Cause of discrimination

[abigailf]

So, another thread got me thinking...

Why do people discriminate? I'd like to hear your thoughts.

Here are mine:

For some I feel that people who discriminate against something do so because inside they feel they are one of what they discriminate against and are so ashamed of themselves that the anger and fear of humiliation causes them to push it away and hence, discriminate.

For others, they are incapable of thinking on their own and they take to the heart and soul something they heard or read. Because they do not posses the ability to think critical, that weakness is made up for in the ability to preach and sway opinion. So, they take their misguided beliefs and impart them on other non-thinking individuals.

I don't know, I guess there could be a lot of grey area in between too.

[NathalieX66]

Some scenarios:

1.Those who have been put down or belittled in life, particularly those with low self esteem feel the need to put down others. They find satisfaction in this, but not joy.

2. Self righteousness ( "my way works better because that's how I 've been told")

3. Fear & phobia. People fear what they do not understand. Does wonders when you throw in God & the bible, which makes fear all the more real.

4. Everything you said.

[sissystephanie]

I think most people discriminate because they do not have the ability to properly think things out! If they did have that ability, they would know that there is no valid reason to discriminate as they do. People are different, and always have been and always will be!! That is what makes the world go round!

[docrobbysherry]

An even BETTER question I overheard at SCC, Abigail, was:

Why do members of the CD/TG/TS community discriminate? Why don't ALL of us realize we r sisters under the skin, one way or another?

What difference does it make if u started dressing first? Or, that I wear complete outfits and u underdress? Or, that u want to transition and I don't. Or, u dress to Walmart and I dress at home. Why can't we all ACCEPT EACH OTHER?

When we can/do, THEN, ask why the vanilla public won't accept us!?

[cassandra54]

WOW!!!!!!! are you serious? millions of man-hours, trillions of dollars endless discussions and in the end who knows why. but i will try to give you some insight. i face discrimination on an almost daily basis. 1. because i am white and 57, no explanation needed there. 2. because i am very bright probably about 130+ on the old i.q. scale. trust me, it's almost the same as being mentally retarded because we have so much in common. a. we are socially challenged, b. we can't tie our shoes and c. we talk about things no-one can understand.

here are some of the things i've learned are.
1. discrimination originates anytime someone is faced with anything diverse and different. we expect conformity and live in a certain comfort zone and anytime anything takes out of that, our defense is to dislike that which is taking us out of said comfort zone. case in point: general motors is about the worst car manufacturer in the world, in terms of quality and poor financial management. but yet they sell more cars than anyone else in the world. so much so that some foreign car makers discovered this and relaxed their quality control standards and started producing cars and bad as the americans do. case in point the recent problems with toyota, once a benchmark for car quality, additionally mercedes benz is not so wonderful as it used to be. even though general motors build junk, people just can't wait to own the newest model. i've often thought that if general motors started selling a car with no wheels, there would be a waiting list.
2. a lot of minorities face discrimination when they act out or portray the stereotype that people have of that minority. when it comes down to it, most people don't have a problem with a particular minority when dealing with a particular person. they may however have an issue with how that particular minority carries out their stereotype by action or reputation. for example, i recently posted a thread in which i thought we (most or all of the crossdrssers, transgender, transsexual on this site are pretty much mainstream). we probably are, we go out in public, mind our business, no we are not afraid or intimidated and in general we have no problems. but if we go out in public dressed like a streetwalker, act really loud and in general get in everyone's face, then people have a problem.
3. a lot of discrimination comes from not understanding people. as i said i am very smart and have a reputation for being one of the smartest people in my company. but yet a few times some co-workers have really come close to calling me stupid and i have been told many times that i have no common sense. so true, i rely on logic more times than common sense, but yet most of these people who think i am stupid, are not really smart enough or willing enough to understand that some people are smarter than they are.

in the end ones' likes and dislikes are just another dynamic in the mosaic we call the world. there has to be the proverbial ying and yang to make everything happen. there has to be differences, which have to be accepted and tolerated, but so often they are not.

[abigailf]

An even BETTER question I overheard at SCC, Abigail, was:

Why do members of the CD/TG/TS community discriminate? ...

This is so true. Even in our own little community there are people who can get quite emotional how others choose to be or present themselves.

It seems to me a stanza from the Serenity Prayer may apply here:

"Why can't everyone just accept the things we cannot change,
have the courage to change the things we can,
and the wisdom to know the difference."

One can't change the way someone wants to be, so don't bother trying. But one can change the way she or he perceives that someone, so change that.

[Intertwined]

The reasons are endless, and more importantally, personal to each individual, there is no ONE explination, nor ONE fix...

I hope this brings a smile to everyones face...

Some people are like Slinky's. Pretty much useless, but, will make you smile when you push them down the stairs

[Kate T]

When discussing this I think we should remember to remove the plank from our own ee before we point out the splinter in somone elses.

I think that we all discriminate and the origin is selfish. Essentially we discriminate against anything that could disturb or change our current situation. Now if we want to draw a long straw we could say that it is genetic i.e. the selfish gene that doesn't want anything to disturb it's nice cosy equilibrium. What makes us more than just a bunch of genes and biology is that we can override that selfishness.

But to override it we either need enormous strength of character and selflessness to place others needs before our own and / or education about the "difference" and what it will mean to us.

[Mikaela]

Blaming other people's self worth is pretty silly & is something people do to turn the tables so that you can feel sorry for them, instead of yourself.

Discrimination happens throughout the animal kingdom. Those that are different, or perceived weaker, or outsiders, or whatever are the focus of an attack.
Generally, the first level is self. Outside of that, murder, bullying, etc are acceptable as means to show who has the right to procreate. Male lions will kill infants to send the females into heat, promoting his genes. Female chimpanzees will kill other chimp's babies for purposes of social status. (In humans, infanticide is caused by women/mother most of the time) Next are families, communities protect their own. Rats will kill anyone perceived as an outsider of their clan, even if it is someone from their clan who has been soiled by the scent of another. These villages can join together to be nations, bound by a language and culture. If it's not nations, it's color.

Early groups were easy to distinguish. You knew who was your family or village. After that, language or appearance (color or dress) provided easy means of determining who was an outsider to your tribe/clan/village. These were the beginnings of the social memes which would beget faith, where prayer and ritual and such could identify an outsider at a level that transcended national boundaries.

The moral obligations (ie killing someone, adultery, etc) of many faiths lose their validity when done to another group. Look at the Crusaders killing, stealing, and raping in the name of Jesus. Look at the Muslims declaring jihad (against different sects, as well as infidels).

Bullying and discrimination are not new. It has very little to do with understanding someone else's faith, race, gender, etc. There is always someone with something to prove or desire which serves as a justification to do something abhorrent. It's a part of our very fabric and although we have the tool (brain) to refrain from it, our very genes may override it. We may do it for procreation rights, social hierarchy, prevention of the perceived threat to culture, prevent of disease, or a host of other reasons that manifest as fear of 'diversity' or 'change'.


Addendum: Looks like Adina has read Dawkins or the Lucifer Principle and we were typing simultaneously :D

[cassandra54]

This is so true. Even in our own little community there are people who can get quite emotional how others choose to be or present themselves.

It seems to me a stanza from the Serenity Prayer may apply here:

"Why can't everyone just accept the things we cannot change,
have the courage to change the things we can,
and the wisdom to know the difference."

One can't change the way someone wants to be, so don't bother trying. But one can change the way she or he perceives that someone, so change that.

don't forget "to thine own self be true"

[eluuzion]

So, another thread got me thinking...

Why do people discriminate? I'd like to hear your thoughts.


I think it is a natural human survival (tool) process. Being human, we naturally did what we do best...found a way to turn something productive into something destructive. :brolleyes:

Discrimination is basically interpreting by categorizing. For individual example, the minute we see another person it kicks in...like a computer...sorting for a suitable category...alive/human/male/familiar...."boss". The "friend or foe" process that kept cavemen from getting eaten. Two or more joining together need to agree on categorization characteristics that the group shares. (Social norms). Off you go down the "us" and "them" path with personal agendas as the nature guides.

The prehistoric process being visually prioritized was adequately effective. It is a mouse you can eat or a dinosaur that can eat you. Big muscles=provider/protector=good mate. Big hips, healthy appearance=good child bearer/mate.

Intelligence and language skills have improved, but we still have a hard time controlling that initial physical categorizing process as #1, before we include/consider the "inner" qualities people possess (it we consider them at all).

Everybody is doing their part each day, trying to guide that sculptor chisel to chip off another piece that pushes that hunk of marble one line closer to a finished statue closely reflecting their own image.

Just my opinion. But if you want to fit into society, I suggest that you straighten up, get with the program...and agree with me. :heehee::D:heehee:

:love:

[Duana]

I hope this brings a smile to everyones face...

Some people are like Slinky's. Pretty much useless, but, will make you smile when you push them down the stairs


It brought a smile and memories, thanks. I had to go to youtube...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZL6RGkPjws

[DebbieL]

One of the most natural fears for anyone over the age of 3, is fear of the unknown. We fear change, we fear the unknown, we fear that which we can't explain. Furthermore, men often fear losing their ability to have sex, such as being castrated or emasculated. Women fear betrayal, deception.

When we were children, we were afraid of the monsters, often they were shadows, shapes we created in our minds from things as simple as some dirty laundry, some shadows, the heating pipes expanding, the electrostatic air cleaner, the furnace turning on or off, or even the refrigerator turning on or going into defrost mode.

Each time, we see something we don't understand, that we can't understand, and create images in our minds that are various degrees of scary ranging from uneasy to terrified. Eventually, we learn to face the "monsters", to examine them more closely, to discover that the source of these sites, shadows, and such, were nothing terrible, and perhaps even something funny or even fun.

When someone first discovers that someone is a cross-dresser or transgendered, it's likely to trigger that initial reaction to the unknown. It's not even us they are reacting to. They see us in the dress and think "Dressed to Kill", "Silence of the Lambs", Drag queens at a gay bar, "Psycho", and and worse. Then their minds start spinning association fears - fears that we are homosexual and might rape them if they are men, fears that we might leave our wives for a man, fears that we might turn into dykes, fears that we might want a sex change.

There are secondary fears as well, wives and children worry that we will lose our jobs, get the family kicked out of church, loose the support of both his family and hers, that we will lose our friends, that we might have to leave town, that someone will start burning crosses in our yards, and so on.

The BIGGEST fear is that they have been our friends for months, years, or even decades, and yet they never knew who we REALLY were. This shakes their own confidence in their ability to assess others accurately, to be trusted, to trust others, to be a friend, to be a lover, to be a man or a woman.

Harvey Milk understood this back in his day. He understood that if as many gays as possible came out to their friends, families, employers, and communities, and answered their questions, let them learn what they needed to learn to diffuse their fear, the fear of homosexuals would begin to disappear. It isn't gone, but we've seen the United States transition from arresting gay men and putting them in jail for years, to allowing gay couples to get married in many states.

The transgendered community stayed in the closet. We stayed in hiding, we refused to go out and say "me too". We enjoyed the safety and security of our wives, families, high paying jobs, and retirement plans - but sacrificed some of our most fundamental freedoms. The irony is that we oppressed ourselves.

When you think about it, cross-dressers are the most harmless people in the world. Instead of going out and getting a hooker or having an affair, we put on the pretty clothes and BECOME the girl of our dreams. Instead of passing around sexually transmitted diseases, we put on our lingerie and enjoy ourselves in total privacy. Even when we go to meet with other CDs and TGs, we do so to learn, to get affirmation, to get emotional support. We don't have wild and crazy orgies with each other.

Cross-dressers try to suppress their masculine traits, which means that when we are dressed, we are less violent, more polite, more soft-spoken, less aggressive, and more supportive of others, including men, women, and other CDs/TGs.

In fact, we are MORE DANGEROUS when we try to suppress our Feminine side. We are more likely to experience acute depression, feeling suicidal, feeling hopeless, feeling desparate. We are more likely to turn to drugs, and other self-destructive behaviors as a result of repressing our transgender feelings and longings. The irony is that it takes so little to turn that around - maybe just getting partially dressed at home for a few hours a few times a month. For others it might be getting fully dressed and going to a party. For others it might even be getting dressed and making love to our own wives.

[Wendy_Marie]

There is a lyric in the song (Witchhunt by the band RUSH) that says it all as far as I am concerned...."Ignorance and Prejudice.... and Fear Go Hand in Hand."

[StarrOfDelite]

People discriminate because at the deepest and most primitive level of our brains we are evolved to do it.

Darwinism tells us that the two most basic urges of any organism is first, survival of the individual, and second, survival of the species. Millions of years ago in Africa, when the average hominid being was four and a half feet tall and weighed seventy-five pounds and facing a hostile world, the most effective method to achieve both survival mandates was to form clans or tribes. These clans or tribes were in competition, maybe even feuds, with other similar groups, and the more that people identified that their clan or tribe was 'special' the stronger their bond with it, and the stronger the group became. As Kipling wrote, "the strength of the pack is the wolf, and the strength of the wolf is the pack."

Discrimination against people who were different was one of the ways of affirming the bond of the clan or tribe, and it is effective for maintaining the homegeneity of a population. So, in a sense, being prejudiced is hardwired into our brains.

Interestingly, scientists believe they have discovered a "religious" gene in our DNA, and that its existence in the genome shows that people who believed in the primitive tribal gods and religion tended to survive better than the free thinkers, individualists and other nonconformists. Current events certainly have demonstrated that the dark side of religion is prejudice against anyone who doesn't believe what the group believes.

[TinaMc]

It's pretty much just intellectual laziness. People would rather assume that they know about someone else on the basis of sense clues (skin colour, clothing, voice/accent) and act according to their own assumption, than actually learn what the other person is really like. Unfortunately, it seems that it's a fairly natural way to think. Fortunately, if we are aware of it we can overcome it in ourselves...