Man are pigs!

[Inna]

In my saga, my life story unfolding, and experience of embracing womanhood penetrating every cell every pore of my body and its essence spewing from the abyss I once sentenced her presence too, through pain and sorrow, through joy and happiness, I walk the path of truth.

Since embracing my new journey which really started at 7 years old but realized and set on lately, my sexuality was put on halt. Gender took place of everything, Everything! Sexuality became null, simply there was no place for it nor any tendency for sparking a debate, one way or the other, hormones did what they were suppose to do and my psyche opened up flood gates of femininity which contrary to popular belief, at least in my eyes, have simply nothing or very little in common with sex at its onset. I have been subjected to intensive HRT for one complete year now, in fact February 16th was my one year anniversary, YEY!!!!!

Well, the inevitable welcoming to the real world, celebration happened last night. I was invited to the unofficial date night with a friend of a friend. The friend in question is very cultured and a gentleman, so I never questioned the invitation however I have put it off for a while, I don't know, girls instincts?
Last night we went out, first to the family cookout party then to couple clubs. All throughout the GUY, Italian fellow, couldn't get the message of "Just Friends" through his thick Sicilian, dark skin (no offense to anyone remotely Italian, please)

I have told him I wasn't interested in anything remotely sexual, he nodded and then proceeded with his own agenda of wooing me, touching and wanting to kiss. I repeatedly refused such come on's but at the same time, was poised, and felt kind of sorry for the guy and with every come on and then turn down, I would stress yet again that I liked him but simply was not interested in taking this any further then all of us having a good time. I suppose a Good Time isn't understood the same in different languages.

Well it went on like this all night, I felt like a teen girl, at the teen party, glancing at the hot guy, then dancing together, then a kiss, then a quick talk, walk upstairs to the bedroom, boy trying more , girl pushing him away, boy trying some more (somehow boys have that "enthusiasm" about them) girl really refusing this time, yet boy trying again!!!!!!!! Resulting in girl crying and running downstairs and out the back door.
Well, I did.......cry, it got to the point that emotions could not contain disappointment and male persuasion felt physical, raw and ugly!

I guess I was welcomed to the teen club by mother nature this time as a girl, and to tell you the truth it felt bitter sweet yet sweet at the same time, to finally have yet another proof of womanhood found and truth brilliantly raw.

Love, slightly realistic, Inna

[Melissa Jill]

Im sorry to hear. I keep trying to believe that some men are good (which they are), but most are just such pigs its really hard to stick to my beliefs.

[Stephenie S]

While I am sure that there are many men out there who are hard working, loving, sharing, and supportive, I am also sure that there is not one who would not drop his pants in an instant if he thought he could get away with it.

Stephie

[Starling]

Not even one? Out of 3.5 billion?

:eek: Lallie

[ArleneRaquel]

Men can be such louts, I understand that ladies can also have loutish characteristics, but men are in a class by themselves. Not all men, after all I'm still male, but way too many. A few men that I have encountered think because I am CD, that therefor I'm easy which is in no way the case. I don't like to be stereotyped and I hope that I haven't stereotyped men, if I have that was not my intent.

[jillleanne]

As was said once a while back in time, when asked where all the sensitive, sexy, strong, caring, loving honest men in the world are, someone said,
" they all have boyfriends already " or modernized for today," .......or transgender."

[Julia_in_Pa]

Inna,

I think everyone knows my feelings about men.
Welcome to the reality concerning what men actually are.


Julia

[suzy1]

No Inna and Julia, some men are pigs!
Are you looking for your knight in shinning armour, your Mr perfect, your prince charming from out of a fairy tale book?

I am transsexual. I have a female side. So over the years, when ever I have seen men act that way I have cringed. Like you I hate it!

But that rare thing the good man is out there. But you have a hard job finding him.
Good luck and tell us when you do. [As if you wouldn’t girl!]

Good hunting, SUZY

[AllieSF]

Well, actually that good man out there is not rare, it just seems like it sometimes. In my experience, most men, meaning the vast majority, are good humans, kind and only want to live life as best they can, work hard, play hard, have a family and survive the real world. I think part of what happens here for our part of society is that we seem to attract the less than desirable men. For every bad male I have seen an equally bad (personality and character) woman. I think these bad traits are fairly evenly distributed between genders. We just get to see a larger share of them.

[Melody Moore]

Sorry to hear about what you have been going through Inna. I learned very early on in my
transition that you have to really keep guys at arm's length. One guy who I thought was a
good friend and a gentleman at first turned out to be one of the biggest creeps around. He
offered me a place to stay temporarily because of the problems I was having with a former
housemate when I came out & first started my transition. The understanding was we were
just friends & I could sleep on his lounge for a couple of weeks until I got back on my feet.

He was a great friend at first and seemed to be very open, accepting & compassionate towards me,
he would give me a hug if I was down, but I resisted him & reminded him we were just friends when
he tried to kiss me, but this didn't stop him from trying. Any time he came near me I would feel his
hand on my back rubbing me, but working it's way down towards my butt. When this happened I
would pull away and put enough distance between us where he couldn't touch me. He told me he
wanted to have sex with me, but I told him that I wouldn't have unsafe sex with anyone, and also
told him that I didn't trust condoms & told him that I would only have sex with a guy if he got a
HIV/STI test done to could prove to me he was clean. He refused to do that. So I made it very clear
to him that those were my rules if he expected sex & his refusal get tested meant no sex for him.

Things got worse after that, whenever I was around him I started to feel constantly harassed me for
sex even when I went out to do some shopping, go to appointments etc, he was sending the most
disgusting SMS text messages to my mobile phone. When I read these messages I felt really sick &
disgusted by what I was reading & was like "My God, is this all he ever things about & sees in me?".

So I warned him many times not to send me messages like this. But he even did it again while I was in
an appointment with my therapist. When I got this message I could not contain the tears & broke down
telling her how bad this guy made me feel. So I showed her the messages and she said I should block
him and move out of his place as soon as possible. So I told her I was going to do that as soon as I had
somewhere else to go, but I was going to be trapped there for a few more days until I got paid next.

After I went back to his place that day after seeing my therapist, I told him that I had blocked his number
because of the messages he was sending me. I also told him that I was going to be moving out in a few
days time and that is when he really turned up the heat in his demands for sex. He said to me "You have
to let me f*ck you because I have given you somewhere to live & let you stay here so you owe me".

I told him that I owed him nothing, he had never asked for any rent but as it was I had bought all
the groceries and had also been cooking meals for him in appreciation of him letting me stay there.
But he continued to argue that I owed him and he was demanding sex. He become very aggressive
then he suddenly rushed at me & tried to push me back onto his bed. That was a bad mistake with
me because he is 5'6" with a small build and I am 5'10" with a medium to solid build, so it was no
trouble to push him backwards and outside the balcony door and backwards over the railing on the
third floor of an apartment complex. I held him over the 3rd floor balcony and gave him a very stern
warning not to ever mess with me. He turned white and crapped himself and after I let him back up
he grabbed some things and put them into a bag & raced off leaving me alone in his apartment. I
never seen him again until I after I started moving out and went back to get the last of my stuff.

When I went back to get the last of my stuff, my ex girlfriend came with me to help me carry stuff
down from the 3rd floor apartment. When we arrived, I knocked on the door just to see if this idiot
was home. No one answered, so I used the key he gave me to let myself in and get the last of my
belongings. After we got inside, I realised he was sitting out on the balcony, so I just slide the door
open to tell him that we came to pick up the last of my stuff and give him his key back. When he
realised I was there he jumped up and tried to charge me again. I repelled him instantly and knocked
him senseless with a right elbow strike to the eye brow/temple area on the left side of his head. He
dropped to the ground and was dazed and left bleeding with a deep cut from the strike. After he
started to come around he was making threats about going to the police. I laughed at him and told
him I would call the cops there myself if he liked because I had friend with me who seen him try to
attack me first. I then suggested that he sits out on the balcony for a few minutes while we got my
stuff, and then I would leave peacefully and he wouldn't have to see me again. He sat there bleeding
into a towel looking very sore and sorry for himself. But I wonder if he ever had any idea how bad he
made me feel? Also I found out recently that this creep is HIV positive as well - Damn pig!

[Katesback]

Why did you go to the bedroom with him if you were not interested in sexual activities?

Another question.

Are you post-op?

If your not then I am sorry but I strongly believe that your should not be dating. Yon mentioned the teenage phase. Well thats part of being pre-op. The big problem is that your not a girl if you have a penis between your legs. No straigh man wants to date a girl with a penis and so that leaves you with the dregs of society. Crap its hard for Post-op girls to date but as a pre girl its a recipe for disaster.

So your pre days should revolve around spending time evolving and preparring for the day you become a girl (getting srs). That does not include dating.

You do not have to like what I say. Crap you dont have to agree with me but these are words of wisdom and if you ignore them then so be it. Finally for those of you that say the being a girl is in your head and not between your legs. Ok I can play that game but the rest of the world CANT. Thats the reality of it. Crap a lot of the world cant agree that your a girl even after srs. Thats one of the reason I say learn to keep your mouth shut and NEVER admit your TS to anyone, especially after you have SRS.

Katie

[Aprilrain]

I've been dating a very nice man for 6 months now. Not sure what to say, they are out there but you'll probably have to go through a lot of duds to find one. Good luck!

[Secret_Dresser]

As was said once a while back in time, when asked where all the sensitive, sexy, strong, caring, loving honest men in the world are, someone said,
" they all have boyfriends already " or modernized for today," .......or transgender."

Add "In the friend zone" and you will pretty much have them all covered. I know a few girls who keep asking for the sensitive, strong...etc kinda guy. Now being an onlooker I know a few of their friends would fit the bill perfectly but the girl insists on "just friends"... boggles my mind at times.

[Kerstin]

You can't write off all men just because of a bad experience!

[Melody Moore]

No one is writing men off because of bad experiences, but you need to be careful with men
and that is the point behind my post. So far 99.9% single men fail to impress me & usually
if they are single, especially if they are separated & divorced often there is a reason why they
are on their own. But to be fair here, I have had the same experience also with women. So
far the best men I have met are already taken and are in relationships, but then I have met
some who wanted to cheat on their partners with me. No thanks. While there are a few good
men out there, most of those on the market around my age you really don't want to know.

[Katesback]

I like to say that at my age the good men are married, dead, or gay!

[Miriam-J]

One of the things I learned when I got back into dating a few years ago ... Far too many of us guys are agressive, abusive, or both. I discovered that most of the ladies I dated had experienced such trauma that they couldn't bring themselves to trust anyone. I so wanted to teach a lesson to each of the guys who had screwed up these ladies (and ruined my chances while they were at it). But the inescapable truth is this: not all guys are pigs, but you have to filter out the garbage and find the decent ones. Some are sensitive and caring, and they'll be worth your patience.

On the lighter side, perhaps all the sensitive and caring ones are crossdressers. Look for them here instead ;-)

The guy inside Miriam

[Katesback]

You know something. I cannot argue with you on the good part of a crossdresser. The downside is the crossdressing. I have no desire to be dating a crossdresser. I just dont have any desire for my man to be a crossdresser. Its my choice.







One of the things I learned when I got back into dating a few years ago ... Far too many of us guys are agressive, abusive, or both. I discovered that most of the ladies I dated had experienced such trauma that they couldn't bring themselves to trust anyone. I so wanted to teach a lesson to each of the guys who had screwed up these ladies (and ruined my chances while they were at it). But the inescapable truth is this: not all guys are pigs, but you have to filter out the garbage and find the decent ones. Some are sensitive and caring, and they'll be worth your patience.

On the lighter side, perhaps all the sensitive and caring ones are crossdressers. Look for them here instead ;-)

The guy inside Miriam

[Miranda-E]

On the lighter side, perhaps all the sensitive and caring ones are crossdressers. Look for them here instead ;-)


An honest fulltime TS pre-op, post-op, non-op either FTM or MTF but never in a million years would I put up with the part time hiding, lying, low self esteem and complete unwillingness to stand up for themselves in public that you often see in crossdresser circles. I'm to old for that drama.

[Miriam-J]

An honest fulltime TS pre-op, post-op, non-op either FTM or MTF but never in a million years would I put up with the part time hiding, lying, low self esteem and complete unwillingness to stand up for themselves in public that you often see in crossdresser circles. I'm to old for that drama.

Now, now. No need to be unnecessarily harsh. We all have our priorities and interests, and the world can scarcely be seen in such and black and white terms. From some perspectives, I'm sure it's hard to understand that many of us enjoy being a guy at least as much as being a lady. This flies in the face of any type of pure logic, but we have to be true to ourselves. I am purely ... nothing. Instead, I'm a conundrum even to myself - a real guy, a sensitive guy, a caring guy, and one who also gains from the female experience. Despite it all, I'm honest enough to admit that I can't possibly live life just one way no matter the inconvenience.

Still the guy inside Miriam

[Michelle.M]

Some random thoughts -

There are some really nice guys out there, and I know a few of them. But I agree with Kate. For me, pre-op dating is not an option. I see this as a training period for me, dating will come in due time.

A handsome man tried to pick me up just the other day and I gently rebuffed him. It was a win for me, as I discovered that I am attractive to eligible men. I have hope for the future!

Inna, you're gorgeous! No wonder men find you attractive, and the more attractive you are the more men you attract and the more slugs you'll encounter. You have to kiss a lot of frogs before you find a prince! But you stand a good chance of meeting more decent guys, also.

Inna, I'm going to see Dr C in a few weeks for my initial consult. I hope he can do for me what he did for you. :)

[Katesback]

First of all I want to say that one thing I cannot agree with was that someone stated that she feels that a lot of crossdressers lack self esteem. I think she was innacurate with that statment. I would submit to you that she probable meant something different but used those words incorrectly.

Second I have to suggest to you to be clear here. You said you get to you get to be a lady. I hope you clearly understand that your experience as a woman is extremely skewed and marginal. You cannot possibly come close to knowing what it is like to be a woman as a crossdresser. I guraratee you that because once upon a time I did what you do. I even have said before that transition to a woman begins AFTER SRS. Anything before SRS is nothing comparred to what happens afterwards. So you dont even plan on beginning transition you cannot even know what its like to be a woman! I promise.







Now, now. No need to be unnecessarily harsh. We all have our priorities and interests, and the world can scarcely be seen in such and black and white terms. From some perspectives, I'm sure it's hard to understand that many of us enjoy being a guy at least as much as being a lady. This flies in the face of any type of pure logic, but we have to be true to ourselves. I am purely ... nothing. Instead, I'm a conundrum even to myself - a real guy, a sensitive guy, a caring guy, and one who also gains from the female experience. Despite it all, I'm honest enough to admit that I can't possibly live life just one way no matter the inconvenience.

Still the guy inside Miriam

[AKAMichelle]

It would have much different if you had been more attracted to him. You would have responded much differently to those advances, but alas that was one of the so-so dates which teach more than anything what you don't want.

[JohnH]

I am happily married to a genetic woman and I really love her. I cannot in a million years imagine myself wanting to get intimate with a man.

Having said that, I do remember when I was younger and all charged up with testosterone I could really be a lout to women! I used to lust after women big time!

Johanna (John)

[Miranda-E]

I think she was innacurate with that statment. I would submit to you that she probable meant something different but used those words incorrectly.


Possibly inaccurate in some cases but it was exactly how the word is used and was exactly what I meant.

[Hope]

True story.

But you have to be patient with them anyway... you know first hand what testosterone does to an otherwise human brain... it isn't pretty.

There is a guy, a rather cute guy actually, who comes by my counter at work all the time (at least once a week) never to buy anything, just to flirt with me. And I am always terrifically flattered, and love the ego boost, and flirt with him as well... and he knows I am a happily married woman, he knows I have 0 interest in men, he is married, he has been (very politely) shot down many, many, many times... but every week or 10 days he comes in to see me, flirts with me for as long as I will spend with him, and leaves me his email address or phone number - every time. I LOVE the attention - but I can't imagine what would happen if I actually went someplace with this guy.

[ReineD]

Inna, you'll develop your instincts and next time you won't put up with an entire evening of advances after you've established your boundaries at the beginning of a date. You'll leave after the first hour. Flattery aside, it really does get old.

Not every man is that insistent.

[Vickie_CDTV]

As was said once a while back in time, when asked where all the sensitive, sexy, strong, caring, loving honest men in the world are, someone said,
" they all have boyfriends already " or modernized for today," .......or transgender."

And some are crossdressers, if the woman is able to see beyond the dressing.

[Julia_in_Pa]

Yes you can. After two relationships with pigs all men are permanently off the table because I have found that all men are pigs.



Julia



You can't write off all men just because of a bad experience!

[Kerstin]

Yes you can. After two relationships with pigs all men are permanently off the table because I have found that all men are pigs.

Julia

With respect I think you're being incredibly unfair. Two men does not equal all men. An ex-girlfriend of mine cheated on me, but it would be wrong of me to declare that all women are bitches based on that.

[Julia_in_Pa]

Kerstin,

I have an immense hatred for men. My father was abusive until he went away. I was sexually molested by a man in my teens.
I find men disgusting, shallow, willfully ignorant, violent, sexually abusive, emotionally unavailable, unclean, vile and because of these things less than human.
Nothing anyone can say will change my viewpoint.


Julia

[Melody Moore]

but it would be wrong of me to declare that all women are bitches based on that.
It is funny you say this because I know quite a few men who think all women are bitches. So if you
think women are being unfair by thinking that men are pigs, just remember all is fair in love & war. ;)

[Aprilrain]

Each to her own, that being said I have met scores of genetic woman and a few trans woman that have had all of the negative experiences mentioned, abuse, rape, emotionally unavailable, mean blah blah blah that a person can have with a man and yet I don't see them running off to the lesbian bar. If you are hetero it dosen't matter how shity your last BF was your going to look for another man next time too. Oh and who dosen't have daddy issues??

HA! Maybe my man is so great because he is a CDer!

[Inna]

WOW! I had no idea I have touched such a dramatic subject, YES, I must admit the experience I had was to say least, off-putting, disgusting, and made me understand further that for some man getting to bed is of the utmost importance, and they really don't have any interest in You per say but what you can give them!
I knew this feeling from before when my own body was infected with T, YES, I sometimes was a PIG, but now I had experienced the same from womans perspective and I honestly, felt sorrow for every woman who must put up with this kind of advance, it is shameful and disgusting, yet it is the natures way, it is part of the attitude some man posses, me, me, me, me!

I am sorry to start such a debate, the title Man are Pigs was SUGGESTIVE, a creative license to set the tone of what I felt, nowhere however did I say "ALL" man!
I know of few, yes I admit only few but then these man are wholesome loving, honest gentlemen, and always treat with respect and dignity. We all posses the ability to respect one another, but some choose to behave and follow their own agenda despite harmful attitude towards others, but such is not reserved to man but is a choice to all!


I love you girls tremendously and thanks for being my family so helpful and always there for me, love, Inna

PS: I read my own post yet again and nowhere did I speak of any other then the individual at question, the "horny Sicilian". But my title sparked quite a stir. I am proud of such a strong thought provoking title however, it did its job illustrating my disgust in situation I was experiencing in only 3 words! Now that's good writing skills :hd:

[ReineD]

Anyone who says that "ALL men are ...", or "ALL women are ..." is looking at the world through their own bias. It is more accurate to say, "Because of my experience, I believe that All men or women are ....". This way, the listener knows that it is the speaker who has issues, and not either "all" men or "all" women.

[Ineke Vashon]

I wonder if perhaps the professed dislike of men drives some males to crossdressing. So they can say "see, I am acting female, I am not one of those bad guys. Look at this attractive package".

Perhaps Ms Piggy really, could it be, nah, could she be a "cochon en femme" a.k.a. a he-Pig? :eek:

Ineke

[Melody Moore]

Anyone who says that "ALL men are ...", or "ALL women are ..." is looking at the world through their own bias. It is more accurate to say, "Because of my experience, I believe that All men or women are ....". This way, the listener knows that it is the speaker who has issues, and not either "all" men or "all" women.
I totally agree with you Reine, the really funny part is the same guys I heard claiming that all women are bitches
and were constantly running them down were really two-faced. Whenever a pretty woman was around they were
perfect gentleman but behind their backs the lack of respect is appalling. I had it out with a long time friend who
was my former landlord over this. He came to the realisation one day that his misogynistic chauvinistic crap might
be offending me and said "Oops, sorry I forgot you were on the other side now" (realising that I was now a woman).
I said "What is this sorry crap? I have seen this chauvinistic two faced crap many times when there aren't any women
around, but when there is you suck up & grovel all the time when you have just finished running them down. WTF?".

This guy has serious issues, he is paranoid because he owns property and has trust issues with women because he thinks
that all women are s!uts who are out to take him for all they can get. (but mind you that is how he treats women). He even
admitted to me one day that he has no idea about dating & romance, he is also musician who chases groupies. He is good
looking and has a load of charisma, but it is no wonder he cannot find a good woman who wants to be loyal and stay with
him because this guy really is a pig! However this stupid war between the sexes will never be won because there is always
far too much fraternisation with the enemy going on. So I sit back and laugh but at the same time I do feel really sorry for
the guy because he will die one day all alone not ever knowing or experiencing real love.

[Sally24]

I have an immense hatred for men......I find men disgusting, shallow, willfully ignorant, violent, sexually abusive, emotionally unavailable, unclean, vile and because of these things less than human.Nothing anyone can say will change my viewpoint.
We all know that nothing anyone says will change any of your opinions. That's just you.

Now for all the others on this forum, many of us know plenty of courageous, moral, sensitive, beautiful men. None of my guy friends are trans that I know of but are still emotional men that have raised kids with tenderness and love. It's not purely exposure to T that creates the bad guys. It's their core values too. And as others have mentioned there are plenty of women that have no qualms about abusing everyone around them. Gender does not determine personality or morality.

And yes, one of the downsides of going out is dealing with the same thing that natal women have to deal with.

[JohnH]

I am happily married to a genetic woman and I really love her. I cannot in a million years imagine myself wanting to get intimate with a man.

Having said that, I do remember when I was younger and all charged up with testosterone I could really be a lout to women! I used to lust after women big time!

Johanna (John)

I wish to add to my previous comment. Tonight I watched "Sex for Sale" with the National Geographic channel. I recall when I was young and testosterone laden I went to strip shows. Thank goodness I never went to any prostitutes.

Now with the feminizing hormones I find the whole sex industry really disgusting. It is amazing and wonderful that I now see prostitution as a blight in the visceral sense. Now I value genetic women as fellow human beings who are not to be lusted over. My wife does not need to worry about my being unfaithful to her.

Johanna (John)

[lightfoot]

We all know that nothing anyone says will change any of your opinions. That's just you.

Now for all the others on this forum, many of us know plenty of courageous, moral, sensitive, beautiful men. None of my guy friends are trans that I know of but are still emotional men that have raised kids with tenderness and love. It's not purely exposure to T that creates the bad guys. It's their core values too. And as others have mentioned there are plenty of women that have no qualms about abusing everyone around them. Gender does not determine personality or morality.

And yes, one of the downsides of going out is dealing with the same thing that natal women have to deal with.

Thank you Sally. Glad to hear not everyone shares the views of the OP.

[Empress Lainie]

I think most men are pigs. Thank goodness I NEVER was a real man. I am much more comfortable now with my girlfriends and tgirl friends. Besides all the guys older than me are either dead or in dire straits. I only flirt with younger men, like 30 yrs younger!

[ReineD]

I only flirt with younger men, like 30 yrs younger!

Lainie ... if you don't mind the question, why do you flirt with men if you think they are pigs? :)

[Tara D. Rose]

Inna my friend. With all due respect, and with so mnay issues between men and women, why do you start are thread entitled
"All men are pigs"? Why is there so many threads over the years on here about men bashing and hating?

[ReineD]

Inna didn't say, "All" men are pigs. Other member(s) did, or implied it. Inna posted about her single experience with this one guy.


Edit - And male bashing has frequently been a popular sport here, at cd.com. I always assumed this was because most or our members seek to distance themselves from their male roots or selves, if not permanently, then at least as long as they are logged into this forum.

[Momarie]

Men can be so wonderful.

I can say this even after being kidnapped, molested and probably raped when I was six.

The worst part was, the many layers of red neck fat the cop literally had when he kept trying to hold me in his lap, as he was trying to get my statement.
He scared me more than my abductor I think.
But this was circa 1966...and we have all lived and learned.

Even so, I don't hate cops or men.

I adore them.

The one or two who meant me harm or were ignorant, can't outweigh my belief of the gifts of men or how truly wonderful I know they can be.

[Aprilrain]

The one or two who meant me harm or were ignorant, can't outweigh my belief of the gifts of men or how truly wonderful I know they can be.

Agreed. I think the problem here is that the word "men" gets used for anyone with a penis, personally I think they need to earn their manhood until then they're just boys and boys do a lot of stupid, immature and often destructive things irrespective of the boy's age!

[Beth Mays]

My take:
I have been a hunter all my life, from rabbit to bear, the first and the most important think to learn in hunting is to think like your quarry. If you think like a deer when hunting moose you will not come out well.
Some men think like men in the quest for a quality woman, if they stand a chance it is due to dumb luck. Women (GG,TS,CD) that want true qualities they seek must first know those and then identify where to hunt. Understand too it is open season on alpha males, you must fit into the role, not just looks, and be hunted by him as well.
The qualities I assume most women want in a man are the same qualities many others seek as well both straight, Bi, Gay.. etc.
You are not likely to find gold in a silver mine, or diamond in a cow pasture. that does not mean you cant find something good in anyone, I have never heard of a diamond being ready to wear.
One of my favorite quotes of all times " You can put a turd in a candy box, but it is still a turd"



Beth

[kimdl93]

I don't know....maybe its because I'm not as thoroughly male as this fellow (I won't characterize him as a gentleman), but I was also raised up to treat women with courtesy and respect. I am very sorry you had to experience this loutish behavior, Inna. But, I remain hopeful that there are men out there who are not pigs. So much for dating friends of friends, tho, eh?

[Melody Moore]

I think it is fair for anyone to say that there are a lot of men out there who are pigs!

I have encountered many males throughout my life who are pig-headed, selfish, lazy
& stubborn and is all they think about is sex. For the best part of my life I tried hard
to prove to myself and the rest of the world I was a man. And to prove my manhood
to myself and my male peers I felt like become a pig and always felt really guilty about
it afterwards. Whenever I struggled with gender issues I compensated with masculinity
which eventually led me to engage in hyper-masculinity. I was a pig of a man because I
become homophobic & transphobic & become a bully & player who used women without
emotion because that is what I seen that the men all around me ever did. I would crash
and burn every now and again with guilt because I could not be the same as other men.

I was really ashamed at what I had become just trying to find my place in the world & it
nearly destroyed me because I realised what a pig of a man I had become just trying to
find my place in what is really a Man's World. Until men grant women equality & also
learn to treat women with the proper love & respect they deserve then unfortunately
most men are still going to be seen as pigs because that is just how most men are.

[Jorja]

I happen to like most men. Yes, some of them can be quite rude, crude and sociably unacceptable. There are those who are quite acceptable and do not do the things of which are spoken of in this thread. A lot of it depends on where you are finding these men. It's kind of like going shopping at Wal-Mart or Ann Taylor's (or your choice of upscale store).

One thing that can be said, pigs are pigs, unless they want to transition to be cows or horses. :)

[Bree-asaurus]

On the lighter side, perhaps all the sensitive and caring ones are crossdressers. Look for them here instead ;-)

I dunno.... I've seen the attitude of some crossdressers here, as well as stories from GGs who are dealing with crossdressing husbands, that tells me that isn't quite the truth :P

[Melody Moore]

One thing that can be said, pigs are pigs, unless they want to transition to be cows or horses. :)
Like I said a lot of men are pigs, ok, so I am an old cow for saying that, so bite me :D

[suzy1]

All men are pigs, so are all women b*****s? Is this a serious discussion or are you joking?

In my world most men and women are lovely.

Or am I missing the point?

[Inna]

OK enough is enough and I have started it all, yayks......

My title MAN ARE PIGS was suppose to illustrate my frustration over one date, with several guys involved in getting us together, one me and one guy, and participating in an outing which turned sour and their lack of consideration earned them such accreditation.

NOW!!! Nowhere did I say ALL MAN nor did I speak of lots and lots of people, man or woman alike.

So in the spirit of writers own right, I call everyone to calm down and get of the ALL are this or ALL are that. We are truly all fantastic beings however, for many we get lost in the dark corners of life and expectation.

Love ya all and this time I mean when I say "ALL", Inna

[ReineD]

NOW!!! Nowhere did I say ALL MAN nor did I speak of lots and lots of people, man or woman alike.


Inna, I think most people do realize that you didn't say, "All men are ...". But as so often happens in threads on this board, members respond to other people in the thread who said, or implied "All men are ...", and so the discussion takes on a tone of its own. :)

[Melody Moore]

All men are pigs, so are all women b*****s? Is this a serious discussion or are you joking?

In my world most men and women are lovely.

Or am I missing the point?
Suzy, I really think you are missing something, neither Inna or myself have
implied that ALL men are pigs here. We both just so happened to believe
after our experiences that there is a few men out there who are real pigs,
just like there is also a few women out there who can be real b!tches if they
want to be and I know I can be one of them, but I would rather be a b!tch
any day than a pig, because it really does come a lot more naturally to me.
And I am only ever a b!tch when some pig is insisting to see this side of me. :D

People in general also need to lighten up & not take everything so personally
& seriously where they become agitated & aggressive up over what other
people post on the internet. And I really do think those people need to learn
to go with the flow & roll with the punches if they are to succeed in this life.

The fact is there are women out there who do think that all men are pigs,
but there are also men out there who think that all women are bitches.

But the bottomline is "The war between the sexes will never be
won because there is far too much fraternisation with the enemy". :heehee:

[queenie]

Inna, I think most people do realize that you didn't say, "All men are ...". But as so often happens in threads on this board, members respond to other people in the thread who said, or implied "All men are ...", and so the discussion takes on a tone of its own. :)

It probably has to do more with the vague title, "Man are pigs." The words "are" and "pigs" implies plural and at first blush, I thought Inna was referring to ALL as well.

Regardless, upon reading through some of the comments here, it's very sad to see that some people think that misandry or misogyny are somehow okay or appropriate.

[Traci Elizabeth]

What's his phone number? No! Just kidding.

[tanyalynn51]

I think that the only guys I know who really fit the bill have already been grabbed by a woman who they are loyal to and arent looking. Personally, I have no interest in guys except as friends, but most of my guy friends fit the description. Its just that some woman has already had the sense to grab them.

[KaTanya]

Inna, if you're putting dating off the table for a while, you might look into Krav Maga. It won't help you find a better man, but at least you'll be better prepared the next time bad things happen. (Not just talking about bad dates.) oh, and stop falling for the "cultured gentleman" schtick. They're some of the worst offenders.