To All The Thin Freaks And Gym Junkies.

[Julia_in_Pa]

This is what sexy and attractive looks like. :thumbsup:


Julia

[Asako]

Aye, it's funny how things change over time. I've never really tried to communicate this sort of feeling but I'll do my best by posing it as a question.

What happened to relying on personality to be a "sexy" and "attractive" person to others???

[Eryn]

Sexy is between the ears, not on the body.

[Julia_in_Pa]

Not when it comes to your outward presentation, remember that.


Julia

[Pamela Kay]

Here's another one that helped us win a war.

171759

[SandraAbsent]

Me: "Does this make my but look big?"
Friend: "No, not at all."
Me: "Damnit"

[abigailf]

Let's go back a few more years and see what was interpreted as sexy. Botticelli's Birth of Venus was always a favorite of mine.

I won't post the pics directly because some are paintings of nudes and may violate forum rules. But a google search for "renaissance paintings of women" will show you what some artists of that day perceived as something worth spending their valuable time and money to paint. And it was not cheap for them to paint at that time.

Some of the "beauty" is ... well ... frightening.

[sandra-leigh]

The sexiest woman I ever went out with was shocked that I considered her attractive. She never tried to be sexy, and as best I can tell, the guys around didn't pay attention to her (maybe it was her trace of mustache... who knows?) To me she was a Persian beauty, and I still remember her nearly 30 years later as "the one who got away".

Overall presentation? Even that is in the eye of the beholder. Yes, you can aim for what your local population favors, but perhaps it is better to "be yourself".

[Aprilrain]

(maybe it was her trace of mustache... who knows?) .

is this what my boyfriend sees in me??:eek:

[Marleena]

Don't forget this lady!

[sandra-leigh]

is this what my boyfriend sees in me??:eek:

Do you have the padding and curves, the hips-out-to-here, and the hooded eyes of a belly-dancer? If not then don't give up your beauty-marks too quickly! :D

:sigh: Now I'm getting all maudlin about her again. Beautiful, charming, devastatingly intelligent, everything I’d been saving myself up for. Life, was it strictly necessary for me to be so stupid as to argue with her back then? :sad:

[Kate T]

I think I understand what you are trying to do Julia. If I am correct you are trying to attack a social perception or prejudice (i.e. must be skinny to be attractive) by giving a clear example of an exception to the premise.

I think when doing that though we must be a little careful that we do not then encourage a prejudice against the original premise.

Oh and I'm just not even going to go there about the reinforcement of women as sexual objects.

You can ignore me though. I'm just in a bit of a bitchy mood. All the above pictures of women are no doubt attractive. But then again I think most people are attractive in their own way.

[Nicole Erin]

problem when they start talking bout how sexy comes in many sizes, then the truly obese start thinking they look sexy

[noeleena]

Hi,

What is behind the meaning of sex/y. is a person thrown out because she does not mesure up to a percived males eye's. . If it comes down to how one looks then 3 / 4's of us women would be thrown out. age 30 on. what happens after giveing birth. percived beauty is only face value & its not the whole of the person. real beauty is the whole person ,

Jos & i have seen some lovely pics of women who are /were in thier 50 - 60 's not a young girl of say 16 ,

Yet the beauty she showed in her face was just so lovely it defies words for that. thinking about it i belive she was in her late 70's,

We are all different & the real beauty comes from with in & is given freely, & many of the pics that were painted over 100 to 5 00 years ago show a different view than what is portrayed to day, = the cat walk thats not natural is it & when you read what they have done to them self s its not good, Of cause theres more going on behind the fence - money for one.

Being on a forum of over 2000 women i hear a lot of things concerning this & what it does to confindence self worth self esteem & a host of other details what this does, & some younger women suffer because of this, & one other womens forum in the U k , it becomes very hard .

more so when you have heard & seen what many men think. time for a change in attitude in how women should be, not told how they have to be like .

...noeleena...

[Kate T]

problem when they start talking bout how sexy comes in many sizes, then the truly obese start thinking they look sexy

And that requires education about the detrimental health effects of being obese (or anorexic for that matter). Then I think there is a body image problem if to feel attractive you must have a body type that causes physical illness.

[Kaz]

Obese is obese... anorexic is anorexic... then there is 'normal'... and sexy! It is so easy to have perceived views of the ideal woman... the reality is that we all come in all shapes and sizes.. isn't life great!

[Kelsy]

Julia,

That picture is enough to put my body dysphoria into high gear!
Ahhhh hips - if only!! All women are beautiful nuff said

Kelsy

[Julia_in_Pa]

Amen!!!! Thank you so much for that one Pamela!!


Julia




Here's another one that helped us win a war.

171759

Sandra, That's too funny sis!!


Julia



Me: "Does this make my but look big?"
Friend: "No, not at all."
Me: "Damnit"

OMG Marleena, Bette Page!! Delicious!!


Julia


Don't forget this lady!

Everyone,

I could give a sh&t hat a man thinks is attractive.

I'm a BBW lover. I'm very proud of that.

If there was ever a almost overpowering attraction for me that would be women of size.

I'm 45 years old. I have never dated, made love to or married anyone under a size 16.

The overwhelming majority were size 18 to 24.

Women with curves, women with weight, women with substance.

Crazy good!!


Julia

[Pamela Kay]

Here's my all time favorite Julia, definitely some curves here.

[Babeba]

Thinking of dysmorphia....


Marilyn Monroe was quite thin. You cant look at her number size of the time (12) as the same as what our sizes are, she was more like a modern 4 or 6 (N American sizing). When the Glenbow museum in Calgary, AB had a display of her clothing a few years ago, they had to go buy new child-size mannequins, pad out the hips and chest and stick them on longer mounts because her waist was so small. All these 'Dont worry about being big, thin is ugly!' models are what I would call thin. Their arms are slender, their legs are without cellulite, they have defined elbows... These all just say that it is okay to be fat, so long as your fat is in your breast and your hips.

I actually have always found these sorts of pictures to be more depressing than the obviously unattainable for my body type twiggy types, TBH. At my heaviest (stressful undergrad and a bad car accident = pretty porky, out of shape Babs) I was about a 14 at 5'4"... Not attractive. I still battle limb fat and cellulite, which none of these 'curvy' photos have despite losing a bunch of weight.

Now I know you can dress sexy at any size... And that weight is more relevant to how you FEEL. When I'm smaller, I get sniffly sick less, sleep better, and feel better. I've creeped up from a 4/6 back to an 8 or so... And I don't feel as well now. I'm hitting the gym now, trying to not put processed crap into my body, and cutting back on fast food, cheese and grease. Going to the gym isn't something I am doing to make myself thinner, but to make myself stronger and more fit. My body size is secondary to my feeling of well being, although I'd like to be as proud of my back view as I am of my front view!

[Julia_in_Pa]

@ Babeba,

My first wife was always battling being 5'8" and 300 pounds.
Granted she was not in the best of health but she did not smoke and ate well overall.

My second wife was 5'6" at approx 230 pounds.

I've never dated anyone under a size 16 and never will.

yes I discriminate against thin women but the majority are not in any danger of being alone because of western societies view of thin vs fat.

Believe it that there are many men and women out there that find thin disgusting and worship at the alter of the big and beautiful.

Babeba, I'm not saying a woman needs big boobs, large thighs and a big butt to be attractive even though that is my ideal.
woman.

Just be you and don't buy into the bullsh%t of thin equals attractive because from the people in my camp it squarely does not.


Julia

Pamela,

Your thinking is on the correct path now just add 50 pounds to Raquel and you have a non stoppable woman.



Here's my all time favorite Julia, definitely some curves here.

[Pamela Kay]

Pamela,

Your thinking is on the correct path now just add 50 pounds to Raquel and you have a non stoppable woman.[/QUOTE]

Here you go Julia. I hope I look this good at 70.

[Julia_in_Pa]

Pamela,

Yes!! She's beautiful! There ya go! :O)


Julia

[Babeba]

Here is a good comparison - Camryn Manheim (who is just a gorgeous person and a great actor) next to Jennifer Love Hewitt (whose chest made her one of those people that got pointed to to say, 'look, you shouldn't try to be skinny, curvy people are pretty too!' back in the late 90's).



This is more my point - it's about being healthy and strong in the skin you're in. I honestly don't think the average guy can take a look at a woman and guess her size (and I'm not sure the average CDer could do it, either.) Heck, many women can't figure out others' sizes either. So when you say 'look at Marilyn Monroe, you don't need to be thin to be beautiful!' that's great... but she was thin, too. I remember a conversation with a girl who right after listing about three medical issues she had which have a relationship with obesity (which she definitely had a relationship with) started out the next breath with, 'but Marilyn Monroe was a size 12, so I don't need to worry about that!' I mean, it's good to be whatever fits your body... but there is a point at which delusion seems to set in?? This girl seemed to have absolutely no concept of how her physical body related to her wellbeing, or what her body was for shape, or any of that.

[ReineD]

Let's go back a few more years and see what was interpreted as sexy. Botticelli's Birth of Venus was always a favorite of mine.

Me too. Ever since my teenage years.

Here's an excellent detail of her face:
http://www.ksvoboda.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/botticelli_birth_venus_2.jpg

And the painting:
http://www.artchive.com/artchive/b/botticelli/venus.jpg

[Brynn_A]

I guess I have to look at it from my two sized perspective. A pair of size 3-5 pants or jeans fits ne perfectly, however, dresses I require a 12/14. I look at women like Marilyn and Raquel, not to mention Jennifer Anniston and many others and wish.."IF only." I'm dealt these cards and just gotta play them out. I agree with everyone that ladies with curves can be and are sexy. I have to say that one of my fav ladies is..

[Nicole Erin]

A sexy femme body has a couple aspects - size and curves.

With size, as long as it is not too extreme it is OK. This is for big or small.
With curves, those should be on the sides like hips, not some big ol pot belly hanging down. hip to waist ratio.

With physical beauty on a woman, I am also a believer that if a woman at least tries to look good, it is sexy. I have seen women with less than ideal bodies who are cute cause they present well, then I have seen ones who have "perfect" bodies who are not cute just cause they look so "plain jane"

what I said earlier about truely obese thinking they are sexy, that is like the 300 pounders who wear short shorts and look like slobs but think they are hot.

[Julia_in_Pa]

Without Google I would say that Camryn Manheim is a solid 22 and beautiful.
Jennifer Love Hewitt is disgusting looking.
Walking death.


Julia


Here is a good comparison - Camryn Manheim (who is just a gorgeous person and a great actor) next to Jennifer Love Hewitt (whose chest made her one of those people that got pointed to to say, 'look, you shouldn't try to be skinny, curvy people are pretty too!' back in the late 90's).



This is more my point - it's about being healthy and strong in the skin you're in. I honestly don't think the average guy can take a look at a woman and guess her size (and I'm not sure the average CDer could do it, either.) Heck, many women can't figure out others' sizes either. So when you say 'look at Marilyn Monroe, you don't need to be thin to be beautiful!' that's great... but she was thin, too. I remember a conversation with a girl who right after listing about three medical issues she had which have a relationship with obesity (which she definitely had a relationship with) started out the next breath with, 'but Marilyn Monroe was a size 12, so I don't need to worry about that!' I mean, it's good to be whatever fits your body... but there is a point at which delusion seems to set in?? This girl seemed to have absolutely no concept of how her physical body related to her wellbeing, or what her body was for shape, or any of that.

[Julia_in_Pa]

Brynn,

I have to say I find your example beautiful in the face and horribly ugly in body.

Take her and add 80 pounds and you would be in my camp.


Julia



I guess I have to look at it from my two sized perspective. A pair of size 3-5 pants or jeans fits ne perfectly, however, dresses I require a 12/14. I look at women like Marilyn and Raquel, not to mention Jennifer Anniston and many others and wish.."IF only." I'm dealt these cards and just gotta play them out. I agree with everyone that ladies with curves can be and are sexy. I have to say that one of my fav ladies is..

[Babeba]

With physical beauty on a woman, I am also a believer that if a woman at least tries to look good, it is sexy. I have seen women with less than ideal bodies who are cute cause they present well...


How can you say this, after being all disgusted at the sort of women who go to the gym to try to improve their fitness in your thread in the lounge?

[Traci Elizabeth]

Yep! Fat was in in the 40's and 50's but this is 60 some years later and all those Icon's of the age have gotten breast reductions and have been on one diet after another to get to where I am today (lol).

[Sheren Kelly]

Julie,
I don't understand why you have to insult others to make your point. Those who care about their bodies (eating right and exercising) are as valid as any other. I think you would do better by focusing your energy on those who are anorexic or bilumic (both mental health issues).

And isn't your focus on curvy women as objectifying as those who focus on a small waist?

You may have a personal preference, but you have no standing to determine what is attractive for others.

[Kate T]

yes I discriminate against thin women

People who live in glass houses should be careful about throwing stones.

[Julia_in_Pa]

To Kelly,

It is my personal taste that larger women are beautiful. Kelly you stated "" You may have a personal preference, but you have no standing to determine what is attractive for others""

Western society objectifies thin women as benchmarks of beauty where I find them ugly and sickly looking.

Doesn't then society determine what is attractive for other's Kelly?? Anything outside the considered "norm" would be looked upon as deviant behavour?? Hmmmm?

Society dictates preference for the majority that cannot or will not think for themselves.

Society makes large women feel less than human even when the average size of a woman in the United States is a size 16.

My reaction to thin women is a byproduct and a direct result of my preference just as the majority of societies preference dictates people's reaction to large (fat) women.

Like I've said before Kelly I have neither dated nor married any woman under a size 16 and I never will.

I've met some really nice and kind thin women who wished to date me but I feel absolutely no attraction to them whatsoever due to their body type just as I'm sure many here would have no attraction to large women.

Please don't say that the majority of society does not have an adverse reaction to large women when there are countless stories of discrimination concerning it.

Kelly, I have never said anything about women with a small waist. My ex wife Lorrie was approx 300 lbs at her heaviest standing at 5'8" tall.

Her waist was wide and showcases my preference.

I accept large women of all body shapes as beautiful. I am attracted to those that are large in the rear with large breasts.

Those women can have a thicker waist or a thinner waist it does not matter to me.



@ Adina,

The same I say of you.




Julia

[Jorja]

Remember, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. What one thinks is beautiful, another might think is ugly. This is why we as humans come in all shapes and sizes.

[kimdl93]

Marilyn wasn't toned, but she was really fairly petite. But in my humble opinion, she would have been equally attractive, with tighter abs and more muscle definition.

[ReineD]

Julia, why do you have a preference for heavy women? And if you don't mind my asking, do you prefer women who are at least similar in height as you?

So far in this thread I've only answered to provide a detail of one of my favorite paintings, without writing about my own personal preferences. I can't say that I prefer heavy vs. thin, vs. average. As a teenager, one of my bfs was on the heavy side, but oh man, could he ski! He was actually active and very fit. He was not obese. If I think about it, I'm drawn to people who are fit and who take care of themselves, no matter their body types. But without specifying a weight range, if someone is overly anorexic or obese it is an indication they have issues that need to be dealt with. That said, there are plenty of people who are above or below the average weight range who are not anorexic or obese and who are healthy and fit.

So ... apart from the weight extremes, my attraction is fueled by the person's mind and personality and how much chemistry there is between us no matter their weight. :)

[Sheren Kelly]

To Kelly,...Doesn't then society determine what is attractive for other's ...
...Please don't say that the majority of society does not have an adverse reaction to large women ... I have never said anything about women with a small waist.Julia

If anyone allows society to determine what is attractive for them, they have bigger problems than can be addressed in this forum.

I have been a member here for nearly 2 years, and cannot think of one negative comment thrown at anyone based on their weight, so I don't understand why you feel it necessary to attack anyone who is not round enough for your liking or does not share your preference. We all know there is an obsession in high fashion with thin, but there are also an increasing number of plus size models. My point about the thin waist was that judging anyone on their physical desireability, be they round or thin is objectifying them.

I hope we come here to support one another, not throw insults around.

[Julia_in_Pa]

Reine,

I have a preference for larger women just like others have a preference for thinner people.

There are many nice, thin women out there that have an impressive intellect along with a fantastic personality but if they aren't my body type I just don't pay any attention to them that's all.

Your outer physical self is your calling card whether people like to acknowledge this or not.


@Kelly ,

The only reason why you feel insulted is because your thin.

This doesn't mean your not a nice person but as I always am here I'm just being brutally honest.

I wouldn't notice you out of the crowd due to my preference just like others wouldn't notice me because of whatever preference they have that I do not possess.

Be nice, run along and enjoy your life.


Julia


Julia, why do you have a preference for heavy women? And if you don't mind my asking, do you prefer women who are at least similar in height as you?

So far in this thread I've only answered to provide a detail of one of my favorite paintings, without writing about my own personal preferences. I can't say that I prefer heavy vs. thin, vs. average. As a teenager, one of my bfs was on the heavy side, but oh man, could he ski! He was actually active and very fit. He was not obese. If I think about it, I'm drawn to people who are fit and who take care of themselves, no matter their body types. But without specifying a weight range, if someone is overly anorexic or obese it is an indication they have issues that need to be dealt with. That said, there are plenty of people who are above or below the average weight range who are not anorexic or obese and who are healthy and fit.

So ... apart from the weight extremes, my attraction is fueled by the person's mind and personality and how much chemistry there is between us no matter their weight. :)

[Traci Elizabeth]

OK...I will be the first to say this trite but true saying, "Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder." The saying that "Beauty is only skin deep," I do not believe as the most important beauty of a person is the inside.

[Sheren Kelly]

Be nice, run along and enjoy your life. Julia

I am declining your dismissal.

My comments on your thread have nothing to do with me personally, they were to call out the tone of your post serves to alienate others on this board. When one person claims status at the expense of another, the discussion degenerates into a flame war. That you want to sing the praises of full figure women is your option, but not at the expense of others who through nature or exercise have a different physique.

This is not the only instance I have come across recently. I responded to another who asserted that "there is a reason TS and CD butt heads. CD's are just in it for the fun but do not want to sacrifice anything..." (http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?166351-Transphobe-got-what-was-coming&p=2703006&highlight=#post2703006)

Statements that divide us are as pointless as schoolyard taunts. Hopefully we can all support each other here as equals.

[Julia_in_Pa]

Kelly,

Oh but we are divided. I along with others in my community have nothing in common with you.

I'm divided from you by my biology along with my life experiences and community affiliation .

Your illustrated thread proves the gulf between us that needs to be there.

It doesn't mean that I can't smile, say a few good words then go on about my life just as you will.


Julia

[erika130]

Obese is obese... anorexic is anorexic... then there is 'normal'... and sexy! It is so easy to have perceived views of the ideal woman... the reality is that we all come in all shapes and sizes.. isn't life great!

Exactly! Ok going back to what I think the point of the original post was, sexy/beauty comes in all shapes & sizes & looks, etc, and women & men in general are attracted to people of all shapes & sizes.. Like someone said, beauty (& im sure 'sexiness') is in the eye of the beholder..

[Julia_in_Pa]

Now that Erica I agree with.



Julia

[stacycoral]

Ha Sis, please dont' be cutting down my girl Jennifer, Love ya