growth as a person

[Steph.TS]

I'm 28 years old, and in all honesty I haven't been rebellious through out my teens I did things pretty much what my parents wanted/expected, most of my life I've been a robot in many ways, but recently I've been thinking about doing yoga (something my parents don't want for religious reasons) but I want to do for health and fitness, I'm also thinking more seriously thinking about removing my beard something my mom said she doesn't think is a good idea (a friend of mine also voiced opinion against it) but I need to remove it to be able to be more feminine, apply make easier, and simply avoid shaving the beard everyday.

Rebellion is not something I want to do, but it seems necessary to move forward. the more I do to inch closer to transition the more I feel it's a growth experience. going to see a therapist and doing laser hair removal, are other areas I'd done things for myself instead of what anyone else wanted, and I feel better for having done that.

does anyone else find transitioning to be a growth experience?

[Melody Moore]

does anyone else find transitioning to be a growth experience?
Everything you do or everything that happens, either good or bad, in your life is a growth experience.

Yes in your case rebellion against your family is the only way forward, but this is not unusual by any means.
It means you are becoming stronger & more independent does it not? So no doubt you will start really growing
up when you really have to start to stand on your own two feet.

I think the answer to your question is a 'no brainer' really when you consider those of us who
have found true peace, happiness & freedom through transition, of course you can grow, that
is why we do it. LOL

[Kelsy]

Steph,

I have grown as person and in understanding myself since finding a therapist that is well versed
in gender issues! I love her! I feel freer and more alive even with the ups and downs and the HRT
has settled me downand has made me emotionally more expressive. I really didn't know the value of
a good cry until now!

At twenty eight I think you're adult enough to make any choice you want without feeling it is rebelious.
I have learned that guilt is unproductive and regret is a waste of time and energy. They are the things that
will bind you.

Kelsy

[Jay Cee]

... but recently I've been thinking about doing yoga (something my parents don't want for religious reasons)...

I'm trying hard to wrap my brain around that one. Are they saying that yoga is a sin? And what exercise IS endorsed by them or their church? :rolleyes:

Whose life is it, Steph? Who has to live it, every single moment of every single day? You! Time to cut the apron and/or puppet strings, and get on with your life. You've got lots of support here, and I'm hoping you've joined a support group locally, so that you can talk with folks face to face as well.

Sorry if that sounded like a reprimand. It isn't. It's just strongly worded advice. ;)

:hugs:

Jay Cee

[noeleena]

Hi, Steph,

So your under 16 & live at home okay thats cool. tho i think your real age is a bit more than that no dought youv given them a lot of your time, its time to drop the chains & have a life of your own with out the over bearing of you know what you can & cant do.

For me to hell with the beard, oh never had one , keeping fit yes thats good, so long as you dont allow your mind set to change by taking on others teaching as can be the case just be very awear of what they teach, & if you do yoga have fun

Vinyasa yoga is allso popular & is more fluid.

Ashtanga yoga is called power yoga more for those who are very fit.

Bikeam yoga is referred to as the hot yoga has 26 poses students do in a room at 90 to 100 degrees to loosen the muscles ,

With any keep fit detail , its about take your time & work up to the next level.
& doing to much can cause injury,
So be carefull , mind you a good walk helps , he he ,,,,,,,:):thumbsup:

all the best,

...noeleena...

[Steph.TS]

I'm trying hard to wrap my brain around that one. Are they saying that yoga is a sin? And what exercise IS endorsed by them or their church? :rolleyes:

Whose life is it, Steph? Who has to live it, every single moment of every single day? You! Time to cut the apron and/or puppet strings, and get on with your life. You've got lots of support here, and I'm hoping you've joined a support group locally, so that you can talk with folks face to face as well.

Sorry if that sounded like a reprimand. It isn't. It's just strongly worded advice. ;)

:hugs:

Jay Cee
Yoga isn't a sin, but it is tied to to eastern religion, they just don't want me to be influenced and fall away from the faith, this Friday, I'll be attending my first trans support group meeting (as long as I don't chicken out lol)

Noeleena, I used to have a big thick beard because I was too unmotivated to to do anything about it, though when I was 15 I thought it made me look older/wiser. it's because I had such a nice beard (for about 10 years) that my mom and my friends are opposed to removing it permanently, they think I'll regret losing it. I've found that the more charge I take of my like the more feminine I become the more hope/motivation I have, and ultimately I'm happier, I doubt I'll regret losing it, but admit the possibility is there. I'm coming to the conclusion that hair removal including the beard is the test before you try, removing the body hair does bring me closer to being beautiful if I end up regretting it then I'd probably regret SRS and HRT but if I have no regrets from doing this then it's a green light to move forward.

one of my concerns was removing my arm hair, that everyone would notice and call my girly, but after using veet on it no one has commented on it, and I'm treated the same so that one less thing to fear.

[Aprilrain]

I thought people would notice my arms and legs being shaved who knows maybe they did but no one said anything. One guy I climbed with a lot did ask me about my shaved legs. I said I shaved them cause Im weird. He said he had considered it because it had been so damn hot that summer (last summer). No one said any thing about my arm hair and it took my wife over a week to even notice! That being said there is a HUGE difference in being a guy with very little body hair and being a M2F transsexual. I think you are correct in thinking that if you regret loosing the beard that you probably don't want to do anything else to feminize your body however HRT is a slow process and mostly reversible up to a point. SRS is NOT reversible!!!!!!!!!!

Your family sounds very fundamentalist to me. Do they know of your desires to transition? Not to be negative or bad mouth your religion in anyway but have you considered that if they feel that strongly about yoga and facial hair that when you tell them you're transitioning from male to female that that will probably be the end of your relationship with them? NO ONE should begin transition without being at least somewhat prepared for the very real possibility that they will lose EVERYONE AND EVERYTHING. I have been very surprised at how well everyone has taken it so far however there is yet time to lose some more people. i pretty much lost all my guy friends but instantaneously gained better relationships with many woman. I was always disappointed with the adult male friendship dynamic anyway. Frankly I don't miss any of them and the one male friend I have left from that group is great and is a source of inspiration to me because of his complete lack of judgement and bigotry he also happens to be a very devout Catholic the religion I am still recovering from lol.

[noeleena]

Hi,

Steph,

Yes dont be a chicken & not going , I know what thats like For me if people were involved i hated going , age & that was most of my 55 out of 63 years, & even then i allmost bailed out at a meeting. & then i tryed to hide in a cornerat age 55 & trying to hide, what does that say. . & then we had to give our names & say why are we there. & then i was sweating it hard out. talk about being embarrised, there where about 16 people there. & did not know any one , worse still.

Iv been in all male groups of lots of men totaly hated it & then i walked out,
i just could not stand it any more & soon after in one big group. i was in both male & female i came dressed as i should have been & no one knew me till i smiled at them ,

then they knew, to late then in front of 150 people i had to go up front of all of them with 15 from our group & even those who know me did not know till i told them. after, they were thinking whos this woman. it was really funny at the time, so that being the case i did ...pass . of cause i was sort of hideing behind my ....yea i know wig,

The difference now is iv been in front of many 1000.s of people & talked to 100.s .

Some times what.s expected of us or presumed is what we take on yet is that really us , no of cause not because its not who we really are, & to change that mind set in how we see our selfs is whats holding us back i wont say that every thingis , of cause not ,

Family yes , oh dear you cant do this , because .........of .... how i feel or how i wont you to remain as you are, its not why can i not have my life because they dont wont you to.

So this brings up the ? do they know you are a woman. & going to live as one or, i get the impression that they dont know, ,

For me no hair love it, & nothing up top to comb ether, as it was i rode our horse.s & hated getting my leg hairs in knots silly me never thought to shave them off i should have Jos knew i hated the hair, & who would have cared no one ,that was 38 years ago.

...noeleena...

[Kelsy]

NO ONE should begin transition without being at least somewhat prepared for the very real possibility that they will lose EVERYONE AND EVERYTHING. I have been very surprised at how well everyone has taken it so far however there is yet time to lose some more people. i pretty much lost all my guy friends but instantaneously gained better relationships with many woman. I was always disappointed with the adult male friendship dynamic anyway. Frankly I don't miss any of them .

I always find it amazing how similar my experiences are with so many on this site. I never fit as a male and had to pretend to be one most of the time.
I was never really accepted and so I have little to lose in the male bonded friendship area!

There is nothing in the bible that condems transsexuality! I studied and settled that for myself along time ago!

Kelsy

[Steph.TS]

I thought people would notice my arms and legs being shaved who knows maybe they did but no one said anything. One guy I climbed with a lot did ask me about my shaved legs. I said I shaved them cause Im weird. He said he had considered it because it had been so damn hot that summer (last summer). No one said any thing about my arm hair and it took my wife over a week to even notice! That being said there is a HUGE difference in being a guy with very little body hair and being a M2F transsexual. I think you are correct in thinking that if you regret loosing the beard that you probably don't want to do anything else to feminize your body however HRT is a slow process and mostly reversible up to a point. SRS is NOT reversible!!!!!!!!!!

Your family sounds very fundamentalist to me. Do they know of your desires to transition? Not to be negative or bad mouth your religion in anyway but have you considered that if they feel that strongly about yoga and facial hair that when you tell them you're transitioning from male to female that that will probably be the end of your relationship with them? NO ONE should begin transition without being at least somewhat prepared for the very real possibility that they will lose EVERYONE AND EVERYTHING. I have been very surprised at how well everyone has taken it so far however there is yet time to lose some more people. i pretty much lost all my guy friends but instantaneously gained better relationships with many woman. I was always disappointed with the adult male friendship dynamic anyway. Frankly I don't miss any of them and the one male friend I have left from that group is great and is a source of inspiration to me because of his complete lack of judgement and bigotry he also happens to be a very devout Catholic the religion I am still recovering from lol.

the comments about HRT and SRS, I understand, and that why I'm approaching this cautiously (and I don't want to rock the boat with my family/friends) my Family are fundamentalist, and the only person in my family I told is my mom and she doesn't approve, she prefers I don't talk about it and I think she's hoping it'll go away. I expect that if I come out to my entire family, or even just my dad,my relationship with my family will be dead my dad is opposed to homosexuality and he groups CD,TG, TS in with homosexuality so I come out in his eyes, I'm gay and will very likely want nothing to do with me. I plan to move out before I say anything. so for now I want to go as far as I can without moving out.

[Kelsy]

My older sister and her husband are fundies. but they can't pinpoint where transsexuality is sin!
But talking to a belief system is unproductive!

[Jessinthesprings]

it's not rebellion so to speak... you are being yourself. those who cannot recongnize this and force their thoughts and will on you are being opressors. And what's worse they do so under love.

[Melody Moore]

Sorry Steph to tell you this, but how your parents are dealing with this is wrong & in total contradiction
with everything that is taught in the Bible. And if your parents have so much hatred in the heart for others
who are different just remember it is them who will be judged & cast into hell for their blasphemy. Because
the Bible gives us lots of warnings about how we will be judged with the same measure as we judge others.

Here is an interesting little fact I have uncovered. In ancient Hebrew times being TG/TS or Gay was such a
sin that it was even a sin to talk about it. So the ancient Hebrew language never actually had words for being
gay, homosexual, transgendered, transsexual or intersex. If they had of wrote any type of text to describe these
'vile' acts then they too would have been committing a sin under ancient Hebrew laws. :heehee: So what this means is
the words in the Bible, especially in the old testament that refer to effeminate men & homosexuals were added to
Biblical Scriptures later. The book called the Bible your parents believe in has evolved to become a complete fraud.

There is quite a bit of interesting reading on this topic if you do a search on Google, but here are a couple of links.

See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lesbian_and_gay_topics_and_Judaism
and: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgenderism_and_religion#Judaism
and also see: http://home.earthlink.net/~ecorebbe/id18.html (http://home.earthlink.net/%7Eecorebbe/id18.html)

[Aprilrain]

Sorry Steph to tell you this, but how your parents are dealing with this is wrong & in total contradiction
with everything that is taught in the Bible. And if your parents have so much hatred in the heart for others
who are different just remember it is them who will be judged & cast into hell for their blasphemy. Because
the Bible gives us lots of warnings about how we will be judged with the same measure as we judge others.

Here is an interesting little fact I have uncovered. In ancient Hebrew times being TG/TS or Gay was such a
sin that it was even a sin to talk about it. So the ancient Hebrew language never actually had words for being
gay, homosexual, transgendered, transsexual or intersex. If they had of wrote any type of text to describe these
'vile' acts then they too would have been committing a sin under ancient Hebrew laws. :heehee: So what this means is
the words in the Bible, especially in the old testament that refer to effeminate men & homosexuals were added to
Biblical Scriptures later. The book called the Bible your parents believe in has evolved to become a complete fraud.

There is quite a bit of interesting reading on this topic if you do a search on Google, but here are a couple of links.

See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lesbian_and_gay_topics_and_Judaism
and: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgenderism_and_religion#Judaism
and also see: http://home.earthlink.net/~ecorebbe/id18.html (http://home.earthlink.net/%7Eecorebbe/id18.html)

According leviticus eating shellfish is an abomination! Not sure what part its in but eating meat and milk mixed together is a sin as well. Guess beef stroganoff is out!

[arbon]

does anyone else find transitioning to be a growth experience?




Absolutely. It has been all about growth. About becoming a whole person that is not living in shame anymore.

I had to face fears I never never imagined being able to face - like people knowing about me. I always thought if it was ever found out I would just have to kill myself (though there were people that did know I tried hard to forget they knew). Then I accidentally outed via email a couple years ago really shattered me inside, messed me up. I was holding onto that secret so tight it was insane. I look back now and think jeez, what the heck was the big deal about that, that I was prepared to kill myself for? Now pretty much everyone that knows me knows. I used to be so concerned about what others thought about me, and though I still hope people think well of me if they don't it is not a such a big deal.

Self acceptance. I have come to accept myself and who I am. How I feel about myself is not as dependent on what other people think about me now is what I am trying to say. A lot of power in that. A lot of growth. A lot of freedom. Even my mom who I was the most terrified to have find out now knows and I'm still here and doing OK, I did not have to kill myself. Getting through all those fears that held me in a kind of life that I hated. Yep, lots of growth and feel like I am really just starting.

[Melody Moore]

According Leviticus eating shellfish is an abomination!
LOL

April, that is too funny. :heehee:

So just because a guy called Leviticus who claimed to be a Prophet didn't like the taste of shellfish,
everyone else must not like it so it must be a total abomination & a sin to eat it to God right? How
does Leviticus know what God likes to eat? Leviticus was just another mere mortal who had his own
ideas through 'God consciousness' about right & wrong & good & evil & he gained a bit of a following
for it - nothing more - so what?

Personally I look at the Bible for the real good & the 3 greatest gifts that it promotes which is
Peace - Love - Truth. At the end of the day nothing else matters. Especially what was written
in the old testament. The Old Testament promoted hatred which the radical fundamentalist like
the Westboro Baptist Church still try & preach these out-dated beliefs today. The new testament
was delivered to us to teach others to turn away from these old ways which were bad & wrought
with evil & the wrong ideologies about how we should love & respect our fellow man. Anyone caught
up with similar out-dated ideology is wrong in the eyes of God according to the New Testament which
warns us very clearly about judging & promoting anything but Peace & Love towards others as far as
I am concerned. And this is why I believe that radical Christians are ignoring the true word of God to
promote fear & evil in fellow mankind which is no different to any other form of radical Islamic terrorism.

[Kelsy]

[QUOTE=Melody Moore;2544040]
So what this means is
the words in the Bible, especially in the old testament that refer to effeminate men & homosexuals were added to
Biblical Scriptures later.
[QUOTE]

Melody the word effeminate had a different meaning and connotation when it was used by the translaters for the King James
If you study the original languages coupled with numerous commentaries and the Strongs and Kily lexicons You will discover that
the verse actually says that effeminate was better decribing a womanizing male who was decietful and took advantage of
women A Gigilo!

[Frances]

Letting go of religion could be a tremendous growth experience as a person. I recommend reading Dawkins, Hitchens and Harris.

[Melody Moore]

If you study the original languages coupled with numerous commentaries and the Strongs and Kily lexicons You will discover that
the verse actually says that effeminate was better describing a womanizing male who was deceitful and took advantage of
women A Gigolo!

Kelsy, I understand the true definition of Effeminacy actually traces back to the Romans Greeks (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effeminacy#History). The Latin term is mollities (http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/mollities),
meaning soft, weak or enervate (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Enervation). So if this is the word's true meaning does this mean that gentlemen or any other man with
a softer demeanour are also sinners? Because whoever added the word effeminacy to the Bible has actually used the word
way out of its true context. Later the word evolved into 'Malakia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classical_definition_of_effeminacy)' in the Greek language & I have heard it used as an insult
because it is used to describe effeminate type cowardice, or any other race, culture or society that the Greeks didn't like.

Frances, I totally agree that letting go of obscure religious beliefs is often huge steps to take in personal growth.

I didn't start to go forward until I sorted out the religious aspects of my life. But after seeing the hypocrisy I did
in the church, I realise that my walk with God is a personal one. As soon as I freed myself from the bonds they
had tried to encase me in I started to go forward in my life. Since then I haven't looked back & everything has
come out of the wash in a much more healthier balance. God is very much part of my life, but he lets me make
the decisions I choose & because of this, I feel really at peace, happy & set free. But when other people judge
you & try to take control your life it has to be evil & a sin because suddenly its turmoil, grief & suffering while
other selfish & cruel people try to make you their prisoner, or make you feel that you are totally reliant upon them.

Loving someone is all about wanting the best for someone which includes happiness, peace & giving them the
understanding, respect & independence to experience real freedom to grow into the person they truly are meant
to be . This way they can reach their full potential. But the bigots of of society have been well documented right
though out history in the Bible doing the same thing today as they did in the OLD Testament - promoting hatred.
This type of crap really has to end Steph :hugs:

[Dawn cd]

I must respond to Frances' statement that "letting go of religion could be a tremendous growth experience." For some people that may be true, especially if their religion is narrow-minded and judgmental. For other persons, however, FINDING religion could be a tremendous growth experience, especially a religion that expands their horizons and fosters compassion. The writings of Dawkins, Hitchings, etc., focus on that first kind of religion--straw-man religions--and are almost as fundamentalist and blind as the ideologies they attack.

True religion has bigger goals than dietary regulation. Perhaps in ancient times eating shellfish from contaminated waters or eating pork made people sick, and so--because people at the time didn't understand bacterial theory, and because religious law was the only law they had--they simply proscribed those foods under religious law. It achieved the desired end. But ultimately religion is not about food, and we who come to our historical religions many centuries later have to shuck off those cultural accretions and seek out religion's beating heart. If we react just to the surface of religion, we run the risk of becoming superficial people.

[Faith_G]

Letting go of religion could be a tremendous growth experience as a person. I recommend reading Dawkins, Hitchens and Harris.And some people who let go of religion come back with a new understanding that faith is not about rules and judgment.

It's not a bad thing to throw out everything you think you know and start over.

[CharleneT]

one of my concerns was removing my arm hair, that everyone would notice and call my girly, but after using veet on it no one has commented on it, and I'm treated the same so that one less thing to fear.

I think you'll find that until you start wearing dresses/skirts or breast forms, or (strangely) spaghetti strap tanks, no one will notice much of anything. When I came out to my clients, in preparation for RLE, I was surprised when they all said "...I didn't suspect this at all about you, never saw a sign....". While in fact for more than a year before those conversations I had not worn a single piece of male clothing !! I was carrying a purse, I wore light make up... etc. BUT, I had not appeared in front of them with any of those red flag items.

[Melody Moore]

Steph,

I have to agree with Charlene on your earlier comment which she just quoted. In fact I am sure I have even discussed
this with you previously around the end of last year. When I started feminising my face, thinning down my eyebrows &
removing my body hair etc,, not one single person I know noticed anything unusual. The only one comment I did get from
my best friend for over 20 years was how much younger I was looking. Once you start hormones the hair on your arms
& the rest of your body generally thins right down & grows back lighter eventually. Now I have very fine hair growth on
my arms & the rest of my body, including my legs that looks no different to any other female.

[Kelsy]

And some people who let go of religion come back with a new understanding that faith is not about rules and judgment.

It's not a bad thing to throw out everything you think you know and start over.

I question no ones views on religion what I look at is how does that person treat others. True
religion is about Love, Caring, And wanting to help others along the way. Any time a religious zealot tries to control you or demonize you
You can bet they are missing the mark! Being transsexual is being who we were created to be!

K

[Amber99]

I thought people would notice my arms and legs being shaved who knows maybe they did but no one said anything. One guy I climbed with a lot did ask me about my shaved legs. I said I shaved them cause Im weird. He said he had considered it because it had been so damn hot that summer (last summer). No one said any thing about my arm hair and it took my wife over a week to even notice! That being said there is a HUGE difference in being a guy with very little body hair and being a M2F transsexual. I think you are correct in thinking that if you regret loosing the beard that you probably don't want to do anything else to feminize your body however HRT is a slow process and mostly reversible up to a point. SRS is NOT reversible!!!!!!!!!!
I have been really thinking about shaving my arms and legs but I have been too afraid that people will notice, but if it took your wife a week to even notice maybe I should try it...