Q for married cder's who's wives are accepting of some behavior, BUT...

[amazonian gg]

i have a question for the married cder's who's wives who accepting of your cding to a point, but do not want any physical intimacy while you are dressed. are you happy in your marriage?"

about me: my h told me about his cding a few years back, after we were married and had kids. while i understand that this is something he can't entirely control, and that this is something i cannot fully understand, i accept it...to a degree. i'll help him dress up and apply makeup occasionally, but i have zero desire to be intimate with him while he's dressed. we've both made concessions about cding over the years, but at times i feel like we're just settling. as though we'd be happier with someone who truly could be "that person" that would satisfy us most. on the other hand, marriage is about commitment, sacrifice and supporting your mate. it is NOT a cakewalk :) i realize all marriages are different, and we all bring different issues to the table. just curious about other married folks in similar situations.

i should add that we are very happy with each another in all other areas - kids, jobs, likes/dislikes. we are also in agreement on cding as it relates to people we know, work with, our kids. it's just that cd'ing it's such a difficult subject for us intimately. for him, the years of hiding, guilt confusion and only talking to one person (me) about it. for me, hurt feelings that i wasn't told sooner, uncomfortable with the weight of being the only one that knows and that i can't give him the full support he wants/needs, so on and so forth. it's hard to talk to one another about it, even though we know complete honesty is key...so much emotion on both sides. when we don't see eye to eye, the disappointment and anger ripples out to other areas. it is a very helpless feeling sometimes.

[Jill Devine]

My only advice to you is not to take advice. My marriage (or anyone else here) has no bearing on yours. Regardless if we are all happy, it cannot make you happier. Or if we are secretly miserable, it does nothing to ease your potential pain or confusion.

Sadly in life we only normally figure out the answers when we are too old to make use of the wisdom or knowledge.

The answer you seek can only be found by you and your spouse.

As an FYI, my wife is mildly accepting and we've had many similar discussions. All we know for sure is that we love each other and value our life together. Fairytales are in
books and not life. So we live our lives and try to live a little in-between.

[amazonian gg]

The answer you seek can only be found by you and your spouse.

agreed, jill. i would never base a decision on the future of my marriage by anyone's comment. nor would i take any joy away from thinking we were better off than anyone else's situation. i sincerely hope i didn't offend! i was just looking for commentary from the "shared experience" angle, that's all.

[Zoe Preston]

I can't answer your question because my wife whilst fairly tolerant of my CDing doesn't want any involvement at all.

The point I would make though is not to accept anything that you're not comfortable with. I think it's quite reasonable for you to say to your husband "When you're a woman - no intimacy. You're just a friend".

We're all different. There's no rulebook that says you have to accept this or that. Personally I think it's admirable that you have been so accepting so far but I think you need to have a discussion along the lines of "This I can accept/cope with, this freaks me out a bit etc"

My wife and I had a similar conversation, unfortunately it all freaks her out :eek:

Zoe

[danielle swenson]

Keep the lines of communication open! It takes time, perhaps a lifetime. Butt you have each other 2 share that with. My wife n I don't get intimate in that situation either. Albeit we have experimented it is not something she is comfortable with. I don't know if you would be comfortable with it butt, perhaps your SO needs to find some real time friends who are cd/tg. I don't mean being intimate with them, but having a friend to share with hangout with per-say.
I have made some friends and it is a gr8 experience! As for yourself, I applaud you taking the steps to become informed, To keep the love and trust alive in your marriage! To answer the original question. Yes I am absolutely happy in my marriage! Ya so no sex'n it up when I'm gittin my girl on but that don't mean there isn't any intimacy in our relationship! My wife loves and accepts me unconditionally for who I am,She always has, and I couldn't ask for anything more then that!

[Jessica_Dillon]

You do present some very difficult questions and feelings. Of coarse, you have already stated the most intelligent thing, and that is that you will not base anything on anyone else's answers. Looking for experience, well, it all varies. My wife and I are best friends, and that's why we married in the first place. I told her about Jessica shortly before we got engaged. After years, and of coarse some arguments, and intense talks, and misunderstandings, we are now girlfriends when Jess is around. For me, I felt like I wanted intimate time with her while dressed. As I've matured in my own understanding and acceptance of myself, nothing could be further from the truth. I am simply not interested while dressed. How does that relate to you? It really doesn't...it's just our own personal experience.
You are exactly right, that marriage is continuing work, and it sounds like you and your hubby have both put work into your relationship. The only thing I can add that may be of substance is that you both need to keep that up. It may take years, before you find a "meeting ground" on this topic, or it may never happen. As long as you both communicate openly and honestly with each other.

[Phoebe P.]

I'm lucky. My wife doesn't have a problem with being intimate when I'm dressed. It's just me in different clothing and some "face paint". If I came home from a football game with my team's colors on my face (I don't do it, but if I did) is there really a big difference? It's just makeup and at least the makeup I DO wear looks good!

Simplistic yes, but we have so much more to worry about.

[Kathi Lake]

I would never try to bring another woman into our bed - whether that woman was me or not. :)

I have no need to even think about this. You sound even more accepting than my wife, but that crosses a line that I would never push. Call us vanilla. Call us boring. We don't engage in any type of play. I ensure her needs and wants are taken care of, and she does the same for me. Life is good. Why mess with that?!

Does your spouse know your feelings on this? Although definitely embarrassing, it is something you both have to discuss for the health of your marriage.

Phoebe, yes, there is a big difference. It's not just the clothes or makeup, it's the perceived role in lovemaking.

Kathi

[Alice B]

My wife and I, via very open discussion, reached a working agreement very early on, once I came out to her. I am a late in life cross dresser and we have a very strong relationship and marriage. There is no intimacy when I'm dressed. She accepts my dressing, but wishes not to participate in it. It is OK for me to dress at home, usually wit her upstairs, but on occasion in her presence. I am careful to not put her in any difficult situation. I can go out dressed. At times not having her participate frustrates me, but all things considered it is a good working relationship. Would I like more - sure. Is it going to happen - I think not. The key is give and take by both of us and always considering the others concerns and fears. Over the years (about 4 years) I have gained greater freedom by keeping her concerns in mind and not pushing too hard. She has given me the OK to go away for a week to DLV and spend a whole seek dressed due to the trust we have established. As many will say-the key is open discussion, willingness to listen to the others concerns and arriving at a workable agreement. From what you have said you are more accepting than the average SO and are to be commended for this and your willingness to come here for discussion. I wish the both of you a strong and happy relationship.

[Phoebe P.]

I guess we're just very practical. We've known each other since we were 14. She knows I'm the man and will always be. To us it's not a big deal. To each his own. To us it's me in bed, not another woman.

There are no hard and fast answers. Every relationship is different.

[BLUE ORCHID]

Well I guess I'm somewere in the middle my Wife tollerates it but don't want to see Orchid it's a don't ask * don't tell kind of a thinggie.
I don't need to hide anything I have things hanging in three closets and five dresser drawers.
I dress at home and she will stay in the other part of the house and will ask if it's clear to come down stairs.
It could be better and it could be worse I know my boundries and don't cross them.


Orchid

[StacyCD]

I would like to have sex while dressed but I know that I can't push to hard or I will meet with resistance. Patience is the key!

[JamieG]

Your relationship sounds similar to the one I have with my wife. She is pretty accepting but prefers that I do most of my dressing out of her sight. We have experimented with intimacy while I was partially dressed, and it was uncomfortable for her. I do sometimes fantasize about us doing more, but I don't want to push her comfort zone. We have a very close relationship, even closer after she got over the hurt of me keeping this big secret from her. I couldn't imagine being with anyone else, even if it did give me the chance to live the fantasy: it wouldn't be her, and thus holds no interest for me. As it is, we both do a pretty good job of keeping each other happy.

[suchacutie]

As said above, we can only give you our experiences and hope that some of these nuggets ring true with the two of you. I had no idea I was trangendered until we were into the 4th decade of our marriage. My wife and I are both fascinated with Tina (we named her jointly) and how Tina plays a part in our lives. My feminine side clearly affects me, and thus, affects our relationship. Since I started so late in life, and since my wife was a part of that revelation, I skipped the guilt and confusion that seems to be the baggage that many carry. We both recognize that Tina has always been a part of me, and that it's important to us to know her. This need has led to marvelous conversations about what it's like to grow up as a girl or a boy, the differing expectations, desires, fears, and psychologies. It's led to an increased closeness, frankly!

We both agree that we are completely heterosexual, and, frankly, I have no idea how we'd pull off sincere intimacy with Tina invovled. After all, we've been married a long time, so we really don't need Tina's help with that. On the other hand, this frees Tina to not worry about all that stuff :). Tina can dress to the nines and feel terrific and be girlfriends with my wife.

One thought: true long-term intimacy requires trust and comfort. Even if Tina were to become involved that way, it would take a long while of being girlfriends first, and then letting things proceed naturally, if there is a natural progression. To press it is difficult in any gendered situation.

It sounds to me like the long-term effects of guilt and not coming to grips with his feminine self is much of the issue, and that's a tough issue for everyone. That really must be addressed first, from my perspective.

All our best wishes!

[Phoebe P.]

I explained to my wife when I told her that there was big sexual component for me dating back to puberty. She understands it and knows I don't want to have a sex change and I'm not gay. It's just a different side to my personality.

[sissystephanie]

I had known my late wife since I was 9 and she was 7! I told her I was a CD when before I asked her to marry me whe we were in our early 20's. She not only accepted me "as is," but fully supported me during the almost 50 years we had together. We did have very intimate moments whe I was at least partially dressed enfemme. I wore silk or satin nightgowns most of the time, and she did love me when I did!! But she always knew that I was her MAN, no matter what kind of clothing I had on!! That was a given for our whole marriage, and would be if I ever remarry!

[GG Kathy]

I think I must be the exception to the rule. I love making love to my SO when she's dressed. I find it highly erotic. I feel I have the best of both worlds, but then I thought I had the best when there was only one.

[ReineD]

One thought: true long-term intimacy requires trust and comfort. Even if Tina were to become involved that way, it would take a long while of being girlfriends first, and then letting things proceed naturally, if there is a natural progression. To press it is difficult in any gendered situation.


What a wonderful observation! Thank you for sharing this.

[Phoebe P.]

Stephanie, you're relationship sounds much like mine. I think it has much to do with familiarity and having a history. I was pretty shy growing up and really had no history with girls besides my wife when we got together outside of kissing a girl when I was in 9th grade. The year before we met. We dated for 6 years, broke up for 6 years, got back together and were married 9 months later (not a shotgun marriage! :) ) We'll be married 15 years in November. We run a business together and are always together. She's my best friend and I'm her best friend. I wouldn't have it any other way. I love her with all my heart. If she has a need, I'm always open and she reciprocates. This is one of mine and she is open to it. Our relationship is the exception I'm sure. We didn't have too much baggage except for the 6 years we were apart. She had relationships, mostly bad. I was engaged. She broke up a crumbling relationship. You could say we have history which may be why she is more accepting. Intimacy for us while I'm dressed adds quite a bit of spice to the experience for me. For her, I make sure she is very well taken care of and I don't ask her to do what I know she doesn't like to do. I think she appreciates that and does what she can to satisfy me.

Every relationship is different, but I think when you know someone (at this point) for 2/3 of your life it makes a difference!

[t-girlxsophie]

My Wife loves to be Intimate with me dressed,she loves me as a whole person,whether en femme or not,We know that our feelings for each other overrides which ever way I present,Im the same person in my heart,and in hers

[Phoebe P.]

My Wife loves to be Intimate with me dressed,she loves me as a whole person,whether en femme or not,We know that our feelings for each other overrides which ever way I present,Im the same person in my heart,and in hers

I understand this completely. You sound like you have a wonderful relationship!

It's always to each his/her own.

[kathie225]

Over the years my wife and I have come to an understanding of what Kathies boundaries are as well as her place in our relationship. Within the ambit of the established boundaries we act entirely normal with full acceptance including intimacy whether in femme attire or not.This is where we are at after more than 40years of talking and some fighting. It didn't occur overnight and alot of give and take was involved.

[Shari]

Thanks so much for posting this thread and providing a woman's perspective.
I too, am in a very similar situation where it has led to exactly where you are. It's frustrating for me but your words have helped ease my own frustration and make me more understanding of my wife.
For me, I'll no longer push the issue and will try to maintain a lower profile.

One thing all of us cd's have to realize is that our wives have feelings too.
It isn't all about us.

[EricaCD]

What the heck - I'll unlurk for this one.

It sounds as though our situation is quite similar to yours. My wife is probably a little less personally conflicted about my trans life, though she's also much less involved. I have never seriously considered bringing my fem side into the bedroom, because I know it would make her immensely uncomfortable.

That's all background. You asked whether I am happy with our marriage. In a word, absolutely! I wouldn't trade our life together for anything.

You pretty much answered your own question, I thought. I agree with you that marriage is about communication, respect, and compromise. Those are also the skills necessary to successfully navigate a transgendered life with a "partially on-board" spouse.

And now, back into hiding...

[wanagione]

Hi, my wife is accepting and she has even ventured out to a conferece. She has met my friends in drab too. As for sex while I'm dressed, we really have never talked about it. I think it is the next topic on the list. The problem is that it would be hard to do with the kids around. It would take alittle extra planning and I think it would stress her out.

[Tina B.]

I've been married for almost 40 years, I told her about, my other side, around 35 years ago, she as always been very accepting, but as far as the bedroom goes, we tried once or twice, she just was not comfortable making love with the images of a women, I doubt I could have been to good if she had worn a Beard, so I have to accept that as part of life. At home I'm in the closet, no desire to go out into the world, and most of the time, I wear what I want, so skipping the night gown from time to time is no big deal. Oh, and I consider myself to be is a very happy marriage, and so does she.
Tina B.

[Jenniferathome]

In answer to your initial question, yes, I am happy and so is my wife. I came out to her 2 weeks ago and things are better than ever. I think you also are asking about being intimate with your husband while he is dressed. YOUR comfort level is all that matters here. In my case, my wife has no interest in being in bed with my female half. I have assured her it will never happen. It's not who she is. If this is the "support" you feel your husband is not getting, Well, He is the one who is not supporting you.

[MillaMarie]

I'm so lucky to have a wife who competely accepts me and loves being my girlfriend when dresssed, and in my usual androgyne mode day to day. While she will help me with hair, makeup, advice, and enjoys being with me on femme' I totally respect her desire to have her husband in bed. Like many have said, it's completely unreasonable to push her to have intimacy when fully dressed. I love it when she wears pretty lingerie and understand that I would not like it if she cut her hair, wore mens' clothes to bed, and acted rough. No Way will I push her, I just adore this woman !
If things evolve naturally to the point of us being functional lesbians I would love it, but can't imagine not loving her totally the way she is just as she loves her Gender-Queer partner as ze is.

[kimdl93]

I know my wife and I are outliers, but her acceptance of me extends to intimacy. In part this works, because I came out to her before we were engaged, and we were both very honest with each other about what worked for us, sexually speaking. Neither of us to be confined to a narrowly defined gender role. Another reason I think it works is that I'm the same person whether dressed or not. I don't have two personas.

[Wendi_cd]

See, to me saying 'Oh, my wife accepts but doesn't want to be around it', is not accepting. Tolerant perhaps, but accepting? no. But if it works for you that's great.
I may tolerate my wifes smoking, but I don't accept it so I make her go outside to smoke.

I guess I got lucky as my wife was in sort of a bi-curious stage when we met, so I got to be her guy *and* her girl. We even had a date night for it. After the 'date', Wendi would 'go home' and her guy would be back, sometimes she'd even tell me about the date as if I wasn't the one there. After a while of that, she started wanting me to stay a while. I think the longest time I stayed was 3 days!
(PS, the skin under breast forms gets a bit ripe after 3 days of being sealed up!)

This is part of who I am, saying you don't want to be around that is saying you don't want to be around me. Time to adjust because you just sprung this news, understandable, but "that's fine, when you're dressed you stay upstairs I'll stay downstairs" no thanks.

I said all that to say this, and it's not directed at anyone in particular. You need to look real hard at what your needs are. If being intimate while dressed is a need, that need doesn't go away just because your spouse doesn't like it. At some point you will start to resent that your spouse refuses to meet your needs. You have the right to have your needs met in a relationship, just as much as your partner has a right to have their needs met.

While you will never be everything to your partner, you need to find out what the essential items are. If you can't meet your partners needs, your partner will get them from someone else. There's not anything inherently wrong with that, you can't be all things to someone, it's unrealistic to think you can. The fairy tale idea that you all you need is each other is BS

[NicoleScott]

I re-read the OP a couple of times, and couldn't find where the husband asked (demanded, insisted) that you be intimate while he was en femme.
He's lucky to have such an understanding wife. My wife is tolerant, even indifferent, of my cd-ing, and I don't have to keep my dressiing sessions out of her sight. But taking it to the bed has never even been up for discussion. Is this a real need he has?
Some women don't mind if their husbands dress up, but they want a man in bed. If that's asking to much, there might be a problem.

[Lorileah]

It didn't matter what was being worn....it all came off later. So if you define intimacy as sexual relations, it was a non-issue. If you define intimacy as being closer together, yes dressing brought that out. So there was an advantage to her when I was in "girl mode" to the point where she had actually told me "Go put on a skirt".

I think what seems to be the issue here is that in many people's minds when someone dresses they become someone else. Maybe in the fantasy world they do but the main core is still there. Do women fear that the partner when dressed will try and change to a more passive or aggressive role? Just because of a piece of clothing? That would be a fetish and could be associated with anything. I have trouble seeing my SO/spouse as anything but my SO/spouse no matter what color hair, clothes, lipstick, whatever. I do understand that years of being taught that A is A and B is B is hard to overcome. But they are the same person no matter what they wear. Things like this can add spice to a relationship if you want it to. Relax, enjoy the ride. You love the spirit not the container right?

[Mercedes]

I would start out by saying that the rest of your lives together sounds pretty great. Which also sounds like the relationship I share with my wife. She is tolerate of my dressing and does not want to be a part of it so we made an agreement of what was allowable and we have stuck to it. I do not think there is a marriage with 100% compatibility, I think most are lucky at over 75%. So if you have everything else going for you but crossdressing (or what goes on behind closed doors) then you have a lot to keep you together.

Mercedes XOXOXO

[Mistybtm]

I think I must be the exception to the rule. I love making love to my SO when she's dressed. I find it highly erotic. I feel I have the best of both worlds, but then I thought I had the best when there was only one.

Do you have a sister:D:devil:

[cdinmd206]

My wife is supportive of my dressing and we shop together and she helps with my makeup. She says she looks upon me as the big sister she never had, but then she also smiles and says she is not into incest, so the clothes come off when it is time for sex. She sometimes will tell me to leave on the stockings and garter belt. She says she likes felling my stocking covered legs against hers. So I am lucky in that department.

[Denise69]

I'm going to agree with Jessica on this one. You two have a caring and nurturing relationship in all areas but this one, He needs to give a little. Sorry. He has the option of logging in and chatting with any of us at any time. fantasy or not, To bring it up after knowing how you feel about it is purely selfish. Perhaps in Time, you'll change your mind. But that's for You to decide when, Not him.....

[marissa_sissy]

It is difficult every step of the way. My wife knows, and luckily, we still maintain a kinky and intimate relationship with it. She has been awesome, and as a result, I try to be awesome at everything else in our real lives. She is the only person who knows about me, because my desires do not exactly include public. Mine are deeper, kinkier, sexual, and at home. (which really requires a high level of understanding)

It is a struggle, and it will always be a struggle. You should know that going forward. Even if they know and accept, they still question a lot of it, and still lack the understanding of the hows and whys. Mine is terrified that she will wake up one morning and I will be gay, or want to be a woman permanently. (which neither are the case)

[HairyBethCD]

The OP sounds very like my wife in many ways. We are very happy together and she is OK about my CDing in as much as she knows and understands but doesn't want to get involved or see me dressed that way. This suits me quite well as I feel a bit daft dressed up anyway as I know what I am 'seeing' in my head doesn't match reality. In my mind I'm a sexy young thing. In reality I'm a hairy bloke in panties so not really very alluring! I'm sure they're are women out there that would let me shave all over and really got for it but would everything else in the relationship be as good as it is now? It's all about balance. I'm qute happy to put up with things the way they are on the CD front given that in most other areas, we agree and get on well.

[Sue101]

If you feel the lack of intimancy is a problem which needs to be addressed then you have to look within yourself for the answer. There is nothing your husband can do except be patient with you. If you treat this as aversion therepy then the answer is to take small incremental steps towards acceptance. Basically just spend lots of time with him dressed until you are completely comfortable seeing him this way then sit together, hold hands together etc. It is really about you recognising your husband irregardless of what clothes he is wearing. If he normally wears make-up and a wig then ask him to take these off so you can see him more clearly.

[Allsteamedup]

I would like to address the reality of attempting sex with someone dressed in a wig, dress, high heels and makeup.
Now as GGs we would not expect to begin intimacy dressed like that. We also learn how to take off our outer garments stylishly. Getting wrapped up with a cder who can't slip his shoes off nor take off a dress without it being a production number may be funny, if you want to start laughing at this stage.
Then there's what's underneath. Now mine is in to vintage corsetry. I've seen more attractive trussed turkeys at Christmas! So there is no flesh for me to touch.
At this point it becomes obvious that |I am very secondary to proceedings. All he wants me to do is touch the corsetry. which is from his chin to his knees. Nothing is accessible. If it gets any further I risk chafing from the rough broche fabric and boning.
Now I have tried to see what could possibly be erotic/fun/stimulating/pleasurable for either of us out of this. Why doesn't the stuff come off? Presumably because it is so tight and several layers,it wouldn't be easy.
The average objection to intimacy with your cding partner is smell (from the cosmetics. We use less and wouldn't wear them in the bedroom.), the fact that many look funny ( as in amusing rather than peculiar) and the sheer impracticality of wigs, breastformsand/or heavy corsetry. Even though this is your partner the spectre of lesbianism hangs in there somewhere while you try to work out what on earth is going through somebody's mind: I am ignored as a partner who might like to wear something entrancing to bed.
So this isn't just wil she/won't she? What, exactly, is on offer to your partner, bearing in mind that intimacy should be a shared expression.
I sympathise with amazonian.

[Alisa]

Great post hun... Lots of insight here from all levels of experience... thanks for starting it. Hugs.