Another Thread on Labels

[Samantha_Smile]

And not the good kind that are marked 75% Off either.
No I mean the ones we all pidgeon hole ourselves with.

I was talking with some friends on the chat tonight when the subject of gender labels came up becuase the site has undergone a bit of an overhaul and has required all users to re-enter their gender;
-Male
-Female
-Transexual
-Transvestite
-Crossdresser
and then others like
-Couple
-I'll tell you later.

Ive entered mine as CD, just as it was pre-overhaul.
But a friend of mine has changed hers from CrossDresser to transvestite, when she said this I asked her why? Had she increased her regularity of dressing? Prolonged the periods for which she is dressed? Had she decided she's now living and presenting as a girl but electing not to go for surgery or hormones?

Nope.

Her response came as a shock. (This is not a direct quote, more of an aproximation)

CDs in this country (UK), and I dont know about overseas tend to be frowned upon purely for going by the title of Crossdresser. It conjures up images of hairy panty wearers who's robbed some knickers from somewhere for a cheap thrill. Or of a guy who just bought a load of clothes but hasnt really tried to look femme.
Ive tried my hardest to get my look right, drop weight, shave well and learn makeup, but people see crossdressers as the fat guy in an ill fitting dress.
Thats no me, Ive worked at it and I feel that if people see the title of Cross Dresser, they assume the worst.

Now, Im (Its me again, Smile) putting this up for debate, whether youre a UK lass or otherwise (please state in your reply) what do you think?
Do you think that 'Cross Dresser' carries a weight of seedy tone or gives you a lower impression of a person than someone who reffers to themselves as 'Transvestite' who has taken time to learn skills and craft an evolved feminine illusion beyond clothes and a wig?

No offence meant, just wanted your thoughts.

[whowhatwhen]

I think that to the people who care about labels we're all a bunch of hairy men in ill-fitting dresses.
This wouldn't matter in person because anyone would see that you've put effort into your appearance, online is different but everyone should take anything online with a grain of salt.

[Aprilrain]

If anything the opposite is true in the US. Transvestite=creepy CDer=dude in dress. In either case they mean the same thing, literally. I know people want to ascribe other meanings to the word transvestite but is basically Latin for CDer.
Trans=cross vestite=clothes or dress.

Anyway I look forward to this becoming a seething debate filled with flame wars and eventually "moderation" of some type : )

[Julogden]

I agree with April on this, here it's the opposite. "Transvestite" brings to mind an unhealthy mind-set based on compulsive fetishistic dressing, to me anyway. That's why the "crossdresser" term became popular, to make dressing sound less clinical and less of a disorder. Virginia Prince tried to introduce another term for CD's, femmiphile, lover of the feminine, but that sounds creepy and never caught on.

Carol

[ArleneRaquel]

To me " Transvestite " is a put down & an insulting term. I prefer to be called a crossdresser or a transgendered person.

[taís]

here in Brazil, transvestite ("travesti", most commonly in its slang "traveco") is a derogatory term. it implies one's a ******* hooker.

[candicd]

In my house, I'm known as Candi. :o)

OK....I hate labels and trying to make a joke. Here in the US, (I think) most people don't know the difference between transvestite, transgender and transexual. Sometimes I wonder if I have a clue. Although TV and CD can be used interchangably, I prefer the CD title. As Carol said, it sounds less clinical.

-Candi

[BRANDYJ]

I think your friend is wrong in her assumption of the general view of the public as to which term is derogatory. I hope some of other brits come in and comment. Crossdresser is not as clinical or viewed as perverted as those called transvestites.

[Beverley Sims]

Changing attitudes in society, the internet, informed education and a multitude of politically correct terms all have managed to denigrate the person who likes dressing up as opposed to the person undergoing transition.
Maybe I will express my desires as a "Dresser" and that is probably generic enough.

My name is Beverley and I am a dresser.:)

[Rianna Humble]

It does appear that this is another example of the famous quote about "two nations divided by a common language".

AFAICT, here in the UK, TV is more acceptable by the wider community than CD and in the 'States, it is the other way around.

When I was trying to get by as a CD, I got called out on a couple of sites which have more UK-based members because I did not want to call myself TV.

However around where I work in Brighton, CD seems to be a perfectly acceptable expression so who knows?

[~Joanne~]

To be honest, I don't like any of the terms, even CD. GG's wear men's clothes and such all the time, some may argue this statement as well but it's true as women will shop for themselves in a mens section without caring, which I have no problem with, but never be labeled as a CD. Men should have that same right as we are all equals correct? so why do we accept this label or any other?

I label myself as "Me". That's all I need to describe myself. I have no problem with being labeled these other terms because they don't bother me as much but I will not accept transvestite or sissy.

Now the real question is, why do all these threads come up in pairs of two or threes? lol I see one pantyhose thread then there is anther 5 minutes later. I just replied to a "sissy" thread and now there's this one lmfao

[Vicky_Scot]

Cross-dressing is the act of wearing clothing and other accoutrement commonly associated with the opposite sex.

Transvestism (also called transvestitism) is the practice of cross-dressing, which is wearing clothing traditionally associated with the opposite sex. Transvestite refers to a person who cross-dresses; however, the word often has additional connotations.

So the term CDand TV mean the same. Some definitions state that a crossdresser wears clothes of the opposite sex and transvestites wear clothes of the opposite sex for sexual gratification.So I amguessing this is what they mean by the word transvestite often has additional connotations.

At the end of the day society has to have everyone labeled and pigeon holed but at the end of the day I want tobe labeled 'Me'

[Aprilrain]

. GG's wear men's clothes and such all the time, some may argue this statement as well but it's true as women will shop for themselves in a mens section without caring, which I have no problem with, but never be labeled as a CD. Men should have that same right as we are all equals correct?

I dont know what kind of woman you hang out with but I don't know ANY who "wear men's clothes all the time"

No one is stopping you from "shopping in the (woman's) section without caring" other than you. Before I transitioned I shopped for woman's cloths in drab without so much as one comment EVER!

Men make up the "rights" they givith and takith away from woman all the time. It's only been in the last one billionth of a fraction of the entirty of human history that woman have had any "rights" at all. It would not take much for this fragile world civilization we enjoy to collapse and send us all back to the stone age where woman would be little more than the property of men. So quit your bitching!

[Renee W]

For me (and maybe a lot of people from my generation), if I were asked a couple of years ago (before I learned more about myself) to picture a transvestite, the image that immediately comes to mind is Oswald from the Drew Carey Show in the Rocky Horror Picture Show episode. If you asked me to picture a crossdresser, you could go to the same show and the episodes that have Drew's brother Steve in them.

So, if I were to tell someone outside of this community about myself, I would use the term crossdresser because I think it would paint a more favorable picture in their mind.

[Shananigans]

I'm in the US...

"Transvestite" sounds something an older person would say...I haven't heard people say it in a while. The term "crossdresser" is pretty self-explanatory, and there ARE varying degrees to which people crossdress. So, it might require (oh no!) getting to know someone to find out what "crossdresser" means to them.

You can clearly read on my driver's liscense that I'm a female, and most people will make presumptions based on that fact. Some of these presumptions are right and some are wrong...some things require you talk to me.

Labels are helpful, but they are only meant to be a guideline. Either term "crossdresser" or "transvestite" conveys to me someone of their natal sex dressing as the opposite sex. The degree to how they dress should be established by talking to tr person. However, though both words work, "transvestite" kinda makes you sound old.

[kimdl93]

I doubt that the public's stereotypical images are much different, regardless of the term being used. I could just as easily switch the words around in your friend's observation and make the same argument.

The label debate need not be a debate at all. We are not labels. We can use labels as abstractions to help in our understanding of who we are and what we do. Just as the word "book" isn't a book, but a representation of a book. But the word can help us communicate with and understand each other.

If people attach innacurate or unflattering stereotypes to a particular word, there's not much we can do about that. But we can conduct ourselves in accordance with our own understanding of ourselves...regardless of those stereotypes.

[Robyn7778]

The world is not as black and white as the label makers would like to make it. People seem to want to label others so to identify them. But labels don't clarify, rather, they tend to create greater misunderstanding. This is why I hate labels. For the truly open minded, a label is just that, a label - a starting point to understanding a person; their lifestyle, their philosophy, etc. But to the closed minded, it's a way of pigeon-holing people to segregate. They don't want to understand beyond their narrow interpretation. And this leads to polarization and further misunderstanding. In the end, it's not about what label is applied. It's about taking the time and effort to understand and accept the person or group beyond the label.

[drag n fly]

Good subject, Smile...Yes, I do think there's a negative stigma attached to both Transvestite and Crossdresser...We are misunderstood, and, as you say, thought of as some kind of panty stealing perverts...maybe even lumped in as sexual predators of some kind...I don't know which terminology has the least stigma attached...I go with crossdresser....but i also like transgendered...a tad more ambiguous, but correct...smooches Jackie

[Bree-asaurus]

Her response came as a shock. (This is not a direct quote, more of an aproximation)

CDs in this country (UK), and I dont know about overseas tend to be frowned upon purely for going by the title of Crossdresser. It conjures up images of hairy panty wearers who's robbed some knickers from somewhere for a cheap thrill. Or of a guy who just bought a load of clothes but hasnt really tried to look femme.
Ive tried my hardest to get my look right, drop weight, shave well and learn makeup, but people see crossdressers as the fat guy in an ill fitting dress.
Thats no me, Ive worked at it and I feel that if people see the title of Cross Dresser, they assume the worst.

Eddie Izzard is from the UK and is a self-proclaimed transvestite. An Executive Transvestite, no less!

[Julia_in_Pa]

Then of course you have the minority within the minority, the intersexed.
This usually conjours looks upon the faces of the majority of the population of " WTF does that mean? "
I usually tell them that we were historically referred to has hermaphrodites and is a genetic mutation.

Being the gender of our need and want as well as marrying the gender of our choice is not only the intersexed choice it's our birthright.

As for the rest of you that's for you to decide.

Julia