the finger-ring incident last straw > therapy (long thread)

[jaglover]

One or two readers may have surmised that my marriage is far from perfect. My wife says (when she mentions it) that CDing leaves her cold and she'd rather not discuss it/see it etc. On the other hand, on a few occasions over the years when she has seen me dressed she has always claimed she has no problem with it.

For all sorts of reasons there's no space to go into here, I believe her hostility is actually a facet of an overall dissatisfaction with the state of our marriage - principally relating to money and security - and without that being fixed, nothing can be considered.

So... I wear six (finger) rings - or at least I did until last weekend. One is my wedding ring. One I bought myself. One was a gift (from my wife) and the other three are technically hers. By 'technically' I mean that they were hers but over the years she'd become bored with them, left them lying around and I'd appropriated them. Note - I've worn these particular rings 24/7 for about three years. She was aware of them, as were everyone else in my family and social circle. No biggie, you'd have thought.

The only time I take my rings off are when doing DIY etc. and when I'm in the bath. This Sunday I had a long bath then floated around in a dressing gown for ages making lattes and so forth while my wife was around and apparently unperturbed. Then I went upstairs to get dressed and one of the rings was missing from the pile.

I took the bedroom apart, looked in the cat's favourite hiding places, looked down the sofa, looked round my desk etc etc and finally went to my wife and said I'm sorry but I've lost one of the rings - can you help me find it. She says "which ring is it?" so I describe it and she says "you mean, my ring?". You can guess where this going. After a moment the penny drops and I say "Are you saying you've taken the ring?" and she just repeats " it is my ring you know.". She wouldn't say the words "I took the ring" - and I basically lost my cool and started shouting about having taken half the house apart to find it and why couldn't she have said something, but she would only shrug. Our daughter heard the whole thing and was visibly upset.

She had taken one ring from the pile and hidden it, then decided not to say anything to me so I would panic and search and generally be discomfited.

Following this incident I had a long think and decided I should consider a therapist. One thing I want to understand is how much I am responsible for causing this irrational behaviour in my wife (this is just the final straw) and to what extent I should feel guilty about it as opposed to defending the general honesty and integrity (I believe) I've always tried to bring to our relationship.

I've made contact with a suitable professional who is asking what do I want to work on if we start a programme of sessions - and suddenly I don't know how to answer that. What DO I want to talk about?

[Foxglove]

If you don't know what to talk about, maybe you start with the ring. Why would a little thing like that cause such a big problem? Maybe that will kickstart you, and you'll start figuring out what you need to talk about.

I can appreciate your problem. If I had gone for therapy when my marriage was falling apart, I'm not sure I would have known where to start. But I think I would have got into it eventually.

Best wishes, Annabelle

[KarenCDFL]

In my opinion, what your wife did was just plain mean and a form of abuse.

From your posting, I gather that she was fully aware that you were using her rings and she intended to start something and get into an argument.

I wonder if she did that out of some kind of revenge and is she getting some kind of rush knowing she has hurt you to equal the score of Wife 1 - Hubby 0

It really bothers me when I read about this kind of interaction between SO's and married couples.


I think going to a therapist is an excellent idea.

[suchacutie]

The simple fact is that you can only be responsible for your actions and not the actions of others. There is a disconnect, that's for sure, one that I hope the therapist can help you bridge. The conversation is not happening and without that I'm not sure how anything can improve.

best wishes,

tina

[AllieSF]

Yes, I think a therapist may be the way to go, a therapist for joint sessions, you and your wife. If you cannot (you being both of you) honestly and openly, that is where to start. The CDing or whatever it is your style, may or may not be a major part in it all. I wish you good luck.

[Lorileah]

and I don't think it was mean....after all it was HER ring YOU appropriated.

She didn't gift it to you. Possession is NOT 9/10ths of the law.

She is conflicted with how you present that is true. So that would be a good place for you BOTH to start. At 200$ an hour you should really have an idea exactly what you need the therapist to help you with. What do you want from the relationship? What do you want from dressing? And how can they help you with your kleptomania and possessiveness?

[Chickhe]

I can't figure out my wife either... she may think I'm crazy, but I think she is the one who needs help. Sounds like she was trying to be playful, didn't excute it quite right and and you took it the wrong way...

[Inna]

I am at loss as to the question at hand? Do you want to figure out your self and perhaps trans issues that go with it or do you want to get your marriage in line or happiness back into your relationship?

[Miriam-J]

As Lorileah reminded you, it really is her ring - as are the others. You might start by respecting her boundaries, though perhaps those should be clarified as well. While therapy might help, it's only likely to work if you have some specific areas that you want to work out. You should first just try to work out the communication between you and your wife, and you don't necessarily need a therapist for that.

Miriam

[~Joanne~]

Give her all of her rings back and go out and buy some of your own. that seems to be the simplest solution to the problem. Why she waited 3 years to take one of them back baffles me unless she was truly being spiteful. I always thought that two people in a long term relationship or marriage got rid of the me/mine and replaced them with ours/we. I could be wrong as My GF does the same with constant reminders.

Therapy might help or might break the bank, maybe you just need to sit down and talk with her. See where her frame of mind currently is as all of a sudden it has changed.

[Laura912]

Must agree with Lorileah, technically, but you need an unbiased third party here to sort out this Gideon knot of a marriage.

[kimdl93]

wow, that's a good place to start the conversation, as Annabelle suggests. Passive aggressive behavior, as your wife exhibits is one of the problems. Your response is another. Really, both of you need to learn to communicate more effectively.

Relationships may be strained by finances, but they are destroyed by the clumsy, hurtful and counter-productive ways that people habitually communicate.

[Leelou]

Well, since you asked, I'd ask the therapist how to deal with your wife when she pulls little passive-aggressive stunts. And please, don't take this as a slam on you, but I bet the therapist would suggest that responding with losing your cool and shouting probably wasn't the best reaction--especially since it disturbed your daughter.

[Stephenie S]

Whoa now, girl!

Irrational behavior in your WIFE??

You're the one who lost your cool, flipped out, took half the house apart, started shouting, and you want to examine HER irrational behavior?? She just picked up a ring. A ring which you describe as hers to begin with.

I think you might want to examine some irrational behavior here, but I don't think it was her behavior.

Think about it, then maybe apologize for flipping out? And maybe get yourself some rings of your own.

Stephie

[Tamara Croft]

There has to be more to this story than her just taking the ring and hiding it to piss you off... Besides, it was her ring to take back, did you tell her you took them in the first place? By the sound of your post, it seems you took them because she left them lying around, well you left them lying around, she just took back what was hers, she didn't need your permission to take them, because you didn't get her permission in the first place to wear them... you assumed because she was 'bored' with them, you'd just take them.... pot/kettle...

As for screaming at her, well maybe you need some anger management therapy, going off the deep end for something trivial like that is a bit OTT don't you think? especially for something that wasn't even yours in the first place. As to why she took it back, how about asking her instead of acting like that?

[Sheila11]

If one little ring is "the last straw" then you are just looking for an excuse.

[TGMarla]

You really feel some need to wear six rings on your fingers? It's important enough to you to allow it to interfere with your marriage? It's obvious that she's not down with it, or she'd have not bothered to take HER ring back.

I mean, come on!

[jaglover]

Well, OK. Thanks to all who chipped in. Based on the above clearly I'm the one with the problem. Foolishly I thought that if you use something that belongs to your spouse, with their knowledge and consent, for three years, then if they covertly hide it in order to freak you out and then refuse to admit doing so even when confronted then you're being got at, not the other way around - but I'm always ready to learn. And of course TGMaria, anyone that wears six rings is asking for trouble.

[TGMarla]

Who's "TGMaria"?

I never said that wearing rings was asking for trouble. I asked whether your need to do so was worth more to you than your marriage.

[jaglover]

Who's "TGMaria"?

I never said that wearing rings was asking for trouble. I asked whether your need to do so was worth more to you than your marriage.

Please excuse my typo.

For what it's worth; the number of rings I wear, or not, is of no consequence to me - certainly compared to my marriage. I'm sorry if I somehow implied that it was. If I want to replace the ring she has hidden, or the other two I gave back to her, I'll buy them.

I clearly failed to communicate my original issue to the forum when I started this thread for which I apologise to all and let's just leave it there.

[Kerstin]

It sounds like she got the reaction she wanted. Clearly it's about more than the ring. If she's got something on her mind she should just come out and say it and not play silly games. She said she doesn't want to discuss the CD issue, but clearly she wants to communicate something about it. You're husband and wife, get all the cards on the table. Try not to lose your cool, it puts you in a weaker position.

[Tamara Croft]

with their knowledge and consent, for three years

Uhm, consent?


By 'technically' I mean that they were hers but over the years she'd become bored with them, left them lying around and I'd appropriated them.

That's not consent, you took them...

[DonnaT]

I've made contact with a suitable professional who is asking what do I want to work on if we start a programme of sessions - and suddenly I don't know how to answer that. What DO I want to talk about?
1) How to get your wife to be more open and straight forward with what is bothering her. Without causing an argument.

2) All the things that are bothering you with respect to your marriage. Then figure out if they are little things or part of a larger picture.

3) All the things you adore about your wife, and why you two married in the first place.

My son-in-law once asked how my wife and I have stayed married for so long. I told him I don't sweat the little (or not so little) things, and have never started an argument with my wife.

[jaglover]

Uhm, consent?



That's not consent, you took them...

Oh boy look I'm now wishing I'd never started this. I wore these rings for three years. In front of her (and the rest of the world). If I think back hard enough I can remember at least one occasion when my wife referred to them - as I recall she suggested that a particular ring would better on the other hand from the one I was wearing it on because she thought it 'fought' with the wedding ring - in such a way as to acknowledge my permission to wear them. Please everybody just forget it. The blasted ring is not the issue.

[Tamara Croft]

The blasted ring is not the issue.

And there it is, the ring isn't the issue at all, so what is the issue exactly? Unless you tell us the full story, instead of making out like you had a hissy fit over a ring, how are we supposed to help you?

[Miranda-E]

A simple honest "I'm taking my ring back" would have avoided the whole situation.
Unfortunately vindictive games seem to be the popular choice.

[PretzelGirl]

You might start by respecting her boundaries, though perhaps those should be clarified as well.

This is the key point to me. The rings are just a tool right now. You are overly mad about one disappearing and she took one to get a point across. You may be right about needing therapy. You two need to be sitting down and talking it out. Right now it sounds like anger and manipulation are more rampant. How far are you wanting to go in your presentation? What are her boundaries? Maybe she has been insinuating some boundaries and you missed it. Maybe it is wearing 6 rings daily and that is the reason behind her taking one.

The big point is you will never know if the two of you don't sit down and calmly discuss what is going on and how both of you are feeling. Get back to ground zero and start building up a list of feelings and agreements/compromises. It sounds like there is a bit to work through.

[Tina B.]

Your wife is a sneak thief, If I took my wifes ring, because she wasn't using it, 3 days, or three years, it wouldn't matter, she would pick it up, put it on and dare me to say a word, but I'm smarter than that.
when it comes to clothes, or Jewelry, what is her's is hers, and what is mine is mine,neither of us would ever think to "borrow", with out asking. of course,neither of us have ever told the other one no, unless it's something that could be stretched out of shape. And it keeps the peace, we all have a right to at lest a few things that is ours and not joint property.
Mary M. and Sue are right, It's about boundaries, and respecting each other as equals.
Tina B.

[Momarie]

A simple honest "I'm taking my ring back" would have avoided the whole situation.
Unfortunately vindictive games seem to be the popular choice.

A simple honest "I am taking your rings" would have avoided the whole situation.

Unfortunately, vindictive games seem to be a poor substitute for communication for you too.

[Miranda-E]

Unfortunately, vindictive games seem to be a poor substitute for communication for you too.

want to explain that? I'm one of the few upfront non-gameplaying people on the board.

[Momarie]

want to explain that? I'm one of the few upfront non-gameplaying people on the board.

I apologize, my comment was meant for the OP not to you directly.

It seems the wife in this story is accused of many things, among them being vindictive...
I was just pointing out vindictiveness seemed to be a poor substitute for communication on his part.

Again I'm sorry, I can see now reading it back how you might think I was directing my post to you, which wasn't my intention.

[Miranda-E]

no problem :)

misunderstandings happen

I apologize, my comment was meant for the OP not to you directly.

.
the op could have handled things better.

[suchacutie]

Jag, your wife wanted to get a rise out of you and she was successful. I can't fathom the reasons because I'm not trained to do that, but please understand that many of us see that the communication issues between the two of you are not positive. We really hope that the two of you can work on this to make both of your lives better.

with hope,
tina

[DianeSusanne]

Perhaps Jag, she wanted to find out if you were borrowing her ring or if it now belonged to your crossdressing self?

I think you did the original 'wrong' when you appropriated the rings but her taking it and hiding it was definately a spiteful action. Is she the kind of person that you know does spiteful things (not just in relation to your crossdressing -- but in other things as well)? Is she the kind of person to try to find out where she stands in relation to others (and not just in relation to your crossdressing)? When it is calm and quiet at night, do you get the feeling that she wants to leave or stay? You've implied that money and security are issues in your marriage; if they make you angry perhaps they terrify her.

Perhaps you should ask her: "If everything was financially secure and fine; would you leave me or would you stay?"

You might have an answer and a direction to work towards. Once you know the direction, then you can gain much more from counseling.

Oh, and either return her rings or ask her if they can be yours.