Going to Church Dressed

[Lisa Marie]

Has anyone in here ever gone to church dressed up? Im a catholic and have thought about trying it. What does everyone else think? Angela

[Lacamas]

You should talk to your pastor first.
If they are okay with it, go for it.

I came out to my local pastor a few months ago.

He suprised me big time in accepting what i am going thru and doing.

I have had some problems with a few of the members, with them talking behind my back.
But like everything else the 15min of fame is over and they have moved on.

[Darlene Rochelle]

My church would probably beel cool with it, I go to a Very liberal United Methodist Church with about a 50% gay/lesbian membership. Our pastor is AWESOME,she would embrace ANYONE!

[BeckyCath]

I have started going to a United Reform Church congregation in Oxford (uk) and there are only a handful of people who know i am TS, the minister is lovely and is really inclusive and accepting, she's fabulous...
Apparently i've been accepted as a woman, as the minister tells me people have been asking who the new tall woman is...
I was also asked by one of the other women what my husband did... so i guess i have passed.

I wouldn't think the catholic church would go a bundle on a TG person turning up for sunday mass given their phobic stance on GLBT issues!

No one at my church knows me as anyone other than Rebecca, and i think that has helped to be honest...

Rebecca

[KathrynW]

My vote is NO, absolutely NOT.
There's a time & place to cd. Church is not it.

[Denise01]

I would love to be able to go to church as a Lady. I live in a very small village, and I would probably have to go 50 miles or so to go to a church where I was not known.

I agree chat with your minister and if he or she is happy with it do it.

If it is your desire to go to a new church, and the first time as a Lady, I think it is also a positive step that the people know you only as the lady you are

Denise

[Christina Nicole]

I would not go to Mass dressed as a woman. The Catholic Church has no teaching regarding crossdressing. I have looked though the Catechism and cannot find a thing. Now if crossdressing is an obsession that interferes with your life both earthly and spriritual, then that is a different matter. I also confessed crossdressing and was told by my priest that "That's not a sin." I said that "I thought so, but my wife disapproves, so ..." Which is yet another topic.

So, if it's not a sin, why not go dressed as a woman? Because if you don't pass 100% as a woman, you'd be distracting others from their worship, and that would probably at least be wrong, if not a sin. We do have a responsibility to act in a responsible fashion and to consider others in what we do.

Warmest regards,
Christina Nicole

[Vivian Best]

My vote is NO, absolutely NOT.
There's a time & place to cd. Church is not it.

Kathryn says it all in her post and I agree with her.:thumbsdn: I can think of thousands of places to go dressed before I would go to church. I go to a very fundamental church and would never do to go dressed.

Vivian:rose2:

[jo_ann]

lutheran maybe if it was discussed ahead of time. Catholics will probably ban you since the bible is against it technically from a passage. I remember once when I was a kid I was wearing my baseball cap because I didn't want to mess with my hair, and I actually had some 40's something women comment on how I wasn't dressed appropriately (who didn't work for the church).. I was shocked someone would say something to me. I mean I know it's nice to dress up for church, but don't judge me because one day I decide I don't want to.. probably the biggest reason why I'm a lutheran now, catholics are strict nutballs (no offense). you can never take the bible literally, it's the most story conflicting book ever written.

[TGMarla]

Hmmm....the Catholics might make you burn in Hell. And Hell can be a bit rough on the pantyhose.

I'd watch it.

[suchacutie]

I'm a life-long catholic. In most regions of the country, if you went to the earliest mass of the day, no one would notice if you were there as long as you don't wear inappropriate clothes or makeup. Don't go to your home parish dressed as you would be outed instantly, since patterns are noticed over time, but IMHO if you gave all the outward clues of being female (dress, walk, general body language, conservative makeup (but definately some makeup), cover your adam's apple with a turtleneck sweater, maybe even some lovely leather gloves in this weather) there is no way anyone would notice. This is especially so in the winter where you'd need a standard winter coat and boots that would stay on during mass, as would be the case for everyone else!

I can't see any way that crossdressing in itself is a sacremental issue. I would think that a catholic mass would be the easiest place to crossdress. Heck, it's often difficult to get anyone to even acknowledge your presence in mass for the 3 sec during the sign of peace! Head to some large city's cathedral and hit an early morning mass.

So...I just don't see the issue if you know you can pass generally and you act as anyone would. You know how to be a catholic...just remember that you would be a catholic woman. :)

just my humble opinion.

tina

[KathrynW]

So, if it's not a sin, why not go dressed as a woman?
Probably for the same reason you wouldn't walk into church wearing a devil costume and carrying a pitch fork. It's just not appropriate.;)

[Stlalice]

Angie,

Given the current position of the catholic church on LGBT issues I would probably not recomend that you go to your home church dressed unless you are 100% ready to be out and open about your status. That does not mean that you can't go to a church service dressed - in the St. Louis area one place that I can gaurantee a friendly reception is the Metropolitan Community Church of Greater St. Louis - MCCGSL is the first place that I went out in public as Alice and I've been going ever since. You can find information on our service times and location by going to www.mccgsl.org - for those of you outside the St. Louis area that would like to try an MCC try going to www.mccchurch.org and clicking on the find an MCC link. If you decide to try MCCGSL drop me a line and I'll try to be there to greet you personally. :angel:

[FionaAlexis]

I think it pretty much depends on why you are going to Church dressed?

If it's because you are TG, believe you are female and simply want to present as your self identified gender - then it sounds perfectly ok to me.

But if its because you'll get some adrenalin kick out of wearing your frillies in front the shocked and horrified choir or simply to challenge the Church elders - then I think that might be inappropriate.

Fiona xx

[CharleneCD]

I think it pretty much depends on why you are going to Church dressed?

If it's because you are TG, believe you are female and simply want to present as your self identified gender - then it sounds perfectly ok to me.

But if its because you'll get some adrenalin kick out of wearing your frillies in front the shocked and horrorified chior or simply to challenge the Church elders - then I think that might be inappropriate.

Fiona xx

I was going to say the same thing but Fiona summed it up perfectly.

[cathy b]

i'm with kathryn:mad:

[LeannL]

Well, I had to join the forum to respond to this thread.

I usually go to church dressed and have been doing it for the last several years. I agree with many of the comments already posted (both positive and cautionary). I go dressed as I feel that it represents an important part of me that I have to go before God to pray and worship as Leann. I admit that on more than several occasions I have asked the Lord to give me the insight to know why I am what/who I am. If you cannot go to church and keep you mind on the real purpose of going to church and not on the fact that you are dressed, then I would suggest that you should not dress.

I have been worried about being a spectacle at church. It has occurred only a couple of times. What happened each time was that there was a group of teenage girls who looked my way an inordinate number of times. If I felt that I was preventing people from doing what they (and I) have gone to church to do, I would not do it. The most worrisome parts of the mass considering being read are the sign of peace and communion. I have not had a problem at either. Nearly all people are not expecting someone to come to church crossdressed. So they are usually just not going to notice. If they do, then I suspect that they will figure that the person is a TS starting their RLT as crossdressing at church is unusual.

I can’t post a picture so I have to tell you that I can (now) usually go to the mall or the supermarket and not be read but it still happens. I am not tall but I am big boned, barrel chested and have a fairly large neck. So I am not a petite, cute little lady.

I would offer the following suggestions:

1) Go to a distant church – I usually go about 25 miles. Switch among several if you can.
2) Arrive just before mass starts so you can better select your location
3) Avoid crowded pews – especially teenage girls
4) Dress conservatively – I usually wear a suit or long skirt. Only about 25% of the time do I have a skirt that comes up to the knee. Conservative makeup is also in order.
5) Be prepared for the sign of peace. Don’t be assertive in your posture, smile, look into the other person’s eyes and speak softly. Singing helps to keep you voice loose and you can get the pitch up a little bit if you sing an octave higher than you usually do if you have to (I do).
6) When you go to communion, act like you belong there.
7) If you are uncomfortable moving in a crowd, stay and pray as everyone leaves.
8) If you are really comfortable, go to the coffee and donuts after mass:)

So, go to church dressed if you feel that is the appropriate persona to be attending church. If you are going to church dressed for other reasons, then I would suggest that there are more appropriate venues for dressing.

Leann

[DanaJ]

Leann - excellent post and welcome to the forum!

Angela Marie - you have received many good replies here, are you going to come back and join in the discussion?

[MarinaTwelve200]

lutheran maybe if it was discussed ahead of time. Catholics will probably ban you since the bible is against it technically from a passage. I remember once when I was a kid I was wearing my baseball cap because I didn't want to mess with my hair, and I actually had some 40's something women comment on how I wasn't dressed appropriately (who didn't work for the church).. I was shocked someone would say something to me. I mean I know it's nice to dress up for church, but don't judge me because one day I decide I don't want to.. probably the biggest reason why I'm a lutheran now, catholics are strict nutballs (no offense). you can never take the bible literally, it's the most story conflicting book ever written.

? Since when do CATHOLICS take anything from the Bible? I was a Cathoilic as a kid. In my experience Catholothisim was a collection of its own dogma and silly rules made up in Medevial times by a bunch of priests who sat around and debated about how many angels could dance on the head of a pin. --- And they worship(They say "honor") the virgin Mary more than Jesus or God. (Just my opinion)
Indeed that is the reason I am a Methodist today---we READ the Bible and base our religion on THAT and not what the Pope or the local priest or old Catholic ladies say. And that thing in the Bible you mention about womens clothes, in context, it suggests that a man is NOT to do it for reasons of DECEPTION--such as to enter a woman's tent----as a woman is also not to cross dress for deception--so as to enter the temple (forbiden to women)---Crossdressing itself doesent seem to be condemed, only CD used to deceive.

As to the thread---Get real. unless you can 100% pass, its STUPID (IMHO) to "Dress" in public, especially in places like Church--unless one has a desire to be publicly humiliated, beat up or even killed.---society is usually still not accepting of CDers---a sad fact that we are all too aware.

[DonnaT]

As long as you are not doing it for a thrill, and it does not distract from your being able to worship, go ahead. If you think it will distract others, sit in the back pew. At the sign of the peace, shake hands lightly, like a lady ;)

[TGMarla]

Frankly, I don't really think God cares what you're wearing. But the other church members might. Leanne's advice seems sound, especially the part about dressing conservatively. I'd worry a heck of a lot more about the others in the church, though, than I would about God.

Heck, if we accept that God knows us completely, you're not fooling Him anyway.

[VickySTG]

We do have a responsibility to act in a responsible fashion and to consider others in what we do.

Warmest regards,
Christina Nicole
This is true for life in general.
People need to mind their own buisness. If they don't want to see how other people are dressed they should stay home.

[VickySTG]

I go every where dressed.
Women don't wear make up stockings and high heels every day all hours of the day now do they.

[VickySTG]

lutheran maybe if it was discussed ahead of time. Catholics will probably ban you since the bible is against it technically from a passage. I remember once when I was a kid I was wearing my baseball cap because I didn't want to mess with my hair, and I actually had some 40's something women comment on how I wasn't dressed appropriately (who didn't work for the church).. I was shocked someone would say something to me. I mean I know it's nice to dress up for church, but don't judge me because one day I decide I don't want to.. probably the biggest reason why I'm a lutheran now, catholics are strict nutballs (no offense). you can never take the bible literally, it's the most story conflicting book ever written.
Do you really think the Creator cares what cloths you wear???

[Lisa Marie]

Replying Back, I think what Marla said is correct I dont think God really cares how you dress He loves you for who you are. I was just curious and wondering if anyone has gone dressed to church. Thanks all Angie

[Lisa Marie]

I will Dana, But I have not heard your thoughts on this discussion do you have any? Angela

[VickySTG]

I think it pretty much depends on why you are going to Church dressed?

If it's because you are TG, believe you are female and simply want to present as your self identified gender - then it sounds perfectly ok to me.

But if its because you'll get some adrenalin kick out of wearing your frillies in front the shocked and horrified choir or simply to challenge the Church elders - then I think that might be inappropriate.

Fiona xx
Don't you think if you are TG, believe you are female and simply want to present as your self identified gender, that you would shock and horrify the choir and challenge the elders anyway??

[ronda]

I feel that if you want to go to chruch dresser as a lady go and do it. God made us what we are so what does i matter what others think.

[VickySTG]

I feel that if you want to go to chruch dresser as a lady go and do it. God made us what we are so what does i matter what others think.
well said

Here is what I say.
I am that I am made me as I am.

[DanaJ]

I will Dana, But I have not heard your thoughts on this discussion do you have any? AngelaI don't go to church, and have never been Catholic, so it would be hard for me to make an informed opinion.

But - as I said before, there are many excellent replies here ;)

[KathrynW]

As to the thread---Get real. unless you can 100% pass, its STUPID (IMHO) to "Dress" in public, especially in places like Church--unless one has a desire to be publicly humiliated, beat up or even killed.---society is usually still not accepting of CDers---a sad fact that we are all too aware.
BIG TIME BONUS POINTS FOR MARINA...
Every person on these forums needs to memorize these words because they are 100% TRUE. "passing is everything" :)

[VickySTG]

Matthew 6:5-6 (King James Version)
5And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
6But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.

synagogues would also equal a church today as the are both places to pary.

[Christina Nicole]

I wouldn't think the catholic church would go a bundle on a TG person turning up for sunday mass given their phobic stance on GLBT issues!

and

Given the current position of the catholic church on LGBT issues I would probably not recomend that you go to your home church dressed unless you are 100% ready to be out and open about your status.
Since crossdressing and homosexuality do not have much to do with each other, and since no teaching or doctrine exists regarding crossdressing, this is non sequitur.

Since when do CATHOLICS take anything from the Bible? I was a Cathoilic as a kid. In my experience Catholothisim was a collection of its own dogma and silly rules made up in Medevial times by a bunch of priests who sat around and debated about how many angels could dance on the head of a pin. --- And they worship(They say "honor") the virgin Mary more than Jesus or God. (Just my opinion)
Well. Despite your self-professed expertise in many subject areas, Catholicism obviously isn't one of them. This isn't the forum to rebut what you posted, but then again, your posting of the above has nothing to do with the question asked. Your Catholic experience probably was confused. With over 2000 years of Scripture, teachings, and Tradition, the fullness of the Church is a lot for anyone to grasp. It's wonderful that you are a practicing Christian. But you have cut yourself off from the fullness of Divine Revelation. Many Protestant ministers, as they study Scripture, find that their search for that fullness leads them to the Church. For example, Marcus Grodi, a former Presbyterian pastor, who now is president of the Coming Home Network (http://www.chnetwork.org/), gets a couple of calls each week from Protestant clergy who's journey is bringing them back home to the Catholic Church.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Christina Nicole
So, if it's not a sin, why not go dressed as a woman?
Probably for the same reason you wouldn't walk into church wearing a devil costume and carrying a pitch fork. It's just not appropriate.
If you are going to quote me, please quote the entire paragraph instead of lifting one sentence out of context. You significantly changed the meaning of what I posted.


catholics are strict nutballs (no offense) Offense taken. If you didn't want to offend anyone, why did you post something offensive?

Warm regards,
Christina Nicole

[Wendy me]

ok as i see it if your going dressed just for a shok thing or for the rush of it maybe not a good idear , if this is how you go out everywere then go for it...
but rember a church or outher places people go to worship and pray should be respected...

[FionaAlexis]

Don't you think if you are TG, believe you are female and simply want to present as your self identified gender, that you would shock and horrify the choir and challenge the elders anyway??

possibly...but not necessarily if you try to blend in and behave appropriately.

However, if the church members and church are still horrified and/or feel challenged then they have the problem.

Fiona xx

[celeste26]

I can honestly say that I have in fact gone to church dressed, not just once but several times. Also to other church functions, I even got up in front and sang a couple of song (it was during a talent contest by the way.) For those who ask it was a Methodist church, in this particular church the lay leadership are a bunch of quite open lesbians!

Of course they also dont preach the gospel, they preach compromise with the world. I got either compliments or just plain left alone. No one said anything negative.

[Marlena Dahlstrom]

As to the thread---Get real. unless you can 100% pass, its STUPID (IMHO) to "Dress" in public, especially in places like Church--unless one has a desire to be publicly humiliated, beat up or even killed.---society is usually still not accepting of CDers---a sad fact that we are all too aware.

No offense Marina, but since if I recall correctly you haven't been out of the house (except for Halloween), so I'm not sure what you're basing your conclusions on.

As I've said before, I've been out a lot and while I can blend in a crowd but I've got no illusions about being mistaken for a GG in up close interaction. And guess what, no one's stoned me to death. Have I gotten stares sometimes and the occasional giggle, yeah, but that's their problem. But for the most part people are willing to treat me like anybody else. I act like I deserve respect and I usually get it.

Yes, I do live in a t-friendly area so other people's mileage may vary, and yes, t- hate crimes do occur. But enough of us have gone out in a wide variety of places without incident that the world is hardly the scary place you've described.

As far as going cross-dressed to church, I do think that can be asking for a scene depending on the church. At some churches, like the Unitarians or churches (including Catholic ones) that cater to the gay/lesbian community it might raise an eyebrow or two, but wouldn't be a problem. Go to a church that's very socially conservative, and yeah, I suspect there would be a scene.

[BeckyCath]

As to the thread---Get real. unless you can 100% pass, its STUPID (IMHO) to "Dress" in public,

OOOOOPPPPPPPPPPSSSSSS Marina, guess i have fallen into the deluded trap, and think i can pass in public...
Y'know, there's natal women who don't pass very well, but they go out...



especially in places like Church

So, as a transsexual woman who isn't 100% passable 100% of the time, then you're saying i shouldn't go out and worship as me, the person i was created to be?


--unless one has a desire to be publicly humiliated,

I'm more humiliated going out in boy clothes, i don't see anything humiliating in dressing femininly.


beat up or even killed.---society is usually still not accepting of CDers---a sad fact that we are all too aware.

I live in one of the chav capitals of Oxfordshire, and i have no problems when i am out going about my daily life. I shop in Milton Keynes, which is also a chav magnate, and i have never had any problems...

Please don't think that society is so transphobic that it's always going to end up with a problem when you go out. I have accepted myself as a woman, and i love being a woman... and going to church as a woman and worshipping in the gender i beleive i should always have been is a liberating and fulfilling experience, one i have been waiting for a very long time

Rebecca

[kwebb]

If I went to my church dressed they'd be laying hands on me trying to deliver me from this demon befroe I could get up in the door good. It would then become the talk of the town. Good, kind christian folk.

[BeckyCath]

If I went to my church dressed they'd be laying hands on me trying to deliver me from this demon befroe I could get up in the door good. It would then become the talk of the town. Good, kind christian folk.

The charismatic fundamentalists at the church i used to go to tried that, but it didn't work... i never went there dressed, but they still tried to cast ot the demons making me want to be a woman, and of course, the ego of the leader was really swelled by my acting...

You have my sympathy K

Rebecca

[kwebb]

Hey, for all I know it could just be the devil in my case, I can't seem to come up with any other reason, no one can, no one really knows. Why not demons?

[LeannL]

In case no one has seen it before, there is a good collection of views about CDing and religion on the Gendertree site: http://www.gendertree.com/

Leann

[jenny_centaur]

Hi,

I've been to church dressed several times. I hasten to add that each occasion was a New Year's Eve service, and many of the congregation were in fancy dress. Our vicar, who's female, invited me to come to the service dressed; she first met me (dressed) a while before the first New Year's Eve service I attended, and actually invited me to come as I was dressed at the time.

Nobody batted an eyelid, other than to complement me on my legs. Let's face it, there are churches and then there are churches!

Jenny x

p.s. This was taken just before church last New Year:

http://img136.exs.cx/img136/9904/nyoutfit24hq.jpg

I had cheered up by the time I got home!

[jo_ann]

Do you really think the Creator cares what cloths you wear???

Never said I care, saying strict christians/catholics do because they follow the bible word for word. I always go with "god would want you to love your fellow man and treat others as you'd want to be treated".

[sherri]

Going to church en femme makes sense to me if:

1. You are pretty much out of the closet anyway and your femininity is genuine.
2. You have made the effort to find a church that will be, if not accepting, at least tolerant.
3. You dress and behave in the spirit of communion and reverence, not for the sake of drawing attention to yourself.

[Christina Nicole]

Never said I care, saying strict christians/catholics do because they follow the bible word for word.

And


Since when do CATHOLICS take anything from the Bible?

Well, you anti-Catholics don't have your stories straight and you probably don't have the slightest understanding of the theology that you criticize, but at least you do have your bigotry all nicely fashioned. Someone asking about going to church en-femme isn't an invitation to spew your bilious vituperations.

Regards,
Christina Nicole

[ronni]

Kathryn's right.
You go to church to observe the other ladies and enjoy the way they dress up, learn from them, or even worship (them).
You try to be like them in your spare time, but don't be sacreligious (is that the right word?)

[Stlalice]

Christina,

I am far from being the anti catholic that you seem to think I am - nor am I unfamiliar with the catholic faith having been born and raised in it. Obviously our individual experience with and in the church differs and what of it? If you are comfortable and feel safe worshiping in the catholic faith then well and good - but not everyone is blessed with that circumstance. In most places the policies are decidedly non LGBT friendly - like many others at MCC I never felt comfortable, safe or wanted in the catholic church and became a refugee of sorts who for many years attended no church at all - it was only when I was in the early stages of coming to terms with being TS that a friend invited me to try attending an MCC service with her and I found that there really are places that you can worship without the fear of having to deal with the mind games, ridicule, and worse that characterizes so much of mainstream religion. We really have nothing to fight about - I wish you well and hope that you find peace.:angel:

[raelene]

I dont go to church dressed:::Im Jewish!!!, but I have gone thru A DRIVE thru restaurant dressed.

[windycissy]

I am lucky living in Chicago, a big city that swallows up a girl. I have been to four different churches en femme, always dressing conservatively -a church is one of the few places where a single woman in a dress and stockings does not stand out in a crowd these days, the pews are filled with them, praying for the errant men in their lives...

I have always been respectful, and try to slip away without getting the full court press to join the congegation. The "peace" is always a little awkward, but most people are too preoccupied to notice, or if they do, they are too polite to say anything....

If you are going to church to meditate and communicate with your maker, I see nothing wrong with dressing as you please. He knows all about you anyway....

Windy

[HaleyPink2000]

This is really a subject I'd like to address.

I believe I'm a crossdresser. I'm Married happily, don't want sex with men etc.
I love being dressed in female clothing. I don't like wearing male clothes at all. Never did actually. When I was a small child I had urges also, as many of you did.

Would I go to church dressed. If I could I would. If people would not have a fit about it , yes I would. Would I care if just a few had problems with it. Yes.

If what you do makes one person not think of you as a Christian, then you are doing wrong, as it says in the bible.

I try to " try to" put my best self in front of others. OK, sometimes the same as many others. I don't get that done. But I get up and try again. I try, that is what counts. I try to be what I feel I should be. As I said I don't always get it done. But i TRY! BUT IF THAT MAKES SOMEONE ELSE STUMBLE!
SIN, NOT THINK OF ME AS A CHRISTIAN, THEN I HAVE DONE WRONG.

Sorry I hate the darn caps lock key.

Anyway, If people would just love me for who I am, then I could go to Church in any clothing I wanted with in limits. Nice Dress, shoes and clean etc. Wow yeah, I'd love to be excepted for being Me in a dress. Not a female in a dress. But Me in a dress and heels, looking nice not trashy. But proper legnth dress, heels maybe a little makeup. But just Me in either pants or a dress at church. Will that happen. not in my lifetime. A man should be able to put on a dress over female undies and go to church even without a wig. Just as Him in a dress. My God does not care. Why should our culture?

I love looking like a born Female, I do!

But for now I'll wear my Jeans and a Polo shirt with Nike's.

Love to all my Sisters! Also thanks for thinking
about me and the prayers when I was in the Hospital.
Haley:)

[KathrynW]

Anyway, If people would just love me for who I am, then I could go to Church in any clothing I wanted with in limits. Nice Dress, shoes and clean etc. Wow yeah, I'd love to be excepted for being Me in a dress. Not a female in a dress. But Me in a dress and heels, looking nice not trashy.
the key word here is IF...
IF it were a perfect world...
Newsflash...
It's not.;)

[Rachel_740]

Has anyone in here ever gone to church dressed up? Im a catholic and have thought about trying it. What does everyone else think? Angela

My thoughts are that (as far as I'm aware) every religion there is preaches 'love thy neighbour', so I'd say go for it! If you get kicked out it just shows how hypocritical the church you attend is.

Yes, I do know that this is a head-in-the-sand attitude, becuase I'm very well aware of attitudes - years ago my brother tried to get into midnight mass one xmas (he was filthy from living in his car and having no facilities and wearing disgusting clothes). He was turned away at the church door - and this by the C of E who definately teach 'love thy neighbour' etc.

From time to time I attend my local? - it's 40 miles away - LGBT church.

Anne

[Rachel_740]

If what you do makes one person not think of you as a Christian, then you are doing wrong, as it says in the bible.

From my post above, and what you have written here, it is my opinion that the minister who turned my brother away from the church simply because of his appearance IS DOING WRONG, because his attitude certainly WAS NOT Christian!

Anne

[HaleyPink2000]

I have to tell ya. People some day won't even blink what ever you wear.
It's just that for now we are stuck. It's like many other threds have said.
When the GG's did do this in the late 1800's till into the 1960's they had issues on what was ok for them to wear. But Men are slowly coming out. The more we come out to others the more it will be ok in our culture.

But remember, like in Iraq, Women still have to wear vails etc. There will still be places that stereotype sex and clothing.

I don't agree with many things but I have to exist in this culture for now.
As for Church, you build one here that is not that way, and I will come, every Sunday. It's like I told others on another thred. We need a town I the USA that is just for us. Churches Schools etc. You Build it, I'd probably move there after I retired in two years.

BTW: Good luck on finding a Church. Let us know how it goes. I'm rooting for you. *smile*

Haley:)

[MsEva]

Well, to echo what has already been said...the reason for it would make a differnce if I were to go dressed. If it is for the thrill, find some other way to do that..go to the library dressed, go shopping, drive through a fast food place. If I were TS in transition, then by all means go ahead..whether it be Catholic *which is what I am...lutheran, presbyterian, methodist, episcopal, whatever, go and get closer to the lord. I don't think most baptists or orthodox jewish churches or synagoges would be that accepting..

[raelene]

Answering ms. eva=
It doesnt matter what religion you are or want to attend their congregation dressed in femme or not, the main answer to each and every religion today especially is how much money you are willing to give them either to attend or put into the passing plate. Religion today is nothing more than a BIG Business. Each and every religion has huge structures they use to for large attendence and they dont pay for it themselves. They cost tons of money to erect and most or all religions are regestered with the government as Non-Profit Organizations---Yeah Right!!!!

[danielle d]

hi everyone
i'm not a religious person but i don't think it would be a good idea to go to church dressed unless the people in your church know that you are a dresser and are ok with it.church is a place for those who believe and want to go to worship and going dressed might interfer with their territory.
danielle d

[Robyn2006]

Perhaps not completely on topic here, but I've always so wondered about how dressed-up women get when they go to church. Seems they so often get as dressed-up and made-up as they would for a night on the town. Some of my earliest memories (and inspirations) are of the women at my Lutheran church when I was a kid. Christ, they were so immaculately dressed, yet so glammed-out!!! it was all I or any of my friends could do to not be filled with anything but lust..., lust as our pastor preached his words of insanity.

To this day, it is those wonderful dresses my mother and sisters wore to church that I mark as being the very spark that made me realized I was not exactly a normal little boy - for it was those very dresses that I first was drawn to adorn as my own back when those Sunday mornings turned to Sunday afternoons alone and experimentation was the order of the day.

Robyn

[HaleyPink2000]

I am not perfect. Never will be. But I know what that questions answer is in my bible. The Pastor was wrong! He should have been leading His Church towards loving not hate. Any Pastor that does not except any person in their doors, of His or Her Church, is wrong. In my Bible. In My Heart. In My Way of believing. If it was my Pastor and I knew it. I'd take him aside later on, in private, no gossip, and talk with Him over the issue. No one else! About the Issue of letting anyone in the doors of the church. Also I'd leave the church if He did not agree with what my bible says, about loving your neighbor, and many other things. Jesus did not hang with the wealthy and well to do only. He hung with everyone, down to the poor lepper.

Haley:)

BTW An! My Bible does say that and so does yours if you use a Christian Bible.

[JAYNETHOMPSON]

I'm not a religous person but do go to Durham Cathedral at times to contemplate things; the place is so big that you can sit quietly for as long as you need.
One of the clergy once asked me
"would you like to make a donation madam?" aI guess I passed as a women OK. (I'm a little paranoid.)
Its the ultimate peacefull place.

Jayne

[cyndyw]

When i went to church today, there was a women in front of me who dressed and acted like she was proud to be a women. I wished I could dress like her and exhibit my femininiity.

[HaleyPink2000]

cyndyw:

Maybe someday we will be able to. But I don't think it will happen in my life time.

That might be a reason for CD town threds LOLOL.
Haley:)

[liz1928]

Yes I have done this often out of town without being read. This is being honest with God. Love, Liz

[KarenNY]

It's a long story but I have gone to church (Protestant) a handful of times en femme ... always out of town and when I was much younger, with my mother, who was very accepting and supportive of my crossdressing. A few times it was on Easter and I wore a new pastel floral print Laura Ashley dress. But I was also a whole lot more passable when I was younger too. To my knowledge, no one twigged on to my "true identity" -- but we were also going to a church that was in another town where we were not known...

[Katie Anne]

Robyn, I won't speak for women of other denominations. Catholic women seldom dress up for anything but the main service and frequently not then. There are plenty of women who look like they are there to hand scrub the place: ratty jeans, an old t-shirt, no makeup or jewelry, more than few who look like they have not combed their hair since Thursday. This being the case, I have not problem whatever wearing a skirt to Mass. I don't own long pants. I have always disliked the feel of them. I would never pass, so I stopped trying years ago. As the priest is wearing what is essentially an evening gown, what is he going to say ? The one brief conversation I had with the assistant pastor was about the movie " Bruno" (The film is well worth seeing, it is about a boy in Catholic school that likes skirts and eventually meets the Pope, who is wearing his cassock. It is a wonderful comedy ) Two women and one man complained to the pastor about the way I dress. He informed them he would love to back to the days when women wore dresses, hats, and, gloves and the men wore a coat, tie, and dress shoes. Apparently the idea that a dress code would apply to more than me had simply not occurred to them. According to Father they nearly tripped running for the door at the very idea that some might tell them what to wear to church. Cheers, Katie Anne Vive Le Jean d'Arc

[Christina Nicole]

Robyn, I won't speak for women of other denominations. Catholic women seldom dress up for anything but the main service and frequently not then.
[edited for brevity - CN]
Two women and one man complained to the pastor about the way I dress. He informed them he would love to back to the days when women wore dresses, hats, and, gloves and the men wore a coat, tie, and dress shoes. Apparently the idea that a dress code would apply to more than me had simply not occurred to them. According to Father they nearly tripped running for the door at the very idea that some might tell them what to wear to church. Cheers, Katie Anne Vive Le Jean d'Arc

Bravo for him! It was a wonderful way of pointing out the log in their eye while they accused you of a splinter in your eye.

Warm regards,
Christina Nicole

[Katie Anne]

Christina, An excellent Biblical reference you quoted " For what ever you measure out to others, it will be measured back to you " The pastor is a good soul, no pun intended. I think he believes me to be one of the characters Jesus might of hung around with, like the gentiles, Samaritans, tax collectors, etc. He also has a special devotion to St Joan of Arc, who of course was burned alive for crossdressing. It was truly funny that my critics believed that the priests would read me out from the alter for dressing as I do and their faded blue jeans and sweatshirts would still be fine. Tonight at Midnight Mass there were 8 in the congregation wearing skirts out of 400 women and two CD'ers. It is down right balmy here in Western PA. Even the cantor, the female choir members and Eucharistic minister wore pants. We are not poor parish. The need to wear faded blue jeans by everybody under 80 just escapes me. Both the priests made a point of complimenting me on my outfit, a Christmasy red sweater, long red skirt and black boots. My friend was complemented on his split skirt and vest outfit as well. Maybe the GG's will get the hint. Merry Christmas to All, Katie Anne

[Falcor]

As one condemmed to oblivion[re not religious],I find this topic, slightly amusing,I wish no offence,but are we not already condemmed to a fiery end because we dress as women[read that somewhere].So darlings,it don't matter how you dress as long as it'sappropriatly tastefull.Just one small ob.,from here in Oz,[and I mention this in a sweet and friendly manner]you my American girlfriends,are so conservative and obedient to church and state[not to say you'd bore the arsehhole off a wooden horse,and no I didn't think that up myself...I stole it.],become like us[Oz and the Poms],cheap and common,but as always clean panties each and every day.
I sincerly,sincerlyand sincerly mean no offence,and if I have,I am sorry.Big make up hugs all round falcorxx

[rnewpoint GG]

It is sad :( to read that most of you would not go to church dressed up. You are you are and God knows you are you and accepts that. God loves us as we are no matter what. I am Catholic and I would never discourage anyone from dressing up for church. But, you have to be comfortable about it. Go to another church where no one knows you if you have to but, do not let it stop you. What about going out in public? You more than likely will run into someone you know and that does not bother you? So why should going to church bother you? Be proud of who you are.:thumbsup: Rachel

[suzy]

Well,

What an interesting topic.
Frankly, no, I have not, not will I go to church dressed. But, I don't want to even appear to be judging anyone else if they choose to or not.

Not my place...and further more....I don't care........

It's just not something that I'd personally do

Love and hugs,

Suzy

[KathrynW]

It is sad :( to read that most of you would not go to church dressed up.
No, it's not *sad* at all. It's a matter of respect for God and for others who attend church. There's a time and a place for cd-ing. Church isn't it. YMMV. ;)

[insearchofme]

I can't pass so i would never go to chruch dressed. I wear panties all the time so I guess that might count just a little bit. I have also worn a bra to church.

I am Catholic and would never think of wearing jeans to Mass. That being said I don't mind if others don't dress up, I want to be somewhat dressed up. My priest has said in the past that being there with a giving heart is all that counts. Last night at Mass a young girl sat next to me in the pew and I eventually looked at her shoes, it was all I could do not to say "Nice shoes!"

[VickySTG]

I went to a wedding in a church ( I don't go to church to pary) dressed Not in dress stockings high heels and night club makup.

But in pants, top and a bit of makup. Eye shadow, mascara, a natural lipstick, nail as long as my wife’s and polished frosted pink. Those that knew me it made no difference, those that did not referred to me with fem pronouns. I know most nearly fell out of their skin when my wife and I held hands.

Vicky

[VickySTG]

Well, to echo what has already been said...the reason for it would make a differnce if I were to go dressed. If it is for the thrill, find some other way to do that..go to the library dressed, go shopping, drive through a fast food place. If I were TS in transition, then by all means go ahead..whether it be Catholic *which is what I am...lutheran, presbyterian, methodist, episcopal, whatever, go and get closer to the lord. I don't think most baptists or orthodox jewish churches or synagoges would be that accepting..

Lets make it very clear you don't need to go to church to get closer to God the Creator. you can do it while siting in front of your computer and you don't even need a bible.

Vicky

[VickySTG]

HaleyPink2000 in reading your post it seems to me that you think christians are never wrong. If they think something is a sin then it is a sin.
I suggest you do some research into the history of christianity. Can you imagine a pope sanctioning the murder of hundreds of thousands of people? It happened check out
http://www.macha.free-online.co.uk/7day-extracts/malleus-malificorum.html

Please don’t think that those that call them selves christian are all Christian. Some are just blind followers believing what they are told to believe.

Vicky

[Rikki Elisabeth]

Churches are inanimate objects. They are buildings where people gather to express their religious beliefs with the friendship of others.

I will not go on a rant, but, what does your heart say? If you are dressed for the weekend, who are you? Does the "force" you follow point at you and laugh? If you went dressed inappropriately and called undo attention to yourself, yes, you would probably disrupt or distract others. I have attended many churches...both in Easter finery and casual. I have never had another person express being affronted. Those to whom I have spoken usually welcome me and understand that I am who I am and follow the voices from the temple in my heart.

Sorry for rambling and I mean no offense to anyone.

[Christina Nicole]

HaleyPink2000 in reading your post it seems to me that you think christians are never wrong. If they think something is a sin then it is a sin.
I suggest you do some research into the history of christianity. Can you imagine a pope sanctioning the murder of hundreds of thousands of people? It happened check out
http://www.macha.free-online.co.uk/7day-extracts/malleus-malificorum.html

Please don’t think that those that call them selves christian are all Christian. Some are just blind followers believing what they are told to believe.

Vicky

Another anti-Catholic diatribe that is so full of garbage that it's hardly worth refuting. The idiot who wrote the text Vicky referenced is so blindingly stupid that he or she repeatedly writes "Malleus Malificorum" instead of the actual name of the text "Malleus Maleficarum". This book was never part of the teachings of the Church. Even Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malleus_Maleficarum) has that correct. But liars and pagans don't have much use for the truth. They only have hate.

This is not to say that the Inqusitions did not happen. But they did not happen the way that these pagan claim. Their claims are, for the most part, distortions and lies. The only weapons that pagans have against Truth are lies.

Regards,
Christina Nicole

[Sharon]

This thread has gone off topic and is being closed. If you want to continue this discourse, I suggest you take it to the Religion Forum.