Locked in the closet.

[Wildaboutheels]

Sorry but I just ain't buying it. There seems to be a very common theme at this Forum that ALL CDers want to/will want to eventually leave their house "dressed".

I believe there are probably many that are perfectly happy to dress and stay at home no matter how much home time they spend dressed as a female. No matter how much effort, or time or money they spend trying to appear as feminine as their bodies or budgets will allow them.

I do realize of course that a number of ladies have opined in various threads that when they started CDing, they never thought in their wildest dreams that they would someday want to venture out of their homes "dressed".

[Karren H]

I was perfectly happy being in the closet.... Then 9 years ago.... BOOM.... Something happened and things just plain escalated out of control... Next thing I remember I was dressed enfemme and walking through the mall! Pretty sure there was some missing time and maybe an alien abduction! Lol. Doesn't mater what you do as long as your happy.. If I never dress again I'll die happy... Mainly because my happiness isn't dependent on the clothes I wear. But that's just me...

[Kaz]

I was happy in the closet for years, but then when I started with the wigs and make-up I reached a point where I thought I looked okay and when staying away in hotels I started to walk about to get the feel for walking around dressed. I always ran a mile when anyone appeared! I was excited about just walking around places, feeling the swish of the dress etc... then I started getting closer to where the people were and heading back to my room once I tried the elevator and literally bumped into a guy as I was getting out. He gave me the sort of smile I have NEVER seen from a guy before. When I got back to my room that was it. A few days later I was walking around a busy 'mall' - well in the UK we have these big outside retail 'parks' - one of these. Amazing experience!

BUT... I know loads of great people on this site who are firmly in the closet with no desire to go walkabout. And to be honest, if I couldn't go out anymore or felt that I couldn't/shouldn't it wouldn't bother me so much. The closet is not a bad place - but it is what you make it!

BTW Great avatar Karren!

[Dana921]

I agree with Karen.

Not all want to transition and not all will someday feel the need to go outside their home! Each of us, is on our own path with the appropriate timetable in doing it as the individual feels the need. Though we may have similar themes for our journey, it still is an individual's path for that person to decide.

In the end, being happy with the choices we make is the best we can hope for!

[Barbara Ella]

The great thing about dressing, is that we are free to do exactly what we want to do at the moment we want to do it. The only thing standing in our way is realizing what it is we want to do. Whatever that is, in a closet or out, full or andro, or even just as a dude in a dress, doesnt matter, what is important is you are doing what it is that you want to do. That is the greatest accomplishment anyone could hope for. And if for some reason you are not happy, you really need to rething if it is really what you want to be doing.

And from the posts here, there are a whole lot of happy dressers who stay at home, and that is great. I was happy at home, but a switch was flipped, and just had to go out. Only gone out 4 times, and now have jumped deep back in the closet for cover from the shock, so who knows. I could die happy tomorrow as i now know who I really am and know that my woman inside me has established herself. OK, in typical female fashion, has dominated the conversation...lol

Hugs, Barbara

[Lorileah]

I guess you can put me in the oblivious category for years. Back then it was mostly just a sexual kick. Now I go where I want when I want.

Float your own boat. But the kick wears off and one day you say I need a new rush. You may be 100 years old by then though.

[Rachel Renee]

It's definitely a different strokes scenario. I can totally understand the various reasons why one would have no desire to go out in public. For years I was certain that I would never ever need or want to. But there's a whole bunch of stuff that I swore I'd never do that is now very important to me. Speaking purely for myself, I have learned to never say never.

[bobbie c]

great comments....having a year plus under my belt of saying hello to "bobbie"...i am discovering my own path and that is embracing the new me...while being intune to those around me whom i love and care about. my path is mine and it is not only chosen times at home,but going out to a few lbgt clubs for fun and dance....i love the rush and the thrill of 2 lives...one with my guy tie ,suit etc and the other flamboyant side of bobbie...it makes life very fun and pushing the envelope gives you something to look forward to if you chose....and karen...you look great!...and kaz...always great insight!!!..similar paths!!...hugs to all

[Kate Simmons]

I think it has something to do with being "All dressed up and nowhere to go.":battingeyelashes::)

[Linda St. John]

I'm with Rachel : Never say never !!":straightface::heehee:

[AndreaS]

Not sure why, but I had a strong urge to go out dressed at a young age. I took the keys to my older sister's car and drove to a nearby convenience store while wearing one of my sister's dresses at the ripe old age of 14. You know the urge is bad when you're not even old enough to have a learner's permit yet, but you're risking a lot to get out of the house for just a few minutes while dressed.

[Julie1123]

For me it feels like I'm standing in the middle of a teeter totter, trying to keep my balance. Somedays I feel like I want to tell more people or go out in public dressed. Other days I think that it would not be as great as I imagine it to be. It worries me that this means I'm not quite accepting of myself as I think that I am.

As an aside, I do believe someone can be completely accepting of themselves and still stay inside.

[sandra-leigh]

Sorry but I just ain't buying it. There seems to be a very common theme at this Forum that ALL CDers want to/will want to eventually leave their house "dressed".

It cannot be disproved. We can, after all, claim that at the very least, in your dying seconds, when your life flashes before your eyes, you will think "I wish I'd gone out dressed".

About as disprovable: "Everyone wants to or will want to, perform Karaoke."

[Vanessa5]

I agree. Not all want to venture out. I have gone out. Didn't really float my boat. Quite fine just staying home.

[whowhatwhen]

It's on the "have to" list, but I'm in no rush since there are more important aspects of myself to deal with first.
It's not a race :P

[Chickhe]

I don't ever say what anyone else should do...except do what you need to do to answer the questions you have...whatever is holding you back, find out how to get past it. The main thing I think anyone needs to work on self acceptance...maybe the world doesn't understand me, but I'm doing no wrong... in fact if you spin it right, what we do if pretty darn cool!

[AllieSF]

I disagree with your theme/premise. Change "ALL" to "most" or "the majority" and then I would agree with you. This is not a new discussion topic here. If one is happy in the closet, i.e. the one that keeps them in the house and not going out into the real world, that is more than fine with me. I think that there are some, the minority in my opinion, that truly have no latent desire to get out of the house. The rest that stay in the closet may be due to fears, looks, lack of self confidence and courage, opportunities, et al. I do not see these reasons as excuses, but as valid justifications for them to live with their status quo. When and if they are ever ready, they will find that with the right attitude, it is an awful lot of fun being out there.

[UNDERDRESSER]

I'm not sure if i want to go out dressed or not. Maybe if I find a supporting or accepting SO, I'll experiment. These days, I'm finding a strong want to just put on a skirt for work, just for the feel of bare legs, I know I can get away with bike shorts, or even brief running shorts, ( another guy used to do that and got no complaints from management ) also want to try a naturist group, clothes, (particularly male ) are really beginning to bug me from a comfort point of view.

[suzy1]

I know that I will always be totally happy and fulfilled not going out in public dressed.
The annoying thing is that several times individual members have told me, [yes told me!] that one day I will want to go out dressed. Like I don’ know my own mind? [Yep, scroll down to The Veronicamoonlit post]:eek:

I do get the impression that the members that are dedicated to going out and encouraging others to do the same post more than the ones that are happy in there closet.

[Wildaboutheels]

I don't think it is any accident that the ONLY Forum allowed to the public is the MtF one.

But is that an "enticement" of some kind to get folks to actually join?

[Marleena]

It's a personal choice. I have no problem with either. Do whatever makes you happy.:)

[bimini1]

If you go out that first time you may become like a crack addict chasing that elusive "first high". Then maybe not, some people can do drugs once and then just walk away from it.

I went out a couple of times years ago with both positive and negative results but for me it was not worth it at that point. I always say the price of admission was not worth the payoff.

[VeronicaMoonlit]

I know that I will always be totally happy and fulfilled not going out in public dressed.

I'd be careful making absolute statements like that. I made that one myself once. That's right, I said once that I'd never go out in public.


The annoying thing is that several times individual members have told me, [yes told me!] that one day I will want to go out dressed.

Fair enough, but imagine the inverse. Seeing someone say they'll never go out and a couple years later say they want to go out, and then do. It happens quite a bit. I did it myself, I've seen it happen, here, other boards, USENET, IRC, you name it.


Like I don’ know my own mind?

Some crossdressers don't. I didn't. They're in so much societal pressure to conform they engage in self-denial. We've seen examples on this own board of it happening. Crossdressers who believed they'd never tell anyone their secret, telling. Crossdressers who thought they'd never go out, doing so. People who adamantly said they were crossdressers at one time, deciding they're Transsexuals. People change and grow.

Now if someone says that people "must" go out, I would disagree with that. I think that it is in genral a good idea, for the most part, but the person needs to be mentally ready. Going out when they're not really readdy for it can be bad too. Personally I think going out was a good thing for me, but I made a bad choice as to exact day I first did it, a couple of weeks before or after would have been better.


I do get the impression that the members that are dedicated to going out and encouraging others to do the same post more than the ones that are happy in there closet.

Most certainly, I agree with that.

VEronica

[Cynthia Anne]

We all be different! When I left home at the age of seventeen I was dressing and going shopping! I've never wanted to stay in the closet!

[Eryn]

If one can be satisfied in the closet and never feel the need to go out that is a wonderful thing! You avoid a lot of expense and anxiety!

OTOH, some of us have a need to express ourselves to others, and that often involves going out.

When I first came to grips with my CDing I was a "no way, I'm too big, not in a million years will I go out that door" person. That has obviously changed!

[RADER]

Yes, I am a closet person. In fact, about 11 years now, I almost doubled the size of my closet,
As I needed more room to at least walk around in it. It was kind of a Buss Mans Holiday.
A Carpenter comes home from work and builds a room addition to his house, Actually 2 rooms.
Rader

[BobbieBrooks]

Well I was happy with four walls around me, safe from the world. Finding this site and all the info and support The walls gave way and Bobbie was out and about. If they can do it so can I!!! Small steps at first then bigger ones. Have a bucket list so will empty it bit by bit. Have "passed" have been outed. Yes I'm a guy in a dress, and darn happy that I own it and am able to do it. Just me being me!!

BobbieB

[BLUE ORCHID]

Idon't know if I will ever wander out of the safety of my home but if my wife
would ever learn to accept meand go with me it would be wonderful.

[Allisa]

Let's see now.When I was younger I was very closeted but then got the nerve to go out in public and loved the thrill of it all.Now I wear some "feminine" clothes while at home and am completely satisfied,but if and when I feel like leaving the house I prefer to present myself as a woman from head to toe,the hard part is not to over dress for the activity planned.I was very happy in the closet and after stepping out now feel at ease in or out,I guess being comfortable in my own skin is what really counts.We all need to find our comfort level.
bye-bye Lisa

[ReineD]

Sorry but I just ain't buying it. There seems to be a very common theme at this Forum that ALL CDers want to/will want to eventually leave their house "dressed".

A natural progression to the CDing is to want to go from a single to a multi-faceted expression (staying home in front of a mirror vs. going out in public), but this isn't for everyone. Some CDers have families who would never condone this. Other CDers feel they would never be able to pass and they do not want to subject themselves to ridicule. Others are prominent in their communitities and they don't want to risk doing anything to lose their standing or their jobs. In other words, people balance their CDing needs with the other aspects of their lives.

And for still other CDers, it is a pure fetish, whether it is sexual or not, and there is absolutely no need to take it beyond the realm of the very private.

So no, not all CDers will want to leave their closets. Who said they do? :)

[suzy1]

A natural progression to the CDing is to want to go from a single to a multi-faceted expression (staying home in front of a mirror vs. going out in public), but this isn't for everyone. Some CDers have families who would never condone this. Other CDers feel they would never be able to pass and they do not want to subject themselves to ridicule. Others are prominent in their communitities and they don't want to risk doing anything to lose their standing or their jobs. In other words, people balance their CDing needs with the other aspects of their lives.

And for still other CDers, it is a pure fetish, whether it is sexual or not, and there is absolutely no need to take it beyond the realm of the very private.

So no, not all CDers will want to leave their closets. Who said they do? :)




Don’t leave me out Reine. I just don’t NEED to go out. It’s not a natural progression for me. And it's not a fetish for me either.

Suzy feeling a bit left out here.:sad:

[Noel Chimes]

To go or not to go? That is not the question. The question is are we happy being who we are? For some it is enough to come to terms with who we are when we see our reflection in the mirror. For others it is the positive acknowledgement of others. But it is being happy where you are that is most important.
I remember a quote I heard as a child and it still holds true today, "be who you is, not who you is not. Those that do this are the happiest lot".

[Lorna]

I'm a firmly in the closet person. All the usual reasons. I don't want even to try to fool anybody "outside" that I am a woman but I would love to be able to go out dressed. As I've explained before, it's the feelings I enjoy from wearing the clothes and I would love to know how it feels to walk down a breezy street or relax in the park or get on the bus, etc., etc. wearing a variety of my favourite clothes. I know I will not do it, though, and I accept that I must make do with occasional solo dressing at home (or occasionally in a hotel room). I enjoy underdressing and spending time walking around, having a restaurant meal, shopping, travelling, etc, feeling the bra, the girdle, the stockings responding as I move - but that's the best I can do and I'm happy to stick to that.

[PretzelGirl]

I do get the impression that the members that are dedicated to going out and encouraging others to do the same post more than the ones that are happy in there closet.

I agree that this is definitely part of it. Another is that there are a fair amount of discussions where someone says they are interested in going out and look for recommendations. Just seeing all the responses can skew the view of this site to having a majority of people pushing going out. We should support those that want to go out and we shouldn't tell someone that they should go out. Unfortunately there are a few that tell people what to do. Don't let those few cause you to view the site on a whole a certain way.

[kimdl93]

Sorry but I just ain't buying it. There seems to be a very common theme at this Forum that ALL CDers want to/will want to eventually leave their house "dressed". ...".

I'll rise a quick objection. It seems that You are objecting to a sweeping generalization by making anther sweeping generalization. Lots of CDrs, myself include are surprised that eventually they are not satisfied with dressing alone and in the confines of thier home. That doesn't mean we we expect or demand the same of anyone else.

[ReineD]

Don’t leave me out Reine. I just don’t NEED to go out. It’s not a natural progression for me. And it's not a fetish for me either.

Suzy, let me ask. How full is your social calendar? How many activities do you engage in on a regular basis with friends outside your home? How many friends do you invite over for dinner and vice versa? Are you happy and fulfilled in your male life and is the CDing for you just a little thing you do on the side once in awhile, and nothing more than this? If it is, then you are correct, I should have mentioned that for some CDers the activity is nothing more than an occasional, non-fetishistic, hobby.

But if the CDing takes up more time and energy than that, there are umpteen reasons why people choose to keep it in the closet. I can't possibly address each one in a short post. :)

... and each reason to keep it closeted is valid. As I said earlier, it is a question of balancing the CDing needs with the CDer's other, non-CDing needs. :)

[suzy1]

Suzy, let me ask. How full is your social calendar? How many activities do you engage in on a regular basis with friends outside your home? How many friends do you invite over for dinner and vice versa? Are you happy and fulfilled in your male life and is the CDing for you just a little thing you do on the side once in awhile, and nothing more than this? If it is, then you are correct, I should have mentioned that for some CDers the activity is nothing more than an occasional, non-fetishistic, hobby.

But if the CDing takes up more time than that, there are umpteen reasons why people choose to keep it in the closet. I can't possibly address each one in a short post. :)

... and each reason to keep it closeted is valid. As I said earlier, it is a question of balancing the CDing needs with the CDer's other, non-CDing needs. :)



I wasn’t criticising you Reine. :eek:

I spend about 50% of my time out with friends/family and being involved in motorsport.
The other 50% of the time I live alone as Suzy. Am I happy? My life is almost perfect. [For me that is!]

As you say Reine, there are umpteen reasons for staying in the closet. I love my life just as it is. Simple!:)

SUZY

[ReineD]

I don't feel criticized Suzy.

But I chose to answer your post because it is in the same vein as the OP. I get the impression that people who choose to keep it in the closet feel criticized. They are not, or at least, not by me. I also think that the closeted members on this board far outweigh those who do go out.

But, there are also umpteen people who say they would go out if they could, and each and every reason for keeping it closeted is valid. Some people do not even consider going out because they are not interested in overcoming their reasons for staying in, whatever those reasons are. This is what I meant by "natural progression".

If we lived in world that totally accepted the expression of non-binary gender, if a significant amount of the male population had a strong enough desire to present as women and we grew up with a significant amount of men presenting as women on a regular basis in our families, in our schools, in our neighborhoods, at work, at the mall, in the media, I don't think there would be any need to keep the CDing closeted for anyone, do you?

[Stephanie47]

I am totally happy being an in-home cross dresser, which includes my backyard. I dress for the peace and tranquility it brings me. I will never pass as a woman on the street because I have the physical stature and facial appearance of a man. I have gone out for evening walks and found the adventure rather boring. Walking around in a dress and heels loses its appeal when there is nothing to do. And, if I am going to an event that would not be associated with cross dressing, then why go en femme. If I were to go for example to a plastic model building expo at the Museum of Flight, I do not feel the need to be en femme. I would not mind attending a cross dressing convention such as the one held Port Angeles, WA en femme, of course. However, that is specifically for cross dressing. I guess for some of us being en femme is a private thing.

All that being said, I've seen many pictures on this forum of young attractive young ladies who have the body size, facial features, etc who easily pass. If I had a feminine face, five foot seven and wore a size ten dress, then I would probably venture out during the day time.

[suzy1]

I have been criticized by a few members Reine. And I immediately go into attack mode. I’m not apologising fore that, that’s just me being me.
I am not in the situation where I am ‘not interested in overcoming my reasons for not coming out’ I just don’t deed to, if that makes sense?

Yes, members that do not choose to go out are criticized here sometimes.

And I agree with your last point Reine.

Hugs,

[ReineD]

All that being said, I've seen many pictures on this forum of young attractive young ladies who have the body size, facial features, etc who easily pass. If I had a feminine face, five foot seven and wore a size ten dress, then I would probably venture out during the day time.

This seems to be one of the biggest reasons for staying in: not feeling one can pass, and a healthy wish to avoid the very real negative consequences of being read as a man who is presenting as a woman. The other huge reason is the overall bias about this among our families, friends, coworkers, and in society in general.

If any member here ever says, "It's all in your head, you can pass if you want to, all you need is confidence, you can go out if you want to and no one will say a word", they are wrong because they can only speak for themselves and not for you. They do not know what you look like, the makeup of your personality, the area you live in, and they do not know the strength of your CDing needs or how you've chosen to balance them with the other aspects of your life.

My SO goes out frequently and I join her. But this does not mean that everyone else will feel comfortable doing this. In fact, I'd say that most members here would not feel comfortable doing this. At the same time, it is possible for those who do want to venture out. :hugs:


EDIT - And I want to emphasize again: the number of members on this board who are closeted far outnumber the CDers who go out. We have about 7,000 current members who have logged in in the last three months. I'm picking a number out of the air, but I do not see more than 500 members who post regularly about going out and even this seems high. This leaves about 6,500 who do not and I'm guessing if they did go out they'd post about it.

[BRANDYJ]

As usual, very good point and well said Reine. Then there are those of us that do go out to places that other TG's are known to frequent and are well accepted there. I am one of those, but to go out into mainstream...NEVER.

[Kaz]

Oh Wow! One of THOSE threads! I has no idea it would turn out like this!

OK Once I was in the closet. Then I got to go out and play - some great times, some good times and some plain scary! I am less inclined to go out now... This is NOT a one way street! There is no set direction - do not pass GO until you have had 10 trips the 'the mall'... If we want board game analogies or metaphors, try Snakes and Ladders. That is more like real life as a CD!

For most of us it is just a weird brush with the reality of what we would like to do and what we are comfortable with doing. I love going out but am quite comfortable being 'in the closet'. I would certainly rather be in the closet than not 'in' at all!

[ReineD]

Oh Wow! One of THOSE threads! I has no idea it would turn out like this!

I saw it coming with the very first post. :p

I think that one of the issues with this topic (and I understand why it comes up on occasion), is that other than the handful of members who take it upon themselves to tell others what to do, there are TONS of posts from members who do share their going out success stories and who make no comment about someone else's choice to stay in, but whose posts might still be seen as "criticism", as if the going-out CDer is making a comparison when she isn't at all.

[suzy1]

I saw it coming with the very first post. :p

I think that one of the issues with this topic (and I understand why it comes up on occasion), is that other than the handful of members who take it upon themselves to tell others what to do, there are TONS of posts from members who do share their going out success stories and who make no comment about someone else's choice to stay in, but whose posts might still be seen as "criticism", as if the going-out CDer is making a comparison when she isn't at all.



Wise words from a wise women

“Might still be seen as "criticism", as if the going-out CDer is making a comparison when she isn't at all”

Guilty as charged.:sad:

[Nikki A.]

To those who are comfortable being closeted and have no desire to head out, I accept you for who you are and totally understand and would no belittle you for your feelings. It is your right to do what feels right for you.
There are others that would like to try going out but are afraid for various reasons. To those all I can say it's a a lot scarier until you try it and realize that there are no pitchfork mobs waiting to tar & feather you. I've kinda passed this stage although I still do chicken out when I really do want to dress.
Then there are you that go about your everyday lives dressing as you please and wearing what you want. As long as you're happy go for it.
To the TS members, this is a non issue, you dress as a female because you feel that this is what you are.
Long story short, we are a broad spectrum and there is no right or wrong. You have to do what feels right for you.

[Kaz]

Good point Reine. I suspect that many of those that do go out (me included here) are so 'gobsmacked' that they did it and it worked (or didn't) that their posts are focused on what they did rather than what others didn't. We do need to get a better balance though in how we position things.

I have enjoyed being out and about, but not in the full frontal assault of some of our community here. But I am more in the closet these days... a mixture of circumstance and 'wariness' rather than fear, but certainly worried.

So I feel a kindred spirit with everyone... we should all recognise this. It is a game of snakes and ladders rather than ludo.

[Beverley Sims]

Some will remain closeted forever. Appearance, family situations, fear and a myriad of other reasons.
Some just want to dress and do not aspire to go out either.
On the other side the intention is to go out and see how living a womans life feels.
Others because they're more out going, feminine in appearance, more fortunate circumstances, and again family and friends acceptance, will shed the shell and go out on the town. Younger ones these days have more bravado and support to emerge, whereas twenty years ago acceptance was quite different.

[STACY B]

Hell some stay in ,,,Some get out ,,,Not everyone want to get up an sing ! But ya cant shut some of em up ,,,Some sing well ,,,Others not so well ,,Some think they can sing,, Some think they cant ! If ya want to just Sing in the shower then Sing ,,, But if ya wanna get up in front of every one then Get up an get it on .. But rememeber one thing about being up front ? Your the first one they will look at ! Some folks just dont like being in the spotlite ,, Low ,,Slow,, An easy ,, Others wanna blow there horn for all to hear . This stuff is just like swimming ,,,Some dip there toe in an say ,,,No way ,,,,, Others dip it in an just jump off an swim all day ,,Some dip ,,,Dip,,, Little more,,, Little more ,, An say thats enough for me ,,, Some go all in ,,,An some are just satisfied getting there foot wet,, It no fun being all the same ,,, Anyway ya dont want all of us out on the town ,,They dont have enough size 12 heels as it is ~!!!!! :D

[Noemi]

This is a great post.

There are some cd'ers who make us feel bad about being in the closet. One, who wears a different wig every two days in her avatar, said some thing like I am missing out on all the good stuff. And there are a few others that criticize the closet.

For the most part I ignore them because it is obvious to me that they are a bit how do I say, daft. I mean there are all kinds of us on this board.

I am not really a them and us type, and I am usually(except today)respectful of the choices of others. There is no them and us but just, we, together.

Well I do not like long posts and it is sounding like I am going to go on and on and could............

Those of us in the closet have our reasons. I still love to be Noemi(need to be her). Looking at my pink painted toes as I write this makes me very happy.

And to reiterate there are only a few who are pushing us out the door. Most folks here are intelligent enough to understand why we are in the closet.

Now the closet does come with some emotional issues. And it is lonely at times, for me. I am more then a cd'er and I know this, maybe I will go further, but when I am ready.

I have learned a great deal from reading these boards and am grateful for this place.

♥♥♥
Noemi

[ReineD]

Wise words from a wise women

“Might still be seen as "criticism", as if the going-out CDer is making a comparison when she isn't at all”

Guilty as charged.:sad:

Suzy, if someone ever slams you for your choices, you have every right to tell them to mind their own business. And maybe some members here do post with the intention of making a subtle comparison, in a passive-agressive manner. But I know that many others are simply relating their own experiences with no judgment on anyone else.

So I think in forums where we only have the typed word to rely on and not tone of voice and the all-important non-verbal language, the onus is on each member to choose to see the positive rather than the negative in the text, unless of course there is outright criticism.

I was told something years ago (at a period of time when I was unhappy and critical of others): "If you spot it, you got it", meaning that it is not uncommon for people to project their own feelings or insecurities onto other people's motives. But if they do this repeatedly in a negative manner as I did, they need to learn to look at internal root causes rather than focus on other people's behaviors or motives, unless of couse the other person is being flagrantly malicious.

OK. I'll get off my soapbox now. :facepalm:

[NicoleScott]

To the TS members, this is a non issue, you dress as a female because you feel that this is what you are.

Right, Nikki. I'm not a TS, but this is what they say, and I believe them. The thread is about a CDer going out, which is a different POV than a TS going out.

[Radina]

Yea I don't see myself 'going out' for a LONG time as long as I still live with my family or as long as they are near by me. I don't want to disappoint them that I've not turned out to be the ideal male rather just a little CD fetish. I will probably remain 'in closet' but I'm OK with this. I'm only in 20's.. still young I guess.

[Carmen]

I disagree with your theme/premise. Change "ALL" to "most" or "the majority" and then I would agree with you...When and if they are ever ready, they will find that with the right attitude, it is an awful lot of fun being out there.

Well said Allie.
I started dressing in my mid-20's and the word "closeted" was not in my vocabulary. Early on in my CD 'career' I just assumed that I was supposed to dress my best and then go out. And I became used to society's reactions both positive and not. For me the closet is where I keep my femme attire in between outings.
When I have put all that time money and effort into dressing and looking my best, to me it is a waste to do so and then remain indoors.

[Wildaboutheels]

Just ONE of the reasons for starting this thread.

True or False??? VVV

It would be very easy for any GG to come to this site and easily get the impression that if a fella she is dating has mentioned anything CD related, she will eventually have to deal with HIM wanting to do it publicly with or W/O her.

In my mind [and the now closed thread just adds fuel to the fire] there is a huge difference between keeping it stricly at home and displaying one's "girly side" to the world and having to deal with all the repercussions of a non accepting Society even though her thread was labeled with the B word and that was the apparent "angle" of it.

CDing IS at least a partly visual thing for ALL CDers of every stripe and most likely the ONLY factor for the vast majority of CDers {MEN} who probably only dress for 5 or 10 minutes at a time before deciding "maybe that's enough dressing for today". The numbers clearly support the ones in the closet are the majority theme as Reine pointed out.

Of course, the vast majority of people who POST here DO go out dressed, making it appear that most all CDers either want to get out of the closet or will want to eventually if they have not already.

Just because someone plays a musical instrument does not mean that they WILL someday want to play in a group or a marching band in public. Does not mean they don't play a mean guitar, piano or whatever and being able to pass has nothing to do with it for most people perfectly happy staying in their closet.

There is no right or wrong here. Every one of us has reasons for what we like or don't like and for what we will or won't do.

What's good here, is that this site offers support and encouragement for the folks in the closet WANTING to get out.

[sandra-leigh]

Step on a board that has wheels on it. Fall immediately. Repeat a dozen times, the average time between falls decreasing even as you roll on a variety of surfaces. Flush with excitement, get off, and go over to your friends' house -- and don't say a thing to them because you don't want to risk the possibility of giving them the impression that you feel that you are "better" then they are.

Likely? I don't think so. You're probably going to say the equivalent of "Oh man, what I just did was sooo awesome! You gotta try it!"

I reluctantly got on a Plank With Things Attached That Turn Underneath It, once. I promptly fell backwards and hit the back of my head hard on asphalt. Everyone around laughed at me. I worried about brain damage.

My friends kept riding their Planks With Things Attached, not caring if I might feel inferior. Which I didn't. Just lonely sometimes, when it got to feel that it had been too long since we'd done something I could participate in.

[Engendered]

This may start to veer slightly off topic, but there seems to be some concern here about how GGs/SOs...new people to the site, might perceive CDs as a whole (and thus their partner) in a certain way, based on the prevalent views and positions of a vocal minority. Since it's more likely someone will post about "I finally went out today", than "I stayed indoors again today", a slanted view of reality might come across. I'm not sure there's any way to redress the balance, as it's quite natural for this to happen in any random population of people.

You also mentioned that the MtF section is one of the ones open to the public. I think it's important to be mindful of this at times. I'm sure there are quite a significant portion of non-registered people reading this very topic. This isn't really that significant a stat, but right at this moment 142 out of 161 people reading the MtF section, are not signed in. I doubt the real number of non-members is 88%, so I assume most members don't sign in when reading (although I'm logged in 100% of the time I'm here).

[Elizabeth]

Hi Wildaboutshoes,

As to the true or false question, it's my experience that more likely than not, a SO is going to have to deal with the issue of her partner going out in public in one way or another. As to preference, I think one has to look at the reasons for being in the closet. For some the reasons are serious motivators to stay closeted. There are some people who would lose their job, or be ostracized in their community. The consequences can be harsh. Families disown crossdressers, relationships are damaged or broken.

For me there was a time when coming out of the closet would have been impossible. It would have cost me my marriage, my business, my kids, and my relationships with immediate family members, such as mom, dad, brothers and sisters. But circumstances can and do change. When that happens the reasons for remaining in the closet can evaporate. I make no judgements about any sisters who remain in the closet. They know what is best for them.

My last point here is that for me it turned out I could have come out anytime. I just didn't know it.

Love always,
Elizabeth

[IngeInCO]

My closet is Awesome! Um our closet

[ReineD]

It would be very easy for any GG to come to this site and easily get the impression that if a fella she is dating has mentioned anything CD related, she will eventually have to deal with HIM wanting to do it publicly with or W/O her.

...

Of course, the vast majority of people who POST here DO go out dressed, making it appear that most all CDers either want to get out of the closet or will want to eventually if they have not already.

Question: Do you foresee having a SO who might want to join this forum one day, and do you anticipate issues when she reads posts that do not mirror your situation?

If this is the case you will simply need to explain to her how vast is this community, and where you fit into it. You can also explain that many members who do want to go out use this forum to learn all about the "how-tos" and this is why there are so many going out threads. There are also many other members who are in the process of figuring out what all of this means to them, which accounts for a large chunk of the posts. Also, don't forget the members for whom this forum is one of their only outlets for expression.

If someone only dresses for 5-10 minutes at a time, a few times per month, they will not be interested in posting so much here, so they will rather be a part of the relatively silent majority? :)

[TxCassie]

I don't have the desire to go out in public "en femme", least not as we're speaking in this thread. I wouldn't mind attending an intimate social gathering of accepting and friendly individuals such as a dinner party. But, I don't see me driving around, shopping, or any other public outing "en femme", at least not anytime soon or in the next twenty years.

Cassie

[UNDERDRESSER]

All that being said, I've seen many pictures on this forum of young attractive young ladies who have the body size, facial features, etc who easily pass. If I had a feminine face, five foot seven and wore a size ten dress, then I would probably venture out during the day time.Yes, me too. Why? I don't feel i have an interest in going out dressed, partly because I don't think I'd pass, but mostly I don't want to unless I can feel attractive. Why is that? These days I'm getting more adventurous as a male, the other day i went out in some outrageously bright bike shorts, why? Because i want to "display." Do others identify with this?

[Lynn Marie]

Wow, 31 threads started out of only 151 total posts. You are quite prolific.

Some girls get out and some don't. Some are married and some aren't. Some have careers that would be in jeopardy if they are discovered and some don't. Everybody has an opinion. I guess I just don't get the question!

[kimdl93]

Yes, those of us who go out on occasion like to describe our experiences and encourage those who express a desire to go out. And even offer a little advice on how to make the experience work better for those who choose to go out. And granted, some uninitiated reader may conclude that this desire to go out is representative of the majority of CDrs.

I'm not advocating that everyone go out...or that anyone do so. But I fail to see any practical benefit in self censoring topics so as to avoid giving one impression or another to casual readers. If someone over generalizes that's not my problem to solve.

[RebeccaLynne]

No desire whatsoever to CD in public. I enjoy my femme time either with my SO or by myself.

I've crossdressed since I was four years old; at fifty-eight, don't think I'll be changing my mind.

[Amanda22]

I suppose we're all different in the need or desire to stay in the closet or exit the closet. I always had a feeling I'd not be satisfied with the closet, and I was right. I think the issue is when a person denies who they really are or what they really want to do. I denied myself and made excuses for hiding for so long, but when I finally faced what was authentic for myself, I went for it. I haven't looked back. That was my authenticity. For others, their destination/home is the closet and that's great. Whatever fulfills a person is just fine.

[Helen_Highwater]

Getting back to the original question, isn’t it just the same as the conversation that goes something like:

A. “I don’t like curry”
B. “Have you tried curry”
A. “No but I know I don’t like it”

Many a thread describing someone’s first time outside the house will talk of the overwhelming liberation they felt. They and I included are not saying you must, it’s more about inviting others to share in a wonderful experience.
Isn’t it also about degrees of going out? I’ve been out at night but in places where there was enough people about (for safety) but only a small chance of a close encounter.
And as for degrees of out, I can never see me going to a pub, club or restaurant enfem.

Did I say I don’t like Mongolian food?

[TGMarla]

I dress quite often. I go out rather rarely. My well-being and happiness in my crossdressing is not dependent upon my going out anywhere. It's fun, and even a bit exhilarating. But it's not what I live and die for. I'd encourage anyone who has a genuine desire to go out dressed to gather up the courage to do so. (Learn how to carry your purse before you do, though!) However, if you feel that you don't want to, then don't. It's not like you're missing some incredible life out there that will somehow fill all the empty spaces in your life. Your happiness will come from within, not from some mall somewhere while you're wearing a skirt.

[Launa]

I never thought in a triliion years I would ever go out dressed, now I want to do it a lot something must have snapped upstairs in my noggin. Its almost like my mindset has totally switched and I really don't care to dress at home. I just want to get out in the world a little more often. I used to be just fine with wearing a nice dress around the house but now it has to be FULL OUT with all the fixings!!! Even have to learn to drink girly drinks when I go out, no more beer out of the can.

[suchacutie]

That first day that I donned feminine lingerie and posed for my wife started the greatest adventure of my life. That adventure is trying to understand who Tina is, and we are doing that by letting Tina have a life that is not necessarily linked to her male self in any way. When the transformation occurs and Tina arrives the focus is on how Tina thinks and acts, her desires, her traits, and her wants. This transformation almost always happens with her girlfriend (my wife!) and the two of them spend time as girlfriends.

Whether or not this adventure would include other people was never thought of as some barrier. My wife's first question to Tina seems always to be, "how are you Tina and what's new in your life?". I only learned about this "barrier" of private vs. public here at the forum. Maybe it's because I trust my wife completely so her seeing Tina as ready to step out the door is all the validation I need.

The other part of it may be that there have been so many instances of sharing the fact that I am TG when I'm in male mode. Buying shoes and having an SA ask if they are for me (when I'm standing there wearing them!), or my wife handing me my first mascara and eye liner clearly telling me that "Tina" will need these now, or getting my foundation color matched at a Mac counter all tend to "normalize" the fact that I'm TG. So maybe it just wasn't something that I thought about too much!

The bottom line is that being transgendered is not about whether or not one leaves the privacy of one's abode, but rather about who our feminine selves are, and who we want them to be. Not much else really matters.

Lastly, the posts about successful and unsuccessful outings in public are a god-send to all of us. I don't see them as criticism, but as useful information to all of us, even if we never leave the living room! It's great to read about how we are all being ever-more successful in our endeavors as our feminine selves. The more successful we are as individuals, the more successful we are as a group! Successes can be measured in a lot of ways, and leaving the house is just one of them!

[Lainie]

It depends on why you do it. If it's sexually exciting, then really it should stay private. If it's personal style, or adrenaline rush, then out is better.

[Veronica27]

I just discovered this thread and there are some terrific replies. I especially agree with most of the comments by Reine, with the possible exception that some deeply closeted readers could possibly read into some messages an unintended "just do it " implication. I don't see any solution to this, as we certainly do not want to discourage folks from telling us all about their adventures, but on the other hand do not want to make anyone feel inferior. In the past I have suggested that overuse of expressions like "its all about confidence and or attitude" or "we need to be true to ourselves" might be contibuting to this impression, but the reality is that these things are essential for anyone wanting to leave their closet.

When I first allowed byself to give into my previously suppressed crossdressing desires, I was self-employed and spent about 75% of my time working at home. I could crossdress fully whenever I felt the desire, and did so about one day a week. On these days I assumed the role of a woman heading to work at her office, and remained that way, until the schoolbus brought my son home from school. This satisfied all my crossdressing "needs", and I felt no desire to leave this closet. Now that I am retired, I have been experiencing a growing feeling that my crossdressing desires are "trapping" me in my home. I have no real desires to "out" myself in front of everyone, especially friends, relatives and neighbours, and my personal situation places me among those with real legitimate reasons to not do so. The problem is that I no longer want to hang around the house, when everything else in my life is now freeing me to do whatever I want, and go wherever I please. Any time I crossdress, I feel that I am wasting what precious time I have left. I limit the extent of my dressing, so I can quickly change if the need arises, but the simplest tasks such as taking out the garbage, filling the bird feeders, and tending the garden necessitate such changes. But that is my problem, and the messages on this forum have no direct influence on my actions, but do provide helpful advice and, yes, entertainment.

Finally, the closet in this context is a word with a very wide definition. Such things as attending CD gatherings, frequenting accepting gay clubs, joining support groups, shopping in certain stores, and even going for night-time drives, can in reality be viewed as extensions of the closet, if the surroundings are totally supportive, and anticipating the presence of crossdressers. But this is a subject that should have a separate thread.

Veronica

[Mizz Nyla]

I've read this thread with great interest.
I have thought about going out dressed to a local bar that "caters" to gay/lesbian/TG/CD etc lifestyles, and the thought excites me,
but on the other hand scares me! No amount of makeup will ever make me pretty, nor I think, entirely passable unless all the patrons are quite intoxicated. ;) Still, the desire is there, and if I get the right person to escort me I think I would like to try. After all, if I can't be accepted there then I shall never go out dressed again and resign myself to dressing in the hotel rooms as I travel for work.

[RebeccaLynne]

CDing IS at least a partly visual thing for ALL CDers of every stripe and most likely the ONLY factor for the vast majority of CDers {MEN} who probably only dress for 5 or 10 minutes at a time before deciding "maybe that's enough dressing for today". The numbers clearly support the ones in the closet are the majority theme as Reine pointed out.

Wild, I can agree with your take that many men are more visually stimulated than your average woman. However, to postulate that "the vast majority of CD'ers (men) only dress for five or ten minutes" is quite a stretch.

I'll speak only for myself... I don't CD for sexual gratification. I do so only in a genuine desire to make an emotional connection to the sex which with I feel so strongly aligned.

Yeah, I'm an "in house" CD'er. Many times referred to as "in the closet". My expression of femininity is mine to own, and I can assure you that everytime I CD, I do so for far longer than you've suggested. How could I possibly compartmentalize such a significant part of my identidy into such a small time frame?


Of course, the vast majority of people who POST here DO go out dressed, making it appear that most all CDers either want to get out of the closet or will want to eventually if they have not already.

Been a member since Aug '05. Appearances can be deceiving; I don't go out, and although I've entertained the thought, I do this for me; no one else.


If someone only dresses for 5-10 minutes at a time, a few times per month, they will not be interested in posting so much here, so they will rather be a part of the relatively silent majority? :)

Point well taken, Reine. And yet, I dress extensively and almost everyday (after work, of course), although my post count is low... because I only post if my viewpoint hasn't already been been expressed by others. Additionally, I'm only logged-on "en femme", and proper decorum requires me to give others the opportunity to make themselves heard without interjecting my opinion, unless doing so would prove beneficial.


It depends on why you do it. If it's sexually exciting, then really it should stay private. If it's personal style, or adrenaline rush, then out is better.

Lainie, out is not always better. My CD'ing is both a relection of who I am and personal style, not a requirement to seek approval or acceptance from those that I encounter in society; as to the adrenaline rush, suspended rollercoasters does it for me... try "Silver Bullet" at Knott's Berry Farm in Anaheim, CA... now that's a rush! :)