Reversal

[Amelie]

I heard this from another CD site. What if your wife or SO decided to shave the hair on her head off or get a short crewcut. And also didn't shave her legs or armpits anymore, and still wore clothes that showed her legs and armpits to others. Also she would get some socks and stuff them between her legs to show a buldge in that area. When she went out she would talk to others in a deep husky voice. How many here would like their wives or SO,s to be like this? Don't forget she would like to go to the malls this way and have the neighbors see her this way, including the parents of your children's friends.
And for those straight and single CDs here, if you saw a woman like this at the mall, would you consider her to be "dating material". Can you look at her as a future wife?
NOW- Be honest with your answers.
Love Amelie


PS- What I mean is they would want to dress and act like a man as much as possible.

[crispy]

Amelie

I, like (I suspect) you, would be thoroughly put off.

But isn't the whole point of CDing that boys are made of slugs and snails and puppydogs' tails whilst girls are made of sugar and spice and all things nice?

Girly girls are naturally attractive, and we would expect girly boys also to be naturally attractive, because femininity is pretty, beautiful & graceful.

Maybe you should ask the GGs if they really prefer rufty tufty boys instead of girly boys. Judging by the level of acceptance by some GF acquaintances that we have read about on this forum, it may actually be quite natural for both males and females to like beautiful people in beautiful clothes.

I may be biased, but I cannot think of anything beautiful about any man I have ever seen. Maybe something in the female psyche is attracted to a very masculine type just as a breeding mate, but does it necessarily follow that she is also attracted to such a creature on an intellectual or esoteric level?

On the other hand I do not expect GGs to be attracted to a guy who is a travesty of a femme creation. But there are some lovely ladies on this and other forums (fora!!!) who are surely attractive to both girls and to boys.

[Missy]

First idea that would come in would be would be She butch
the one on top
then that would make me on bottom. :D
Remember in some ares of the world being unshaved leg or underarm hair is sexy and totaly acceptable :eek:
What ever one does come with a price that one will pay sooner or later


Missy :)

[Muffles]

If I went looking like that again she'd kill me :p





I heard this from another CD site. What if your wife or SO decided to shave the hair on her head off or get a short crewcut. And also didn't shave her legs or armpits anymore, and still wore clothes that showed her legs and armpits to others. Also she would get some socks and stuff them between her legs to show a buldge in that area. When she went out she would talk to others in a deep husky voice. How many here would like their wives or SO,s to be like this? Don't forget she would like to go to the malls this way and have the neighbors see her this way, including the parents of your children's friends.
And for those straight and single CDs here, if you saw a woman like this at the mall, would you consider her to be "dating material". Can you look at her as a future wife?
NOW- Be honest with your answers.
Love Amelie


PS- What I mean is they would want to dress and act like a man as much as possible.

[Renecd]

I agree with Julie 100%. I have said for years women can and do wear anything they want, including mens jeans and tops now. My last g/f even stole all my men's pj's LOL..she said they were more confortable that her's.
I did met one woman that did act in a total masculine role and we lived in a role reversal for an entire weekend. Funny thing was in the morning we did revert back to our true roles. The clothing didn't make a diference.

Hugs to all,
Rene

[Amelie]

I am not trying to say whether fem is more appealing or more attractive than the male. Also I'm not saying just the clothes. I asked would you accept your SO if she changed her persona to a male, whether she looked pretty or not doesn't matter. If she shaved her head, and didn't shave her legs, stuffing her pants with socks for a buldge effect, would you accept her doing this. There are women who dress in men's clothes but not all would go all the way, as to imitate a man like a CD imitates a woman. Women wear men's clothes but CD not only wear women's clothes they also change their body shape, by tucking, stuffing a bra, and wearing a corset to get a woman's shape. If CDing is just wearing the clothes of the oppisite sex, then why alter your figure, you should just wear the clothes of the woman unless you want to become a woman.

What I'm asking is would you accept your SO if she wanted to be like a man, not just in dressing, but also alter her physical appearance(like CDs do) to look and act like a man. Would you still like to be seen with your SO in public if she had hairy legs, shaved head, maybe a false beard, stuffed crotched, more muscular arms. If you can not accept your SO like this, then you can understand why they don't accept you.
Love Amelie

PS beauty is in the eye of the beholder, while I like to look like a woman, I find certain men much more attractive than any woman.

[babe4life]

Honestly, I would be totally put off. But totally. Clothing is one thing. But then again, it may be interesting to hang out together but as friends you know? But if I was a straight guy, eeewwww. Not that I would say eeewwww ;)

[Charlotte Elizabeth]

dont really think I could handle dating a GG with more body hair than I've got..

[SatinSarah]

This is such a good question. When I discuss my CDing with my wife she asks the same question - would I find her attractive and a turn on in the bedroom if she wore my suit and stuffed something down her pants to try and be as manly as possible. For me this would not work at all, I love her as a woman so I can see why she doesn't always like to see me go girly. On the otherhand I do sometimes think it would be nice to be treated totally as a woman when making love dressed sometimes and as I'm not gay this would be a good compromise. So I guess my answer is it depends. But it depends upon me being a CD in the first place. You would have to pretty lucky to find a SO who was happy to do this and was attracted to CDers.

[Shinya]

I am not trying to say whether fem is more appealing or more attractive than the male. Also I'm not saying just the clothes. I asked would you accept your SO if she changed her persona to a male, whether she looked pretty or not doesn't matter. If she shaved her head, and didn't shave her legs, stuffing her pants with socks for a buldge effect, would you accept her doing this. There are women who dress in men's clothes but not all would go all the way, as to imitate a man like a CD imitates a woman. Women wear men's clothes but CD not only wear women's clothes they also change their body shape, by tucking, stuffing a bra, and wearing a corset to get a woman's shape. If CDing is just wearing the clothes of the oppisite sex, then why alter your figure, you should just wear the clothes of the woman unless you want to become a woman.

What I'm asking is would you accept your SO if she wanted to be like a man, not just in dressing, but also alter her physical appearance(like CDs do) to look and act like a man. Would you still like to be seen with your SO in public if she had hairy legs, shaved head, maybe a false beard, stuffed crotched, more muscular arms. If you can not accept your SO like this, then you can understand why they don't accept you.
Love Amelie

PS beauty is in the eye of the beholder, while I like to look like a woman, I find certain men much more attractive than any woman.


I wouldn't want a GG to M, and I wouldn't put a GG in that situation after you got a relation going on over time. Read on.

Knowing what I am, I haven't been in a lot of relationships in my life to date.

One of them I hinted at playing around with CDing for fun in the bed room. She laffed at me, but went along with it. But was I truthful about the desires of it No. That relation ended for other reasons.

The second GF, was great in the start, I slowly let her know of my desires. That ended in a bad way. Again was I truthful from the start No.

At this time in my life I figured I'm not going to be happy with any one.

Then she came into my life, we were friends for 6 months before anything happened between us. And I didn't want anything to get started until she knew me well and I her. Hell, we even lived together for 3 of the 6 months and slept together{Nothing sexual,for those that think other wise}. We talked about everything under the sun, and I mean all of it. She was a beautiful GG in my eyes, and she was into many things I was and many things that didn't cause conflicks between us as friends. Including my CDing and her also enjoying the occasional Bi-experiences. She was happy with who I was, we got married. Had three years of total bliss. Then it hit the fan, right out of the blue. She tossed my CDing right in my face as the failer of the marriage. And there is a hell of lot more to this, that caused more pain and suffering for, I think the both of us, after the Big D. I have been without SO GGF for 8 years, 3 of pain, 5 because I don't want that kind of pain in my life again. As I haven't yet found another.

So back to the question. I am LeFem for the GG's and Hetro Male. If a GG is a FtM I'm cool with it, but I am not going to date him. I will be friends with yes.

If I was in a relation and MtF with her, and she tossed that into the mix after a year or two. Would it cause a conflict, Yes. I would hope that the Gender lines are stable though out the realationship. No matter how we bend them from the start. I mean like, how many on here woke up and said to them selves "I'm a Crossdresser"/"Opposite of what I see"/ and so on. I'll bet dallors to doughnuts that this never happens.

Know who you are, and what it is that you want. Crossing these lines are a huge part of our lives. So why cut it short by not being truthful about who we are.

So there is a price to pay as a MtF or FtM. As we might have friends and family. To find that one SO to share your life with, is as difficult as it gets.

This is a deep subject and this is my 2cents.

Great topic Amelie.

Shinya

[crispy]

If you can not accept your SO like this, then you can understand why they don't accept you.


Amelie

your point is quite valid. I don't expect my wife to accept me like that. I've never asked her to. Unfortunately that represents a fundamental breakdown in the relationship - two people living partly separate lives under one roof, and her searching out and destroying anything representing my femme side. :(

So be it.

But young CDs setting out on this voyage of discovery should be warned - it is not a good recipe for a happy long term relationship or for establishing a conventional family. Don't expect too much from anyone else if you follow this path. It is not a perversion (as my wife would have it) but neither is it a socially acceptable activity in most situations.

love to all

[kristi cd]

I'm probably different than most since I really don't want to be femme all the time, just when I feel like it if that makes sense (it's too much work hehe :D). I would find it totally repulsive if my girlfriend/wife was like that all the time, maybe not at first, since appearance shouldn't be the only thing that attracts you to someone who is that close, but after a while I would tire of it as I'm sure she would with my femme side if it was around all the time. However I think most younger (my age :rolleyes: ) GG's today aren't as bothered by more feminine guys, so I'm not sure how big a deal it would be to them? :confused: Since that was one of the points of this thread I think. :p

[Amelie]

Your story sounds like what every CD here talks about, just reversed. The only difference in your story the male accepts the dressing, where in these threads most times the wife does not accept.

I just posed this question, not to see if CDs liked masculine fems, or what their taste in women would be. I wanted to see if CDs would be hypocritical on their views. CDs want the world to accept them, but when the shoe is on the other foot would CDs be as accepting.

It was an easy question, the answer should have been YES, I accept my wife no matter what she looks like. This should have been the answer immediatly, Every CD here should have answered yes without question. That is every married CD. You can not expect your wives or society to accept you, when you can not accept someone(your wife) else being different.

There is no debate here, there can only be one answer. Yes I love my wife and I will back her whatever she wants to do. That is the answer you would want from your wives.
Amelie

[Julie]

Amelie,

You are so right! But I think many of us have had this question asked before and our tendency is to answer back in a general sense. That's what I did in my first reply. But actually picturing my wife going masculine was kind of hard. That's not in her personality so I had to stretch the imagination. But once I was able to project on her everything I feel all I thought about is seeing her happy and that made my heart soar.

We talked again last night. She was sad she is stopping me from being happy. She can't accept Julie and she is sad because of it. When I told her how happy I was all day yesterday and how I almost cried having to change back she felt she was my problem.

I am a more open minded person than she is. She admits her views are very Victorian and she doesn't know how to change that or even if she wants to. I just take people for who they are and accept it. When someone can find a higher level of happiness and I have been part of that I am elated. Nothing else matters. It seems making people happy has been a common thread throughout my life. I'm no saint but I have a very strong sense of how those around me feel and I react to that.

This has been a good lesson in viewing yourself from the outside in.

[Amelie]

I'm glad that you can see the point of this thread, I hope it helps you to understand how your wife feels. Also I wish you and your wife a happy future, You are a dear and special person and I'm sure your wife see's this as well.
Love Amelie

[NewShy21NJmtf]

This is a very difficult question to answer. First off, I wish that I could just say that I would be attracted to any female for her personality, irrespective of her appearance, but the two, especially in this case, are not so easily separable, but are in fact interconnected. I am attracted to girls, and to crossdressing in general because I am attracted to femininity, as has been stated in this thread many times before, but I am also sometimes attracted to men when I am dressed up. When I dress up, I find myself looking for a stronger independent, take-charge woman, so there is defienetly some appeal there, but I am so turned off by body hair. I might be able to get over her having little or no head hari, I'm not really sure, but body hair is just gross. Even as a guy, I am often attracted to girls that don't care much about their clothes. They are still girls, but if they wear jeans everyday and aren't afraid to burp in public that's fine. I guess I'm rambling. I don't really have any set rules for who/what I'm attracted to I guess, but that seems to be because I don't really have any rules for who I am either. I am a very complex person, and that shows in who I am attracted to as well.

Stephanie

[NewShy21NJmtf]

I'm not married, and haven't had any successful meaningful relationships, although at just under 22, I don't think I'm that far behind. Like I said in my first post, I wish that I could just say "yes, I would accept anyone for who they are" but I have to be honest with myself and all of you. I would be accepting as in, I would love to have such a person as a friend, but as I've explained in depth in my previous response, I have mixed feelings about being romantically involved with a masculine woman.

Amelie, I respect you very much for being so accepting, and I hope that I can be such a caring person as you, but I honestly don't think I am yet.

Stephanie

[Amelie]

Thanks, the question was basicly for married CDs. You being single have the choice to find the fem that you are attracted to and is willing to accept your CDing.
Love Amelie

[JoannaDees]

In my marriage, my wife was not real girly, a woman definitely yes, but not girly. She would not wear heels or anything. Utilitarian women's shoes or even mens shoes (Vans!). Rarely dresses or skirts. Very little makeup, and rarely lipstick. I sometimes wanted her to get all dolled up, but never asked her nor really felt like something was missing. Sometimes I wondered if she was bi (of course that brought some multi-partner fantasies, :cool: ).

Anyway, she did always shave her legs and such. If she stopped? I'd still love her. Full man with socks to stuff? Harder, but I really think acceptable if I was dressed, kind of a role reversal thing.

Now here is where I'm confused. Being a male is hard if you have even the slightest inkling of internal femininity, especially in this John Wayne society. God, some males are so egotistical and childish and selfish. It's beyond me why women like us. Why would one want to be that? I've tried very hard to escape those male chains ... ego, homophobia, suppression, out of touch with feelings and just other human beings. I really envy women, their souls, how they feel and communicate, how you see them with their friends.

I guess there is also a woman's point of view, always the submissive underdog, scrambling for equality, and maybe that male persona with all the power and the "I don't give a *$&% attitude" that allows them to be selfish and free.

I would accept it ... but only if I can have her beautiful female soul available too. The inverse of that I guess is she can accept me, but only if she can also have the dominant, commanding male persona available to her also?

Yes, I can ramble on and on and on .......

[crispy]

Amelie

I guess the original question was skewed. :mad:

If my wife (not my actual wife, we're too far gone for this discussion) wanted to wear smart well tailored trouser suits, shirts, ties, smart business shoes, and cut her hair neatly in a boy-style, I honestly think it would be a bit of a turn on. OK, so lots of GGs do that (or nearly that) anyway, without necessarily being lesbian. We're conditioned to it. Wearing mens' PJs and track suits around the house has long been acceptable behaviour. And tee-shirts were never intended for GGs, now they even wear them to bed. :)

So, flipping the other side of the coin, should we be more considerate and only expect to be accepted by our wives if we dress modestly and smartly, nothing overdone, nothing too blatant, wearing femme clothes that naturally enhance the male shape, but without DoubleD cup breasts, and without heavy make-up? We should never allow ourselves to become travesties of femininity. But looking at many photos (try the photo site associated with Crossdressers-Forum.com for example), some CDs are just that. :(

[Wenda]

Excellent discussion point Amelie. You are so attentive. I think some of the postings have been a bit 'oh poor me', 'my wife won't take the kids to Walmart and buy me a new bra" type of attitude. My mother and my favourite aunt often wore men's clothes. They did men's work. Their 'crossdressing' didn't embarass me. My mom's out-of-place comments and behavior did. On the weekend, my gf suggested we buy matching green bras. She is really trying to not make my rediscovered obsession an issue.
You have raised a valid point. If my gf stuffed socks in her panties, quit shaving her legs and arms, and took hormones to make her beard grow, would I still find her sexy....honestly??? I doubt it. wenda. thx. luv u.

[crispy]

Taking my thoughts one step further, I would have hoped that my wife could have found it within herself to accept me in the following get-ups, for example:

under my boy clothes: shaved body, bra without forms (so-called trainer bra maybe), panties, camisole, tights (pantyhose) or stockings.

evenings and bed-time: silky PJs, or a shorty nightie with panties (a modest babydoll)

I would never have expected her to initially accept me dressed to go out, or wearing falsies. Maybe those things would have happened in the course of time, but there was never an opportunity.

Modesty in all things?

[Wenda]

hi crispy, a common dream.. 2 nights ago we were playing cards and my gf stroked my leg with her toe....''...you're shaving your legs?!?!?"She handled it well. I was grateful. We talked about how many bras she owns. I think 200, she thinks 50. We joke about buying matching his and hers. She is REALLY trying, and I am so grateful. This forum has just helped me focus on how much I appreciate it. Thanks girls. luv, wenda.

[Julie]

You have raised a valid point. If my gf stuffed socks in her panties, quit shaving her legs and arms, and took hormones to make her beard grow, would I still find her sexy....honestly??? I doubt it. wenda. thx. luv u.
Okay Hon, that's all perectly understood. But is that what you have done? Have you taken hormones? Do you walk around with a stuffed bra? Most of us don't flaunt our femme selves in front of our SOs or the public in general.

Compare apples to apples. What if she went out with other CDs to TG friendly places? If she wore men's jeans occasionally? If you saw her men's underwear in the laundry occasionally? If she told you how happy it made her to dress like a man? If she was totally upbeat and in a great mood after a nite out with "the boys"? If she was more affectionate because you "let" her go out?

Or for those still in the closet, what if all you knew was what she told you of her deelings, that she wanted to dress like a man?

Those are more realistic scenarios. If this made her happy and as a result I lived with a happier person, I would accept it and cherish the times when I got to spend time with my happy wife. Right now she sees me as the sole source of her happiness but never tells me how I can accomplish that. What a wonderful thing it would be for her to find something that makes her happy.