Why do some MTF crossdressers claim to be attracted to males only when enfemme?

[Areyan]

hehe, hi all ;)

i normally avoid this section like the plague but i was intrigued by the thread "crossdressers that are into men" - http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?155855-Crossdressers-that-are-into-Men

in this thread a large number of cds claimed to be sexually attracted to men - only while dressed enfemme. to me this is the biggest load of codswallop i've ever heard.... lol. seriously? :devil: puhlease.

i am FTM and consider myself straight. before i came out and accepted myself i lived as a straight woman and had relationships with men. now i cannot even think of doing something like that because it feels wrong. i cannot change my orientation even if i wanted to. i am STILL straight. i am now attracted to women and have a girlfriend. i grappled with this part of my sexuality for a long time before realizing i was a man on the inside and not just a lesbian woman. it has nothing to do with what i'm wearing, it's who i am. to use crossdressing as a cover-up for your orientation is rather sad and i believe, dishonest.

i know plenty of ggs freak out when confronted with their husbands/SOs cding so i have to ask - are you lying about your orientation to keep your partner in your life or are you just one messed-up and confused cookie?

[busker]

Areyan, you certainly didn't pull any punches did you? It will be interesting to see what responses you get. Maybe there are more bi folk among us than care to admit. I too wonder since one of the threads that got 50K + hits was "dating men".
I got this from Nation magazine as an email message a week or so ago. They are soliciting funds on behalf of the safeharbor organization.
If the figures below translated to the general population, there are going to be some large numbers, and would apply to this forum's users as well.
Did you know... that of the nearly 1.7 million homeless youth in this country, 20% to 40% of them identify as LGBTQ? Yet just 10% of the general population identifies as LGBTQ. Young people who risk "coming out" also risk being rejected by their families, thrown out onto the streets where they face the even greater dangers of violence, abuse, and exploitation.
http://safehorizon.org

[girlalex]

I'm a mtf cd and in my case I'm attracted to men regardless if I'm dressed enfemme or not. The reason why I would want to get dressed if say I'm going out and I want to meet someone is because I don't want to appear as a gay male because that's just simply not how I feel about my self. All the cloths do is make me feel pretty and appropriate to my gander identity. The exact same reason why a genetic female would dress sexy when she goes out to the club with her girlfriends on a Friday night. The reason why I might feel more attracted to men when I'm dressed is because naturally men are more attracted to femme guys/girls be it gay/straight. The whole idea of being dressed with full on make up and everything is "exiting" already by itself because you automatically look more desirable/happy.

[Areyan]

I'm a mtf cd and in my case I'm attracted to men regardless if I'm dressed enfemme or not.

thanks a lot for your answer, and i appreciate your frankness but i was aiming my question at cds who claim to be hetero males when not dressed.


If the figures below translated to the general population, there are going to be some large numbers, and would apply to this forum's users as well.
Did you know... that of the nearly 1.7 million homeless youth in this country, 20% to 40% of them identify as LGBTQ? Yet just 10% of the general population identifies as LGBTQ. Young people who risk "coming out" also risk being rejected by their families, thrown out onto the streets where they face the even greater dangers of violence, abuse, and exploitation.

this is also interesting to note but again, i'm not asking for statistics or how big a percentage of the cding population is gay, i am asking why some closet bi/gay cders feel the need to lie to their WIVES and GIRLFRIENDS - people who are not particularly famous for this hideous abuse and violence that these statistics are showing.

anyone else?

[Cynthia Anne]

Ya got this country girl thinkin'! Good question! I'm not into men! BUT when I'm in fem I'm more comfortable around them! And my thoughts are so girlish I feel I could flirt and have! When I'm in male mode don't mess with me if you want to keep breathing! OMG help me!!!

[Violetgray]

Areyan I agree with you 100%, here's my theory:

I'm only attracted to men while enfemme = I love feeling like a woman, and I'm willing to do things with men in order to make myself feel like a woman.

It's the high of being desired the way a woman would that they are after. Either that or they may actually be bisexual, and only willing to indulge it enfemme.

We should also consider that when you say "I'm only attracted to men while enfemme" what you're saying is that sexual preference is a choice, and not hard-wired, and we all know the implications of that..

[PetiteDuality]

You can actually find people claiming that they are CD, are attracted to men only when dressed, but they are straight...

I don't know why it's so hard for some people to admit they are homosexual/bisexual, or at least bi-curious. I can understand why it's hard in real life, but I don't get why so much hiding in an anonymous Internet forum.

[Areyan]

We should also consider that when you say "I'm only attracted to men while enfemme" what you've saying is that sexual preference is a choice, and not hard-wired, and we all know the implications of that..

thanks violet, i think this where a lot of misunderstanding can happen. i have no qualms about how people want to express their gender or sexual orientation, and i'm not judging folks for being gay or bi - but i get annoyed when i see cders making comments about flirting with men who have gg SOs in the forum. it's insulting and rude to their partners so i thought to ask if there was a reason for it beyond fantasy and being careless. no one likes the implication that orientation is a choice, but i think you've helped define for me just how easy it can be for some to get caught up in the fantasy of it all and it can blur the lines for some.

thanks for your answers, ladies... anyone else who wants to add to this, you're welcome... i hope this thread helps broaden not just my understanding but perhaps helps others with their questioning too.

[Genivieve]

It might just be late and I might be cranky...but your post seems inconsistent and a bit mean spirited. "i normally avoid this section like the plague" is not a good intro kind of sounds like a put down from the start.

You are FTM and consider yourself straight had relationships with men yet now have relationships with women. Ok brushing aside any irkiness. You kind of explained your journey. You were with men and now with women.

I can say for me like some of the above comments, when I'm dressed and fully expressing that side I can see how I might want to play the role of female to the fullest. Maybe I will take it further make it more permanent. However, men do have a harder time easing into that role for many reasons. The least of which is that women "crossdress" all the time with little judgement. Go ahead wear pants, have short hair, have a girlfriend, kiss in public. A guy wearing a dress kissing another guy would not be accepted so easily. I have worked a few corporate jobs and gone to 2 high education universities where this was the case.

[JiveTurkeyOnRye]

I expect this thread is going to get heated quickly.

I think Violet is right in that for many, it isn't so much that they are truly attracted to men as much as it is that they are attracted to what being with a man represents for them when dressing/acting like a woman. It never quite sits right with me though when people say stuff that essentially says they consider being penetrated by a man to be the ultimate in being "treated like a woman." It just feels very misogynistic to me.

As far as the latent bisexual tendencies in some MTF CDers, it seems like many CDs actually take on almost an entirely different personality when they dress up and adopt their female personas. It's not my place to judge the psychological weight of keeping one's own personality so bifurcated, but I think these men who do this are being honest, or at least think they are, when they say they have no attraction to men when not en femme because they've so successfully pushed all of those desires onto their female personas.

However, I don't know if the ones to truly villanize are the ones whose GG SO's also post on this board because at least that means there's some degree of openness about it because they're not posting it somewhere they're worried their SO won't see it. It's the guys who might post an ad on Craigslist or other less-reputible crossdressing websites that I think an SO would have actual trouble with.

[Traceyjo]

I am definititely only attracted to men when I am en femme, I'm not trying to hide from myself or anyone else that I'm really gay. When I'm dressed I am attracted to men and wanting men to feel attracted to me. As a male I find no sexual arousal induced by any male but it changes once I'm transformed. It's not codswallop Areyan, its the way it is for me and the way I like it to be.. I didn't start dressing until I was over 30 and until then the idea of attraction to another male never entered my mind. It took a few years before I realised that having a guy wanting to have sex with me made me feel more fulfilled in my role as a woman and excited me. As Tracey I feel a desire for handsome sexy guys that is just not there in male mode and I love it being that way

[Violetgray]

I am definititely only attracted to men when I am en femme, I'm not trying to hide from myself or anyone else that I'm really gay. When I'm dressed I am attracted to men and wanting men to feel attracted to me. As a male I find no sexual arousal induced by any male but it changes once I'm transformed. It's not codswallop Areyan, its the way it is for me and the way I like it to be.. I didn't start dressing until I was over 30 and until then the idea of attraction to another male never entered my mind. It took a few years before I realised that having a guy wanting to have sex with me made me feel more fulfilled in my role as a woman and excited me. As Tracey I feel a desire for handsome sexy guys that is just not there in male mode and I love it being that way

This illustrates my point perfectly. If I don't particularly enjoy the taste of donuts, then dressing up like a cop isn't going to change that. But I might be willing to do so if for whatever reason I was interested in playing the role of a cop*. I don't think you are truly attracted to the person if it is dependent a upon change that you make to yourself. "You're only hot when I put on this hat."

What you are attracted to is the situation, but there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. As long as he understands that your good time together exists exclusively under these conditions then enjoy! It could be that he's attracted to the situation too. You've fulfilled the "two consenting adults" requirement, and that's what matters.


*(I'm aware that "All cops like donuts" is just a silly stereotype, but then again not all women like men either!)

[sometimes_miss]

"Why do some MTF crossdressers claim to be attracted to males only when enfemme?"

Ah yes, the forbidden word. Homosexuality. We grow up with it being told to us as the absolutely worst thing any man can ever contemplate. So horrible that even gay men are made to feel guilty about it. I don't blame anyone for feeling that way. But let's not kid ourselves about it; 99.9999% of us, when we dress if female clothing, dress in that which is designed to entice lust in males. Few of us aspire to wear plain gray female sweatshirts and pants, old grungy female sneakers, no make up, no jewelry, and wear our hair tucked under a baseball cap to keep it out of the way; like Roseann Barr on a bad day of housekeeping back on her TV show. Nope. Not by a long shot. We want to look like a Victoria's secret model, or someone who just walked out of a Fredericks of Hollywood photo shoot. The reason's for that will vary; but the end result is still the same; to appear like a very beautiful, and therefore very sexy to males, woman.

And as Jerry Seinfeld said, "Not that there's anything wrong with that." Because there isn't. Even Ron White admitted, everyone's at least a little bit gay. No one should dislike what they are. Let's just get over it everyone, admit that even if we are completely repulsed at the idea of sexual contact with a guy, still, the behavior is, what it is. Nothing more, and nothing less.

[Pythos]

NO. Quite simply I am NOT attracted to men in a sexual nature. I do not find the male physique in anyway apealing as something to cuddle with, make out with, and yes have sex with. I do not find many points of male behavior in any way attractive. But this may be also due to the fact I am male that has a preferred look that is only a mix of the two genders, leaning toward feminine. It is a look that is in fact unacceptable for the most part out in the "real world" where a fulll on Feme CD that passes is much more accepted.

Just look at the number of times a male in skirt look is lambasted even here. This is essentially what I would love to do. I get BS because I am a male that wears leggings more often than jeans, despite the fact leggings were originally and to an extent still are Unisex. I would face none of that if I were a female.

I will also say, that when I am in androg, or full on fem mode I do feel MORE attracted to women, and nearly NO attraction to men. I went clubbing last monday and there was a fellow CD in the group, and he did really good, but I was not sexually drawn to him. Nutty I know, but you asked.

Also, if you are a FtoM that has not had surgery, then in the most technical way you are in fact a lesbian, which I have absolutely no issues with. In fact if I could find myself a bisexual or lesbian female, I would hope I would be a happy man (in my skirts, wigs, and makeup :P)


It never quite sits right with me though when people say stuff that essentially says they consider being penetrated by a man to be the ultimate in being "treated like a woman." It just feels very misogynistic to me.
Yea, I read this line here and other areas and it is one that just baffles me. It makes me think that these individuals think that the whole being of being a woman is centered around being penetrated. Seems really limited to me honestly, and quite inaccurate.

On a different note brought up here, and that is the aversion to "gay". Ok, once again one just needs to look around. Yes in the more enlightened areas of the world, homosexuality is at worst tolerated. But when you get into the less enlightened areas of the world, this characteristic can actually lead to YOUR DEATH. In this country you can still have a hard time getting a job for any number of reasons, but the real reason that they will not say is that you are gay. In our silly world if you are a CD you are dressing to attract men....IT WAS JUST STATED IN A POST IN THIS THREAD. Look at it.
when we dress in female clothing, dress in that which is designed to entice lust in males. I for one do not dress to attract men, I dress for me, and to attract an open minded, free thinking woman. I dress for the woman that finds Abby, Morticia, Elvira, Mana, Lady Gaga, and Marilyn Manson and whoever else attractive, but is not truly a lesbian. I know they exist, but they are quite hard to find in the circles I am currently mostly exposed to.

When in male mode....no question, I am attracted to women. The level of attraction only increases when I am dressed up. LOL

Crazy, I know.

The great maker had some fun when it wired my brain. Then most likely looked at the plans and crumpled them up.

[AllieSF]

I see several reasons for the attraction to men while dressed. An easy one is that someone is gay. The next one is that someone is bi. The next that someone is bi curious and the dressing offers them the opportunity to explore that side of themselves together with the other side of them as a man in women's clothing. All those, to me anyway, are easy to understand.

Then you get to the professed straight CD's and their statements here that they would like to be with a man. They also can be sub-divided. Some are not sure of their bi curiousness, so in replying to "Dating Men" type threads, they can truthfully say they are interested, but interest does not always mean action. Then you get the other CD's who also fantasize a lot so that anything feminine, anything that a woman would do, they dream of doing too, like getting out of their closet and actually going out into the real world, dancing at a ball, having sex with a man, sleeping in feminine nightgowns, extreme sissy outfits, smoking as a woman, whatever. I think that a lot of these do just that, fantasize, and will probably never act on many of their expressed dreams.

What I do not understand from your post is why it bothers you at all. There are people out there not understanding why you dress as a woman and why you thought that you were bi and will never understand why you even experimented with your desires and needs. As far as I am concerned everyone on this site can be questioned for anything they do that is associated with out lovely T world, from us T's, to admirers, to SO's. Someone out there has probably already asked, "Why do you stay with your crossdressing husband?". So, lack of understanding and a lack of acceptance and tolerance of us and by us, to let others be themselves from being T's, to loving T's or just supporting T's, exists everywhere from the outside world to us here on this site. My question is to you why does it bother you? Are you looking for total honesty? What? Can't a person dream and fantasize and share those dreams among a similar group of people associated with a common interest. Their dreams do not in anyway harm us here on this site, the dreamers supposedly safe zone. I believe in letting people live their lives, dream their dreams and experiment when they can get up enough courage to do so. I do not believe in indirectly looking down on them by questioning those dreams and making their safe zone a not so safe zone as other members question them on, for them, a possibly very sensitive subject. All for what its worth!

[Paulacder]

People in most cases need a reason or a excuse for doing what they do. Dressing in womens cloths is the reason I like men. Bull..........I have ben dressing for over 4 decades, going out in public has never ben a problem. I have ben a active member in two different crossdressing support groups, and I will say there are very few Heterosexual Crossdressers as everyone claims to be.

[Sheren Kelly]

I theorize that for some, crossdressing gives "permission" to act contrary to their expected social role. In that same line crossdressing may allow some "permission" to express a sexual desire that they would otherwise feel is taboo. I agree with Violet that sexual attraction is innate, but it is also diverse and unique to each of us. Accepting your sexuality is another matter.

[sara.s]

But i was aiming my question at cds who claim to be hetero males when not dressed.

I am hetero, but I think I can still answer your question. I asked a cd I met personally if he (he was in drab mode at that time) was a transvestite/crossdresser and his reply was that he considered himself "bi-gendered"; that he completely switches to female mannerisms when dressed and is completely male mode when not. He thinks of them as two totally different persons. I did not ask him about his sexuality but I presume it would be the similar - "hetero when not dressed and not when dressed".

[Crissy Kay]

A very interesting question. I find that I am on the bi side, but am only attracted to other cds!!! I have no interest in men as men, other then being friends. I am really not sure what that means, and have not told my SO about it at all.

[Angiemead12]

Im attracted to mostly females and TS girls. Because men compartmentalize their identity its easy for them to think differently when they are dressed. Also to validate ones sexual identity means to have sex with the opposite sex.

[Avana]

The answer I think is simple -

Attraction to men is probably based on perceived reciprocal male attraction to the CD.

What they are really looking for is attention and validation.


Either that or it's merely repressed homosexuality.

[Elsa]

"Why do some MTF crossdressers claim to be attracted to males only when enfemme?"

But let's not kid ourselves about it; 99.9999% of us, when we dress if female clothing, dress in that which is designed to entice lust in males. Few of us aspire to wear plain gray female sweatshirts and pants, old grungy female sneakers, no make up, no jewelry, and wear our hair tucked under a baseball cap to keep it out of the way; like Roseann Barr on a bad day of housekeeping back on her TV show. Nope. Not by a long shot. We want to look like a Victoria's secret model, or someone who just walked out of a Fredericks of Hollywood photo shoot. The reason's for that will vary; but the end result is still the same; to appear like a very beautiful, and therefore very sexy to males, woman.


I agree totally with this. We are unconfortable to be labelled as Gays, not necessarily because we are afraid of that word, may be it is just that we do not know what we are.
Most of us dress to be attractive and sexy women. if we would like to have a relashionship with men when dressed, does that make us automatically gays or should we bring the gender/sexe dimension and consider the relation as heterosexual?

I personally crossdress for over 30 years. The sexual component of my crossdressing is and has been always very important although my crossdressing has evolved and changed with time. I dress more and more frequently and feel more and more feminine. In the past, I have never been attracted to men dressed or undressed but I have to admit that with age, the idea of being a sexy woman on the receiving end of a sexual encounter is becoming more frequent. Is that because I am getting Gayish or is it because I am getting more feminine? I think the issue is a bit more complexe than we want to admit and I certainly would love to have a definite answer to this dilemma.

[Kathi Lake]

I call it 'situational heterosexuality.' When dressed as a woman, some feel more comfortable admitting those feelings that are usually buried. It almost makes it all right to have those feelings as hey, they're women now, right?

Kathi

[Kaitlyn Michele]

In my CD days, i learned to accept my sexuality. i had a hard time doing...it was part of my "arc" as a ts person...It must be tough for a married CD to confront these feelings..i'm sorry if you are going through it...

however, saying you are not gay because you only go out with men or only fantasize about men when dressed is codswallop to use areyan's phrase..

When i had male parts, almost every single lover and man i met actually said the words "im not gay" to me... think about that...they would say it....sometimes it was said with 60 seconds meeting them, or if we started to touch in any romantic way., and also in emails...

but they sure liked my male parts, and not one of them had any interest in me after transition and srs..not one.

People don't like to confront the very sexual nature of cd'ing for lots of reasons.

[Becca13]

What Violet said, “What you are attracted to is the situation” made a lot of sense to me.

I’m not out, so I have no experience in the real world as Becca. So this is how I think and feel. I consider Becca to be bi and Paul straight. So yes I am one CD that is only attracted to males while enfemme. For example when I watch movies, mainstream or adult; as Becca I visualize myself in the female role; as Paul I visualize myself in the male role. Easy enough for mainstream movies. As for adult movies, in either mode I enjoy straight and lesbian scenes, however gay scenes do absolutely nothing for me in either mode.

Then Sara said “"bi-gendered"…He thinks of them as two totally different persons.”

Bi-gendered, describes me and explains how just as Becca and Paul are different persons/genders they can have different sexualities.

Or with just a little modification to what Kathi said, “situational *sexuality”

I think you girls just saved me a bunch of time and money on therapy, Thank you, *hugs* all-around.

Cheers

[Avana]

What Violet said, “What you are attracted to is the situation” made a lot of sense to me.

I’m not out, so I have no experience in the real world as Becca. So this is how I think and feel. I consider Becca to be bi and Paul straight. So yes I am one CD that is only attracted to males while enfemme. For example when I watch movies, mainstream or adult; as Becca I visualize myself in the female role; as Paul I visualize myself in the male role. Easy enough for mainstream movies. As for adult movies, in either mode I enjoy straight and lesbian scenes, however gay scenes do absolutely nothing for me in either mode.

Then Sara said “"bi-gendered"…He thinks of them as two totally different persons.”

Bi-gendered, describes me and explains how just as Becca and Paul are different persons/genders they can have different sexualities.

Or with just a little modification to what Kathi said, “situational *sexuality”

I think you girls just saved me a bunch of time and money on therapy, Thank you, *hugs* all-around.

Cheers


You can rationalize it anyway you want, but at the end of the day, you have one brain and one body, and whether or not you only have sex with men as a woman and women as a man, that makes you bisexual through and through.

[JiveTurkeyOnRye]

You can rationalize it anyway you want, but at the end of the day, you have one brain and one body, and whether or not you only have sex with men as a woman and women as a man, that makes you bisexual through and through.

I agree. There's a real "jekyll and hyde" excuse that some people seem to have where they want to act like they are two very distinct people who just seem to be renting the same body, but United States of Tara aside, Multiple Personality Disorder just isn't nearly as common as these boards would sometimes suggest.

It's sort of like the Colbert Report. By virtue of playing a caricature of a certain type of TV host, Stephen Colbert is able to say things he might not be able to get away with if he were just hosting a straight forward show as his true self, but even the real Stephen Colbert has said he likes sliding his true beliefs into the rhetoric of the character on the show.

[dutch-anita]

I personally crossdress for over 30 years. The sexual component of my crossdressing is and has been always very important although my crossdressing has evolved and changed with time. I dress more and more frequently and feel more and more feminine. In the past, I have never been attracted to men dressed or undressed but I have to admit that with age, the idea of being a sexy woman on the receiving end of a sexual encounter is becoming more frequent. Is that because I am getting Gayish or is it because I am getting more feminine? I think the issue is a bit more complexe than we want to admit and I certainly would love to have a definite answer to this dilemma.

This is so me, 38 years into crossdressing and only the last 2-3 years thinking about men, but still into women as well so this make's me BI, very late in life but better late then never! btw same question asked 4 years ago? 100% strait! never ever thinking about men, (maybe a good looking CD'er but no men) so never say never..... it can happen to you to :D

[joannemarie barker]

it's a bit different for me,before finding this site I was totally attracted to big strong looking guys but since I have been here I've become more and more attracted to other CDs :)

[LilSissyStevie]

I think a lot can be explained by the concept of "copulatory instinct" which is explained here (http://www.crossdreamers.com/2010/09/female-and-male-copulation-instincts-1.html) and here (http://www.crossdreamers.com/2010/09/female-and-male-copulation-instincts-2.html). I think many if not most CDs who fantasize about sex with men only see the men in question as faceless abstractions. They aren't attracted to men in real life but the male abstractions exist so that the CD can be the woman in the fantasy.

My very first orgasm when I was 12 was achieved while having just such a fantasy. I figured that I must sexually attracted to males or why would I think such things? But, as the years went by, I had numerous crushes on girls and never once found another guy attractive even though I still had these fantasies where I was the girl having sex with men. The only two explanations that have ever made any sense to me are autogynephilia and the copulatory instinct concept. I think autogynephilia was just my way of rationalizing the fact I have the cis-female copulatory instinct. What I really experience is actually autogynephila turned inside out. I am not aroused by the thought of myself as a female. Being aroused brings out the "female" in me. And, no, it's not the only thing.

[Pythos]

Weird. I have never fantasized about being with a man. I have fantasized about being with a "masculine" or strong woman, but that is the closest to male I have gotten.

[Badtranny]

Wow what a fantastic thread.

I can't really answer per the OP's initial question, but as an aside I can say that I thought I was gay since I was very young, because I thought that all gay guys wanted to be girls. Mind you, I did not WANT to be gay and I tried earnestly to be the macho straight guy that I admired. I had girlfriends, got married (twice) played Hockey, raced Motocross, made my self as muscular as I could but in the end, all I was doing was wasting time. Later I obviously realized that I had other issues and I wasn't exactly gay, but I can speak from first hand experience about the power of denial. I can attest that coming out to MYSELF as gay, then as trans, was far more difficult than coming out to anyone else. Being completely out is like being given the key to the world and my heart breaks for those closeted (even to themselves) souls that cannot allow themselves to experience the joy that I've discovered over the last few years.

[busker]

Areyan I agree with you 100%, here's my theory:

I'm only attracted to men while enfemme = I love feeling like a woman, and I'm willing to do things with men in order to make myself feel like a woman.

It's the high of being desired the way a woman would that they are after. Either that or they may actually be bisexual, and only willing to indulge it enfemme.

We should also consider that when you say "I'm only attracted to men while enfemme" what you're saying is that sexual preference is a choice, and not hard-wired, and we all know the implications of that..

Isn't this also the classic definitiion of transvestite? Men who dress like a woman to have sex with a man. so perhaps there really are two categories of dresser, crossdresser (plain vanilla) and transvestite
. "Situational heterosexuality" is just a euphamism for TV. It all boils down to being honest. Wouldn't it be easier if folks just said they are bi-sexual. They would certainly gain more support from the LGBT groups, at least more so than claiming to be a crossdresser. There is a lot of talk about honesty here but that too seems to be situational.
just saying.

[NicoleScott]

Minutes ago I posted to a thread started by Pythos and I said that I'm not physically attracted to men. And that is true. I used to chat a lot on AOL and occasionally exchange emails with men. I've never asked for a photo and I would never as a cd meet a man, period. But I do enjoy the conversation, and I like it when we both use the anonimity of the internet to be honest in our conversations. We talk about my cd-ing and his attraction to cd's. By the way, more often than not in my experiences, men who are attracted to cd's consider themselves straight, the usual explanation being that they are attracted to the pretty female appearance independent of what's under the skirt. Anyway, I think there can be a psychological attraction to men who find me attractive, but still no physical attraction. I think it's a response to flattery, wanting to hear more of it. That's how I see it, from my experiences.

[eluuzion]

In my opinion...cognitive dissonance has a tendency to wear you down, like a toothache that is ignored.

The mental discord produced by this issue eventually sends you looking for a way to release some of the pressure. An acceptable way that allows you to resolve some of that cognitive dissonance "pressure" in your head...but still enables you to continue self-denial.

One of the typical strategies employed by liars is to attempt to "redefine" and break down their acts of deception and lies into "categories", which always include some cases where their actions are "technically" not lies and deception, lol.

It is the same process, but the person is doing it internally (self-denial).

It is kind of like accepting the concept of being "a little bit dead"....

...this is an issue of being "a little bit honest"....:heehee:

just my thoughts...:hugs:

:love:

[Elsa]

I think a lot can be explained by the concept of "copulatory instinct" which is explained here (http://www.crossdreamers.com/2010/09/female-and-male-copulation-instincts-1.html) and here (http://www.crossdreamers.com/2010/09/female-and-male-copulation-instincts-2.html). I think many if not most CDs who fantasize about sex with men only see the men in question as faceless abstractions. They aren't attracted to men in real life but the male abstractions exist so that the CD can be the woman in the fantasy.

Better rush and read this concept of copulatory instinct, might bring some insight. Thanks.

[JiveTurkeyOnRye]

I think many if not most CDs who fantasize about sex with men only see the men in question as faceless abstractions. They aren't attracted to men in real life but the male abstractions exist so that the CD can be the woman in the fantasy.


This is interesting to me, if only because it reminds me of waaaay back before I was open and out about my CDing and my only internet presence was faceless pictures on myspace or earlier attempts at internet social networking like AOL profiles and chat rooms or yahoo photo galleries. Back then I would get frequent emails from men soliciting me for sex, and they'd be so forward and explicit about it that it really freaked me out and made me feel like maybe there was something wrong with me and what I was doing if my pictures elicited such a reaction, namely that it made these guys think such behavior was welcomed. I would put messages in my profiles in as plain english as I could that I was not seeking such attention and that I was interested in women, or in friendly conversations with other crossdressers.

Nothing put a stop to it, until I started posting face pics. This was before I had started showing my boy face, so I was in full "Alyssa" mode back then, but once I started posting my face these messages almost entirely stopped. It was then that I realized that by posting faceless photos, I was essentially an identity-less symbol for these guys' desires, and they didn't see me as anything but that. But once I had a face to it, and let's be honest, a face that made it clear I was really a man as I was never all that passable, I became a real person. I'd still get hit on sometimes but it was usually a more tastefully done, and in a way where I felt more comfortable saying "Thanks but no thanks" rather than just wanting to hide from it.

[Pythos]

Good point Rye. Actually excellent points. Faceless is how I think many males view women or even sexual partners. I recall seeing in history class little "fetishes" which were ancient statues of "women". Essentially they were headless things in the very rough shape of women. They were plump, had to breasts, and a slit in the nether regions. These statues had NO HEAD ever, this could be dicerned in the manner the neck area resulted in a point.

Personally I find the fantasizing of a faceless person somehow revolting. It shows that there is actually no interest in the person, but instead the person's "goods". To me, in my opinion, that is a very crass way of viewing another human being for such an intimate thing.

[Maria Blackwood]

I guess you are you and other people are other people. Your experiences and feelings are not theirs, and vice versa.

Now, I shall cough vigorously and send a cloud of plague in your direction.

[ReineD]

I think there is a difference between a genuine attraction to the opposite sex, and a desire to use props (or faceless men in fantasy posts) in order to feel more feminine.

I can "sorta" imagine how a CDer in her fantasies might feel more masculine in comparison to a GG, and more feminine when picturing herself with a guy. But if she's hetero (or if she prefers, lesbian when dressed), then I imagine there would be a real turn-off if she did go out on a date with this "faceless" guy, then found herself naked with him in a bedroom afterwards. And those who would not be turned off are either gay or bi to begin with.

In other words, the fantasy of being feminine and being desired as a woman is far more important than the sexual act of being with a guy.

Just saying that a post from someone who fantasizes or "wonders" is not the same thing as actually going through with it.

... and, you know, this place does lend itself well for people to get lost in their fantasies. It's the internet and it's anonymous! :)


EDIT - Elsa, sorry I've just read your post and see that you've already said this.

[ChanDelle]

Why do some MTF crossdressers claim to be attracted to males only when enfemme?

Is it possible some ARE only attracted to males when enfemme? I can see that it might be true regardless of opinions. I'm not one who feels this way as I'm attracted to women only en femme or not. Just want to give them the benefit of the doubt....

ChanDelle

[xcdmargo]

I know for myself that I have absolutely no sexual feelings for guys when I am not dressed. I don't ever remember feeling any different. When I am dressed I love the feeling of guys paying attention to me and wanting me. I also love the feeling of giving in to their desires. But then again I also love the feeling of being with another CD or Tg as well.

I have no idea where this puts me on the sexuality meter but it's the way I am.

BTW I'm very attracted to women no matter how I'm dressed.

margo

[Jeanna]

In my opinion...cognitive dissonance has a tendency to wear you down, like a toothache that is ignored.

The mental discord produced by this issue eventually sends you looking for a way to release some of the pressure. An acceptable way that allows you to resolve some of that cognitive dissonance "pressure" in your head...but still enables you to continue self-denial.

One of the typical strategies employed by liars is to attempt to "redefine" and break down their acts of deception and lies into "categories", which always include some cases where their actions are "technically" not lies and deception, lol.

It is the same process, but the person is doing it internally (self-denial).

It is kind of like accepting the concept of being "a little bit dead"....

...this is an issue of being "a little bit honest"....:heehee:

just my thoughts...:hugs:

:love:

You hit it right on the head. I'm also amazed on how many people need to reply "No not me!" I never had those thoughts! I'm totally straight" Do they really need to post that? Come on, really?

[Lucy_Bella]

Great question ,

I never even read the thread you are talking about nor will I , I am secure in my sexuality. I have no desire to ever be with a man dressed or not . However , if those whom like being dressed and seek a man are amoung us so be it I have no problems with it and its none of my business . Some here really truley believe that they were born the wrong sex and maybe they have been forced to live their life as the sex they were born as , perhaps taught morales from family to resist temptation or they are not prepared for the cost of filling their desires. I am sure that for some its a heavy price to pay.

But it's typical for most women to equate that because some men who where unfortunate enough to be born with this non socially acceptable behavior of burdened with the need to dress as Femme.. To be also be tied as a homosexual, and thats far from the truth.. Some of us are straight males and its an unfair conclusion to think other wise from any gender or sexually different or oreanted
person..
Thats just my two cents..

[Violetgray]

Isn't this also the classic definitiion of transvestite? Men who dress like a woman to have sex with a man. so perhaps there really are two categories of dresser, crossdresser (plain vanilla) and transvestite
. "Situational heterosexuality" is just a euphamism for TV. It all boils down to being honest. Wouldn't it be easier if folks just said they are bi-sexual. They would certainly gain more support from the LGBT groups, at least more so than claiming to be a crossdresser. There is a lot of talk about honesty here but that too seems to be situational.
just saying.

Um, no. No definition of transvestite involves interaction with members of either sex. I've heard some define transvestism as specifically crossdressing for sexual gratification, but the act of dressing has nothing to do with who you sleep with.

[Aprilrain]

I haven't read all of the responses so maybe someone said it already. Anyway I think another explanation is that many "CDers" are really closet TSes, not that being TS means you have to be a heterosexual woman. I only bring this up as an option because it is my experience somewhat. I didn't dress and then feel attraction toward men I would feel the need to be a woman, dress and then usually fulfill my desires for sex as a woman with a man by masturbating. inevitable after the act i was filled with shame, guilt and remorse. I desperately wanted nothing more than the desire to be a woman to go away! The idea of being a man with a man was repulsive to me so i knew i was not gay. Even now I am not attracted to gay men, they may be cute but they are gay which is a turn off for me. I want a man that wants a woman. The last thing I want is to be treated like a man by another man who likes to have sex with men sorry but YUCK! What I undoubtedly am is a heterosexual woman but if your stuck in a mans body that can be very problematic.