Acceptance...haha...funny

[Aly Cat]

So the other day, my wife had a few words to say about me shaving my legs and dressing in general. I had thought that things were going rather well in terms of her acceptance....how wrong I was...

She had pulled back up all the times I had dressed and told me that she noticed my attitude towards her changed afterwards. I told her that it was because I was thankful that she was allowing me to do what I needed to do without her writing me off and giving up on me. I said that it was about gratitude. She said that it is nothing more than a slap in the face to her when I act sweet and nice to her afterwards. She told me that she doesn't allow anything. She said that basically she is just here for the ride since she knows that she can't and won't control me. She made it very clear that she does not accept it nor condone it.

That is the quick and dirty of the conversation that lasted 3 hours. I explained that it will most likely continue and that I didn't know how far things went but that I wanted to find out. There was some more back and forth and more tears and then finally just got up and ended the conversation since the kids were getting ansy and a bit worried about what mommy and daddy were talking about.

So.... so much for acceptance in any way shape or form. Things are back to being rough and I'm working a ton of hours in retail but all I can think about is our conversation and that I so want to be like those women walking around my store in their heels, dresses, and cute outfits with their long hair done up and looking nice.

Why do things have to be so complicated???

[Princess Grandpa]

Hug

I'm sorry! Getting smacked for being appreciative. Just doesn't seem right does it.

Hug
Rita

[Barbara Ella]

Yes, our lot in life is one of complications. I would suggest that you try extra hard to be just as nice to her when you are not dressing, as you do after you dress. I would also say, that if you don't push things, the attitude may swing back somewhat, no guarantees with this situation, my wife included, but time can heal. Don't give up on yourself, and don't give up on her. Stay connected.

Barbara

[Maria 60]

I find my wife at times is the same way. When I do finally get some time to dress or she will buy me something of course I get more appreciative and I am more happy myself. She feels it's not honest because she says I am not being myself, that she does a lot of other nice things and it doesn't get appreciated the same way. To me I have a great deal of respect for her for dealing with all of this. Well I believe us crossdressers were dealt a bad hand and now that's the hand we have to live with. I hope it works out for you and hope and we can try to find some kind of happiness in our relationships. Wish you well.

[Leona]

I'm seeing some potential for her to be controlling and abusive. It's worth spending some time evaluating that. As CDers, we are particularly vulnerable to abuse when we out ourselves to our SOs, because that is a BIG BALL to use to control us and abuse us.

So take some time to figure that out. Maybe the reason she's not accepting is because it's leverage for her to use against you.

[Phoebe Reece]

Acceptance doesn't always happen quickly. I know some couples that it took years for the wife to get to where she could stand to see her husband crossdressed. Continue to be nice to her in all situations and don't give up.

[Leah Lynn]

Early in my marriage I tried to feel out my wife. She was totally anti, so I let it ride. I was pretty much in denial at that point anyway. Over the years, I'd slip something into a conversation, and test the waters; still anti. Not until year 37 of our marriage did she begin to understand. That was after the third halloween that I'd been enfemme. Six months later, she suggested I get dressed and we'd go out as the girls. We had three such outings before her death. I'd hope that your SO would come about (albeit much quicker!), but if she's just along for the ride, the marriage is probably doomed already.

Leah

[stefan37]

Instead of being so sweet and nice after dressing. Why not try to act the same all the time. Open up some lines of communication and have an honest discussion about her needs and yours. She equates the act if dressing with a personality change and is probably wondering why you can not be like that all the time. Fear is a powerful motivator and while I can not think for her maybe she fears you need more. Maybe you do or she has other concerns. Honest communication no matter how painful is the only way to resolve difficult issues.

[Beverley Sims]

You always have to be careful that you don't take things for granted.

[jennyscott]

You always have to be careful that you don't take things for granted.

I think most of us infer a level of acceptance by our SO that may not reflect reality. Yes, I am guilty too. I see it almost every time I read these threads. In one recent situation one of the girls thought her toe nail polish was OK with her wife but yet, in reality, the wife had not seen the toe nail polish (until after getting out of the shower).

Keep it real, lest the pink fog sweep you away.

[linda allen]

..................... Why do things have to be so complicated???
Life is complicated. Less so for dogs and cats, but for humans, it's very complicated and not just for crossdressers.

We've been given brains and we've acquired education to deal with these complications. As you age, you will understand and learn better how to deal with them. Read the advice here, but take it with a grain of salt. Think about what you read and about how you feel, then act on what you decide.


Acceptance doesn't always happen quickly. I know some couples that it took years for the wife to get to where she could stand to see her husband crossdressed...........

And in some cases acceptance never happens. In other cases, that "acceptance" is there in the beginning, but goes away in time.

Every relationship is unique and comes with its own problems.

[Tracii G]

I learned in two marriages women don't appreciate a man that is sweet and nice and easy to get along with.
They like a guy with an attitude that can be an a-hole 80% of the time.Women like to argue and pick fights and want you to stand up and fight back.
Knowing all the while they can cry and get their way and make you feel guilty.
Of course they won't say that to your face.
Sorry to all the GG's here but that had been my experience.

My second wife told me I was too nice to her and she didn't want that in a man anymore.

[Jenny CD]

I feel ya, Tracii... Same problem. I was kind of a jerk to my first wife, who was my highschool sweetheart. Thought it would never end, ya know? Anyway, second wife... She was WAY TO HOT FOR ME!!!... So, I treated her super nice because I didn't want this one to get away. But alas... I was TOO nice. Women are complicated as hell. I wonder... Am I like that, too?

[Tracii G]

Jenny they always complain and say you don't listen or you don't show any emotion.WE NEVER TALK!!!!! *cry sob*
When you do all those things and buy them things on a spur of the moment because it reminds you of them or you just think they will like a surprise then they think you are cheating or have an ulterior motive and trying to cover something up.
When it reached that point I said OK I give up I've tried my best to be honest and caring but you can go anytime you want don't let the door hit you in the butt on the way out.
Oh and tell your BF I said hi he can have you.

[Sharon B.]

I with you on that Tracii; that has always been my problem I listen to what they have to say and do my best to be nice. I have come to the conclusion I would rather be single and dress as I please then to have one sneak around behind my back.

[donnalee]

There is something about women that periodically makes them want to push your buttons, probably because they want to make sure those buttons still work and they still have power over you. Sometimes the best thing to do is to let it run it's course; when she's spent and wants to reconcile is when to reassure her that you love her and that you will be there for her as long as she wants. The only thing possibly successful is to weather the storm until it stops blowing.

[Greenie]

I with you on that Tracii; that has always been my problem I listen to what they have to say and do my best to be nice. I have come to the conclusion I would rather be single and dress as I please then to have one sneak around behind my back.

A lost of us would rather be single than have someone sneak around behind our backs dressing like women. So I guess we get how you feel too. :/ You all are sounding pretty judgmental of women to be men who DRESS LIKE WOMEN. :/

Also did you ever think that maybe the women who are accepting of their CDing significant others is because they are into the more emotional side of their men to begin with. Using two marriages as a blanket statement to describe all women seems unfair. We can't use our experiences with our own CDing SO and generalize those experience towards the rest of you? I would just pause to remember that there is a GG population at this site who have made it clear they don't follow the "normal generalizations" towards CDing so that goes to show we aren't all the same. So obviously ALL women don't fit into your ideas of what "women are like. " I am sorry that you have had those experiences with women, but I caution you to judge us all the same. By doing that you might never the right woman.

But about the OP: Eva dear. I am sorry that this is happening to you. She sounds really stubborn. :/

[Tracii G]

Greenie neither of my wives knew of my TGism and I never dressed while I was married to them just to set the record straight.
I was a good provider and a great Dad to my kids I raised two Daughters on my own they were 10 and 5 when their Mom took off with another man.
Even put both of them thru college.
I do see your point tho'.
I adore women generally but seems I picked two bad ones.LOL

[MysticLady]

So the other day, my wife had a few words to say about me shaving my legs and dressing in general. I had thought that things were going rather well in terms of her acceptance....how wrong I was...

She had pulled back up all the times I had dressed and told me that she noticed my attitude towards her changed afterwards. I told her that it was because I was thankful that she was allowing me to do what I needed to do without her writing me off and giving up on me. I said that it was about gratitude. She said that it is nothing more than a slap in the face to her when I act sweet and nice to her afterwards. She told me that she doesn't allow anything.

Why do things have to be so complicated???

Hi Eva, Let me tell you what it is that's pissing her off. She's pissed because it's not her that's making you happy happy joy joy. I experienced that with my wife. Sometimes, I wonder if a spouse does not become vain in thinking that she has got too the one, the only one, that should make you happy all the time. I suspect, to a spouse, it's just like a man watching another woman or even like committing a sexual affair w/ another woman. You know, some have said that they'd rather it was an affair rather than crossdressing. I believe that way, they can at least wrap their minds around it easier than CDing. CDing just confuses the Hell out of them.:straightface:


Yes, our lot in life is one of complications. I would suggest that you try extra hard to be just as nice to her when you are not dressing, as you do after you dress.

Hi Barbara, When someone is happy, they feel like doing things out the norm, off the wall for someone they Love. How can someone be nice if they're treated like a child and restricted. Eva is a responsible adult. She knows what she wants.



My second wife told me I was too nice to her and she didn't want that in a man anymore.

Tracii, That's what I'm trying to warn the Newbies about. Watch them closely:heehee:



Also did you ever think that maybe the women who are accepting of their CDing significant others is because they are into the more emotional side of their men to begin with.

That's a very interesting statement, Greenie. Since, I show hardly no emotions towards my wife, that may be why she may have issues w/ my crossdressing. I will need too look into this a little further. Like I've said before, she says "I have a heart of Stone". But, I feel fine.:straightface:

[Leona]

Victoria: I think this "heart of stone" is a facade. You've said it, she sees it, but it's still a facade. If it were real, you wouldn't be here, you wouldn't dress, and you certainly wouldn't have an avatar pic of you drinking "iced coffee".

Maybe that's your barrier to get past. Maybe you need to learn how to show your emotions, empathize with other people, and actually cry at a dorky movie? It's within reach for you, and "iced coffee" can help with the first steps, to be honest. But once those steps are taken..... (Yes, you might cry during TRON)

[Aly Cat]

You know, some have said that they'd rather it was an affair rather than crossdressing. I believe that way, they can at least wrap their minds around it easier than CDing.

Thats funny....my wife has used almost that exact verbiage in previous conversations when I first came out to her. Crazy. To me, thats harder to wrap my brain around.

[Leona]

I wouldn't have a problem if my wife said she didn't like shaving, preferred to wear pants and t-shirts, and didn't like putting on makeup.

[Aly Cat]

I wouldn't have a problem if my wife said she didn't like shaving, preferred to wear pants and t-shirts, and didn't like putting on makeup.

My wife tells me all those things all the time. I told her that her trying to make me more manly is like me trying to make her more feminine. It's not fair to anyone to try and change who they are. I just see her saying she hates doing all the feminine things and cant help but see the double standard there... maybe it's just me....

[Leona]

It's not just you, sweetie. My wife recognized the double standard and worked actively to eliminate it. She's unique in that regard. I should point out that the kid who learned about it when she was 11 or so (may have been 10 still) has NEVER had a problem with it. Now she's 13 and she requests us all to get dressed up and do each other's makeup. (Technically she's my step-daughter, but she accepts me as (her words!) her dad-mom)

[TheMissus]

CDing just confuses the Hell out of them.:straightface:

Stopped in to see what's up and had to say, yep, it sure does confuse us, lol. Seriously, other than dressing as a duck (think I've mentioned this before:) I can't think of much else that confuses me more. I often tell my H if I could go back in time and tell his childhood self not to start CD, I would! But alas, here we are, stuck with a duck in the house.

Anyway, about the OP situation, I honestly don't know many women who understand CD and I know none who would actively choose this In a partner. Most of us fit somewhere in the middle and tolerate what we can depending on our own upbringing and desires and that's really about all most of us can give. Any more starts stealing from our authenticity and there comes a point when we need to say "is this really what I desire in a relationship."

I think many here assume it's all about a GG accepting the CD. How about the CD learn to accept a GG and the unique dynamic she brings, including (in many cases) a dislike of CD. Seems understanding should really go both ways.

My two cents :)

[Tina B.]

The missus gets a hit, and a miss! She Say's if she had known her husband back when he was a kid, she would have told him not to start to CD. Doesn't she think there was someone out there saying don't do it! Mother, brothers, and fathers, friends and teachers, there was no one saying do it.
If we weren't compelled to do it, we wouldn't do it!
But she is right about women and hoe they feel, we are different, most of the world finds us strange, and confusing even scary.
A women wants regular, dependable, a real rock, and a hard, well you get the idea. Some of us don't fit that bill. So why should she put up with it, love a guy that does it. Oh he should ignore her short comings, she can get fat ignore her looks, dress like your brother, and it's all good, but don't you dare be anything other than prince Charming, her momma promised her she had him on order!

[MysticLady]

Victoria: I think this "heart of stone" is a facade. You've said it, she sees it, but it's still a facade. If it were real, you wouldn't be here, you wouldn't dress, and you certainly wouldn't have an avatar pic of you drinking "iced coffee".


You know Leona, I wish it was. My wife has complained that all of my extended family(dad, mom, brothers and even my little punk sister(don't freak out, I love my little sister) does not Love her and judges her. I think it's either genetic or she's just insecure about being accepted and being herself. She has complained of them always judging her. Problem is, I don't see it. She's just Funky.


Thats funny....my wife has used almost that exact verbiage in previous conversations when I first came out to her. Crazy. To me, thats harder to wrap my brain around.

See, I told you, they're just weird. Or, should I say, Cursed, from the beginning of time.


I wouldn't have a problem if my wife said she didn't like shaving, preferred to wear pants and t-shirts, and didn't like putting on makeup.

Then Leona, they would be a Natural Woman. I think they've just gotten all wrapped up in this beauty thing. Look at the marketing of beauty products, It a multi-Gajillion dollar Business. And for them to even say to a man, I don't like it when you wear makeup:doh:


It's not just you, sweetie. My wife recognized the double standard and worked actively to eliminate it. She's unique in that regard. I should point out that the kid who learned about it when she was 11 or so (may have been 10 still) has NEVER had a problem with it. Now she's 13 and she requests us all to get dressed up and do each other's makeup. (Technically she's my step-daughter, but she accepts me as (her words!) her dad-mom)

Smart Girls.



I think many here assume it's all about a GG accepting the CD. How about the CD learn to accept a GG and the unique dynamic she brings, including (in many cases) a dislike of CD. Seems understanding should really go both ways.


Well Hello Mrs., I am so happy you have returned. I hear you, maybe it is time that understanding is in Order. Trust me, it way make both people real, real happy happy joy joy.



Some of us don't fit that bill.

Oh he should ignore her short comings, she can get fat ignore her looks, dress like your brother, and it's all good, but don't you dare be anything other than prince Charming, her momma promised her she had him on order!

Hi Tina, you know, I think we would fit that Bill, if they'd let us. But no, Lets freako out and become complete Nags.

As far as the latter part of the statement, Have you ever noticed that they get all dolled up to go to the Grocery store, yet, when they come too bed, they look like Hell. How about getting all dolled up for me when you come too bed, not just when you want some. Sometimes I think that they are being Hypocrites w/o even realizing it.

[stephNE]

I often tell my H if I could go back in time and tell his childhood self not to start CD, I would! But alas, here we are, stuck with a duck in the house.

I can't agree with this. there is something embedded deep in my brain that has a need to cross dress and attraction to being a woman. As a child, my parents caught me a number of times and did in deed tell me to stop crossdressing, and even gave me a number beatings because of this, but I only pushed it deeper inside and tried to keep it a secret - and never stopped cross dressing.

My parents never saw that everyone of us are individuals, with our own personalities and likes and dislikes. Any one that was non-conforming to their likes, just needed a good beating to get it out of their system.

[TheMissus]

I can't agree with this. there is something embedded deep in my brain that has a need to cross dress and attraction to being a woman.

Perhaps for some here this is the case - for others like my H, CD was born of family issues and rejection. It was a small boy's coping mechanism (counselling helped to figure this out but we were lucky the counsellor had helped thousands of men who CD for similar reasons) and time and repetition has permanently embedded this in his psyche. My H is a sexual CD though and it's common that a fetish stem from trauma etc.

Not that the point was about my H stopping CD as that's just a running joke between us - the point was GG's generally struggle with it and in my opinion they're as entitled to feel this way as you are to feel feminine.

[MysticLady]

the point was GG's generally struggle with it and in my opinion they're as entitled to feel this way as you are to feel feminine.

I agree, Now, How do we fix it? :thinking: Maybe by having Faith and Courage in one another? Sorry, just a dum thought.

P.S.. BTW, Eva, How's the Wife, Still freaking out. I usually gave mine a couple of Days, and then she would Love me again. The part I like now, is that I don't have too fear going too bed and get all comfy and then she would come too bed and want too talk. For some reason or another, I would get extra sleepy and just say, uh huh. She would get all emotional and start throwing pillows at me and just do everything in her Power too keep me awake. That, would really tick me off. Why can't we talk about it in the Morning?........................sheesh:doh:

[Karren H]

I've always said there is no such thing as acceptance of this.... just varrying degrees of tolerance ...... from total repulsion to 99% tolerance.....

[Greenie]

I wouldn't have a problem if my wife said she didn't like shaving, preferred to wear pants and t-shirts, and didn't like putting on makeup.



The problem with this, is that comparing this and CDing is not going to get you anywhere. This sort of view is not going to appeal to most wives when trying to "justify" cding. If they already aren't having it, telling them that you "accept" that they don't like to shave, or wear makeup and that you "accept" that they wear pants. This is going to get you into some hot water.

The sad part of the story is that you have to realize part of your wives reactions are socially constructed. Like it is socially acceptable for them to wear pants and no makeup.

Tangent: Lets get this make up thing straight. This women not wearing makeup as a point to make with you all grinds my gears. I am beautiful without makeup. Many women are. Just because you NEED it to pass, doesnt mean that we NEED it to be feminine.

UNtangent: So while it is socially acceptable for her to wear pants. And has been for a while now. It is still not socially acceptable for men to wear dresses. Does it suck? Yes. For many women this aspect about you makes you less desirable of a mate. You are in more danger due to a lack of understanding in the world. And thus so is she.

One of the reasons that I am so "accepting/tolerant" of the cding is because even when I have a hard time with it. I do. I will tell him I want my man for a couple days. He never turns around and try's to make me feel like I lack femininity. Or compare himself to me. Or tear me down in order to make me feel BAD so that I "let" him CD. Don't you see that by making these comparisons to your wives femininity that you are tearing her down, to make her feel GUILTY. So that she "lets" you dress. That wouldn't be the best solution to me. I would want her to accept my dressing because it makes ME happy. Not because you said something to make HER feel bad.

[MatildaJ.]

One of the reasons that I am so "accepting/tolerant" of the cding is because even when I have a hard time with it. I do. I will tell him I want my man for a couple days. He never turns around and try's to make me feel like I lack femininity. Or compare himself to me. Or tear me down in order to make me feel BAD so that I "let" him CD.

This is lovely. But maybe it's also that you are generous with your own smiles and warmth when you are with him en femme, so that he feels like being generous back to you, when you do ask him to be your man for a while. Can I ask -- what's the balance these days, for you? When you have the evening together, what percent of the time is he dressed in women's versus men's clothes?

[MissTee]

What you may be getting from your DW is an acting out of emotion while she processes the whole CD thing. Unfortunately, she doesn't ever HAVE to accept it. i would show understanding to her and give her time if you want the marriage to work. Otherwise, you have other choices and can make those whenever you feel ready.

Hey Greenie, thanks for giving us the GG perspective. Men in dresses wanting to be women but acting out like men is quiet the conundrum, huh?