Y-women and X-men

[juno]

I was thinking about genetics, after reading about the transwoman booted from Miss Canada. There are many "natural born" women who have a Y chromosome and never know it, due to AIS. Collectively, I we could refer to all of us Y-women, as in women with a Y chromosome.

For a similar status of men without a Y chromosome, we could refer to transmen as X-men. The transmen should like that, because it means they have super powers.

(Mostly for fun)

[Frances]

That is what irks me so much when I read comments on journalistic Web sites. People ungender trans women based on chromosones all the time, as if one caracteristic of gender is the only valid parameter. "Whatever he says, he will always a mutilated man because he has a Y chromonse." I don't know what my karyotype is, and very few people do. There may as much as 1 in 500 men who are XXY. Some of the women commenting negatively may be XY themselves.

It pisses me off to no end. Gender is so much more complex, which is why that "natural born women only" may apply in the case of contestent, even though she was born with a penis. Prejudice dies hard in our case. We have come far, but there is still so much support for hatred from the religious, medical and governmental establishments. Not voting laws that protect us and keeping the mental illness qualifier fuels the misconception and hatred in my opinion.

[sandra-leigh]

I no longer remember why, but when I was in grade school, I remember wondering whether I was genetically male or something else, and I used to be worry that maybe I was not genetically male. I was picked on fairly regularly for no good reason, and I felt if there had been something unusual in my body development, I would never hear the end of the taunts, as then there would be a real reason.

The peak of my anxiety was perhaps when I started going through puberty and developed hard discs under my nipples; of course "cancer" came to mind, but what came to mind even more strongly was "Oh no, I'm developing breasts!!!" I was very much relieved when the doctor said that the discs were common and would go away naturally in 8 or so months, which they did.

These days I look at aspects such as my 2-4 digit ratio, and my general body development (e.g., not much body hair), and I tend to think, "You know, there must have been some genetic oddity for me." But I've read about the typical symptoms for (e.g.) XXY, and I just don't fit.

My life... I just seemed destined to break the rules, to be the exception to the exceptions. Sometimes it feels like it would be easier if I had something like KS, because then it would be a somewhat known quantity, a "reason", known treatments, and guidelines of what typical development is like. Instead, it's like I'm making everything up as I go along.

One of my big problems as a teen was fear of making the wrong decision, and now I'm living a life where there might not be any "right" decisions.

On fear of wrong decisions: typelogic (http://typelogic.com/intp.html) describes it well:


A major concern for INTPs is the haunting sense of impending failure. They spend considerable time second-guessing themselves. The open-endedness (from Perceiving) conjoined with the need for competence (NT) is expressed in a sense that one's conclusion may well be met by an equally plausible alternative solution, and that, after all, one may very well have overlooked some critical bit of data. An INTP arguing a point may very well be trying to convince himself as much as his opposition.

[Andie Elisabeth]

Collectively, I we could refer to all of us Y-women, as in women with a Y chromosome. For a similar status of men without a Y chromosome, we could refer to transmen as X-men.

X-men, why not? But Y-women, did you pronounced it aloud before you wrote it down? Transwomen is better because it states facts and doesn't question whether or not she has a right to be a woman.

EDIT: In some languages it could be read as ypsilon-women /'i:psɪlɒn/ Which I like even less. I hope I got the IPAs right. (^_^)



These days I look at aspects such as my 2-4 digit ratio, and my general body development (e.g., not much body hair), and I tend to think, "You know, there must have been some genetic oddity for me." But I've read about the typical symptoms for (e.g.) XXY, and I just don't fit.

When it comes to 2-4 digit ratio I am statistically a woman. Otherwise I am as hairy as hobbit may be more :sad:


My life... I just seemed destined to break the rules, to be the exception to the exceptions.

Don't worry I am throwing exceptions as I go since 2nd grade. We do what we have to do and breaking the unwritten rules and working around the system that "normal" people work within are sometimes necessities.


One of my big problems as a teen was fear of making the wrong decision, and now I'm living a life where there might not be any "right" decisions.

From INTJ's perspective: What's your mission? When you have mission then you have goals, steps et so on. "Wrong" decisions can delay your arrival to the destination you set and reset as you go but will not stop you unless they are the fatal ones.

[Kathryn Martin]

Who has had their genes tested?

[Julia_in_Pa]

I have. I'm 47 XXY.


Julia

[Frances]

I have. I'm 47 XXY.


Julia

That proves my point. The one person who has been tested has an atypical karyotype. Maybe most of us do.

[Noemi]

Some of the points raised here are good to hear today. Gender is complex, don't we know it. So much existing outside the box, I have been trying for years to fit into and am now realizing that that is not going to happen. I still am second guessing myself, I have no support and am depressed I am sorry to say, because I do not know what how I am to proceed. Well my intellect has answers, like build a new box, and learn from those who have gone before me, but I am scared and feel alone today.
XMan Mutant for sure LOL, I used to collect those and Spiderman.

[sandra-leigh]

That proves my point. The one person who has been tested has an atypical karyotype. Maybe most of us do.

I'm not sure it proves anything. Julia and Melody have each often posted about discovering being intersexed. IS people are more likely to have themselves tested, if only to determine which genetic variety of intersex they are so as to have a better basis to make medical decisions.

[Kathryn Martin]

I will get tested after surgery just to know. I have a suspicion though.

[Frances]

I will get tested after surgery just to know. I have a suspicion though.

It cost around $1200 in Montreal to be tested.

[Frances]

I'm not sure it proves anything. Julia and Melody have each often posted about discovering being intersexed. IS people are more likely to have themselves tested, if only to determine which genetic variety of intersex they are so as to have a better basis to make medical decisions.

Not all IS conditions are obvious enough for doctors to have the patient tested. Dr. Schaawb's research points to physiological differences in the brain of transsexuals. That sounds like IS to me. My point was that are many components to gender and focussing on chromozones only is a mistake. Especially when they may be way more atypical people than we think.

[Amber99]

Wolverine is one of the X-men.

But seriously how much does it cost to get a karyotype? I'm super curious about it.

[noeleena]

Hi,

To base what we are on this test is quite wrong we can have any number of x's & or Y's & mixed & more x,' & y's, it does not tell us very much , for those of us who are intersexed,

we can be one or the other or not its not that , that detemins what we are , theres so much more, & we have more info now than many years ago..

I know what i am & it has no bearing on any thing,
we have both sets of hormones , well most people do , the how much depends on a lot of other things that have happened long before conceptsion,

even before we are born ,& what is seen at birth does not mean we are male with external parts or a woman who has none internal & some of us have both , some women are born with out a womb, think about that & see what it feels like or my case ......not......you wont to go insane , think about us women who cant have babys . yea well my rant,

...noeleena...

[ReineD]

The condition is not even that uncommon and I've seen no information to suggest that the occurence of transgenderism among XXY persons is any different from that in the general population. I know its not the cause of my TG status, more of an interesting coincidence.

There is just as much misinformation about IS as there is about TG, and because of this people lump them together.

This is the best explanation of gender from a physical point of view that I've run across:

http://www.isna.org/faq/what_is_intersex