when does one croos the line!

[latanya]

i know that i'm a cross dresser?but i am not sure if that's all it is. i have the urge almost all the time to express my fem side! Am i crossing the line to being transgendered? when I'm in fem mode i don't want to be perceived as cross dresser. if i went out as latanya i would want to be as feminine as possible. totally present myself as a woman and would want to be perceived and treated as one. SO have i crossed the line? there is a lot of gray area and im very confused with it all

[RenneB]

Yep it's confusing. The pink line is very foggy and it's width and the journey varies from person to person... Remember what ever you pick, be good at it.

Sorry but that's about the best adivice as I can muster up for now... When the journey's over and I meet with the girl upstairs, I'll let you know what the answer is.... maybe..

Renne.....

[moondog]

Difficult to say. I too want to be fully accepted and treated as a woman when I finally do get the courage to go out fully dressed. Personally I believe the only lines to cross are the lines we make for ourselves.

[Miranda-E]

SO have i crossed the line?

If you have "modes" and don't want to put the dress on and not take it off no mater what the world throws at you, because that's what it takes to survive you haven't crossed the line.

[latanya]

miranda-e please explain!

[carhill2mn]

I am not sure what "line" it is that you are worried about "crossing". There are many of us here who also do not want to be seen as a "man in a dress" when we go out in the general public. We also do our best to emulate what we admire about women. We try to be as feminine and womanly as possible in manner of dress, actions, etc.

Perhaps, you are referring to the "line" where you want to "become a woman" and not just look and act like a woman. That is
another issue entirely and requires a lot of thought, and maybe therapy in order to decide what it is that you want or need.

[ReineD]

Am i crossing the line to being transgendered? when im in fem mode i dont want to be perceived as crossdresser.

The simple answer is, there is no definitive line to cross when it comes to how you wish to present in femme mode. It's more about wanting to retain your male identity when you are not dressed (no matter how you identify or present when you are), vs. wanting to obliterate the male identity altogether.

A crossdresser crosses gender boundaries when he has a desire to wear women's clothes. To cross any gender boundary defines "transgender", therefore as a CDer you are already TG. The majority of CDers who wish to go out in public also do not want to be perceived as a CDing man in a dress and be read. This kinda ruins the experience.

Are you asking if it is natural that you should discover it is more than just fetish dressing for you and now you are beginning to feel a degree of feminine identity when you do dress? Yes it is. This is the natural progression of the CDing, but it does not mean that you wish to be a woman full time, take hormones, have sex reassignment and facial feminization surgeries.

You'll find that a large number of CDers realize in time they are gender fluid, unlike transsexuals who do believe they are strictly women internally. All the time.

[Cindi Johnson]

You probably crossed that line when you were born. Maybe even nine months before then. After that, you're just along for the ride.

[Miranda-E]

You say "if i went out as latanya". If you were transgender and not a crossdresser there would be no "going out as latanya" you'd be latanya. Latanya wouldn't be a costume, instead your legal name would be the mask. No spouse, family, friends, job, or court would keep you from living it.

[abigailf]

Keep exploring yourself and don't hold back, you will always learn new things. Always try to be accepting of yourself. Eventually, how others perceive you becomes less important than how you perceive yourself.

I remember when I liked to cross dress. I would come home and nobody was here I would dress up in whatever I had. Now for me, cross dressing is when I go out dressed like a guy (which I rarely do anymore) and I don't like it much. It was a complete reversal of perspective.

So now, I consider myself of two minds. The default which is Abigail, a girl with some very (not so unique) physical traits. I get dressed, do my makeup and whatever, I go out and you can perceive me as you wish and I don't really care. But I am all girl.

Then there is the other me who is a transsexual and proud of it. I want the world to know I am trans and I want the world to know that we are out there and that we are not going away.

Keep asking questions..

[Karren H]

I just keep moving the line... Engineers are good at that.

[Alice Torn]

Karren, Would that be moving the line in ice hockey!?

[kimdl93]

I thought Reine covered the subject pretty succinctly. All I can add to this is that over the years, the progression she describes makes it very hard to say "I am __________". Its very possible that you'll have a different opinion in 2, 5 or 15 years than you have today. That doesn't mean there's any inevitable outcome. We all change with maturity and experience.

So, I most assuredly would define myself - at least as far as gender identification is concerned - differently than I might have 15 years ago. We change, and our view of what's possible changes. Maybe we move the lines a bit, as Karren suggested above.

[sarahcsc]

Hi there Latanya,

I;ve been reading up (alot) about crossdressing ever since I came unto the forum and more so with my recent breakup. One of the textbooks mentioned very nicely, that the difference between a tranvestite and a transexual, is that a transvestite views their genitalia as an organ of pleasure while the transexual views their genitalia as an organ of disgust. A transvestite also have normal (or heightened) libido while the transexual have low libido because they often struggle with body image. A transexual often have accompanying anxiety and depressive symptoms because they find it hard to acecpt their bodies hence they don't feel physically appealing unless they are dressed in women clothes.

I guess everybody gets confused from time to time but I just go by this simple guideline. I don't think I want to remove my external genitalia and I am quite happy being a transvestite despite my ongoing, and increasing urges to dress. There are lot of full time dressers (ie. dressed up 24/7) here on the forum and maybe they can shed some light on the issue. =)

Hope this helps.

[Badtranny]

If you have "modes" and don't want to put the dress on and not take it off no mater what the world throws at you, because that's what it takes to survive you haven't crossed the line.

Yes exactly. Trans people don't have these "modes". I remember when I first found this site and started experimenting with cross dressing I was sooo concerned about not feeling fem enough like so many of the gals here talk about. I would have sworn I was a gay cross dresser because I'd always been gay of course and I'd recently discovered the cross dressing thing and it was so fun to dress up and take pictures. I was extremely naive just a few years ago and I honestly didn't know my childhood wish of being a girl was even possible. I thought CD'ng was the closest I could get and I had never even considered that until I found this site. I lurked here for probably 6 months reading hundreds of posts and I was very confused about how I was feeling about all of it.

I never had the male side or female side that they talk about and after I finally joined and started discussing things, I started to wonder if I even belonged here. I went through a period of feeling so inferior to the veteran cross dressers because I could barely comprehend what they were talking about and that inferiority was the main topic when I finally started therapy. I didn't think I was really TS because I didn't have those same feelings they were talking about. I truly thought it was supposed to be some kind of progression. The part time girls would become full time and then they would become TS. If I didn't grow up cross dressing, then how could I possibly be a TS? Of course I'm much older and more experienced in these matters now. ;-)

In answer to your question (finally), If you talk about your "fem side" in the 3rd person, you're very likely not a transsexual. Be thankful and enjoy it.

[RADER]

I just keep moving the line... Engineers are good at that.

Karren; The line is kept moving by a Millwrights, and they are Carpenters.
The Engineers just show where the line should be built.
Rader

[Annaliese2010]

...when I'm in fem mode i don't want to be perceived as cross dresser...

I get that, its confusing. Even more so when you don't want or need to be fem All the time but when you Are fem you are so 100% yet..don't need others to inform you of what you Know is a natural fact true about you. It's like..take it or leave it... here I AM.

[NathalieX66]

The way I see it, being a crossdresser is kind of like being bi-curious. Being bi-curious doesn't really mean you're gay, though you may not have confirmed to yourself that you are bisexual.

Once you start building your life around expressing yourself as the other gender, the gender that you are not born with....you might be transgender ( as comedian Jeff Foxworthy says about rednecks). ..... that's the way I put it.

Sex columnist Dan Savage (who's gay, btw) said that what people often seek is not deviation, but variation. I say this: you only live once. Find yourself. Don't leave any regrets while you are on your deathbed.

The term transgender is too broad in it's definition. I know that some transsexuals complain about crossdressers using the term transgender because they think it takes away their cause , but the fact is transsexuals have their own label....it's transsexual. Maybe they don't like the sound of the word, but it is what it is.

[KellyJameson]

If cross the line means to "become transgendered" and you feel panic as if you have taken a drug and are now addicted or have opened pandoras box and now are in the grip of forces beyond your control, I would be inclined to say that you cannot make yourself transgendered as much as discover that you are and for some this is discovered when they crossdress. Crossdressing is a path to self discovery and what you learn will be unique to you even though many others will have had or are having similar experiences to your own.

Try to not fear what changes the future may bring but stay in the moment because that is the only place life really takes place. You will know what to do in the future when it arrives , You are stronger than you think .

[karenlong]

i think just saying that you want to present as a female when dressed, just makes me think you want to look as good as possible, while im sure most of us want to pass, lots cant, hardly any, but there are a few out there that want to just sorta fem but not totally female when out and thats their business, when i go out i want look as good as i can, doesent mean anything but you want to look like you want to look

[Cheryl T]

If you've crossed that imaginary line, then you're standing next to me and many others.
I dread the possibility that others see me as anything but a woman when I'm out. I don't "act" feminine, I am feminine.

[Marleena]

If cross the line means to "become transgendered" and you feel panic as if you have taken a drug and are now addicted or have opened pandoras box and now are in the grip of forces beyond your control, I would be inclined to say that you cannot make yourself transgendered as much as discover that you are and for some this is discovered when they crossdress. Crossdressing is a path to self discovery and what you learn will be unique to you even though many others will have had or are having similar experiences to your own.

Try to not fear what changes the future may bring but stay in the moment because that is the only place life really takes place. You will know what to do in the future when it arrives , You are stronger than you think .

Kelly has said it quite well. I think it's like a plane flight but we all arrive at different destinations.

It really is a journey and you need to unravel years of programming that told you to be a guy and nothing else. In my case I have decades of programming to undo.:) Put your seatbelt on and take your flight.:)

[JohnH]

Like Melissa Hobbes (badtranny) I do not have distinct "male mode" and "female mode". Rather, I see myself as being a two-spirited individual like a Native American shaman. Most of the time I wear standard male clothing (except in the summer when I wear a denim skirt instead of shorts and painted toenails with otherwise standard male clothing). I do have a femme haircut, wear lipstick, and have breasts. Now on the other hand - the pitch of my speaking voice is on the order of Joe Friday of Dragnet, and my singing voice is basso profundo. When I wake up in the morning I can do a very good rendition of the extremely low Russian basses.

Nobody in the church choir or the community chorus has given me any grief. It's a little hard to call a basso a sissy.

I do like to dress up occasionally in a dress, hose, and heels. I am transgendered as I am taking M2F hormones. The medication has done wonders to lift me out of my suicidal depression I have had for decades.

I am going to retain my masculine name John and will not change it to Johanna. So I have changed my signature block to reflect that fact.

John

[swiss_susan]

Latanya,

Essentially there is no line. You are who you are and that's a wonderful person. I think what your really asking about is a label, and for me those don't really matter. When you come down to it most of our forum members are "crossdressers" and just look at the range of opinions we all seem to have about what we do and how its labeled. At then end of the day ask yourself this, Are you happy with who you are, and if not what can YOU do to make YOU feel better about YOURSELF.

And remember each one of us is unique, so the only one who can really answer your question is YOU :)

Love Susan