands off" approach. It was considered the same as any other "medical condition" and treated it as such. They didn't get actively involved but they created no hindrances either. When the day arrived that I transitioned at work (which my IT department moved up a few days by being too efficient) I sent out an email to the people and groups with whom I worked with a brief explanation of what was happening and that was it.

[Steph.TS]

before coming out should I (anyone considering transitioning at work) apply to other places just prior incase negative response occurs? the idea I'm thinking of is to minimize down time of employment especially in today world when employment is more difficult, also what types of companies would be more likely to be supportive, what types of companies would likely be something we should generally be afraid to come out at?

[Rianna Humble]

Note to the readers - this is fairly detailed, feel free to skip part or all of it.

The other replies so far have been big on giving you advice - and they are right that you want to make sure people treat you as a woman not as a "tranny" - but in the main they have not actually replied to your original question about what it was like and how the employer acted.

My employers already had an equalities policy that states that any discrimination on the basis of "gender realignment" is a sackable offence. Several colleagues knew that I am transgender before I did anything about transitioning, and had encouraged me to be open about it. I held early discussions with my team leader then my immediate manager before making moves in the workplace and they explained the company's approach - which is actually a very simple one of seeing what support they need to offer me.

I had read through the advice on tsroadmap.com and compiled an FAQ to be made available to people in the two teams with which I work most closely. The colleagues who knew about my gender dysphoria helped me with this. The team I work in was fairly close knit at that point (although that has since changed with new arrivals and several departures) so the colleagues who knew encouraged me to speak to each member individually before the day and I am glad they did.

We put together a project team of myself, my team leader, my manager and my HR rep to oversee the practicalities of my transition. Within the project team I took a reasonably flexible approach but made it clear that the goal was for me to become just another female employee. After a couple of hiccups such as the HR rep not knowing whether I should be allowed to use the women's toilets straight away, we chose a date. In the UK, you don't need a court appearance to change your name, but you do need a witness for the legal documents. My manager volunteered to witness the documents for me.

A comic note came when they reminded me that I would have to abide by the dress code, then realised they hadn't published one for the female employees and had to get Head Office to come up with something for the whole company.

Two days before my transition, HR informed all the department heads so that they could be prepared to field any questions from within their department. My team leader and that of the other team with which I work sometimes read pre-prepared statements to the effect that from 1st July, Robert would be changing his name legally to Rianna and that she would be starting her transition. They also distributed the FAQs to team members.

Right at the start, there was a silly incident because the director who is in charge of the whole site had not been briefed and he stormed over to my manager to ask WTF was going on and why I was dressed as a woman. Once he was told about it, he was fine.

Virtually everyone has been very supportive and now treats me as one of the women - I was even nominated to the Group Forum (a sort of works committee) because I am a woman and they had only had nominations for men up until then.

There are a couple of girls on the 2nd team who are happy to help me with fashion advice and we often chat about shopping, make-up and other girly type things. If one of us tries a new nail varnish and likes it, we generally bring it in for the other two to try.

A couple of people on my immediate team who said that they would be supportive have since shown by their actions that they are not, but they don't do anything actively against me.

Near the start there were a couple of silly incidents that might have been accidents or might have been attempts at harassment (stuff spilt over my desk on my days off) but management acted immediately to ensure that this did not continue.

I have also been complimented by the manager of another department on how well I managed the transition and on my attitude when customers get my gender wrong on the phone. This manager (Alex) had had a transwoman in her department who couldn't handle people mistaking her gender on the phone and eventually resigned because of it.

The only other official reaction I have had to my transition is that in a review meeting, my team leader told me that my customer handling skills (which were already rated as excellent) had actually improved since 1st July. As an indirect result, I was nominated as November's departmental employee of the month.

I was feeling down, recently about delays in my treatment and my manager noticed. She asked me if I wanted to talk to her about it and encouraged me to take a long-term view of the delays, but said if I was feeling down again, I should just go over and have a chat.

I have recently started looking for work nearer to where I live, but that wil have to be a long-term project because of the recession being created inthe UK by government cut-backs.

[Faith_G]

before coming out should I (anyone considering transitioning at work) apply to other places just prior incase negative response occurs? the idea I'm thinking of is to minimize down time of employment especially in today world when employment is more difficult, also what types of companies would be more likely to be supportive, what types of companies would likely be something we should generally be afraid to come out at?I think that's a bad idea. Coming out at work is a time when you want management to think you are a dedicated, loyal employee. Why would they bother to support you if they think you are about to quit?

I think if you like your job, you should give it a chance. My work situation seemed impossible, but here I am 6 months later.

[Stephanie Anne]

You are going to have to do it whether you want to or not. So long as they know you as a good worker, you should be able to communicate with them your intent. Hopefully you will have an understanding management.

As far as this talk of making sure you escape the stigma of "tranny".

You're now and will always be a trans woman. There is no shame in that. There is no reason to run and hide away behind the veil of woman. While I endorse discretion and a level of dignity that comes with being able to have privacy about you being a trans woman, you do not need to run from being trans.

While i agree there is no reason to bring this up to anyone you are not comfortable with, until we all break this outdated belief that we must assimilate, we are going to perpetuate the hate that cause us to do it in the first place.

I understand that you need to be as comfortable as you can and keep a positive outlook. There will be times where you are laid low, that is going to happen no matter how hard you try to prevent it. That is no reason to assume that the only way you can achieve happiness is to hide once again. You spent all this time gaining the courage to stop hiding. Don't now try and rush through transition only to hide once more.

I have made the decision to be an advocate for trans normalcy in mainstream people's minds. I now it is not for everyone but until we all stop this reluctance, I don't see how we can ever have any pride in ourselves and those who share our same struggle.

[Aeva]

before coming out should I (anyone considering transitioning at work) apply to other places just prior incase negative response occurs? the idea I'm thinking of is to minimize down time of employment especially in today world when employment is more difficult, also what types of companies would be more likely to be supportive, what types of companies would likely be something we should generally be afraid to come out at?


I think that's a bad idea. Coming out at work is a time when you want management to think you are a dedicated, loyal employee. Why would they bother to support you if they think you are about to quit?

I think if you like your job, you should give it a chance. My work situation seemed impossible, but here I am 6 months later.

I think if it is a good or bad idea depends on how long you've been with the company, and how much you trust the company. If you've been at the place for many years, you probably don't have to worry as much than if you're a newbie there.

Also, knowing that you have a backup plan or a safe way out if worst comes to worse can be really important for some.

[subaru_forster]

Wow, thank you all so much for your insight! I really appreciate it.

Here are some clarifications, though I don't think they really change anything.

My intention was never to generally identify as "transgender" indefinitely. As soon as I present as a woman full time, that is how I will identify myself to anyone, unless the distinction is directly relevant and is any of their business (I think that pretty much limits it to TG forums, dating, and medical records)

I have been with the company for about 3 years now, and am pretty well liked. My job is to write code and maintain the software used in-house by a large retailer chain. I pretty much have everything in my favor except for one important thing: I'm not certain what I would do in the worst case.

As for this:


Start applying for a new job once you get your female presentation and paperwork done. Why? Because the people at the current job knew the guy and will NEVER re-program to the woman. It is priceless to start a new job as the woman.

I've read that it takes 6 months for a person's subconscious to update to a change to a person like that. I figure I should give them that much time before I consider doing that.

My plan right now is to be frugal and save up several grand over the year. If things go well, this money will be used towards electrolysis. If not, it will be good enough for me to live off of for a few months while I find another job. I've just been having low points that leave me feeling kinda depressed in the afternoons. Being called by male pronouns is getting harder and harder.

Thanks again, everyone!

[Victoria Anne]

Subaru , I was terrified to come out at work , once I did it was a non-event . I would advise talking to you HR representative and make known your intentions and set a time table , they will advise you of a course of direction with regards to who you need to talk to . Once you come out as yourself and are living as the woman you are then leave it at that , don't talk about it just be the woman you are and demand to be treated as such .

I only had to talk to my immediate supervisor , (HR did tell me if I had any bed reactions to tell them and they would handle it ) I have had no problems save for one , supervisor who persisted in calling me "sir" even though he knew my name is Victoria , I confronted him and demanded he refer to me properly as a women and that was that , now he calls me by name or mam . My point is you do have to be prepared to stand up for yourself but know when and when not to be confrontational.

I have been full time for 4 months and reputation is still solid with the company , I have been nearly 10 years so every one knew my male facade but now all except me for the woman I am and treat me with respect , just be kind and yet strong and you will have no problems. Good luck.

[Hope]

You are going to have to do it whether you want to or not. So long as they know you as a good worker, you should be able to communicate with them your intent. Hopefully you will have an understanding management.

As far as this talk of making sure you escape the stigma of "tranny".

You're now and will always be a trans woman. There is no shame in that. There is no reason to run and hide away behind the veil of woman. While I endorse discretion and a level of dignity that comes with being able to have privacy about you being a trans woman, you do not need to run from being trans.

While i agree there is no reason to bring this up to anyone you are not comfortable with, until we all break this outdated belief that we must assimilate, we are going to perpetuate the hate that cause us to do it in the first place.

I understand that you need to be as comfortable as you can and keep a positive outlook. There will be times where you are laid low, that is going to happen no matter how hard you try to prevent it. That is no reason to assume that the only way you can achieve happiness is to hide once again. You spent all this time gaining the courage to stop hiding. Don't now try and rush through transition only to hide once more.

I have made the decision to be an advocate for trans normalcy in mainstream people's minds. I now it is not for everyone but until we all stop this reluctance, I don't see how we can ever have any pride in ourselves and those who share our same struggle.

Thank you for saying this.

I have never understood people's need to duck back into the closet just as soon as they have clawed their way out.

[pamela_a]

While i agree there is no reason to bring this up to anyone you are not comfortable with, until we all break this outdated belief that we must assimilate, we are going to perpetuate the hate that cause us to do it in the first place.
Outdated belief we must assimilate? All I've wanted was to live my life as who I am, the same as any other woman. Now that I've transitioned and achieved that it's wrong?


I understand that you need to be as comfortable as you can and keep a positive outlook. There will be times where you are laid low, that is going to happen no matter how hard you try to prevent it. That is no reason to assume that the only way you can achieve happiness is to hide once again. You spent all this time gaining the courage to stop hiding. Don't now try and rush through transition only to hide once more.Hiding from what or whom? Is just living a quiet life as you've always wanted/needed to now a bad thing?


I have made the decision to be an advocate for trans normalcy in mainstream people's minds. I now it is not for everyone but until we all stop this reluctance, I don't see how we can ever have any pride in ourselves and those who share our same struggle.You KNOW being an activist isn't for everyone but until everyone is an activist it's not going to stop? I hate to break this to you but being trans or any other form of "birth defect" ISN'T normal and never will be. "Trans Pride"? Please explain to me what I have to be proud of by being trans. That's like being proud of being born with a cleft lip or other birth defect.
I'm happy I've finally been able to overcome what has been my past and am now able to be and live as who I am but I find nothing in any of that of which to be proud.

[Jessinthesprings]

Hi. I have ambitions of transitioning at my job, but I want to make sure I do it as safely and sanely as I can. For those here who have done it, what was it like? Was your company supportive? Discriminatory? Pretending to be the former while being the latter in ways you can't prove?

Did your work surprise you? Full support at an auto body shop? Illegally fired at an office that "takes pride in its diversity?"

Finally, in any worst case scenarios, how did things shake out? If you took legal action, did you succeed? If you had to find a new job, how long did it take?

Thank you all very much in advance!

No personal experiance but a friend of mine was "laid off" after transitioning. She was fired for being trans, but one of those things that's hard to prove. She had yet to find a job and that's been over a year. It's hard for anyone to find a professional job in this day in age for anyone let alone someone who falls out of the range of "norm"... That being said I feel that anyone can suceed its just a matter of finding the right niche.

[pamela_a]

No personal experiance but a friend of mine was "laid off" after transitioning. She was fired for being trans, but one of those things that's hard to prove. She had yet to find a job and that's been over a year. It's hard for anyone to find a professional job in this day in age for anyone let alone someone who falls out of the range of "norm"... That being said I feel that anyone can suceed its just a matter of finding the right niche.
I'm curious about the specifics of your friend being laid off. Was it a large company or a small one? What Industry? Was she the only person laid off or was she part of a larger group? What was her job, skilled, professional, labor, etc? Was it one that was easily replaceable by someone else or was it unique?

The reason I'm asking is I've seen many friends and colleagues get laid off in the past few years and most have struggled to find another job yet me, the trans woman (me) who has put herself into a unique position at work is still there . Depending on the answers and circumstances I think it's more reasonable to believe that she was caught in the recession like everyone else and I believe it unfair to blame it on being trans.

[mslenak]

Hi - I agree with some of the other postings here. If possible, it is better to start a new job where they only know you in your new gender role. In my own case, I took a several months medical leave of absence from work so I could keep my benefits and then got some of my surgeries and treatments done. I then started looking for a job. I was lucky enough to get something through a temp agency and then the get a full-time offer. As soon as I got the temp position I sent in my resignation to the previous job. My new job is in a different location so everyone knows me only as a female. I realize this is harder to pull off but it is worth giving a try if you can manage it. Good luck.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

Katesback advice is very good...
She is sharing a truth that can only really be fully understood in hindsight...nobody really cares, they have their own problems and lots of people would probably love to have your job or leapfrog you...

I think there is only one choice...if you are transitioning, you prepare as best you can, you press the button and see what happens..and the whole time you NEVER EVER say one bad thing, or complain or whine...you have a medical condition, you are fixing it...and you are giving your employer insight into how you are never going to cause a problem..one bad comment is pandora's box... i made this mistake andi 've seen others make it...i'm long gone from my fantastic job but only years later realizing that it was the right answer for my transition...this is the most common result people have had..

if you want to stay then you do your best to prepare info and find a couple supporters inside your work situation.. no matter whether you are beloved or not, a great worker or not...you take a risk that you will be shunned...and "shunning" can happen in more ways to count..
as shown by the folks here, that is not always the case, but even for successful job transitioners, they will never know how their careers are effected..

i was a boss...i had a ton of responsibility and a bottom line...this is what matters to companies...and to small businesses too...if there is a feeling your transition is costly/hurting the business/even risking hurting the business...you are screwed and there is nothing you can do about it...it happens to pregnant women, it happens to gay and lesbian people, it happens to people that speak up too much, and all kinds of others too...if someone supports you, they are risking their job too...keep that in mind..don't take it personally, it's business...so be a businesswoman

your only option is head high and do it as best you can... the chips will fall and you'll deal with it...playing games and threatening lawsuits and overfocusing on discrimination laws will bring focus to the risk of your situation...those laws are double edged sword...as a ts, you are on a list...when promotions come around people will have it in their minds...it could be they start a file on you just in case you get "uppity"....you are transitioning in the real world, and in business what people say to your face is quite often different than what they do...transsexuals learn this often!!

so learn all you can...listen to every post because frankly we all have our own experiences that may give you nuggets to get your best result...i have a more negative view because i lost my job, folks who kept jobs will have a more positive view...listen to us all..it's a great question and should be constantly updated as a conversation because every time another one of us goes through it, the landscape changes...

[Cathypb]

I think it depends a lot if your company has a defined policy. I am lucky in that I work for a big company that has a supportive & accepting policy, except for the certain heathplan non-coverage elements :( In the end, it wasn't nearly the big deal I thought it would be. I wasn't even close to being the first.

[Cheyenne Skye]

I personally don't have the experience but I'd like to throw in my two cents anyway. I work for a very large national company who has a diversity policy. Am I scared at the very thought of transitioning at work? Heck yeah. The diversity thing looks good on paper and gets them good press but when it comes down to it, it's the people you work with. Are they open minded or close minded bigots. If I transitioned at work, I'm sure my bosses would make the necessary accommodations, but my coworkers would probably end up talking about me behind my back, even occasionally making disparaging remarks to my my face. So only you can tell what it would be like to transition in your particular workplace environment.

[Diane Elizabeth]

Worse case scenario is that you are not accepted by your co workers despite any company policies. The teasing and torture from them leads you to quit or do something in defense which gives the company cause to fire you. With no unemployment one becomes depressed until it drives you crazy. Thats just one worse case scenario. Whatever you fear the most about it is your WCS though. I pray no one has that problem. Good luck.

[Veronica_Jean]

I transitioned on the job in June 2010. I have continued to work there and I am being given more responsibility along with higher levels of access. I could not be happier on how it has all turned out.

I told everyone about two months before I transitioned and since I have simply let others ask if they are interested, or make their own assumptions. I work as a contractor on a military installation along side other contractors, civilians, and military people.

I anticipate being promoted into the position I am currently working in March once reviews are completed. There are those that continue to struggle with the he/she thing, but it is simply their issue and not given or taken as a means to insult or hurt me.

It is different for everyone and there is no single correct way to transition, nor way to live your life. That is a decision you have to make for yourself. However, having a consistent income and positive workplace can go a long way toward establishing a normal life that you can take you to wherever you want.

Veronica

[noeleena]

Hi.

We are a bit different over here & how i went about details & things. i was self employed & as a builder of some years at the time 42 years , so age can be a help it was for me & being quite well known helped as well. before & after, they those i know just accepted with in a very short time not months it was days because i had been in the media those who wont to know , knew all about me over night. pretty much it was accepted with out ? even those firms i had dealt with for years just asked me is that you , noel , i said yes it is. so from then on they have called me noeleena . thats how quick these are men & 97 % of people have done the same. even those i worked with accepted there & then oh your a woman okay, end of so yes people can accept ,

While it was good for me & i have had with out ? acceptance was there . i wont say itll be the same for every one.
What i found was you be open have a good out look on life just have a attatude of life is good & it can be if you wont it . be happy in what you do be pleasent with others & be socialable with others not standoffish. & disarm them so they see you really are a part of the group , firm what ever.
any way just a few thoughts,

...noeleena...

[Teri Jean]

When I transitioned on the job I had a mixed bag of reactions but nothing that was too difficult. The University envirorment is one of acceptance on the whole but this year the faculty have opened their classroom doors and have asked me to speak to the classes. I have done a couple to date with another planned for this April. This has been the biggest boost to my confidence besides the individuals who have surprised me with their acceptance.

[Kathryn Martin]

If you have the opportunity to be discreet about it, it is my view that keeping things under wraps is very important. To achieve normalcy post transition you want to make it a non-event and get to full acceptance with your co-workers as quickly as possible.

If you cannot do this without it being a "newsworthy" event in your community (which is the case for me) then you still want to be discreet until you are ready. At that time, you want to take proactive steps that permit you to control the message to the largest extent possible. In my case being self employed in a highly visible profession it means preparing my professional fields of activity, i.e. clients, courts and colleagues through some sensitivity training and professionals to talk to and get advice from.

Discretion and keeping quiet is, in my view always the default position. While being a hero, sacrificing and advocacy sound really good on paper and the screen, the reality is it does not pay your bread and butter and often get's you in more trouble than you want to. And, that on top of everything you have to deal with? Don't overload!

[Angel.Marie76]

So much information in here! I recently came out to my job, and started working full time as my true self as of New Years 2011. In a year before that time, I had informed my HR department of that change. (See many of my threads on here for that) They took it all in stride, and did everything officially. They reviewed the concept internally, hired a consultant to reference and train, and educated the staff in less than a year. Everything was orchestrated without issue.

The staff have been friendly, and overtly accepting across the board. Do I think there's a few that are not to comfortable with it? Yeah, but they're doing well to keep their mouth(s?) shut for the time being. As it stands I have one rather aggressive and supportive ally in the office that's been checking in with me almost every other day, and dwindling to once a week now. Because of his support I don't feel afraid to be here, and know that, even in the worst cases of support, if I ask for help from him, action WILL be taken. Do I feel like they are trying to phase me out? Absolutely not. They spent probably a good few thousand dollars to get everything ready for my RLE, so the investment should need to repay itself before it's cast aside (if ever).

My opinions, though, of perspectives of fellow employees differ than some of this thread. I can only say that I KNOW people have known me at my office for 6 years before... now I'm a woman F/T... they're adjusting with names and pronouns as appropriate with screwups here and there. I don't have a problem with my Trans status at work, as at least I get to be who I want to be, and regardless if I am accepted completely as a woman, or just as a transwoman, I will still be content with my life. I see so many people (including myself) who are often very pre-occupied with passing. For some people, it is a necessity.. for others, a convenience. If you are not content with yourself regardless of whether you pass or not, you may have a much harder time living your life in a more pleasant context.

I KNOW there will be people who will choose not to accept me as a 'true woman', and yes, it will hurt my feelings. However, being called 'The Office Tranny' (behind closed doors obviously) can't really be helped. Would I perhaps prefer to live my life without the trans- reference attached? Sure. Do I think will happen? Sometimes, yes. Do I have a PILE of coworkers that are so awesome they have already brought me in BAGS of (really NICE) clothing for me to try on / keep just because it doesn't fit them anymore? Absolutely. THAT makes the fact that I may be called a transwoman for the rest of my time here just a little speck of dust in the big picture.

[ReneeT]

Angel, that is absolutely AWESOME! Truly a workplace success story! Do you mind naming your employer? Are they participants in the HRC CEI?

[Angel.Marie76]

Angel, that is absolutely AWESOME! Truly a workplace success story! Do you mind naming your employer? Are they participants in the HRC CEI?

I'd rather not in this particular place. Suffice enough to say that I work for a financial institution in the Northeast, that I'm in the I.T. field, and generally don't interact with the public on a day to day basis. However, I do interact with vendors constantly, so while customers might be one-offs hat I'll likely not talk to, the many vendors I deal with have ALSO known 'him' for those same six years. My company also went through the effort to inform the most immediate ones of my transistion, and to be clear with them that they were to accept the situation, or else.