Husband not a girlfriend

[Delila]

I am about to go on a vacation with my wife. The first that we have taken by ourselves the last couple we have been with her mother. The conversation started sort of inocuously talking about nail polish I said that I didn't like the color she recommended and I was thinking of changing it before vacation if that was ok with her. I meant to keep it for vacation which she picked up. Now I viewed this vacation as a time to potentially stretch some of my limits since it would be extremely unlikely that we would encounter anyone that we knew which is my primary fear going out dressed up. She told me that on this vacation she was expecting to go with a husband not a girlfriend. Am I off center here is this a common line to cross? To me a vacation is doing things that you can't do at home and relaxing. I was really excited by the idea of getting to act more femme away from home. Now I feel that I will be imposing my will on her vacation if I do anything that is not normal husband behavior. Am I wrong should I be the good "husband" and act as masculine as I can during our break? I always thought that vacation was a chance to escape from normal life and do something out of the ordinary. Is her statement a way of showing that out of the ordinary is me acting like a man because that would be stressful to me trying to fit something that I am not. Any advice would be very appreciated especially from GGs that may be familiar with this situation. I know that I should just appreciate what my wife is willing to put up with but I guess I am selfish and want some enjoyment for myself.

[tiffanyjo89]

I don't think you crossed a line that many crossdressers haven't crossed themselves.

What I think your wife was saying was that she wants to spend some time with you as husband and wife, not two girl friends. I think she's okay with your dressing, but wants you to be a man sometimes as well. Maybe next time you two are on vacation you can be "two girlfriends hitting the town" or something, but this time it appears that your wife wants to bond with her husband, the man she married (which is perfectly normal).

You mentioned that the last couple vacations was with your mother-in-law. She probably feels that you two need some time as husband and wife to be a normal married couple and spend some time together. But don't be too surprised if she finds she wants a "girlfriend" along after all...but for now, she appears to want to be a woman and you be the man and y'all two just be husband and wife without a lot of extra stuff.

[Karren H]

It sounds like you should consider yourself lucky she lets you do as much as you do..... and it wouldn't hurt you to do something she wants to do... Life isn't all about you ya know... marriage is a partnership... give and take..... IMHO.... My wife wants a husband all the time so I have very little empathy....

[Shananigans]

Well, I can see both sides of the coin. She wants to spend time with YOU. And, to her, you probably act very differently when in femme. But, she should also understand that you want to have some fun too. Why not meet in the middle? On vacations, my SO and I bring Camie along but he also spends time hanging out with me in drab too and knocking back beers. I find that when he dresses, it can be a little stressful for me. Many, many hours (like half a day) is spent removing body hair (he's Polish)...more hours are spent with me shaping eyebrows and doing makeup...more hours spent with pictures. And, all of this is fun, but sometimes I am like, "Damn...I want to be on the beach right now!" So, we meet in the middle. Maybe spend the day with her in drab and the night in femme? Or maybe spend a day or two in femme and the rest in drab?

P

[Intertwined]

It sounds like you should consider yourself lucky she lets you do as much as you do..... and it wouldn't hurt you to do something she wants to do... Life isn't all about you ya know... marriage is a partnership... give and take..... IMHO.... My wife wants a husband all the time so I have very little empathy....

VERY Well said Karren, Thank You...

[Delila]

Well, I can see both sides of the coin. She wants to spend time with YOU. And, to her, you probably act very differently when in femme. But, she should also understand that you want to have some fun too. Why not meet in the middle? On vacations, my SO and I bring Camie along but he also spends time hanging out with me in drab too and knocking back beers. I find that when he dresses, it can be a little stressful for me. Many, many hours (like half a day) is spent removing body hair (he's Polish)...more hours are spent with me shaping eyebrows and doing makeup...more hours spent with pictures. And, all of this is fun, but sometimes I am like, "Damn...I want to be on the beach right now!" So, we meet in the middle. Maybe spend the day with her in drab and the night in femme? Or maybe spend a day or two in femme and the rest in drab?

Plus, I think that we maximize the time he spend in femme and just really have fun with it. But, he knows that I expect to spend time with Ryan too at the end of the day. I love my Camie time, but I also love my Ryan time. So, I see where your wife is coming from with all of this.

It's a relationship and you have to realize that it's her vacation too. But, I understand that it is also YOUR vacation. You got married and you knew with marriage there was going to be compromise. So, make you wife happy by not spending the ENTIRE time in femme and make yourself happy by taking the time to enjoy yourself in femme.

Talk to your wife about this and see if she finds that more reasonable. Tell her that you want to be there for her and connect with her and have fun, but you also want to take a little time to dress. See if you can't find a compromise that will make you BOTH happy in the long run.

I hope that this helps. :)

I should be clear. I seldom go out fully dressed there have been a literally 3 occasions all of which were halloween. I am not asking to go fully dressed this particular conversation was related specifically to nail polish. I know that I have little right to complain with so many CDers in the closet but in this particular situation I feel as though she has drawn a line in the sand as it were. I was hoping to express some not full but some of my feminine nature while on vacation I didnt ask to wear a bikini or anything so obvious this was about nail polish and flip flops. I am still not brave enough to go full femme in public outside of holidays. I feel like she is asking me to be MAN through the whole vacation I am not MAN I am something else the male part of my persona does show most of the time more than female though that has been less lately. I don't want to spoil her vacation but since the last vacations that I have been on have been for her family is it really too much to hope that this one I might be able to express myself more than is usual. It might help to mention though it will probably make little difference that I have made the point of being male on our previous vacations to the point ot wearing the couple of pairs of boxers that I own rather than panties the whole time. I have spent my only ever vacations full male I would think that I am due one where I am allowed to express myself. Am I wrong?

[Eryn]

I think that you are discussing this with the wrong people. You really need to talk about this with your wife. Let her know specifically what you want to do and then listen carefully to what she wants to do. I'm fairly sure that a compromise can be worked out between two mature people as long as they communicate well.

[Delila]

I think that you are discussing this with the wrong people. You really need to talk about this with your wife. Let her know specifically what you want to do and then listen carefully to what she wants to do. I'm fairly sure that a compromise can be worked out between two mature people as long as they communicate well.

This is a good point and I have discussed this with my wife who answered that she will think about it. My wife's woman speak is more confusing than average woman speak. I would ask my only CD friend but he is so in denial that his denial has denial. I was hoping for some insight hopefully from some that have been in a similar situation. I am very lost at this point.

[Shananigans]

I should be clear. I seldom go out fully dressed there have been a literally 3 occasions all of which were halloween. I am not asking to go fully dressed this particular conversation was related specifically to nail polish. I know that I have little right to complain with so many CDers in the closet but in this particular situation I feel as though she has drawn a line in the sand as it were. I was hoping to express some not full but some of my feminine nature while on vacation I didnt ask to wear a bikini or anything so obvious this was about nail polish and flip flops. I am still not brave enough to go full femme in public outside of holidays. I feel like she is asking me to be MAN through the whole vacation I am not MAN I am something else the male part of my persona does show most of the time more than female though that has been less lately. I don't want to spoil her vacation but since the last vacations that I have been on have been for her family is it really too much to hope that this one I might be able to express myself more than is usual. It might help to mention though it will probably make little difference that I have made the point of being male on our previous vacations to the point ot wearing the couple of pairs of boxers that I own rather than panties the whole time. I have spent my only ever vacations full male I would think that I am due one where I am allowed to express myself. Am I wrong?

The toe nail polish seems like a reasonable request, but I am not your wife. I agree with Eryn in that you ultimately need to begin communication with her. Does her family even know that you are a CD? And, I understand that you aren't just a "MAN" no one is black and white male or female. You will find that most people are in a grey area to where they enjoy expressing both gender characteristics. This is because no one is purely masculine and no one is purely feminine. But, you DO have societal expectations that you are buying into and so is your wife...and I agree...they suck. But, you have to pick your battles. My grandmother always asked me, "Is this something you want to fight 'the big fight' over?" Meaning: Is this really worth it? Women never forget. Ever. I hold onto a grudge like it's my job...mess up my vacation and I'll hang it over your head 10 years from now. Most women are come from the same stock, so I feel like your wife may not be unlike me in that regard. At the end of the day if your male and female dichotomy is internal and not purely External, can you not find something else to remind you of your inner femme if she is adamantly against toe nail polish? Can you get some good smelling body spray, lotion, or hair products? Maybe you can file and clip your nails so that they look nice and manicured?

[Delila]

The toe nail polish seems like a reasonable request, but I am not your wife. I agree with Eryn in that you ultimately need to begin communication with her. Does her family even know that you are a CD? And, I understand that you aren't just a "MAN" no one is black and white male or female. You will find that most people are in a grey area to where they enjoy expressing both gender characteristics. This is because no one is purely masculine and no one is purely feminine. But, you DO have societal expectations that you are buying into and so is your wife...and I agree...they suck. But, you have to pick your battles. My grandmother always asked me, "Is this something you want to fight 'the big fight' over?" Meaning: Is this really worth it? Women never forget. Ever. I hold onto a grudge like it's my job...mess up my vacation and I'll hang it over your head 10 years from now. Most women are come from the same stock, so I feel like your wife may not be unlike me in that regard. At the end of the day if your male and female dichotomy is internal and not purely External, can you not find something else to remind you of your inner femme if she is adamantly against toe nail polish? Can you get some good smelling body spray, lotion, or hair products? Maybe you can file and clip your nails so that they look nice and manicured?

I get what you are saying I really do. But the nail polish is an example really a small part ifof the issue. Can I go a week without polish on my toenails? Sure but what is the next restriction I have to wear men's underwear every day because I could be seen? I can't do the small feminine things that make me feel ok without fear? Really it is a small point in a bigger problem I try to be the husband as often as I can manage and honestly sometimes more than feels right. I know that she has made sacrifices to deal with what and who I am I sometimes wish that I could be the man that she seems to want. Ultimately I was fully honest with her from very early in our relationship there has been very little dishonestly and what there has been has been a result of fear. I had considered this vacation this one small thing to be a chance for me to really relax and be me. Is that really so much to ask? Am I being selfish hoping for some girl time during my time off?

[Shananigans]

I get what you are saying I really do. But the nail polish is an example really a small part ifof the issue. Can I go a week without polish on my toenails? Sure but what is the next restriction I have to wear men's underwear every day because I could be seen? I can't do the small feminine things that make me feel ok without fear? Really it is a small point in a bigger problem I try to be the husband as often as I can manage and honestly sometimes more than feels right. I know that she has made sacrifices to deal with what and who I am I sometimes wish that I could be the man that she seems to want. Ultimately I was fully honest with her from very early in our relationship there has been very little dishonestly and what there has been has been a result of fear. I had considered this vacation this one small thing to be a chance for me to really relax and be me. Is that really so much to ask? Am I being selfish hoping for some girl time during my time off?

The fact that you say it is a small point in a bigger problem just shows that this isn't just about the vacation and the toe nail polish. What you are telling me Right Now is that this vacation isn't enough. What you are saying essentially is that you want more freedom in your every day lives...but, you are using the vacation to test your boundaries.

Is this what is Really going on?

[Delila]

The fact that you say it is a small point in a bigger problem just shows that this isn't just about the vacation and the toe nail polish. What you are telling me Right Now is that this vacation isn't enough. What you are saying essentially is that you want more freedom in your every day lives...but, you are using the vacation to test your boundaries.

Is this what is Really going on?

It may be that I want to use the vacation to test the waters so to speak. I do want more in my daily life and I am honestly afraid to ask for it. The fear is probably self imposed but ultimately it is there. I don't think I want to go out fully dressed I really don't think I have the courage what I really want is to be able to wear more feminine clothes sometimes but really I am concerned about her comfort. She says that she doesnt care but that seems more of a "I care but I don't want to say so in case it hurts you." The times that I have tried to push the lines it has always seemed like it was pushing her comfort. How can you know when "I understand" really means that and is not just a trap to see how far you will push?

[Stephanie47]

Your wife wants a vacation with a husband, not a girl friend. You stated the answer to your question. You stated a vacation is a time to do things you cannot do at home and relax. This sounds like more than wearing nail polish. Dressing en femme would be relaxing for whom? You stated you've been out three times, all at Halloween. Are you easily read? I would love to go out en femme. However, my wife would be mortified if I went en femme in public. I have no illusion about passing- I don't. Do you want to subject your wife to possible uneasy confrontations, glances, etc? I would suggest a separate mini vacation-three day weekend-for yourself. The last thing I would do is to make my wife unhappy on a mutual vacation.

[Shananigans]

It may be that I want to use the vacation to test the waters so to speak. I do want more in my daily life and I am honestly afraid to ask for it. The fear is probably self imposed but ultimately it is there. I don't think I want to go out fully dressed I really don't think I have the courage what I really want is to be able to wear more feminine clothes sometimes but really I am concerned about her comfort. She says that she doesnt care but that seems more of a "I care but I don't want to say so in case it hurts you." The times that I have tried to push the lines it has always seemed like it was pushing her comfort. How can you know when "I understand" really means that and is not just a trap to see how far you will push?

You have to communicate. Now that you know what you are really asking for, you can start this level of communication. It's hard to do and you may have to go to a counselor for it to be really effective on the level that you are hoping for. It doesn't mean y'all are crazy or are having problems...but, sometimes it is nice to have an outside party who can see things that you cannot see and steer the conversations to a more constructive level. Those are just my thoughts..

[ReineD]

I was hoping to express some not full but some of my feminine nature while on vacation I didnt ask to wear a bikini or anything so obvious this was about nail polish and flip flops.

...

I have spent my only ever vacations full male I would think that I am due one where I am allowed to express myself. Am I wrong?

I understand your feelings. I hope I can explain your wife's, even though I don't know her. So what I'm about to say has more to do with me.

I don't know how old you are, or if it is common among your friends for the guys to go out wearing nail polish or femme flip flops, or however you may wish to express your femininity. But where I live, it would be a cause for raised eyebrows, although most people are polite enough not to say anything out loud.

We had a poll years back when we still had polls and asked the GGs to tell what they found most stressful about the CDing. The biggest issue (other than having been lied to) was what other people thought, especially in the beginning. GGs take on the looks, the sneers that are directed against CDers as if they are directed against them. I remember in the beginning feeling horrible when people would read my SO and "stare". One time I don't know what I wanted to do more: sink into the ground, or slap him (the guy who I thought was sneering). We were in an art gallery.

So maybe your wife is looking forward to a stress free vacation and it is not so much about whether she sees you as a man or a woman. It might actually be easier if you could just pick one or two days and dress fully, and then be in guy mode the rest of the time. At least when you are fully dressed you stand a chance of blending in with the crowd better rather than have your wife wonder how many people are noticing your painted nails all week, and what they are thinking.

We all like to believe we don't care what other people think, but it takes time before some people can develop a thick skin.

I also agree with Eryn. Can you ask your wife why she doesn't care to have you express femininity on your vacation? And can you also tell her that you'd like to, since it is your vacation too, and perhaps you can both reach a compromise?

[Delila]

You have to communicate. Now that you know what you are really asking for, you can start this level of communication. It's hard to do and you may have to go to a counselor for it to be really effective on the level that you are hoping for. It doesn't mean y'all are crazy or are having problems...but, sometimes it is nice to have an outside party who can see things that you cannot see and steer the conversations to a more constructive level. Those are just my thoughts..

I hope to respond to two posts with one. I can understand her wanting her own stress free vacation she has had more than one without me. This is a very hard conversation to address I have a hard time discussing such things without some alteration (reads liquor) so I think she doesnt take me seriously. I likely will never go out fully dressed I am very readable too tall with male build. I enjoy the occasional blend I also work to have such blends not be read. I do not trust councelors on any level and refuse to speak with one this is just a personal view on them. I guess this is really making a mountain out of a mole hill but I truly see it as a real limit or a marker that the only time that I have felt comfortable doing and sort of public dressing is when I plan to be on vacation and she shot me down. It makes me think that much of the support over the years has been false or really just saying what I want to hear knowing that I don't have the courage to follow through. This is one of the first times that I am really interested in going beyond the norm and pushing my bounderies. I gues maybe I am forgetting about her bounderies which is wrong.

[Holly]

The fact that you are suspicious of her motives tells me that the two of you have more communicating to do! When we are seeking a solution to a situation and it involves compromise, the nature of the action itself is going to involve stretching some boundaries and likely discomfort for both parties. The key is to do so with the proper attitudes... her, genuinely willing to allow you some latitude in your gender exploration during part of your vacation and you, giving your wife her guy time free of resentment on your part. The sooner you begin a dialog with her, the sooner you both can reach an agreement. And be prepared to continue the conversation after the vacation as well. I hope you both have a great time.

[ReineD]

This is a very hard conversation to address I have a hard time discussing such things without some alteration (reads liquor) so I think she doesnt take me seriously.

That's not good, Delila. :sad: If it's important enough for you to post here, then it's important enough to have deeper a heart-to-heart with your wife.

Since you do work hard to have your occasional blends not be read, I'm at a loss to imagine why your wife is unwilling to have you express yourself unless, as you say, she doesn't know how important it is because the two of you have not had serious discussions about this?

I wouldn't go so far as saying that her support over the years was fake though. But if you express yourself only in private with her, then perhaps she doesn't understand why you'd want to do it in public? You do need to ask her.

[Kathy4ever]

In life we have to make choices. I think you have to make the choice of making her happy at this time. That is my problem as well. If you want the relationship to suceed I guess you have to use your inner feminity to please your spouse. It is easy for us to push the envelope but you both might end up having a miserable vacation. It seems to me you need relax and enjoy annd make her happy. On the inside you can hope she surprises you and let's you do something you want. Just becareful because wishing can lead to disappointment. Enjoy your vacation.

[kittypw GG]

Hi Delila,
Since you stated that this is the first vacation in a long time that you two will be alone, I can see why your wife said that she wanted to go on vacation with her husband and not a girlfreind. She wants romance with the man she married. In my marriage I did not like to mix a vacation with my husband with "her" especially since I only marinally enjoyed spending time with "her". Also there is the fear of the unknown. We would take mini vacations that were designated for him to streach his wings as "her". We would go to places that we already checked out as husband and wife. These would be gay clubs that were tolerant of trans people. I did not feel comfortable going out in the general public. Perhaps she is not either.

I would suggest you man it up on this vacation and when the time is right ask for a weekend away to be Delia. That always seemed fair to me. Good luck.

[erickka]

I can see your wife's point of view. You are fortunate in the fact that she is accepting. Bearing that in mind, and since marriage is a two way street ,I think that if I were in your shoes, I would do everything in my power to do what she requests of you. Later on down the road, there is a real good possibility that she may let you have a Delila weekend, since you were able to do for her as she asked on vacation.

[Claire Cook]

If my experience is any guide, be patient and take your time. Keep in mind that this is a mutual vacation, not just yours. You can express your femme side in ways that don't involve dressing -- buy her some roses, surprise her with nice earrings, or other thoughtful touches.

A good relationship takes time to build. Let her take the lead here, and as others have said, communicate.

[Tina B.]

I've read a couple of post here that make Delila sound shellfish, but lets keep in mind there past vacations where spent whit her mother in law, maybe asking the wife to do one her is not such a shellfish thing after all. But Dalila, that's pretty much what my wife would say too.
Tina B.

[sometimes_miss]

Delila, you're kind of caught in a 'catch 22'. If you are allowed to relax and enjoy your female self, your wife will not. If she is allowed to relax and have the relationship with you that she wants, you will have to 'act the part' of a 'standard issue guy', and you will not be able to completely 'relax' and enjoy the vacation. I don't know the solution.

[Noortje]

Is her statement a way of showing that out of the ordinary is me acting like a man because that would be stressful to me trying to fit something that I am not.

Is your wife the sort of person who makes very subtle cryptic remarks and expects you to distill messages like this from them? Why don't you just ask her what she thinks and wants?

By the way, what she meant is that she does not want you to dress up on your vacation.

[erica12b]

maybe a rock and a hard place would describe it better , try and find a balance with her and remember the stress your dressing may cause, excepting wife's are hard to find ,

[suchacutie]

My wife has been Tina's mentor, her girlfriend, her confident, and a massive supporter. Tina has become a third person in our marriage, and that is no trivia thing!

So what have I "given up" for all this incredible support? One: complete openness...Tina and I tell her what we are thinking and she tells us what she is thinking about every subject transgendered. Two: Tina is private between the two of us (and all of you, of course) but if Tina's existence were to be known to others it would be a joint decision. Three: When she wants her man, she gets him!

Dear Delia, take her on vacation and rock her world! This is what she is asking for! It is clear as a sunny day! How can you possibly pass up that opportunity? I am also sure that she will make it up to your femme self big time in the future! Do it!!!!

Tina!

[Kim_Bitzflick]

I can see both sides of this. I have been on vacation with my wife, some all male, one all female and one mixed.

But I think we should also look at this WITHOUT the CD issue.

If it is a "regular" vacation (no CD issues involved), would you do everything your wife wants and nothing you want?

In my life, we discuss and do things BOTH of us want to do. Sometimes the vacation is a lot of what I want, sometimes it is a lot of what she wants and sometimes it is what we both want.

I suggest you compromise with her and suggest that if this vacation is all male for her, the next one is your turn to do what you want.

[Barbra P]

Hi Delila

I think Eryn hit the nail on the proverbial head, you aren’t going to find an answer to this particular problem here, the answer lies with you and your Wife. In the future I would suggest more and better planning, maybe two vacations, one primary vacation with wife and her husband and maybe a shorter vacation with wife and girlfriend Delila – sharing some girl time, shopping, dinner – maybe a night on the town. Maybe your wife would amendable to spending a couple of days during the vacation with Delila and then the rest of the time with her husband. I’d say it is important to get your expectations and your wife’s expectations about this vacation ironed out prior to the vacation, otherwise one of you is going to be sorely disappointed and that could very well have a very negative impact on this vacation for both of you.

[JamieG]

If it is a "regular" vacation (no CD issues involved), would you do everything your wife wants and nothing you want?

In my life, we discuss and do things BOTH of us want to do. Sometimes the vacation is a lot of what I want, sometimes it is a lot of what she wants and sometimes it is what we both want.


Kim makes a good point here, but I think we have to be careful when the couple is in violent disagreement about what to do. If we push too hard, too fast on the CDing angle, it can only serve to push our SOs away. I don't know how along ago you told your wife about CDing and what your history has been like since then, but it sounds to me like forcing her to deal with CDing on the vacation is only going to end badly. Of course, if you don't indulge your femme self, then you'll be unhappy the whole vacation. What to do?

How about this? Why not spend one day of the vacation apart? Let her spend the day at the spa (or something else she likes to do). You spend the day indulging your femme self. Whatever it is that you want to do: dress to the nines in your room, paint your nails and walk around town in flip flops, etc. Don't go into details about your plans unless she asks for details (she might prefer to be in the dark about what you're up to), but if she does ask, then be completely honest and straight-forward with her.

[Persephone]

I understand where you are, Delila. I've been there. You so want the chance to get away and to just be you. You've built up an image of exactly what you want to do and how you want to do it. You've planned every detail of your "dream vacation" and feel that your spouse has just shredded it.

You feel hurt, frustrated, angry and trapped. And I'll bet that now you're feeling like the people who have commented here haven't understood either.

I'm guessing, of course, but I think I know because I've been there. Yet from what you describe, it sounds like your otherwise understanding spouse is telling you that this time she really needs a real vacation -- not saddled with family -- but some of the time that she dreams about with her spouse.

I don't know when, or how often, you get a vacation or a weekend, and I don't know what your financial resources are, but if it is possible could you consider doing another, later trip to one of the crossdresser events that occur around the country? So far as I know, many of them are specifically designed as fun times for those who are otherwise normally closeted and who feel that they cannot routinely pass. I think that if you (and your spouse) can attend one of these you will have the time of your life.

Is that a possibility?

Hugs,
Persephone.

[Mistybtm]

IMO: it is better to keep your wife happy. then next vacation it will be your turn.

[kendra_gurl]

Delila:

Convey to her what you just said in your second post. Start a dialog of communication about how you both really feel. If some sort of compromise can be agreed to great. If not its still best to deal with it before the vacation starts or neither of you will enjoy it.
I have to say from what I read if its all about you being able to wear nail polish and flipflops then I can see her point. My wife would be embarressed to be seen with me in public as my male self but wearing nail polish. It would also serve as a constant reminder to her that I was wishing for more and not content of being her Man. You mention a vacation as a time to potentially stretch your limits. Could be you have already reached her limits so honest communication is the best advice I can give

[Rianna Humble]

I guess maybe I am forgetting about her bounderies which is wrong.

This is the first thing that I have read in this thread that gives me some hope that you and your wife will be able to communicate with each other about what you are each feeling.

Your wife married a man, it is not unreasonable for her to want to go on vacation with him. You corss-dress to a limited extent, it is not unreasonable for you to want to do that and perhaps a little more during part of your vacaction.

Instead of this being all about you or all about her, this needs to be all about communication. You need to listen to and try to understand her feelings, she needs to do the same for you. only then will you be able to work out a compromise where neither of you has to sublimate themself for the other.

[Being Paige]

You need to just go on vacation and be a husband to your wife, bottom line no if's and or but's. It is one week of your life and it means alot to your wife I'm sure. When I go away on vacations with my family everything Paige stays at home. You could always plan a femme vacation with your wife down the road that the both of you can do together for you! You do this vacation for her! Take time to plan out your vacation wish's and she will hopefully except a vacation with you while enfemme.

[Jenniferathome]

You are very, very lucky you have an accepting wife. I am one of the lucky ones as well. I firmly believe that your wife has the right to set boundaries when she is present and we cross dressers can not impose upon them our desires. Know where the line is through talking and never cross it. If you want girl time on a vacation, take one. Invite your wife to join or not but she will know the condition of the invitation. As for your vacation together, do something different WITH her.

[DanaLynn57]

For the past few years my wife and I have been on mini vacations that has all but revolved around me. I did not dress as Dana for all of the time away but when in "Drab" it seemed we were shopping with Dana being shopped for also. Back last Nov. my wife actually went in public with me as Dana Lynn but she would not ever be seen with Dana unless she felt like she would blend in to some degree. Her major stress factor is we will run into someone we know, etc. As crossdressers we dont really think how this would make our spouse look or even the type of looks she would get from people that would make us. Lets face the music guys, no matter how we think we look in the mirror, it is very hard to fit in. I have really been sellfish with my thinking that ever time we went out of town Dana had to come along.

My opinion and advice to you Delila is to be the man she married for the weekend and enjoy each others company. Its not always about us as crossdressers. If you go on this trip as the man she married, I bet anything she will see how much you care for her and her feelings and then next time Delila is invited she will remember your sacrafice and reward you. Dont make the mistake I have made and now im paying dearly for it. My wife has done alot of things thru the.past 10 years with Dana that she did because of her love cor me. That is now over for me because I kept pushing her, thinking only of Dana, having a facebook acct.with pictures that she didnt know about, not being totally honest with her etc.

If you put your spouse first and let her know that she is always first and be attentive to her needs, there can and will be room for Delila. If you dont do this, you will wake up one day losing everything you have now with her and you will be left on the outside looking in.

This has been one of the better post/ comments that I have read in some time. Responses have helped me in my situation.

[carhill2mn]

You have already had much good advice. I do know how your are feeling. For long term happiness with your wife I would suggest that you follow the advice of one of my daughters: "Happy wife, happy life". A possible compromise would be to see if your wife would be OK with you wearing something feminine at night once in a while.

[Stephenie S]

"Dear Delia, take her on vacation and rock her world! This is what she is asking for! It is clear as a sunny day! How can you possibly pass up that opportunity? I am also sure that she will make it up to your femme self big time in the future! Do it!!!!

Tina!"

Dear Delila,

Listen to Tina. I know this is not what you want to hear as you have been looking forward to this vacation as a time you can spend some "girl" time. But DON'T DO IT!!

Your wife has made it quite plain what she wants. She wants to go on vacation with her HUSBAND. She wants to spend some time with her MAN. Man up dear and give it to her. As Tina says above, take her out and rock her world.

This will earn you SO many points dear. Honest.

If you don't, you will never hear the end of it. She will drag this out every time she wants to needle you about anything.

She told you exactly what she wants. She didn't hint about it. She didn't beat around the bush. She came right out and said it. Listen to her. Really. I don't think there is any question about this. Give her what she wants. Next time it will be your turn, and you will have all the credit you need to negotiate this.

You could even start now. Tell her you will and then DO it. Rock her world. Give her the best time you can. Be the man she married. Be the man she wants. Don't you DARE pout or act resentful. Then next time you will be able to say, "Look, remember what I did just for you? I did it because I love you. Now may I please have some time for MY feminine side?" I am willing to bet she will say YES.

Put yourself aside for now. You will reap ample rewards later.

Stephie

[Debglam]

Hi Delila,

Others have said it already so I will simply say talk this over with your wife plainly and tell her what you are feeling. LISTEN(!!!) to what her feelings on the subject are. While not perfect, you have it pretty good. If this is something that is really upsetting your wife, reasonable or not, let it go.

Good luck!


Meaning: Is this really worth it? Women never forget. Ever. I hold onto a grudge like it's my job...mess up my vacation and I'll hang it over your head 10 years from now.

You are becoming one of my favorite posters Shan! You must know all of the GG's in my life!

Debby

[RebeccaJ]

As others have said, your wife is sending a message......she wants her husband for vacation, not a girlfreind. Only you know your wife best, but in my opinion, if you do not meet your wifes expectation I honestly think you will regret it.

[Delila]

Is your wife the sort of person who makes very subtle cryptic remarks and expects you to distill messages like this from them? Why don't you just ask her what she thinks and wants?

By the way, what she meant is that she does not want you to dress up on your vacation.

To your question. My wife only speaks in cryptic remarks, generally I can read her like a book the only time I have trouble is with the CDing where I am not sure she is always honest. To be clear so that there is no confusion I am not asking to stroll around town in flip flops with painted nails I merely wanted to wear flip flops on the beach and my nails are always painted. The only vacations I have ever been on in my life have been with my wife and her mother and at least one I didn't want to go on at all and I still went. I am not trying to be a selfish person nor am I trying to spoil her vacation I merely wanted a small opportunity to express myself in what I consider a small way. I will communicate this to her I was really just looking for advice here.

[Mimi]

To your question. My wife only speaks in cryptic remarks, generally I can read her like a book the only time I have trouble is with the CDing where I am not sure she is always honest. To be clear so that there is no confusion I am not asking to stroll around town in flip flops with painted nails I merely wanted to wear flip flops on the beach and my nails are always painted. The only vacations I have ever been on in my life have been with my wife and her mother and at least one I didn't want to go on at all and I still went. I am not trying to be a selfish person nor am I trying to spoil her vacation I merely wanted a small opportunity to express myself in what I consider a small way. I will communicate this to her I was really just looking for advice here.

Since you say that the two of you don't always communicate clearly, she may have heard you say something about nail polish and enjoying yourself, and immediately had a vision of you dressing 24/7, even though it wasn't at all what you had in mind. I will simply chime in along with everybody else and tell you to communicate to your wife what your expectations actually were. She may be quite relieved to find out that was all it was!

[Chickhe]

Don't forget, your wife also has a certain view about what her vacation should be. Sounds like she wants to spend some time with you, the you she originally married/fell in love with... probably she is glad you two are finally alone. She may be okay with crossdressing, but maybe it is a small added stress for her....something that cuts in to her total relaxation. So, I guess it would be negotiation time, maybe you can add in a day or so of dressing... if I had to do it and keep the vacation atmosphere, depending on your vacation plans, I would go for a transformation service or an event that requires dressing. Since you are competing with fun...you need to notch up the CDing to be fun for her also if you want her buy in to it.

[t-girlxsophie]

I think it's right that you both sit down and lay your cards on the table.If you talk things over that means there is no doubt what you both want from your Holiday.maybe you will find she may decide that you can have one night dressed.Vacation time is meant to be relaxing,a break from the rat race.the last thing either of you need is friction at a time when you should be having the best possible time together

Sophie

[Ericka2]

Is your wife the sort of person who makes very subtle cryptic remarks and expects you to distill messages like this from them? Why don't you just ask her what she thinks and wants?

By the way, what she meant is that she does not want you to dress up on your vacation.

This is so funny....thanks for clearing this up...lol

[busker]

Am I being selfish hoping for some girl time during my time off?

You continue to ask this question even though several here have basically suggested that the answer is YES-you are starting to sound selfish.. You can always take a vacation alone if you so desire femme time. The vacation will probably be short and a bit of giving in NOW, may get you rewards in the future. Use this as a bargaining chip for another time. LIfe really is about compromise, even though it sucks sometimes.
Have fun, be a mensch, and give your wife a nice, stressfree vacation.

[JenetGG]

This one hits very close to home. My fiance - CD'er and I broke up a couple of months ago over this very similar situation. We were together for 4 years. I was more than accepting of his femme self - I loved her- found her beautiful, in fact, she showed up early in our relationship and was a new discovery for him. I felt so proud and happy that my partner would discover a part of himself that is very important. For the 4 years, we had a beautiful balance - in the bedroom and out and about sometimes. We always discussed when and where she'd show up and he seemed to respect my wishes. Then we had a week long vacation in Mexico with about 30 (straight) friends. He planned to be "her" the entire week because he deserved it. There was no discussion beforehand about it. He didn't even bring many male clothes. I didn't even think we needed a conversation about it, since we've always done it 50:50. The first 4 days were fun, we hung out at the pool, did lunch, got our toes done, went dancing, went shopping - great! The 5th night though, I requested "him". I wanted a turn to be the woman and be treated special by my man. My request did not go over well and we had a big fight. It made me see that he always had to have things go his way and our relationship ended. Given that he just met his femme self, I don't think he realized the jackpot he hit with such an accepting partner.

[vetobob9]

The answer you seek is simple: compromise.
If you are Christian then you know that you own your wife and your wife owns you. Therefore you should treat each equally and no side should expect to get everything it wants.

[Noortje]

To your question. My wife only speaks in cryptic remarks, generally I can read her like a book the only time I have trouble is with the CDing where I am not sure she is always honest. To be clear so that there is no confusion I am not asking to stroll around town in flip flops with painted nails I merely wanted to wear flip flops on the beach and my nails are always painted. The only vacations I have ever been on in my life have been with my wife and her mother and at least one I didn't want to go on at all and I still went. I am not trying to be a selfish person nor am I trying to spoil her vacation I merely wanted a small opportunity to express myself in what I consider a small way. I will communicate this to her I was really just looking for advice here.

Speaking only in cryptic remarks seems like something to work on. Open and clear communication is very important in a marriage, especially if the marriage involves crossdressing. I'm sorry if I was being blunt, but I was just surprised that you were asking us what your wife thinks.

[Stephenie S]

Because I think this is so important, and because I think you haven't got it yet, I am going to say this again.

Take your wife on a vacation WITH HER HUSBAND. No girly flip flops. No painted toenails. No nuthin' girly. Not on the beach. Not in the bedroom in private. Nothing. Be the man she fell in love with 100% for the week of this vacation. Stop trying to be fair. Stop being selfish. You will reap so many points with this.

There's a saying that I learned in Baltimore. "If mama ain't happy, ain't NOBODY happy." Your wife has made her position on this vacation very clear. Listen to her. If you don't you will regret it for the rest of your (possibly short) marriage. As was pointed out already, women have LONG memories.

Come on. You aren't man enough to be a man for a week? Of course you are. Just do it. You'll be glad you did.

Stephie

[Rianna Humble]

I won't be quite as brutal about it as Busker and Stephenie S, but you have received good advice and keep coming back to what you want to the exclusion of what your wife wants.

Sure, you can go on your vacation, totally ignore your wife's feelings and in doing so irreperably damage any support that she was willing to offer you and possibly even jeopardise your marriage. If that is what you want then go ahead and follow your desires but don't be very surprised when you have a miserable time.

Equally, you can do what Stephenie suggests, ignore your own needs for the vacation still continue not to communicate with your wife and make yourself resentful and your wife's vacation hell. If that is what you decide, don't be very surprised when you have a miserable time or if your marriage fails.

Alternatively, you can try to rediscover an artform thast many men seem to have lost - that of communicating. This does not just mean wading in and laying down the law. It means you tell your wife about your feelings and she will listen, then you listen to her feelings without trying to work out how to "win the argument". After you have both expressed your feelings, you try to see how you can understand her needs and she will do the same for you. Following on from the genuine listening and genuine understanding, you get to the point where you can work together to plan a vacation that meets the needs of both of you.

[suchacutie]

I have to say that initially I thought we were talking about a little "pink fog" here, but after all these postings one could look at the situation from a couple of perspectives:

One is clearly a communication issue. There seem to be walls building here and that can only eventually lead to conflict from behind those walls. Oh, and that "cryptic" thing that women do? Isn't that what we want our en femme parts to understand, and isn't the only way to gain understanding is to ask, listen, ask, listen, etc?

Secondly, and this is the frightening part, you have a balance in front of you. On one side is your wife literally handing herself to her man on a silver platter. One the other side are painted toes and flip flops. If your wife is not your first choice, I am worried about the balanced within your marriage. I am also worried about the setting of priorites and the ability to look long term (as opposed to short-term).

Please look at this carefully. Everyone who responded sees how important this decision is.

best wishes,
Tina

[jayme357]

You come here asking for advice and then promptly ignore everything that does not fit in with your pre-conceived ideas. If there is a consistancy in the responses you have received it is that your attitude is going to do significant damage to your relationship. Forgive me for my candidness, but you display the biggest stubborn streak I have seen in ages. You have decided what it is you want and are looking here for validation of your position. It ain't gonna happen! The reason it will not happen is because your position is so flawed that it has virtually no merit whatsoever.

Listen to the advice you have been given.

[Jessica86]

A vacation is a trip away from home, yes. Maybe she wants to take a trip to forget about things on her side as well. A trip away would do wonders for the both of you, whether or not you are en femme. I know I have gone on vacation before with my wife and I never mention even the slightest thing about dressing. I do it for my wife, who, in my view, deserves a break from all stressful things while on a vacation. Dressing stresses our wives out whether they want to admit it or not. They also see how you put it out of the way while on vacation. Putting it aside for a while will build trust with her that you want to stay with her and want to stay a man. Most women instantly think we want to have a sex change when we admit we cross dress. That's rarely the case in married relationships. Guarantee you if you put it out of the way and forget about it, she will know what you did for her, and will do nothing but help your relationship together.

[kendra_gurl]

When I was young and still living at home my father bought a camper for his pickup truck thinking it would be great to vacation in. He was selfemployed so vacations mainly consisted of 3 day weekend trips not too far away. My Mother never complained untill the day several years later when he sold that camper stating "I never got a vacation from that camper. I still had to buy the grocries pack the clothes do the cooking and the dishes while on His vacation". Just something to consider since your wive has accepted what you have been doing for the last several years all along. Perhaps SHE just wants a vacation from all your femme side for just one week.

[Fab Karen]

I think that you are discussing this with the wrong people. You really need to talk about this with your wife. Let her know specifically what you want to do and then listen carefully to what she wants to do. I'm fairly sure that a compromise can be worked out between two mature people as long as they communicate well.

Yep. And neither person should make assumptions with their partner. But if you've got a situation like Karren's, you've got to find a career that takes you away from home just so you can let your femme side out.:)

[StarrOfDelite]

Based on your posts only, my fwiw opinion is that You and Wife need real professional counseling sessions, and not half-assed curbstone opinions from the Crossdressers message board.

[ReineD]

Based on your posts only, my fwiw opinion is that You and Wife need real professional counseling sessions, and not half-assed curbstone opinions from the Crossdressers message board.

StarrOfDelite, did you wake up on the wrong side of bed this morning? :)

True, this is a message board and not a therapists' couch. Still, we do the best we can with providing our own points of view and sharing experiences that have worked for us. This is what non-professional support is all about.

The OP is always free to take what fits, and leave the rest.