Question for bi-sexuals!

[docrobbysherry]

I've never quite understood HOW anyone be bi?

Most of my life, I could NEVER figure out why women r attracted to men at all. Because I find male characteristics unappealing and nothing to get aroused about. Gross, hairy, course, rough, smelly, ungroomed, pushy, obnoxious, etc. etc. Yuck! All turn offs for me!
Woman, on the other hand, r soft, smooth, neat, unhairy, smell nice, sweet, pleasing, etc., etc. All things that I find sexually exciting!

However, when I began dressing at age 50, I had fantasies of being a woman dominated by a man! And, found those images arousing. For awhile I thot I must be bi! However, I still found everything male repulsive. Eventually the fantasies stopped completely! But, I still remember how cool they felt.

My question to actual practicing bi's is this:
Since male and female characteristics r so completely different, do u actually find BOTH SEXES arousing? The touch, smell, actions, etc. of the sexes r so different in bed. Fantasies, I can understand. But, how can BOTH sexes be sexually exciting for u? A female can fake arousal, a male CAN"T!

[LeaP]

This question is relevant to the transsexual forum ... why?

[JulieK1980]

I am attracted to both. As for the why can I be attracted to both when they are so different? I don't know, why do I have to only be attracted to one set of characteristics? (I know I answered a question with a question)

If someone likes apple pie, does that mean automatically that they must hate blueberry pie? They are so very different, so it follows the same logical path you laid out.

[Bree-asaurus]

I don't know, why do I have to only be attracted to one set of characteristics?

Exactly. I'm not bi, but I do find beauty in both genders. Might as well be asking how can I like trucks and muscle cars? :P

And yeah... why the transsexual forum? Transsexuals aren't any more bi than anyone else...

[Danika140]

And yeah... why the transsexual forum? Transsexuals aren't any more bi than anyone else...

I would assume this thread was spawned from the thread I started as it's relative to that topic and what was discussed there. Just my assessment though.

[RADER]

Opposites attract.
I guess the Maker of us all had a plan, Boys chase Girls, Girls chase Boys;
Boys and Girls join and make more boys and girls. And the story repeats.
Rader

[Bree-asaurus]

Opposites attract.
I guess the Maker of us all had a plan, Boys chase Girls, Girls chase Boys;
Boys and Girls join and make more boys and girls. And the story repeats.
Rader

I think you kind of missed the question... Gays and bi-sexuals aren't part of that whole 'opposites attract' thing.

[Lorileah]

My question to actual practicing bi GMs is this:
Since male and female characteristics r so completely different, do u actually find BOTH SEXES arousing? The touch, smell, actions, etc. of the sexes r so different in bed. Fantasies, I can understand. But, how can BOTH sexes be sexually exciting for u? A female can fake arousal, a GM CAN"T!

Because somethings are just attractive? In general, many women can get my attention. However there are some that I would not consider being with for all the tea in China. Maybe it is just the opposite for me and men. Most men don't do a thing for me. There is are physical things with both of those and it has to do with how they present in both cases. The ones who attract me in either case are the ones who seem to care about themselves. Then after that they are the ones who care about ME.

I have heard so many times how one can never be with a member of the same sex saying things like it is gross or unappealing and my mind goes to "Why? You are the sex you are dissing, why do you think that being with that sex would be bad?"

If a man looks good (and there are many I do find attractive) I also think how I could be with him in a sexual situation, just like I think about how I would like to be with a woman in a similar situation. That is the essence to me of being Bi. I do lean toward liking the female shape and figure but sometimes...OK a lot of times...a guy can get me going too.

Having been in that situation though I can say that a man can turn me off quicker also. Guys can be disgusting in so many ways and the number one on the hit parade is hygiene. I rarely meet a woman who doesn't have good hygiene but guys...I have met so many that you just wonder "don't you smell that?" about them.

So I guess to answer your question, a well groomed, handsome, gentle man who fits my idea of what a guy should look like (usually a swimmer type body) can get my attention and if they play it right more just as easily as a woman.

[kimdl93]

Sorry, I'm not going to be much help. As a former practicing bi (I consider myself a monogamous non-practicing bi in a heterosexual relationship), just think some of us are wired to find some sexual attraction in both male and female anatomy. Why - don't know. But then I neither can I explain "why" I live life outwardly as a male, but increasingly prefer to present myself as female.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

What about Try-sexuals?? they'll try anything...

ba dom bomm

[Mistybtm]

I am Bi and love both sexes, when I dress as a woman which is most of the time I am A woman and want everything A woman wants including sex with A handsome stud, well mostly sex. When in guy mode not to often any more I love woman as well some time very jealous of what they have And I can't with out great cost. As far as having A long term relationship it would only be with A woman. For the men side of it, it is all about sex with them which I love and will never give up.

[cyndigurl45]

Being Bi sexual doesn't necessarily mean that I am OK with all the repulsive stuff you mentioned, I don't like hairy smelly men, so I find men that are clean well groomed I prefer totally shaved and muscular and the intimate times are obviously different so it all depends on my mood and there again I find what I like.

[LeaP]

What about Try-sexuals?? they'll try anything...

ba dom bomm

Or as the saying goes: Try before you bi. (permanently anyway)

[Mistybtm]

Or as the saying goes: Try before you bi. (permanently anyway)

I do love trying and more trying that is the fun of it :)

[ReineD]

I am Bi and love both sexes, when I dress as a woman which is most of the time I am A woman and want everything A woman wants including sex with A handsome stud, well mostly sex. When in guy mode not to often any more I love woman as well some time very jalousie of what they have

There's a question I've always had about people who say they are bi but are into men while dressed and women when not dressed.

Since sexual attraction is separate and distinct from gender identity, wouldn't a bi transperson have the capacity to be attracted to both men and women in both guy and girl modes?

And if an individual can have sex with anyone but can only find an emotional and romantic connection with one gender, are they truly bi or just sexually adventurous?

I personally have a difficult time disconnecting sex from romantic attraction. They go hand in hand for me. Although I have deep and meaningful relationships with women, I could not see myself romantically involved or sexually attracted to them.

[Kathryn Martin]

There's a question I've always had about people who say they are bi but are into men while dressed and women when not dressed.

Since sexual attraction is separate and distinct from gender identity, wouldn't a bi transperson have the capacity to be attracted to both men and women in both guy and girl modes?

And if an individual can have sex with anyone but can only find an emotional and romantic connection with one gender, are they truly bi or just sexually adventurous?

I personally have a difficult time disconnecting romantic attraction to sex. They go hand in hand for me. Although I have deep and meaningful relationships with women, I could not see myself romantically involved or sexually attracted to them.

Bi-sexuals are attracted to both men and women. That does not mean they have sex with both men and women at the same time. Attraction and commitment are two separate things. I have always been bi. Nevertheless my relationships were monogamous and I happen to be in a committed relationship with my wife. I can see myself romantically involved with a woman or a man. But like any other person, being committed means being monogamous for me. But I could have sought a similarly committed relationship with a man. I hope this makes sense.

[Bree-asaurus]

There's a question I've always had about people who say they are bi but are into men while dressed and women when not dressed.

Since sexual attraction is separate and distinct from gender identity, wouldn't a bi transperson have the capacity to be attracted to both men and women in both guy and girl modes?

And if an individual can have sex with anyone but can only find an emotional and romantic connection with one gender, are they truly bi or just sexually adventurous?

I personally have a difficult time disconnecting sex from romantic attraction. They go hand in hand for me. Although I have deep and meaningful relationships with women, I could not see myself romantically involved or sexually attracted to them.

I can't speak from experience, but I do know that a lot of transgendered individuals repress a lot about themselves. I think in cases where a cross dresser who says they only like men while dressed could very well be bisexual or gay, but they still manage to compartmentalize those feelings. They won't allow themselves to like men when they are being men, but when they give themselves a little leeway in being themselves when they dress they can let those feelings surface. But they could also just be adventurous and willing to fantasize or be with a man so the man can fill the role of making the cross dresser feel submissive or whatever... but I have my doubts about that because a woman could be just as dominant. I've heard that being with a man while dressed is the 'ultimate feminine experience' or whatever... but I think there's a liiiiiittle more to it than that. If you like **** you like ****... lol.

[ELIZABETH46]

i am not bi, or wish to be one, but i have experienced the receiving and giving end of the question.
i enjoyed both at the time, for the same reasons expressed by LORILEAH (below ), but i will not be looking for nothing that my GG

[docrobbysherry]

Originally Posted by Bree_K
"And yeah... why the transsexual forum? Transsexuals aren't any more bi than anyone else..."

I would assume this thread was spawned from the thread I started as it's relative to that topic and what was discussed there. Just my assessment though.
That is correct, Danika. It seemed a similar topic but I didn't wish to redirect your thread!

Thank u, Reine, for putting into words what I was trying to say! It's got to be MORE than simply attraction for men. The person they're with must be arousing if they r going to have intercourse.

For those have tried to explain, thank u! It sounds like some of u aren't attracted to all men, but like GGs, u have your standards! I get part of that I think.
As, I wouldn't mind Sherry being accompanied out by a clean cut guy. (Kind of like the one that hit on me in Vegas! Lol) But, as Reine said, there's no romantic attraction for me there.
I've also met that rare CD/TG that I found "romantically attractive" enuff to possibly fool around with. I really don't know if I'd be aroused unless we did, tho! And, I can't imagine any situation that would involve playing below the waist!

[Laurie Ann]

Being bi doubles your chances for a date on Saturday night.

Ba da da

[KateSpade83]

I'm a beautiful passable crossdresser that can attract men, but I'd never touch them because deep down I'm a guy and I don't want to be gay. But if GOD changed me into a 100% woman with a real vagina and boobs I'd really be into men - oral and vaginal sex!

[Bree-asaurus]

I'm a beautiful passable crossdresser that can attract men, but I'd never touch them because deep down I'm a guy and I don't want to be gay. But if GOD changed me into a 100% woman with a real vagina and boobs I'd really be into men - oral and vaginal sex!

So.... if you had the same brain, but a different body, you would like men? Well... if you are happy as a man, that would indeed make you gay. You are just choosing not to be with men. It's the desire that makes you gay, not the action.

I've been with men and women, but I don't like being with women. Just because I've been with both doesn't make me bi.

[max]

I think one of the things that complicates these discussions is that sexual orientation can run all different sorts of gradients, not just a couple rigid boxes. So someone may be attracted to a large swath of different types of women and only very particular types of men in very particular circumstances. Or the reverse. They might hesitate to call themselves bi because it implies a much larger range of same-sex attraction than really applies to them.

Another situation where the English language just doesn't cover the possibilities well.

[Bree-asaurus]

I think one of the things that complicates these discussions is that sexual orientation can run all different sorts of gradients, not just a couple rigid boxes. So someone may be attracted to a large swath of different types of women and only very particular types of men in very particular circumstances. Or the reverse. They might hesitate to call themselves bi because it implies a much larger range of same-sex attraction than really applies to them.

Another situation where the English language just doesn't cover the possibilities well.

Well... if a straight woman only likes certain kinds of men, do we have a term for that? Nope... Being a straight woman doesn't mean you are attracted to ALL men. So why have a term for someone who likes certain kinds of men and certain kinds of women? If you find both sexes attractive in any scope you're bisexual or pansexual or whatever. If a woman likes cowboys and BBW (big beautiful women), do we REALLY need a word for that? She's bi... who cares? :P

[KellyJameson]

Hi Doc

Usually men are much more of a slave to what they see than a woman. Your examples were about appearance and observable behaviors. Do you like pushy, gross, smelly, obnoxious, ect... women?

Your fantasy of being dominanted is about power not sex in my opinion and power can be a sexual aphrodisiac by equating being female as being in a position of having less power so you feel more "female" but it really has nothing to do with being male or female only about power and this taps into are childhood experiences of being protected by more powerful adults so in a sense being dominanted is becoming a child again with all the freedom of childhood, a desire that never really leaves a person completely.

If you are able to move beyond social conditioning including religious as well as move beyond the limits that are placed on your arousal by your dependance on your eyes you than may be able to have a "meeting of the minds" which for me is what I call romantic sex and for me the only sex worth having all things being equal. It is the difference between sexual love and sex.

Sex can be on the surface or it can go to the very core of your soul depending on the person you are with.

[Sharon]

I find myself attracted to the person, not to a set of stereotypical characteristics and behaviors. Not all men are "gross, hairy, course, rough, smelly, ungroomed, pushy, obnoxious, etc. etc." As a matter of fact, I don't agree that even most men stand under this umbrella.

A sense of humor, a ready smile, honesty, a generosity of spirit, and maturity are traits that I appreciate in any person regardless of gender.

But, then again, I'm not a bi-GM. :)

[ReineD]

So.... if you had the same brain, but a different body,

I just want to point out that the brain is a part of the body. :)

For example, they used to differentiate between neurological and psychological brain disorders (i.e. altzheimers disease vs. depression). Now they've determined that any brain disorder is neurological.

I say this because tonight my SO and I watched a PBS special on depression led by the top researchers in the field, where they discussed the neurology of depression and anxiety extensively. It was fascinating. I even suspect that in the future we'll even be able to attribute personality differences among people to their brain chemistry. Increasingly, in the debate between nature vs. nurture, nature wins.

To tie this into the topic, it makes sense to me that sexual preference is hard wired.

[max]

I just want to point out that the brain is a part of the body. :)

For example, they used to differentiate between neurological and psychological brain disorders (i.e. altzheimers disease vs. depression). Now they've determined that any brain disorder is neurological.

I say this because tonight my SO and I watched a PBS special on depression led by the top researchers in the field, where they discussed the neurology of depression and anxiety extensively. It was fascinating. I even suspect that in the future we'll even be able to attribute personality differences among people to their brain chemistry. Increasingly, in the debate between nature vs. nurture, nature wins.


Not to take the thread too far off topic, but if it all is neurological it brings up the question of how much free will do we really have? What is consciousness? Is it all just chemical reactions or is there something more?

Just some ramblings, back to the regularly scheduled programming!

[CharleneT]

I'm confused about something in the original question. What is a Bi-GM ? A bi-male, yup, understand that. A gay male, sure, I know many ! As far as I know, you can't really be both....

ah, DUH, my bad ....

Never mind ....

[Aprilrain]

My question to actual practicing bi GMs is this:
Since male and female characteristics r so completely different, do u actually find BOTH SEXES arousing? The touch, smell, actions, etc. of the sexes r so different in bed. Fantasies, I can understand. But, how can BOTH sexes be sexually exciting for u? A female can fake arousal, a GM CAN"T!

This is offensive and smacks of cissexist homophobia. Proof positive of how different transsexuals and cross dressers really are.

GM = genetic male

P.S. You really think faking an orgasms is that hard to do??? Wow!

[docrobbysherry]

------------------------------------------
I've been with men and women, but I don't like being with women. Just because I've been with both doesn't make me bi.
Well spoken! I strongly respect people that r open minded enuff to try something before they say they don't like it, Bree! Many foods look horrible, but taste great!
In my case, if I'm with someone and they r not arousing now, I'm not interested in having sex with them. However, when I was young it seemed any woman I was with was arousing! I've never been aroused by a masculine male in my life.


I find myself attracted to the person, not to a set of stereotypical characteristics and behaviors. Not all men are "gross, hairy, course, rough, smelly, ungroomed, pushy, obnoxious, etc. etc." As a matter of fact, I don't agree that even most men stand under this umbrella.

A sense of humor, a ready smile, honesty, a generosity of spirit, and maturity are traits that I appreciate in any person regardless of gender.

But, then again, I'm not a bi-GM. :)
My bad, Sharon! As Kelly asked, "Would I want to be with a woman like that?" No! Of course not! A better example of MASCULINE characteristics mite have been; strong, commanding, angular, big hands, feet, and stature, penis, flat breasts, etc. Altho some of my girlfriends have been tall and a couple had small breasts, they didn't have the rest on this list.

And, like u, I like and am attracted to either sex that have those special personality characteristics u mention. But, I'm not aroused by them!


April, to be honest, I've NEVER tried faking an orgasm! None of the women I've dated were dumb enuff to buy that if I wasn't erect!

[Lorileah]

This is offensive and smacks of cissexist homophobia.
I will accept your feelings on this. However

Proof positive of how different transsexuals and cross dressers really are.
:witsend: throwing the BS flag on that again.:evilbegon It isn't even a good hypothesis let alone proof. Let's quit riding that horse ok?

[ReineD]

April, since this discussion is rather civil, I'll add my two cents to ask, why is it offensive for someone who is attracted to only one sex, to ask if the attraction to both sexes for those who are bi is the same or equally as arousing?

Maybe Sherry needn't have specified GM though since the question is applicable to every bi person regardless of gender. But still it's an honest question?

[KellyJameson]

Hi Kate

I had to sleep on your words about being with a man if you had a vagina.

If we avoid sex because of limits placed on the experience based on anatomy but the desire for the experience is still there is this than not a state of mind that is attracted to men and wants the experience of being with one?

The state of mind that would create attraction to men is not acted on because you
do not have a vagina but not because you are not attracted to men so your state of mind is the un-acted on truth. The mind not the body is where sexual attraction lives and it is only the conditions we impose on ourselves or are imposed on us that decides whether it is expressed or not, just as identity lives independant of the body but not the mind/brain which attempts to express identity through the body.

There are similarities between how identity is experienced and how sexual attraction is experienced but we become confused by thinking it is determined by the body.

The body is a tool used by the mind/brain to express it's reality, it's truth, it's identity.



The brain is a part of the body in that the brain has a physical mass and so all psychology is neurological with a interdependant relationship, the mind changes the brain and the brain changes the mind.

The brain/mind than has a interdependant relationship with the body so your overall health will affect the mind/brain so we are not parts but a holistic whole that extends outward so relationships with others bring health or sickness, seasons, climate, ect... We are parts as part of a greater whole.

One way I have learned the truth of myself is by imagining my brain/mind in another body.

[Mistybtm]

There's a question I've always had about people who say they are bi but are into men while dressed and women when not dressed.

Since sexual attraction is separate and distinct from gender identity, wouldn't a bi transperson have the capacity to be attracted to both men and women in both guy and girl modes?

And if an individual can have sex with anyone but can only find an emotional and romantic connection with one gender, are they truly bi or just sexually adventurous?

I personally have a difficult time disconnecting sex from romantic attraction. They go hand in hand for me. Although I have deep and meaningful relationships with women, I could not see myself romantically involved or sexually attracted to them.

I have in the past been with men in drab mode but find it more satisfying when I am in woman mode . Maybe because of the state of mind I am in when in woman mode. I always play the same role in both as A sub

[whowhatwhen]

It's easy, look at a guy and then look at a girl and if you find both attractive then you could say you're bi.
I'm way more picky in what I'm attracted to when it comes to guys, for example so it would be wrong to say "since I find more women attractive, I must be straight".

And believe me, I've tried to make that stick so many times.
:)

Although I tend to look at women in a "wow, she's really pretty" kind of way vs guys in a "*** **** ***** ****** ***** *** upside-down" kind of way.

This is coming from someone with no sexual experience with either gender, the physical act of sex (or lack thereof) doesn't change your orientation.
Just ask all of those gay guys who used to be married to women.

EDIT:
Or gay women who used to be married to men.

[Aprilrain]

This is offensive and smacks of cissexist homophobia. Proof positive of how different transsexuals and cross dressers really are.


throwing the BS flag on that again.:evilbegon It isn't even a good hypothesis let alone proof. Let's quit riding that horse ok?

Perhaps I should have said how different males and females are.


April, since this discussion is rather civil, I'll add my two cents to ask, why is it offensive for someone who is attracted to only one sex, to ask if the attraction to both sexes for those who are bi is the same or equally as arousing?


Doesn't the word BISEXUAL answer the question?? Why bother with the "other" sex if one is not aroused by it?? I don't think one could accurately puts percentages on sexual attraction other than perhaps number of partners of each sex however that could have more to do with circumstance than on actual arousal.
to ask if there is MORE than sexual arousal would have been a better question as I do believe that while a person may be sexually attracted to males and females they may only be emotionally attracted to one or the other.

There are a lot of reason why I find the OP offensive, one MORE reason is the OPs seeming inability to wrap his brain around the fact that TSes are NOT men in spite of genetics

[SabrinaEmily]

Exactly. I'm not bi, but I do find beauty in both genders. Might as well be asking how can I like trucks and muscle cars? :P

And yeah... why the transsexual forum? Transsexuals aren't any more bi than anyone else...

Actually, they are.

http://www.thetaskforce.org/reports_and_research/ntds came up with the following percentages for the transpeople it surveyed: 21% gay, 23% bisexual, 20% queer (whatever that means), 21% heterosexual, 4% asexual, 11% other. That looks wildly unlike the general population.

Still, this shows that there are plenty of transpeople who are not bi, but I don't see that there was a better or worse place to put this thread. I do agree that the question was badly phrased at best, and the answer is as simple as that not everyone's preferences are like the OP's.

[kimdl93]

Rather than debate who may be bisexual, or percentages from surveys, why not refocus on the OP. The OP was asking an honest question, in my view, andcertainly don't think Sherry meant to be offensive. Of course she can't understand what a bisexual finds attractive in either sex...she's not bisexual. Isn't it really impossible for any of us to answer "why" to that question: I can say that I find some men attractive, and I find others less so. And I find some women attractive and others less so. But I can't tell you why.

[ReineD]

There are a lot of reason why I find the OP offensive, one MORE reason is the OPs seeming inability to wrap his brain around the fact that TSes are NOT men in spite of genetics

I personally don't see the correlation between being TS, CD, or cis, and having a preference for same-sex, opposite-sex, or both.

As a person who is opposite-sex attracted, I have also wondered if people who are bi are equally attracted to both sexes. I dare say that if I had always been same-sex attracted I'd wonder the same thing. Also, I've read opinions or theories here and there that some people who are fundamentally opposite-sex attracted but are in denial over this, will go through a phase of being bi as a stepping stone to the realization they are same-sex attracted. And so it seems to me such a person would prefer one sex over the other while in their exploration stage.

I disagree with the idea of becoming impatient with or offended by questions from people who are trying to understand something they do not experience and to blame it all on the difference between being CD and TS. I am neither and it is still a question I would ask of someone who is bi and cis.

[LeaP]

Actually, they are.

http://www.thetaskforce.org/reports_and_research/ntds came up with the following percentages for the transpeople it surveyed: 21% gay, 23% bisexual, 20% queer (whatever that means), 21% heterosexual, 4% asexual, 11% other. That looks wildly unlike the general population.

Still, this shows that there are plenty of transpeople who are not bi, but I don't see that there was a better or worse place to put this thread. I do agree that the question was badly phrased at best, and the answer is as simple as that not everyone's preferences are like the OP's.

"Transpeople" (not transsexuals) - everybody in creation that identified under the transgender umbrella. In a survey, no less, that relied on voluntary responses.

Intuitively, it makes sense to me that sexual preference variation from cissexual norms would be higher in a gender variant population. So what? My question is still the same. Why is this relevant to the transsexual forum.

I don't think people are quite getting April's point. The OP specifically asked a question of "practicing bi GMs" - in a transsexual forum where people identity as female. It's equivalent to asking a TS "You're a guy ... What do you think?"

The right forum? How about the GM forum?

[ReineD]

Intuitively, it makes sense to me that sexual preference variation from cissexual norms would be higher in a gender variant population. So what? My question is still the same. Why is this relevant to the transsexual forum.

Given that sexual attraction is independent from gender identity I agree there is no particular relevance to the TS forum. But, having read many threads here I also know there is less fear of being androphilic among TSs (http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?175547-Sexual-preferences-as-a-TS) as there might be among CDs, so maybe Sherry felt she would get more honest answers here, and also answers that are not mired in fantasy as are sometimes found on the other side of the forum, from members who claim they are bi (when they are dressed) but who've never tested the waters to actually find out if this is true. :p

[Bree-asaurus]

Actually, they are.

http://www.thetaskforce.org/reports_and_research/ntds came up with the following percentages for the transpeople it surveyed: 21% gay, 23% bisexual, 20% queer (whatever that means), 21% heterosexual, 4% asexual, 11% other. That looks wildly unlike the general population.

Still, this shows that there are plenty of transpeople who are not bi, but I don't see that there was a better or worse place to put this thread. I do agree that the question was badly phrased at best, and the answer is as simple as that not everyone's preferences are like the OP's.

*sigh* that's one survey. And there is more to consider... such as, maybe transgender individuals might be more willing to accept and pronounce their true sexual attractions than the general population who may be more likely to repress theirs? There's always more to it than "This survey says..."


Rather than debate who may be bisexual, or percentages from surveys, why not refocus on the OP. The OP was asking an honest question, in my view, andcertainly don't think Sherry meant to be offensive. Of course she can't understand what a bisexual finds attractive in either sex...she's not bisexual. Isn't it really impossible for any of us to answer "why" to that question: I can say that I find some men attractive, and I find others less so. And I find some women attractive and others less so. But I can't tell you why.

Thank you. And I agree, having had many interactions with Sherry. I don't think she was trying to say that MTFs really men. She has always shown me respect.

[Kaitlyn Michele]

I was not personally offended but the question was sexual and aimed at guys... why wouldn't some of us wonder why the heck it was here...

Of course, transsexuals are dehumanized and sexualized as a matter of simple fact..

So if i have a question about why a guy would be attracted to both boys and girls, where else to ask other than TS forum??

[ReineD]

I was not personally offended but the question was sexual and aimed at guys... why wouldn't some of us wonder why the heck it was here...

Sherry, this is your cue to come in and acknowledge that it is offensive to come into the TS forum and address a query to "GMs". Please understand that transition is a difficult journey and this corner of the world need not be a sore reminder of genetics.

(I hope that I haven't offended anyone by my statement above. I agree this is no place to call people GMs, but I also understand that learning this is a process for many people.)

[Bree-asaurus]

Sherry, this is your cue to come in and acknowledge that it is offensive to come into the TS forum and address a query to "GMs". Please understand that transition is a difficult journey and this corner of the world need not be a sore reminder of genetics.

(I hope that I haven't offended anyone by my statement above. I agree this is no place to call people GMs, but I also understand that learning this is a process for many people.)

*sigh* where is this kind of intervention in the cross dressing forum when people say that being gay and being transsexual is a choice???

(not blaming you Reine... I've just never seen a mod take action like this on this kind of discussion... but maybe right now you're speaking as a forum member, not as a moderator. I guess it's not a moderator's duty to say who's opinion ranks higher... :/)

[ReineD]

I'm speaking as both, in an attempt to get people to understand each other's POV. I don't think that Sherry's intent was to be offensive, I think she had a genuine question, and maybe just a gentle reminder by someone to not emphasize the "GM" in here would have elicited an apologetic response. Honestly, that part of her post eluded me when I first read it as it apparently did many others?

And I do the same thing in all the sections here, when I come across similarly inaccurate assumptions. I do my best to 'splain one side to the other. :hugs:

So I'll go ahead and delete the "GM", I'm sure that Sherry will agree when she sees this.

[Bree-asaurus]

I'm speaking as both, in an attempt to get people to understand each other's POV. I don't think that Sherry's intent was to be offensive, I think she had a genuine question, and maybe just a gentle reminder by someone to not emphasize the "GM" in here would have elicited an apologetic response. Honestly, that part of her post eluded me when I first read it as it apparently did many others?

And I do the same thing in all the sections here, when I come across similarly inaccurate assumptions. :hugs:

So I'll go ahead and delete the "GM", I'm sure that Sherry will agree when she sees this.

Yeah, I don't think she meant it that way at all. But I often wonder myself... I mean... if I think about it, I AM a genetic male... my brain just wasn't told to also be male and therefor I am transsexual... I hate this stuff! I try not to think about it and just live my life as myself.

[ReineD]

I mean... if I think about it, I AM a genetic male... my brain just wasn't told to also be male and therefor I am transsexual... I hate this stuff! I try not to think about it and just live my life as myself.

Exactly. The term is biologically accurate, yet it is often used in this forum to describe males, and transsexuals do not define themselves as males.

We need A LOT more words to describe gender and sexuality, IMO, or people need to use combinations of words rather than just one, in order to be accurate. :p

[Bree-asaurus]

Exactly. The term is biologically accurate, yet it is often used in this forum to describe males, and transsexuals do not define themselves as males.

We need A LOT more words to describe gender and sexuality, IMO, or people need to use combinations of words rather than just one, in order to be accurate. :p

I think Cis-male would be more accurate... I THINK?!?!!?!?!?

But I don't think many people know what cis-anything means. Heck, I didn't for the first year I was on this forum!

[Kathryn Martin]

Seriously, I think that this is all semantics. If you substitute "GM" with "people" then it is just a question. How useful the question is in the first place is a different matter. When you strip it down then the real question is "why are you attracted to someone?" This is almost an unanswerable question.

And sorry, I was born a genetic biological male which does not take anything away from who I am. I just finished overcoming that.

[Wildaboutheels]

Doc, I have a sneaky suspicion, you have never seen the movie, The Crying Game? I also suspect that a great majority of those that participate here on a regular basis have never seen it either. I think it should be "required watching" for ALL Humans over the age of ten. Course that is only my opinion. It is one of those rare movies, that SHOULD make people stop and think something to the effect of "wow, how would I handle something like that"? I sure hope no one at this Forum is challenged enough to think they are too sharp to be "fooled". Sure, the VISUAL is very important, especially for men [just our most basic Evolutionary programming at work] but there can be/should be so much more to "arousal" than that.

Human Sexuality is NOT a B&W issue. Look at all the letter designations tossed about at these Forums on a regualr basis. I seriously doubt that anyone that participates here would or could say that "YES that's me. I am a XYZ!" Wouldn't some COMBINATION of 2 or 3 groups of letters [if not more] be more fitting for everyone?

Me? If it matters, I am simply a RBAM. [That would be Red Blooded American Male]

[Bree-asaurus]

Me? If it matters, I am simply a RBAM. [That would be Red Blooded American Male]

Me? I'm a red blooded (when exposed to oxygen) something something something...

I don't care... as long as people treat me with respect... which has been my experience so far :)

[Julia_in_Pa]

Concerning "The Crying Game" Del was alright but Jimmy was just another pig.
I really don't think Dell was anything but attracted to men but in the movie you really don't know.

Being born Intersexed qualifies me to say that I was truly born in the middle.

Like Spock from Star Trek being half human. Spock hated that fact.
I'm half male but that doesn't stop me from being absolutely disgusted by that fact.

I used men for sex and women for a meaningful relationship.

I would not call myself bisexual in that regard.
To me the term bisexual implies that I would potentially have an emotional connection to both men and women.
I would have an emotional connection to men much like a killer would have an emotional connection to their victim.


Julia



Doc, I have a sneaky suspicion, you have never seen the movie, The Crying Game? I also suspect that a great majority of those that participate here on a regular basis have never seen it either. I think it should be "required watching" for ALL Humans over the age of ten. Course that is only my opinion. It is one of those rare movies, that SHOULD make people stop and think something to the effect of "wow, how would I handle something like that"? I sure hope no one at this Forum is challenged enough to think they are too sharp to be "fooled". Sure, the VISUAL is very important, especially for men [just our most basic Evolutionary programming at work] but there can be/should be so much more to "arousal" than that.

Human Sexuality is NOT a B&W issue. Look at all the letter designations tossed about at these Forums on a regualr basis. I seriously doubt that anyone that participates here would or could say that "YES that's me. I am a XYZ!" Wouldn't some COMBINATION of 2 or 3 groups of letters [if not more] be more fitting for everyone?

Me? If it matters, I am simply a RBAM. [That would be Red Blooded American Male]

[muzzy]

It's simple...just like women,men can look after themselves in a grooming fashion....they can smell nice,shave themselves and really look smart...you have obviously been hanging around the wrong type of man...When I pick up a man i look for all of those qualities and I'm always satisfied,just look in the right direction...men and women can be ignorant of how they dress xoxo

[docrobbysherry]

I'm speaking as both, in an attempt to get people to understand each other's POV. I don't think that Sherry's intent was to be offensive, I think she had a genuine question, and maybe just a gentle reminder by someone to not emphasize the "GM" in here would have elicited an apologetic response. Honestly, that part of her post eluded me when I first read it as it apparently did many others?

And I do the same thing in all the sections here, when I come across similarly inaccurate assumptions. I do my best to 'splain one side to the other. :hugs:

So I'll go ahead and delete the "GM", I'm sure that Sherry will agree when she sees this.
OMG! I had no idea! I TOTALLY screwed up this time! GM is NOT what I meant in ANY forum. I only meant folks that have male equipment. I tend to think of all TS's as females. Without digging a deeper hole for myself, I better not say any more now! It's dinner time and I had my glass of merlot before checking in here. I'll delete the GM reference immediately and come back when I can think clearly! Please bear with me until then! Thanks!

[Tara D. Rose]

OMG! I had no idea! I TOTALLY screwed up this time! GM is NOT what I meant in ANY forum. I only meant folks that have male equipment. I know a few TS females personally. And, I think of them as females. Without digging a deeper hole for myself, I better not say any more now! It's dinner time and I had my glass of merlot before checking in here. I'll delete the GM reference immediately and come back when I can think clearly! Please bear with me until then! Thanks!

Well if you do that Sherry, it will sort of mess up my repsonse to your thread if you take out the GM aspect of it. But it's ok.We are friends for life dear,


Tara

[Bree-asaurus]

I only meant folks that have male equipment.

Just a heads up for when you're thinking clearly... MTF transsexuals usually do their best to NOT have male equipment. Plenty don't have that equipment anymore and many who do have it don't like to use it. The equipment means nothing. What's between the ears means everything! :)

[whowhatwhen]

What's between the ears means everything! :)

Is it earwax?

char twenty[ 20 ];

[juno]

My answer to the bi question:
Sexual preference is like ice cream. Some people prefer chocolate. Some people prefer vanilla. Some people like both flavors, and some don't like ice cream at all. Some are more interested in quality than the exact flavor (i.e. pansexual).

Then trans people come along and add Neapolitan, part chocolate, part vanilla, with some fruit in the middle.

And the reality is that gender/sex is more like Ben & Jerry's.

For monosexual people, think of bisexual as something like being interested in women with either small or large breasts, or men with either a small or large penis.

[docrobbysherry]

Just a heads up for when you're thinking clearly... MTF transsexuals usually do their best to NOT have male equipment. Plenty don't have that equipment anymore and many who do have it don't like to use it. The equipment means nothing. What's between the ears means everything! :)
Yes, u r correct and I KNOW THAT, Bree! Unfortunately, I phrased my question as poorly as possible! Let me apologize for offending nearly everyone here. That wasn't my intention. I think some of u know I get my feet stuck in mouth quite often! In my stupidity, I should have differentiated between TG/TS's with male parts that they use during sex and TS's that don't, period! Or skipped the reference entirely. As Kathryn said, the term GM clearly doesn't even apply to the question. Because the question was about bi's attraction to both. Anyone's explanation of their attraction to both sexes would be helpful for me. I already understand attraction to women! Because I am, too. But, men, too?? And, being male, I may have gotten side tracked by the word "arousal" and the different ways that it is experienced by the sexes. Just blame it on my "performance anxiety"! Lots of us guys suffer from it! And, that's no joke!

Why I picked this forum? I actually already answered that, but I'll repeat it. Another similar thread got me thinking about this question. I thot the posts here were deep and concise. But, I didn't wish to hijack that one! The other reason, Reine picked up on rite away. This subject may be out of line in the regular forum and for reasons I can't explain, the GM forum doesn't seem to delve into subject matter as deeply as u do here!

I honestly feel the conversations here r often deeper than in any other forum. Many r way over my head! Maybe u can see why!? Lol!

[ReineD]

Sherry, thanks for the explanation, I'm sure you've exonerated yourself. :) But if you don't mind, I think it's time to close the thread. Already in the last few pages there have been a lot of tongue in cheek (pun not intended :p) answers and also many tangential remarks. When threads disintegrate in this manner, it's an indication that everyone has posted everything they had to say on the matter.

If you pick out the on-topic answers and reread them, I'm sure you'll come out of this having learned something. :hugs: