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Kate
09-21-2005, 06:51 PM
Hi all. I'm new here, but have been lurking around a little and have found some helpful things on this forum already.

I am hoping that some of you might be able to help me more; perhaps to start with a little background. I am 28, and have a good life - a loving wife, a dream job, a big house etc. However, over the last 18 months I have started to seriously question my gender. Mostly secretly, I have always wanted to be/appear female, but thought I was "just a TV" (mainly since I used to get sexual kicks out of it) - it seems to run a lot deeper than that though. One thing that has really brought things to the forefront has been my introduction to online games - a place where I can be who I really want to be. Even before then I had basically stopped crossdressing (I was only ever a closet-TV anyway) since although it feels nice, I know that I look hideous - a man in a frock (sorry, but ick! :/).

Anyway, I'm rambling. I have been seeing a professional counsillor with appropriate expertise for the last 6 months, and we have explored various aspects of me, my emotional state, my childhood, etc etc. During the course of this it also became apparent that I was fairly seriously depressed, and my doctor recently put me on prozac.

There are a number of factors in my depression, but a large one is this; I seem to want to be a woman, and yet to "change" would destroy my life, terribly wound the one person I care about above all others (my wife), and would probably leave me as an ugly woman with fairly serious sexual dysfunction for the rest of my life (the latter two being trivial in comparison to the hurt I would do to my wife). There seems only one sane choice at first; to lock it away and live my life as it is. Yet, when I think that the future seems bleak and pointless (ie. depression).

What I really want to figure out is whether I am a TV who has taken the fantasy too far and will be able to go through a year or two of distress but come out the other side happy with who I am, or whether this is something deep that will continue to haunt me and I should therefore get the pain over with now, for my and my wife's sake. My counsellor is not able to answer that question for me, although I had foolishly hoped she might.

I know you will all say "that is something only you can answer", but I need more information. I need more ways to measure myself - more people to compare notes with. This is my first forray into a TS/TV forum of any sort and I could use some pointers as to where to explore further....?

Vaerise
09-21-2005, 07:39 PM
Kate, we seem to be in the same boat. I too cannot figure out what is happening with me, and has been hoping that the therapist is able to provide me some answers. I also dabbled in online games and enjoyed playing the opposite sex not for the perks for being female, just that it felt right doing so. Although when questioned I would say I am male.

Has there been any things happening to you lately that may have kick start this "urge to be a woman"? Did you feel like you wanted to be a women since you were younger before or after puberty? There are alot of resources out there that discusses being Transexual, pre/post op. Perhaps you might want to do a bit of research and compare your experiences?

Also what did your counsellor tell you?

Lastly, there are some girls here who are transexual but did not want to transition because of their family (wife and kids) the implications that comes with it would be too dire. I think they might have better advice as they are far more experienced since they have been dealing with it far longer than I have.

Well since I am like you, it would be like the blind leading the blind, but I want you to know that you are not alone and hopefully things will get better for you.

Kate
09-21-2005, 08:22 PM
I also dabbled in online games and enjoyed playing the opposite sex not for the perks for being female, just that it felt right doing so. Although when questioned I would say I am male.

Hmm. For me it has been a double life for the last year or more. I am an active (and popular) member of group online gamers and they almost all think I am a real girl. I lie through my teeth and tell myself that perhaps its not really a lie... I even became involved with someone - I had to tell them of course, but they embraced it and I had a blissful few months in an online relationship with someone who treated me as a girl. It was so fulfilling... and so terribly heart-breaking when they left me suddenly (and yes... I did say I was married, so it was an affair *sighs* :()


Has there been any things happening to you lately that may have kick start this "urge to be a woman"? Did you feel like you wanted to be a women since you were younger before or after puberty?
...
Also what did your counsellor tell you?

I have a poor memory of my childhood, but I know I first started crossdressing to a degree from as early as 13. As far back as I can remember, I have always been powerfully drawn to stories where there is a gender transition and I have always taken a female role if possible (I used to play pen-and-paper roleplaying games at school for example. I was always the girl...).

There is perhaps one key event recently. My father died in 2002 and that seemed to... liberate me. My counsillor and I have been exploring the way in which - up to that point - I seemed to have been trying to lock out all emotion; to deny a part of myself (he was the one person I would have hated to know about me). Where we are at the moment, she describes me as being a bit of both; Someone who has a gender-inditerminate mind, and agrees that I'm certainly not a normal TV. I think she thinks it may all just be a fantasy that has gotten out of hand... yet it "feels" so very real.

Rachel_740
09-21-2005, 11:14 PM
Kate,

No counseller who is whorth having will tell you that you should transition. As you suggest at the end of your post - that is down to you alone.

Reading your post though, it looks to me like you've (deep down made the decision that you want to be a woman, but you don't want to destroy (in particular) your wife's life and the other things you have going for you. My suggestion is, you have most of your life ahead of you. Sit back, take a hard look at yourself, your true feelings and just take this very slowly and see in what direction your life developes, then re-evaluate in a couple of years.

During that time you can also work on your looks etc, if that's what you choose to do.

Take your time Kate!

Anne

Kate
09-22-2005, 07:22 AM
Thank you both for your input. My counsellor is infact specialised in the areas of sex, relationships and sexuality and certainly seems qualified and experienced (her resume is impressive) although GID counselling is not her "headline" skill. Currently, she is still trying to work through some of my other issues before really tackling the gender one, which seems sensible.

As for my wife; she does know - to a degree. She knows I am getting counselling for GID, however I have perhaps not been totally honest with her about where my thoughts are taking me. I think she feels "safe" because I seem to be "doing something about it" - but does not realise that I am seriously considering a new life. I guess I should try and be honest with her about that. My sister knows the full truth at least, and seems relativly unphased by it.

Although I do appreciate what you are saying about patience, I feel like I have already wasted so much of my life (perhaps). I desperately regret not having been able to address these issues when I was younger. I have already missed out on being a girl, and if I am to change then I do not want to miss out on life as a young woman. For me thats quite an important factor; I do not simply want to "be female" - I also want to live my life and interact with others as a woman, and being able to do that while still fairly young is important. I would be basically starting my adult life again after all.

Heh - that said, I'm getting rather ahead of myself. I do not even know if this is "real" or if its just a "phase" or some such! It certainly feels real though....

MandyTS
09-22-2005, 10:06 AM
I am in the same boat you are.

I just got my dream job, and have a few really good friends. I have know I was TS from a very young age, etc. I am not the size of your stereotypical TS person, 6'6", 210 (could be 195 or so), etc.

I do not know if I wil ever transistion, right now I can survive in male mode, particulary because I never knew what it was like to really grow up as a true "guy", with all those raging hormones, etc.

You have to do what is right... but also give it some time, you have a long long life left and these things can not be pushed...

Good Luck

Vaerise
09-22-2005, 10:17 AM
Thank you both for your input. My counsellor is infact specialised in the areas of sex, relationships and sexuality and certainly seems qualified and experienced (her resume is impressive) although GID counselling is not her "headline" skill. Currently, she is still trying to work through some of my other issues before really tackling the gender one, which seems sensible.

As for my wife; she does know - to a degree. She knows I am getting counselling for GID, however I have perhaps not been totally honest with her about where my thoughts are taking me. I think she feels "safe" because I seem to be "doing something about it" - but does not realise that I am seriously considering a new life. I guess I should try and be honest with her about that. My sister knows the full truth at least, and seems relativly unphased by it.

Hey Kate, I dont feel that you should drop the bomb on your wife, at least not yet. Give time to prove it first. I felt that its much better that one person go through the pain and agony compared to having two person go through it. I mean at the moment you arent really sure. It can be a rather trying moment on the relationship imho.



Although I do appreciate what you are saying about patience, I feel like I have already wasted so much of my life (perhaps). I desperately regret not having been able to address these issues when I was younger. I have already missed out on being a girl, and if I am to change then I do not want to miss out on life as a young woman. For me thats quite an important factor; I do not simply want to "be female" - I also want to live my life and interact with others as a woman, and being able to do that while still fairly young is important. I would be basically starting my adult life again after all.

Heh - that said, I'm getting rather ahead of myself. I do not even know if this is "real" or if its just a "phase" or some such! It certainly feels real though....

I can appreciate where you are going with this. I too want to be known as a woman and interact with people as a woman. And I would want to live my live as woman or how I feel to be when I am still young, I dont think any sisters here would want to miss out their younger days living as they should have been. Already we miss going through our childhood and adolescent years as a female, the thought of waiting as the years go by can be rather trying.

Just a sidenote, I thought about the possibility of online gaming and gender bending might have contributed to our situation. I suspected that perhaps, we were might not have the alpha male brains, but being more or less adrogynous in thinking found that the being in the female role brought forward us far more pleasant feeling. This carried too far and eventually brought us closer and closer to our feminine side which we enjoyed. This continued until it might have became an obsession. So obsessed that we MUST be woman, because we felt better being a "virtual woman" that exists in an online game. That persisted until the desire to play a woman is replaced by actually wanting to be a woman in real life.

Well anyway thats me theorizing, which I had hope might be true in my case. As I feel that transitioning is certainly not a bed of roses.

Kate
09-22-2005, 10:58 AM
Vaerise,

I have wondered a lot about whether pretending to be a RL girl in online games (and other online environs) has contributed to my current self-perception. The problem is that it is hard to see if it is a cause, an effect, or perhaps some sort of facilitator - merely exposing what was already there sooner than we would have got there on our own.

In my quest to try and answer my personal "am I a TV or a real TS" conundrum I came across this interesting document:

http://www.genderweb.org/experien/obstg.html

Its quite bulky, but scroll down to the transsexualism section, and the writer's three "categories". Irritatingly I find myself strongly associating with the description of the "late onset transsexual", but "the escapist crossdresser under extreme stress" model also fits too :/

The reason I may seem unrealistically keen to pidgeon-hole myself is that if I am just a "stressed crossdresser" then this will probably pass in time. If it is real, and lasting though then I need to be starting to take steps... I have a nasty suspiscion that the only way to find out will be a long, painful prison sentence as I am, but I have not given-in to that yet.

Kate.

Bianca
09-22-2005, 02:36 PM
Councilors never seem to answer questions they only seem to ask them :(

But in terms of measuring yourself theres lots of online tests like the cogiati test , or even, if u can manage the time ,a mini real life test for a long week end or a week. See how that makes you feel, and see how u feel about societies reaction to you - harldy conclusive I know, but at least its an indication.

xxx B

Kate
09-22-2005, 06:05 PM
I had not tried one of those COGIATI tests before, so I asked Google earlier. :) I checked around and there seems to be a lot of cautionary writing about them, and it seems rather crude, but I gave it a whirl anyway. As one might guess it put me in the class 4 one "probably a late-onset transexual", but I do not plan to read too much into it. Another snippet of information however, and the questions were interesting from a gender psychology point of view.

A mini "real life test" does keep on coming up as a suggestion. In all honesty I would love to live as a woman for a time, but I just don't see how it is practical. The idea of trying to pass in public fills me with abject horror. I already know what its like to be girly at home (its lovely, relaxing, nice), but that too is something I only ever do alone - and therefore rarely. :/

Infact the prospect of perhaps having to go through a RLT is something that worries me a lot; I do not think I could manage it without changing my face. Such a thing sounds like a torturous nightmare - why would anyone think that is a good idea?? Some sort of test of your resolve - public humiliation for months on end? No thank you very much!

As you can probably tell, I have an extremely dim view of the cross-dressed me (which is also why I do it very little now). I honestly don't know how some of you girls get the courage to step outside the door without FFS - I do not feel I could, and I'm worried that should I decide to transition that will cause me problems.

MandyTS
09-22-2005, 10:24 PM
You are the same boat as me again,

I dress and look in the mirror... and realize that to me I see a guy in makeup looking back in the mirror, not the girl I see inside. I could never go RLT without FFS, to make me look femine and possably transistion on the job. I have heard that FFS is even more important than SRS for most people, FFS will help you pass, SRS does not to a point.

Another concern is finding someone who helps with the action of "being a woman", i.e. how to sit, what to do with legs, hands, etc. I guess it all comes with experience though...

But then a week or so of RLT will really help someone to see if they are really serious. It is discouraging looking in the mirror though sometimes.

Kate
09-22-2005, 10:56 PM
Mandy,

It does sound like we have a lot in common. Bizarrely (given that I a "normal" male) I am in some ways better off though I suppose - I am only 5'8" and my fast-falling weight just passed below the 11stone (154lbs) mark, although I do have annoyingly large feet. It must be really hard for you though, but I'm sure all the physical issues are surmountable. *hugs*

If I were to transition, my ideal would be to present it to those who know me as a fait-acomplis rather than going through a phase of looking hideous. That is certainly one thing you have going for you; I would like to get a better grip on what the RLT is actually for in some ways... I could almost argue that I have spent the last 18 months leading a double-life online anyway. I interact daily with people as Kate via MSN & other means. Hardly comparable to real life, but worth something as a test I would have thought? Its certainly not something I have tired of...

Kate.

Bianca
09-23-2005, 04:18 AM
While I would like FFS if I could afford it the idea of doing that b4 having any real life experience strikes me as unwise. It would be difficult if not impossible to reverse and if you couldnt hack it then what ?

Vaerise
09-23-2005, 09:00 AM
Mandy,

I could almost argue that I have spent the last 18 months leading a double-life online anyway. I interact daily with people as Kate via MSN & other means. Hardly comparable to real life, but worth something as a test I would have thought? Its certainly not something I have tired of...

Kate.

I could certainly relate to that experience, I was in the female role for 2 years until I decided to put an end to it. The feeling of shame and guilt was too great to ignore, it felt right but ethnically it wasnt right. I was cheating on them afterall I was not a real GG.


While I would like FFS if I could afford it the idea of doing that b4 having any real life experience strikes me as unwise.

I have comtemplated about having FFS done, being passable would be a much greater bang for the buck than having the SRS done. No one is going to pull down our pants/skirts and see whats really between our legs.
As for RLT before FFS, I felt that FFS might help us pass better making RLT an easier process? I might be wrong here, hopefully some of the wiser sisters can step in and relate their experiences?

Kate
09-23-2005, 06:51 PM
I could certainly relate to that experience, I was in the female role for 2 years until I decided to put an end to it. The feeling of shame and guilt was too great to ignore, it felt right but ethnically it wasnt right. I was cheating on them afterall I was not a real GG.

I'm afraid to say I still am doing it. Some of the people I consider my closest friends I only know online, and they only know me as Kate. Its very hard actually... I cannot meet them, and I am afraid that I may loose them if they know the truth.

Ethically, I tell myself nothing is wrong since I am perhaps not really lying. I do afterall feel that Kate is the "real me" - and that the rest of the time I am shutting out a large part of myself.



I have comtemplated about having FFS done, being passable would be a much greater bang for the buck than having the SRS done. No one is going to pull down our pants/skirts and see whats really between our legs.
As for RLT before FFS, I felt that FFS might help us pass better making RLT an easier process? I might be wrong here, hopefully some of the wiser sisters can step in and relate their experiences?

I guess the problem others would state is that a RLT is (as far as I can tell) aimed at testing whether you really do want to transition, and if you have already undergone FFS you essentially already have (SRS is important, but not outwardly noticible as you say).

But then we are back to the chicken-and-egg issue; I for one am horrified by the prospect of trying to pass without FFS and do not know if I could face a RLT without it. So... any additional words of wisdom would certainly be appreciated. :)

Steph2cool
10-09-2005, 11:33 PM
Kate,

I think I can relate to your situation. I started crossdressing when I was 11 years old. When I married at 21 my wife new I crossdressed. Over the years I went through 3 purges of my wardrobe. Somewhere along the way I didn't get a sexual thrill from the clothing but developed an inner peace. After 19 years of marriage as I started going through therapy for depression my therapist referred me to a specialist in women's issues. It was also at this time that my wife said that I had to do what I needed to do to make myself happy, that i had been doing everything to help her now it was my turn. when I retired at the age of 49 i started living full time. I have not had srs or any other surgeries, the only thing I have done is undergone hormone therapy. I am still married and work full time as a woman. My wife is accepting, doesnt understand it all, but is accepting. My children are trying to be accepting. My mother is heartbroken. I have come to the conclusion that there is not a need for srs for me because I do not intend on finding a man. I have had offers but after 33 years of marriage, I am satisfied right now. I know that this does not offer answers but hopefully within my story you might find some answers for you.

Stephanie

Caitlyn
10-10-2005, 12:22 PM
While I would like FFS if I could afford it the idea of doing that b4 having any real life experience strikes me as unwise. It would be difficult if not impossible to reverse and if you couldnt hack it then what ?


FFS is just that.....it feminizes. If you decide that you could not lead a life as a woman then you could still revert back to looking male. Just get a haircut and stop plucking those eyebrows. Not wearing makeup might be wise as well. If you look closely at men, you will see a fair few are quite feminine looking. Most 'heart-throbs' are quite feminine.