catch 22

[Inna]

How do I start this so that I would convey the concept yet let everyone's feelings unharmed?

What I am referring to is simply state of Transgender, or if you will more precise state of transsexuality.

I know very well that I my self could not be able to experience remotely my own transition without general acceptance on basic of transgender understanding and rights.
We are all pushing for the world, to take upon its conscious, the idea that perhaps this is in fact a birth defect and to correct it, one must submit to align their Avatar to the correct, innate gender.

However, even though we, as a group, are doing quite well in exposing this variant of natures whimsical play on gender, we also at the same time diminish the importance of full transition, to become in all its possibility, a Woman.

By making world accepting, we also make the condition of transsexuality (the half way point between Male and Female body, become the end point.

For many, because it just is easier, will stop the quest at the mid point and live accordingly. Not that this particular instance is in any shape or form, wrong or lesser, however, for those who innately know of them selves as women, the half way point does not cure the illness, yet the ease of non transitioning could sway their resolve.

So the big question:

Would you still do utmost anything to achieve the illusive realm of Womanhood, or would you rather settle on an easier task, of being perceived transsexual forever???

[Jorja]

It was all or death for me. What I think is more important is that those that do undertake transition, know that they only need to go as far as they are comfortable with to control thier level of GID. There is nothing that says once you start transition you must go all the way.

[Kathryn Martin]

My short answer to this question is: women have vaginas. As a woman with a transsexual history, it is a do or die moment. And I don't mean suicide. If you were born a girl with a body that betrayed you and a socialization that subverted your nature you will die if you cannot overcome your gender/sex conflict. I never set out to be transsexual, I was born with it, it is a defect not a state of being.

[Starling]

I believe this thread is just another opportunity to rile people up.

:) Lallie

[LeaP]

I'm not entirely clear on your question, Inna, and I can take your OP to imply several things. One would be that you are suggesting that the broad acceptance of gender variance undermines transition, despite your comment that you personally needed the acceptance you associate with the transgender agenda. One might think you are questioning some people's transitions at an even more fundamental level. Your comments about not transitioning being easier may be taken as either appropriate or an inappropriate compromise, for example. So your statements seem ambiguous.

I guess my take is this. If someone can avoid transition and live with that, then more power to them. If the current atmosphere is such that that living a middle path is acceptable to more people, whether transsexual or gender variant, or to the general public, that's fine. Most transsexuals seem to fight transition anyway, though. So I can't see where the patterns of transition would change.

The notion of transgenderism – gender variance – and it's use in the public dialog does obscure the nature of transsexualism for the general public, I think. We see that right here all of the time. But again, in the end I don't see where that would matter as far as transition goes.

My only caveat to that is this: I read some people's comments as expressing a belief that transition is never necessary. That if one could simply accept oneself as they are, then all would be well. This betrays a fundamental misunderstanding of the nature of transsexuality. I do think this belief is given extra life and depth by all the discussion on gender variance (for which it is appropriate). To the extent this kind of thinking ends up changing things like insurance coverage, diagnoses, treatment options, and other such things for transsexuals, considerable damage will be done.

In direct answer to your question, I see no difference for me. My focus has been inward throughout.

[Rianna Humble]

I hope that this does not descend into another Trannier-Than-Thou competition.

I cannot help but think that the question at the end of the OP might have something to do with another thread on activism and whether agitating for someone's rights necessarily marks one out as being identical to those for whom one agitates.

I know from experience that campaigning on behalf of rape victims has not yet caused me to be raped. Yet if the OP is to be believed, then in the eyes of all who hear me speak or read my writings on behalf of trans* folks I must inevitably be trans*.

As just about everyone on this site will be aware, Inna's parting question

Would you still do utmost anything to achieve the illusive realm of Womanhood, or would you rather settle on an easier task, of being perceived transsexual forever???
Can never apply to me since I have been branded by the gutter press and that story has made it's way around the Internet being translated into multiple languages.

But to try to answer the intent behind her question, I will say this

I would rather be branded an Indian rape victim than not speak out for rape victims in that country

I would rather be branded an impoverished African cocoa grower than not speak out against the injustice I see

I would rather be branded a transsexual than stand idly by whilst another TS person is trampled underfoot or murdered, or even just ostracised for who they are

In one mythology, a character is said to have asked the question "Am I my brother's keeper?". My answer is simple "If my brother needs me to keep him, then keep him I shall". If that brands me in the eyes of some as being my brother, then I cannot be held responsible for their defective vision

[Genifer Teal]

I've had a lot of unique fun good things happen to me because I am TG. None of it would have happened as a man. I wonder how much might have happened if as you suggest it didn't matter due to full acceptance or infact I was born a woman with more typical looks and features. I like the attention I get. I like walking into a room and people talk to me. I am different and that makes me more interesting. I like most of the attention it gets me. So, I have often asked myself, If I could completely pass, would I miss that. I'd have to way all the trade offs. While I'd like more acceptance, you know what they say about too much of a good thing. Keep in mind, I live in NYC, which is no stranger to girls like us. Living somewhere more remote could easily change my opinion.

[melissakozak]

Well. Here we go. Being TS has MANY DIFFERENT LEVELS OF EXISTENCE. First, there is the internal sense of who we are. Second, there is the physical state of who we are. Third, there is the social aspect of who we are. Fourth, the gender construct within that social aspect of who we are. Fifth, the emotional state of who we are. Sixth, have we accepted it? Seventh, do we transition. Eighth, personal relationships are changed. Ninth, how far do we go with transition. Tenth, we are not genetic women. Get the idea. Being TS is a big damn deal.

[Nicole Erin]

I hope that this does not descend into another Trannier-Than-Thou competition.

Oh gyod like THAT ever happens.

For me, I would LIKE to be able to afford a better more complete transition but as my finances beg silly questions like "how can I budget to have enough groceries for the week?" well then worrying about whether or not I can get operated on is not a concern. I don't have a good job, rich relative, 401K or anything so I have to live with what i have.
Sure i could become the "career" type in hopes of saving a ton of money but life has a tendency of costing. More you make, more crap you are expected to pay for. besides that, by the time I could save enough for anything decent, i would be too old to really enjoy it. I would just be some old crepid granny (but hey, I would "pass" better)

With transition or anything - You have to make the most of what you have. sitting around waiting for better days is a waste cause as anyone over 30 has seen, "better days" is little more than an empty hope that gets us thru hard times.

[KellyJameson]

Inna your thread has made me think of a question to ask that never occured to me to ask until now that may go along way toward explaining something I have been mystified about.

Does or did transition change you from being Transsexual so now you are not, or are you always going to be a transsexual woman?

[Jorja]

Does or did transition change you from being Transsexual so now you are not, or are you always going to be a transsexual woman?

This depends on who is applying the labels. I tend to look at it like this, you are transsexual until you have had SRS and made the adjustment to it. At that point the transsexual tag can be removed and you are just a woman.

[Xrys]

I am taking this one step at a time. I take one step toward being a woman. I ask myself if this is enough for me to be happy. I make a list of what things i want to change next and assign them priorities. i plan my next step. i will continue this process until i can finaly be truly happy with where i am. whether that will be after a complete transition or somewhere before, I do not know. i will only know when i get there.

[arbon]

Would you still do utmost anything to achieve the illusive realm of Womanhood, or would you rather settle on an easier task, of being perceived transsexual forever???

I guess I just don't see being perceived as transsexual as easier.
But since I don't see having the money for the surgeries for some time, I can't change my gender legally, and I am still pretty easy for most people to identify as trans then being perceived as transsexual is something I am just going to have to live with for a while. Just trying to make the best with what I have.

[ColleenA]

Inna, your thread has made me think of a question to ask that never occured to me to ask until now that may go along way toward explaining something I have been mystified about.

Does or did transition change you from being Transsexual so now you are not, or are you always going to be a transsexual woman?

Kelly, anything involving a transition should have an endpoint -- that is, the process gets completed at some point. A caterpillar becomes a butterfly. A child goes through adolescence to become an adult. One president leaves the White House and turns everything over to the incoming president in a transition of power.

A transsexual does become a woman and there is nothing more to be done in terms of transition. One simply lives her (or his for transmen) life from that point forward.

My BFF had a reaction of mild shock with an unanticipated moment in her transition. Her endocrinologist checks her body chemistry every six to twelve months. She was caught off-guard the time his feedback was that EVERYTHING showed in the normal range for a woman her age. She had never thought about such a possibility and actually had to take some time to adjust to the notion.


This depends on who is applying the labels. I tend to look at it like this, you are transsexual until you have had SRS and made the adjustment to it. At that point the transsexual tag can be removed and you are just a woman.

As Jorja indicates, though, there are still certain times labels might get applied. For instance, one's physician should probably be aware of one's health history.

Generally, though, the vast majority of people you interact with have no need to know anything about your past. This is why many women choose to largely go stealth after transition.

[Inna]

....................................Well. words can only express so much and there are others who do it better:
wOSv1TIa58M#!

[Jorja]

Well, if transsexuals had a song, that one would be right up there at the top.

[Kate T]

I am sure that Inna did not intend to be condescending however the big question did come across to me as such

".... would you rather settle on an easier task, of being perceived transsexual forever???"

Which one of us will put their hand up and declare they should be the judge of what is and what is not easier?
I agree with Lea's and particularly Rianna's comments on this.

[Inna]

I suppose I haven't written the OP all too clearly and conveyed somewhat clouded theme, I do apologize!

As I still am attending, however seldom, gatherings of trans folks, from Crossdressers to Ts women, I can't help but face continuous disheartening notion of pain and anguish within most of them, due to, not feeling complete in their visual aspects.
A child's question, "are you a girl or a boy", quick ambiguous "Sir, may I help you" and the pain is visible on their faces, their stories do make the heart bleed but what I personally see is the lack of belief in that illusive realm being at their disposal.

Perhaps it is a harsh way to look at this, maybe transition should be way easier and stormy seas of the process, way calmer. But this is reality, at least it was that way for me.
I was homeless when I announced to the world of who I was, I was penniless , yet I put my life on line, I did absolutely everything to achieve the other side.
Being called "sir" did hurt tremendously, and yes I cried often, oozing pain from every pore of my broken body, but I did not settle.
I fought my way through, I still am!

This is my reality, the only reality I know, but the wonder of being fulfilled is so immense that words can not describe.....I wish everyone could experience this feeling, but as I have said in the past, "all it takes, is everything"

[Aimee20]

I really believe that of all people we should be the last label or stigmatize our brothers and sisters based on where they are and what they can do in their transition. A Trans woman who has decided and accepted her path has already earned the right to be called woman, there is no magical gate keeper that bestows that on us. Some people can not afford the surgical intervention or get it for health reasons.... Does that make a person in that situation any less genuine? Perhaps instead of debating on issues that divide we could take a look at encouraging each other to be the most authentic people we can.

Am I any less a woman because I have only been on hormone therapy for two short months? I do still dress as a man every day and go to work. Sometimes I wonder if this will all be worth it. Sometimes I don't feel pretty and just wish I could stay under the covers in bed and try again the next day... We are all fighting and trying for the same goal, why is there the need to tear each other down instead of the drive to empower and encourage?

[PaulaAnn]

Aimee20;Well stated;I couldn't agree more.
PaulaAnn

[Inna]

Misunderstood again........please read the OP again, and read into the words it says:


referring to visual clues, because once born a woman, always a woman!

However, even though we, as a group, are doing quite well in exposing this variant of natures whimsical play on gender, we also at the same time diminish the importance of full transition, to become in all its possibility, a Woman.



Not that this particular instance is in any shape or form, wrong or lesser,

I believe that those who read my posts, do get clear idea of what I am speaking of, however those who do not, see it at the face value and it may come of as in your face do it or else! Well, It isn't!
This is based on years of experience, research and psychology of societal perception, which will stay ignorant for most, acceptance will be forged over decades, but even then, what good is the acceptance of someone you are not!!! They will accept you as a trans-person, not the person you really are, a woman, or man! (excluding gender fluid)

[Nicole Erin]

I think if a TS has nothing in life to worry about other than if they pass or are accepted etc, their lives must be pretty good.
Whether or not I pass (seen as a woman) is but one of my daily concerns.

I think and worry about things like - how am I going to survive in the future, how am I going to make it by until I get paid again, is my car going to keep running well, am I gonna be single the rest of my life, how will I ever repay my debts...
"How am I going to survive in the future" tops my list of concerns.

So with that list, one of my lesser concerns is about "passing". Sure with that in mind, i worry about my safety and yes it hurts when I ocasionally get called "sir" but for real - If "I want to pass and be stealth" is the most pressing issue in your life, you are quite lucky and probably pretty spoiled.

EDIT - As i said, one has to be happy with what they have.
I think in general, the more assimilated a TS is, the better she will be treated but there will always be people who see us as a TS. They don't bring up things like "adam's apple" or "broad shoulders", no, they bring up really harsh realities like "chromosomes" or "inability to have a baby". Having a damned vagina is not going to make you a "real woman" in their eyes. Having surgeries increases ability to hide your birth gender but that is about it.

Oh gyod and get this - how come so many TS out there do all this stuff to pass, get FFS, SRS, dress well, electro... but the ONE thing they don't bother to work on is their voice? I mean christ, that is one of the few freebies in transition.