Just a random thought on denial

[Stephanie Miller]

Walking out of the local building supply center today, I saw a truck with a drywall logo on the door. The guy just happened to be loading stuff in the back. I'm always on the lookout for new subcontractors so I sauntered over and asked for his card. When he gave it to me - I looked and introduced myself and said "glad to meet you Jason". He said no that is his project managers card - the company is printing him new ones. I said " Cool. New shinny cards" and he replies "They can be whatever, as long as they ain't pink".

THAT'S when I started looking.
Looking for pierced ears, manicured nails, tweezed brows etc. Anything that might give him away. Not that I really expected to find anything - and I didn't - and he probably wouldn't have said such a defensive statement if he knew who he was inside already.

But I did start to wonder - if he was still in denial? I mean that seems to be what we do before we admit it to ourselves a lot of the time isn't it? Fight the hell out of "I'm not transgendered (or gay, or anything else to be inserted here)" Deny who we are by puffing up our chests and talking as low as we can.
I can't stand pink. Call any guy who even appears to be on the less than macho side "gay". Make raunchy jokes about women etc.

It's sad because they don't know what they are missing. But at the same time I'm jealous, since they don't have to put up with the majority of society that makes people like myself and hold up in some kind of protective cocoon from all the hate out there.

Oh well, time to start getting ready to call it a day and head home for my nightly half glass of wine. ( for medicinal purposes only you see :wine: :shush:). And ponder much more.

[Wonderwho]

Many of us have played sports we wern't good at, gone to bars and hung with the tough crowd and done things we were ashamed of in the serch of who we really are. It took me 50 years to find out that I can't throw a football, don't like bars, can't stand hunting but love fast cars.
I also like silk, long dresses and high boots, none of these fit in the world I used to live in.
Am I happier now, I'll have to get back to you an that, as soon as the new boots I ordered get here.LOL
Besider that cold beer is almost empty.
Wonderwho

[Jorja]

If you live your life in denial, you're all wet. :)

[May(be)]

I don't understand the war on pink. Pink isn't even its own color. Pink is just light red.

[AllyCDTV]

I believe you are reading too much into it. The only thing you know for sure based on your conversation is that he doesn't like pink, assuming he is being honest.

[Rogina B]

I wonder if the guy would like the pink tool boxes that Sears is selling! Perhaps one for his boss as well.What a great color! Graingers has pink hardhats and gloves and even pepper spray! I would only wear them with the sweatpants that say "I love Pink" across the butt.

[Tracii G]

I actually would put a pink tool box on my truck if I had one just for SH&%'s and giggles.

[LaraPeterson]

My big denial is that someday I'll grow up and outgrow this thing--I know better but sometimes I still get guilty feelings usually caused by some comment I hear when in guy mode. I still don't even know how to describe my-self. Am I CD, TV, TG, TS? I think I need some of that wine.

Oh, I have some of the prettiest, shiniest, sparkly pink nail polish you've ever seen. It's all I wear besides red.

[I Am Paula]

I have pink steel toe work boots. (Mark's Work Wearhouse if you need some)-Celeste

[Stephanie Miller]

Not making accusations about this particular young man Ally. It was just one of those random thoughts I had. Probably only because I myself went through it. :strugglin
The same struggle many, many people have and are going through. Be they MtF or FtM. It's a terrible internal battle with yourself.

[Beverley Sims]

When I was younger I had a pink nylon tie, I wore it everywhere without any comments.
I just liked the tie. :)

[noeleena]

Hi,

My fav colour has allways been pink pink is white & red to gether as equale ,& pink is a boys colour & blue was girls, what happened over the years then,to change that.

I never denied what i was, as it was a part of who i am as a person & was seen by others, just it was never ? nd,

& i never had the words to explain what or who i was intersex, think back 55 years well 65 when i was born.

...noeleena...

[ReineD]

THAT'S when I started looking.
Looking for pierced ears, manicured nails, tweezed brows etc. Anything that might give him away. Not that I really expected to find anything - and I didn't - and he probably wouldn't have said such a defensive statement if he knew who he was inside already.

It's true that more severe homophobia may reveal denial of someone's own same sex attraction. But isn't it common for guys to make random anti-gay wisecracks as a form of guy bonding? Also, you were looking for tell-tale signs of CDing, but most CDers are not gay men in denial?

[GabbiSophia]

Its the peer pressure of wanting to fit in and not be different that leads to the biggest denials. I also have spent years trying to fit in with the macho crowd.. because that was what was excpected.. living up to the standards others have set for me. I finally have had enoug hand want to live my life for me. When other people finally stop trying to live to please everyone else they can have a chance to find happiness. Though being the square peg isn't an easy journey!!

Steph

[joanncd]

I wear pink shirts.....and pink panties. :)

[ChelseaErtel]

I just think he was being a "guy" talking to a "guy".

Now I love pink and I think it goes well being a redhead (If my hair hadn't fallen out, and if I hadn't gone grey...but I have one patch of red to prove it, snicker, sniker). I love all the reds for my nail colors including pink and everything in between.

I used to feel guilt thus the purges. Then I realized that was who I am. Then I looked deeper and woops, I'm a woman trapped in a man's body. When I look back at all the signs how the hell did I miss that for 51 years? Slow learner I suppose.

By the way, I just love these little random thoughts threads. A question or though just "pops" in our heads and we usually just dismiss it, but here we can put it out there and see where it goes. It's mostly fun and "girls just love to have fun".

[Kate Simmons]

A lot of it is societal conditioning. I see it in my young Grandsons. They would not "think" of doing anything girly because of pressure from their male peers. Although my youngest Grandson took me aside one day and admitted he would like to have a Barbie doll but not to tell anyone. Go figure! :battingeyelashes::)

[kimdl93]

I'm not sure why people put on such pretenses. One of my favorite male shirts was a very light "rose" color. I suppose some people might have thought it "pink". But my wife always tells me I look good in pastels ;)

[Stephanie Miller]

Originaly posted by ReineD
"It's true that more severe homophobia may reveal denial of someone's own same sex attraction. But isn't it common for guys to make random anti-gay wisecracks as a form of guy bonding? Also, you were looking for tell-tale signs of CDing, but most CDers are not gay men in denial?"

Hi Reine,
While your statement may be correct in its own content.. I wasn't referring to "gay" as being the subject matter. It was aimed at the actual denial process we go through. And as a CD, your correct, I am on the lookout for like minded individuals. Not gay men. Not for any other reason other than group association I am use to. I'm am very sure gay men (and women) go through some form of denial process as well.

Originally posted by AllyCDTV
"I believe you are reading too much into it. The only thing you know for sure based on your conversation is that he doesn't like pink, assuming he is being honest."

Ally,
Of course I'm reading into it on the level of color. He didn't have a problem with any other color in the spectrum. It was pink. If he was/is in denial, as far as orientation is concerned, he is going to be bashing anything feminine. Pink is associated with femininity. As is lace, perfume, long hair etc. Like Reine said - we do stupid things in the name of male bonding. Bashing in the name of denial is one.
I'm just playing the odds here with my own thoughts. (Not that my intelligence with odds have ever done me any favors in Vegas either!) You may be right and it was a random color choice of the gazillion color choices.

[Debra Russell]

Just for the record PINK is not red and white mixed -- it's magenta and white (a lot) and a touch of purple (or cobalt blue)---- red and white is more of a tomatoe soup and milk color -----yeah so what but I love RED and PINK, don't like to see thm degregated :naughty..............................Debra

[sometimes_miss]

Maybe it's just avoiding unnecessary drama. Often when a straight guy uses a pink anything, that topic will be brought up back to him time and time again. So, why make life more difficult than it already is? I know lots of you lust after discussing and arguing with people about CD and TG topics, but some simply just want to get on with our lives with as little difficulty as possible. Example; as much as I like pink as a color for my dress, shoes, skirts, tops, even jewelry, even if it looks good that way, I wouldn't paint my car pink. It simply invites the inevitable questions and suppositions that I don't care to spend my life dealing with.

[AllyCDTV]

Pink is associated with femininity. Perhaps in many cases it is but in my case, pink has a strong association with Pepto Bismol which I got a lot when I was a kid when I got sick, so for me pink > Pepto Bismol > sick.

[ElleduSud]

I don't understand the war on pink. Pink isn't even its own color. Pink is just light red.


Just for the record PINK is not red and white mixed -- it's magenta and white (a lot) and a touch of purple (or cobalt blue)---- red and white is more of a tomatoe soup and milk color -----yeah so what but I love RED and PINK, don't like to see thm degregated :naughty..............................Debra

"Light red". It's a classic line from Red vs. Blue. And it was definitely associated with presenting as a female! Hilarious :D

[Allisa]

Being in the building trades myself,one must get thier testosterone flowing at a great rate to perform and be in that state of mind so any thing "girlie" is not acceptable so the color in its connotation to being feminine (not gay) is a no-no.As far as looking for signs of a possible CDer does that mean all men with long hair are CDer's? If so I'm out of luck,and I'll have to let my eye brows get all bushy again and bite my nails or let them get all caked with dirt and such? It does not mean we are in denial it's just the nature of the beast.It is a very conflicting world we live in.I myself have never liked the color pink for the same reason I do not like the flavor of mushrooms I just dont ,plain and simple.

(Al)Lisa

[Butterfly Bill]

In addition to a pink fire engine, we have a pink barge in Muskogee. All to raise awareness of breast cancer.

http://muskogeephoenix.com/local/x1332350357/Pink-barge-brings-in-big-cash

[mikiSJ]

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

There are actually people out there, both x and y, who are not gay, not transgendered, not intelligent who make remarks that are simply homophobic responses to something they don't or won't understand.

[Jamie001]

Maybe it's just avoiding unnecessary drama. Often when a straight guy uses a pink anything, that topic will be brought up back to him time and time again. So, why make life more difficult than it already is? I know lots of you lust after discussing and arguing with people about CD and TG topics, but some simply just want to get on with our lives with as little difficulty as possible. Example; as much as I like pink as a color for my dress, shoes, skirts, tops, even jewelry, even if it looks good that way, I wouldn't paint my car pink. It simply invites the inevitable questions and suppositions that I don't care to spend my life dealing with.

If we don't do as we wish and simply take the path of least resistance, we will never make progress like our gay brothers and sisters. Why not get a pink cell phone or carry a pink wallet to use in male mode? After all, women use blue items and blue is supposed to be a boy's color.

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi Stephanie, I have pink shirts and ties that I love wearing.
Years ago I painted the shop pipe wrenches pink so no one would take them

who would want to get caught with a pink pipe wrench in his tool box

[Ceri Anne]

I was having lunch with a friend yesterday and he brought up the fact that pink was origionally a boys color and blue was a girls color. The reasons being that pink being a very warm color is a stronger color, related to red, and blue a more tranquile color, also associated with the Virgin Mary. Reading your post Stephanie, I was reminded of that and looked up a couple links on google that afirmed this, although the distinctions are not as strong as could be. It wasn't until the 1950's that pink was winning out towards being a feminine color. Here are a couple links: http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/2831/was-pink-originally-the-color-for-boys-and-blue-for-girls
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pink