Would you ever tell employers that you cross dress?

[KlaireLarnia]

Given that a lot of people are less bothered by men wearing women's clothes (to various degrees), if you where to change job would you ever tell your new employer that you crossdress and ask if they would object you you wearing female clothing to work - even if in a limited form?

I.e: You are offered a job and accept it. Would you then say to that employer something like: Just want to be upfront, at times I dress in more feminine clothing and often carry a women's bag. Do you have any objections if I turned up to work in appropriate clothing but wore female trousers/shoes/had a shoulder bag at times (or a mixture of male/female clothing for example)? Possibly even go as far as to say I am trying to understand myself and this is part of that and it would help me if I could do this.


I only ask this as with my recent ventures, I sit here (and at work) and often wish that I could tell them what I do so I could bring in a large shoulder bag rather than my male ruck-sack or wear female jeans or trainers to work (we only wear business attire in the office if we have clients in - otherwise it is jeans and t-shirts for us). But my bosses would most likely have a mental at me if I even asked them this now after being there around 2 years, as they are not the sort of people you can be open with and are purely focuses on their business and running it. But part of me wishes I had said something when I accepted the job as the people I work with (13 of us in the office) would not care. We had an openly homosexual guy work with us for 6 months and his dress sense was very female (including carrying shoulder bags) and no-one cared or was bothered. So I sometimes wonder if this would apply to someone like me.

Just wondering what others think or if anyone has actually done this. And I am aiming this at people who purely crossdress, not those who are or would consider some sort of gender realignment and do this as part of having to live as a female full time in run up to this, as I think employers would be more tolerant and understanding of this - over someone who dresses purely because they like/want to.

K

[Vickie_CDTV]

As my old girlfriend says, anything that can be used against you in life probably will be. Knowing you dress, even strictly outside of work, can only work against you in the eyes of an employer. In these hard times where jobs are scarce and most folks can be easily replaced, I wouldn't risk my job.

[DAVIDA]

Well, in my case, it was the employer that didn't tell the employees.:heehee:

[Karren H]

I think many at work know. My department VP warned me that if I showed up at work wearing zebra heels like one the girls in another department that he wouldn't be happy. Lol. Told him all my heels were weren't that wild.

[Tanya C]

Over the years I've never told any of my clients or employers about my cding. I don't want to give anyone an excuse to be unhappy with my service.
In a perfect world I might consider it. But does this look like a perfect world?

[kristinacd55]

I have a very good friend who's dealing with this issue right now. She plans on transitioning and has told her family and this is the next step. I know currently it's a huge issue. As far as me, I just started driving a school bus recently and have definitely thought about it as well. The usual concern is will there be a justification by them to making me lose my job? Could be something down the line to add to my being out in public.

[Rebecca W.]

No, I would never tell my current employer. I do enjoy under dressing and that is a thrill because I am happy and only I know what is going on under the drab, boring clothing. I believe that every person has to understand their work enviroment very carefully and check on any laws that will provide you with employment security. Or in other words, harrasment or gender discrimination. My state is providing more and more protection for everyone regardless of your gender or the need to dress as the opposite sex. Just be informed and protected before making any statement to your employer.

Rebecca

P.S. We are all here to support anyone who asks.:)

[Krististeph]

I've consider several times finding an employer in the LGBT realm, not so much so i could CD at work, but so it would not particularly matter. it would need to be in a manner that did not affect affect the business adversely, if i ever did CD at work.

[Kate Simmons]

It depends on the employer. Some are progressive enough to not care unless it affects the quality of your work somehow, or if working with the public how the clientele react.:)

[Kristy_K]

I think it also depends on what you wear to work and where you work. Once your employer knows than your coworkers also knows. Once it is out it can't be undone. And it can changes people's opinion's of you as a person. Sometimes this is good and sometimes it is bad. It isn't easy to be yourself at times but it is a lot of fun.

Hugs,
Kristy

[shyselina]

I have sat down with my HR rep and she told me they would have no problem with me dressing as a woman for work.. She is very helpful and supportive if and when I make that leap.

[KlaireLarnia]

Part of my reasoning for asking is that I am considering my career at the moment and while I love the place I work - various things are making me wonder if I want to be there too much longer and heading into my 40's in the next few years I probably do not have that many career moves left in real terms.

This is why I wonder about work and dressing. At work I do think about it and get very very down at times (and only one person who I trust explicitly knows why I get down). While these drops are often short lived I have them. I am even seeing my gp this week (in part) to help me keep my mind straight so these swings are not as bad as they are now - which again pains me as I would rather tell everyone what I do and who I really am so I could just get on and act natural in work. But the latter is not going to happen.

If I was able to find a suitable new job I wondered if it would be possible or safe to be open about who I am. Using my example above the guy who worked with us was very open on who he was and how he dressed. Only twice was he asked to tone it down a bit by the boss which is fair enough. So I sit here and wonder, if I was honest - what would it do for me. Would it help or hinder me. If I was to turn up in female trousers, coat and shoulder bag would anyone really care enough - or would I be singled out for ridicule and abuse. Rhetorical questions which no one can answer but important ones.

I am pushing the boundaries of what I can and will do each week now. Yesterday was the shoulder bag. Tomorrow I will be doing a 2-3 mile walk home with a much bigger and obvious one (which will be in my male bag while at work and which I will take out when I am dropped off by a colleague in the town where I live). I will take out the shoulder bag, fold my male bag into it and walk home with it over my shoulder. This is me testing both myself and the reaction of others who I pass. Trying to understand what I am comfortable with and can take. Due to the roads around where I live not being the... best... in the world 5 mins from home I will swap the bags back over as a precaution.

If I could get away with not needing the male bag in the first place at work, or at any other time it would be such a big step and bonus. A way of giving a little freedom without compromising who I am and what I want. This is why I wonder of a career change. Would that give me that little extra room? A way to offer me another aveune to what I see as normality.

Thanks for the responsese they are kind of what I expected and it does give me a lot to think about.

K

[Melissa Cross]

As much as I want my family and friends to know about my CDing, I have no desire to tell my employer about it. We all know about work gossip and, for me, it's a personal issue that is none of my employers business.

I don't really have a strong desire to go to work en femme. I work for a large employer and all the issues regarding rest room use etc. would come up and I would rather not deal with that in terms of my employment.

[KlaireLarnia]

As much as I want my family and friends to know about my CDing, I have no desire to tell my employer about it. We all know about work gossip and, for me, it's a personal issue that is none of my employers business.

I don't really have a strong desire to go to work en femme. I work for a large employer and all the issues regarding rest room use etc. would come up and I would rather not deal with that in terms of my employment.

In my case I am not looking at going En Femme. More my normal mix of the two. Trousers, looking obviously male in the face but with more feminine clothes on. So trousers, decent shoes (or trainers as it would be now) and possibly a collared t-shirt or blouse and carrying a female bag rather than a male one. Something where I look decent, fit in with the dress code but still am obviously male. So the changing room issues etc would never come up. Working for a small employer helps in that respect.

[barbie lanai]

I'm retired and underdress everyday now. And in drab mode wear women's jeans sneakers and pink toed socks. Sometimes the wife even lets me wear a female top out, if not too female looking. So if I were working would probably wear the same in drab, but not mention crossdressing to an employer.

[Jenniferathome]

Not a chance. First,it is none of thei business what I do in my private life. And second, I think people are far less tolerant than you think. While on the street, people generally do not care, when in a work setting,things are quite different. Your career path would be nil. I happen to now live in a state, Idaho, where you can be fired for being gay, lesbian, or transgendered. There are other states as well where there are no protections. No,the business world I snot ready for crossdressers.

[KlaireLarnia]

[QUOTE=Jenniferathome;2735883 I happen to now live in a state, Idaho, where you can be fired for being gay, lesbian, or transgendered. There are other states as well where there are no protections. No,the business world is not ready for crossdressers.[/QUOTE]

Sorry, you can be fired for being gay etc? Excuse me? I am amazed that there are places like that in the USA. If that where to happen over here all hell would break loose and the employer would get in deep trouble (if it where proved which is another matter all together I accept). I understand that laws can vary from state to state in the USA, but even so I am surpised there is no (federal?) law that stops this sort of thing irrespective of the position of a given state.

I understand that is it way easier to ignore a stranger in the street than someone you see regularly or work with - fully understand and respect this. I know people in the UK where I am who are transgenderedand hit a few issues initially when they had to go full time female as part of their preparation before the surgery. They both said while their employers where initially uneasy they accepted it and all was fine after a couple of weeks as people where told and understood. But my side is very different and it is more about being who I am and expressing myself as I feel I should be able to. Are there any people in the UK who have told their employers and gone to work in (even partial) female clothing? I wonder if the UK has the same mentality as the USA or not...

K

[Marleena]

Here is a map of the U.S. showing states with transgender rights in place for employment. The southern U.S. states being the least supportive.

http://motherjones.com/mojo/2011/04/transgender-lgbt-employment-map

[johanna.kitten]

Klarie,

I've outed myself at work and I'm in IT (London, UK). I got it in my contract that I can dress however I like, it
only has to be smart. I was not up front with them when I started but I started out wearing more and more women's
at work and now I wear almost only women's but I do kinda mix a little bit at times. There are two co-workers that has
opinions (one of them more than the other...) But I got support from head of HR, CEO, CTO and head of Professional
Services. Having said that, I do go drabs when I got meetings with customers and sales people. I've also shown them
pictures of me dressed a little bit more extreme and we all had a good laugh at it. They also know I'd like to embark on
my transition, but they never said if they would approve of this or not. I'll find out soon enough as I am awaiting my
first delivery of hormones.

/Johanna

[AndrewJenny]

I work in the midwest in a highly technical field. A lot of the big employers are pretty good about TS employees who have proven themselves with a good track record of quality work. I think this is part fear of bad press and part business sense: a lot of these companies live and die on the efforts of their engineers, researchers, etc. and it just doesn't pay to lose someone with the knowledge and experience needed to innovate.

However, everyone I know who is "out" at work has a medical diagnosis and is actively pursuing gender reassignment. There's a big difference between this and "I like to wear women's clothes but am still a man." It's stupid that employers don't let us CD, given the emotional stress it causes to have to hide it (of course, it's also stupid that I have to work a 9-5 schedule when I have shown time and again that my best work is in 3-4 day marathons with no sleep, followed by a few days off). But I think that's still the way it is.

[Ava Tryptyk]

I don't think I would do something like that - if I am working I would like CD-related stuff to be separate from the work environment.

[jsunic_1978]

Everybody will get welfare and ssi disability at some point just being who they are!! Let the rich get richer, all fine by me :)

[KlaireLarnia]

I don't think I would do something like that - if I am working I would like CD-related stuff to be separate from the work environment.

I used to think like this but recent times and experiences have changed this - or perhaps I am reaching the point where I am no longer that bothered by how others perceive me as long as I am given respect where needed.

As I am not a TS or have any desires in this area, my dressing is purely for personal reasons. And while some time ago I would not have wanted it out in the open, these days I am less concerned. I have have been out in public with female clothes and shoes on. Had a lengthly, intelligent conversation in public on a train with a gentleman while in 3inch heeled ankle boots, female t-shirt and carrying a large shoulder bag (even going into it with him beside me to get my mobile phone out to check something we where talking about) - I have come to realise that most people are not overly bothered.

As long as I do not tread on my wife's metaphoric toes or do something she takes major umbridge to I am okay. It has taken me just under 5 painful and sometimes exceptionally lonely and unhappy times to get to where I am now. To reach the point where I finally understand and accept myself and the balance between the two personalities within me that make me whole.

I am by nature the sort of person you either get on very well with, or hate with a passion. I have been told by previous bosses I have an attitude problem. While I agree I have an attitude, it's not a problem for me - just for those who don't understand or like it. Dressing is starting to be seen this way for me. I am who I am , I am what I am. Why should I be forced into a box that does not fit me?

MY mind is currently asking - why can't you have both (to a degree)? Why shouldn't I walk in with a shoulder bag and not a rucksack. Why can't I walk around a supermarket in heeled boots. Why can't I wear a wider selection of clothes or softer looking styles? Perhaps I am looking for a balance of private, public and work life. There may be no balance to be had - but maybe there is and I am grateful for the insights I have been given, even though they are not as encouraging as I may have hoped.

[ArleneRaquel]

Being retired I might tell them Now, in person, enfemme :heehee:

[Richelle423]

If I ever told anybody they would'nt believe me anyway.I would never tell an employer for fear of losing my job.It's none of their business anyway.We girls are not all there yet.

[RenneB]

My last positions were 'at will - no cause'. Which means you serve at the pleasure of the boss. One day, you whistle the wrong way and you're out the next. So now being involuntary retired I get dress when everyone else is at work and I'm in the home office....

Renne.....

[Talldrinkofwater]

In situations where you're work contract is "at will" I'm pretty sure this is a terrible idea. Even though there are certain transgender rights in my state, I'm fuzzy on if this would translate to someone still identifying as male.
I made a horrible mistake by showing up to a Halloween party last year that I thought would be a more intimate setting among trusting friends. I dressed a little too well (so much that my best friend didn't recognize me from two feet away)
That was when I noticed about a handful of people from work. One of them took a number of photos and showed them to everyone the next day.
I was pretty much outed at work from my own stupidity of going too far to have a good time. No one would stand anywhere near me for the next week. My hours were cut in half and the ones that remained were close at night, then open the next morning where I only had less than five hours before shifts. I knew what was happening, but ended up getting fired for a first offense of being ten minutes late one morning.
As a minimum wage job I wasn't destroyed, but as a newer college grad who is having a lot of trouble finding a career, I'm really scared that this will affect me with references and such. I've already been turned away for multiple part time jobs. I'm really in a fix right now and getting pretty stressed.

-m

[Kathy_G]

No, No, No, No, NO!

I don't know about the US, but here in the Uk if one even dared suggest they were a CD to an employer they'd be "out on their ear"' before they could say 'pantihose'. The average employer does not understand such things. You would be declared a 'poof' and (hey) we don't want such people working here. We can find a straight person to do that job.

Sad, Yes, but that's how it goes. So-called 'normal' people do not understand us. They see any man wishing to wear a skirt as an abhoration. So, NO. don't go there. If you want to keep your job, stay in the closet.

One day it may change. But until that day arrives, don't push the boat out. You will only regret it.

[Sandra]

Sorry Kathy but I disagree. My SO came out at work as a cder, at the time she was in denial about actually being TS, she left that job as they were offering redundancy and she wanted a change.

We was chatting about where I worked at the time at a college for young people with autism and I said that they were recruiting, she asked me to ask the boss lady if it would be worth Nigella applying. I spoke to her and the reply I got was " I don't care what anyone wears so long as they can do the job. Nigella applied and got the job as Nigella and she has been there 5 years now. She came out there as TS and they have been really helpful, so not every employer in the UK is the same.

[ReineD]

Klaire, what type of work environment is it and what is the average age of your co-workers? Do you deal with the public? Do you work with a mix of men and women or is it predominately men? Do you have a "creatives" type of job such as advertising or the music industry, or is it a more conservative area such as pharmaceuticals or engine building or something? :p

Also, what is the tolerance level of alternative gender and sexuality in your area? Do you live in a major city or a small town? How do the people you know (neighbors, family, etc) feel about CDing in general?

I think there are many factors that might influence the decision to come out at work. For example, an ad agency in San Francisco or a fashion house in London might be more open to it than a mechanic's garage in a small town somewhere.

[GaleWarning]

It's a funny thing, but the Ministry of Education would probably not be impressed. They can't even deal with bullying in schools.
So, no.

[giuseppina]

Absolutely not. It's none of their business. While Canadians are a bit more liberal than other countries, it isn't worth the risk IMHO. Sure, we have antidiscrimination laws in place here, but it is fairly easy to work around them by compiling a file of alleged wrongdoing relating to on-the-job performance.

[Elana]

I've always considered telling my current employer, but i wasnt sure how'd they'd react.

Possibly tell a future employer, especially if i found a job in San Francisco itself.

[Marie-Elise]

Interesting question from the original poster. After reading through the comments, I thin the only bit I can add is this:

I would not let a new employer know about my crossdressing but I would not be afraid if they found out. I am who I am and, if I was hired, it is because I can deliver what they need. Now, if they were to find out I would not be worried about it. I am who I am and if they liked me before they found out, as far as work is concerned, they should continue.

Now, in the real world, I don't think that last sentence is true. People in the real world have all kinds of prejudices.

I would leave crossdressing out of my work space because it does not add/contribute anything to the work.

[KlaireLarnia]

Klaire, what type of work environment is it and what is the average age of your co-workers? Do you deal with the public? Do you work with a mix of men and women or is it predominately men? Do you have a "creatives" type of job such as advertising or the music industry, or is it a more conservative area such as pharmaceuticals or engine building or something? :p

Also, what is the tolerance level of alternative gender and sexuality in your area? Do you live in a major city or a small town? How do the people you know (neighbors, family, etc) feel about CDing in general?

I think there are many factors that might influence the decision to come out at work. For example, an ad agency in San Francisco or a fashion house in London might be more open to it than a mechanic's garage in a small town somewhere.

I work in a small firm of of 20ish people (but only 14 of them are in my office). We dealing with part of the UK Motor Insurance industry. My work is telephone based so only those I work with generally see me. Occasionally I attend court cases I am directly involved in - these are always in male business dress but I often travel in my male/female mix and eat in the hotels in the same clothing mix. So there is no "public" face to us, it is all verbal as it where. The only public side is the occasional client visit to the office. I used to be the only male there, but now we are split pretty evenly between men and women. Age range is also mixed from mid 20's to mid 50's

With regards to where I live. Average UK town and population mix. The area I live in is not the best admittedly but walk 5 mins down the road and it is a lot better. My street is not the sort of place you would go for a walk down the street dressed en femme as people like to say - if the wrong people saw you, you would get serious verbal abuse at best. Sensible covered mix does go unnoticed. I.e female jeans and trainers and anything else covered in male clothes. I posted something yesterday about my using a woman's shoulder bag for the first time and mentioned about the area I live in then.

Not many people know what I do but this year I am resolved to tell a select few as I need to broach the issue with my daughter this year really as well and she will eventually tell our closest friends and family - so I will get there first to protect both her and me. My wife is FULLY aware of everything I do and have female wise. I hide nothing from her and live within rules she sets in the house.

With my considering my work position and how my dressing may or may not affect it, I am also looking at the future and what else it could affect - like friends/family etc. What I want from this is shifting quite a lot from 5 years ago for example, and I have a choice of moving with the shift and being able to manage it or try and repress it and slip into depression. I am trying to do the former as I think it is the right move.

[Kathy_G]

Hi, Sandra.

I appreciate your comments. And I am glad that Nigella has found her rightful place in society. But I was thinking of the 'average' employer in a typical industrial or commercial environment. I very much doubt whether Nigel (Nigella), Stephen (Stephanie) or Tony (Toni) would be welcomed as a regular member of any team. "He's a weirdo! He's gonna upset everybody! Get rid of him. We don't need that sort of person here. God! He's wearing a skirt and heels! Can you imagine what he's going to do to our existing staff?" No, men are destined to be men, and women are women. And ne'er the twain shall meet. We can't win. We are not understood. We are out on a limb, and the average person on the street even in 2012 (let alone an employer) cannot accept anyone who is 'different'.

Thankfully I am now retired, so the problem does not arise in my case. But I would have loved to walk into my office in a pencil skirt and be accepted.

[VanIsle]

I dress for fun, and to relax. These two things are directly at odds with going to work, so no, I would never tell, nor do it.

[NathalieX66]

Nope.

My parents are another story.
S**t is going to hit the fan in a couple of days, and I will let y'all know how it goes.
To make a long story short: they gave me the Beatles 12disc box set,and my step mom want copies. I sent a couple of CDs, and slipped in one of the more tame photos (me at Target) inside the case. When my folks hear the song Get Back, they'll figure it out. There is no turning back now.

[KlaireLarnia]

Thankfully I am now retired, so the problem does not arise in my case. But I would have loved to walk into my office in a pencil skirt and be accepted.

That is one of the things... When I say limited I mean limited. I do not wear skirts or dresses ever. They are not something I have the need or desire for. That too me is a step too far. I wear female clothes that (with exception of underwear) are what I would wear normally. Trousers, t-shirts, jumpers, shoes etc - just female versions. So for me the idea is simply to wear female versions of what I would normally wear any other day.

There is a difference in my eyes. I would never think or dream of turning up in full female clothes and I never wear wigs/make-up again that is a step beyond what I actually want out of my dressing.

K

[Helen Grandeis]

My wife has zero tolerance. She would remove cross dressing from every neuron of my brain if she could. Therefore, work is a moot point.
-
However, if my wife and I were to go our separate ways (I get kicked to the curb) and my cross dressing were to blossom again, I think it would be publicly tolerated if I eased them into it gradually and dressed tastefully and professionally.
-
I am in a 20,000 employee company and have no need to meet the public. There might well be much talking behind my back; however, I envision my coworkers treating me with kindness and respect.
-
Best wishes,
Helen

[ReineD]

Not many people know what I do but this year I am resolved to tell a select few as I need to broach the issue with my daughter this year really as well and she will eventually tell our closest friends and family - so I will get there first to protect both her and me. My wife is FULLY aware of everything I do and have female wise. I hide nothing from her and live within rules she sets in the house.

With my considering my work position and how my dressing may or may not affect it, I am also looking at the future and what else it could affect - like friends/family etc. What I want from this is shifting quite a lot from 5 years ago for example, and I have a choice of moving with the shift and being able to manage it or try and repress it and slip into depression. I am trying to do the former as I think it is the right move.

Based on what you describe, I would come out to select friends and your daughter first. If the attitude about the CDing is conservative in your community, you can well expect that some of the people you work with (perhaps even your employer) will also share some of these attitudes. If it is a small firm, chances are they do not have an HR (Human Resources) department with established policies regarding transgendered individuals? If this is the case, your coming out may well leave you out of a job. It may not, but how much are you willing to risk this?

If coming out at work is important to you, I'd begin doing some research and looking for employment in larger companies who are known to have equal opportunity policies regarding transgenders. But a word of caution ... some companies are equipped to handle employees who are transitioning, but it is more difficult for people who present a mixed gender or who switch back and forth, so it may be worth your while to talk to an attorney in your area who is familiar with UK labor laws and practices.

[Debb]

Once upon a time, I exercised poor judgment and confided in my only co-worker that I dressed femme on occasion. She's gay and quite open, so I thought it'd be safe ... but honestly, I suspect she complained to our employer.

I too work in an at-will profession.

I was let go very soon after my confession; my co-worker treated me differently beginning the moment after my confession to her. I suspect, but there's nothing I could do.

Based on that, I wouldn't suggest outing yourself at work.

Now, to address the issue of femme clothing ... people will notice. I wear femme jeans most of the time, and I am quite certain folks notice, but they don't say anything. A time or two, I've forgotten to remove my nail polish, and it's been noticed and commented on ... no ill consequences, though.

[Michelle2008]

I came out at work about a year ago and my on-the-job-transition was not too bad. I've had the same job for many years and have had the same work friends also for many years. Many of those work friends knew I was TG and encouraged me to come out at work b/c they knew I really wanted to. I was really nervous at first but my friends were great and huddled around me until I got my confidence in the work place. Management was supportive too. I got a letter from my doctor and from a psychologist I had seen for 7 years confirming I was TG so all my legal bases were covered. I know for a fact that some at my work still gossip and mock me behind my back but mostly it has been a positive experience for me. I always make sure my attire is appropriate for the work place and I use a family/disabled bathroom which seems to help show others I am being respectful.

I feel very lucky to have such a positive experience and know others aren't so lucky. I am much happier in my life and have no regrets for coming out at work. Now, my family situation is completely different and not so positive....but that is for a different thread.

Michelle

[AndrewJenny]

So much of it depends on the individuals in charge. Some will be okay with their own gender, and others won't. If they aren't, they will feel lots of anxiety about what you are doing because of their own conflicts. This can really determine how they react, and it can be very unpredictable.

You can never tell how someone is going to act when their own sense of identity is threatened. And I've noticed that people who tend to act out their psychological conflicts on others find their way into authority more often than not.

[wearingtanpantyhose]

Crossdressing? No. If you are transitioning, that's a different story... or at least it is right now. Hopefully someday it won't matter.

[Eryn]

an ad agency in San Francisco or a fashion house in London might be more open to it than a mechanic's garage in a small town somewhere.

I can think of one exception to this. Back in the 1960s there was a farming town of 2000 people or so near the place where I was growing up. There was a man there who (gasp!) wore dresses. He was the first TG person I had ever knowingly encountered. His dressing was well known and the local thrift shop would even set aside large-size dresses for him when they came in. You'd think that in a conservative 1960s rural community that a CDer would catch a lot of heat, but this one didn't. The reason was that he was the best d**n Diesel mechanic for over 100 miles and nobody was going to be responsible for losing his expertise!

Funny how reasonable people can be if it is in their self-interest!

OTOH, I now live in a state where TG rights are fairly well protected, but I would never come out to my employer. It would just be a complication that I don't need.

[t-girlxsophie]

My Immediate bosses and most colleagues know,more by accident than design,6 years it's been out,but there has been absolutely no Issues and still I'm here,probably because I don't shove it in their faces,think pitching up dressed would be a whole different ball game,don't think customers would be too pleased either.but I wouldn't think my employer (in UK) would have a leg to stand on if they tried to boot me out because I dressed away from work

Sophie

[ReineD]

Funny how reasonable people can be if it is in their self-interest!

So the moral of the story is, if you're indispensable you can do what you want? I buy that. :)

[KlaireLarnia]

Thanks for the replies. I have no real intention of letting anyone else where I work know what I do bar the one person who I have told (and in the last year I am 100% she has not told anyone or I suspect I may have spotted adverse reactions from some people).

I was more thinking if I was to change job down the line at some point would it be an option. I.e fresh start, use it as a chance to me more open and who I want to be. I fully understand the risks and at this point in time would not take them at all. I pretty much expected the replies I got on the whole as I am not transitioning or have any intention of going down that route I thought it would be a bad idea - and on the whole it seems most would agree.

Sometimes you need to look in the face of defeat in order to make sure you do not actually loose something.

K

[JessicaM1985]

I agree that if it's just crossdressing, keep it to yourself and underdress. However, if you plan to transition and your papers still I.d. you as male, then you need to talk to H.R. and be honest.

I find that if you keep the cding at work to a tasteful amount and well within company dress guidelines, you should be fine. Of course here in cali, we do have better laws protecting transgenders than some places, so be careful and cautious. If you're not sure, don't do it.

Also keep in mind that corporate life discourages individuality, hence professional attire. Go to any fast food place and the G.G.s will be wearing essentially the same kind of shirts and tees as the guys. Same thing at walmart. They want you thinking of the company and not yourself, hence where uniforms come in. The office attire imo, is a uniform, albeit more diverse in nature. Wear the uniform, earn the paycheck, then go home and wear whatever you want. I'd love to be able to wear a blouse and skirt to work, but people's attitudes have not advanced so far as to be universally ok with it.

I myself am TS, but if I was asked to dress a certain way (outside the realm of sexual mind you) to earn my pay, then I would have to grin and bear it, then go home and go back to being Jessica. Now once my papers say I'm female, then they wouldn't care and expect me to dress female. Which I'd be happy to oblige.

[Vickie_CDTV]

Even if one works in an at-will state or locality that also has trans employment protections, it is still one's burden to prove it. Unless the employer is a total moron and admits that is why they fired you, it is almost impossible to prove.

[Renee W]

As much as I would like to extend my CDing to another venue such as work, I do not have the guts to be the ground-breaker. Now if someone else was to be the first, maybe after a while I would feel comfortable enough to do it myself.

[Daphne Renee]

I would love to.. I do however work directly with the public so I am reasonably certain that would be frowned upon epsecially since I live in the south. I like to keep things somewhat private anyhow. The older I get though the less I care about what others think.. so maybe someday.. :)

[susan54]

I have a job that is about as secure as it gets. But I am not transgender. I love wearing skirts and dresses and ACTING as a woman, and getting feedback on my outfits from women. But my job involves a lot of status based on honesty, and acting is not really something that would fit in with this. It simply would not work. There would be acceptance of me as I want to dress on a social level, but professionally it would be very difficult to do my job, even though it would be theoretically the same, and my job is very important to me. One person has changed gender with no problems, but that is not for me. I have so much already I do not need to go this extra distance. I can wear whatever I want all the rest of the time, and that is enough.

[sarahcsc]

Lol. This is a very interesting question. I am a doctor and I work with people evryday. I believe patients tend to respect doctors a bit more than they would respect other people and it is not a good idea to show to work dressed en femme. In terms of employers, I think they would be more receptive and accepting of it if I were to apply for a job in the psychiatric dept vs the orthopaedic dept. The orthopods are all 100% man ya know.. lol

[Suzette Muguet de Mai]

He already knows, I am the employer.

[candice44]

I will one day soon when I start my transition

[Loni]

i would not.
the only time such would need to be said is if you just started to do the correcting thing. but then he/she would be hiring me as such any how.

there is work and it is only a very small part of my "life"....sure it takes up most of it. but none of there "need to know stuff".

.

[Eryn]

So the moral of the story is, if you're indispensable you can do what you want? I buy that. :)

Yes, that about sums it up. I'm not, so I can't. :straightface:

[NicoleScott]

Generally, it's not good for a company to have employees they consider indispensable. They don't become indispensable, they make themselves so, often for devious reasons. If you have employees you consider indispensable, fire them. Not really, but remove that condition, even if you have to fire them. Some companies have policies requiring employees to take their vacation time in week-long (or two) increments, rather than a day at a time, for the very reason of making sure that no one is indispensable, and also to see if any fraudulent activities will come to light in their absence.

[Stephanie47]

Although my state has protective laws against discrimination against cross dressers(and my city enhances that law), I would not ask any prospective employer whether I could be en femme. Nor would I consider working en femme, if I had not asked my prospective employer if I could work en femme. It is virtually impossible to prove on an individual basis whether you were denied employment because you asked that question. You'd have to have numerous CD-ers rejected for a job they were fully qualified for and the job is awarded to another. Unless the employer/interviewer is stupid and clearly states a discriminatory bias, it is difficult to prove anything.

That being said, I'd love to have had the opportunity to be a server in a gay/lesbian/transgender restaurant. I would love to wear a white blouse, black skirt, black hosier and black heels and a little white apron. In that environment I'd suspect if you told the prospective employer you are straight, you may not get hired.

[KandisTX]

There is only one reason your employer needs to know you dress, and that is if your dressing is because you are considering transition, or living as your female persona. If you have no intention of transitioning, or living as your female persona, there is no reason you should consider bringing crossdressing up to an employer, or potential employer. As a MtF crossdresser, who has no intentions of going "full-time" with this aspect of my life, this part of my life shall remain a secret as far as my employer is concerned.

[Crysten]

Funny they will hire people with tatoos on their faces, multiple piercings, with a green mohawk...but DON'T GET CAUGHT WEARING A PAIR OF PANTIES OMG THAT WOULD BE THE END!!!

[Annie M]

I will wait until they tell me I HAVE TO wear a bra!...

[Tuesday Theriot]

"Would you ever tell employers that you cross dress?"

Uh, absolutely not. I want to continue my employment. I'd like to find employment again if I need to.

Why? I'm a contract worker. I work in a very conservative environment. I live in a very conservative state. My home is in an overwhelmingly conservative parish. I do not personally know of a single person that admits to being a Democrat or liberal or progressive. We have one statewide elected official that belongs to the Democratic party and she is really a Republican in political drag. Our politicians are well known nationally for pushing their Evangelical Christian agenda on us all. People still feel comfortable discriminating against, blacks, homosexuals, Hispanics and Atheists in the workplace. My circle of friends is small and tight.

That's life in small town Louisiana.

[Julia Welch]

No way ... Absolutely not ... My personal life is for my consumption only

[Rogina B]

The real shame here is that once you are forthright in telling someone [that you consider important enough ..employer,etc] THEN their opinion of you changes instantly,yet you are still the same person that they considered "great",a second before...I work for myself in a phobic environment[the commercial waterfront]. I am not always indespensible,for every customer,so I try to keep my distance.Only a few people on the waterfront know Rogina.

[Chazity]

noooooo!!!!!!!!! i'm a mechanic ,i dont think that the other guys in my shop would understand .....lol plus i would take a chance of hurting my job, and thats how i support my family .IT SUCKS THAT I HAVE TO KEEP IT IN THE CLOSET

[JiveTurkeyOnRye]

I'm coming into this thread late, so I apologize if some of this has been discussed, I sort of skimmed it. But my thoughts Klaire are that if all you want to do is add some feminine flaire to your day-to-day outfit, I think actually having a talk with your employers about it beforehand would be the wrong move. I think doing so would make it seem like a bigger deal than it is. Instead what I would suggest is to just slowly start to integrate the things you want to wear into your wardrobe, pieces at a time. Why not buy a purse that is a bit more unisex looking, for example I usually carry a small cross-body canvas bag that doesn't scream "WOMEN'S PURSE" even though it is one, and I do this often in male mode even when I wear jeans. I'm sure you could find something similar and bigger to start bringing to work, and eventually bring nicer handbags in. Plenty of men carry nice bags these days, I'm sure it wouldn't be a big issue if you did. If anyone asks about it, just play it off as no big deal. Also, I have worn women's jeans to work countless times without anyone noticing or making any comments, same with women's flared dress trousers.

I've never officially "come out" to my HR or anyone at my job about my crossdressing, I've told anyone who has asked, because I have dressed as a girl for the past two halloweens and I do wear eye makeup on occasion, so I'm pretty open about it, but it's not something I ever had to have a sit down talk with anyone about and I think doing so would have made it seem like a bigger and worse issue than it really is.

Seriously though, I think if you just slowly integrate different pieces of your wardrobe in bit by bit people won't really notice it as something to make an issue out of, and I can speak from personal experience, it can be kind of a fun game deciding what to wear next.

[Annaliese2010]

I did & there's no problem actually. I'm lucky, I know. And grateful...

[SusieK]

We have casual dress Fridays where I work (IT), although the dress code is fairly casual most of the time - some men always where suits, some a shirt and tie, others always casual. What the women wear varies similarly from dress trousers and blouse - to full skirt suit - to jeans and t-shirt.

Anyway, recently on Fridays I have been wearing women's boot-cut jeans with more feminine stitching (whatever that actually means) on the pockets. Last week I added a women's denim style shirt (worn open over a men's t-shirt) with studs on the shoulders and buttoned half-sleeves. Given current styles, I think it was fairly obvious that they were women's, however they could also have been seen as retro-men's with a late 70's look to them. I did get a couple of comments from work-friends about my new style - I think they think (and they wouldn't be too far off) that I'm going through some kind of mid-life crisis, and that I am in denial about getting older. My guess would be that it was probably obvious to the women, but that it wouldn't even cross the mind of most of the men. I think where I work people would be fairly relaxed about it (even if they did/do realise) at this level.

Skirts or dresses could well be a different matter, as I think it would just make people uncomfortable - work does have policies in place, but as others have said a gender-mix CD is rather different to a transitioning TS in terms of employment protection.

I'll see how it goes - I don't really want this to be my permanent Friday uniform. Plus if it is a regular thing, what would I change into to relax at home?

Susie

[Jennifer in CO]

Klaire,
what you describe is my daily attire...fem slacks (even side zip), nice top/blouse (but very understated fem) fem shoes 99% of the time simple loafers and full under dress but no obvious bra lines/etc. I present as a male and have only had positive comments about being a classy dresser. That said, I see no reason why you should say anything to anybody. As far as talking to HR, I transitioned on the job with the blessing of my HR dept (almost at their insistence but thats another story) but I know that I had it lucky with VERY understanding employers. On another job many years later I had a medical issue...I couldn't wear pants for almost 6 weeks...and my female employer even said she'd not wear a pair of pants for 6 weeks if I would come to work in a skirt (what was it Nichole said about "indispensable"?) and she a butch lesbian. So, I wore skirts to work for close to 4 weeks...and so did she.
You'd be amazed at what you can do and people wont say a word...notice yes, but not say a word...

Jenn

[BRANDYJ]

Woulld I ever tell my employer? Not only NO, but hell NO! I don't like unemployment lines and job hunting. I have no reason to ever share this part of me with anyone other then those close to me.
My opinion is simple: If you are not a transsexual that will be undergoing transformation, then you have no good reason to ever tell an employer. For us that are crossdressers, all I have to say is get a grip and control your urges to dress or expose yourself to an employer or co-workers. If you don't need tha job, go for it.

[Jamie001]

Funny they will hire people with tatoos on their faces, multiple piercings, with a green mohawk...but DON'T GET CAUGHT WEARING A PAIR OF PANTIES OMG THAT WOULD BE THE END!!!

Why is this true? Can someone please attempt to provide some insight as to why?

[KateSpade83]

Crossdressing has greatly hurt my career. Every time I had a job and gossip spread that I crossdressed they automatically thought I was gay. Then I was laid off or didn't go permanent on a temp job, adn the worst was at Synchro Start where I had a great permanent job that just degraded into a nightmare when they found out I crossdress. They made fun of me at the company Xmas party and then scammed / set me up to fire me and they denied my unemployment benefits.

Now if I get another job and crossdressing gossip surfaces I will be out and just tell them I'm not gay, I just like to crossdress because I'm beautiful. I have wallet pic of me to show how beautiful I look and that will be my excuse.

[Josie M]

As far as work in concerned, I don't talk about where I work on the internet though any of my public personas or on stage (I do storytelling from time to time). Likewise, any conversations about my personal life at the office is strictly on a "need to know" basis. That being said, I have just finished a two-year term with our diversity council and plan to be more active supporting the LGBT affinity group this year. While I am not gay (relative to my birth gender that is), I do think there may be some value in sharing that I'm TG with that group. A lot of members of the group are either straight "allies" or "under the radar". That's not to say they are closeted, they're just concerned about potential impact to their careers. Sadly, LGBT still carries a negative stigma with those in position to make promotion/hiring decisions.

Yet, if no one was out at work, there would be no LGBT support group. Additionally, the "T" part of "LGBT" tends to be under-represented. I have outed myself to a long-time friend who works at the same place, partially to explain my empathy toward the LGBT group and partially because it was weird that she'd known me so long and never knew this about me.

I'm a bit torn between "My personal life is none of their business" and "T's need to be represented as well".

[KlaireLarnia]

Thanks for all the comments on this, I was amazed at the results and the amount of them!

It is a shame most people think it is unwise to explain that you cross dress at work or do it (even in limited form). I fully understand that if you are Transgender and going through the latter stages in preparation to being female full time you have little choice and in a lot of cases it seems employers may understand or accept this (well in the UK I think they would anyhow, even if the staff where not so sure).

My main concern was that with me not falling in the LGBT bracket in any respect I would basically be doing something akin to shooting myself in the foot before running a marathon - and it seems I was right in that area. Shame really as someone rightly pointed out, we can have tattoos, piercings in pretty much any place and almost to any amount but we cannot wear clothes that make us comfortable without getting ridiculed. Sad how society has allowed this.

I am frankly amazed that the USA seems to be so anti on a large scale, when it is supposed to be (or was) the land of dreams. Perhaps it still is as long as those dreams do not involve wearing female clothes if you are not female. I Dunno.

I am currently evaluating my own situation at home and work. As I go away at times I do have dressing chances and public ones outside of the eyes of work which is good. But these can also fuel an annoyance at not being able to do it in other situations - so there is a trade off. I hope oneday that dressing at work would not be such an issue, but perhaps that requires another generation to overcome that issue and not my one :(

K

[Raychel]

When I was an employer, I pretty much kept it to myself. It would not be a wise business decision to allow that cat out of the bag.

Now I am an employee. In my line of work (blue collar) everyone wears a uniform. Male or female, it is all the same.
Would I ever tell my boss. If the subject came up and he asked, I would be truthful. But I will not go out of my way to bring it up.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

it's business...whatever makes the owner more $$ wins... having a guy walking walking around in clothing that bothers people (life is not fair) will never make the boss more money
lots of people will want you out for tattoos and earrings too...

Personal matters are almost never appropriate business matters... Need to know means tell no one..no one in the world "needs" to know about what you wear under your pants...if you wear black and green combat print underwear, who needs to know??

Even as a TS woman, if i was a boss, and you came to me and told me you crossdressed, i'd say why are you telling me this? and from that moment forward i'd make a mental note that you are an idiot.

[Josie M]

...
Even as a TS woman, if i was a boss, and you came to me and told me you crossdressed, i'd say why are you telling me this? and from that moment forward i'd make a mental note that you are an idiot.

I certainly hope you are kidding...a lot of TGs are CDs first and not all TGs are TS. Such a person could be in the process of "coming out" and see you as a safe person to come out to. Brushing them off as an "idiot" is a bit harsh, don't you think?

[Kaitlyn Michele]

not kidding
yes harsh... but also real.. it's business for crying out loud.....
it's a competitive harsh world...there are 3 good people for every job right now..
if you are bagging groceries(which i have done btw..), maybe nobody really cares...but if you have any meaningful responsibility, you are demonstrating very poor judgement

Its a bad strategy for a person coping with transsexuality to start their coming out process at work... it's just a flat out bad idea... i understand the urge...it's very real..but its work...its business...
If you are crossdressing for enjoyment, how can you possibly argue that's appropriate to bring into work??
having an affair, getting drunk at lunch, sending inflammatory emails that will end up traced to you, and telling your boss you'd like to wear some NY&Co city pants (cute as they are) to work are all stupid moves..

people still do them...but i would not trust your judgement if you did..

I totally support all of our rights from drag queens to transsexuals...but WORK is the EXACT wrong place to come out....ts people end up having no choice, and despite best laid plans of many, it still gets us marginalized at best, and fired at worst..

[April_Ligeia]

I can't think of a single reason to tell my employer. That is just not an appropriate subject, just as I would never feel compelled to tell my employer that I listen to industrial music. The logical response would be, 'why are you telling me thid, what is wrong with you?' If the motivation is to try to get a green light to crossdress at work, I would expect that to backfire. I wear business casual to work because I'm at WORK. I wear whatever I want at home.