What am I and How can I make my wife happy?

[Kerigirl2009]

I am in a place right now that I was hoping to avoid forever. My wife of seventeen years has called to enquire about divorce. She has not filed yet but, what do I do with this knowledge?
Part of the problem is that she says I do not care about her thoughts and feelings, this just is not true, I do care about what she thinks but I also just cannot help myself to a point.
I do not dress in front of her, I DO underdress which I guess she can tolerate (maybe)
I guess its the things that I consider SUTTLE such as shaved arms and legs. Plucking eyebrows, very light make up(on occassion)
As far as the make up I do try to take it off when I end up back home and I am going to be around family.
I really pissed her off when I showed up at church with what I figured was well groomed fingernails. NO color but I did put false nails on over my nails and I liked them because the tips where clean and unbroken. not to girly in my opinion, but way over the top for my wife, I did remove them the next morning after I got home from work.

I don't know how to stop being who I think I should be without hurting her anymore.
HERE IS THE BIG PROBLEM
We are not intimate anymore, this is pretty much my fault I will say 85 percent
I have issues which I take pills for (currently out and need to go back to refill)
She thinks it is in my head and I agree with her that part of it is totally in my head as I have a fear of not being able to satisfy her which is upsetting to myself.
I want my wife to be completely happy, but I don't think I am making her happy anymore.
How Can I change so I can be happy but also bring new life into our marriage?
Do I tell the doctor that I am a Crossdresser?
Do I force myself to give up one part of my life that makes me happy but bothers my wife.

This is a selfish lifestyle because we are forced to hide important parts of our lives from those people that we truly love but do not want to burden them with anything to do with crossdressing. This leads to taking away from them as well as ourselves.

I do not know what to do to bring LOVE back into my wifes vocabulary, As she said we are mearly roommates at this point because we have no intimacy.
Big issue is she says I do not change in front of her, I do try to not stand in front of her while wearing panties because I know she does not want to see it.

I need help, the only thing I can think of is give up the side of my life that brings me happiness to get back to the LOVE that I want to share with my wife.

[jennCD]

I'd say both of you communicating with a therapist is a good way to begin the process of reconciliation, but only as long as both of you have the desire to work it out. If either one of you has already given up hope or let go other the relationship, the damage may already be severe enough that no amount of effort by the committed partner will be able to bring the other back to common ground.

It all boils down to the level of communication available....

:)
jenn

[Miss Maxine]

I need help, the only thing I can think of is give up the side of my life that brings me happiness to get back to the LOVE that I want to share with my wife.

I am going through a divorce, currently. Your situation sounds very similar to how mine was. I don't really want to tell you what to do, or what to think, but I do think that the above quote does deserve some serious contemplation (I'm not suggesting it's right or wrong, btw). I'll give you this advice, for now: Please take care, and follow your heart's desire. Like Jenn mentioned, communication is key. In my experience, complete honesty and acceptance is crucial, in a relationship. I hope this helps.

[Ellyn]

Right off, my opinion is that you need therapy, and as a couple you probably need therapy, otherwise the evil hand of divorce is going to slap you on the head. It is no wonder that your wife cooled off towards you. You obviously stepped over her line that is marked "normal" by engaging in rather intense feminization without her participation, or input, in it. If you had discussed your needs, she may have informed you of her needs, and you could have considered her needs before you engaged in the feminization you have done solo. I wish you luck in fixing this hole in the dike before you get washed away in a flood of rejection. If you really love her, go to her and tell her you love her. Then ask her if you can talk to her about what is happening. Tell her you want to save your marriage, and ask her to help save your marriage, if that is what you want. Ask her to set the boundaries of your activity. Talk. Then you can establish a course of action that she approves of. Believe me, divorce is seldom worth persuing, and you were pushing that button pretty hard.

[Miss Maxine]

Right off, my opinion is that you need therapy, and as a couple you probably need therapy, otherwise the evil hand of divorce is going to slap you on the head

Divorce isn't evil. I'm sorry, but I think that is an unfair statement. The social perception of marriage and divorce is very one-sided.

[Jessica86]

This is a part of you. A part you can not ignore. It is the same with your wife. She must realize this is a part of you. However, when she married, she married a man. Our life styles are selfish at times. We think about what our limits are instead of thinking about theirs. I would say to be a man to your wife. She has been with you all of this time. It's worth tossing this aside for a while and showing her the male side. Patch things up. Then, speak of boundaries and remember it is a sacrifice on both of your parts. I do agree that therapy would do well, but only after improvement from her following your action. This will show she is willing to work with you. If she is willing to work, then therapy won't be a waste of time, and worth it. Show her you want to try to work this out by putting this in the back seat for a while, but explaining how important it is to you later. If things do not get better, things just are not working out. No doctor, therapist or psychologist will be able to fix it.

[Miss Maxine]

If you don't mind me asking: Do you want her to like and be involved in your crossdressing?

[Bernadina]

OK, some questions.

Why do you think your dressing is the reason she wants a divorce?

Did she know about your dressing before your marriage?

Did you keep your dressing a secret from her?

[Kaitlyn26]

It's been my experience that you can't make some people happy.

[danielle.cd]

i get were your coming from and maybe you arnt paying atention to her needs , now i know u try to put her first like not letting her see u dressed and all but that could be part of the problem . example 1 you exclude her so she doesnt know what your doing. 2. you say u cant be initimate with her cause your afraid of not pleasing her , well from what i read women like touch rather than just straight up sex stop thinking about yourself and think about her feelings , she might just need u to want to please her in any form rather than give up before u start anything. now to me my wife said that it embaressed her to be seen with me in anything fem outside the home . and right fully so i want her to look her best if shes out with me, not in her saggy baggy pants or sum bum of a shirt so why should she expect any different , 3. talk to her ask her what upsets her about your dressing habits instead of guessing , who know maybe she want to see you in your panties and just doesnt want to admit it . my wife likes mine even though she makes coments here and there about them and can act like she doesnt but will rub me intimately while im wereing them . nude massages go along way in the intimacy part. further more unless u want a therapyst invovled you need to communicate and remember who u are this IS part of u and not the whole u, and marriage is a compremise not just for u to decide whats best for the other person and vise versa talk talk talk and more talk before it goes where u dont want it to go

[Patty B.]

I get where you are coming from and although the D word hasn't been brought up yet and we are still together we are also roomates and not intimate. I've more than once suggested that I give up the crossdressing to reestablish our marriage, but my wife is adamant about my not being true to myself and also very adamant about this not working. I dont if she will be able to live our lives together as we currently do or not and don't really know where this is going. It is very difficult living in a limbo and not having a direction that we are moving in together. The last thing I want to do, like Kerri is to hurt my wife or cause her any distress. Talking with therapists probably is the way to go for yourself and your wife and also to keep talking and listening to each other, best wishes Patty B.

[suzy1]

I think I am known here as a member that has no time for therapists.
I think it’s good for all of to face up to our problems, be strong, and work out our problems ourselves. [You will be stronger and wiser afterwards]
What you describe is a failing marriage. Any man that crossdresses and then wonders why they have a problem in there relationship is not facing up to reality.
I know there are some nice stories of crossdressers here that have wonderful marriages and that’s always lovely to hear. But they are in a minority. [I await the inevitable flak from saying that]

If you go through life trying to be someone you are not just to please your wife you will never be truly happy. I have personal experience of this.

In all probability you can not achieve true happiness and save your marriage.
I hope I am wrong and will be the first to share your joy if I am.


SUZY

[Kaitlyn26]

I think I am known here as a member that has no time for therapists.
I think it’s good for all of to face up to our problems, be strong, and work out our problems ourselves. [You will be stronger and wiser afterwards]
What you describe is a failing marriage. Any man that crossdresses and then wonders why they have a problem in there relationship is not facing up to reality.
I know there are some nice stories of crossdressers here that have wonderful marriages and that’s always lovely to hear. But they are in a minority. [I await the inevitable flak from saying that]

If you go through life trying to be someone you are not just to please your wife you will never be truly happy. I have personal experience of this.

In all probability you can not achieve true happiness and save your marriage.
I hope I am wrong and will be the first to share your joy if I am.


SUZY

You said it exactly right.

[Kate Simmons]

Only you can determine if your love for your wife out weighs your love of CDing or not. I will say it's difficult to try and live two different lives at the same time to say the least.:)

[Kaitlyn Michele]

Keri,
My heart goes out to you and yours...

At around 18 years of marriage, after many sexless years, my wife told me she didn't love me anymore...
Like you, I blamed pills (im guessing anxiety meds?) and crossdressing...
I bought "keep your marriage together" books...i went to therapy (to be attacked..which i deserved)...

you can't NOT be a crossdresser... i am sorry to share this opinion, but you can't just quit...if you promise to quit, you will end up breaking that promise.
your wife knows this in her heart, in the way that women know...

sorry for you guys, but if she is "out of love", its a difficult mountain to climb...all you can do is support her and validate her feelings, and perhaps she is overstating her negative feelings right now...falling back in love is not likely to happen...
it sounds so easy to get back the spark in the bedroom, but the damage is permanent, you are who you are, and if she has in her mind your dressing, that is part of the problem...even if you get hairy, man up and become her puppet, she will always know...
and the negative feelings you will have over this will cause other issues..

this is tough love..you have to deal with your own reality about who you are , and nothing can change that..

[GingerLeigh]

I see some parallels here between you and I, however I never completely outed myself to my wife. She does know enough to not be surprised when I do tell her. Divorce is not a word that comes into our conversations yet, and I hope it never does.
What would I do if I were in your shoes? I wouldn't push her limits by wearing makeup and getting my nails done. Shaving your body...well... no biggie. Lots of regular guys do anymore. I wouldn't let her know I underdress. I wouldn't do anything feminine in front of her.
I know it isn't easy. There are things I would like to do to be myself but our relationship likely won't survive if I did. Either that or it would morph into something she won't tolerate.
Intimacy is a huge issue. The lack thereof makes it hard for your wife to get that reassurance you're still attracted to her. What medication are you on that inhibits this? You need to get that bed-a-squeaking, often!

ginger

[*Vanessa*]

Well keri you are in a bit of a pickle aren't you.

Do you have an income? I'm thinking from what you have said you do and the job will be a little safety net for you.

Wife issues: there is nothing that anyone can say that will magically change anyone mind. It is incredible mean spirited of your wife to wave that legal paper in front of your face in an ultimatum (angry or otherwise). That is absolutely wrong, and a real indication that you should be setting down 'together' with a marriage counselor to talk things out. At least to see if there is any marriage left. Marriage generally speaking don't work with less then half making it, so get ride of the cross-dressing guilt stuff.

If your wife can't deal with Keri then she can't. To give up part of yourself for her is even more wrong. In any event, at the end-of-the-day, you both need to be happy with your lives. If it is the end of the marriage then it is the end of your marriage. However, that also means a new beginning has started. You will get to run around the house in your panties, paint your toes and just be you anytime you want.

Am I a counselor - nope! So you have to take what I am saying and think on it. You could benefit greatly by talking to a professional. I think there maybe more to Keri then you know. I do know that most marriage problems have very little to do with someone putting on a dress or tie to that matter.

I wish you the best Keri, it maybe a little rough over the next little while, but I am sure you will come out just fine in the end.
Love
v.

[jillleanne]

A million and one questions can be asked and answered without resolve. IF the marriage is to flower with happiness in the future, both parties have to really want it that way. THAT means accepting who each other is, with no secrets, open commmunication, and sharing each others life with each other. It's important for each person to know, we are individual and are not pieces of pottery clay that one can mold to one's satisfaction. IF open acceptance is not possible, then the relationship is not possible, period, unless one party or both decide to live without happiness, and what's the sense in that.

[kendra_gurl]

I do not dress in front of her, I DO underdress which I guess she can tolerate (maybe)
I guess its the things that I consider SUTTLE such as shaved arms and legs. Plucking eyebrows, very light make up(on occassion)
As far as the make up I do try to take it off when I end up back home and I am going to be around family.
I really pissed her off when I showed up at church with what I figured was well groomed fingernails. NO color but I did put false nails on over my nails and I liked them because the tips where clean and unbroken. not to girly in my opinion, but way over the top for my wife, I did remove them the next morning after I got home from work.

.

Keri all of this leads me to think you may feel as if you are transgendered rather than a crossdresser. If that is how you feel I can't give you much advice on how to proceed. I am a Crossdresser and my wife has come to accept and enjoy my feminine side because I involve her in it when we have the oppertunity to do so in total private places. On special weekend trips or very late at night I can be as feminine as I want. I always wear false nails and eyelashes when I dress but NEVER EVER at any other time.

The statements you made I quoted show how your wife could have to opinion that you have no reguard for how embarressed she is to be around you in public. People do notice those Subtle things even though nothing may be said to you personally. they do mention it to others behind your back. Especially other females love to gossip about it amongst themselves.

For some it is impossible to seperate the male and female side of themselves so whats left is the constant blending of gender. This will always be a problem for a wife who does not understand.

If there is a way for you both to agree on specific times where you can be as totally feminine as you need to be while still remaining as masculine as she needs you to be all the rest of the time it can and will work, but YOU have to be able to accept that.

[kimdl93]

Keri, I would absolutely and emphatically encourage you and your wife to seek professional counseling services. Its my experience that all too often, couples are not able to effectively communicate for a variety of reasons. A therapist won't solve your problems, but will help both of you clarify your thinking and your expression. In that manner, you both will have the opportunity to gain understanding of the other.

Another note. If intimacy is absent in your relationship, you need to do something about it. Nothing makes a woman question a relationship more quickly that the feeling that her lover has lost interest in her.

Prescriptions are fine, but thats only one small part of intimacy. Most of the women I have known and loved truly appreciate a lover who will take time and creatively touch them...both physically and emotionally. That doesn't require an erection so much as it does an awareness and responsiveness to the woman. Any touch, anywhere can be intimate and erotic. Intimacy can be an embrace in the kitchen, a whisper, a look.

[J'lyn GG]

I think I am known here as a member that has no time for therapists.
I think it’s good for all of to face up to our problems, be strong, and work out our problems ourselves. [You will be stronger and wiser afterwards]
SUZY

I totally disagree with this statement. Therapy saved our marriage. She was able to explain to both of us why I felt the way I felt and then we could learn to move past it and/or deal with it. She also taught us how to communicate better. Basically, I DO NOT hold ANY feelings/thoughts in, b/c of the fear of hurting hubby's feelings. Which I think is a very common problem. I know I will hurt his feelings sometimes, but if I hold it in, I will resent him, b/c I felt like I had to bottle it up. He tells me EVERYTHING. I tell him EVERYTHING. (that deals with cding) Even things that shouldn't matter or are so little that you may forget. Why? B/c I have to know that he is not purposely hiding things from me and he needs to know exactly how I feel. That I am not pretending to like something when I don't.

I can tell you, that she may hate the thought of you underdressing. I know I do, so hubby doesn't. I guess he never desired to do that, so that doesn't really relate. You may think she is okay with stuff, when she really isn't. And the anger builds. If that's the case, it may be too late.

I can also say I am the type of person that I have to face my fears and discomfort head on and push thru the bad feelings and talk about them. If we hadn't gone to counseling, I wouldn't have been able to cope with doing that and therefore, we would be divorced or I would be dead.

[Ellyn]

Divorce isn't evil. I'm sorry, but I think that is an unfair statement. The social perception of marriage and divorce is very one-sided.
When you look at divorce as what it really does to a family you will find that it is indeed evil. The importance of a family can only be emphasized by looking at those who oppose the family, keeping in mind that divorce is the terminator of mariage, and marriage is the binding of a family, and the family is the building blocks of a society:

"In the Manifesto of the Communist Party, Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels wrote that with the introduction of Communism, “The bourgeois family will vanish as a matter of course.”

[Kaitlyn26]

I see so many crossdressing men around here that apologize or say they deserve this, or needed that. Makes me so sick that society conditions you all to sacrifice yourselves for the opposite sex so easily. Talk about male conditioning in it's purest form. Try telling your wife what she can't wear. See how ****ing long that shit flies.

[Miss Maxine]

When you look at divorce as what it really does to a family you will find that it is indeed evil. The importance of a family can only be emphasized by looking at those who oppose the family, keeping in mind that divorce is the terminator of mariage, and marriage is the binding of a family, and the family is the building blocks of a society:

"In the Manifesto of the Communist Party, Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels wrote that with the introduction of Communism, “The bourgeois family will vanish as a matter of course.”

You're right. Two fighting parents who do not love each other, but stay together "for the kids" is better than two parents who are apart, yet are with people they really love that make them happy. That's always what best for the children. Let's teach our children that outdated and pointless political principles are more important than being with someone that makes you happy. That would be setting the best example.

I knew I'd regret getting in the middle of this. I'm done.

[MJ]

If you go through life trying to be someone you are not just to please your wife you will never be truly happy. I have personal experience of this.

SUZY

please forgive me but sometimes divorce may be best for both of you. you may not know it but from the wifes point of view your marrage's been dead for a long time and she just wants out

[TGMarla]

The problem here is obvious. Your wife isn't down with the crossdressing. Mine doesn't much like it either, but we've found that if I keep it away from her, she can deal with it. She knows I'm not going to run off and have a sex change, and that I'm not interested in gay relationships. She knows I'm true to her, and that I love her and I want to stay her husband.

But I don't wear "light makeup" in front of her, or put false nails on around her, or underdress on a daily basis. These things may have become habitual to you, but they are absolutely not necessary to me as an outlet for my feminine qualities. My wife is very important to me, and so I remain her man whenever she's around. And this isn't some dishwater version of her man, it's the whole enchilada. When she's away, I often engage in complete crossdressing where I'm nearly indistinguishable from a woman (at least at first glance). But when she's home, and whenever we're together, the femme stuff goes away, and I devote myself to her as her husband.

I'm no expert here, but if you want your marriage back, then you need to commit to the marriage, and be the man she wanted in the first place. You'll likely always crossdress, but if you want her to commit, then you need to also. That means no more underdressing, no more "light makeup" when she's around, no more tweezing your eyebrows (within reason), and no more false nails when you two go out somewhere.

Put yourself in her shoes.....and no, I don't mean her high heels. Try to see things from her perspective. If you cannot be that man for her, then why the heck should she stick around? Sure, it takes two to tango, but this is more on you than it is on her. I'm guessing that your point of view is that "she just doesn't understand.....!" That's right. She doesn't. And it's not incumbent upon her to suddenly see the light. She married a man, and that was the bargain she made. You're not holding up your end of the deal, and you're trying to change the rules on the fly.

My advice to you, much as you may not want to hear it, is to man up, put the girly stuff away, and only use it when you have the opportunity to crossdress in private. The rest of the time, you owe it to your wife to be her man, not her wife.

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi Keri, I think that a therapist will say what one side wants to hear and not the other side
that was the way it happened to my wife and I .
One of them said what i liked and another what my liked.

Crossdressing is like the Mafia you cant just quit.

Orchid

[Kittyagain]

Put yourself in her shoes. She says she is ready for church. You look at her and she has on male clothes, a makeup applied beard, she has shaved her head and something that is obvious to the world, stuck in her pants. Put this vision in your mind and ask what you would think and do.

You two get together and find a compromise. Save your marriage and yourself if you can.

Kitty

[Kaitlyn26]

Put yourself in her shoes. She says she is ready for church. You look at her and she has on male clothes, a makeup applied beard, she has shaved her head and something, that is obvious to the world, stuck in her pants. Put this vision in your mind and ask what you would think and do.

You two get together and find a compromise. Save your marriage and yourself if you can.

Kitty

Judging by the information about her given here, you shut your mouth and smile, and you get your butt to church. Sorry, but this doesn't sound like a healthy relationship anymore, and certainly not one of equal status.

The op has made many concessions for her, and she still isn't happy. Tyrant wife needs to be tyrant ex-wife.

[bomba]

this is all so depressing. and i see a trend here in my own marriage.i believe im going to stand down on the dressing for a while as i dont want to put my kids through a devorse under those circumstances. im signing off and wont be back. thanks to you all you good people though.your stories and insites have been very enjoyable.i will miss u all.

[NicoleScott]

Marla nailed it. The OP knows what the wife is willing to tolerate but crosses the line. The line appears to be keeping the girly activities private, and her man presenting as a man in public.
My wife tolerates my crossdressing, and I can even dress in front of her, although I prefer privacy. But she is very sensitive about others knowing, so to keep the peace and the good deal I have, I keep it private. I know I could expect trouble if I started letting others see that my body was becoming feminized. I DO shave my body (arms, legs, chest...all) but only in winter time after shorts get put away for the season. And let it grow back before wearing shorts again.
The only thing I can think of as a reason the OP pushes the boundaries (besides being a knucklehead - no offense intended) is an internal feminine identity that can't be contained. If so, the wife doesn't want a girly man and the marriage is in trouble.
So, does Keri want to be a husband to a wife who wants a man, or be a person with the freedom to express a feminine side unfettered? Time to choose and take appropriate action.

[Kaitlyn26]

Marla nailed it. The OP knows what the wife is willing to tolerate but crosses the line. The line appears to be keeping the girly activities private, and her man presenting as a man in public.
My wife tolerates my crossdressing, and I can even dress in front of her, although I prefer privacy. But she is very sensitive about others knowing, so to keep the peace and the good deal I have, I keep it private. I know I could expect trouble if I started letting others see that my body was becoming feminized. I DO shave my body (arms, legs, chest...all) but only in winter time after shorts get put away for the season. And let it grow back before wearing shorts again.
The only thing I can think of as a reason the OP pushes the boundaries (besides being a knucklehead - no offense intended) is an internal feminine identity that can't be contained. If so, the wife doesn't want a girly man and the marriage is in trouble.
So, does Keri want to be a husband to a wife who wants a man, or be a person with the freedom to express a feminine side unfettered? Time to choose and take appropriate action.

She does not define the line, herself. Each person needs to clearly state what they can and can't tolerate, if tolerance overlaps then each side needs to give some concession or compromise to the other. Like it or not, a GG that finds out she's married to a crossdresser, even after a long period of time, will need to do things that she is not fond of, if you want a real and equal relationship. If she doesn't want to do that, then she needs to find the door. Which is what it sounds like the op's SO is doing.

Forcing someone entirely into a closet is no form of concession or compromise. It's just selfish.

[Aprilrain]

"What am I and How can I make my wife happy?"

This is going to sound glib but its the truth.
question 1: You are a human being (as far as I can tell from your avatar anyway)
question 2: There is nothing you can do to "MAKE" your wife happy. If she can't BE happy with you as you no amount of you not being you is going to make her happy either if anything it will only make her resent you even more than she already must. There are other fish in the sea and divorce is not the end of the world (though it maybe the end of your finances!)

My guess is she has made her decision. Why love someone who doesn't love you back? "I love you, now change" isn't love at all!

[Debra Russell]

The problem here is obvious. Your wife isn't down with the crossdressing. Mine doesn't much like it either, but we've found that if I keep it away from her, she can deal with it. She knows I'm not going to run off and have a sex change, and that I'm not interested in gay relationships. She knows I'm true to her, and that I love her and I want to stay her husband.

But I don't wear "light makeup" in front of her, or put false nails on around her, or underdress on a daily basis. These things may have become habitual to you, but they are absolutely not necessary to me as an outlet for my feminine qualities. My wife is very important to me, and so I remain her man whenever she's around. And this isn't some dishwater version of her man, it's the whole enchilada. When she's away, I often engage in complete crossdressing where I'm nearly indistinguishable from a woman (at least at first glance). But when she's home, and whenever we're together, the femme stuff goes away, and I devote myself to her as her husband.

I'm no expert here, but if you want your marriage back, then you need to commit to the marriage, and be the man she wanted in the first place. You'll likely always crossdress, but if you want her to commit, then you need to also. That means no more underdressing, no more "light makeup" when she's around, no more tweezing your eyebrows (within reason), and no more false nails when you two go out somewhere.

Put yourself in her shoes.....and no, I don't mean her high heels. Try to see things from her perspective. If you cannot be that man for her, then why the heck should she stick around? Sure, it takes two to tango, but this is more on you than it is on her. I'm guessing that your point of view is that "she just doesn't understand.....!" That's right. She doesn't. And it's not incumbent upon her to suddenly see the light. She married a man, and that was the bargain she made. You're not holding up your end of the deal, and you're trying to change the rules on the fly.

My advice to you, much as you may not want to hear it, is to man up, put the girly stuff away, and only use it when you have the opportunity to crossdress in private. The rest of the time, you owe it to your wife to be her man, not her wife.

Exactly what she said and pay attention it's important if your wife is tolarent but not into your hobbie it's important that she has her man ....................Debra

[Aprilrain]

My wife tolerates my crossdressing, and I can even dress in front of her, although I prefer privacy. But she is very sensitive about others knowing, so to keep the peace and the good deal I have, I keep it private. I know I could expect trouble if I started letting others see that my body was becoming feminized. I DO shave my body (arms, legs, chest...all) but only in winter time after shorts get put away for the season. And let it grow back before wearing shorts again.

This sounds like the rational of a house slave!

If you guys are so MANLY why aren't you setting the boundaries????

[Kerigirl2009]

Thank you for the responses, I have to clarify something here!
First of all I love my wife more then I love Keri but they are both apart of my life
The reason I underdress so often is I do not get any real alone time. Sure I work nights and she works days but when I am home alone I t is bed time for me, This allows me time with my family later in the evening.
I just feel if I do not get some sort of Keri time I will crack and totally out myself in some way that my wife would be upset.
The reason I told her is I was tired of hiding who I really am. And of course making a mistake and letting her find her own conclussions.

My wife and I still get along great minus the intimacy, but we still care for eachother.
I am hoping to have a good talk with her soon and I will be back to update our status.
Oh and one more thing to those that have ripped on my wife- DON'T do it. that just pisses me off. Rip on me as much as you want but don't go there.

[Kaitlyn26]

Thank you for the responses, I have to clarify something here!
First of all I love my wife more then I love Keri but they are both apart of my life
The reason I underdress so often is I do not get any real alone time. Sure I work nights and she works days but when I am home alone I t is bed time for me, This allows me time with my family later in the evening.
I just feel if I do not get some sort of Keri time I will crack and totally out myself in some way that my wife would be upset.
The reason I told her is I was tired of hiding who I really am. And of course making a mistake and letting her find her own conclussions.

My wife and I still get along great minus the intimacy, but we still care for eachother.
I am hoping to have a good talk with her soon and I will be back to update our status.
Oh and one more thing to those that have ripped on my wife- DON'T do it. that just pisses me off. Rip on me as much as you want but don't go there.

To be honest, you need to clarify a lot more than just that if you want any good advise. If she's willing to, as I said, give concessions and make compromises, then you can start to get somewhere. Until then, it's Keri or her. Make the choice.

If you paint your wife up as a tyrant, then expect someone to call it. Specific info is needed to get to the bottom of your problem. Not "she's mad and wants divorce because I wore false nails to church, and a little makeup sometimes", and "she didn't tell me not to! I didn't mean it!". It makes her look like a very difficult person. I'm guessing that your attitude from when you made the original post has probably changed by the time that you wrote that reply. :)

The only thing that you really need to focus on to solve this problem is, will she sit down and talk to you? Would she choose to learn to live with this, with you, or would she rather not deal with it, with or without you? Until you know this for sure, all points are moot.

[NicoleScott]

Kaitlyn (post #32), maybe I read more into the OP than was there. I assumed tolerance line was expressing femininity in public. She knows he crossdresses in private and underdresses, but fake nails and light makeup is too much. I agree with you to a point: they should both lay it out and see if there can be a negotiated set of boundaries that each can live with. It doesn't do any good to agree to something if you can't keep your side of the agreement (don't make promises you can't keep). If they can't find common ground, the marriage is doomed. But it's not forcing someone into a closet. He may go into the closet as an agreed-upon term. It's not selfish to expect the man she married to act like a man, at least in public. Agreeing to something is not being forced. I agree with you: they need a serious sit-down talk.

Aprilrain (post #35), are you suggesting that the manly man should make all the rules?

I'm not a house slave. I don't keep my crossdressing private just because she wants me to. I kept it private long before I met her. WE agree that it is in OUR best interest. That's what makes it work. My crossdressing presents no problems for us as long as both of us keep the agreement. Maybe I shouldn't have said she tolerates my crossdressing. It's not like she is against it but is OK as long as I stay within her boundaries. She accepts my crossdressing as a part of who I am. I am also a regular guy, husband, and father without gender issues. I just like to dress up sometimes. I do all the manly man things other men (who don't crossdress) do, except I don't set all the boundaries. We do that together. That must seem strange to you.

[Kittyagain]

Keri, you are trying so hard. That really stands out to me. Keep trying every angle you can think of to find the middle ground you both can be happy with.

Now we need the genie to have a third wish.

Kitty

[Kaitlyn26]

Nicole, within that line comes interpretation and opinion. To some men, makeup is a daily and masculine occurrence. Without knowing how femme the makeup was, it's hard to say for sure if it went outside the lines. To some, any makeup may cross the line. Maybe Keri pushed too far, maybe the line needs to be a bit more clear. I think that based on Keri's love for the SO, and the public displays, that any lasting resolution will need to include more outlets for feminine things. It's going to be difficult to get that kind of compromise from a wife that just asked for divorce. Without it, I think the problem will come up again.

[Rachel Mari]

Keri,

This really hits close to home and I feel for you as I'm going through somewhat of the same situation except that we don't consider divorce as an option in the foreseeable future (we have two kids and have communicated our love for them but also our need to grow in possible seperate directions).

We have gone to counseling before and until the last time, has worked for us. I think we tend to need a third party there to help us keep on track with our thoughts and emotions when trying to talk to each other. We both feel that it allows us to say what needs to be said without it becoming too overwhelming and us shutting down.
We're trying to find a new counselor as the last one just wasn't working out anymore.

It is very difficult to define who we feel we are and how that matches up to how we were. Whether to suspress the needs as before or grow in other ways. Be true to yourself and her.
I wish you luck and I hope it turns out for the best, whatever the outcome.

Rachel

[ReineD]

I have a few thoughts, but first I'd like to get something out of the way that isn't specific to your situation.

We all like to think that we "shouldn't" care what others think of us. And perhaps if a person's need to be a non-conformist is strong (whether it is gender-bending, or goth, or punk, etc), this will make it easier to not care, especially if they mingle among other non-conformists. They will already have a peer group and they won't care what anyone outside their peer group thinks. Or, there are people who are strong individualists, perhaps they are loners, and they walk through life doing as they please without caring what anyone else thinks.

But, most of us do need others in our lives, to varying levels of closeness and this is why many CDers keep their femme appearance in the closet, as least to the people they interact with daily. We are social animals; friends, church groups or other groups of people are important to many of us, hence after a certain age, few of us care to stray too far outside of convention. We want to fit in. We want to be invited to stuff. We don't want people to whisper behind out backs. At the same time, most of us don't care what strangers think, since they'll not see us again. But we do care what the people we interact with daily think.

That said, I'm about to make some major assumptions about your wife now, just based on how many of the GGs that I've spoken to over the years have felt. I'm also making some assumptions about you, based on your post:

You need to be yourself, which from your description is a gender blend. You like to incorporate feminine elements while you're in guy mode and when you look at yourself in the mirror, you just see a reflection of who you are. Or, perhaps you swing more to the female side and you don't even come close to expressing the degree of femininity that you would like. I don't know, since you haven't elaborated on this too much.

But, your wife (I'm assuming because she is a gender conformist like many if not most people), does not want others to know that you are a gender blend or a gender non-conformist, nor does she want others to know you are female if you do swing more in that direction. She wants to be with, and she wants to be seen with a guy when she is out in public. She doesn't want people talking behind her back. It is unfortunate we live in a society that looks askance at men who overtly look feminine, but, it is what it is. She likely wants to be included in various social groups and not be ostracized because people might question your gender identity.

Again, not knowing where you sit along the gender spectrum, I do want to point out there are ways that CDers can come up with a neutral look that will look OK whether they are in guy or girl mode. My SO does this. For example, he has mid-back length hair that he wears tied at the nape in guy mode. He works in a liberal environment where other males do this as well, so he doesn't stand out. He trimmed back his arm hair so that it is not overly bushy, but at the same time he still has some arm hair (women have arm hair too :p). He plucked his eyebrows the same way; there is no high arch that makes it obvious in guy mode that he plucks them, but they look nice in femme mode as well. He let his fingernails grow so there is no need to wear press-on nails ever. He doesn't paint them when he's in guy mode, not even a clear coat. Fingernails can also be a neutral length that look OK in both modes. (I keep mine short, simply because they split when they get long.) He pierced his ears, but he doesn't wear earrings in guy mode. No one notices the piercing in guy mode and even if they did, lots of guys nowadays have body piercings. He does keep his legs shaved and his toe nails are often painted, but most times he is in jeans and sneakers so no one knows this. He would never wear sandals in guy mode showing painted toe nails. And he never wears makeup in guy mode, ever. And last, he has had a few sessions of laser facial hair removal which makes it much easier when he is out en femme, but I can't tell when I see him in guy mode. He just always looks cleanly shaved, like lots of other men.

In other words, no one looks at my SO in guy mode and guesses "crossdresser" nor do they question his gender (except people who notice the little things). Yet, he can get ready to go out dressed in a flash whenever he wants to, because of the way that he maintains his appearance. That said, he does want to appear male when he's in guy mode, and female when he's in femme mode. Perhaps it is important for you to appear feminine when you are in guy mode?

Back to your wife: she likely feels odd about you wearing makeup and press-on nails in guy mode and she may feel as if you don't care to maintain your male appearance any more. And if you don't like to be naked in front of her, she may feel as if your sexuality is changing as well, as if you are no longer interested in her. In fact, she may believe you are more TS than CD. You should ask her this, because if she feels you are TS, she may wonder if you might not prefer to be with men than with her.

So .. this very long post is my attempt at trying to explain some very subtle changes that you might make, that would satisfy both your wife and yourself, depending on where you sit along the gender spectrum. But if you cannot live without wearing makeup and press-on nails, or visibly painted toenails in guy mode though, then I agree with the others. I think you've crossed a line that your wife can't live with and if this is the case, I also strongly recommend you make a last ditch attempt at saving your marriage by suggesting couples counseling to your wife.

[prettytoes]

I can say for sure that my wife would very much prefer that I was not a crossdresser. She is, however, fairly accepting because she knows that this is a part of me that cannot be changed. We have been married for 27 years, and she just found out this past spring (found my stash of clothes). After a few days of silence, we talked about it and I was able to explain myself, and answer all her questions. I make sure to tell her every day how much I love her, how happy I am to have her, and how much I appreciate all she does for me. I also bought the book "My Husband Wears My Clothes" for both of us. It was excellant! It really helped explain things (to both of us!), and put into words what I was unable to. She has asked for certain boundries, which I am happy to honor. I am able to keep my toenails painted and wear yoga pants/shorts without making her uncomfortable. I wear panties 24/7 and I normally sleep in nighties. I do not wear skirts or dresses in front of her, or feminine tops/blouses. She knows I have them, I just don't wear them in front of her. I do not wear nighties when we are intimate; I would like to, but she wouldn't like that.
She has said many times that she married me and loves me "for better or for worse", and she loves me unconditionally. I highly recommend reading the book I mentioned, and explaining to her that as much as you enjoy your time to be feminine, you also love being her man. It is a part of you, and if you try to make it disappear, you will only be miserable and depressed.
Good luck, I hope you can turn things around. When there is true love, there is always a way to work things out.

[Kaitlyn26]

I can say for sure that my wife would very much prefer that I was not a crossdresser. She is, however, fairly accepting because she knows that this is a part of me that cannot be changed. We have been married for 27 years, and she just found out this past spring (found my stash of clothes). After a few days of silence, we talked about it and I was able to explain myself, and answer all her questions. I make sure to tell her every day how much I love her, how happy I am to have her, and how much I appreciate all she does for me. I also bought the book "My Husband Wears My Clothes" for both of us. It was excellant! It really helped explain things (to both of us!), and put into words what I was unable to. She has asked for certain boundries, which I am happy to honor. I am able to keep my toenails painted and wear yoga pants/shorts without making her uncomfortable. I wear panties 24/7 and I normally sleep in nighties. I do not wear skirts or dresses in front of her, or feminine tops/blouses. She knows I have them, I just don't wear them in front of her. I do not wear nighties when we are intimate; I would like to, but she wouldn't like that.
She has said many times that she married me and loves me "for better or for worse", and she loves me unconditionally. I highly recommend reading the book I mentioned, and explaining to her that as much as you enjoy your time to be feminine, you also love being her man. It is a part of you, and if you try to make it disappear, you will only be miserable and depressed.
Good luck, I hope you can turn things around. When there is true love, there is always a way to work things out.

That's the way it should be. I would not settle for anything less, personally.

[NicoleScott]

Kaitlyn (Post #40), I agree totally.

[cassandra54]

your signature says it all

I wish I had the courage to just be myself and live my life how I want.

tough questions, hard times, difficult. choices and no easy answers. a lot of soul searching is in store for you.

what's more important crossdressing or your wife? would you be happy not dressing and would she love you again? would you be happy? definitely tell the doctor everything about you. maybe he will understand, maybe not. if not find a doctor that agrees with you. take your meds if you need them. most of all, don't give up hope and being positive.

[Phylis Nicole Schuyler]

TGMarla;
AMEN! Amen to " you owe it to your wife to be her man, not her wife." If you want to be her wife, expect the big D. Explain that you are the MAN she married, show it, prove it and above all else, give her every reason to believe she is the biggest part of your world. Set it in your mind that if you want the marriage to "work", you're going to have to WORK at it. No lip service, just pure honest proof by example. Show her that you understand that some of the things that you do while crossdressing makes her very insecure and possibly feel rejection. The crossdressing is a part of you not her. She accepts (maybe) but she may not like it. Let her know you understand that and work on setting limitations. Consider you time crossdressing as a business trip. You wouldn't bring your wife on one to sit through boring meetings like you have to. She knows you're on a trip and she doesn't NEED to go with you. She knows you crossdress but she doen't need it stuffed her nose.

Excuse my rambling. I had to take a darvicet for the pain from changing my abdominal wound VAC and like my mouth, my fingers are typing whatever comes to my mind. God help us all.

[Duana]

You're asking to forego your happiness for your wife's. While a noble idea, it doesn't work well in practice. Realize that each others happiness may be possible only if apart. I'm a firm believer in divorcing non-accepting wives. I don't mean to sound harsh in expressing my belief but I really think its for the best. She can find a "normal" guy and you can find someone that loves all of you, not just half of you. Everybody wins.

[Kaitlyn26]

TGMarla;
AMEN! Amen to " you owe it to your wife to be her man, not her wife." If you want to be her wife, expect the big D. Explain that you are the MAN she married, show it, prove it and above all else, give her every reason to believe she is the biggest part of your world. Set it in your mind that if you want the marriage to "work", you're going to have to WORK at it. No lip service, just pure honest proof by example. Show her that you understand that some of the things that you do while crossdressing makes her very insecure and possibly feel rejection. The crossdressing is a part of you not her. She accepts (maybe) but she may not like it. Let her know you understand that and work on setting limitations. Consider you time crossdressing as a business trip. You wouldn't bring your wife on one to sit through boring meetings like you have to. She knows you're on a trip and she doesn't NEED to go with you. She knows you crossdress but she doen't need it stuffed her nose.

Excuse my rambling. I had to take a darvicet for the pain from changing my abdominal wound VAC and like my mouth, my fingers are typing whatever comes to my mind. God help us all.

Regardless, being a MANLY MAN, for her sake, will just screw up the situation even more down the road. If she's willing, finding some middle ground that you both consider a "win" is the only lasting resolution. The urge won't leave, and the more you try to make it leave, the harder it's going to dig in and want to hold it's ground. Anything more than that, is purely speculation.

Keri may want to consider some of the things that Reine mentioned about how to go between quickly and keep a few subtle femme things that most people will not notice.

[sterling12]

You seem to have problems piled on top of problems. Your crossdressing seems to be one aspect of the overall picture, but it's not the whole thing. Yeah, I agree with the others, you need to get some professional help. And Counseling ONLY works when you are candid, and put a lot of your own self-help work into the equation.

Will you end up with a divorce? Probably, and The Counseling will hopefully get you and your wife to a place where you can handle the idea. One important thing to remember: "Your NOT responsible for your wife's happiness, nor her unhappiness!" "Only she can effect that problem!" "Conversely, she's NOT responsible for your moods, good or bad!" Ultimately, The only person we can effect, is ourselves.

With many issues, it will take time to begin to sort it out. If your Wife wants to try and wait, then something good might come out of it. If she doesn't, that's OK too. It just wasn't meant to be.

Now, having said all this; I like to remind folks who solicit our OPINIONS, that "it's not Gospel." We aren't experts, and we certainly don't know all the facts. Hope that some of this Info. helps you. But, don't expect miracles around here. Don't wait for further opinions, get with your county's Social Services.....get help!

Peace and Love, Joanie

[Kerigirl2009]

While I always appreciate peoples opinions as they sometimes help to make us think. I always make my own decisions. But imput helps too, even the imput I do not agree with.
I thought I was being suttle with the things that I have done or been doing in my feminine side. As far as make-up, I was wearing clear mascara(lightly applied) a very similiar eye liner and again lightly lined but not all the time and not infront of my family, when I would remove it I would basically leave a tiny trace of it. Now no one has ever said anything about it. I believe she may have seen that I was wearing makeup maybe once or twice but basically only because my face was extra clean.
the nails I can live without.
I am going to suggest that I take her up on her offer to go out more often. basically I have not gone out very often because I do not wish to take away from family time.
I am making a dr appt.
We get along and I do not think it is too late to bring the spark back into our relationship with the help that I may require.
The Crossdressing is not the whole picture, actually she told me that it does not bother her as much as it seems to bother me. I think this has a lot to do with the lack of intimacy and I would love to have a more intimate relationship with my wife anyway.

I don't think I am overly girly as I can be pretty intimidating as a man and have no problem getting dirty when necessary. I have and can build pretty much anything, except I hate working on cars. So being a man is not lacking,
I am guilty of trying to push the boundaries that we have established, I think it will be a good time to talk and discuss the boundaries.
In the event that our marriage does end, it will not end badly for either of us. I will always love her even if she only wants me as a friend. I have said before this is my life and I have chosen to spend it with her

[Aprilrain]

Aprilrain (post #35), are you suggesting that the manly man should make all the rules?

I I am also a regular guy, husband, and father without gender issues. I just like to dress up sometimes. I do all the manly man things other men (who don't crossdress) do, That must seem strange to you.

No Im suggesting that if you guys are as "manly" (read assertive) as you all claim to be then you would make it clear to your wives what it is in the relationship YOU need. Trust me most woman are more than happy to tell their SOs what they want out of the relationship but woman value verbal communication more than men. Perhaps this is how it is with you and your wife however more often than not one reads on this forum something more like this: "What am I and How can I make my wife happy?" We all want to be good to our mates but we can not MAKE anyone happy especially if they are disgusted with some fundamental aspect of us. Being servile and scraping just to get someone to like us is pathetic at best and the other person will resent the effort and eventually hate the person for even trying.

Yes indeed CDing as you describe it does seem rather strange to me. Without some sort of internal gender conflict (even if only slight) I can't even imagine what would drive some one to wear the clothes of the opposite sex.

[ReineD]

I am guilty of trying to push the boundaries that we have established, I think it will be a good time to talk and discuss the boundaries.
In the event that our marriage does end, it will not end badly for either of us. I will always love her even if she only wants me as a friend. I have said before this is my life and I have chosen to spend it with her

Good luck, Keri ... I hope that you and your wife will be able to work things out. :hugs:

[Kerigirl2009]

I have been rereading some of the comments and its really kind of funny what I am reading and who they are from, atleast what I would consider the no hope additude people that say do what you want and don't worry about the other person. They seem to be the younger generation that have not invested half of their lives into making a family with someone.
I wont say who they are that I am thinking that is up to the others to read into.
I am going to have my own soul searching to do but I wil take into account my wifes feelings as well as my childrens. While also allowing myself some freedoms. This to me is what my marriage is about.
Thank You Reine for what I consider one of the best comments, not to say their where not others but yours stood out to me.
I am thankful for everyone but I will be done with this post as for the mist part it is too negative for me.

yes it is true I may be more TG then CD but I believe the TG side is more of a choice where as the CD side is something that we are either Born with or it is environmental with the pwople that we grow up with and associate with. There are times in my life I believe being a woman is what I want but this would be a conscious choice that would effect everyone that I know love and trust. Something I am not even ready to consider.
My crossdressing side is something about me that I truly adore and I believe is a huge part of my life, one that I could never give up for any reason nor will I, I told my wife when I came out that this is something that has never gone away and never will. She has never asked me to give her up and never will. Thank you again

Keri

[Jessica1984]

"What am I and How can I make my wife happy?"

This is going to sound glib but its the truth.
question 1: You are a human being (as far as I can tell from your avatar anyway)
question 2: There is nothing you can do to "MAKE" your wife happy. If she can't BE happy with you as you no amount of you not being you is going to make her happy either if anything it will only make her resent you even more than she already must. There are other fish in the sea and divorce is not the end of the world (though it maybe the end of your finances!)

My guess is she has made her decision. Why love someone who doesn't love you back? "I love you, now change" isn't love at all!

Although maybe a bit more blunt than I would have put it, I agree with this.

[Kaitlyn26]

I have been rereading some of the comments and its really kind of funny what I am reading and who they are from, atleast what I would consider the no hope additude people that say do what you want and don't worry about the other person. They seem to be the younger generation that have not invested half of their lives into making a family with someone.
I wont say who they are that I am thinking that is up to the others to read into.
I am going to have my own soul searching to do but I wil take into account my wifes feelings as well as my childrens. While also allowing myself some freedoms. This to me is what my marriage is about.
Thank You Reine for what I consider one of the best comments, not to say their where not others but yours stood out to me.
I am thankful for everyone but I will be done with this post as for the mist part it is too negative for me.

yes it is true I may be more TG then CD but I believe the TG side is more of a choice where as the CD side is something that we are either Born with or it is environmental with the pwople that we grow up with and associate with. There are times in my life I believe being a woman is what I want but this would be a conscious choice that would effect everyone that I know love and trust. Something I am not even ready to consider.
My crossdressing side is something about me that I truly adore and I believe is a huge part of my life, one that I could never give up for any reason nor will I, I told my wife when I came out that this is something that has never gone away and never will. She has never asked me to give her up and never will. Thank you again

Keri

Actually, I've watched 8 divorces in my immediate family take place, all were well invested as you are, and around your age group. At the end of the day, they muttered the D-word because it was already over for them. Something to think about, before you go saying this or that to yourself, having not spoken to her yet. Have you sat down and spoke to her yet?

What you need to do right now, is talk to her about this, and do not make any other conclusions about anything until you know how she feels, and where she wants to take it. Let her do the talking, and then present exactly what you want, should you two get back together, if that option is even on the table. Putting yourself through hoops will only brush the problem aside for a time. Not allowing for more self expression could give you "cage syndrome" and make you irritable, and cause problems later on, again.

It's not a game of "what can I do to get my wife back", it's a game of, "how do I get my marriage out of this hole that's sinking it".

[Allsteamedup]

Stop guessing and listen to what is being said
.
Your wife complains about lack of intimacy. You are only roommates.
This has little to do with your pills and a lot to do with you. If you persistently do not cuddle, stroke, or generally show closeness and affection to your wife she will decide you don't care physically for her. That will make her feel unattractive.

If you persistently needlessly embarrass her in public. eg showing up to Church with false fingernails, never mind how subtle you think you are, this is totally unnecessary behaviour and again tells her you don't care.

You have obviously gone a long way down the feminising route and it leaves your wife feeling that she is no longer important in your relationship. Where is her man?

Giving up cding is not going to help you at this point. Once you signal to a woman that your alter ego is more important than she, the genuine woman in the relationship, then you are the one not-so-subtly telling her that you are finished. Ask yourself why you did this.It didn't happen by chance.

You could try relationship counselling. Remember, even those of us who are supportive do not expect to be made a fool of by your femme side. You are the one with issues here. Face them.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

Good luck Keri.. Hopefully you are right..

You asked the question...

honesty and real life experience is not "negativity"...
negativity is spending years lying to yourself and hurting the person you love

if your statements about your gender identity are exaggerations than you've wasted our time..