Wife found my mug with lipstick!

[ChelseaErtel]

. .

[Nikki A.]

I hope all goes well. Good luck you may need it.

[paulaprimo]

oh i'm sorry and hope things work out for the best.
hopefully this is a blessing in disguise, and maybe after a good honest
talk, she turns out to be supportive!!

[wanagione]

hang in there, just be honest and give it time to settle in. you've had all this time to come to grips with this and she will need the time too. When I told my wife i offered everything, internet, books, ect. she didnt talk to me for about a week. I though o well i'll be moving out soon but she came to me and said it was ok. its been about 8 years and she still gets hot and cold about it.

[suchacutie]

If you were ready to have "the talk" with her anyway, at least now the edge is a bit dulled and it might go much smoother. I certainly hope so...best wishes.

[Michelle (Oz)]

It is little things like the lipstick that happen so easily and are so obvious that catch us out.

One piece of advice (from my psychologist) is to talk to her in "I" statements, e.g. "I am terrified that I will lose you but I need to share something really important about me. This is how I feel ...." What you need to avoid is akin to a game of tennis where you serve, your wife returns the ball as hard as she can and the discussion intensifies. No one wins. The "I" statements are aimed at you taking the ball off the court. It also avoids you trying to put yourself in your wife's position ... she will do that for you much better!!

And don't make promises you can't keep.

Good luck. I well understand why you are nervous.

Michelle

[ChelseaErtel]

Michelle: Thanks you for the advice and I'll heed it. I'm just trying to get her to talk to me but she keeps going on doing things. So, when she gets home (took my daughter out to get poster board) I'm going to ask her to sit down and talk in private. I think having my daughter close will help keep things calmer. I was ready, but I did not exactly plan it this way. Better out than in I always say.

Oh, my god. I'm shaking........

[heatherdress]

Good luck. Already a lot of good advice. Seems like you also have to have a separate discussion with your daughter.

[AllieSF]

Just don't give too many details. A simple I like to dress in women's clothing is enough for now. Then as her questions come out, answer each one directly, honestly and most importantly, succinctly. It seems that we tend to over explain to others, when it really is not necessary, and when the other is not really interested in all the details at that specific moment. You will have many more opportunities to talk about the details later after she has had the time to digest that first big news that you dress. Good luck.

[Kathi Lake]

A simple I like to dress in women's clothing is enough for now.Unless that's not the truth. Lying to her - especially about something as big as this - is wrong, unfair, and a sure way to find yourself alone. If you tell her the truth - the whole truth - and she leaves you sooner rather than later, isn't that more fair to her? Your daughter? Yourself?

What do you want? Who do you want to be? If you don't know, then tell her that. Do not tell her something to calm her down, when the truth will come out anyway.

Kathi

[Stephanie47]

No offense to you, Chelsea, or any other member. But, after reading so many threads over the years, it ceased to amaze me the number of members who think their wives are just plain non observant. People have routines. People put things exactly in place time and time again. My wife made the comment one time that see thought she saw eye makeup that I had not totally removed. She did not say anything at the time. Give some credit to your wives. They are not stumps. If I was a truly secretive operator, I would have been working for the CIA. I'm sure the lipstick on the glass or cup is not the only slip up you have made.

Time to fess up. Frankly, you're going to find out your wife would have rather the lipstick was from another woman than you in a dress. A woman at least can try to work her charms on her man and win him back. Trying to woe him away from wearing a dress?? Nah! The best you can hope for is acceptance of your little quirk because all your other qualities override your cross dressing.

[Julie Denier]

Good luck and hang tight -- by your recent posts, you've been moving toward this moment for a while now, so at least it's not something you haven't been giving serious thought. I've been through the spousal storm too, so I'll be thinking good thoughts for you ;)

[stephNE]

Good Luck Chelsea, I am hoping for the very best for you S.

[~Joanne~]

Chelsea I wish you the best of luck with this. I was also planning to tell my GF in a different way and at a different time but fate had other plans. In the end I didn't have to tell her at all but I went ahead anyways. this may be the break you needed to force you to have this talk especially if you plan to transition. From the sounds of things though, yours is not going to go as smooth as mine did.

[Lady Catherine]

Hope everything works out for you. Deep breaths.

[ChelseaErtel]

Well I've told her, and it's more than just crossdressing, but as I have said before is nothing certain at this point. I know I am not happy as a man. At least my therapist and I agree there but we have not talked about what is next, and that is what I had to tell my wife. I asked her if I was just a CD, would that make it better and the answer was no.

Oddly enough, she had not a clue. But, we have been living pretty much in a platonic relationship for five years or so.

It was very hard, but we agreed to not expose our children right now. Our daughter specifically we agreed to keep this from her for now. My son we will tell eventually, but not while he's in school. My children are first, my wife second and I am third. That being the case, I will keep this from the community. Eventually, if I transition I will move to another town and start over - just dissolve away. I like to think that I'd be accepted, but that would be unrealistic.

My biggest concern is telling my children in the proper way, and to get support. One of my TS friends is going to help me with a support group, a TG doctor etc. When and how is all an unknown, but I have help and support here in VA and I'm taking advantage of it all.

I feel like a huge weight has been lifted off of my shoulders, but some other weights have been added. I honestly don't know what will happen, but at least my wife is willing (at the moment) to help make those family decisions. She's not going to tell everyone, go to a lawyer, make me move out etc.

I have reassured her that I want to keep the impact on her as low as possible. It's not just about me, and affects a great many people. I have a long, painful road ahead and I'm not sure where it will lead. At least now I have been honest with my wife, and I think I can now move on with my life.

I'm not being very clear right now, I'm kind of in a fog wandering slowly - it all seems so surreal. So Saturday out to a TG social, and next Friday to my first support group. Life does throw some curves at you. I have to go take some Advil, my head hurts.

[ChelseaErtel]

Unless that's not the truth. Lying to her - especially about something as big as this - is wrong, unfair, and a sure way to find yourself alone. If you tell her the truth - the whole truth - and she leaves you sooner rather than later, isn't that more fair to her? Your daughter? Yourself?

What do you want? Who do you want to be? If you don't know, then tell her that. Do not tell her something to calm her down, when the truth will come out anyway.

Kathi

Kathi:

You are right and I told the whole truth and nothing but the truth, hard as it was. So, it's the status quo and we'll be talking and deciding what to do as we move along.

[Lady Slipper]

Chelsea I'm proud of you, you did the right thing. I just want you to know that I'm pulling for you! I hope things improve for both you and your family with this new level of communication with your wife. I think your signature is probably an accurate description of how you feel right now. You will feel better, hopefully sooner rather than later. Keep taking advantage of your support systems, including this one! :)

Hugs,
Stephanie Marie

[Angela Campbell]

I hope things turn out ok for you. Just remember we didn't choose this and although it really is a ton of weight we will always have to carry, there are others out there with harder burdens than us. For your sake always be honest and do not forget that you hid it out of being protective of others. In being honest we may not always have the outcome we want but we will have the knowledge that we did the right thing. In years to come your self respect will be shaped by the honesty and character you show today. Chin up girl, sometimes what seems bad now looks better in hindsite. Good luck.

[CarleyR]

Hope things work out for you, Chelsea. You are a good person confronting a difficult situation and trying to proceed with honesty and caring for those close to you. What more can you do?

[Ceri Anne]

Good luck Chelses, prayers and thoughts with you.

[suit]

well you can redefine what you imagine a man to be .......then shade in where and what you are.

[Beverley Sims]

I am pleased that the outcome did not develop into a shouting match.
You can at least both talk about it without scratching each others eyes out.
Try and work it out between yourselves without lawyers.
All they do is take their share of the proceeds.

[Lorileah]

Just don't give too many details. A simple I like to dress in women's clothing is enough for now. Then as her questions come out, answer each one directly, honestly and most importantly, succinctly. It seems that we tend to over explain to others, when it really is not necessary, and when the other is not really interested in all the details at that specific moment. You will have many more opportunities to talk about the details later after she has had the time to digest that first big news that you dress. Good luck.

Easier to ask forgiveness than permission again. I agree with Allie but you have to get this OUT in the open. Otherwise you won't have any trust left in your marriage.

[ChelseaErtel]

Thank you ladies, for all the support. Last night she did ask questions, and some good ones. Most related to the children if I transition. I still cannot see myself not transitioning, I can't go on the way I have been and now it's even more important. The desire is just that much more, that closer.

The thing is, and this is all so hard to put into words here, I'm so worried my children will not want to see me anymore. I think my son will come around, but my daughter, I just don't know. I can work through all the social stigmas as I'm not going to allow my issue to impact her life anymore than it has to. I don't feel as empty inside as I expected. My wife asked me do I see myself alone at 75 or 80 with no one. We'll, I had to say I've had to think that, but I hope not. What else can I do?

But, I won't be alone - maybe family will desert me - but I already have TS friends, TG friends, and CD friends. A few I know personally they have already been in touch and helping. I often wondered why I most of my friends, my really good friends are gay, lesbian, or TS. Maybe I saw something in them that was in me I didn't recognize. I'm not gay, but I don't want to have another relationship. I'm not a sexual person I've come to realize, why I have asked myself and am trying to figure it all out.

My marriage was already over. I think she would have left if I didn't make so much more money than her. So, we are going to talk which is wonderful. We are not going to do anything rash, and be honest with each other. I hope as this sets in and we move forward that she will be supportive and not turn my children against me. She said she won't, but these are delicate times. She did seem receptive to seeing my or a therapist together as a family. I wonder if that is the conduit to tell my children, to have a professional there to explain it, because I have a difficult time with it at times. When I was telling her I had a pebble in my sock, so I took off my sock and she saw my painted toe nails. She wants me to remove that in case I end up in the hospital. Well, I'm not going to do that. She doesn't know I've shaven my body hair, so what would a little nail polish do for the picture in addition to my panties and camisole I usually wear. The Dr and nurses don't care, they just take care of the body and they can't tell anyone so, I'm leaving it on. I would love to have my ears pierced, but that would go too far right now. I may mention it as a desire to see my kids reaction, which if I know them well will be to go ahead. But, these are small things.

She said she felt sorry for me, which is OK I guess. She's genuinely concerned what my life is going to be like and not JUST concerned with our children. After I crawled into bed (our activity-less bed) she asked about my trip to NJ, that did I just sit in the room dressed. She was kind of shocked when I told her some of what I did. So, she's taking baby steps. I'll offer answers to her questions when SHE is ready. All the feelings of loss - disbelief, guilt, anger, sadness, acceptance (I think that's close, I'm too tired to look it up, but you get the picture) - will come. We both know that. I've already gone through them several years ago when she pulled away from our marriage bed. I think she understands the reasons she did that are because of who I am and who I am becoming.

I'm in a weird, foggy state now and I'm not sure what I'm feeling - mostly numb. Deep down, I know I'm doing the right think. It's how we handle it now, how my family handle's now that will be the big thing. Her whole family will be coming to our house for Thanksgiving and she's going to tell two of her sisters for support. I know it won't stay with her sisters, it will get out and spread and I don't think I can be there when it does. One against 23 people, nope, I can't do that. So, I think well cancel the plans, or I'll go to PA to visit my parents. I'm going to have to talk to her about that.

Thanks again for all your support. Cheers!

I gone down the slippery slope and there is no turning back. The good thing is I don't want to. I dreamed of being a woman, but there too many opstickels, but a few have now been knocked down.

[Beverley Sims]

Chelsea,
don't fight humor your wife remove the nail polish, it is no big deal.
Think of the fun when you apply it again next week.
If she sees it still on she may think she has a valid argument so I recommend one step backwards and then two careful steps forward.
What I am saying is don't be obstinate and try and keep the peace.

[kimdl93]

Take this a step at a time. You are just getting to know yourself, and there are a lot of things that may change in the months and years ahead. I would advise against plunging into the deep end. Just acknowledge the obvious and let her know that you have always enjoyed wearing women's clothes and feeling feminine. Stick to the script, and leave speculation about being transsexual until you've had more time in counseling.

[Angela Campbell]

I am going through a divorce right now. I can tell you that once the bedroom has become activity - less for a period of time the marriage is over. No, sex isn't the only thing in a marriage, nor the most important thing, but it is a very important part of a healthy relationship. Once the intimacy has died the relationship is on autopilot, and it is just a matter of time. I know, my soon to be ex told me about 5 years ago that she didn't care if she ever had sex again. Then came the no physical contact at all. And she wonders why the marriage fell apart after that. She made the decision to have a relationship that was cold, sterile and void of intimacy. When I stopped caring about much of anything she did she also found the marriage to be over. She never knew about my dressing and she never will because she would not be supportive. In fact she would be disgusted by it. Since she and I live apart I have begun to fully dress now. Before it was only a few articles every once in a while and now it is full dress and makeup and wig and going out in public. My life is changing very quickly now and I just am not sure what is next, but I know I will never be able to have a live in relationship again. To me a marriage is supposed to be a communion of souls. It is bringing together two lives and joining them into one. Not just two people living in the same house who think they are supposed to tell the other one what they are allowed to do and what they should not do.

[linda allen]

I know it's not the real point of this thread, but lipstick and makeup will get you caught eventually. There's no good way to hide it and you'll leave a trace eventually. Wig hairs and heel marks on hard surface floors are problems as well.

Chelsea, I wish you well with your wife and daughter.

[ChelseaErtel]

You are all very sweet and I expected nothing less.

This morning as she walked out the door she kissed me tenderly on the cheek. I'm crying as I write this.

Got to go.

[ArleneRaquel]

You are all very sweet and I expected nothing less.

This morning as she walked out the door she kissed me tenderly on the cheek. I'm crying as I write this.

Got to go.


Lovely darlin, lovely. Sorry that I'm tearing up in joy ! HUGS!

[Ceri Anne]

Chelses,

I really sounds like things are going well. I know its all a fog and a very touchy situation, but from what you have said, she is reacting very sensibly, and possibly even accepting. If you work on reassuring her and use this to rebuild the seperation the two of you have gone thru, it may even turn into something positive, possibly a renual of the marriage, which would be best for the kids. Having been married for 28 years, I do know that the best and most sucessful marriages are the ones that choose to continue thru the rough patches.

I can understand your wife wanting to be able to talk to her sisters for support. I would recommend you stay for Thanksgiving, and ask her to wait to tell her sisters til after Thanksgiving, or at least til just before they leave. Explain that you realize that word will spread quickly, and you can't yet handle facing everyone at once, in addition to the kids there overhearing the adult conversations and not understanding. If you need to, let her know you will set up a time when she can travel to her sisters to tell them if need be.

You mentioned her saying "do you want to be alone when you are 70 or 80?" In my experience, the people you can count on most when you are old are family, particularly your spouse and children. While most people have one or two friends who are close enough to put up with your daily issues, they will usually be struggling with their own aging at that time also. I'm not trying to paint a picture of gloom, but if its at all salvagable, your marriage is worth it.

I am very inspired by your story, and know I would be terrified going thru what your going thru. I am not looking for transition, but my crossdressing really allows me to express feelings that have been repressed, and I know I will need to come out to my wife sometime also. I wish you the very best and know I'm pulling for you and your family.

[linda allen]

You are all very sweet and I expected nothing less.

This morning as she walked out the door she kissed me tenderly on the cheek. I'm crying as I write this.

Got to go.

Chelsea, My advice (and what do I know) is to take this as slowly as possible and not say or do anything that you're not sure about and might regret later. I'm assuming that you and your wife love each other so in some cases at least, couples have gone through this and remained couples and remained married.

I wish you the best. :hugs:

[kimdl93]

You are all very sweet and I expected nothing less.

This morning as she walked out the door she kissed me tenderly on the cheek. I'm crying as I write this.

Got to go.

That's wonderful, Chelsea. In every ensuing conversation, remember how you felt receiving that kiss. think about the message she was conveying and imagine the emotions she was feeling at that moment.

[Elle1946]

GOOD LUCK and BEST WISHES!!

[sandra-leigh]

Our daughter specifically we agreed to keep this from her for now. My son we will tell eventually, but not while he's in school. My children are first, my wife second and I am third. That being the case, I will keep this from the community. Eventually, if I transition I will move to another town and start over - just dissolve away.

I have no idea how old your children are, but I would be concerned that if you just fade away that your children may think that it was because of something they did. That is, I gather, a common reaction in divorces. And if you just fade away, how will they know that you still love them?


I am going through a divorce right now. I can tell you that once the bedroom has become activity - less for a period of time the marriage is over. No, sex isn't the only thing in a marriage, nor the most important thing, but it is a very important part of a healthy relationship. Once the intimacy has died the relationship is on autopilot, and it is just a matter of time.

Interestingly, after years of my relationship drifting apart, my relationship is now getting closer again.

[linda allen]

...... I can tell you that once the bedroom has become activity - less for a period of time the marriage is over. No, sex isn't the only thing in a marriage, nor the most important thing, but it is a very important part of a healthy relationship. ........

Many folks, for one reason or another are not able to have sex, at least in the traditional way. If the people truly love each other, they don't let the lack of sex destroy the marriage.

When you get older, you will understand.

[MsRenee]

I wish you and your family all my love as you go thru this tedious time in your lives. We all know its not easy and its gonaa take time and little steps but hopefully the out come will keep you two the bestes friends. Hugs girl.
Renee

[ChelseaErtel]

My son is 20 and will adjust, he is smart and very liberal. My daughter is 12 and very vulnerable. We are staying together until I have to move out when my transition reaches a certain point. I have time yet because I'm still in therapy working on plan. We are going to be very careful to ensure both children know we love them, that mom and dad still have love and friendship for each other but have to move on.

My wife and I will separate amicably and talk to both children. Later, it will become apparent that Dad is different, then we will seek professional help again. That is the initial thoughts. We are both going to support groups, and are supporting each other. My family is first, and I come second.

I actually think that the eventual outcome is the best I could have hoped for. I'd give more details, but quite frankly I am exhausted, but doing pretty well. Damn my wife is a wonderful person, and so strong.

Love to all of you, I don't think I could have made it as easily without your support.

Chelsea.

[Kasandra]

I wish you lots of good luck, and think it over very hard before coming out. I would read as much as possible on the subject, and if you're not ready then a few white lies maybe necessary. "the lipstick was from a friend, or you wanted to make a kiss on a card (for a friend) o whatever.

[ChelseaErtel]

My wife and I are in complete agreement on how to proceed. She is supportive and if you have been following, will remain a friend.

Therapist is on board and happy with our decisions. I'm a little depressed now (just a little) because I know I have to eventually leave my home of 20+ years. There is no rush, we are holding tight and not divorcing right away, separate sometime in the future, but no divorce.

If she finds some who will treat her as she needs to be treated. I truly hope she finds new love, she deserves it. Then, we will divorce.

When I was planning to tell her, I had a best outcome, and a worst outcome and everything in between. So far, it's has turned in to the best outcome.

It seems all so surreal now, still in a fog and kind of numb. Partly because I probably only got 2 or 3 hours of sleep last night.

We are going out to dinner tonight and that is hard for me to believe. Rough things are coming, for sure, but it will work out. I just hope my children aren't too hurt. Go to go, tearing up again and can't see.

[Silentpartner GG SO]

I wish you and your family all the best Chelsea - you've got a hard road ahead but if this is what you truly want then it will be worth it. You only get one life, no point in wasting it on regrets. xx

[tammysmiles]

Chelsea, I'm very glad to read that you and your wife have been able to discuss everything openly and that things have lined up with your best case scenario.

May any future challenges you have to face follow suit.

Best wishes to you and your family.

[heatherdress]

Chelsea - Continued good luck, Chelsea. It is good that you and your wife are communicating and working together. Hopefully, all will continue to progress well. Your posts a few weeks ago stated you were happily married and enjoyed being a male. I do hope you are not moving too rapidly and am glad that you have professional help. I wish you the best.

[ChelseaErtel]

We just got back from dinner alone. It was nice to talk and just be out of the house. I know I need to take it veeerrrrrryyyy ssslllloooowwwllllyyyy now and let the therapy figure out the best course.

It's not an easy decision as it affects my whole family and work relationships. I get doubts and feel down in drab, but I feel so much better when dressed and I am then certain of what I must do. I'm not sure if that means anything or not, time will tell.

So, the cat is out of the bag, and nothing blue up. My wife just came up and said how much she appreciated the kindness and thoughtfulness I have expressed and kissed again on the cheek. She is truly remarkable. She doesn't think she can ever find love again, but I think she can and deserves happiness.

Slowly we go, taking deliberate thoughtful steps. Nothing is in concrete accept our commitment to our children and our affection, even though it's not a husband/wife love, it is love - we have two wonderful children and have been together for 28 years. We just can't toss all that away.

Maybe, for the sake of the children I won't do anything, maybe just HRT, maybe more. I wish I had the certainty that some of you have. Of course I'm totally exhausted. So, after a good night sleep I hope that what I just wrote makes sense.

[kristinacd55]

Hey Chelsea,
I can totally relate to what your going through...my wife found out 5 years ago and we're currently separated (still living in same house). We've been together 37 years and she's been dating since February of this year. I have a lot of posts about it on here, this is something that is a process and being patient and totally honest and upfront is the way to be. But, you've been through a lot in a very small bit of time so take a deep breath and exhale ohmmmmm....there's a long road ahead. Be strong for your family! :)

[ChelseaErtel]

. But, you've been through a lot in a very small bit of time so take a deep breath and exhale ohmmmmm....there's a long road ahead. Be strong for your family! :)

Ah men, I'm with ya girl!

[Cassandra Lynn]

Sending all the positive vibes i now have (just came out to new GF and got acceptance) your way.

Best wishes and be positive, i think that's one of the most important things.

[Vanessa Amber420]

Hi Chelsea I hope everything works out for you. You did the right thing by being honest with your wife.

XOXO

Vanessa

[RainyNightGirl]

Wishing you all the very best Chelsea, honesty is always the best policy.

Hugs
Natasha

[Genny B]

I came so close to going down the same road you are heading onto. I do with you all the luck. Not just you either, but your family. I do wonder, would I be correct to assume the support group is NOT in Virginia? I haven't found any...

[ChelseaErtel]

The support group is in Fairfax, VA. My first meeting is on Friday the 9th.