Change in the Social norm

[JessHaust]

I really noticed something different this past weekend and it has taken me a bit to understand it.
I went out to dinner Saturday night with 3 CD friends and my Wife and daughter before a theater event. We decided to go to the Spaghetti Warehouse in the West End development, downtown Dallas. This is an old established tourist destination and is filled on the weekends with people from every walk of life. We had a 45 minute wait for out table. As we mingled with the general crowd, also waiting for a table, we would get various looks from smiles to bland stares to mild looks of shock.
This was completely to be expected, particularly when you consider one of my friends was 6' 5" before heels.
What struck me was that there were no comments, either directed at us or even behind our backs, at least not that could be heard by the crowd. Why this struck me is that it is now not socially acceptable to openly display the prejudice that would have years ago allowed those who disliked us to speak up. In fact there was a time that people would not only have spoken, but social pressure would have compelled those who did not disapprove to speak out against us just to fit into society.
But our society has changed to one where those who vocally express feelings of prejudice are no longer tolerated in general public. Yes, of course they will speak of it in private. But no longer in public.

[AllieSF]

Texas leads in some things and is catching up in others. Glad to see that they are catching up in this area.

[KellyJameson]

I'm glad to see Dallas is changing, I did my graduate work at SMU in the late nineties and coming from Los Angeles it was a cultural shock. I did find Texans to be some of the warmest people I have ever met in the United States and Dallas has a vibrant gay community that I found shelter in. In general I found Dallas and Austin to be more liberal and open minded than other areas of Texas but I was always cautious in public if I was wearing anything other than pants and felt a guy was checking me out, making my escape before he could fiqure out something was amiss never being sure how he would react if he knew the truth where on the west coast I do not worry about it as much.

Some of my fondest memories were going to the West End and the Spagetti Wharehouse with one night particularly funny watching two couples on a date together. One guy who had far to much to drink would pass out and fall face first into his spagetti and the other three from embarrassment would just pretend everything was normal and ignore him. He would wake up with sauce all over his face and than fall back into the spagetti snoring into his plate, the whole restaurant was laughing and everyone was coming from all corners to see it.

I had several friends from school of the cowboy persuasion and I was always on edge never knowing what they would do next and if it would land me in jail for the night, Texans know how to have fun and the cops know it. I miss the people, the storms and the beautiful glass buildings.

[DanaR]

I agree, the general attitude is more accepting that what it used to be. You still need to be careful where you go though.

[noeleena]

Hi,

Thinking about this as a rank outsider, would you say the attitude is still the same & people just dont so much say any thing out loud . because when i was talking to a friend on an other forum & i said because im intersexed would i be accepted , as being different & seen as different, so i was a bit more than surprised to hear many over your way would not accept us period , because iof being different,
So the attitude has not changed has it, yet were you to come over here you would be more accepted in the main.

Of cause this will depend on who you know & where you go & are seen with.

Again its not what your saying its whats not being said or the undertow,

...noeleena...

[JessHaust]

Noeleena,
I do think that the attitude has changed, many, many people I meet are genuinely friendly and most of all curious. Women in general seem to be the most accepting. I know that it is not the rule, but in general people's attitude toward us has changed, and I believe the change in what is socially acceptable to speak out against has helped this situation. There will always be those that dislike us or don't understand us. But these days those who are the most vocal are usually seen as someone with the bigger problem. Guys who boast too much about their manhood are now perceived as having some issue with their manhood they are ashamed of. I think it is exactly the fact the we do what we do that is perceived as brave and that we are actually being who we are instead of pretending to be what we are not.
I can not speak for everywhere in the U.S., but I can say that in this city you would be accepted by most.

[kimdl93]

I hadn't really given it much thought, but I suppose this is true. Its nice to know that things do actually change, even here in Texas.

[Cheryl T]

Sometimes it's not that openly showing prejudice is not accepted it's that people are so accustomed to being in their little bubble (car for example) where they can make any vocal comment they please that they are scared of repercussions in it's done in public.
It's like people cutting you off on the highway, you can say what you want and they can't hear it....but cut in line at a bank and be told off and they are super embarrassed.

[Abby74]

I don't think anything is changing for the better I just believe people don't care. Look at how people drive and act at work. People think about themselves and that's it.

[Barbara Ella]

I think both are changing, but attitude does not change as quickly as behavior. But I do believe attitude is changing as education efforts begin to reach more people, and the youth begin to assume higher positions within the public structure. Some places are changing faster than others.

I do believe that behaviorally a greater number of the public are becoming intolerant of those who would ruin their own evening by spewing hate in a crowd, so yes they are tolerating more and behaving respectfully even if they still hate in private.

Good observation Jess. One I have only seen from the other side of the dress...sigh.

Barbara

[Chickhe]

Everyone is watching 'what would you do?'... I really do think the tide is slowly changing and its really nice to see it happening in down economic times...

[busker]

I really noticed something different this past weekend and it has taken me a bit to understand it.
I went out to dinner Saturday night with 3 CD friends and my Wife and daughter before a theater event. We decided to go to the Spaghetti Warehouse in the West End development, downtown Dallas. This is an old established tourist destination and is filled on the weekends with people from every walk of life. We had a 45 minute wait for out table. As we mingled with the general crowd, also waiting for a table, we would get various looks from smiles to bland stares to mild looks of shock.
This was completely to be expected, particularly when you consider one of my friends was 6' 5" before heels.
What struck me was that there were no comments, either directed at us or even behind our backs, at least not that could be heard by the crowd. Why this struck me is that it is now not socially acceptable to openly display the prejudice that would have years ago allowed those who disliked us to speak up. In fact there was a time that people would not only have spoken, but social pressure would have compelled those who did not disapprove to speak out against us just to fit into society.
But our society has changed to one where those who vocally express feelings of prejudice are no longer tolerated in general public. Yes, of course they will speak of it in private. But no longer in public.

Jess, isn't this the same hypocrisy that sort of disappeared around the end of the 1960's? suddently, the things that nobody acknowledged were no longer taboo after say 1970. Now it's back. Nobody talked about affairs but it didn't mean that there weren't any. It could be that social conservatism has made a comeback. you know, what goes around...... II don't remember who made the remark in a post about a week ago, but I think they were right. We will have to convert one heart and one mind at a time to accept our desired life style . That people are no longer talking in public is probably not a sign, but it could be, I suppose. It depends on the locations and how educated and liberal people are. There was an interesting article in the NYT a few days ago about a daughter making a documentary film about her TG father, an artist. After 15 years or so of his changing his name, there are people in his own town of 6K that still do not talk to him. Shattuck is his name is you want to look up the article.

[Eryn]

There are a lot of things going for us when we are out in public, Most people are engrossed in their own lives and friends and don't pay close attention to much outside of these. The few who do notice us might suspect something, but even if they do what would they say? Civilized people don't stare and point. It would be terribly embarrassing to misidentify someone's gender and there are plenty of GGs out there with masculine features. From the POV of most people it wouldn't be worth the risk so they will choose to keep their thoughts to themselves.

The only danger occurs when that inhibition is not present, either due to social inexperience or alcohol.

[Jacqueline Winona]

Agree with everyone, dressing isn't that big of a deal, for most people in most places. There are a-holes everywhere, that comment on anything they don't like, approve of, or understand, but most people just couldn't care less. Now if this thinking would only help me get over my fears of going out anywhere. :)