WARNING (Long read). Sexuality, Gender Spectrum, Society. My take on how CD'ing fits

[Soriya]

I know it's long but I promise it's a good read!


I was just responding to another thread about CDing being an addiction or just a way of life and such. The last few posts started talking about fantasies being strong among CD's and all and while writing my post a lot of others things I have felt for a while kept coming up so I decided to share.

Of course I know this thread may get a lot of attention and more then likely spark quite a few CD cat fights :heehee: but that's not the point of it so please no matter what you 'believe', this is about having an open mind and abandoning what you feel is right for you. Hopefully that will minimize the sarcastic attack threads from some that feel what shared in here threatens their own belief.

Now of course what I am about to type is my personal belief. Some will say that what I believe is wrong and I am only finding ways to feel better about myself and justify what I feel.

So be it but here's the deal. I could give a rats a** what anyone else says because plain and simple, nobody, no other CD, GG, Dr., Professional, nobody will ever know what is inside my head or tell me what I am thinking or feeling and why I am! I also refuse to take someone else's thoughts as fact. That is how things about anything are generally taught to us since we were very young. Teachers, religions, parents, other people, most do this. They teach that what they have experienced is fact. This causes most to not learn how to critically think for themselves and make decisions based on what is right for them.

With that said, I know there is plenty of information out there but I have read very little. I make my own opinions on what is right for me and only me. I developed these thoughts from all that I have seen in life and through my digging deep into the history of my CD'ing and where it came from. I have those all answered and know how it was born and why it took the different forms it did.

Sexuality and these little things called labels meant to describe something but society loves to weaponize for it's own justifications. These are purely my thoughts on what they really mean, purely from the physical level

Heterosexual: Someone of one gender in physical appearance attracted to the opposite gender in physical appearance.

Bi-Sexual: Someone of one gender in physical appearance attracted to both genders in physical appearance.

Homosexual: Someone of one physical gender attracted to the same gender in physical appearance.

I base these exclusively off of physical outward appearance only disregarding what plumbing is underneath. What junk is in the truck is a main way society has weaponized these labels IMO.

Example: A man who has no attraction to men, the physical appearance and doesn't really think about male plumbing but becomes attracted to a beautiful MtF transsexual. We all have seen them, they look flawless in everything including body shape and voice. Now if said Transsexual still has the male plumbing and has no plans to have SRS and this man decides to engage in a relationship.

Lets add a twist to it. The TS still functions down there and likes to still use it sexually. Is this man Gay? From the weaponizing stand point of the label, yes to most he would be. Now what is she had SRS. Would he still be considered gay? To some yes but it becomes more blurry.

You can twist it further if you wish.

My point is, society as a whole tends to twist the 'labels' of sexuality by exclusively basing it off what is in someones pants. Add in the fact that most never look past the physical part and take into effect the attractions of the mind.

Now the gender spectum and TG spectrum. I believe they are not seperate. It's one spectrum as everyone is a human being. At one end is your typical 100% male and at the other end is your typical 100% female, as society depicts what they should be (more weaponizing)

Everyone fits in there somewhere. All men have female elements and all women have male components. The more a woman displays male elements, liking sports, not into makeup, being Tom-boyish in activities and dressing apparel slides them off the end and more towards the center of my imaginary version of the spectrum. Same thing for men. The more a man is say, emotional, caring, sensitive, and such slides him off the male end towards the center. CD's fall in somewhere and I view TS's and inter-sexed types at the center.

Because what I learned about my CD history and how it began, I believe the most important things for any CD to understand themselves is to look back in their life, do the hard work it is to uncover the truth and find what insignificant event sparked it's birth. A lot of us do already, sister dressed us, mom dressed us, but for the most part, most don't. There is always a reason why it started and is essential for understanding the reasons for anything, not just CD'ing. You know the saying, "get to the ROOT of the issue' effect.

So for me with my one gender spectrum description and how my CD history fits outside the root reason it started.

I am 'male' as defined by society in most ways. I am physically fit, like to get my hand dirty. Love sports, cars, racing, building things, and including my male looks as the gay community would define me, I am very 'Butch'

But, I am also a very empathetic, emotional. I cry easily during TV shows and movies, like sappy love stories, love talking about deep things, and even shave most of my body hair all the time and not for CD purposes! I am quite hairy in places on my body and after doing a fitness contest and shaving everything for the after pictures, I liked the look so much I kept doing it. It's just a bonus when I CD.

These are not considered by society as 'manly' and are often found more in women. I struggled through my life trying to fit into what I thought was right and how a man was supposed to act which caused a lot of pain. Because CD'ing was inadvertently introduced to me, I used it as an extreme way to get in touch with the elements of me considered female thought patterns. This is why when the 'Urge' came on it came on strong. The more I tried to not be me, the stronger the urge was to CD. The phases of it all were during dark lonely times.

Now over the last few years the more I got in touch with myself overall and feel comfortable being who I am as a person, there are no more 'urges' to CD. I don't need to dress to feel those emotions considered by society as female anymore. Cd'ing became less and less to now being a once in a blue moon thing and in the form as artistic expression. It's no different now then me airbrushing, drawing, or doing photography. It's just another form of art for me.

So there you have it. Please remember this is only me sharing my thoughts on all this. I have never seen a therapist about CD'ing and read very few 'professional' articles about the subject. This is all from me doing what I consider to be the hardest thing any human being can do in their life. face themselves in the mirror.

As a whole, I have always seen all things differently then society. Society looks through the looking glass in reverse but I see it clearly which is why I always felt alone overall. The issue was never 'I don't fit into society'.

Society doesn't fit into me.

Fire away gang! But remember, I will fire back! :D

[Jana]

The only thing I'm going to say at this point is that the urge will return... lol. It may take years, but it's as sure as sunsets.

[Tracii G]

Why does one HAVE to fit that is my answer.
I'm the same person no matter how I am dressed @ yes like you I don't feel the need to dress all the time.
I know some its to the nines or nothing and thats fine.
Could be in part to that person not having the freedom dress everyday.
I go for long times not dressing in that fashion.I feel in my case its not that critical.
I just express myself as a mix sometimes more one than the other.Not to make a fashion statement in girl mode or to shock the general public thats not my thing.
I do what works for me and don't let others dictate what I do.

[KellyJameson]

We must be twins that were separated at birth. Not only do you look very much like me in your avatar but your words and path are similar to my own.

The difference is my desire to take it farther by changing my body because I needed to go deeper into the rabbit hole.

We experience life by the vessel we live in and through this vessel the experiences of life changes us so it is a dance between the inside and outside.

I wanted to change back into me by finding that person again.

Crossdressing took you back to yourself because other things outside you took you away from yourself and I did the same thing but with my body (another form of clothing) so we both no longer need the fabric because we have come back to where we started before "us" was stolen from "us".

[Tracii G]

Good way to put it Kelly.

[Dawn cd]

I am hesitant about responding to this because you said at the outset that you don't care what anyone else thinks.

However I concur that gender dysphoria is a spectrum and that people fit into it in different degrees. While most people don't grow out of it, some may.

[Soriya]

Thanks for responding everyone. I am going to answer some points from others in the next post but before I do I want to clarify a few things.

The intention for me posting this is not and NEVER was to make someone feel what I believe is right for everyone else. It's the opposite no matter how it reads to others. We all communicate and describe things differently thus if how I described any of it comes across as me pushing 'my' facts onto others, I apologize to those who take it that way as it's not my intentions to do so. Please remember that before you post from an angry feeling. Perhaps ask me to clarify in a different way so I can try to explain it better for you. :)

The true intention of this is for me to share what I have learned 'for me' in my journey of putting my CD'ing in perspective. My journey is only mine and everyone has their own. I read here all to often how CD's and GG's are confused and trying to make sense of things and while doing so get confused even more. My hope is for others to see something, even a few words that may spark different types of questions for them to ask themselves to help get to the bottom of their journey.

Forget CD'ing for a moment. Any problem or issue one has in their life has a root cause and often causes a person to react in future situations based off of how the initial incident caused them to react and to make matters worse, they will do so 'unconscionably', and have no idea. We all do this!

Example: I have a friend who in any situation were someone doesn't agree with him, he gets very defensive. He has told me that when he walks into a room of people he doesn't know, in his head he is sizing everyone up, trying to find what he thinks is their weakness. He feels everyone is out to get him so to speak or take advantage of him. His overall mentality is always in a defensive posture so even when someone is really not challenging him, he reacts as if they are. This started in his childhood when he found out who he knew as his mother was in fact his grandmother. He learned his real mother abandoned him when he was a baby and his grandparents legally adopted him. What he knew as his sisters were in fact his aunts. They were all lying to him to coverup up the truth and the only reason they told him is because his real mom was coming back to the entire family. He took the truth as them lying to him and not understanding why it happened. Now 30+ years the effect causes his defensive mind in every situation.

Anyone who see's this clearly can't tell him that is why he does it. He won't listen, He has to do that work himself. That's why a good therapist will never tell a patient why they do something, they will only make suggestions to help the person see it for themselves. He has to go back and start from the beginning for himself and figure it out and only he can choose to do so otherwise he will think he is fine the way he is and cause all sorts of different pain to himself.

My journey in CD'ing is only a small piece of my overall journey ito self discovery. All the work I did this way outside CD'ing is what allowed me to look into it with a clear mind and figure it out what it meant to me.

It doesn't matter if a CD continues to dress on a regular basis, go out, date men, become TS, whatever. What matters is them understanding everything about what it's meant to them and why. Understanding the root cause and any actions that stemmed from it through the years so no matter what happens down the road and whatever decisions they make moving forward come from clear well informed decisions so they don't experience any more unnecessary emotional pain from it.

Is that not what a true TS must do before they transition and take the ultimate step in physically altering their body so they don't end up having regret?

This looking within to see and understand were our emotional pain comes from and how it directs our present is essential for every human being.

Now let me address a few points about comments made so far. Stand by. :)

[Soriya]

Hiya Jana. :)


The only thing I'm going to say at this point is that the urge will return... lol. It may take years, but it's as sure as sunsets.

Jana, I mean no disrespect but, Who says? Because that is what most if not all CD's say? Is it because that is what most others including what even I felt in the past? What makes that 'fact'?

A couple basic definitions of the word 'Urge': "to force or impel in an indicated direction or into motion or greater speed". "stimulate, provoke <urge not my father's anger — Shakespeare>"

The real question is what provokes/stimulates the urge in the first place. I'll quote my original post.

I wrote:

"These are not considered by society as 'manly' and are often found more in women.I struggled through my life trying to fit into what I thought was right and how a man was supposed to act which caused a lot of pain. Because CD'ing was inadvertently introduced to me, I used it as an extreme way to get in touch with the elements of me considered female thought patterns. This is why when the 'Urge' came on it came on strong. The more I tried to not be me, the stronger the urge was to CD. The phases of it all were during dark lonely times."

Basically, the longer the gap went of me trying to act like the typical 'Alpha' male as depicted all over TV, magazines, billboards, and how fathers teach their boys to be and trying to bury core elements of my whole personality, the stronger the urge would be. I was trying to live my life by trying to be what others said I should.

I know this now about myself thus these past events that provoked/stimulated the urges to CD are no longer a factor.

And to quote one more thing from my original post. I wrote:

"I don't need to dress to feel those emotions considered by society as female anymore. Cd'ing became less and less to now being a once in a blue moon thing and in the form as artistic expression. It's no different now then me airbrushing, drawing, or doing photography. It's just another form of art for me."

So, I never said I wouldn't dress again. I may, I may not. I purged a while ago and don't regret it. I didn't purge out of fear or anger for doing it. I purged what I had because I closed that chapter in my journey. I have since bought a piece of makeup here and there. They sit in the closet right alongside my airbrush paints and camera. Overtime I will add more makeup, outfits, whatever so when I feel creative and want to create something, CD'ing is simply a choice within my artist mind. If I was in an 'urging' state, I would have bought everything I needed in one shot to fulfill that urge instantly. I may dress once in a while and perhaps never dress again. I haven't airbrushed in years and may never pick it up again. I suppose only artistic minded people could truly understand that.

Hiya Tracii, thank you for responding. :)



Why does one HAVE to fit that is my answer. I apologize you took it this way. That is not what my intentions were to imply. Check out my previous post before this one.

I'm the same person no matter how I am dressed @ yes like you I don't feel the need to dress all the time. I know some its to the nines or nothing and thats fine. That's great! It works for you and that is what matters


Could be in part to that person not having the freedom dress everyday. This happens often especially when one is not aware of why they CD or do anything as an outlet to achieve a feeling that is missing to them. That's a big point to this thread. Does someone know why they feel something is missing, what it is that is missing, and why they CD to achieve that feeling? That's why I feel it is so important for every CD to understand all aspects of what it means and how it serves them. Without doing so can lead to blind, unhealthy actions that cause a lot of pain.

I go for long times not dressing in that fashion. I feel in my case its not that critical. I just express myself as a mix sometimes more one than the other. Not to make a fashion statement in girl mode or to shock the general public thats not my thing. I do what works for me and don't let others dictate what I do. Again, perfect! You know this for you and are fine with it. That is what matters!



Hiya Kelly!


We must be twins that were separated at birth. Not only do you look very much like me in your avatar but your words and path are similar to my own.

The difference is my desire to take it farther by changing my body because I needed to go deeper into the rabbit hole.

We experience life by the vessel we live in and through this vessel the experiences of life changes us so it is a dance between the inside and outside.

I wanted to change back into me by finding that person again.

Crossdressing took you back to yourself because other things outside you took you away from yourself and I did the same thing but with my body (another form of clothing) so we both no longer need the fabric because we have come back to where we started before "us" was stolen from "us".

Exactly Kelly. I assume you are a spiritual person as I am. The way you describe it seems so. I purposely left out my spiritual elements with energy exchange between people as this wasn't the type of post for that much detail.


I am hesitant about responding to this because you said at the outset that you don't care what anyone else thinks.

However I concur that gender dysphoria is a spectrum and that people fit into it in different degrees. While most people don't grow out of it, some may.

Hiya Dawn. No no, please post all your feelings. Thank you for saying my words made you hesitant about posting. Communication is all about learning from one another and because you mentioned how me not caring what others think made you feel hesitant just showed me I could have done a better job with my wording. Saying I don't care what others say is true but I see how I worded it sounds combative to others.

Clarification: I love reading others thoughts. Saying I don't care what someone else thinks was meant to emphasize that other peoples beliefs don't dictate my beliefs. :)

Also, I have to disagree with your use of 'Gender Disphoria'. Believe me, I understand it's just the way you described the gender spectrum I view and yes, we agree the same. I personally just don't like using words like 'dysphoria' because it to me it's just a label and a negative one at that. Perhaps in your journey you feel that's what it is and that's cool, but if so, do you use the the word disphoria by viewing it as a problem? In my view of things, CD'ing or conflict in gender is not the issue thus negative words like dysphoria easily help create that feeling for people. I prefer to simply say 'Different'. Being different is not a threat, it's an opportunity to learn. The issue for one self is to understand why the difference occurs, at it's root so no matter what outside influences attack, they will fall of deaf ears for the individual. :)

[Melissa_59]

I guess I'm just strange. When I'm in guy mode, I have absolutely and completely zero interest in guys. Nada, zilch, and so on. When I'm dressed though, I have a small attraction to guys - but it's not just any guy, it would have to be a nice, caring understanding sort of person - not the typical roughnecks you find out in the oilfields on drilling rigs or some such.

I have no explanation. I wish I knew why that bit flips from 0 to 1 in my head when I'm dressed - but it's not a full bore thing either! Most guys are still a complete turn off when I'm dressed, I can't stand ... jerks, to put it very lightly. I can't stand jerks when I'm NOT dressed, but I can deal with them better.

Dr. Jekyll and Miss Hyde? I don't know. I really wish I did.

[Tiffany Grace]

Thank you Soriya, for this wonderful thought provoking self analysis. It is always wonderful to hear the story form others which in turn gives us an expanded and deeper view of our community. I am always amazed at how diverse a community we are with regards to our separate and individual journeys.
The happiest times of my life, bar none, have been as Tiffany, and continue to be. thanks again for such an insightful post.

[flatlander_48]

Unless we go at crossdressing in a compulsive or an emotionally numb way, I think the understanding part falls in the realm of academic curiosity. The only other possibility that I can come up with is if we think our crossdressing behavior is at the core of some other thought process or behavior. In short, that understanding may not be worth a lot for many people.

I do think that labels do serve a particular purpose. How else would we know how others view themselves and who we should align ourselves with? I'm speaking more in the political sense here. However, most of the problem is due to the fact that we sexual minorities, to use a broad term, have allowed the population at large to define who we are. That's a problem because we have no control over those definitions and, in a lot of cases, the population at large may be using self-serving thought processes and logic. In short, it's never a good thing when you allow someone else to define YOU.

[AllyCDTV]

Soriya,

You touch on so many things and many of them hit home with me. I really had to think about it for a while so I could respond concisely. I feel that the factors regarding my crossdressing are so complex, that people may relate to parts of it but nobody other than me, can fully understand the reasons why I crossdress. I do however look to see how others think on certain issues. I like challenging my own perspectives because maybe new input can give me a better idea about my own situation.

I grew up in the late ‘60's and was pretty close to being hippie, so conformity is a concept I have a tough time with. As such, I have long ignored society's non-sexual definitions of what makes a man or a woman. I lift weights, enjoy hard rock, model railroading, baseball, football and target practice. I also enjoy art and musicals. Hell I even got a bit misty-eyed when I went to see the play "Rent" last weekend.

I have no sexual interest in guys when I'm in guy mode. Still, once in a while when I am crossdressing, I do fantasize about guys and in those cases, it is purely sexual and nothing romantic. Yet even if I am crossdressing, being with a guy in reality would have no appeal.

I have been through about 4 cycles of crossdressing and quitting. Outside of my first cycle, the initial spark for my crossdressing was always a situation of high stress. This latest one was caused by a near perfect storm of stress. What CD'ing did was give me a place to go where I could get away from the stress. It was like a place where I could be alone and nobody could find me. As the stress has subsided, I now dress less frequently. I feel the time is coming soon when I could consider that I am no longer dressing at all. Whether that means I am done with CD'ing or not, I guess I'll just have to stay tuned to find out.

I know exactly what you mean about CD'ing being a form of artistic expression too. When I'm dressed, I look at myself in a mirror and am sometimes amazed at what I created. Sometimes in a good way and sometimes not. LOL

[DebbieL]

Consider the possibility that there are two dimensions, gender identity, and gender preference, and that each is independent of the other. Let's keep things simple and stick with the ratings of 1 through 6. For Sexual preference, 1 is someone who ONLY desires the opposite sex, including fantasies, and a 6 is someone who only desires the same sex, even in fantasies. Now, let's set identity with 1 being totally the same as birth gender, no desire to do anything the opposite sex does, and 6 being a transsexual who wants a full and perfect transition. Just in that matrix there is the possibility of 36 different combinations. Now lets add the possibility of another partner, who could also be one of 36 combinations, which now means that we could have 1296 possible combinations. Only about a dozen of which would work out well. For example, the woman who was totally heterosexual would have a hard time with the guy who wants to be a cross dresser, and the guy who cross-dresses but only likes girls would not go well with a guy who was bisexual.

For those in the middle, there might be some flexibility, for example, a girl who has fantasies about both men and women might find a CD/Transgender to be just the ticket. A CD who is bisexual might find that a CD who is bisexual might be just the ticket.

Some CDs and TGs also tend to change sexual preferences when they are dressed or in femme mode. For example, a MtF CD might prefer women when in boy-mode, but have more interest in boys or men when in femme mode, in some cases, they are more like 2 on the preference scale in boy mode, and 4 or 5 in girl mode. If the desire to play in girl mode is strong enough, she might even prefer the intense desire of a man who wants a boy who looks like a girl - perhaps a 2 or 3.

When you begin combining 3-4-5s you get much better odds of a winning combination, the problem is that CDs tend to be very secretive, often trying extra hard to maintain their masculine identity to hide their femme side. A woman who is attracted to the masculine might be a 1 or 2, preference wise, even if she's a 3 or 4 identity wise.

Transsexuals are required to have a period of Real Life Experience (RLE) to help them determine whether or not they are willing to deal with the benefits and consequences of being female. More important, it gives the woman a chance to form new relationships with men and women who find her attractive. If her partner is still attracted, that's wonderful, if not, then the relationship or marriage will end if transition continues, and the therapist needs to make sure that the the transitioning she can have loving and supportive relationships.

Until I came out as Debbie, I didn't think any woman would want me. I told my 1st wife, and even she went from being reluctant but OK to abusive. When I came out, I was quite surprised at how many women there were who were interested. Some were tom-boys who wanted someone like me and loved that I was so femme. I also found some women who were more feminine who liked the idea of a "Sister". I even met a woman who was a lesbian who wanted to enjoy my feminine side. The options, however, didn't even make themselves evident until I was willing to share myself, to show up as Debbie, and take the heat, own who I was, and admit that Inside, I was Debbie. For me, Rex, the masculine, was a character I created to survive.

[Girliegirl]

An awesome song by foo fighters called “pretender" I think sums your feelings about self identity really powerfully. Especially the way you use the word weaponize to describe labels. Look up "foo fighters pretender“ on youtube.

[Soriya]

I guess I'm just strange. When I'm in guy mode, I have absolutely and completely zero interest in guys. Nada, zilch, and so on. When I'm dressed though, I have a small attraction to guys - but it's not just any guy, it would have to be a nice, caring understanding sort of person - not the typical roughnecks you find out in the oilfields on drilling rigs or some such.

I have no explanation. I wish I knew why that bit flips from 0 to 1 in my head when I'm dressed - but it's not a full bore thing either! Most guys are still a complete turn off when I'm dressed, I can't stand ... jerks, to put it very lightly. I can't stand jerks when I'm NOT dressed, but I can deal with them better.

Dr. Jekyll and Miss Hyde? I don't know. I really wish I did.

Hiya Melissa :)

The sexual component to CD'ing is perhaps the most complex and confusing part of it. It sure was the most frightening for me. You're not strange at all. That is very common among CD's and I was exactly like you in that regard, almost word for word as you describe it except even when dressed, the truth for me was there still wasn't any attraction to men at all. The fantasies I had indeed did have a male figure in them but I refer to this imaginary figure as a 'faceless' man. It was more the idea so to speak that centered around not a man himself, but the male plumbing. That made it even more complex and confusing for me on top of the fact I was having those thoughts in the first place.

Basically, for me it never had anything to do with a 'real' attraction to men. The thoughts happened as a way to amplify the 'rush' I got from CD'ing and came about when the initial highs from just dressing began to dull. Kind of like when someone becomes addicted to drugs and whatever they are currently taking to get becomes dull and they look for something stronger. It was a bout the 'high' feeling and took the form of a 'false attraction' to men.

I can't do it justice without going into extreme detail of how I figured it out as it would be too long for a forum post. I think the site limits the size of what we can post. Anyone is welcome to message me to talk about it in detail. :)


Thank you Soriya, for this wonderful thought provoking self analysis. It is always wonderful to hear the story form others which in turn gives us an expanded and deeper view of our community.

Thank you Tiffany. :) That was the point of me making this thread. I saddens me to see how many of us feel all the confusion involved and more so, it saddens me even more when their is an SO involved. I can never know what that is like for either party as I was never in that situation. My hopes about sharing my views is to help all parties think deeper inside themselves and to show how complex this really is.


Unless we go at crossdressing in a compulsive or an emotionally numb way, I think the understanding part falls in the realm of academic curiosity. The only other possibility that I can come up with is if we think our crossdressing behavior is at the core of some other thought process or behavior. In short, that understanding may not be worth a lot for many people.

I do think that labels do serve a particular purpose. How else would we know how others view themselves and who we should align ourselves with? I'm speaking more in the political sense here. However, most of the problem is due to the fact that we sexual minorities, to use a broad term, have allowed the population at large to define who we are. That's a problem because we have no control over those definitions and, in a lot of cases, the population at large may be using self-serving thought processes and logic. In short, it's never a good thing when you allow someone else to define YOU.

Hiya Flatlander! Thanks for responding, very insightful points you make. Your right, and most CD's, perhaps all that don't know why they do it will act in a compulsive or addictive manner to do it. CD'ing is neither a compulsion or an addiction in itself. That is up to the individual to make it that way. Anything can become a compulsion or addiction, video game, TV, you name it! The real question is when someone uses something in this manner, what is the real void they are trying fill?

Your right, for most things with any long lasting pain, on the outside it won't feel as if it's worth trying to understand because in doing so, it's facing pain that has long been ignored. The longer it goes, the greater the pain. It takes a massive amount of strength for someone to face themselves in the mirror and dive deep within to figure out what makes them tick. Doing so brings out the pain and everyone naturally wants to feel good but by ignoring it, we as humans tend to look elsewhere for topical things to feel good. This is one way external things can become addictive.

Labels do serve a purpose. Like you said, they are definitions but the issue with them is how society weaponizes them as it does with just about everything right down to money. Instead of just defining something, it's to easy for society to use labels as a way to go further and isolate people.

I do disagree on that last point of yours I highlighted. We do have control over the definitions. No, we can't individually change them and how they are used but every single one are the only ones who will ever have control over own power. Nobody can take it away from us without our consent. Just like you ended your post, we have control by simply not letting someone else define who we are. :)


I know exactly what you mean about CD'ing being a form of artistic expression too. When I'm dressed, I look at myself in a mirror and am sometimes amazed at what I created. Sometimes in a good way and sometimes not. LOL

Hiya Ally!! LMAO I know exactly what you mean about 'sometimes not'. Man is that a buzz kill after being all excited as you watch the transformation in the mirror only to completely finish and think "This didn't come out the way I wanted." LOL

You and I sound very much alike in our thoughts. I would love to chat 1 on 1 sometime. :)


For me, Rex, the masculine, was a character I created to survive.

Hiya Debbie! That is awesome and the greatest self empowerment to discover that as your truth no matter how hard it was getting there. The rest of what you said is just a bit to complex for me as I hate math LOL but, I get your points. You actually said in your own very detailed way the same exact thing I said about my view of the single gender spectrum. :)


An awesome song by foo fighters called “pretender" I think sums your feelings about self identity really powerfully. Especially the way you use the word weaponize to describe labels. Look up "foo fighters pretender“ on youtube.

I know it well and yes it does! Thanks GirlieGirl!

[laura.lapinski]

Awsome post. I relate to it all. I share a lot of your thoughts. Thanks for taking the time to articulate it.

[Soriya]

Thank you Laura! :)

[sometimes_miss]

A lot of these discussions come from an inner homophobia, and/or disappointment in ourselves at being unable to hold back desires that we think we should be able to. After all, most of us are brought up to believe that any interest in interaction of any kind regarding romantic or sexual feelings is one of the worst things we can ever do. Add to that, that few understand why they are feeling the things they do, and you come up with all kinds of bizarre theories as to why we are like this. After all, how could a heterosexual male ever want to behave as a female, or have any desire to have sexual interest in doing anything, ever, with another male? It just doesn't make sense. Until you start to dig deeper. And it can take years, decades, to figure it out. Even then, many psychologists will fall back on their old theories and insist it's just denial, that they simply must have some underlying homosexuality to want to behave this way. Well, not necessarily; like the example of the guy wanting his SO to use a strap on, on him, which many would automatically insist that makes him strictly a homosexual. Again, probably not.
I figured myself out, it took a very long time, with virtually no help from the professional mental health community. First of all, throw away all the categories that you have. I know most people feel the need to fit others into a particular category so they know how to interact with that person, but really, it's better if you simply learn how to interact with them as a person, not a gay person, not a straight person, not a black person, not a foreign person, etc.. Throw away the categories. Get rid of presumptions of who and what that person (and yourself) is. Only then can you begin to learn who they really are.
For example, Soriya, the biggest problem with the categories in your first post is, virtually no one fits into them, at least not exclusively. nearly everyone who defines themselves as straight, has at least some type of homosexual thoughts at some point in their lives. Same with the reverse; gay people have at least some type of heterosexual thoughts. And bisexuals usually lean towards one end of the sexuality spectrum or the other, even though they may go the other way at times.
I'm of the belief that most crossdressers don't want to know where it comes from, because it might upset their self esteem, or it may point to something that is inconsistant with what they believe to be correct, that could inspire guilt or a feeling of failure to live up to who they (and/or their family, church, etc..) think they should be.

[DebbieL]

One thing I have noticed is that I have many very unpleasant memories of how boys and men treated me as a "Sissy", or when they assumed I was gay. Very often, there was violence, terror, brutality, blood and pain inflicted on me by other men. I wasn't accepted by other boys as one of the boys, and was often excluded by the other men as I grew older. No big surprise then that, as Rex, I would have little interest of any kind in men.

In high school, the gay boys were far nicer to me, even protective. The knew that I wasn't interested, but they also knew that I knew other gay men and would introduce them to each other. As a result, I felt much more comfortable in the gay community.

When I came out as Debbie, I was surprised at how many men, even though they knew I was a "guy in a dress" - were much nicer to me and were more gentle and kind when they were interacting. At the same time, many women were clearly not interested once I came out. The experience of being gently caressed or being gently held while dancing with a man while out as Debbie was something special, very different. I knew it was an illusion, but I considered the possibility that if I did transition, I could get used to that kind of attention.

However, for me, the most amazing experience was when I would be dressed up as Debbie and a woman in heels hose and skirt started flirting with me, brushing her leg against mine. Even when we were already lovers, that contact was so intense, so intimate, and so thrilling that it was an intense rush. I was lucky enough to end up in a relationship with two such women, at the same time, and the three of us lived together for about 2 years. It was some of the most intense and wonderful times of my entire life.

[Soriya]

Deb, thank you for sharing. :)

If I may ask, in your journey with Debbie, have you ever wondered if your bad experiences as Rex contributed a lot more to your discovery of Debbie then perhaps you realized? Not saying that is the case, just curious is all because I love learning about people as it helps me learn things about myself. :)

[Frédérique]

Now over the last few years the more I got in touch with myself overall and feel comfortable being who I am as a person, there are no more 'urges' to CD. I don't need to dress to feel those emotions considered by society as female anymore. Cd'ing became less and less to now being a once in a blue moon thing and in the form as artistic expression. It's no different now then me airbrushing, drawing, or doing photography. It's just another form of art for me.

I completely agree that it’s a form of expression. Since I’m an artist, crossdressing is just another way to express myself – via crossdressing I make myself into a work of art, one that I want to see and feel, even though, like any artwork, it never comes out quite the way I planned. Crossdressing is no big deal for me these days, but I never take it for granted – it is essential for my overall well-being, and, like any artistic endeavor, it requires practice, patience, and skill...

[Shananigans]

I think that you have an interesting post that resembles somewhat of a "movement" that I am seeing from quite a few people that challenges our concept of gender in conventional terms.

I really kind of wish that we'd start seeing people as just people...it's getting really bananas when there are like 20+ different types of transgenderism. It kind of makes you think that it is a much more highly individualized concept than we are willing to think. I've always thought it was a little weird that we love to break things like gender, sexuality, race, etc. into strict groups. It's strange to me because a lot of what is assigned as "fundamentally separating" the groups is pretty arbitrary and varies based on location. I identify as female mainly because that's the group I have been grouped with all of my life...it's my "gender" only in that other people who have been grouped as "female" usually have many of the same experiences/challenges in life that I have faced. But, as a whole, I'm not particularly tied down...I'd like people to see me as a person and not as just a female. If I woke up a man tomorrow, I'd still be the same person with the same thoughts and feelings. I feel the same way about sexuality...it's easiest to say bisexual, because everyone knows what that means. However, when it boils down to it...I am just attracted to people that I find attractive. Gender/biological sex/race doesn't quite fit into any sort of criteria that I have to "weed people out." It all boils down to how I like you as a whole person.

So, I like that you brought up labels and how they don't seem to fit. I do think labels are generally necessary....it's hard to speak without them...and, we like to get a general picture of people quickly without having to hear their life story. But, they fall short. Many people say that the binary system of gender seems to not fit people...but, really, I think the whole concept in general falls short for most people. When you take a look through the many, many, many ways someone can be TG, it gets kind of crazy. So, would a "spectrum" rather than a binary really help? Personally, I think if I could choose, I'd just erase myself off of that spectrum entirely...I'd rather just be seen as a person...no one really needs to know what I am rocking down below. And, personally, I find it really awkward that we label ourselves with our sexuality...like it's a big sign to everyone that tells them what type of people they like to screw and what type of people who need not apply. It's just awkward...who really needs to know that information other than you and your potential mate?...Do we really need to like advertise it? I find myself skeptical when someone tells me that she is a lesbian, or that she is straight...it just makes me feel weird...like who I am as a person only matters as much to them as what is between my legs, and that all interest is either gained or lost based on that criteria. It's incredibly awkward. So, sexuality as a spectrum?...Erase me off that spectrum too.

I guess my point is that many people see things differently. I think that CDing gives you the ability to look more deeply on the subject...some people just never really think about it or get bothered by it. And, in general, I agree that the labels seem a little too static. I think the important thing is that you have found what works for you/what makes you comfortable. I kind of wish we'd get rid of the whole thing. Overall, "gender" is more restricting than it's worth...it obviously has nothing to do with clothing...and, it seems everyone's "gender concept" is highly individualized to a point of uselessness. And, labeling yourself by sexuality is just kind of TMI...and, I'm never sure how I feel about people that just have to be a certain sexuality. It seems like it would be such a waste/such a tragedy if two people met who could be perfect for each other...but, some genital obsession prevented the relationship from intimacy. But, I don't know how it feels to be "straight"...so, I guess my openness limits my view. I also do not really know how it feels to be sternly identified to a gender, so this also probably limits my view. It would be very strange if I woke up a male tomorrow...there would be a lot to learn...but, it would be crazy to think having a penis would magically change who I am, my beliefs, and how I feel. I just refuse to accept it...and, the only test would be to wake up tomorrow as a man, but I am 99% sure it won't happen. And, I'm okay with that too. I'm pretty much okay with anyone that treats me like a person...it only gets awkward when people tell me how I am supposed to look and feel based entirely on my genitalia. It's a very strange culture.

[Kate Simmons]

It is what it is my friend, although sometimes it is what it isn't. That is when things need to be addressed by us personally. In any case, the best way to approach things is to take all experiences, even perceived negative ones, and turn them around to make them work for us so we can move forward. That is true mastery, labels notwithstanding.:battingeyelashes::)

[ClosetED]

Soriya, thank you for this thread. I have also been trying to see if my own way of seeing myself might lead to others seeing bits of self-truth. It is not an attempt to define or label anyone else, but to raise a viewpoint and see how many others here see themselves within that framework and if others bring other valid issues to enrich it. "To thine own self be true" applies here. If you understand why you do something, you have that bit more of control of it. Both "gender" and "sexuality" are spectrum labels that are not binary. My thoughts blend into yours, in that many choose to crossdress to express their particular level of feminineness (or maleness for transmasculine). But if you find other ways to express your feminine aspects without clothing, then the physical activity of CDing may decrease, without the "urge" to express who you are being compromised. This may be in behaviors, underdressing, wearing made for men clothing very similar to women's clothing, wearing women's jeans that don't look too different - whatever it takes to make you feel those aspects as expressed. For some who have a higher level of feminineness to express, then there may be no way to do this without CDing or transitioning.
Knowing who you are and what do you really want should also be helpful to SOs who are just finding out. It would be interesting to hear their thoughts on that.

[Soriya]

It would be interesting to hear their thoughts on that.

Yes it would. I made this thread specifically for other CD's who are still bothered why they do it. I wanted to share what I went though, what I learned, and how I made peace with it so perhaps those who are still conflicted as to why it's part of their lives might see something that sparks them to look at their journey a little differently in hope to get answers. I believe we all already have the answers to any question we have about ourselves, we just need to dig deep within to find them. All the years of pain and frustration we go through in life with everything clouds the truth causing us to think and react out of fear. I made this thread for the SO's out there that are trying to come to an understanding of why their husbands to this. It's confusing enough for the CD who isn't aware but I can only imagine how mush harder it is for a Wife or GF.

Frederique, yeah, that was edited by the moderators. I stepped over the line in my attempt to illustrate a comparison. We learn something new everyday :) LOL

Shananigans, very insightful thoughts of your own. :)

This subject goes much deeper then just CD'ing for me and is helping me with a project I am working on that has nothing to do with cross dressing. It's about society.

I agree, labels are needed in our society as in their pure form, it's just a way for humanity to describe something but the society we live in that's been built over thousands of years uses labels as weapons. In my opinion one of the most basic human instincts that has been taught since say the cavemen times is to 'Kill what you don't know'. When something living was 'different' from something else back then, the end result was usually conflict with one of the two people, creatures, or parties ended up dead. This mentality is traced throughout human history and still exists today.

The brutality of actually killing is seen on a much lager scale now with countries and cultures at physical war but it still happens even at the smallest level. Bullying is a direct connection to it. Most bullying is done because of some sort of difference between the bully and the victim and what's even more troubling, both are the bully and the victim! Most bullies are victims themselves and use the bullying of others in attempts to find peace within themselves. The victims such as myself who did not physically bully others will often be the bully of themselves. I was smaller then everyone else and stuck out like a sore thumb thus I did not 'blend' in with what was considered normal. Once I grew and the physical bullying stopped, I held onto all the mental scars and bullied myself by believing the things that were said to me.

mental bullying is far more common and we ALL either do it or have done to someone else. It's far more complex the physical bullying but is everywhere and can be sparked simply but not agreeing with someone else. Their view is not the same thus it's 'different'. The 'kill what you don't know' mentality takes over.

Communities is another word so easily used as a weapon. Like labels, it defines a group of like minded people but society easily uses it as a way to 'divide' people because again, there is a difference between each and every community.

LGBT Community
Catholic community
Muslim community
Technical community,

and so on.....

Different is not a threat, it's an opportunity. Society still looks through the glass in reverse. As I look at humanity and all it's diverse cultures and beliefs I only see 'one'.

To me, there is only one community, the Human community.

Barring a game changer such as an alien invasion, this thought process won't change quickly.

[MssHyde]

not dressing? and you looked so cute too.

[Soriya]

Not at the moment no, but I am pretty sure I will eventually if the mood strikes me. :)