Jenni's coming out to the wife log

[Jenni Yumiko]

So yeah I know I said about waiting until a couple more life aspirations of my wives were fulfilled, but its been very heavy on my mind, and after really thinking about it it has been 2 years since i first brought it up. (wearing lingerie)

I told her we needed to talk cause things haven't really been right with us and we agreed tomorrow night would be a good time.

JenniferAtHome tweaked this for me a bit, TYVM! but wondering if there is anything integral that i'm missing. I plan to read this to her, I can speak for hours on technical stuff, but am not so good when it comes to affairs of the heart...

//begin rant
Honey, I may have to read this to you because I'll probably screw it up if I do not but I have something serious I'd like to discuss.

When we were dating and up to about 2 years ago I always seemed to have some private time alone for "gamin in my underpants". Over the past couple of years my stress about cross dressing has been increasing. That's when I told you there was more than just underwear preferences. Understandably your worries that I might be gay and even would want to become a woman. I have come to learn that this is a common fear for most spouses.

Lately, I have been reading about 'what makes crossdressers tick' but there really isn't one all encommpassing thing. I have also been communicating to a few who are kind of like me. Don't worry, It's totally anonymous. I am worried that you are seeing me differently now. I feel like something changed after we talked and let you know I have a feminine side.

This feminine part is really is what balanced the //name removed to protect the innocent// you know. Cross dressing isn't just about dressing like a girl, and it is not a sexual thing, it's something I feel I need to express who I am.

You might recall that prior to the layoff and our conversation, i was a lot softer, did more things that would be construed feminine that you liked. Getting mani's ped's, shopping, being more romantic, huggy, touchie feelie, a listener. We also didn't live together and I had some time to express the feminine me.

I feel like you hope that if we brush my cross dressing under the table, it's going to go away. It's not. It just makes me feel more and more stressed. There is no cure for cross dressing because it isn't a disease. It's not a compulsion but more like a part of me.

I want you to know and believe I am still the same man you married, you are my love, my best friend, my goose. I am still your man when I need to be your man, to protect you, to run to the gas station at 11 at night cause you want some chocolate, your provider and your rock. None of that changes.

But I'm also the person who likes cute things and to feel pretty. For reasons I don't understand when I dress I have a huge stress relief. That seems to be common among cross dressers.

I won't do anything that makes you uncomfortable and it is totally up to you as to what happens at this point, do know again, that I love you with all my heart, I love only you, I love you because we were friends before we fell in love, friends after we fell in love, and my tweedledee, lover of life.

I can't not be a cross dresser so if you don't want any part of this that's ok. I just want your help to figure out how I can be me and not offend you. If that means I have to do my thing when your not around, then that's ok. I get that, but I do need my time to do that. In my ideal world, I would really like, is to be able to share both of me in harmony with you as we grow old together. But it's really only your decision and I can abide by whatever it may be.

If you are interested, there are some resources I can offer, like a book or a web site, just let me know.

So what's on your mind?"
//end rant

Thoughts from the forum?

[Gretchen_To_Be]

Hey, Jennialy. Nice letter. My only input would be to add a sentence after, "Understandably your worries that I might be gay and even would want to become a woman. I have come to learn that this is a common fear for most spouses." You might want to confirm that you are not gay and don't want to become a woman...unless of course you are or do, in which case you should write a different letter. Other than that, I think it's sincere and you are reassuring her that you love her and are committed.

I think after you read this to her you should really tell her specifically what you want to do, how often you want to dress, how far you want to go, etc. This is your chance. When I came out to my wife, I told her about my need (fetish for wearing hose and heels) but not my desire, which would be occasionally to dress all the way with skirts, dresses, wig, makeup, etc. The whole nine yards. That was driven by the knowledge I would look ridiculous from the waist up, but I regret the decision not to tell her everything. She's OK with me shaving my legs and wearing hose, and occasionally heels, but she has drawn the line there. Maybe she would have anyway, even if I told her how far I wanted to go, but you get the idea. This is the time to establish boundaries acceptable to you both.

Good luck!

[CynthiaD]

I would memorize the letter, and then just talk. Writing everything down first is a good idea, because it helps you to figure out what you want to say, and the best way to say it. But reading the letter out loud could be a little weird and uncomfortable. If you just talk, you can adjust what you're saying to the moment, and you can turn the talk into a dialog instead of a lecture.

Good luck.

[Beverley Sims]

I am into writing down your thoughts and then memorizing them.
Write this through a few times as different points come to mind each time.
Giving a letter and asking her to absorb it in her own time is a bit impersonal for me.
If you can talk to each other you still remember the important points but they are delivered with feeling and emotion.
I think this part is important.

[Michelle (Oz)]

Had a similar talk prepared for my wife some 6 months ago. Hope yours goes better than mine - that wouldn't be hard though. Good luck.

[meganmartin]

The letter is nice but as others have said memorize it
speaking from the heart is always better and comes across as geniune.

also another poster stated, and being married 20 years it does mean much more when you validate her feelings.
Do not side step the negatives because she can google and find many negatives.
Find support groups such as Tri ess in your area for spouses can become secure in your journey of who you really are.

Good luck

[NicoleScott]

Nothing wrong with reading the letter to her (but DON'T give it to her and leave). You explained why you're reading it, and you don't want to leave anything out or get off-track. Also, any questions she has can be asked after you finish reading the letter. It's a good way to control the dialog. If you decide to wing it without the letter, keep it close by so you can recover if need be.

One last thought: when you finish, keep or destroy the letter. Others have said that giving the letter to their wife was a mistake. Sometimes the reaction is bad, the relationship goes south, and the letter gives her leverage. Not trying to be negative, but it happens. Good luck.

[Lorileah]

I would start with "You know I love you very much and that I will always be there for you. and then go into
I want you to know and believe I am still the same man you married, you are my love, my best friend, my goose. I am still your man when I need to be your man, to protect you, to run to the gas station at 11 at night cause you want some chocolate, your provider and your rock. None of that changes. But put her first, let her know she is the center of the universe before you start explaining the technical stuff.

I also agree to just map the talking points because you may mind that after the first sentence she gets a glazed look and you will have to improvise. She may surprise you and not ask the "questions". Then if you go there you plant a seed because it is something YOU have thought about. Don't be married to your letter, be ready for things you don't expect.

Good luck

[Annaliese]

Great letter, let us know how it goes. Hugs

[Jenni Yumiko]

So we talked last night. Overall it was a great relief to get it out in the open. She admitted she has looked at me differently since I told her that it was more than underwear and really thought I was gay or that I wanted to get my parts removed and replaced with girl parts. I assured her that was not the case. We talked about how that I am a guy, but have a strogn desire for a balance in my life. I have no plans as of yet for it to become a full time thing, but it does help me to balance my emotions and my overall male/female feelings. She asked what I expect and what options there are of her. I told her all the options available, give me my own time, accept and grow with me, or if you can't accept we start looking at dissolution. I assured her that the third choice is not something I want, I want to be you husband, your best friend and your friend who is a girl. I want to explore this side of me with her.

tl;dr

She said that she loves me, her feelings for me have not decreased in any way shape or form. She's not sure how to process this, and that we would talk more about it tonight.

She would like to read about what a cross-dresser is as it pertains to me, i told her I would find a few books on her nook. I also told her that she could talk to one of our friends who is semi post op FTM and someone I met on here who has been a lot of help. She said she would check out a couple books and talk to our friend.

[Jenniferathome]

That's a good start.

[Gretchen_To_Be]

Jenni, I hope it all works out for you and your SO. Keep us posted. Thanks for your visitor message!

[Stephanie47]

Just don't box her into a corner. Give her time to take a breath and reflect on your options. I can understand your optimum goal: her participation in your cross dressing desires and apparently its expansion as you develop. I wonder if you're prepared for only a "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" relationship, keeping you in the closet. I think you're going to find your situation is going to be very fluid for a long time. After twenty years of marriage your revelations are going to take some time for her weigh. And, do not be surprised if her viewpoint will change, and, if she is mildly accepting in the beginning, may continually change as you change.


She asked what I expect and what options there are of her. I told her all the options available, give me my own time, accept and grow with me, or if you can't accept we start looking at dissolution. I assured her that the third choice is not something I want, I want to be you husband, your best friend and your friend who is a girl. I want to explore this side of me with her.

She said that she loves me, her feelings for me have not decreased in any way shape or form. She's not sure how to process this, and that we would talk more about it tonight.

[pink.switch.lover]

It's just WONDERFUL that she wants to learn more about it and wants to talk more about it - good for her! And you. Your ability to communicate so respectfully and authentically is a testament to the strength of your marriage. I hope you continue grow together. Keep us updated.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Thanks, we have been iming throughout the day and she has been asking questions periodically. I'm pretty prepared for an up down roller coaster of good times and bad times. She said there are a lot worse things I could be doing behind her back and it's been a long time since I said I wanted to share something with her. She also agreed that I am much nicer and "sweeter" when she's gone and she comes back.
Stephanie, I lived the DADT life with her to a lesser extent already. I'm fully prepared for it, and am pretty sure the next few months will remain in an up down DADT state and there will be times where she will need me to be her man, and times she will be accepting and 'I can't look at you now like that' times.
This is new territory for myself also. I always knew there was more to it then just a fetish, but I never really explored any extended time dressed. It was usually an O and then back to drab mode. I am sure I don't want a sex change, and i'm 100% certain I don't want to be with a guy, despite the occasionally fantasy in my head. I do like myself better when both of me's are around. As with anything though in my mind there needs to be a balance.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Update 2
So today was more talking, and went back and forth about is it a sex thing, the fact that I want to get "made over" how would personal time work, would one of us have to leave. Not a very good day. Each day is either up or down. She really wanted to know what I wanted to do "with her" I said the sex would be good, but past that, I don't know. I don't know where I am at with this, but I want to do it with you. I said it would be cool to dress up, but I'm not really looking at going out to Walmart to buy groceries dressed. I don't have answers to where I want to be "as a woman". She asked how it was with the ex'es that I did do this with. She still thinks that my ex'es "turned me out". She still says she loves me and that hasn't changed and she is happy being with me. Also asked if this feminine side has a name. I said no. She started reading He wears my Clothes...

[Denise1951]

SO glad it went well. I can relate my experience. Once I got caught and "had" to have the talk; I was totally honest with my wife. In the end I wished I had done it years earlier. That being said, I took things at "her" speed. I did not force anything. She wanted to see me dressed, so I let her. She said fine, and that was it for a couple of years. Whenever she would bring up the subject, we would talk about it. Now she fully embraces my dressing, goes shopping with me. So take you time. This will be a work in progress that will never be done. Keep working at it.

[Girl]

I'm glad it went so well for you, Jenni! That's wonderful! :)

[nicolecdgal]

I will be having this same talk with my wife this week. Thank you all for your ideas and input in this topic.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Her big question that I'm having problems with is, I married a man. I told her that I'm the same guy as I have always been just one who likes to feel pretty. And that it helps to balance out my over macho other self.
Not sure what else I can say to her.
Thoughts?

[Alberta_Pat]

I would re-enforce that this is a clothing thing.

As such, simply wearing clothing that you find "comfortable" to You is what this is all about.

There should be no suggestion that you wish to "portray" a woman, unless that is your goal.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Last couple days were uneventful, we haven't said anything to each other about it. Did find out though that she has been talking to my friend/ex roommate who knows. (She used to buy clothes for me, and encourage dressing and telling my then girlfriend) in retrospect, I probably could have been with her and have none of these issues, but she was never my type.
They are having dinner tomorrow, which should be good for the above reasons and my wife actually listens to her.

*crosses fingers*

[Bree Wagner]

I'm pretty prepared for an up down roller coaster of good times and bad times.

Jenni,

It sure seems that you are doing almost everything in a good supportive way, but you are right to prepare for the roller coaster. The ups and downs may never end or you may quickly find equilibrium. My wife and I have been riding it for 13 years and there have been some crazy highs, a few lows, and some long stretches where nothing seems to happen. My only advice, which you already seem to be doing, is to keep communicating and reinforcing your love for her.

Good luck on your own personal amusement park ride! The price of admission is usually worth it. :)

-Bree

[aussie cd]

best of luck jenni, it took some time for my wife to come around ,she busted me always staring at the pretty girls (style check! not sexually!) and was not happy so i had to confess or lose her for checking these women out, not good to start with paid out on me big time (why didnt you tell me etc etc)
she accepts me for me after a few up and downs but we have stood the test of time now and she loves the bedroom stuff and getting kissed with lippy on. She's let me go out about half a dozen times now, i dont really pass but we've been to the casino,movies, a club to play the pokies (slots), driving around , i think she's accepted it not too bad
She even bought me 2 pairs of gorgeous heels online yesterday without any prompting (she knows of weakness for high heels!), my advice take is slow dont ram it down her throat , she has reassured you her love your half way there
gl xo

[Jenni Yumiko]

So we had a long talk today, she has a picture of me she can't shake of me in a granny dress with a ru Paul makeup job.
Good talk, were going to let me fully underwear/corsets/nightie/bra underdress at night and let her get used to it then go on from there. She does want to see what I look with clothes on and made up.
We are going shopping now to pick up some minor clothes that aren't "old person" and make plans to visit a transformation service in the near future.
Shortened condensed version. Ill post the whole conversation later, getting ready to go shopping!

[Teri Ray]

Best wishes Jennialy seems you are off to a great start. Just remember to take things slowly and on your wifes pace. Don't let the excitement of opening up the conversation overwhelm your wife.

[jenni_xx]

Edited my post as reading back I was wrong to give out the advice that I did. I wrote it without reading the replies to the thread or the subsequent posts from Jenni, so thought it best to delete the contents of this post as I was being far too harsh and unfair. I'm sorry.

[Gretchen_To_Be]

jenni_xx, I am confused. I like the other Jenni's letter because it is a way to get it all out at once. Conversations take on a life of their own, and one tends to modify the discourse based on the recipient's responses. After reading your previous posts, it appears that your verbal approach didn't work that well, since you didn't tell your GF you were gay when you came out to her. You are indeed harsh.

[Jenniferathome]

...One, it is too apologetic. ...makes it sound that we are doing something wrong.

Jenni xx, you've missed the point of this conversation entirely. When we husbands are having this conversation, it's almost always after LYING to our wives for years, in hiding this. THAT is what is wrong. Moreover, a cross dressing husband is not something any wife should be expected to "accept." It's weird!

[jenni_xx]

Reading my post back, I agree Shibumi - I was too harsh. I apologise to the OP. While I do think that writing everything down is a good idea, I do maintain that talking face to face is a much better option. But my post was unnecessary (and was written from a position of ignorance in regards to how Jenni's situation had indeed progressed). That was silly of me - I should have read the entire thread before diving in to make my comment. Once again, I apologise.

Fair point Shibumi about my own experience. Can't disagree with you on that one, and my own experience in the past does make me sound a little hypocritical. I feel quite bad now, so not only am I sorry to Jenni, but to anyone else who may have got a little annoyed with my post.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Saw Jenni_xx's post but was running for a flight and didn't get to respond.
A big difference between my actual post and my first update was that the original talk occurred face to face, i memorized most of what I wrote and spewed it out pretty quickly. After I said everything, she was like what? huh? so I gave her the letter to restate what I just said since I was nervous and speaking 100mph...
I too do agree that this warranted a face to face talk rather than an email or letter to her with no interaction.
Also I ditched the whole dissolution piece.

On to this past week.

Like I stated she has had quite a few questions and we did have a point where she was crying about it for most of the day, to the point where I was willing to just say forget it and purge. I know I would still have the urges, but I lived most of my life with dressing all the way at a minimum, years have gone without any type of girl clothes, things, etc... I didn't want her to be sad and feel like our relationship was shaky.
We got past that after she talked to our mutual friend.
The shopping day, was more questions on how I am in relation to the two other "out" CD'ers and FTM TS that we know. I continually assured her that I have no intentions of becoming MTF permanently, and have no real plans on going out on a day to day basis. I said maybe if we went together and if it was something we both thought would be fun, we could, but i'm too self conscience to just "go out"
Her vision of me has been a cross between Tim Curry's Frank-N-Furter or Ru Paul wearing a Granny dress. :-(
We discussed boundaries, she wanted to know exactly what I want to do regularly, versus what is occasional. I said that your already ok with my bottom underdressing, I would like to add top underdressing, bra's, corsets, chemise other lingerie items. She said why would you want to wear a bra, she can't wait to take that stupid thing off the minute she gets home. I told her in detail, exactly how it feels, the sensation of the material tightly around me, and how it makes me feel cute and pretty. She understands the whole Ahhhhhhh stress relief, and said it sounds the same as when she gets home from work and puts on her "comfy clothes"
We kinda both came to the conclusion of maybe if she saw my opposite side of the spectrum (fully dressed, makeup, etc), then everything middle ground wont be bad. She said she got used to the panties and tights relatively quickly and to the point that she likes me in cheekies and thongs.
Thats when we decided to go shopping.
Shopping didn't go as well as planned. It was actually pretty funny. We went to Bloomingdales, Kohls and Target and ended up buying clothes for the kids. We went running around the Jr's section, but couldn't really figure out my size nor decide on what we both thought was cute. We were both pretty nervous and we were just like, screw it, lets go buy the kids clothes.
After we got home, I dyed her hair, brushed it out, epilated her legs for her and she was like, can I do your toes? So she painted my toes, we watched a couple movies did something else and went to bed in each others arms and face to face (A rarity cause we both hate hot breath on us when we are sleeping)
Overall it was a very nice day/night, she feels like she understands me and what I am and want to do better and that it's not a bad or weird thing.
When I get back from this business trip, (alone in a hotel right now facetiming her) she would like to see the top underdressing I do have and ok'ed me in bra's/top underdressing.
One thing she didn't like was the whole male name/female name. She said, It's the same you under the clothes, and you don't have a split personality, so she's not going to reference me differently in whatever I wear. (I think that makes sense) We did agree though, if we ever had comments in public though I would be referred to as Michelle.

[Ceri Anne]

I have been inspired by reading your post and all the replies. I am currently working towards this myself. My wife is aware of my "softer" characteristics, but doesn't have a track record for being an understanding person. Its terribly frightening, so I really admire your courage. How long have you been married?

My other question is the name. Your Jenni here, but when out you will be refered to as Michelle. Any particular reason for the difference? Just curious.

I wish you continued sucess in your coming out and growing together.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Jenni was something I just made up without any thought. Michelle is kinda a name we are both connected with.
Jenni also referees to the fact that my friend and I used that name when talking about my stuff and the wife heard by earshot, so she didn't really want anything relating to something my friend and I came up with. (I think my wife is a little jealous of our relationship, more so of her, despite it being purely platonic) we have been married for 8 years, but I have been friends with her prior for 15 years.
I would like to think that I knew all along that she would be accepting, but there was definately doubt as she is pretty religious and comes from a very "Brady Bunch" perfect world existence where nothing odd happens.
I just got back from a trip and I'm sure we will be bringing it up again this weekend due to the unfinished part of underdressing upper body stuff. Let you know how it goes.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Yesterday was definitely uphill on the roller coaster. I asked her if she wanted to see my stuff and if it was ok to underdress now, (she said yes before) and she totally 180ed.
She asked why I had to bring it up all the time, (other than the initial talk and yesterday it has always been her brining it up)
Got angry at me and said she doesn't want to discuss it anymore. Then slept in the guest room.
I sat there like wtf?!
So now were just saying one or two words to each other. Great...
The only other issue she has at the moment is her back hurts. Not sure if that led her disposition being bad, but I think it did :-(

[kimdl93]

Sounds as though she's quite sensitive about things right now. Try to let go off comments she makes that reflect her frustrations. Give it a few days to quiet down, and don't push the issue. Let her come to you with the next conversation - and if it starts to get heated, then ask for a break in the conversation until you're both calmed down. Be very, very patient and try to imagine yourself in her frame of mind.

[Tammy Nowakowski]

i agree with you on this kimdl93
Go withh baby steps and one day at a time

[Jenni Yumiko]

She talked to her psychiatrist yesterday and came home with all sorts of things to talk about.
Her psych said, that I probably wouldn't be able to stop and its a sexual psychosis (I think that's what she called it, don't quote me) and that its good that I came out to her, that we are talking and being honest about all that's going on. It must have been a huge sigh of relief to come out. At the same time, if its something she can't accept, it's not fair to her to be unhappy, nor is it fair to me to be unhappy.
She asked me if we split up would I pursue someone who would be accepting. I told her I don't want to split up. She asked but let's just say we do, I said first and foremost, I would look for someone who the kids would accept and to be honest, I'm not even sure I would want to put the kids through another "other" in their lives. (I would really like to know what this line of questioning is trying to deduce)
She said she was just asking, she doesn't have any plans on us breaking up. She said worst case we would have a DADT relationship.
She asked if I would be willing to go to gender counseling. I said yes.
One of her big concerns still is that I am going to want to go out and hang out in public and present myself as a woman full time. I assured her that wasn't the case and that it goes against what I feel when I'm dressed, which is a relaxed state (and usually super horny) why would I want to risk ridicule and being outed by someone I know if dressing is just the opposite for me, a stress relief. She said ok.
Tonight she would like to see what things I do have. I said ok. It would just be lingerie, and then see me in it at some time in the future, then see my clothes, and then see me in that sometime in the future, providing she can get past each step.
The lingerie for sure matches what I tell her about sensations of material and feeling, (all satiny stuff and compressing, corsets, bustiers, shape wear type stuff) I'm just not sure if I should show her all my lingerie, or just some. I told her I don't have a lot, and in comparison to my last purge, I really don't. It all fits in one drawer, albeit cramped but it does. By contrast though, it's a lot more stuff than she owns.
Her initial line of questioning really made my heart sink and me get that "pit" in my stomach, when something goes terribly wrong in a relationship.
I'm really nervous that she won't be able to accept, and now with her questions, makes me wonder if she doesn't will she want a divorce.

[Di]

Wishing you both the best.
Here is a thread you might want to read
http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?12890-Now-I-Like-It-Now-I-Don-t

Also you might want to invite her here. In FAB she will have others to talk to and understand.

[Jenni Yumiko]

So the night to show her my lingerie came and gone.
All the kids were sleeping and she asked if I was going to show her. I said yeah if you want to see them. Her reply was I have already seen your things from me putting your clothes away.
Ok then why do you want to see them???
She said now that she thinks about it, it's only lingerie in a drawer.
She wants to see me in something.
I told her ok but not tonight cause I was tired.
Honestly I'm scared and nervous as all heck to be dressed up in front of her.
What if she can't accept it? She says she really wants to be able to accept and embrace this, but I feel "awkward"
Then there's the what should I wear? Just a bra n underwear? Bra, thong, garters and stocking? Teddy? Bustier? Corset? Shape wear? Nightgown?
Would wearing the most girlish pinkish outfit be too much? Would it work to get the "worst" out in the open? Will subdued be better?
I'm totally over thinking and driving myself and my friend crazy with all of this. At this point I think I'm causing more anxiety to myself then she has.
Should I just put something on and when everyone is asleep, take off my shirt n pajamas and be all tada? Or wait until the weekend? Or let her see me in the morning when she comes into my office to say good morning?
Never thought I would ever have a need to take a Xanax, but really close to taking one of hers.

[Kalista Jameson]

Hi Jen,

My thoughts are that everything is a matter of perception regarding what the worst is as far as outward appearances are. To you stockings and pink may be what you associate with being most feminine for example, but to her, it could be wearing makeup or a gown to bed. Don't over think it and see it in degrees. I think that you should just jump in with both heels and wear what is sexiest to you and then you'll get it over with. If she can handle your best, anything less you know is okay too. It's kinda of diving off the high dive, you just have to do it. Let her see you as you if she opens the door.

Good luck, and stay strong. Don't over think and psyche yourself out.

Cheers,

Kalista

[kimdl93]

Just relax. Then instead of anticipating and mind reading, tell her you're nervous and anxious about this and ask her to choose when and what. A basic rule is that people generally will tell you the truth. She's being honest about wanting to learn to accept this part of you. You have to be equally honest in expressing your qualms, fears and apprehensions. She'll then understand a little better the emotions that you're struggling with and be better equipped to help.

[BillieAnneJean]

It still amazes me that women (hypothetical person) can change their style and start dressing like a man, cut her hair short, whatever she wants, and expect to be accepted. Yet a guy changes his style and dresses like a woman and he may be condemned by society, his SO, maybe even assaulted.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Wishing you both the best.
Here is a thread you might want to read
http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?12890-Now-I-Like-It-Now-I-Don-t

Also you might want to invite her here. In FAB she will have others to talk to and understand.

Thanks Di, that was very helpful. Now I'm trying to dissect that into her reactions...
Over thinking again :-)

[Jenni Yumiko]

SO went to the movies and dinner with a friend, kid lets aren't home tonight.
She said to pick something and be dressed when I get home.
Kinda demandie of her!
So as this is phase 2, (present myself in lingerie) I'm still not sure what to wear? I have a few hours to decide so I'm sure ill be cycling through a bunch of outfits...
Any suggestions? No, I'm not posting pix :-)

[Lady Slipper]

I hope it went well Jen, keeping my fingers crossed for you.

[Kalista Jameson]

SO went to the movies and dinner with a friend, kid lets aren't home tonight.
She said to pick something and be dressed when I get home.
Kinda demandie of her!
So as this is phase 2, (present myself in lingerie) I'm still not sure what to wear? I have a few hours to decide so I'm sure ill be cycling through a bunch of outfits...
Any suggestions? No, I'm not posting pix :-)

Sounds very promising Jen, I'm pulling for ya. I don't know what you have in your 'Sexy Jen' drawer, but whatever it is, wear your favorite stuff. Best time to find out if she'll be okay with it.

You go TGirl :)

Kalista

[Jenni Yumiko]

Sucked. She got home, snapped my bra, that was kinda funny, we started watching a movie, then I got massive chills, 10 minutes later I'm throwing up, body ache and a headache. I have a 102.7 fever ATM and a headache that is making me want to cry. :-( :-( :-(

[Di]

Sorry to hear you ended up sick.:hugs: But the plus side she wants to interact with your girl side....and thats just how things go sometimes eh?
Get better soon and chin up things seem to be going in the right direction.

[Beverley Sims]

Jeni,
I am so pleased you talked to your wife first before giving her the letter.
You kinda blew it a bit by being in a hurry to catch the plane.
I think you are playing it right by letting her have bits of you at the time.
You do have to overcome your self consciousness in all this otherwise she will feel the fear in your heart.
Lingerie wise I would dress in something pretty that covers all the uglier parts we can display.
Two pairs of undies can help as can a chemise and yes wear a bra not necessarily a large cup size, A or B.
Think of it small busted women look alluring too.I can do a 36Aand look good in a shoestrap top.
You probably got yourself sick with worry, I hope so and it is something that will pass.
As before take it slowly you are doing well in my book and letting your wife lead you.
I am watching with great interest and did not post until I saw some progress.
Still all the best, breathe in and smile,
Beverley.

[Jessica86]

When I dress around my wife, I go all out or nothing. I don't let her dictate what I should do in that department any longer. I went through a similar experience where my wife told me to dress without doing my makeup. Also, she said to dress sexy. I thought....how do you do that without makeup? I went, picked out a school girl looking outfit, as instructed. Then, when I returned dressed, she laughed at me. Talk about being hurt. She said some things that hurt. I went back into our room, cried, and changed back into my male clothes. Then, I took a walk.

I would only present all or nothing. Wives know nothing of what we do. Some things will freak them out. I let my wife see my clothes and things, but lingerie, forms, and even wigs....nah. I only let her see those things if I already have them on. Congrats on talking to her about it. I hope she accepts and participates with you. My wife does not participate as much as I would like her to. I think two people embracing this can help you have a better understanding of yourself....faster...and easier. I'm not one for counseling either. I believe all they do is confirm what is in your mind. After all, is someone you pay money to really going to tell you something you don't want to hear? It's like a car salesman saying the car you picked out is ugly, unreliable, and cheap.

[Julogden]

I'm glad there's a dialog going on between the two of you and that she didn't just shut it all down immediately, sounds like there's a chance for working things out.

I haven't attended a Chi Chapter meeting of Tri Ess in a very long time, but there used to be a few wives involved there. Have you two ever considered something like that? Maybe it would help her to talk to other wives who have CD husbands.

Best of luck,
Carol :hugs:

[Dann12]

AWE CRUD!!! Hope you're feeling better soon. This is a great thread. Get rest. We're all pulling for you and you're wife finding a happy medium.

[allesha10]

Jen, I justy came out to my wife Friday night, she knew something was going on, We talked a lot and she said as long as the Allesha did not get all of the attention and I remembered her, she was OK with me doing it while she is gone. Not sure if that equates to discussing being a girl around her or showing her my clothes? I am just watching and waiting to see if she gets better with Allesha?

[bobbimo]

Great story Jenni, or should we change to Michelle.
I do hope you two will get to enjoy this together.
I found it fun to ask my wife 'what color should I wear tonight?".
This gets her a little involved in a fun way and speeds up the 'what should I wear tonight' dilemma.
Bobbi

[Jane P]

Hi Jenni , I cannot convey just how much I hope everything works out for you and your wife . My own fears prevent me from having the talk , but I know it must be done.

Hope you are feeling better.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Thank you for your kind words and get well wishes, day 4 and my headache is getting better thanks to my dr and Vicodin ES 1500's and a z pack. now I'm just kinda loopy. Going to make a big pot of matzo ball soup and hopefully knock out this congestion.
I have considered tries and hanging out with other cd couples, but at the moment I think it's too soon. Tomorrow night if I'm better we will retry "the reveal" if I'm feeling better. Past 4 days were mostly sleep, logging on here, Skyrim and water.

[Chickhe]

There should be a TV show, 'How not to CD'... anyhow, I don't claim to have the answer and I'm not saying you did anything wrong with your approach, but I've had good luck with not explaining anything and just doing it. I try to make the whole experience for my wife enjoyable. I realize there is a bubble I don't want to burst and I think what most partners are worried about is change...its not really about 'they married a man!'... but it is about security and changes...they had this notion that they would be secure for the rest of their lives and suddenly they think its no so... now there is a learning curve and a lot of bad advice and they get worried. I think the key is to maintain what you both had before and just add in the CDing like an other activity (like you joined a cosplay club or rehearsing for a play). You need less emotion and more experiences. I can tell you, I've experienced a lot and the way I feel about CDing has changed a huge amount. If you know for sure what you need is a huge life change, then do it, but my personal expereince is that I want to keep the security I have with my wife and family and also enjoy CDing sometimes too. So its a balancing act emotionally and practical sometimes, but I tend not to change my lifestyle. ...I really like Jessica Who's saying 'ya, I'm a dude and I wear woman's clothing'... if you can get to a comfortable place, CDing can be a fun activity.

[Tammy Nowakowski]

YUCK THE CRUD!!! Hope you're feeling better soon

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi Jen, I have just been going along for the ride with your post until now, but I sure hope
that things turn out the way that you want, it sound like there's a light at the end of the tunnel.

[Jenni Yumiko]

So she saw me in a bra, it wasn't a good evening, she made an off color remark that sent me to the guest room.
Following day we talked a bit, she said she didn't mean it that way, but reaffirmed that she can't do it.
This led to us arguing about other stuff, and spent another couple nights on the couch without speaking.
Fast forward to today, I sent her an IM at work saying how sorry I was for yelling and being a general tool. We agreed to talk again tonight.
Tonight's talk went much better. She asked me to see some things on, I showed her a bustier and a shape wear slip. We talked about why I do things and why she is worried. Her main concern again is that I will want to transition or become a full time girl. We decided to compromise and see how it goes.
She got over the panties and nylons pretty quickly she said so let's see how underdressing goes. We agreed that I am allowed to underdress, but won't bring up fully dressing until she does. If I'm on a trip for work, then have at it. She's not ready for that yet and will let me know if and when she does feel better about it.

While she is not happy about it, I can fully underdress (lingerie) she doesn't care about pedi's and nails, and said that part she actually likes, cause I'm pretty good at doing her nails, and I do cool things to my toes, like an art canvas.
I told her I loved her and thanked her for being able to come to an amicable compromise. She also said that if this is something I'm still confused about (fully dressing makeup and all) it's a journey she would want with me by her side.

So here's to compromise and a very loving wife.
We will see how next week goes after seeing me for a week with bras and such on under my drab.

[Jodi Anne]

Good to hear that it looks brighter maybe with more time it will be ok.

[MysticLady]

Jenni
Your story and wife are almost identical to my story and wife. Except, my wife finally decided that she couldn't and wasn't going to accept it and told me that she wants a divorce. So,Ive moved out and have gotten my own place where Im free to be me but also lonely because I miss her. But,I do not miss the constant emotional drama that would come we would discuss my crossdressing.
I hope your story ends on "and they lived happily ever after". Unfortuanley,thats going to depend largely on your wife accepting and loving you for who you are and not who she wants you to be.
Best Wishes on your adventure:hugs:

[bobbimo]

Yea Jenni!
I'm so happy that you guys are moving in a positive direction!
Great news!
Bobbi

[Jenni Yumiko]

It's been a few days since I started wearing bras, panties, nylons full time around the house.
Her reactions so far, not disgusted which is good, she constantly says that she is trying to let it go that I'm not me anymore and it isn't that bad.
Every time she wants my attention now she snaps my bra strap and giggles like a school girl, she thinks its funny, dammit it hurts... I apologize to every woman I have ever bra snapped in my life!
She said she has noticed that I am much calmer and easygoing then when I'm en man...
We cricketed yesterday day... I must say, Crickets are effing cool! I bought the software for her years ago so I have been free handing drawing stuff and vinyl cutting it. My office desk and Macs look like a skate shop counter, there are Soo many stickers all over.
W watched the Oscars last night, she said if all I had to do was put a bra on you to watch and interact about shows I like I would have done it years ago.
She's still not keen on touching anything lingerie covered, we will see if we ever get past that.
It's only been a few days, but being fully undressed the whole weekend with my wife around has been pretty cool.
She is not a fan of my unlined no wire bras, they say they look old people, and suggested ordering from VS. I said they were to $$ let's go out for some us time instead and go shopping for spring clothes for you, not me or the kidlets. (Yeah I played that one good :-))

[Jenni Yumiko]

So while I thought things were progressing fine, apparently they are not. She has been talking to our friend, the details I'm unsure of but for the time being she would like me to stop underdressing.
We also called a gender therapist and she will be seeing her, as the therapist would like to see her first to help her cope with this news.
I m not sure what to do other than obey her wishes for now. I'm not sure what stage this is for her or if this is something she will be able to handle. The panties and tights were one thing she said, they were just basically risqué underwear, but the lingerie, fully dressing, nail polish etc, are weighing heavy on her mind,

[Jenni Yumiko]

Talked a bit last night about it after a few nights back in the guest room.
Her talk with our friend painted a bad picture for her.
Our friend told my wife that I would hang out around the house in my underwear and it made my friend uncomfortable, so she bought me LBD's, miniskirts and heels. I was like, uhm, if I made her uncomfortable why would she buy me sexy clothes and not something more androgynous? In retrospect now i fully realize that our friend had a thing for me.

While on the subject of androgynous clothes, and wearing what makes you happy, I commented on her recent penchant for cotton briefs stating those are pretty manly, and she wears big ole sweatshirts and frumpy stuff to bed when she has a ton of more feminine stuff. Yeah foot in mouth, that was probably a bad idea, whether I was a crossdresser or not. Never say negative stuff about your SO's clothing choices, that resulted in a 2 hour long discussion on how she doesn't feel sexy despite me telling her over and over she is.

After getting past that we talked about why she feels she won't be able to accept and made a list.
Her list comprised of two things. (Today at least)

1. The betrayal. I apologized repeatedly for not telling her when we became serious, but she still has issues forgiving me, the only plus is she said she doesn't think it would change anything. I told her she really needs to get over this before we can move forward otherwise its just going to gnaw at you and we are both going to be completely miserable for the rest of our lives. In some aspects I think it would have been an easier reveal if I cheated on her. (Which I would never)

2. Her visual of me in a dress. I don't know what to say or how to resolve this. This is what she sees whenever she sees me, pictures or thinks of me.

Gender therapist is this Thursday for her and she also sees her regular psych today.
Her regular psych though I'm not very fond of and I feel that she is planting seeds in my wife. She told her that she knows her and doesn't think she will be happy like this. She also said that crossdressing is a sexual psychosis. WTH?!? Seriously? And she has a medical degree? I told my wife this, and told her that I know she trusts this lady, but your really going to have to talk to an expert in the field because your psych is not an expert in this field, she even admitted that she has never known anyone who crossdresser, patient or privately.

So tonight should be interesting, I'm almost to the point of making an appointment with her psych just to set her straight. I can't wait to hear what she has to say today.


Day 7 fully en drab and I feel kinda depressed and unmotivated, also noticed my patience level has declined.

[PaulaQ]

1. The betrayal. I apologized repeatedly for not telling her when we became serious, but she still has issues forgiving me, the only plus is she said she doesn't think it would change anything.

She can either forgive you, or she can't. She has to find what's in her heart. Some people aren't forgiving. Hope she's not like that.


Her regular psych though I'm not very fond of and I feel that she is planting seeds in my wife. She told her that she knows her and doesn't think she will be happy like this. She also said that crossdressing is a sexual psychosis. WTH?!? Seriously? And she has a medical degree? I told my wife this, and told her that I know she trusts this lady, but your really going to have to talk to an expert in the field because your psych is not an expert in this field, she even admitted that she has never known anyone who crossdresser, patient or privately.

The mayo clinic's website lists crossdressing as a compulsive sexual disorder or paraphilia:
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/compulsive-sexual-behavior/DS00144/DSECTION=symptoms

Ask her to ask her psychologist about treatment options and historical success rate for the cure of the urge to crossdress. The treatment options I've read about are:
- generally pretty terrible (if they dope you up enough so that you are gorked out of your mind and have no sex drive whatsoever, you may stop. Maybe.)
- have an exceedingly small success rate

I'm sorry you are going through this. We are 1% or less of the population. There is a lot of prejudice. Hey, it hasn't been that long since they stopped considering homosexuality as a mental illness. There's a lot fewer of us. :(

[Jenni Yumiko]

She went to gender therapist yesterday and spent two hours telling the therapist everything that was going on, how she found out, how it has progressed, what I have said, how she feels etc. she made an appointment for me next week and then I guess we both will go to discuss what we have both said.
The irrational, inpatient person in me wished the therapist gave her an "Aha" moment, where everything just clicked and my wife would have came home with a ton of new clothes for me, Milla Jovovich and said get dressed, were going to have a ménage trio with Milla. Back to reality...
I'm glad she got to talk to someone who was able to be objective and she said she felt better, getting it all out to someone who won't judge or interject her opinions into the conversation and just, listen.
The GT thinks from what my wife said, that my "level" of transgender doesn't really go above crossdressing, which mad emy wife feel a whole lot better.
So while I'm still not underdressing I feel as though there may be some light at the end of the tunnel.
Also read and thought a lot about everyone's replies to my compromise post, and will try to figure out something amicable for when the three of us meet.

[PaulaQ]

Jenni, this sounds like it was really positive for your wife. Don't be alarmed, though, if she moves forward on this some, and then backwards some. Any type of big change in a life / relationship is hard to process emotionally. She no doubt has lots of emotions to deal with, and that stuff just takes time, patience, and love. Talking to someone, and listening, is a good sign though.

Best of luck!

[Jenni Yumiko]

Yeah it makes me think of the song opposites attract. 2 steps forward, two steps back...
Should be interesting when I go on Monday. I like to think of myself as pretty self actualized, but that part of me says I'm not. She is definitely more money than your run of the mill psychiatrist, but her credentials are pretty good. I'm scared to see what insurance doesn't cover.

[bobbimo]

I've got my fingers crossed for you Jenni.
Like other here have said, this is a pretty traumatic thing your wife is going through.
I know what my wife went through, even to the point of wondering if she liked me as a woman does that mean she has lesbian tendencies?
Now she just shakes her head and says ' I dont get it"... and that makes two of us.
Bobbi

[JenniferR771]

Jenni,
don't be surprised if your GT does not seem to support you as much when the two of you are together. He may actually side with your wife on some issues.

[Beverley Sims]

Jenni,
As you know I have been taking a great interest in how you are progressing.
Some things I suspect are still being taken too quickly although with your wifes changing views and extensive talking you are making inroads.
I agree that you have foot in mouth disease sometimes but pause, change gear and then reply more considerately.
I speak from experience here, I still have foot in mouth.
Lots of luck and all the best for up coming sessions.

[Jenni Yumiko]

I agree Jennifer and Beverly, I'm fully prepared for her to take my wife's side, ESP since I tend to get foot in mouth when agitated. I'm working on that but sometimes it just comes out poorly.
We are moving at a fast pace, agreed. My wife is very task oriented and has been in very fast paced decision making positions all her life, and wants to receive a task/issue, etc. resolve it, package it and move on. She's like that with everything, I guess that's why she's our general problem solver, I'll hem and haw as she says, about something, check every possible angle, leave it for a while, come back, dissect it again, look at every possible outcome, leave it for a while, come back and see if anything changed, then make a decision.
I'm a little nervous about seeing a psych tonight as last time I did I was put on medications. We shall see, Paula's thread about psychs was very well timed for me!

[Jenni Yumiko]

I really thought about what you said Beverley and told my wife that we need to slow down because its just causing a ton more stress for us as all our conversations seem centered around this big pink elephant. - good advice, thank you!
Went to the counseler, I really enjoyed it actually. We talked for a couple hours, I gave her my history, we discussed how she felt I was on the crossdressing spectrum, autogeniphilic and minor sexual dysphoria. We agreed I don't want to become a woman, am not gay, and have no real interest in pursuits outside of the privacy of my own home. Identified anxiety versus not dressing...
The real aha moment though was when we talked about my wife. Post child, she has been having self esteem issues around her weight. While I make sure to compliment her a lot, she still has troubles dealing with it. The counselor thinks that deep down my wife may see crossdressing as a threat to her womanhood. As if she doesn't have enough to worry about she is also worried that this other me would satisfy my needs and push my wife further away from me as I would be content with me and my other me. I think that totally makes sense given how she has been feeling about her body lately and the issues she had to deal with growing up, coupled with the fact that I'm pretty vain. :-(
This is definitely something ill let the professionals handle as I'm sure if I brought it up I would screw it up royally. So I suspect the rest of this week will be quiet as far as discussions go unless she brings something up.
Next Tuesday is our first group appointment, Wife and myself, then from there I think she will be seeing her some more.

Side note I'm getting very anxious and trying very hard not to explode on anyone as the lack of femme time is really beginning to annoy me...

[PaulaQ]

Jenni, this sounds like it was a really productive session.


This is definitely something ill let the professionals handle as I'm sure if I brought it up I would screw it up royally. So I suspect the rest of this week will be quiet as far as discussions go unless she brings something up.

Oh I totally agree with that.

Only thing you should do along those lines in my opinion is to try to show her that you feel she's more wonderful today than when you married her, that she's special, and you can't live without her. Don't go overboard, but pay attention to her. From your other posts, seems like you are doing this - so keep doing that. :)


Side note I'm getting very anxious and trying very hard not to explode on anyone as the lack of femme time is really beginning to annoy me...
Best of luck with that, I feel for you. I wouldn't make it. You are a better person than I am.

[Jodi Anne]

I still have my fingers crossed, thanks for the updates.

[DaniG]

Jenni, this sounds like it was really positive for your wife. Don't be alarmed, though, if she moves forward on this some, and then backwards some.

My wife has definitely been like this, good days and bad days. She's trying so hard. And I'm TG, possibly headed for transition, so she's dealing with the whole shabang. But you have to roll with the punches.

[Jenni Yumiko]

She came to me Friday morning before work and told me it was ok to underdress, bra, panties, hose/leggings, so my anxiety levels have dropped down immensely and stress levels dropped considerably, with the exception of Friday where I caused a nationwide Internet outage for a few minutes, i don't always test my code, but when I do it's in production. We talked today a bit to determine what we will talk about on Tuesday. We both are a lot calmer though which is good.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Last night was our session both of us with our gender counselor. We went in and straight out told her where we were at and what we needed help on. (Explained in third person to emphasis who's thoughts were who)
Our issues:

Forgive me for not telling her sooner
The visual she has of me dressed up from someone else
What he is and what he is not
How do we accept this
Will one thing lead to another?
Why can't he tell me what I want "Once in a while"
How to set compromise and boundaries


So starting with # 1
While she may be able to let it go, there is always the possibility that she will never forgive him for this. Only time will heal this. He has apologized, and it just takes time and he assured her that there are no more "secrets" We are both ok with this at this point.

The visual is a hard one to let go, especially in light of the fact that she has not seen him dressed yet. It is easily conceivable that once she sees him the visual will go away. The other issue is that since the visual was given third party, part of her is jealous that the friend saw him in this light before she did. We will come back to this at another session after she does him dressed.

From therapists talk with him, he is highly unlikely to want to transition nor is he gay or have any intentions of this. He may fall under the "Transgendered" political label but he is a crossdresser, nothing more. Trans means to move, gender means gender, transgender implies that he is moving to the other binary. He mislabeled himself as transgendered and now that it's clear that is not what he is, she feels better. His need to crossdress started around puberty and was a sexual stimulation, as a ceiling fan can be a sexual stimulation for a teenage boy. As he gets older the sexual need diminishes and is replaced by a anti anxiety, anti stress feeling. You may notice that when he doesn't dress his mood changes and slowly cycles up, until he dresses and has that "release" at that release (which is him now dressed) he is much calmer, the anxiety melts away and his stress levels lowers. This is the same as her anxiety issues, which she utilizes xanax, that feeling of anxiety ratchets up until she takes the xanax then 1/2 hour later, everything is ok. Crossdressing for him is a way to deal with stress and anxiety. She TOTALLY GETS THIS via this comparison now! WooT!

Acceptance comes with intellectual and physiological knowledge, with the above being addressed she feels like she understands more how and why he does this, she understands it's genetic and it's something that can't be cured short of being on high doses of thorazine. (Not happening)

Well today he wants to underdress tomorrow he wants to fully dress what's next? This is a slippery slope! often referred to as Pink Fog. He has to be very mindful of the pink fog and know his boundaries and limitations, therapist has seen many marriages wracked due to the pink fog. the guy buys tons of clothes makeup and accessories despite the mortgage not being paid. (Example, not me) This is very important and must always be on his mind to avoid overstepping or pushing for one more thing. Most act in an almost childlike way of give a little take a mile. He and She completely understand this as they have three kids.

He was finally able to explain what "more once in a while" was instead of "I don't know" Underdressing is a regular thing, the more once in a while is fully dressing with her. The reason he doesn't know what it will lead to is before her, fully dressing was purely a sexual thing, for role playing with an ending of sex. With her, it isn't like that, and he just wants to "be" with her. She understands more, but we will need to come back to this at another session.

How to set compromises and boundaries - He and she will draw up what we want. He will be mindful that she married her man and not to ever lose focus of that and once lines are drawn, that's where they are. no extensions no just this one time... she will also make accommodating recommendations. From this they will come up with something in the next few weeks before our next session.

Overall we both left there feeling very good about the entire situation and are almost embracing our time tonight to discuss this fully. (I started feeling sick by the time we left, unrelated, bad food) Overall I'm very glad we decided to see the therapist as she was able to reiterate things I told her and my friend with a medical degree to back up her statements. I also was able to finally figure out exactly what I was confused about what else is there.

She's on her way home now and said she is ready to talk about where we go next. She said she's now positive that this is in no way a deal breaker for her, and she is going to try very hard to embrace my feminine side. (She said embrace, rather than accept so I'm pretty happy right now :-D)

[PaulaQ]

This is really positive news Jenni. Thanks for sharing this, I know it's hard.

[bobbimo]

Great news Jenni,
Why not ask her to help you with your make-up, or pick an outfit, or your hair.
Let her see Jenni develop instead of springing it on her.
Its more fun that way too.
Bobbi

[Jenni Yumiko]

Since I had a few pm's
It's been all quiet on the Western Front.
Kids are on spring break and wife has new job so we are at home, so not much has happened in the past week.
We haven't had time to set compromises and boundaries yet. We figure we will do that after she has "seen me". Still a scary thought considering every time up to now something or another has happened resulting in a no reveal.

[Ellanore G.G.]

If its any consultation, When i first seen my H
I was shocked at how soft his face looked, and shocked too,
at how well he done make up.
But deep down I just seen him, for the beautiful person he is.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Yesterday we decided today would be the big day. No makeup, no wig, no forms. Jeans Tshirt and heels. I have been so nervous last night that I bummed a couple smokes off my cousin. This morning I took a bath got dressed, woke her up and showed her me.

Her first question. "What size are you?" Small top, 2 pants they are baggy, 7 feet.
Uchhh, I want your body. <-- not sure if this will be an issue.
After that she was pretty meh over the whole thing. She said she needed time to digest it all, came over to me hugged me and said she loves me and we will be together regardless, just not sure if I can see you like this. But at the same time I don't want you to do this via private time because ill feel like I'm missi g out on a big part of you.
So it's out, I'm still shaking and gotta get back en drab so the kids can find their eggs.

[Beverley Sims]

Jenni,
I just keep watching this post with interest and pleasure.
I am glad to see the progres you are making, just remember, don't trip over and smother her.

[bobbimo]

Yea Jenni!
Thats so wonderful, that you finnaly got the chance to break the ice, and the future is looking much brighter.
You have a great wife too. Give her a big hug and kiss from all of us.
Bobbi

[LelaK]

Nice gradual coming out clothes. You're doing a service to the rest of us with your log, but I'm concerned about the drugs, even though they have doctor approval. You need a second opinion about them from outside of allopathic medicine.

I recommend Dr. Mercola's articles on Xanax and pyschotropic drugs at https://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Amercola.com+xanax and https://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Amercola.com+psychotropic and Dr. Anne Blake-Tracy's website: drugawareness.org (http://drugawareness.org). Common side effects include memory loss, mood disorder, lethargy, liver and kidney damage etc. See Dr. Mercola for articles on nutritional support for anxiety etc, such as here: https://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Amercola.com+anxiety
(https://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Amercola.com+anxiety).

[Mindy More]

Definitely some big steps forward on both sides :thumbsup: . Hopefully she'll want to see the whole you (makeup wig forms) so she can see where your at.

Things are progressing very well :)

[TeresaCD]

Good to hear it's going ok. Gentle steps, at least the door is open..

[Maria in heels]

Its great that you had your reveal, I have been just reading your updates as they came along...You both have come such a long way.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Negotiations begun. I feel like its the Versailles treaty or something. Hopefully this will quell a lot of the minor bickering.
Her initial compromise. (She wants to know what I have to rebuttle with)
Underdressing ok, as long as its, under and the kids can't see. (Exception is bottoms) our youngest sees that
Clothes, she will go out or something and give me time to do that. (Seems kinda on the spot planned to me)
Use of a transformation service - go with one of your accepting girlfriends, I don't want to go. (That's a loaded statement if there ever was. If I were to go with one of my friends who know and don't care, I think she would have a huge fit. One in particular, my ex gf)
Heels - not around her
Makeup - not around her. I don't really have any to wear
Wig - not around her. I don't own one anymore

My rebuttle
Painted toes ok?
Jeans ok? More than 1/2 my jeans are girl jeans, I won't wear the overly girlie ones though. Destroyed with leopard underneath the holes.
Ok to any underdressing
Ok to no shoes
Ok to no makeup or wig.

She said she's not ready for all of me, in the future maybe it won't matter as much, but right now it does.
Obviously once we set these compromises, I won't push anymore, I'm pretty flexible. I do like my jeans though.

[Mindy More]

Accepting girlfriends can also mean someone from this site. I have alot of girlfriends these days and sometimes my wife wonders if I'm talking about gg's or cd/tg girls, usually the ladder.

[TeresaCD]

Progress is progress.
Glad she can see it's really important to you , and that there's a way forward

[Jenni Yumiko]

I haven't met anyone on here and I doubt I ever will, well I take that back, there is one who offered to help with makeup... The girlfriends I speak of are all gg's, one is the ex who knows me since high school, the other prolly my best friend, and one more who knows a lot about me and a long time also.

[bobbimo]

It sounds like your making good progress Jenni!
When you feel the moment might be right, ask her to help you pick out a dress or skirt. Maybe when she goes clothes shopping you can go along and get her opinion on a skirt you like. Its a lot more fun to do this CD thing if you have someone to share it with, and maybe she will be able to understand she is gaining a new girlfriend, and not losing her husband.
Bobbi

[mona lisa]

I like the sandals and your toenails look lovely, Jennialy :)

Any more news on the "Versailles treaty negotiations" front?

[Jenni Yumiko]

Met with therapist yesterday. Had quite a few eye openers on my side.
Wife got some good valid reasons why she should not be DADT.

The speed I which this came out and the fact that I felt the need to put it all out there at once seems to be fed by the fact that I feel likeim going to die by the time I'm 50. Long story, but due to family history, its a constant source of anxiety for me.

Wife is still concerned that I will want more and more as time progresses. I repeated I'm fine with who I am. She seems to be getting that now.

My wants or desire todo things with her rather than my two or three GG friends who know and are accepting is an issue for me. While she told me it was ok to do a makeover or go shopping or be dressed with them, it's not what I want, I want to do these things with my wife, or Milla jovovich. She feels like she can't do that, or want to be part of that. ,therapist said, she doesn't have to be fully accepting to do those things, just tolerant, and that its great that I want to share this exclusively with her.
We are definitely having quality us time issues due to our frantic schedules. Mainly with the kids activities. Our therapist came up with one person picks one week the other person picks the next week a getaway of at least a couple hours a week where its just wife and myself. We could really use it.
In terms of our Versailles treaty we ended up with any underdressing is ok as long as the older kids can't see it. (No problems there)
More than half the week I need to be guy mode. Four of seven days. She married a guy, she wants her guy. No problems there either. Every weekend can't be girlie underdressing, even it out.
Women's jeans are ok, as long as they aren't colorful. (I only own blue jeans, high spandex content ones)
Tops are still kinda meh.
If I want to wear a dress or heels, for the time being it has to be when she's not around.
I am not to ever wear hose or thigh highs with sandals or open toes again as its a fashion mistake!
Clothing comes out of my hobby budget - 500 a month. (Mostly on Hockey/PB stuff, which I don't really see me denting much)
At some point she wants to help pick out what I wear cause my girl fashion tastes are as bad as my guy fashion tastes (jeans tshirts flannel)

I think it's no longer a big source of stress for both of us, and that we both seem to be more aware of unsaid boundaries.
I did have a couple aha moments, one with me dying and another about my mean, confrontational alpha male self and how to work those in my head. Also found out really what my wife's anxiety is like. I feel bad for her, I would hate to have panic issues. I think I can help her with that and be more sympathetic to what she is going through.
We also agreed to have no electronics time. With me being a tech junkie, I'm always reading white papers, blogs, work etc... After 7pm, they need to go off and not looked at.
Next appointment is in three weeks, we shall see how it goes!

[TeresaCD]

Some good news there Jen, glad to see!

[kimdl93]

It seems that the two of you have come a long way in a short time. Your therapist has apparently been a great help in sorting out issues and helping attain reasonable accommodations of each others needs.

[boink]

It sounds like you are both making some really good progress and thinking about some pretty serious stuff. Keep at it!

[Jenni Yumiko]

Just a couple updates:
Now she wants to go to a transformation service with me and my friend... That should be interesting to say the least, thinking maybe for my birthday in a couple months.
She bought me some more "tasteful clothes" a few VS tops that definitely girlie but do no look like I'm either my daughters age, or my moms age. LoL
Trying to get some us time thoughts proving to be very difficult with our schedules :-(
Our days are not surrounded by talks on crossdressing anymore which is great, back to regular talks about mortgage, how much we owe in taxes, who's picking up who from skating and who's going downstate for cheer... I think I liked it better when we were discussing dressing...

[kimdl93]

Honestly, this is a better place. She's obviously showing greater acceptance and if you both take a comfortable pace, eventually one would hope that dressing can be routine...not something you need to talk about.

[JenniferR771]

Whoops! For years my wife has been looking through my history every morning before I got up. I knew this. She knows about my hobby but is not supportive. She sees the title of each thread I click on. And I accused her of never reading any of the threads and not appreciating of how normal we are, in reality. Well today she read this thread and my post!
"You want domineering. I will SHOW you domination. You guys are just a bunch of whiners, and always think of yourselves, without considering what your wives go through!" ...at high volume. [Hold on she's on the phone...I am back.] Of course, she also saw my avatar, but I think she has seen that before.
She claims she never threw out any of my shet. She insists that I keep all my stuff in my outdoor garden shed. But she has insisted I throw out some of my stuff from time to time. So how come I cannot find my wedding dress; how could I lose something that big in 6 by 8 shed? Of course, some mice made a nest in the hem--but it hardly showed--a few holes in the lace were barely visible. I am lucky I still have my spare wedding dress (its short). And what about the French maid's costume outfit?

[TeresaCD]

That's true, Jennie, 'normal' life and conversations can seem a little bland, (in a good way!)
Glad it's going well.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Nothing really to report, a lot of other issues seem to be ruling our life now.
One thing I have noticed is that while I now have a ton of clothes, it kinda sux not being able to wear them with her. Dressing up for myself seems to be "too much work" I need some kind of human interaction I guess. This does not mean in any way shape or form that I want to head out and go shopping or hit the bars or what not, just enjoy the company of my wife while in Jen/Michelle/girl mode.
I do wear girl jeans when the kids aren't around, but with summer fast approaching, we will be having kids either in the house or outside playing 24/7 which will make it a little difficult. I did pick up some gym shoes that I think will be kinda androgynous, since I needed new cycling shoes anyway. Didn't go all out and buy some Shimanos or Sidis, but these sketchers - http://www.skechers.com/style/21139/bikers-verified#Color=GYLB figured I could use them for biking and Zumba.
We still seem to have a physical disconnect that I can't put my finger on, I have asked her and she said she's just tired. I don't know. I am a little concerned if she is distancing in perpetration of leaving me. I tend to get a little pessimistic about these things. I'm sure I'm over reacting but its been nagging me for a while. :-(

[Jenniferathome]

...
We still seem to have a physical disconnect that I can't put my finger on, I have asked her and she said she's just tired. I don't know. I am a little concerned if she is distancing in perpetration of leaving me. I tend to get a little pessimistic about these things. I'm sure I'm over reacting but its been nagging me for a while. :-(

Are you two talking about your cross dressing and her fears/concerns about it? I find that just talking about it can act just like dressing int hat it is stress relief.

[Jenni Yumiko]

@jennifer, no not really, real life has really gotten in the way.
But on the plus side I figured out how to get her to agree to go to a transformation service with me!
Buy her a car :-)
I picked her up a Toyota Highlander Hybrid today for Mother's Day, and her response was ok, go ahead and make an appointment for you and ill go with!

Too bad her being ok with it came with a 40k price tag. :-(
Seriously though, she needed a new car, her Explorer was ready to be an Exploder. 75 bux to fill up the tank almost twice a week is just painful.

[PaulaQ]

I picked her up a Toyota Highlander Hybrid today for Mother's Day, and her response was ok, go ahead and make an appointment for you and ill go with!


Jenni, this is seriously good progress. That she's willing to do that is *huge*. It's worth 40K. :) I'm really glad the two of you are making progress. I know it's been a real struggle for your wife.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Heehee, I'm not really sure if she was caught up in the moment or that she is really ok with it, ESP since we haven't talked about it in a while, either way ill take it!

[kimdl93]

Jenni, are you and your wife in any sort of counseling? Your comment that you fear she might be distancing herself was a bit disconcerting. She may indeed be tired, or many other things besides pulling away emotionally. Don't let fears start planting ideas in your mind.

[Jenni Yumiko]

Yes we are Kim, its been pretty good so far in terms of counseling. We are on a summer break from counseling and for letting all we have discussed to "soak in". With summer comes 50,000 kids running around our house at all times since we have the "fun house" on the block. So my dress time will be very limited.

I have been wearing girl jeans almost exclusively now, with tshirts and bras. She's still not digging hugging me with a bra on and it makes her apprehensive and has caused a tactile distance with us, but its getting better as the days progress.
She doesn't mind me doing my nails, but again, summer + sandals = not really appropriate.
Haven't scheduled a transformation yet as our schedules are horribly hectic over the summer (you would think the opposite with no school activities) but not so much. Plus with paintball season fully underway, I don't like showing off a pb bruised body. (I currently have 14 bruises the size of quarters that will spread out before they go away and are replaced by more and more)
So in stasis is where I will be over summer.
The big plus is I work from home so i get to see the kids all day long. I say this now but by midway through summer I'm screaming give me some space!!!

[Jenni Yumiko]

She's filing for divorce.
Reason number 1 - our relationship has become platonic
Reason number 2 - she can't deal with a cross addressing husband.

Just thought I would post this as it goes to show you that women check out long before the husband has a clue.
Take heed and be well.

[tabby1975]

Im so sorry to hear that. I wish you the best of luck. I tried to tell my wife several years ago and it didnt go well. We are still together but i had to buy everything all over again cause she piled it up in the yard and set it on fire, so yet again im back in the closet. But remember you have a bunch of sisters here anytime you need support

[Stevie]

Sorry to hear that. Sounds like she made her decision long ago. Good luck

[Princess Grandpa]

Just read through this thread. I'm really sorry! So much sadness in our world *wipes her eyes*

This is my deepest fear that some months from now...

[Barbara Ella]

Jenni, I have been following this thread, and just came back to it. i am so very sorry to see this development. I often get the feeling that my wife is busting my butt to reno the house to get it ready for potential selling (retired), to remove the burden and so she can leave. Paranoid, maybe, but even with extensive talking, you never really know.

Stay strong.

Barbara

[Jenni Yumiko]

Thank you all for your concenr. Yeah it sux, I had no clue, she is staying at her moms, I had a very viscous verbal argument with her mom also, so I'm sure that sealed it. The mom pushed just enough buttons to send me over the edge, I didn't touch her, but I laid into her pretty bad. My soon to be ex holds her parents on a pedestal and I also found out that she told them about "Jen" which is just another reason why I won't go back to her. (I say this now, while I'm angry, I'm sure when I revisit this post some time later, I'll say the opposite)

Only plus is I have all the kids here. Not sure if I'm going to go for full custody this time around, cause she doesn't really do anything detrimental to our child's welfare, but I am the more attentive parent and the "mommy and daddy" in littlest ones eyes...

Trying to stay mad cause its easier than being sad and depressed.
When the kids are asleep, ill pound the crap outta my practice dummy to release my frustrations.

Sorry this post is all over the place, but I'm feeling pretty all over the place ATM.

[Princess Grandpa]

You have nothing to apologize for hun. *hug* if you need an ear I know there are many of us here happy to give a virtual shoulder. As I have read frequently here, once the cats out of the bag she can't be put back. Your going to need to be strong in the coming months.

I think you did the "right" thing. I'm so sorry it ended as it did

Hug
Rita
P.S. use the anger as you need but don't let it consume you. Or the kids
More hugs

[kimdl93]

wow, Jen, Im very sorry to read about your divorce. I was so surprised by the turn of events that I went back to the beginning to see if there were any signs. Not really, but of course your log couldn't record everything that transpired over 6 months. It seems that things turned in May, when you mentioned a physical disconnect from your wife...which she attributed to fatigue. I guess it wasn't fatigue afterall.

My advice at this point is to cool it. If you are heading towards divorce, as it appears, I'd recommend getting an attorney (assuming you haven't already) and start regular counseling sessions for yourself to deal with or at least prepare yourself for the pain and sadness that is likely to come. And if you have any hope of reconciling - or even if you don't, take every possible step to avoid any further conflict with your wife or her family. this can't help...and in fact, will only make it harder. Let your attorney do the talking.

[TeresaCD]

Just thought I would post this as it goes to show you that women check out long before the husband has a clue.
Take heed and be well.

Sorry to hear that, Jenni.
Tough road ahead, hang in there, girl

[Claire Cook]

Dear Jenni,

I'm just now catching up with all of this thread, and am so sorry to see how this has turned out. It seems as though the divorce came out of the blue and you had no idea it was coming. I get the impression from all of your posts that your wife has been back and forth in her feelings. I don't think you've mentioned her parents before, and perhaps much of the back and forth on her part came from discussions with them? It certainly sounds like they have played a major role in her decision.

Do consider Kim's advice, and thanks for sharing all of this with us.

[PaulaQ]

Hi Jen, I'm so sorry you are going through this, hon. I'd hoped things had turned for the better, not the worst for you two. :(
It is so unfortunate it comes down to this when you are only a CD. I'm feel bad for you and your kids.

[Beverley Sims]

Jenni,
I have been following your thread of course and this is a bolt out of the blue.
I can only say avoid conflict as this will worsen the situation and do not let the children get in the middle of the bun fight either.
Consider what they want and need.
I wish you the best in your eventual resolution.

[bobbimo]

OH NO!
I was so hoping this would turn out to be a happy experience for you guys.
I'm sorry Jenni. Maybe this will still work out. I know there are lots members that are keeping their fingers crossed and saying thier prayers for you.
Bobbi

[suchacutie]

I just finished reading your postings all the way through, as I had lost track of the details since your May post, so when I read you two most recent posts my jaw dropped. I'm so sorry that everything you've both worked for has turned sour. My only hope is that the stark reality of separation overwhelms the negativity that currently exists. We all wish you the best.

tina

[Jenni Yumiko]

Spent he last two weeks in the hospital for my Crohns and other ailment.
During said time, my wife wouldn't leave, despite my protests.
We talked a lot about everything, lack of electronics and outside influences helped with our communication.
The cding wasn't really the root issue, more so other factors in our life and the general disposition of myself lately.
We are together still, when I got home, I showed her everything in had and we piled them in three piles.
Keep, amvets, toss.
As long as I communicate more, am less of a jackass and even out girl/boy time, I'm allowed to wear pretty much anything sans shoes, makeup/ wig now.

[kimdl93]

Wow...this has been a real roller coaster for both of you. If there's a way to manage it, I would work on calm and collected...focus on healing yourself and your relationship. Let the future take care of itself. The present seems a good deal better than it was a few weeks ago.

[bobbimo]

YEAAAAA!
Glad to hear that you guys are still together, and that communications still works!
I believe that if you share Jenni with your wife, she may begin to enjoy having her around, and you need to share your boy part too. Enjoy the ride. When it becomes Overwhelming, then its time to take a break and find out whats really happening. Ie CD/TG/TS.
Bobbi

[TonyaV]

Jen - I have read all of your entries in this thread. I am very happy things are currently on the positive up-swing. But, I want to warn you "PROCEED WITH CAUTION". One thing I realized from all of your comments, is that it appears not only your wife "wears the pants" in your relationship (which is fine if you like it that way), but she now has what I like to call "THE OPTION", and that is totally different from wearing the pants. The One with the Option is the One who controls just about anything in a relationship.

I had a strong sense you're in a troubled relationship very early in your posts. I do believe she's still planning her exit, though. I really want to be proven wrong, but I speak from my own experience (I was lucky to have a good therapist who coached me well). Jen - it's time you play smart. If you love your wife and want to stay with her, you have to figure out a way to take the "OPTION" away from her. Otherwise, you have no control over anything that goes on in the relationship. She has you by the balls, and she knows it. I am going to be blunt here - If I were to guess, when things dried-up between you two, she probably had an affair with someone else, thinking she wanted a real man, and wanted a divorce. But then, for some other reason, she slowed things down. Maybe she found out he's married. All I know is I think you should be careful.

Good Luck to you!

[MysticLady]

She's filing for divorce.

Reason number 2 - she can't deal with a cross addressing husband.

Just thought I would post this as it goes to show you that women check out long before the husband has a clue.
Take heed and be well.

Jen, I'm so sorry to hear of this. But, I believe the main reason is #2. Her insecurity has gotten the best of her. If it was anything else, she would have lived w/ it as part of life. It's going to be hard to let her go. I know, I'm fast approaching my divorce, I believe. I'm afraid, that my wife will be the one suffering after our marriage dissolvment. It will be by her choice that she decides too suffer emotionally for the rest of her life.

[TonyaV]

I agree with MysticLady....

[kimdl93]

One of the problems with a long lived post like this is that people can't keep up with developments. Jenn and her wife have reached an epiphany in just the past few posts. There's not much benefit in rehashing events that have since been superseded.

[Polka Dot]

Jenni,

It seems like things are looking up for you now, make sure to take care of yourself after your hospital stay. Try and stay positive about your situation. Good luck!

[DanaGirl]

Im not sure why your not allowed to wear a wig or makeup. I know when my girl and I started getting into CD it began with some shaved legs and stuff like that, then one night she did my makeup then I went in the other room and put on a wig and got dressed, when I came back she said she really thought I looked beautiful. lets be honest here without the makeup and a wig she will never see you as Jenni , you will always just be a guy in girls clothes.

I think maybe she should see you as Jenni, perhaps exposing your inner self to her like that will be a bonding experience for both of you.

then again you have been seeing therapist that are trained so what do I know.

[Jenni Yumiko]

With the addition of makeup/wigs it crosses the "its just clothes" line that she is trying to get comfortable with.
From my perspective, the wigs and makeup are a lot of work, that can be better spent on other things. Once in a great while ill go all out, but really not that often.

[MatildaJ.]

lets be honest here without the makeup and a wig she will never see you as Jenni , you will always just be a guy in girls clothes.

What's wrong with being a guy who wears girls' clothes?

[MysticLady]

With the addition of makeup/wigs it crosses the "its just clothes" line that she is trying to get comfortable with.
From my perspective, the wigs and makeup are a lot of work, that can be better spent on other things.

Hi Jenn, I see you're still dealing w/ the Mrs. on this. It's work ain't it:heehee: They are problematic, are they not? Tell her, too let go of the "Mental Blocks". It'll make her life much easier. I told mine. We'll see if she listens to me:straightface:

At least, the emotions have faded from our talks and that in itself, is so much nicer:D

[Stevie]

Glad you are having some positive things going for you now. Just remember to take care of your health.

[Polka Dot]

I can totally understand her wanting to have some boundaries until she gets more comfortable with this whole situation. During my progression (long before I had anyone in my life) there were several different "lines" that I couldn't bring myself to cross. One of those was buying shoes. In my mind, having girl shoes was a huge leap from just wearing a skirt or nylons. Another line was boobs. I was fine wearing a bra, but to my mind once there were breasts inside that was a whole different story. Now I have several pairs of both silicone forms and heels.

Take it slow with your wife, and let her get comfortable at each stage. In this way, you will both follow this journey together, and that way she will feel more like a partner that just an outside observer.

Good luck! :D

[Julie Gaum]

Rather than add my two cents to an almost 6-month diary with considerable advice offered, I'd like to address the GI problems as I've had about sixty years experience starting with IBS and in the last few years ulcerated colitis. The Crohn's, as you probably already know, is an extension further into the intestines of the ulcer problem. Most of my treatment has been with VA facilities now in Florida and previously in Washington state (where U. Of W. hospital interns spend some of their time at the VA hospitals) and before that in many other states in my travels. Yes, I'm leading up to something after being long-winded here: At the VA clinic they have a large sign where the GI docs practice that in big letters reads, "Avoid Stress" the most important contributor to colitis and Crohn's --- I know, a lot easier said than to do especially when you have been in high stress conditions for some time now. How you can go about reducing stress is a problem met with some success through both certain mental and physical activities. In addition you may not be aware that there is a national Crohn Institute that connects you on a monthly or weekly basis with a paid worker (paid by them as it's a free service) who provides literature and one-on-one advice. If you need further information on that service kindly PM me. In conclusion, most of my related problems have been conquered along with a few meds to maintain better health.
Hope I've been of some value.
Julie

[Jenni Yumiko]

Yes the ups and downs and the "dragging this out" kills me inside, I would rather it all out done and fixed in a tidy little package, but that isn't going to happen. :-(

Julie - I also have had a long history of stomach issues, IBS, diverticulosis, Ulcer and now Crohns.
I really didn't think I had more stress than the person next to me or any anxiety issues, but boy was I wrong.

Indeed to get this out, this was a really crappy year, anything that could have gone wrong with the family did, I was also diagnosed with Crohns. To keep the Crohns in check, I had a temporary resection to help the inflamed part heal, I was also put on an anti depressant to keep my stress down. After the intestine headed and I was unsectioned, they took me off the anti depressant, abruptly. I went through withdrawal and severe emotional clouding. When I wrote that my wife did a 180 and said she couldn't deal with it anymore, it was via text and I skimmed the long text and picked out that statement. (I know now the entire contents of that text and her statement was if I didn't love you, I wouldn't be here and I wouldn't take all of it) So, armed with that, all the crap that had happened this year, and coming off an anti depressant abruptly, it got in my head that life wasn't worth it. I downed a bottle of pain medication and for a few seconds thought **** it. A few minutes later I came to my senses and attempted to throw up the bottle. I counted about 50 or so pill parts in the toilet. Not good, the bottle had 90. I called my friend who in turn called 911, which in turn gave me a two week stay in the hospital under medical supervision.
I'm still in the hospital for 6 hours a day for outpatient therapy. There have been a ton of things going wrong for me this year, but one thing I will say is that my wife has been by my side this whole time and even of she didn't get or couldn't accept the crossdressing, I would stay with her anyway for the above reasons. Our whole family has since been in group therapy also (part of the post stay regiment) and while I'm pretty close to my kids, we are very very close now. I have a better understanding as to why I am the way I am in terms of the quick hostilities, the whole overcompensating my male side, talking and showing emotion, and our family is doing much better. My son and daughter were like me, never expressing their emotions or opening up to the crappy things that happen, we are now talking daily even after therapy about ourselves how we feel and how things are going in our lives.

A lot of my lifelong actions, demeanor, and feelings stem from the inner Jenni that has just been recently fully realized. While I don't think I would ever be at this point of self actualization nor emotional openness to my family without this experience, I don't recommend it as a route to go by any means.

I do thank God that I came to my senses, and honestly am kinda glad that I was taken of the antidepressant cold turkey. If the cessation symptoms weren't there, I would still be the same stereotypical alpha male I was 6 months ago.

This post. Will probably disappear, but it felt good to get it all out publicly. :-)

[Mindy More]

Quite a Road you've traveled on Jenni. You still have many miles to cruise on, hope all continues to be positive

[Diversity]

So glad to hear of your update. Sounds like your wife is open to further consideration and I'll bet concessions. She obviously loves you as she is willing to read more about CD'ing and what level you wish to explore for yourself. You are on the right path, and the best thing you can do is to keep honest and open conversations with her just as you have been doing. I wish you both my best for a successful outcome. If further concessions are given, I'd stronly suggest that you take things very slowly to allow your wife time to adjust to this 'new' you. Best wishes to you both.
Di

[Jenni Yumiko]

So I have been in post stay group therapy for about a month now, I gave the group my whole story including the transgendered parts so now I have two of the women in there hitting on me quite a bit, sad that if I knew how many were accepting now back en I probably would have actively looked for a woman who was pro cding. I think though the biggest thing was finding out. I have a genetic mutation that directly relates to my depression and stomach issues.
On the cding front, my wife just got a Mac makeover and a good grand worth of new makeup for her new look that I have been applying on her daily (I'm her makeup artist now I guess) while it is fun and we are connecting a lot more on the girl thing front, I do kinda wish it went both ways. I hinted at it and she wasn't very receptive... Baby steps right?

[Tina_gm]

Hi Jenni, I have lurked here for a while and just joined. One of the threads I have followed is this one. I am not a creeper, promise. I have followed it because we revealed to our wives at a similar time, and your wife sounds similar to mine in terms of how she has felt and is coping. You and I seem to be on a somewhat parallel path. And yes, baby steps really is so key to keeping our marriage healthy. What seems agonizingly slow to us probably feels like turbo boost for them. You are lucky as am I that we have wives who are still with us. How we respect our wives and give them the time they need to incorporate this, which is a large yield nuke being dropped on them is a key to a successful relationship. It is a learning curve for those of us who have revealed after the vows. compromise is key, and remembering that any acceptance of cding for our wives is a compromise in of itself.

[Christina Kay]

Wow, I am glad jennialy . That things are at progressing at baby steps. Having yet to broach the full subject with my wife. I am hoping with baby steps to let her see my other side through. A more gentle and caring spouse , we have always been great friends , but the cd thing frightens her. Glad you shared this with us. I can only wish the best for you, and all of us in this situation.. Once again jennialy thank you for sharing. Hugs

[Tina_gm]

Aretha, can I suggest to you you that the layered approach or the gently easing her into it approach will not work. I tried that and did not make anything any better. Perhaps worse. Little comments, started some body shaving.... Maybe deep down the SO's will put 2x2 together... but believe me, if we can deny our own selves, don't think for a minute that they won't make up any excuse in their head to justify that this is anything other than transgenderism or even the most simplest of crossdressing.

By the time I had the talk I felt I had softened the blow. Was I ever wrong! still a major quake for her. How could she not know by now?? Thinking back she did see all the signs, but in their minds they will not recognize because they don't want it to. BTW, this is not meant for putting down women by any means, hell, I did the same to myself. I gave myself every excuse as to why I desired women's clothing and to be feminine.... anything and everything but actually being that way.

There is no real easing into it. She may or may not have it figured out what is going on, probably not as you say the idea of crossdressing frightens her. But It does for a large majority of women, so you are far from alone.

[Christina Kay]

Thank you gendermutt, I really appriciate the advice. One day THAT day and conversation will happen. Still don't know how, or what is the right way,,,alas confusion still reigns. Thanks again hugs. :)

[Tina_gm]

yw Aretha, I dont have the answers, but know from others plus my own experience that the gradual approach doesn't work even though on paper it sounds like a no brainer