Labels.

[melissakozak]

A recent post simply stated that the 'crossdressing' label is inadequate. I agree partially, but it does accurately describe a behavior. We are, for all intents and purposes, anatomical/genetic males who for whatever reason feel a deep need to wear and present as women either partially or fully and/or part time or full time.

Virgina Prince was a full time crossdresser, but I think a more accurate description of her would be a non transitioning transgender woman. No?

My point is that labels fail to define us, and they only partially describe us. And what about some of us who label ourselves crossdressers only to find we are really transsexuals???

And what about transsexuals who don't desire SRS? And what about....? and? and? and so on and on....get it....

I think it is helpful for all of us to simply define ourselves in a manner that makes us most happy. If that means we tell others we are transgendered, trans, crossdresser, TV, CD, TS, etc., so be it. I will even throw in drag queen because some of us exhibit some drag queen like behavior while dressed.

But in the end, we are all humans....aren't we?

[GaleWarning]

Labels categorize things and people. Their purpose is to separate things, rather than to unite them.
The grossest example of this was Apartheid South Africa.

Yes, I agree with you, Melissa. We are all humans. This is what we have in common. It is far more important than any other characteristic some human might care to coin, then try to define.

Well said!

[DebbieL]

A recent post simply stated that the 'crossdressing' label is inadequate. I agree partially, but it does accurately describe a behavior. We are, for all intents and purposes, anatomical/genetic males who for whatever reason feel a deep need to wear and present as women either partially or fully and/or part time or full time.

That's why we adopted the term transgendered, which refers to a broad spectrum of behaviors and is very inclusive, while transsexual is someone who feels that her true identity, her "inner self" is not the same gender as indicators between our legs, is transsexual, which is included within the broad spectrum of transgender behaviors.


Virgina Prince was a full time crossdresser, but I think a more accurate description of her would be a non transitioning transgender woman. No?

I it's the same Virginia I talked to on the Internet back in the 1980s, that would be correct. She eventually got permission from AT&T to come to work as a woman, and was quickly accepted as a woman, even though she never transitioned. I thought she did start HRT though. Of course, back in those days, doctors could lose their license to practice medicine for performing orchiotomies. I decided to have a vasectomy and asked if we could just remove the testes, and after trying to tell me all of the bad side effects, I told him I was transsexual and this would help. That's when he told me that he could lose his license if he did. That was back in 1992.



My point is that labels fail to define us, and they only partially describe us. And what about some of us who label ourselves crossdressers only to find we are really transsexuals???

That is not near as hard as thinking you are transsexual, going through modifications, then deciding you are only a cross-dresser or a transvestite. This is why transsexuals are strongly encouraged to do therapy as they are doing the transition process.


And what about transsexuals who don't desire SRS? And what about....? and? and? and so on and on....get it....

Not all transsexuals have the full SRS. They might start HRT, and be satisfied with how they are living at that point. Often they can't afford to complete the SRS.


I think it is helpful for all of us to simply define ourselves in a manner that makes us most happy. If that means we tell others we are transgendered, trans, crossdresser, TV, CD, TS, etc., so be it. I will even throw in drag queen because some of us exhibit some drag queen like behavior while dressed.

But in the end, we are all humans....aren't we?

Even drag queens fit in the broader transgender spectrum. They may not be doing it because they feel like women on the inside, but they do enjoy being admired as women, being pretty, and being cute and sexy. Many drag queens have transsexual aspects, but don't want to lose the acceptance the gay community and the lucrative job of performing.

[KlaireLarnia]

The problem is that as humans we need to see how we and others "fit" into the world and this is why we have labels for want of a better word for things. Is is so we can see where we fit in a world of so many others. It also helps us find unity and companionship in others. Why do you think that cultural heritage and identity is so important these days? We need to find a a way to define ourselves. People who are offically "British" often label themselves as English, Scottish or Welsh to give cultural identity. My wife who is British (by nationality) still says she is Filipino because that is her way of identifying herself in the world.

Going to our situation, Cross Dressing while not the best sounding term I actually think IS the right term for what we do. We cross the boundaries of what we wear and bring the male and female together.

I am not a Transvestite, nor am I "Transgendered" or anything of that nature. When Debbie says "We adopted the term", I am sorry "we" did not, Just some of us did and forced it on the rest. The whole word suggests I am in some way changing sex / between sexes or not comfortable in my male body - which could not be further from the truth. I am perfectly happy with who I am. I just wear female clothes. And because there are so many different people, so many different reasons and opinions people will never be happy with the "labels" as they will often not fit them as they want.

As i said, Society likes to place people so they can see where they fit in the world. Some labels are created to give a sense of non-normality and help society say "hey you are different and not like me", when frankly I am as normal as the next person - and probably a hell of a lot more mentally stable thanks to what I do.

Sadly there will never be a term that will fit all. Lesbians and Homosexuals are united under those labels because they ALL fit into them. Because we are all differnet and want different things and desires we will never have a label to fit us.

I AM a Cross Dresser and you know what, I'm proud of it.

[Beverley Sims]

I might be a lot of things. I would have to read the various definitions and then interpret them to find out what.
Too many big words in the dictionary to worry about it.:)

[psion128]

A recent post simply stated that the 'crossdressing' label is inadequate. I agree partially, but it does accurately describe a behavior. We are, for all intents and purposes, anatomical/genetic males who for whatever reason feel a deep need to wear and present as women either partially or fully and/or part time or full time.

Virgina Prince was a full time crossdresser, but I think a more accurate description of her would be a non transitioning transgender woman. No?

My point is that labels fail to define us, and they only partially describe us. And what about some of us who label ourselves crossdressers only to find we are really transsexuals???

And what about transsexuals who don't desire SRS? And what about....? and? and? and so on and on....get it....

I think it is helpful for all of us to simply define ourselves in a manner that makes us most happy. If that means we tell others we are transgendered, trans, crossdresser, TV, CD, TS, etc., so be it. I will even throw in drag queen because some of us exhibit some drag queen like behavior while dressed.

But in the end, we are all humans....aren't we?

Labels help define us. That is my 2cents. Some labels are taboo and others are more socially acceptable in certain parts of society. I know in Hawai'i its is very acceptable. I met a guy that was on the street one time in Waikiki. I never got his number or name. But he was totally comfortable going out in clothes that he liked. I don't have the confidence and dislike negativity. In general, my P.O.V. of the whole label for CD'ers is negative. My SO before we divorced was confused and hurt by the whole thing. Eventually she accepted it. She doesn't go blabbing it to everyone and keeps it private. We are still good friends and she is one of my BFFs now.

I did go a slight tangent but I hope that covers the topic here.

I wish I had the confidence like you to say it proudly. Your profile picture is gorgeous.


The problem is that as humans we need to see how we and others "fit" into the world and this is why we have labels for want of a better word for things. Is is so we can see where we fit in a world of so many others. It also helps us find unity and companionship in others. Why do you think that cultural heritage and identity is so important these days? We need to find a a way to define ourselves. People who are offically "British" often label themselves as English, Scottish or Welsh to give cultural identity. My wife who is British (by nationality) still says she is Filipino because that is her way of identifying herself in the world.

Going to our situation, Cross Dressing while not the best sounding term I actually think IS the right term for what we do. We cross the boundaries of what we wear and bring the male and female together.

I am not a Transvestite, nor am I "Transgendered" or anything of that nature. When Debbie says "We adopted the term", I am sorry "we" did not, Just some of us did and forced it on the rest. The whole word suggests I am in some way changing sex / between sexes or not comfortable in my male body - which could not be further from the truth. I am perfectly happy with who I am. I just wear female clothes. And because there are so many different people, so many different reasons and opinions people will never be happy with the "labels" as they will often not fit them as they want.

As i said, Society likes to place people so they can see where they fit in the world. Some labels are created to give a sense of non-normality and help society say "hey you are different and not like me", when frankly I am as normal as the next person - and probably a hell of a lot more mentally stable thanks to what I do.

Sadly there will never be a term that will fit all. Lesbians and Homosexuals are united under those labels because they ALL fit into them. Because we are all differnet and want different things and desires we will never have a label to fit us.

I AM a Cross Dresser and you know what, I'm proud of it.

[KlaireLarnia]

I wish I had the confidence like you to say it proudly. Your profile picture is gorgeous.

Why is it such an issue tho? This is the point being made, because we feel that a "label" is not nice or perhaps respectful of what we do - we try and find something else to make us feel more "normal" or let us hide in plain sight when in fact we should embrace the essence of what we do.

I am not Transgender or a transvestite because I am not "changing" into something or between states of being. I am not undergoing any sort of therapy or counselling for what I do, nor am I am in need or having any medical help. I am simply who I am and happy with it. I dress using a mixture of male and female clothes, therefore I really do CROSS dress. The problem people have with the term is not the name itself but the public perception that all cross dressers are homosexual weirdos who do it for sexual kicks. Rather than try and redefine the term, we should be trying to change the perception of it so we can use it proudly.

If we could address the perception, the need to redefine or categorise would go away and we would be in a much better position both socially and when we venture out into the big wide world.

[Cheryl T]

Why do we have such a need to label ourselves....don't we have names??
That's enough for me...
This is Who I am...not What I do.

[Kate Simmons]

I define myself as Kate Hon. Simple as that. I sometimes use labels for the sake of overall observation but one size never fits all, especially in this "game". It is a game after all but the important part is not if we win or lose but how we play it.:)

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi Melissa, What do you want to be what ever you deside will be ok with us as we are easy to get along with.

[NathalieX66]

I don't know what I am.

I also don't care.

My real hair is beginning to brush my collarbone, and I got pierced ears, and I do my shopping in flip-flops with metallic red toes. I'm about a year or so with permanent hair removal by laser and electrolyisis. It will continue for many months more.

If I decide to do HRT, I will do it. I'm just glad and pleased society has been so nice to me if and when I go out wearing a dress. I try to look good and real. I try to keep my weight down as much as possible.....despite my cravings for a juicy steak.

In the end game, I don't necessarily need a vagina to feel whole, but like a dear friend of mine who is transitioning, and also a member of this forum, said to me "wearing guys clothes is like acid on my skin". I love her quote and can identify with it.

[Veronica27]

The problem is that as humans we need to see how we and others "fit" into the world and this is why we have labels for want of a better word for things. Is is so we can see where we fit in a world of so many others. It also helps us find unity and companionship in others. Why do you think that cultural heritage and identity is so important these days? We need to find a a way to define ourselves. People who are offically "British" often label themselves as English, Scottish or Welsh to give cultural identity. My wife who is British (by nationality) still says she is Filipino because that is her way of identifying herself in the world.

Going to our situation, Cross Dressing while not the best sounding term I actually think IS the right term for what we do. We cross the boundaries of what we wear and bring the male and female together.

I am not a Transvestite, nor am I "Transgendered" or anything of that nature. When Debbie says "We adopted the term", I am sorry "we" did not, Just some of us did and forced it on the rest. The whole word suggests I am in some way changing sex / between sexes or not comfortable in my male body - which could not be further from the truth. I am perfectly happy with who I am. I just wear female clothes. And because there are so many different people, so many different reasons and opinions people will never be happy with the "labels" as they will often not fit them as they want.

As i said, Society likes to place people so they can see where they fit in the world. Some labels are created to give a sense of non-normality and help society say "hey you are different and not like me", when frankly I am as normal as the next person - and probably a hell of a lot more mentally stable thanks to what I do.

Sadly there will never be a term that will fit all. Lesbians and Homosexuals are united under those labels because they ALL fit into them. Because we are all differnet and want different things and desires we will never have a label to fit us.

I AM a Cross Dresser and you know what, I'm proud of it.

You have provided one of the best explanations I have seen as to why many of us insist that we are crossdressers and not transgendered. I am not overly obsessed with the need to label myself, but I can see the value in well defined labels for discussion purposes. If I need a label for myself, I prefer crossdresser because it describes what I do and does not imply something that I am. Those who insist that we are all transgendered are imposing a label on us that describes, and thus limits, who and what we are. It may fit for many, but not for all. As you have said, I think of myself as normal, and a part of ordinary everyday society. I crossdress, while others have their own idiosyncracies. The word transgender tends to set us apart from everyone else, as it describes us, and not our activities.

In a strictly literal sense, trans means going over from one place to another, and not back and forth. We transport goods and a transexual goes from being one sex to being the other. The word gender is not an absolute term like the word sex, but is an intangible. It is primarily a grammatical distinction used to differentiate words as being applicable to one sex or the other, or else neutral. As such, what is considered to be feminine as opposed to masculine is a cultural function subject to fluctuating values. There is no finite definition for what constitutes gender. In recent years, our culture has come to use the term gender, when what it is really referring to is sex. We possess a sex but gender can mean whatever we want it to mean.

Whether we crossdress or not, we are probably all transgendered in that we possess qualities that society or some individuals might interpret as being feminine and other qualities that would be considered masculine. In this sense, labelling ourselves as transgendered becomes meaningless, as does the term cisgender. However, the use of gender to refer to sex, and the broadened use of trans to imply crossing back and forth has become so ingrained in modern useage that the term transgender has become an acceptable word to society as a whole, and a distinct meaning has been assumed. It has become a condition that applies to the individual and refers to confusion by the individual over his or her own gender resulting in living as both genders or working toward becoming the opposite gender.

I probably appear to many to be obsessed over this point, but I am not. If people want to use the term transgender to describe themselves then that is fine with me. This is all just opinion and everyone is entitled to their own opinion in a free society. We are not free to impose our opinions and beliefs on others. I can appreciate the desire by many to have an umbrella term to describe what is an extremely diverse community, and could be very supportive of their objectives. However, this is where labels become important and the transgender label simply does not fit everybody. It implies that we have this condition of confusion over our gender and causes some to distance themselves rather than unite, because they do not fit that description.

I do not have the answers to this dilemma, but simply offer my reasons for feeling the way I do. I crossdress for personal pleasure, not because I want to be a woman or am not sure of who or what I am. Transgender simply does not fit me.

Veronica

[Wildaboutheels]

Every single Human on the planet is unique, even identical twins. Which for all intents and ourposes means that no SINGLE label, no matter how many labels we can come up with, will be a completely accurate description of anyone.

Putting labels on people, just like music or any other category, is mainly an attempth to save "sorting out" time. Saves us both time and energy.

The trouble with labels is that tens of thousands of years of EVOLUTION have trained us to want to easily and quickly determine if other Humans are male OR female. That's a total of TWO labels!!!!!!!! Basically whether they might be a sexual partner or not. If we look at others and need more than a couple of seconds to "easily determine" they are male OR female, it's probably [apparently] disturbing to most folks at least subconsciously.

The ONLY thing any of us can do is show everyone we meet by our actions and words, that we are otherwise "normal" and are in no way any danger to them or their families.

[Annaliese2010]

"But in the end, we are all humans....aren't we?"
Yes. We have looks & behavior that are relatively unchanged for about 60,000 years now. Still a very young species. An 'experiment' in progress.

Very little has changed over the millennia. Still have to get up early on a Monday morning & get to work on time.

:battingeyelashes: