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Sara Jessica
09-18-2011, 11:15 AM
There is a thread in the beauty section about the joy of someone's first pedicure which has fallen somewhat off of the original tracks. Here is the exchange that led to where we are now. Roll with the length, there could be some valuable discussion to be had at the end.


This is what I just posted in another thread.

"Just got back for the nail salon, mani - pedi, light transparent pink finish and lovely conversations with the other lady customers. One lady got the gel treatment on her nails and it took a long time. The pedicurist even complimented me on my feet for the second time. That was nice. "

I have been getting them for about 3 yeas now. I love them. When the cooler weather gets here in maybe November (yeah I live in the warm zone Karren), which is no flip flop weather, I will get a nice dark color on my toenails.


The time to get a nice dark color on your toes is during flip-flop weather. There is no purpose in wearing polish on your toes if you can't show them in flip-flops.


Jamie, I understand, but that will just not work for me since I am in flip flops from April till November, and, most importantly, I am not out to family and friends. I use a transparent pink, Love Letters by China Glaze all summer long on my finger and toe nails. So, cold weather season it is for the darker colors. I still enjoy seeing them when uncovered when I am barefoot in the house and when I go out in the city. Though sometimes they get covered up by nylons or tights. That's life and I am still happy!


Thanks for the reply, now I understand. Also, something to consider if you want to wear polished nails openly and you are not out to your family: Try googling "men wearing nail polish" and "men wearing toenail polish" and you will see than many actors, athletes, musicians, rock stars, race car drivers, and mixed martial arts fighters polish their toenails and wear openly. Even Tori Spelling's husband does this on his reality show. So it is possible to get pedicures and wear toenail polish without being "out" as "transgendered".


Jamie, I must say your enthusiasm for this subject has never waned, nor has your message. But for the 1000th time, while any of us could choose to wear polish openly and proudly, it simply isn't the best choice for dare I say most of us. Speaking for myself, I'm not a rock star, race car driver or eclectic artist type who can set trends in nail-polish-land as I please. I have to consider the elephant in my room who already has long hair, smooth legs and regularly waxed eyebrows, not to mention progress in facial hair clearing via electrolysis. Adding the pedi to the mix would in fact out my elephant as being 100% USDA Select TRANSGENDER. Being in a similar place as Allie, I'm not about to go there.

It's all about picking one's battles, and making the choices that are best for our respective life situations.


t has also been mentioned many times on these forums that most of the fear is manufactured in our own minds. We play-out artificial realities in our minds based upon fear that have no bearing on true reality. Most of the time, we find that the elephant in the room is a figment of our imagination or that it is really a tiny mouse and that there is no need to be afraid of it. Men wearing nail polish is no different then men wearing earrings 15 to 20 years ago. We need to have the courage to take steps to achieve fashion freedom just as women won their fashion freedom many years ago when the began wearing pants. Focus on the elephant in the room and after some contemplation and self realization, you will discover that it really isn't there or that it is a tiny mouse. If you are confident in what you do, other folks will accept. If you appear frightened or act like you are doing something wrong, other folks will react accordingly. You have the ability to create the elephant or to make it disappear. It is you choice.


You're killing me Jamie. I feel like you are not reading a word others are saying.

Let the record reflect that I am beyond confident without an ounce of fear. Anyone who knows me can attest to that. However, people in our community in situations such as mine must consider the needs of others before we go running around with red-painted toenails. The elephant in my room is an analogy I often use in describing those permanent and semi-permanent visible body modifications that individually can either ignored by the masses or easily attributed to something non-TG related. However, it's the compounding effect of these things which can lead to TG being a reasonable conclusion.

This whole discussion seems a bit like a thread hijack but even OP Laura Jade says "I still want to stay stealthy" so I dare to say she is in a similar boat as Allie and I. Whether talking about painted nails, shaving one's legs, growing out one's hair, etc., what is good for one person is not necessarily the best choice for another. Put this in the context of a thread by a person who for whatever reason cannot shave their legs, looking for alternative solutions for a look while wearing a skirt. They are barraged with comments such as "just shave, no one cares, etc.". It's the same thing, people have no empathy and it drives those who are seeking legitimate advice absolutely nuts.

It's one thing to espouse the virtues about the choices one makes but to be pushy with such views and imply that failure to adhere to your thinking is the same as being fearful is nothing more than irresponsible with a complete lack of empathy for other's situations.

Bringing it full circle, getting a pedi is a really fun experience as Laura says. And it sucks to have to cover it up with socks and it sucks even more to have to remove it within a day or two during the summer season but regardless, it's a simple pleasure that any of us can experience whether we have to keep it covered or not.


We should "agree" to "disagree" because I and other girls like Sissy Stephanie know that the elephant really doesn't exist, but we create it based upon preconceived notions that we have had for many years even since early childhood. I understand that the elephant to you have created in your mind is very large and very real and I respect that you believe that it is very real. The point that I'm attempting to make is that everyone's perception of reality regarding crossdressing is quite different and is deeply rooted in their own beliefs and thought processes that were formed over the course of their life. Some of us evolve slower than others regarding rejecting these beliefs that are not based in fact. A lot of girls begin early and reject these unreal daemons in their 20's, while most of us like me didn't begin the rejection process until they reached the mid forties. I respect that you need to continue this process at a speed that is comfortable and that feels safe.

Instead of carrying on within the original thread, I thought it'd be best to do so here where a wider audience can chime in.

Each of us is in a different situation. Life experiences (family, friends, career, etc) along with our respective experience in the TG world, comfort level in our presentation and/or interaction with others (whether TG or the Muggles), not to mention geography (as in it's much easier to be bold in going out in SoCal than it is in small town middle America) all affect the decisions we make when it comes to being "out". As I've said before, I'm out but I'm not "out". I typically take my outings outside of a circle of comfort, a circle drawn many miles around all that which I hold dear. Outside of this circle, the chances of my encountering someone I know diminishes significantly but of course never reaches zero. Outside of this circle I am liberated to simply "be".

Inside this circle sits my elephant. Her presence is based on the fact I am "out" to only one person, my wife. At first, my elephant only existed in my imagination. But as time goes on, she becomes less transparent to the outside world by what I call a compounding effect of changes I have made to my appearance on a day to day basis. This is also referred to as "leaking femme", a term coined by either Veronica M. or Kathi L. IIRC.

Anyways, taken individually, an outside observer is not likely to come to a TG conclusion when faced with one of these changes. Shaved legs? No sweat, he rides a road bicycle. Waxed eyebrows? That one's a bit more difficult but hey, it's kind of a "metro" thing to do, ya know. What to make of that disappearing facial hair? Well my process has been pretty gradual so that one might be hard to notice (oh but what about when you tweeze the rest away before an outing, you have ZERO shadow for a week???). Long hair? Ahhhh, piling this one on top of all the others makes things interesting. Most of my circle of friends thinks the hair thing is really cool. At work I've heard that I am having a mid-life crisis (duh!).

But what is being thought & said outside of my earshot? Perhaps nothing which means my elephant is still transparent. But my theory relies upon the following assumptions.


People are perceptive, they notice things even if we think they do not.
People are also generally polite in not bringing up some things they notice.
Just because people don't talk about it to your face doesn't mean they didn't notice, nor does it mean there is no discussion behind your back.
2+2=4, or the part of this theory which has to do with the componding effect of these changes (also known as "if it walks like a duck...")


Bringing this full circle, let's add the bright red pedi to the list of changes I've already made. My point has been that to do so, I might as well color my elephant grey for all to see, put her in a pink tutu and watch her sing show tunes for all to hear.

I am not some goatee-wearin' NASCAR lovin' manly-man who wishes to show support for my driver by paintin' my toes blue (or whatever color). No, I have made the changes I have described and still wish to keep this whole TG thing on the down-low. This is out of respect for my family and the life we have built together. This is out of respect for my children who really don't need to have to explain things such as this to their peers. This is out of respect to my choice to remain on a middle path, balancing my life as best I can in a daily effort to avoid transition (a struggle that can often be measured by the minute or by the hour).

This discussion is also about respect for the choices people make and their ability to convey their feelings without ridicule or lecture in these pages telling us our "fears" are unfounded. It's one thing to offer encouragement, or to even point out where some fears might be truly unfounded to an objective observer. But when a case is made demonstrating why things are the way they are and still to be told that I'm on some sort of lower "evolutionary" level on the TG ladder, please.

To Jamie, as I said before, your message has always been consistent when it comes to the bright red toenails thing and your love of showing them off. But your message has also been quite singular in that I cannot recall ever reading anything from you about anything else in our world. So you love the bright red toenails, hey that's great. But I don't perceive a depth to your TG experience that gives you any credibility in passing judgement on others for the choices they make.

PretzelGirl
09-18-2011, 11:33 AM
This is one of those tough subjects and our view of it usually rests solely on our experiences. One of the first things we should realize when we come into a forum like this is that we are all from different places, with different life experiences, and different people around us. So we should not place our views upon others as the only way things are. Yes there are some things that are fairly prevalent thoughts (i.e.: many believe you can't quit), but to blanket statement things that you believe usually ends up in a false assumption.

Our experiences are many and that is what makes this place so good. We get to take our own and compare them to the experiences of others. We may find out that our's are common or uncommon, but just because we have those experiences, doesn't mean everyone else does.

Specifically, I believe there is an elephant in the room for many. I am one that believes that although people may not say anything about our appearance changes, many are certainly noticing. So for some, they will never care. For others, it depends on how far you push it. So each of us have to find our comfort level with how far we expose ourselves.

Kaitlyn Michele
09-18-2011, 11:53 AM
There are lots of elephants in lots of rooms around here... this one is easy

you are debating a "strawman"... its not a real point to be discussing.. you are saying there is stuff in your life that causes you to avoid situations that may raise awareness of your nature... you have EASILY UNDERSTANDABLE and VALID reasons for this...
this is your decision...there is nothing to discuss...

you have to develop a thicker skin, and stop engaging in the discussion because there is nothing to discuss... its like monty pythons argument clinic if you keep engaging on this topic..

the idea that there is no risk associated with outing yourself does not hold water...

btw... i transitioned and left my job.. i lost weight, let my nails grow just a teensy bit, plucked 2 eyebrow hairs every couple days... after leaving my job i talked to people from work...EVERYONE one of them said it was noticed and discussed...
so the debate is about whether or not you are interested in having that attention, not about whether there is an elephant in the room

what people forget is that each of us gets to try to improve our quality of life...i cant tell you and you cant tell me how to do that...we can share ideas and experiences, but thats it..

my advice..be yourself, its all good...leave it be...and if people want to keep pushing others to get out of the closet then let them talk to your well manicured, but unpolished hand..

*Vanessa*
09-18-2011, 12:06 PM
WOW - what a great post Sara, there are so few.

Your point, or better your articulation of explanation for who you are as a person, is impeccable. I which I could express myself in words as you do, however, my tools are photography and Visual Arts.

I am part of that greater audience you want to share this with.

From what I read here I extrapolate two different conversations. At a base level both are accurate as stated to there individual arguments as I will only talk to your statements.

I totally agree with what you are saying! If you are like me and live in a bible-belted Oil&Gas redneck city you can bet that elephant is NOT only in your head. It is a way of life. One need only to breeze through the posts and look for girls brave enough to state this city. Very very few and would guess less then 1% of the total active members who live in this province let alone this city.

To relate anyone situation as Jame001 has to an elephant is using mixed metaphors and I think for sport IMHO.
I do agree with: "The point that I'm attempting to make is that everyone's perception of reality regarding crossdressing is quite different and is deeply rooted in their own beliefs and thought processes that were formed over the course of their life."

thanks for sharing - can hardly wait to read other points of view Sara.
v.

Sara Jessica
09-18-2011, 12:22 PM
There are lots of elephants in lots of rooms around here... this one is easy

you are debating a "strawman"... its not a real point to be discussing.. you are saying there is stuff in your life that causes you to avoid situations that may raise awareness of your nature... you have EASILY UNDERSTANDABLE and VALID reasons for this...
this is your decision...there is nothing to discuss...

True, but as we often see in these pages, there is a contingent of participants who think they know what is best for others.


you have to develop a thicker skin, and stop engaging in the discussion because there is nothing to discuss... its like monty pythons argument clinic if you keep engaging on this topic..

I am pretty thick-skinned but this one struck a nerve, mostly based on...


Some of us evolve slower than others regarding rejecting these beliefs that are not based in fact. A lot of girls begin early and reject these unreal daemons in their 20's, while most of us like me didn't begin the rejection process until they reached the mid forties.

There is no higher enlightenment to be had. I don't claim to have any and I reject anyone's notion that they have this over me. We are all different and unwavering advice given without empathy for one's personal situation, especially when a valid case is presented, is something I felt a need to call out.


the idea that there is no risk associated with outing yourself does not hold water...

So true.


btw... i transitioned and left my job.. i lost weight, let my nails grow just a teensy bit, plucked 2 eyebrow hairs every couple days... after leaving my job i talked to people from work...EVERYONE one of them said it was noticed and discussed...
so the debate is about whether or not you are interested in having that attention, not about whether there is an elephant in the room

Or perhaps your example proves the existence of the elephant.


my advice..be yourself, its all good...leave it be...and if people want to keep pushing others to get out of the closet then let them talk to your well manicured, but unpolished hand..

Love that advice Kaitlyn!!!

Stephenie S
09-18-2011, 12:24 PM
Please try to remember that we can NEVER actually know what others think about us. Never.

All we have to go on is how they relate to us directly. Worrying about what you can never know is a futile exercise in frustration. Let it be, huh?

S

Sara Jessica
09-18-2011, 12:33 PM
Please try to remember that we can NEVER actually know what others think about us. Never.

All we have to go on is how they relate to us directly. Worrying about what you can never know is a futile exercise in frustration. Let it be, huh?

S

I'm not saying that I'm wasting any energy in worrying about what others think. Rather, I simply acknowledge that others may come to a reasonable TG-related conclusion based on presentation and as such, I am taking measured steps to try to keep such conclusions at bay.

BTW, your comment speaks to why no one in our community truly knows whether they "pass".

Sandra
09-18-2011, 12:41 PM
There is a thread in the beauty section about the joy of someone's first pedicure which has fallen somewhat off of the original tracks. Here is the exchange that led to where we are now. Roll with the length, there could be some valuable discussion to be had at the end.

The comments have now been removed from the beauty forum, for taking the thread off topic and certain members didn't even bother to reply to the OP.

steftoday
09-18-2011, 01:39 PM
In my opinion, Sara managed to convey perfectly what balance we're trying to achieve without doing harm to what we've accomplished with friends and family.
I am out to my wife, and have no wish to bring kids, family, and anyone else into it. I "leak a bit", as well, as I have ears pierced, shave just about everything, tweeze brows, etc. I think everyone has to be aware of their own situation, and understand the ramifications of what being out means to their jobs and their lives. Losing one's means of support (because even though employers say they have to respect rights, it doesn't always work that way in the real world) for their family is not the best way to make a point.

Badtranny
09-18-2011, 01:53 PM
I love these threads, in fact this one has inspired a new blog post for later today.

I happen to agree with Sara Jessica AND Kaitlyn Michele (sheesh how 'bout just Sara and Kait?)

There is definitely an elephant in the room when your fem expression exceeds what could be considered just metro grooming. On the other hand, convincing someone on this board of how dangerous your particular elephant is, seems to be a waste of valuable electrons.

If you're a TS than coming out is a foregone conclusion. There is no option, as it is impossible to transition without anyone noticing. If you are a CD than coming out to anyone is based entirely on your lifestyle and comfort level. I would love to see all shades of the TG and sexuality spectrum proudly wave their little freak flags but I know firsthand how terrifying the prospect of being "out" can be.

I've learned many things on my journey so far and one of them is people DO notice changes eventually. They may not say anything to you, but they notice and they're talking about it. There's a fairly large group of people at work that know my whole story. My facebook page, my blog, the whole dealio and I've never heard anyone say anything that could remotely be considered negative. I'm not officially transitioning in the HR sense yet and because I don't like cross dressing, I still wear my regular slacks and button down shirts to work. I thought I was totally under the radar in regard to the changes brought about by the HRT but just the other day, one of my closer friends said, "I need to tell you something, last week at lunch the guys were asking if your boobs were growing"

Now, I just assumed that if anybody noticed anything that they would ask ME about it, but clearly I was wrong. I just smiled and told her that it was bound to happen sooner or later and I guess my big secret isn't such a secret anymore.

Another one of my friends told me last month that I've been so obviously blooming since I came out in January that people are eventually going to know everything whether I like it or not. Apparently an elephant is difficult to hide.

They notice. They're talking. They don't care.

ReineD
09-18-2011, 02:50 PM
This is one of those tough subjects and our view of it usually rests solely on our experiences. One of the first things we should realize when we come into a forum like this is that we are all from different places, with different life experiences, and different people around us. So we should not place our views upon others as the only way things are. Yes there are some things that are fairly prevalent thoughts (i.e.: many believe you can't quit), but to blanket statement things that you believe usually ends up in a false assumption.

So true!! :thumbsup:



the idea that there is no risk associated with outing yourself does not hold water...

btw... i transitioned and left my job.. i lost weight, let my nails grow just a teensy bit, plucked 2 eyebrow hairs every couple days... after leaving my job i talked to people from work...EVERYONE one of them said it was noticed and discussed...

I also agree that even subtle things are noticed, even if no one says anything about them to your face.

Whether or not someone decides to wear nail polish or girlie sandals openly will depend on their life circumstances. They may be loners or only have a small circle of friends and family, or maybe they move in fringe circles such as goth, rockers, the LGBT community, or the arts, or among a group of younger liberal people (I can't list them all), and they really don't care what others think. All the power to them!

But if someone's job depends on being highly social, or they have a highly visible job and they wish to attract clients, or if they're running for office even if at the local level, or if belonging to the Country Club is important to them, or if they want their kids' friends' parents to allow sleepovers, then wearing nail polish on their toes or doing anything that gives rise to questions about sexuality or gender will close some doors, even if no one says anything to the CDer's face. Not all the doors will be closed, but some doors will be. It's unfortunate we live in a world like this, but it is the reality.

So it's up to the TG to decide what is most important. Obviously if presenting girlie takes precedence then it's OK if some doors close. The prevailing attitude will be these other people don't matter. But if a high social interaction is more important than the femme expression, then obviously the femme expression will stay in the closet.

Everyone's at a different place with this, everyone has the right to their choices, and to argue about whether or not there is a universal truth is a waste of time.

Asche
09-18-2011, 04:52 PM
I would definitely agree that being "out" with any "non-standard" presentation has its costs.

I live in a fairly accepting part of the USA (~30 miles north of where the Stonewall riots happened), but even so, before I started walking around in public in skirts, I had to accept that there are a number of people who would react negatively to it. I don't get a lot of disapproval expressed to my face, but I know that a lot of people in my village and the villages around me would not want a skirt-wearing man in their social circles. I used to belong to a religious denomination that is considered liberal, but still got a lot of grief just for wearing Utilikilts. I don't know if I would have ever had a chance of belonging to a country club or getting political office (I doubt it), but if I did, I'm sure I don't any more. There are people who don't care how I dress, but probably more who do.

And there are places I don't push things. I dressed in the male uniform for all school functions, while my kids were still in the local schools. Work is strictly "business casual," though I sometimes change into a skirt once I'm on the train home.

I don't know what it would be like if I were in a different part of the USA. One of our offices is in Missouri, and the folks there come across as much more "straight arrow" than us New Yorkers. I sometimes wonder whether I could get away with wearing skirts in my free time if I got transferred to, say, St. Louis.

sissystephanie
09-18-2011, 05:08 PM
I happen to agree with Sara Jessica AND Kaitlyn Michele (sheesh how 'bout just Sara and Kait?)

There is definitely an elephant in the room when your fem expression exceeds what could be considered just metro grooming. On the other hand, convincing someone on this board of how dangerous your particular elephant is, seems to be a waste of valuable electrons.

If you're a TS than coming out is a foregone conclusion. There is no option, as it is impossible to transition without anyone noticing. If you are a CD than coming out to anyone is based entirely on your lifestyle and comfort level. I would love to see all shades of the TG and sexuality spectrum proudly wave their little freak flags but I know firsthand how terrifying the prospect of being "out" can be.

The "elephant" in the room is only a problem if you think it is. Other people don't see an elephant, they maybe see a crossdresser or else they just see a man!! Being "out" is not terrifying at all, if you are totally convinced that you are a crossdresser!! The major problem that most of those who think that way have is that they simply have NOT ACCEPTED the fact that they are crossdressers!! They are still trying to understand it!! I know their feeling very well, having gone thru them myself many years ago. But they have to realize that the only problem is within them, not with other people!! I walk around all the time, dressed completely as a female but looking like the man that I am. People hardly pay any attention to me, and if they do it is usually to compliment me on what I am wearing. I am pushing 80, but dress as though I were in my 40's or 50's!! Fortunately I have a body that allows me to do that. The thing is, I have developed an attitude that more or less says that I don't care!! That is the absolute truth, I don't care! The way I dress and live my life is my business, as long as I am not breaking any laws!! I do not dress and live to please other people, with possible exception of my 2 grown children. They know I crossdress and don't really care but would rather not see me dressed!! So they don't!

Kaz
09-18-2011, 06:00 PM
I do not wish to be flippant, because so many really good thoughts have been aired here... along with the usual dogmas... You know... elephants are supposed to be wise... did anyone think to ask it why it was there? Or having been there what it had learned? Or, one step further, could it offer any insights? Just a thought...

AllieSF
09-18-2011, 06:23 PM
I guess that I should chime in here seeing that my posts are quoted above. I think that I understand what Jaime was trying to convey. That what holds people back from accomplishing things really depends on that person overcoming their own fears and acting on their desires. That all sounds reasonable to me. However, when what we do can affect us in so many different ways, like painting your toe nails a bright red and then wearing flip flops everywhere where everyone that you know can see them, then a whole set of filtering and decisions factors come into play. I agree that no other person is really stopping us but ourselves. So, if one does not care what happens to themselves as a result of taking this desired action, like loss of job, loss of promotion, embarrassment to family if they have trouble dealing with it, marital problems, loss of respect from others, and so on, then yes they can go ahead and do what they want and ignore the white elephant, pink one or a Dumbo cousin. What gets me occasionally on this forum is that once someone states their opinion and they are then given adequate reasons as to why that opinion just doesn't work for the OP or some other poster, the one giving their opinion sees an unnecessary need to repeat, sometimes more than once, that opinion and then make it seem that their way is the only way, when it obviously isn't. It has been stated here so many times by many members including myself, no one, no one at all can tell someone else how to decide something unless they are in their shoes. We just do not know the unique personal circumstances that are used by someone making a decision. Recommending a course of action to another is fine. Continually insisting that their way is the only way is not fine.

Sissystephanie I really do not understand some of your comments above. You are insinuating that most people, and maybe including me, are not out to family and friends because they have not accepted that they are crossdressers. That makes no sense to me. I know I am a crossdresser, but I have no "need" to tell any of them about what I do. I see no gain for the potential negative impacts that it may create for them and for me. Why is it even considered a problem to not want to come out to them? It only would be a problem if I "needed" to come out. I think that a majority of crossdressers have made conscientious decisions based on their own risk - reward analysis. Yes, some may over estimate the potential risks, but that is their decision process and we should respect that. I clearly know your situation because you always preface a lot of your comments about who you are and what you do. I truly respect what you do, but your style is not my style. You don't care and in a way neither do I when I am out and about away from my safe zone, which so clearly described by Sara Jessica above. I could never put on a dress or skirt and go out as a guy. That is just not me. So, your mind set serves you well, but in no way serves me based on the way I want and do live my own life. I care a lot for the neighbors, family and friends that I have in male mode. They do not need to know Allie at this time. Later, maybe I will see a need for it.

Kathi Lake
09-19-2011, 11:53 AM
Oh, the elephant exists. In fact, the elephant did not just walk into the room, we created it. We created it with our fears, our concern for others, and the inbuilt societal prejudices that have shaped our very lives.

Our fears: Sure, we have fear for ourselves. We know that in some places, it is a big, bad world out there. We know that violence does happen to those that seem 'different' from the rest. We know that predators are always circling the herd, looking for an easy mark. We fear loss of status from those we know, love, and work with. Let's face it; you won't find "dress up as a woman" on many guys' to-do lists. It is considered as anything from an odd affectation to something perverse and sick by many. Some maintain that education - by force, if necessary - is the only way that we will ever be viewed as something approaching 'normal.' They say that we need our own little Stonewall. Well, call me selfish, but I'm not willing to risk that. I'm not the type of person that had a Che poster on my wall. I don't dress for you and your freedoms. I dress for mine. I'm not willing to be the poster girl for everyone's freedom. I have another view. I believe that whenever I go out, I do it as respectfully as possible. I educate a few people each time that we're not exactly what they were thinking we were. Revolutionary? No. Not necessarily. However, through small events like this, I hope the more and more people will see our normality.

Our concern for others: One of the main reasons I have an elephant is because I have others in my life - people so precious to me that I will gladly risk my happiness for theirs. Sure, in a perfect world, they would accept me as I am and we would dance around the Maypole. We are not in that world. They have an opinion of what I do. I have an opinion of what I do. Thy don't exactly match. Call me geeky, but I believe that the Star Trek quote, "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one" pretty much sums it up. Does that mean that since they don't agree with me that I will change my ways and stop this foolishness? Heck no! It means that my elephant now has a permanent parking spot next right to mine. It means that I will honor my wife's request to not let her know about it. It means that my church has no idea that their chairman of deacons occasionally dresses cuter than the women's ministry leader. :) It means that I will gladly sacrifice my happiness and my goals and my time for my family and my friends.

Now, does all of that mean that Kathi is gone? That she is in a box and never again will see the light of day? No! It means that I simply will keep 'feeding the elephant' as it were. I will dress in secret (mostly. My daughter and I had a bit of girly time this Saturday. I'm trying to teach her to walk in heels without looking like she's never walked in heels. :)). I will continue my laser hair removal. I will continue epilating my chest, my arms, and any other hair that looks at me the wrong way. I will continue grooming my brows into the incredibly obvious feminine shape and size that they are now. I will continue the skincare regimen that made an old girlfriend at my 30th reunion proclaim, (My gosh, you have the skin of a 25 year-old girl! :)). I will continue being me. If people want to look at all of these changes in my appearance and do the math, they'll certainly find that 2 + 2 does indeed equal 4. They probably won't say anything. That's OK. My elephant will accept being fed by them as well as by me.

:)

Kathi

Cindy.
09-19-2011, 01:25 PM
Nice discussion. I'd like to put my noob $.02 in. I've been "out" to my wife since the day I started having thoughts about it. It comes and goes. But, I'm tired of making excuses for the piles of dung that my elephant leaves behind. Like changing in a locker room and forgetting that your Wife painted your toes 3 days ago with bright red paint and french tips. Or, when you text the wrong person on accident and have to explain to your teenage sister why you said something like that. But, I will throw sheets over the elephant and cough whenever he farts for years to come. It is my life and I'm allowed to hide it. My wife loves me and Is more accepting every day. That is what matters.
Cindy.

Gillian Gigs
09-19-2011, 02:14 PM
Yes, I agree, the elephant does exist, and you can tell by the mess it leaves behind. The biggest reason that I came out to my wife was that I was attempting to reduce the elephants footprint. In my case it worked out very well, but not so with others who do not get acceptance. I agree with Kathi Lake in that it is our fears as she stated, that keep the elephant in the closet. I also think that it is a concern for others that will continue to keep it in the closet for a long time to come. Any married individual has more to consider than themselves when it comes to elephants. How much of a mix of both masculine, and feminine that is within us will determine how we will live our lives, taking self acceptance into this ratio also.