This is driving me nuts

[TeresaL]

My SO wants it to stay for a guarantee that I won't crossdress. She might be ok if the goat was shaved, but not both.

[Davena Doll]

Your SO wants it to stay, that does not meen it has to.

[sissystephanie]

I guess if you want to crossdress, you are going to have to find another SO. On the other hand, if you really love your SO, the hair will stay but the crossdressing will go!! It really is very simple, which do you love the most?

[busker]

Well, how exactly will it guarantee that you won't dress. You could be a man in a dress--there are a number here who do have hair in all the right places and go out dressed. what is she giving up if you respond in the affirmative? That really is a game of blackmail and it usually ends badly. Resentment sets in and that's that. She is obviously not supportive of your CD interests. Is CDing something which you cannot live without?

[Kelly DeWinter]

Riiiiiiight, It will gaurentee you won't crossdress. hmmmmmmmm, how's that going ? This is ment as a chuckle moment.

[TeresaL]

It's been a game we've played for over fifteen years when she found out about my cross dressing. Everytime I shave it off she goes into a hysterical rage. Then the cycle repeats, she then believes the powers of Randall Wayne has healed me, and I will CD no more.

So yes, I've thought about divorce, but it just doesn't seem logical to separate and break the bonds of marriage only on the grounds that I have this abberation. Cross dressing is not an easy thing to quit and never return.

[sandra-leigh]

My SO wants it to stay for a guarantee that I won't crossdress.

One of the members of our local crossdressing society showed up to meetings with a beard for a couple of years, due to a no-shave agreement with her wife. I gather that in some clubs this would have been a big No No, but I never had any problem with her doing what she had to do.

[TeresaL]

I must add that back then, I was doing DIY HRT and lining up with Dr Srang for SRS. At least I didn't go through with it.

EDIT: That was over fifteen years ago.

So now, I am retired while she is away at work. I've started cross dressing for the umpteenth time and aim to hold it at that and not advance to the transsexual stage.

[outhiking]

I could never promise to quit CD'ing because I know I can't and I'd end up breaking the promise. I made it three years once, but by the end I was spending every moment thinking about it and fantisizing. I finally realized that it's not an addiction, it's part of who I am. BTW - the dry spell was my choice, not something for my SO. As for the facial hair, it is your face. Do you tell her how to get her hair cut?

[Leslie Langford]

It's been a game we've played for over fifteen years when she found out about my cross dressing. Everytime I shave it off she goes into a hysterical rage. Then the cycle repeats, she then believes the powers of Randall Wayne has healed me, and I will CD no more.

So yes, I've thought about divorce, but it just doesn't seem logical to separate and break the bonds of marriage only on the grounds that I have this abberation. Cross dressing is not an easy thing to quit and never return.

"...Everytime I shave it off she goes into a hysterical rage...?"

I would hazard a guess from that comment that your wife's refusal to accept your crossdressing is only part of a larger problem. The real problem is that she sounds like a total control freak, and is using guilt and shame along with that to try to manipulate you. How is this working for you in other aspects of your married life?

[Babeba]

I must add that back then, I was doing DIY HRT and lining up with Dr Srang for SRS. At least I didn't go through with it.

EDIT: That was over fifteen years ago.

So now, I am retired while she is away at work. I've started cross dressing for the umpteenth time and aim to hold it at that and not advance to the transsexual stage.

I am a little bit confused. I thought that being transsexual was a different thing entirely than being a cross dresser?
Deep down inside, where the clothes and the facial hair don't matter, what gender are you?

[Barbara Ella]

OK, so it really is more than just crossdressing that is tied to the facial hair! Without it you were moving toward being transsexual. that says a lot about what is in her mind. Is it the crossdressing, or the possibility that it will once again progress to a transsexual experience for you. There is a big difference in the wife's mind over these two outcomes. If you have no desire to progress to transsexual at this time, reassure her, and tell her you will keep the hair, but you are going to cross dress. If you can do this and honestly mean it, I think you may be able to work something out with her. Just understand her fears, and learn what they are. Just feels like something deeper is lurking here in her mind. Just try to understand it.

Barbara

[ReineD]

So just to get a timeline, you're retired now and she found out about 15 years ago when you were around 50. How long had you been married, and how did she find out?

Had you started taking hormones before she found out?

[manemami]

i have just passed through this phase, i have taken permission from wife to remove beards at list once, my daughters objected and reacted very strangely but i have gone ahead and now my wife agreed to continue and daughters have taken soft stance, and me enjoying the fruits feeling free to enjoy full crossdressing you must go ahead nobody will object it is your fundamental right

[AllieSF]

Ya gotta do what ya gotta do. If you believe Stephanie, you can stop if you really want to, but I have never heard of anyone on this site giving it up. Stephanie said she did and the restarted because her wife asked her to, but who really knows? Love has nothing to do with it in my opinion. If you can stop and you want to, then go for it. However, if the truth is that you personally cannot stop, then you already know that further down the road, with or without your SO's knowledge, you will want to, and probably will, start dressing again. That sounds like a vicious circle to me with no true resolution in site. It may be time to face reality and have that hard discussion with your SO and then make the harder, and hopefully mutual, decision to be able to live your life as is necessary for you, with or without her. It sounds harsh, but how many times do you want to fool her and yourself? Good luck with whatever you decide.

[jillleanne]

Guarantee???? Why not just go get one from the local muffler shop and sign it for her? Worth about the same amount. Sounds like you are not sure who you are. You looked into SRS? So did I but I never had any intention of going forward at the time but it was fun learning about it and I wanted to know more about it, period.. DIY hrt? What kind exactly. Herbal? That is not HRT.
Seems very logical to me that if someone in a relationship cannot truly be who they are on a daily basis because the s/o in the relationship cannot/does not understand the intricities of another and is unwilling to learn and accept, a divorce would be justifiable and accceptable. Who says two people are supposed to live unhappily together? Why not live unhappily apart? Might even happen one or more might become happy living apart? I think you may need to sit down, explain who you are, if you know, and try to find some level of acceptance between you both. If you can do that, there is hope in the long run. If not, you soon grow old fast.

[Cheryl T]

My question would be does she love you or just you when you have facial hair?

[BRANDYJ]

My past wife (died in 1984), used to like me wearing a mustache. I hate them. But to please her, every now and then I'd grow one until the thing bothered me enough to shave it off. It had nothing to do with my crossdressing. The damn stache tickled, and irritated me. Funny thing is, I would not crossdress while I had the mustache. Not because my wife cared, she was very accepting of my dressing, but because I can't stand the sight of me or any man with facial hair in women's clothes. When I dress, I want to look as much as I can like a woman, so facial hair doesn't cut it.

[TeresaL]

First, no divorce suggestions please. Second, HRT is HRT. Not herbals, LOL.

I'm doing my level best to avoid both. Agent Orange has landed me in the VA and they've put me on Finasteride for BPH. FLO-Max has run it's course and no longer effective. It's triggered my TG side again, even though it's only one third of the HRT set.

That being said, I want to remain CD and not escalate. What then can I do about the facial hair?
Shave it w/o asking.
Block it
Shave it close
Shave goat and make pencil mustache
???

[Maria 60]

I don't know if this will help but, we have a summer cabin and my wife doe's not like it, but she will come with me to make me happy but you can tell she doesn't like it there. I would like to go more but i don't push it. My dad has past away and when he was alive i told him she doesn't like it, he said to me, nothing is forever in life, you don't know what can happen, in less then 24hrs your hole life can change, you don't know if she will leave you, or you will leave her or you will divorce. In other words, what isn't good for this women might be good for the next one. So for now use the cabin as much as you can and don't sell it for her, because you don't know what tomorrow will bring and try to do things that make you happy after all where only here once there is no second chance. I hope this made some form of sense.

[gender_blender]

Shave the SO and get a new one.

[Tina B.]

I must be the most selfish person in the world, but no one, is going to tell me I have to have facial hair, if I don't want it. If she wants a real man, then tell her she's got one, a real man follows is own path!
When Grandpa loaded that covered wagon and headed west, grandma didn't want to give up the comforts of the east, but she was a wife, and did as she was told, is got in the wagon and kept her mouth shut. That's the way real men did it! Now, in todays world, do you think she really wants a real man?
As for a guarantee you won't dress, somebody tell butterfly Bill to give back that dress, or shave!
I once wore a beard for 2 or 3 years, and wore out more than one skirt in that time. The need to dress doesn't care about beards, or fat or ugly, it ju Your just going to have to make her realize life just doesn't come with that type of guarantee.
Tina B.

[TeresaL]

I'm gong to put all the advice in a shaker and shake out an answer. Stay tuned, I'm shaking.

[Ressie]

Of course, you'll still have the ability to CD with the beard. But it will be difficult to look in the mirror and see a female. That's why I shaved mine off as soon as my controlling wife left me. Sure I get lonely, but it's peaceful.

Relationships are rarely ideal. An ideal relationship is where both people support each other's wants and needs. Unfortunately, most relationships become adversarial or antagonistic which results in the "SO" trying to change the other person into what they want, instead of supporting their partner's choices. People become attached to others that aren't right for them and out of fear stay with that person.

Since divorce is out of the question, you'll have to negotiate. Request her to do something out of the question as a compromise? I wish I could be more helpful.

[Shelly Preston]

It looks like you may have a big problem sorting this out with your SO

Its you body and you should be able to choose how it looks

Trying to promise you wont crossdress hmmm good luck with that idea. ( I am sure it is possible but extremely difficult)

It does sound like there is more going on ?

[Juliana Hart]

I really hate to say this Teresa, but I think you've already lost the battle. Your wife exhibits a classic case of passive/agressive behavior. How do I know? I was the recipient of the same manipulative behavior many, many years ago. My guess is that there's lots of other things where she applies the same standards on you because she has you wearing facial hair. For me, after years of this type of abuse, I had lost all of my dignity, became extremely depressed and finally sought help. Group therapy provided some insight for me that led me to the path of filing for divorce. It was such a relief. It didn't take long for me to return to my fun-loving, confident self. I have never looked back. That was 26 years ago. I'm not advocating such drastic action for you, I just wanted to let you know that I've been there, done that.

Juli

[Amanda22]

This sounds like a relationship with an issue. I'm sorry to say that, but that's my impression.

[Beverley Sims]

I think we all agree you have a manipulative control woman for a wife.
Do you defy her or go the other extreme for a while.

[Stephanie47]

I think her insistence on facial hair is her way of forcing herself to ignore the truth, i.e., her man is a cross dresser. I'm sure she has figured out you cross dress in her absence. I'm a retiree with a working wife. I am assuming she is aware I engage in cross dressing when she is gone because she has found feminine clothing I forgot to put away before she got home or water balloons used as breast forms in the kitchen sink. Opps! I think she has a mental image of you en femme which she can wipe away with your facial hair. Many times I feel the necessity to shave closely, but, I don't because it's too much effort. That's when I choose not to apply any makeup. Other times I want to shave as close as possible.

What will happen if she becomes determined to drive the cross dressing out of you? I know if I was given an ultimatum I would leave my marriage. I am who I am. I have accepted myself. I no longer engage in self loathing, self hate.

You made reference to Agent Orange, so you must be a Nam vet. I was a combat infantryman and attend various therapy for PTSD. Let me tell you, the Stephanie side has become very useful in pushing her twin to the back of the mind. Stephanie has been very instrumental in relieving stress and the excessive reactions due to stress. My therapist asks sometimes what I do to get through the day when alone. Some vets have sought relief with drugs and alcohol. I get my relief by wearing a dress. Too bad society thinks wearing a dress is worse than drug and alcohol abuse.

[sandra-leigh]

My wife has asked me not to remove my facial hair. Shaving is okay with her, but as time goes on she expresses preference for beard or mustache. I gather it is a symbol to her that I am still a guy. No rage, just "Please?"

I have gone along with her wishes on this matter because it is important to her and has not been important to me; an area I have been willing to compromise on. And I can shave any time I feel it worth the effort.

I am, however, thinking about getting it thinned, maybe a few weeks from now; my beard hairs these days have quite a bit of white so if I don't get it thinned by laser now it becomes much more expensive and painful to do by electrolysis later.

[ReineD]

I think you've already lost the battle. Your wife exhibits a classic case of passive/agressive behavior.

Not to single out your post or anything, but it takes two people to get into the passive/agressive behavior dynamics. My ex and I also had similar issues although not related to any crossdressing.

True, Teresa's wife appears to be trying to control Teresa's CDing through requiring that Teresa maintain the facial hair, but Teresa also is going along with it. In other words, Teresa can and should let her wife know that the presence or absence of facial hair is separate and distinct from a desire to crossdress. Case in point, Teresa is here trying to figure out how to get around the beard and still CD, which in a way is a form of hiding which is also passive/agressive behavior. Teresa is telling herself, "Fine. I'll either go ahead and shave it without discussing it with her, or I'll keep the beard and figure out a way that I can still do what I want" (see post #19).

They would both be better served by getting down to basics and discussing Teresa's needs, and either coming up with boundaries to manage the cross-gender expression or moving on, instead of making it all about the issue of whether or not Teresa should shave.

[RADER]

Teresa;
I am in a similar boat. I have a Stash also, and the wife says it stays.
She will let me dress around the "Closet" as much as I want, but do not go out.
I do under dress as much as I can.
Rader

[TeresaL]

There is no middle ground, and my SO has made it perfectly clear that there are no boundaries either. Not even a dab of clear fingernail polish on my cuticle. Absolutely NO CROSS-DRESSING.

So if it is so wrong to sneak, than I must either pack my bags right now, or quit even the idea of cross-gender expression. We have talked, head shrinks have talked, 12-steppers have talked to me, preachers have talked to me, my sons, my daughter, and wife in a group have talked to me and tried to get me to quit. This has certainly not been a closed issue with an absence of communication.

We are probably done with our 40 years of marriage due to cross-dressing.

How will it sound when people ask her and she responds? "We got divorced because he "cross-dressed."

[Amy R Lynn]

Its sad that more people can't just be understanding. If cross dressing makes you happy she should be supportive of that. Unfortunatly it sounds like she really is not supportive at all. It also sounds like she is approaching this from an addiction perspective, 12-steppers, etc... I'm pretty sure that this is not something that we all chose to be. It is a part of who we are. You may be able to tame it down some, but to quit completly would probably leave you very unhappy.

If your marriage is over, then it is because she wouldn't be supportive enough for your needs. And you may find that eventually it could be a relief as you can finally live how you see fit and not under the controll of someone who doesn't understand.

Life is too short to live unhappy.

I don't envy your situation. That is a brutal and awful position to be in. I will keep you in my prayers that she will come around and be more supportive.

[ReineD]

There is no middle ground, and my SO has made it perfectly clear that there are no boundaries either. Not even a dab of clear fingernail polish on my cuticle. Absolutely NO CROSS-DRESSING.

So if it is so wrong to sneak, than I must either pack my bags right now, or quit even the idea of cross-gender expression. We have talked, head shrinks have talked, 12-steppers have talked to me, preachers have talked to me, my sons, my daughter, and wife in a group have talked to me and tried to get me to quit. This has certainly not been a closed issue with an absence of communication.

I'm sorry to read this.

What exactly are her objections?

I ask because the CDing can take on many forms and intensities. Some husbands go out to clubs and stay out until all hours of the night drinking, they cheat, they get drunk at home and become abusive, they overspend. Or their wives find out by discovering their stash of hormones, or an online profile where they look for men and say they're bi. I'm not saying this is you at all, but we've got enough GGs who understand their husband's need to CD and enough CDers in this forum whose wives are either accepting or tolerant, to make me believe that it's got to be more than just the idea that a man CDs to turn a wife off. Even women who hold traditional values have come to understand that their husbands have this need, and if they don't like it or will not participate at least they acknowledge the need without feeling as if they should get divorced.

Is your wife a particularly religious person? You should tell her that we do have a support section for the wives and girlfriends here and ask her to join.

So how did she find out exactly?

[TeresaL]

I'm sorry to read this.

What exactly are her objections?
[I][B]A man dressed in women's clothing -- it's too bizarre.

I ask because the CDing can take on many forms and intensities. Some husbands go out to clubs and stay out until all hours of the night drinking, they cheat, they get drunk at home and become abusive, they overspend. Or their wives find out by discovering their stash of hormones, or an online profile where they look for men and say they're bi. I'm not saying this is you at all,

No, just the idea that is formed in her mind only. I don't have to do a thing but stand in place and take in air wearing my drabs.

but we've got enough GGs who understand their husband's need to CD and enough CDers in this forum whose wives are either accepting or tolerant, to make me believe that it's got to be more than just the idea that a man CDs to turn a wife off. Even women who hold traditional values have come to understand that their husbands have this need, and if they don't like it or will not participate at least they acknowledge the need without feeling as if they should get divorced.

Is your wife a particularly religious person? You should tell her that we do have a support section for the wives and girlfriends here and ask her to join.
We haven't been to church in over a year.

So how did she find out exactly?
She went on a trip with a group of girls from church, about 650 miles from home. I called her and told her. She came straight home, called the boys from college, called the pastor, and had a night-long pow-wow, ripping me apart. That was 15 years ago, and it has only gotten worse.



Two days ago, she (my SO) blew up at me, cussed me one side and down the other, stormed away angry because I let her know about this website. She ripped me apart because I was talking to you "cross-dressers." She quotes from this website and has it memorized...
http://www.firststone.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=55&Itemid=64

I barely got F.A.B. out of my mouth when she said this site is perpetuated by people who are trying to support this and that in itself is the first wrong because they are not trying to help cross-dressers stop their destructive addictions and behaviors.

[Stephanie47]

It sounds as if the deck is stacked against you. You have been totally outed. Are you sure your wife has not taken an ad out in the classified section of your local newspaper. You are retired. If I were in your position I'd spend the rest of my days living in the manner of my choosing. You are not in a marriage. You are being set up as the whipping boy of all your wife's problems. Look at the bright side. She played all of her trump cards prematurely. What is she going to hold over your head to extract in a divorce proceedings?




So if it is so wrong to sneak, than I must either pack my bags right now, or quit even the idea of cross-gender expression. We have talked, head shrinks have talked, 12-steppers have talked to me, preachers have talked to me, my sons, my daughter, and wife in a group have talked to me and tried to get me to quit. This has certainly not been a closed issue with an absence of communication.

[ReineD]

Thanks for your response, Teresa. I felt I needed to ask the questions in order to rule out other possibilities, since you didn't elaborate in your first posts.

Anyway, I wish I could help but given your situation, I'm afraid I have nothing to suggest that might improve your situation. I'm really sorry.

[TeresaL]

So, in a sense, it really doesn't matter whether to shave or not or anything. Real men shave anyway. LOL I've told her, she rejects it, and I am in my own house and not going out. If someone from the street sees my clean shaven face, they'd have to be an idiot to assume I cross dress. Either that or really smart. Hmmm.


It sounds as if the deck is stacked against you. You have been totally outed. Are you sure your wife has not taken an ad out in the classified section of your local newspaper. You are retired. If I were in your position I'd spend the rest of my days living in the manner of my choosing. You are not in a marriage. You are being set up as the whipping boy of all your wife's problems. Look at the bright side. She played all of her trump cards prematurely. What is she going to hold over your head to extract in a divorce proceedings?

[Noemi]

TeresaL,

If the leaving the goatee means keeping you cding in check somehow than leave the goat grow. If it makes her feel secure and keeps it simple for you as a couple then leave it.

[Eryn]

What you have is not a marriage. It is closer to enslavement, with your wife micromanaging everything you do. The facial hair dispute is a symptom, not the problem itself.

From my perspective, based only upon what you wrote, she cares more about what her pastor thinks than what you think and feel. She may not have been to church in a year, but it still seems to have an ironclad hold on her mind.

I'm very sorry, but I see no amicable solution to this. If one party to a marriage refuses to budge at all then compromise is not an option. The only option she has left you is "the highway." This is not fair, but for her this approach has worked for fifteen years and she's not likely to abandon it.

I'd say that you should go ahead and shave if you want to. Shaving is hardly grounds for divorce and it isn't likely to make your situation any worse than it already is. At least you'll have asserted yourself a bit.

[kimdl93]

There are lots of CDrs with facial hair. Its not a look I care for, but a mustache or goatee are not guarantees. As your SO whether she'd rather have you dressed with or without the whiskers..

[jillleanne]

It's your face, do as you please.

[TGMarla]

I wore a moustache for years, and like you, it drove me nuts. My wife liked it, and it had nothing to do with crossdressing or anything of the sort. She just liked it. I shaved it off once, and she expressed her disappointment. I grew it back and kept it for a few more years. Finally, I'd had enough of it, and I just whacked it. Gone. Never came back (nor will it), and she got over it.

Bottom line, as has been said: it's your body, your face, your life. Having it won't guarantee her that you won't crossdress anyway. You'll just not look all that feminine when you do so. It's not her choice, and she really has no business issuing you ultimatums over it. If your marriage hinges on whether or not you have facial hair, then your foundation is not all that sturdy to begin with. And I've said it before: crossdressing is a lousy reason to terminate a marriage.

[KarenCDFL]

This post reminded me about an old girlfriend who told me that I had to choose between her and my cat.

The cat and I were very happy when she left.

Seriously though, I used to have a full beard and even though it looked very un-lady like, I did dress and do makeup with the facial hair until i got rid of the beard forever at the time I told my soon to be wife about my dressing.

[Amanda22]

She went on a trip with a group of girls from church, about 650 miles from home. I called her and told her. She came straight home, called the boys from college, called the pastor, and had a night-long pow-wow, ripping me apart. That was 15 years ago, and it has only gotten worse.

Wow, if I was married to someone who did that, I'd be hiring a divorce lawyer the next morning. What utter lack of respect. You had your reasons to stay with this person, obviously, but when there are no consequences for disrespectful behavior, things tend to get worse. Life is too precious to be wasted being "fixed" by another person.

[WyrmQueen]

Shave the SO and get a new one.

I agree with this post.

[Shelly Preston]

There is no middle ground, and my SO has made it perfectly clear that there are no boundaries either. Not even a dab of clear fingernail polish on my cuticle. Absolutely NO CROSS-DRESSING.

So if it is so wrong to sneak, than I must either pack my bags right now, or quit even the idea of cross-gender expression. We have talked, head shrinks have talked, 12-steppers have talked to me, preachers have talked to me, my sons, my daughter, and wife in a group have talked to me and tried to get me to quit. This has certainly not been a closed issue with an absence of communication.

We are probably done with our 40 years of marriage due to cross-dressing.

How will it sound when people ask her and she responds? "We got divorced because he "cross-dressed."

Hi again Teresa
It seems like she is trying to get you to quit by whatever means she can. The real problem is she does not seem to understand this is part of who you are. It also seems everyone talks to you but your wife does not talk to anyone who really understands. What is more worrying she seems to have no wish to help you by providing support.
Have you both considered speaking to a counsellor who understands transgender issues ?

[TeresaL]

I stood my ground last night. Told her I've got to be me, and that includes being a CD. It got serious, and thought we were going to separate, but she came home from work today and said she would try to learn more. Im so happy that she is considering that my needs to express my feminine side will be here to stay. I assured her that my masculinity is there too, that this is not me fantasing about another woman, that I am me. LOL

I also adding that I am heterosexual and will not have any kind of relationship with another person - and that she is not in competition with this.

BTW, no facial hair is bliss. I'll post a photo in the photo section also.

[Davena Doll]

Nice, I like the look especially with out facel hair.

[jillleanne]

There is no middle ground, and my SO has made it perfectly clear that there are no boundaries either. Not even a dab of clear fingernail polish on my cuticle. Absolutely NO CROSS-DRESSING.

So if it is so wrong to sneak, than I must either pack my bags right now, or quit even the idea of cross-gender expression. We have talked, head shrinks have talked, 12-steppers have talked to me, preachers have talked to me, my sons, my daughter, and wife in a group have talked to me and tried to get me to quit. This has certainly not been a closed issue with an absence of communication.

We are probably done with our 40 years of marriage due to cross-dressing.

How will it sound when people ask her and she responds? "We got divorced because he "cross-dressed."

Sounds like everyone you know has made an attempt to get you to quit. That's just terrific but unfortunately, not a single one of them even thought for a moment that maybe, quitting is not an option because it is part of who you are, so obviously, having any of them help 'cure' you was a waste of time, but thanks are in order, nonetheless. Keeps them feeling validated by society and each other. You are not done with 40 years of marriage. You are done with 40 years of hiding who you are. You are done with 40 years of lying/withholding information from the marital bond you entered. You are done with 40 years of denying who you are.
How will it sound? Well, if they said it to me, it would sound to me like she was unwilling to attempt to understand you and that the public image of you as a male/female couple was more important to her than the marriage itself. How would it sound to me if someone told me that about you? I'd think it a shame she was so unwilling to try to accept you for who you are, and not what others might think of her being with you. I would think she obviously did not weigh the good you from the bad you and realize she is losing far more than she is gaining and that her self pride/image exceeds her intelligence. I'd also keep in mind, in all likelihood, someone that gets told this information will ultimately be transgender. What their response will be is anyone's guess.
IF, you are destined to start a new life, take comfort in knowing there are millions like you, there are places and friends who will support and assist you in finally letting you be who you are without hiding, hatred, bigotry, ignorance and condemnation. We all survive whether we like it or not, that is in our genes and with each day comes hope for better days, peace, and happiness; things we all strive to attain in life.

[Amy R Lynn]

I'm glad to hear that you were able to stand your ground and she is willing to try and learn a little bit more about this. Through all of this though, you never once gave up on her! That says so much more! You are a good husband!

[ReineD]

I stood my ground last night. Told her I've got to be me, and that includes being a CD. It got serious, and thought we were going to separate, but she came home from work today and said she would try to learn more. Im so happy that she is considering that my needs to express my feminine side will be here to stay. I assured her that my masculinity is there too, that this is not me fantasing about another woman, that I am me. LOL

I also adding that I am heterosexual and will not have any kind of relationship with another person - and that she is not in competition with this.

It's amazing what happens when husbands tell their wives this is who they are, isn't it? :)

I'm glad you told her the other side too, and I hope she will believe you enough to stick around and learn more. But a word of caution: now that your mustache is off and you have the courage to be yourself at home, if you overdo it she may well not believe you when you say that you are not TS and you do not want to be with men (this is a common belief among wives), so please don't go too fast. First she needed to get over her religious prejudice. And now she needs to learn the difference between a crossdresser and a transsexual, just like all the other wives. So please be patient with her and considerate of her learning curve.

:hugs:

[jillleanne]

Happy to hear she is willing to learn who you are. As reine says, go slow and stay honest. BTW, much prefer the pic sans the hair.

[TeresaL]

Happy to hear she is willing to learn who you are. As reine says, go slow and stay honest. BTW, much prefer the pic sans the hair.

Thanks. Right now I'm in male mode running errors. Going out dressed would ruin it for sure.
Beside looking like a hideous man in a wig, I'm not going to prep with that much detail. Shaving my 'stash is fine, but shaving elsewhere is going to be delayed. Hairy arms and chest will have to suffice. Just don't zoom in to my pics. LOL
BTW, I'm not showing her my pictures, so what do I do if she decides to check in here? Heheh.

[Tashee]

Before I got Married 8 years ago. I was sure to tell. Matter of Fact Before we became A Couple meaning us with no one else I dropped this so called (bomb on her)
I chose now Never to call it anything but being honest. This is where I may seem too much. See I know me, I studied People and me for a LONG TIME. In Law Enforcement I was The Body reader. & a Counselor for those on Suicide watch. Now I had a Failed EPIC Failed Marrige. I learnt so much from that others and My own Family(parents) on Always being Open and truthful. Also About Skelatons in ones closet. I shake and shook that Cluttered place out. I learnt NOW What can any say that hurts? I am Hiding NOTHING. So When I told my Soon to B Wife. She Already figured. I was HUH?-She Also figures my Empathy Non Judemental EZ side is caused from my Lady side?? She Said She fell in Love with me,my honesty The Whole of me NOT Sections. Inside my Ex work The Blokes can and will be Jerks. Honest I do not need that in my life. I chose Life affirming Good Non Judgemental People. They could CrossDress or Not. I Find If you live by certain codes, you ((in time))will atract like minded souls.~~~~Happy Journey~~~~~ Smile along the road of LIFE....

[Shelly Preston]

Hi Teresa

Its good to hear she wants to learn more. Reine is correct you need to take things slow. I am sure if you do that and keep talking to each other you will make progess and you will both be happier. Please remember there might be a few setbacks for time to time.

You wife may want to join this forum too to get more understanding and support.

I am sure she could benefit from talking to partners who have gone through the same thing.

[Silentpartner GG SO]

I've been watching this thread with interest and its really heart warming to read that things seem to be a little easier. The fact that your wife has 'caved' just a little suggests to me that she was just terrified of the whole CD'ing issue and the "OTT" behaviour was a defence mechanism.

Please, please, dont get caught up in Pink Fog. Your wife has taken a very long time to come to any sort of willingness to accept your CD'ing - dont ruin it now by steam-rollering ahead - she is going to be very fragile for a while and the slightest hint that you are pushing may just tip her back to total n on-acceptance again.

You definately look way cuter in your photo sans whiskers!

I hope your wife decides to venture into this place - she will see that even us accepting wives are pretty normal really!

[Stephanie47]

I will agree with Silentpartner GG SO, et al, to take it slow. In my prior comment I indicated you do not need to live with the scorn placed upon you. Your wife has still done you harm by outing you to everyone you are associated with. If your wife is willing to understand your needs, and, boundaries are established and adhered to, she needs to tell all those she confided in to back off the subject. This an issue between you and her and not the world.

[Babeba]

We have talked, head shrinks have talked, 12-steppers have talked to me, preachers have talked to me, my sons, my daughter, and wife in a group have talked to me and tried to get me to quit. This has certainly not been a closed issue with an absence of communication.


Teresa,

You tell us about how many people have talked about this (at you) - but how many people listened? I think that number is far fewer, and that the people whom were involved in this by your wife were ones who already had their minds made up about cross dressing, without having ever met someone who really engaged in it before they met you.

I think that when you told your wife recently that this is truly part of who you are, and she listened and did not leave you for it - this may have been one of the first true pieces of communication in your relationship on this topic. I really don't think that you can be completely happy with your relationship being so one-sided, and I don't know that your wife can, either - just judging from nothing else but the other relationships I have seen where one partner feels they have to control their partner.

I should also go right ahead and say that I think that not all Christians are bigots and that Christians who use religion to back up bigotry are, at best, afraid to explore alternatives to what they may have been taught culturally and find excuses to do so; and at worst, deliberately perverting the spirit of their faith. On that ministry page your wife quoted from, I found this:



So, for me, I believe cross-dressing is a sin because:

1. It is deception - Yes, most of us to some degree modify our appearance to cover imperfections and to look our best (although sometimes the modifications look worse than the imperfection!). However, to equate this with being completely transformed to look like the opposite sex is a huge leap of reasoning.

Many members of this site believe their male persona to be the deception that they use to fit in; in fact, there are so many crossdressers on this site with very fragmented views of what 'must be' masculine and what 'must be' feminine in their lives that I think they themselves are very much more rigid than even the 'norm' in mainstream society. Is the outer self really viewed as more important than the inner self in this faith?



2. It violates God’s ordained gender role for a person - God doesn’t make mistakes, but Satan can take small hurts and flaws in our upbringing to cause gender confusion. This gender confusion can cause many kinds of relationship problems.

If God doesn't make mistakes, is it possible that in those (many, many many) cases where there were no 'small hurts and flaws' in a person's upbringing, and in the cases of people whose genetic structure makes them intersexed, that God made no mistake in making a person who combines the perceived genders in one person as a complete whole? Is it possible that God celebrates diversity?



3. A cross-dressing father is a confusing model for children

For some crossdressers, their time dressing is something that is their down-time. For some, it is something they do frequently. For some, it is sensual and restricted to the bedroom. I don't think that kids ought to be exposed to something which is for their parent explicitly and solely a fetish, but if it is something which they do as a part of their daily lives (monthly lives?) that it can still be kid-friendly and G-rated. I don't think that seeing Daddy in a dress is going to cause major trauma to a kid, so long as Mom and Dad are consistent in their messaging that it's okay to be yourself, and be whatever you want to be when you grow up. The parents will have to be aware that kids talk about EVERYTHING they see and hear, and they will have to repeat that message to friends, neighbours, parents, teachers... but it is possible to have happy, unwarped children. About a year ago one of our members got very sick, and his adult daughter joined the forum to let everyone here know what was going on and give us updates. She was a very sweet, normal person with an open mind and a kind heart. I don't think she was an anomaly, either.

Lots and LOTS of members do not let their kids know about it - for a variety of reasons. One big one seems to be protecting their step-children from questionable custody grabs; another is needing to accept themselves (and have their spouses do same) before they can give that united front and message of acceptance.

I think it would be just as confusing (if not more so) to very young children to have parents who were actors, to be perfectly honest. Do you know what Johnny Depp's little girl said when she was very small and asked what her parents did (except she said it in French)? "My Mommy is a singer, and my Dad is a pirate!"



4. cross-dressing is normally a very self-centered activity

It's not around my boyfriend and me! We do things together, which match our interests and values - like shopping secondhand for most items to decrease the impact on the environment and our finances.

Sure, if a wife doesn't want to see it or know anything about it, but a husband has a need to express a female side sometimes, it can feel like that activity is being self centered. But whose shoulders is that on? The one who doesn't want to participate, or the one who needs to? Crystal has always assured me that it's my choice to opt in on this stuff (and I do), but she's also always told me that it's a lot more fun with me around than doing it by herself!


5. It is not healthy for most marriage relationships. True, there are some exceptions to this, but most women I have spoken with on the subject indicate a) they want a masculine male as a husband and b) they don’t care to be in a virtual lesbian relationship with the other woman as their husband.

This is definitely a point that I don't think really applies for the majority of crossdressers, who are perfectly happy with being male and just want to also express their femininity sometimes. I'm not going to lie, I don't think you're really a lesbian if you have a penis and you acknowledge its presence. There is a big, huge gap between accepting that a spouse is a cross dresser and becoming a 'virtual lesbian' - and before any hanky panky while dressed occurs, a healthy relationship will have a lot of talks about it.

On the other hand, if a spouse truly is a transsexual, and has a need to align her body with her soul... well, some marriages can last, and some cannot. I highly doubt that any of the spouses who can deal with that situation and accept a female spouse have contacted that site asking for help, so I don't really think they have an unbiased view.




I also should point out that there are some members on this site who come on here and express views or actions which are selfish, reckless or harmful to the people around them and they get absolutely NO sympathy from the majority of members. In fact, they get a lot of home truths told to them.

[TeresaL]

Thanks for all who are telling me to take it slow. I know this, and don't want to mess up any progress that could be made by doing stupid things.

As with many other members on this site, I want her to have a chance to discuss the issue (FAB) in hopes that she will not feel so much guilt and shame. I appreciate that this site is level headed in not being hill-bent on racing on to the SRS / GRS like the TG sites. It's far better to have support for moderation. I will be mindful of Pink Cloud. I didn't about endorphins in the past when I did experiment too much. So this is my chance to keep on track and not muck it up.

Albeit her caving in is a guarded one. Yesterday, she told me that she wasn't saying that she is "giving me permission." She feels that would somehow defeat her sense of value, will, and control. She does however remain backed-off and will not ride me if I'm within boundaries. Boundaries for right now are for me to stay in the house and during her working hours so she does not have to see "it." So she is allowing me to express without "giving me permission," I guess. It would make things much simple for her to get some conceptual advice from FAB. Nonetheless, I am glad to at least get the chance to be who I want when no one else is around. That sounds funny. But it is a step.

[Jill Devine]

She feels that would somehow defeat her sense of value, will, and control.
I just shake my head and say that you have my deepest sympathy. She is a control freak.

[ReineD]

I just shake my head and say that you have my deepest sympathy. She is a control freak.

Or, she's a woman who, because of her age, background, and the value system in which she was raised, has a great deal to overcome. At least she's trying.

Teresa mentions not having paid attention to endorphins in the past and having experimented "too much". We don't know everything that has transpired between this couple. Not in one single thread with a few posts that just have a few lines of info.

[Tracii G]

You stood your ground and I think she respects you for that.
Do go slow and give her time to adjust to it.The whole (CD thing is wrong) aspect is very intrenched in her philosophy/beliefs.
Don't force any of it on her at this time.
You have boundries to work within so CD when she is not around to see it and keep all your CD stuff out of her sight.
Good luck

[TeresaL]

Or, she's a woman who, because of her age, background, and the value system in which she was raised, has a great deal to overcome. At least she's trying.

Teresa mentions not having paid attention to endorphins in the past and having experimented "too much". We don't know everything that has transpired between this couple. Not in one single thread with a few posts that just have a few lines of info.

See post #8 and #19. Also, had gone to the mall en-femme. Those she knows of because she drilled the details out of me back 15 years ago. Today, I don't come near passing and am not planning to transition. Let me say this...

if you are in a room full of people having normal conversation, a strange quiet is evoked when she walks in. The room then knows that someone is now in charge.

[TeresaL]

You stood your ground and I think she respects you for that.
Do go slow and give her time to adjust to it.The whole (CD thing is wrong) aspect is very intrenched in her philosophy/beliefs.
Don't force any of it on her at this time.
You have boundries to work within so CD when she is not around to see it and keep all your CD stuff out of her sight.
Good luck

Thanks, that's the plan, both workable and in place. My alone time (stay at home CD) is 40 hours of daytime per week, when she goes to work (and I am retired).

[ReineD]

if you are in a room full of people having normal conversation, a strange quiet is evoked when she walks in. The room then knows that someone is now in charge.

I used to feel the same way when my ex walked into the room. Believe me, I know all about living with an overbearing person. But looking back, I can clearly see there were two conditions that contributed to these dysfunctional dynamics: his overbearance and all my insecurities that permitted him to be overbearing. Having done a great deal of work on myself in the last decade or so, I can no longer believe that any dysfunctional situation between couples is ever one sided. To believe so turns one into a victim which does little to remedy the situation.

There are always two sides to every story, always two people who should take equal responsibility for marital situations that degenerate.

[TeresaL]

Babeba
Wow! That is a lot of insight. There is a lot of misfocused artificially induced, high verbal output on that website.

[Jill Devine]

Reine, words of wisdom from you as always. I agree 100%.

[jillleanne]

Thanks. Right now I'm in male mode running errors. Going out dressed would ruin it for sure.
Beside looking like a hideous man in a wig, I'm not going to prep with that much detail. Shaving my 'stash is fine, but shaving elsewhere is going to be delayed. Hairy arms and chest will have to suffice. Just don't zoom in to my pics. LOL
BTW, I'm not showing her my pictures, so what do I do if she decides to check in here? Heheh.

It is what it is. You cannot retreat from who you are, nor can you worry about hiding it, which is what you are trying desparately to end. Sure, you could pull the pics, but it seems logical to prewarn her if she visits here, 'be prepared to possibly see pics of you here for no other reason than to be able to share with like people.' Take lots of deep breaths and try to relax. Being transgender is not about anyone's opinion of looking hidious or anything else. That is a description you choose, so be kinder to yourself. I would like to think most if not all here do not judge. As for the hair, well, that is just a bi product of you being considerate and giving her room to learn and accept it all. It's a big plate for her to eat from so give her time and go slow. Right now its important you let her know you love her, you are still you, and if she wants to discuss anything or has any questions, you will do your best to answer her honestly and openly. The rest will come in bits and pieces for you but they surely will come. Hang in there.

[TeresaL]

Thank you Jillleanne for your comforting post.

[Barbara Ella]

Teresa, saw your new pics, and that the hair was gone, and had to catch up. Congratulations on what has been achieved to date. It takes two to have a person in control, and you have just begun to shake her position. She adjusted what you were "allowed" to do, but said she did not give you permission. This indicates to me she really still does not have a clear picture in her mind about what crossdressing is really about for you. This is even more reason to go very slow. You are slowly changing her perception of what crossdressing is. She now knows that letting you dress alone at home wont end the world...PROGRESS..

If she knows you are dressing, and things in your life dont go down the toilet, she might begin to change perceptions even more. Stay the course, be smart, and enjoy your 40 hours for yourself.

Lots of very good advice being given here, and you have done a marvelous job in stabilizing the situation. Maintain it.

Hugs, Barbara

[Rebecca Star]

What you have is not a marriage. It is closer to enslavement, with your wife micromanaging everything you do. The facial hair dispute is a symptom, not the problem itself.

I have to agree Eryn.



I'd say that you should go ahead and shave if you want to. Shaving is hardly grounds for divorce and it isn't likely to make your situation any worse than it already is. At least you'll have asserted yourself a bit.

Respect is a two way street. While being married is a partnership, maintaining one's own individuality and identity is just as important too.

Kudos Teresa for going the clean shave - nothing changes if nothing changes :)

[TeresaL]

So far, so good. Very good as a matter of fact. My feminine at home and during her 40 hour work week has not been challenged. I want to keep on track and not have her come home to find me with shaven arms, chest or other body parts. I'm ok.

[cathie pantyhose]

maybe this has already been said but how does NOT shaving your facial hair make you NOT want to crossdress? Granted, I wont wear makeup with a few days growth and I even grow a full beard sometimes in the winter but I still dress fem. I would imagine if I stopped removing arm and leg hair and let it grow back fully (or as least as full as it would after years of epiliating) I would still dress. I purged when my wife found out and she got mad at me because she said I was just going to buy again, which I did. You can't change this....if you try you will be miserable. Unfortunatly, this is a risk of crosssdressing. SO's dont always understand and use threats

[Jennifer W]

maybe this has already been said but how does NOT shaving your facial hair make you NOT want to crossdress? Granted, I wont wear makeup with a few days growth and I even grow a full beard sometimes in the winter but I still dress fem. I would imagine if I stopped removing arm and leg hair and let it grow back fully (or as least as full as it would after years of epiliating) I would still dress. I purged when my wife found out and she got mad at me because she said I was just going to buy again, which I did. You can't change this....if you try you will be miserable. Unfortunatly, this is a risk of crosssdressing. SO's dont always understand and use threats

I have a moustache I refuse to shave (personal reasons) and I still dress. My arm hair can't be seen. My legs are a little more hairy. I still dress. If I don't, I get uptight. I got rid of a lot of stuff (not a full purge) a couple months ago. Boy do I regret that. It costs a lot of money to buy stuff back. It isn't worth purging!

[TeresaL]

Ditto on what you said. I'm not epillating, or shaving bodily hair except for legs. That may come slowly, but m not going to do it right now. I'm just relieved to be barely tolerated whilst I do my "Teresa" thing in the privacy of my own home.

I will not purge again either. Going out to purchase it again definately becomes expensive and non productive. I wish I had my old pictures back from the day I had moxi and the mojo was working. LOL


maybe this has already been said but how does NOT shaving your facial hair make you NOT want to crossdress? Granted, I wont wear makeup with a few days growth and I even grow a full beard sometimes in the winter but I still dress fem. I would imagine if I stopped removing arm and leg hair and let it grow back fully (or as least as full as it would after years of epiliating) I would still dress. I purged when my wife found out and she got mad at me because she said I was just going to buy again, which I did. You can't change this....if you try you will be miserable. Unfortunatly, this is a risk of crosssdressing. SO's dont always understand and use threats