Strange question

[Cheyenne Skye]

I have a question aimed at any MtF who is an avid runner. I've been running pretty steady for the past 25 years. There is a local 5k coming up in June that I've run nearly every year since I started running. I want do it again this year, but I have a bit of a quandary. Besides the fact that most of the local running community knows me as a male, I need advice on what to put on the entry form- M or F. In the past, I've usually finished in the top 10-15 in my age group (as male). I'll be on hormones about 8 months by the time of the race. I'm afraid if I register as male and I finish high enough to get an age group award, it could be kind of awkward going up to the stage looking more female than male. And conversely, if I register as female, there is a very high chance that I would also win an age group award. But I would feel guilty in that case because I would feel that I had an unfair advantage since I am genetically male. Any suggestions?

[jillleanne]

You answered your own question. You are still genetically male. Lot's of people take hormones; that in itself does not make anyone male or female. Have fun.

[Badtranny]

8 months of HRT is not enough to allow that yet. As long as you have testicles, you're a dude, man. The in-between stage of transition is a tough time and you've still got a ways to go. I was still using men's restrooms at 8 months LOL

[AllieSF]

Jilleanne, I have to disagree with part of your statement. If she is taking hormones and says she is female, she is. She won't become a female just because she takes hormones. She is in transition. That being said, now she is really just trying to figure out if now is the time to start coming out as she starts that transition.

Cheyenne, it really depends if you are ready to come out now publicly. If yes, then own it, and if necessary explain it to the race officials and answer any questions honestly and let them deal with. If not, then don't say anything. If your hair is longer now and you other very visible feminine features that are new, then I recommend that you just go up there receive your award and let people think what they want to think. Some may notice the changes wonder about the changes and may even ask you about them. Just have a few answers that you are comfortable using in a reply. Good luck in the race and your transition.

[Xrys]

I think the answer is simple. Put what is on your licence on the form. If you can have a F on your licence, you can put F on evrything else too. that is my thoughts at least.

[ColleenA]

Not really a strange question at all. Issues surrounding transgender athletes have been popping up for the past few decades. The International Olympic Committee has been one group at the forefront of these issues.

The following comes from the link "outlining very specific rules" in the article "Rules Put Extreme Pressure On Transsexual Players" available at http://www.ontheissuesmagazine.com/2012spring/2012spring_Pieper.php:

(All italicizing done by me)
"On 28 October 2003, an ad-hoc committee convened by the IOC Medical
Commission met in Stockholm to discuss and issue recommendations on the
participation of individuals who have undergone sex reassignment (male to
female and converse) in sport. ...

The group recommends that individuals undergoing sex reassignment from
male to female after puberty (and the converse) be eligible for participation in
female or male competitions, respectively, under the following conditions:

- Surgical anatomical changes have been completed, including external
genitalia changes and gonadectomy

- Legal recognition of their assigned sex has been conferred by the
appropriate official authorities

- Hormonal therapy appropriate for the assigned sex has been
administered in a verifiable manner and for a sufficient length of time to
minimize gender-related advantages in sport competitions.

In the opinion of the group, eligibility should begin no sooner than two years
after gonadectomy.

It is understood that a confidential case-by-case evaluation will occur."

Of course, you're not trying out for the Olympics. However, their rules are among the few that have been quantified to date, so they might be considered to establish reasonable standards.

[Megan Thomas]

I'm not a runner but I do take hormones and they do reduce muscle mass and overall strength, which would surely affect your performance if the same is true of you?

[Nicole Erin]

Probably the license thing. Or you could say you haven't had it changed yet ;)
For "if you have testicles, you are a dude, man" thing - I don't think anyone is going to be checking are they?

[mikiSJ]

Why not call the race committee for advice? You, or someone you know, could do it anonymously.

[Badtranny]

It's pretty simple really Cheyenne, when you've legally changed your gender, you can start entering competitions as a woman.

I know a few very competitive women who would raise 4 kinds of heck if they got beat by somebody with a full basket of tackle. I think trying to cheat the system just makes us look bad. 8 months on HRT is not near enough to mitigate your athletic advantage.

[Rianna Humble]

The way I read the original post, Cheyenne's quandary stems from the fact that she feels she might have an unfair advantage if she competes as a female, but 8 months into her treatment would not feel comfortable competing as a male. It seems to be compounded by the real possibility that she might win an award in the male category but that she would be dressed according to her true gender, not her natal sex.

I'm not sure how accusing her of trying to "cheat the system" is meant to help her to resolve the quandary.

It seems to me that the most helpful advice has been to talk to the race organisers and explain the quandary. Although the quote about the International Olympic Committee will almost certainly help Cheyenne to prepare for the sorts of questions that the race organisers might have.

Cheyenne, I cannot offer you any better advice than that, but if it is mainly the award that is worrying you, would it be possible to suggest to the organisers that it not be presented quite so publicly?

--
Rianna (writing as a member not as a moderator)

[Cheyenne Skye]

Thank you,Rianna. That is what I was getting at.

[jillleanne]

Jilleanne, I have to disagree with part of your statement. If she is taking hormones and says she is female, she is.

Unfortunately, not legally anywhere I know of. And that becomes the issue here. Being in transition is hard enough, but getting legal status change as M or F cannot come about simply by taking 'mones' for 8 months. I understand that the running the race is not the issue but rather, IF she wins something, does she qualify for the win? Only the organizers can answer that. If I were a genetic female and I finished second, I'd be pissed if I found out a male in transition won my catagory. In my opinion, if you are carrying a hat rack in the race, you are competing as a male, regardless of how you feel inside.

[Deborah_UK]

Are you living F/T or are you still presenting in the main as a male?

I didn't start using the red tees until I went full time

[Kaitlyn Michele]

on one level how can we not be supportive of one of us that is going through this...as allie says, we all know that Cheyenne is who she is and we know the difficulties of feeling misgendered..

however (the big however!!), lets have some common sense people!!!!! unfortunately she is not legally female and if allie's assertion were the rule, anyone could inject a hormone in their body, say they are female and that would be that...
this stuff is a highly charged issue in track and field...masculine women are always paid alot of attention....

if it was me..I would not have tried to compete as female during month 8 or even month 16 of my pre RLT transition.......
and during RLT i would be doing EVERYTHING possible to have a good quality of life, i would not get into scrapes about which locker room to go to, and if an event like this caused me stress and distress i would skip it for a year because who needs that crap

...i would look to my future and set it as my goal to complete my transition and then compete...some things are worth waiting for..some things are not worth fighting for...

i get the theoretical discussion...its a pretty gray area... but why go there at all..in the large scheme of things Cheyenne i would consider your ultimate goal and weigh whatever you decide about this race in the grand scheme of things...but i would urge you to consider how you would feel if this became a big mess or if it turned out to be a bad experience for you during a vulnerable time...i can be accused of being too conservative about transition, but that's just me...transition is job 1....everything should be weighed against how it can impact transition..

[melissaK]

Stop RUNNING. Simple.

(Really, I have freaking tri-atheetes all over in my family - sponsored professional ones even, and I don't understand the affinity for self punishment.:bonk: Makes being TS seem sane! :heehee: )( And I know we aren't insane so don't start with me on that word choice)

[Rianna Humble]

I'm afraid I have to disagree with the last two posters. Whilst we should not let anything detract from the transition and what we need to accomplish for that, I feel it is very destructive not to continue other interests.

Cheyenne has a passion for running and obviously feels that she is good enough at doing that to continue with it as one of her "outside" interests. For her, I believe that continuing with the running will be a very healthy outlet.

I do agree, that she is not far enough down the line to compete as a woman - hard as that might seem, but there is still the other side of the question that the majority of replies seem to ignore - what happens if she wins an award in her age category and natal sex? I can't come up with a better idea than the one I have already shared, but surely it should not be impossible for us to collectively come up with a few suggestions for Cheyenne to consider?

[Nigella]

Having followed this thread, my simple response is

Continue participating in the activity you so enjoy, register as your current "legal" gender, but why run for the competition, run for the fun

[PretzelGirl]

I am going to take this another way. Why not run as you apparently really want to? Register as male, which I am presuming is what is on your license. When you are done, step back and watch or go home. If you qualify, it sounds like getting up on stage is what is causing you concern. So pass on it. You might go a year or two passing on the stage depending on your transition plans. But you can still enjoy the run.

[Melissa Rose]

Since the concern is about recognition of your finish place in a specific group, politely refuse the recognition. Perhaps discuss it with the race organizers before hand and ask to be ignored in the standings. This would negate the worry about which gender to use for registration. In other words, you would disqualify yourself from "winning", but still be able to run as your desired gender. If you do not want to reveal your gender situation to the organizers, you can slow down on purpose to avoid having one of the better times, but that may go against your competitive spirit.