Question? Come hither and help me. :)

[Greenie]

So I have a question.

I know a lot of you have supportive wives/SO's and a lot of you don't.

I consider myself "pretty accepting". But lucas and I got into a conversation about the limits to my acceptance.

When he is dressed. It feels like we are girls who are friends. Not a couple. I don't necessarily mind seeing him dressed, I just can't look at him sexually when he is. This normally continues on into the night. E.g. He dresses in the afternoon/ evening. That night, it (you know.. IT, IT.) is not really going to happen.

I am just not there yet. I will hold his hand, but I don't really like to kiss him while dressed.

So Lucas told me that he doesn't dress in front of me anymore because he doesn't like the way "I look" at him while dressed. He doesn't like not feeling like a couple.

But how can I get used to it. If he won't let me?

Do any of you have any advice?

What if I never can? Would that be something YOU as a CDer could live with from your SO? Is this level of acceptance better than none at all?

[Miriam-J]

I wish I had an answer for you, Greenie, but my wife and I deal with the same issue. She's incredibly supportive and helpful, but I know she's far from turned on by my gal mode. We have made some progress though. She will kiss me when I'm in gal mode (and very nicely upon my return from SCC in Atlanta), but she and I know it affects her subconscious receptivity. What does seem to help is consciously recognizing that I'm the same person no matter how I present, and she has helped me to shape my gal presentation to match the underlying personality that's the same in either mode. Perhaps you and Lucas can come to the same understanding. It's incredibly important to him, as it is to me, to find acceptance in affection as well. If sexual expression can follow someday, that's wonderful as well but don't feel you need to hurry it along.

Miriam

[Ms. Laura]

I know that I worry that, despite my wife being accepting, even to the point of intimacy, that somehow I have ruined her image of me as her husband. So, generally, I do try and separate during "dress" times. Recently, we've integrated again in a fun, friendly way, but I still worry about how my male self is perceived.

And, yes, I could live with your level of acceptance! I bet there are a LOT of gals here who would LOVE to have that much.

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi Greenie, This one is like being between a rock and a hard place, It's like a trick question with no right answer.

I wish had a problem like Lucas has I'm in a DA-DT my wife of 49.75 years knows all about everything
I dress at home but she just doesn't want to see me dressed I know my boundaries and stay with in them
and I'm happy with that.

Ms. Laura I was writing this before I saw your last line, Oh how right you are about that.

[Marcelle]

Hi Greenie,

My wife and I have this discussion often. I have asked her if she is uncomfortable with my dressing as things progress to a more intimate level. At first she said she did not mind but I had a feeling that was not entirely true. I mean I get it, in that she wants a "guy" not a "gal" for those moments. So after a few talks she finally admitted for her the turn off was the make-up and full presentation (e.g., stuffed bra). She just felt a bit weird by that portion not to mention, the make-up (I need lots) was a bit messy once things progressed. So we agreed that if I am total en femme then before we move things forward, Isha needs to remove certain trappings. Beyond that, to her the rest is just clothes (i.e., skirt, blouse, lingerie) and those come off in the end anyway. :heehee:

However,I will say that should she absolutely insist that Isha needs to take a hiatus during those moments, I would fully understand and approach this in guy mode. Originally, the CDing had a sexual component for me but now that I am out to my wife, that has been replaced by more of sensual feeling (the art of dressing is more the thrill than what I am wearing). So, for me, I am comfortable switching back to male mode for most things including "IT".

I guess my question to you would be "If your SO agreed to stay "en male" for "IT", would the fact that you have seen him dressed still be a bit of turn off? Not trying to be nosy, but I asked my wife the same question and I am wondering if your SO might feel as though he has ruined that level of intimacy with you. I know I felt that way until we talked it through.

Hugs

Isha

[Leah Lynn]

My wife accepted Leah as a friend, but I had to turn into a man for the bedroom. It's not uncommon; most wives don't want to be a lesbian.

Hugs,

Leah

[Greenie]

Isha: I do not know really. He wont dress in front of me. So I don't feel like I have had the chance to really find out. We also barely see each other as it is. He doesnt want to spend our only time together in a way that makes us both uncomfortable. He is trying to put me 1st which is hreat. But I think its a disservice to us both to keep hiding the dressing. I cant get used to it if i never see it.

[Marcelle]

Hi Greenie,

Have you tried to talk to each other about it? Your SO might feel just as weird about as you do. I know for me, the first time my wife saw me dressed total "en femme" (even though she helped during the process), I had to admit I felt a little less guy standing there in a sundress and lingerie. My wife and I always take time to discuss things with me "en femme" as Isha and also in "male mode". She finds it helps her to connect with both sides of me and integrate the two in her own mind. While she sees me as Isha, she knows that I (guy me) is still there below the surface. We had the discussion about "IT" with me both ways and it did help us . . . that is how I found out about her apprehension to make-up and breasts.

Isha

[RADER]

My wife was OK with my dressing; as long as I did not leave the house dressed.
I was OK with that. My dressing was only once in a while when I was working.
When I retired, I had more time. I would spend the entire day dressed, some times
to the nines. But she never complained. One time she insisted for me to dress
in a Maids outfit to hand out Halloween candy.
When I was irritated about something, she would tell me; "Go and put your Bra on"
I guess it calmed me down.
I wore a baby doll nightie to bed, and we would have fun with me wearing it.
When I asked her if she mined what I was wearing, she said a long as I still had
my "Male Parts" she did not care what i was wearing.
We where married for 19+ years, She passed back in April, The best wife a man could ever
hope to have. She loved me and I loved her.
Every one is different, I am telling you this so you can see what worked for us.
I did not dress all the time, and I never abused the privilege given to me by her acceptance
of me dressing.
Rader

[NicoleScott]

Hi Greenie,
My wife is accepting, but indifferent . That is, she doesn't mind in the least how I like to transform, as long as I enjoy it, but she sure doesn't want any intimacy while I'm en femme. And it's not her burden to get used to it! There's lots of time in the day. There's a time to play dressup, and a time to be your man. Maybe now it's time to negotiate and compromise. But if you don't feel attracted to him when he's dressed, don't compromise that, just negotiate dressup times and terms.

Over the years I've seen a couple of posts in which the CDer was crushed because his wife/SO wouldn't be intimate while he was dressed. It seems that for some CDers, sex while dressed is the holy grail of CDing. That's fine, but only if works for both. Do you think you need to pick his brain on the importance of intimacy while dressed? (not just sex, but kissing and hand-holding).

[ryenmatt]

This is exactly the reason why I don't go full fem. Cause I am a straight male that just happens to like what society has determined to be women's clothes. Going full fem would mean I would completely close the door on who I want to have a relationship with cause straight women are not attracted to women. So by just wearing the clothes and not doing the makeup and wig I keep a balance. I get to wear whatever the freak I wanna wear and yet I still look like a guy so maybe one day I will find a woman that is into effeminate males since I am getting into labels here is what I am I suppose. Greenie maybe you two can try that out if you haven't already kinda mixture of the two guy and girl mode like I do.

[Kate Simmons]

Being honest with one's self and one's partner is the answer. It's really all about feelings. Those feelings need to be sorted out both individually and as a team if a relationship is to survive.Just bear in mind that it extremely hard sometimes for a man, being a CDer notwithstanding to get in touch with his feelings and truly convey them to his partner. Sometimes it takes a lot of soul searching and patience is the key. :)

[NicoleScott]

I guess my question to you would be "If your SO agreed to stay "en male" for "IT" ...

Isha, we know that we all have different drives to dress, and that includes the frequency we dress. I like to think that my dressing is kept in good balance, and that I am her man most of the time and dress only occasionally, and at the right times.
Regarding my quote of your post, I wouldn't think it would good to hear: "Oh, you're not dressing tonight, I guess I know what you want". Ouch.

[ReineD]

He wont dress in front of me.

You know, I'm wondering if he's projecting his own feelings of inadequacy as a man when dressed, onto you. He's just newly out to you, isn't he. He needs to understand that you don't think of him as less of a man when dressed, you simply are not turned on by the image of a woman. Men are rather visual creatures so he should understand this?

I agree with all the others, communication is key and if he is embarrassed by talking, he does need to get over it ... for the sake of your relationship.

As to my own experience with my SO, at first I thought like you ... that while dressed we would simply be platonic girlfriends, just as I am with all my other female friends. It took me a while before I realized that he wasn't seeing it that way, that he also wanted to be affectionate while dressed. But since it is a second relationship for both of us and my SO was a breath of fresh air after my marriage, and since my SO never pushed me, I was happy to comply. This is because I realized that fundamentally, my SO was the exact same person whether dressed or not dressed. Also, when we (or most people) make love, the clothes tend to come off and the height of the moment is rather genderless ... just two souls merging as one.

I did ask my SO to not wear lipstick or perfume since I didn't like my SO smelling like a woman. She readily complied which made me feel as if my desires were also important. So not to get too personal, we experimented a lot with switching things around, but then it slowly went back to the standard modes. When we come home from an outing, the clothes and forms come off right away because they are too binding, and my SO immediately washes the makeup off her face.

What I'm saying is, that sometimes we wish for something intensely and when we do get it, we see that it wasn't so special after all.

... like having an accepting SO to dress at home with. A lot of CDers with non accepting wives desperately want their wives to support and be involved with their dressing at home. Well, what they don't realize is that after a while, it rather becomes 'old hat' and they don't feel any differently while dressed with their wives, as they do while not dressed ... for the CDers who go out that is. I dare say that the CDers who stay home will continue to dress at home.

[Jenniferathome]

...When he is dressed. It feels like we are girls who are friends. Not a couple. I don't necessarily mind seeing him dressed, I just can't look at him sexually when he is. This normally continues on into the night. E.g. He dresses in the afternoon/ evening. That night, it (you know.. IT, IT.) is not really going to happen...

Kae, this is me and my wife. I would never expect her to be romantic with me while dressed. My advice is to ask Luca to read my comment:

think objectively. You are NOT a "couple" when he is dressed and that is ok. That's a cost of being a cross dresser. Of course you will look at him differently! He's dressed as a woman. You are not physically or emotionally attracted to women. Having a girlfriend is really cool. Think how rare that is. Enjoy what you have.

[AmyGaleRT]

Greenie, Sabrina has the same issue, I think, in that she has no lesbian tendencies and hence is not attracted to my Amy-self. We do kiss when I'm in that mode, but they tend to be more "girly" kisses than when I'm my male self, almost as if Amy is her best girlfriend. Of course, that's kind of what I feel like when I'm being Amy, and I respect her feelings and don't try to come on to her when en femme. You probably also know that she won't let me wear my nightgowns to bed, because she wants "her man" in her bed with her. But she has no issues with seeing me dressed; in fact, she likes to see how I look before I go out. Neither do I have any issues with her seeing me dressed.

The two of you might try to get to this sort of point, but it might take some work on both your parts. It might help if Lucas developed a distinct femme persona separate from his male self, as "Amy" is distinct from my male self, so you each have different points of reference when he's in that mode. I don't know if that helps, but that's my opinion...

- Amy

[AllieSF]

In direct answer to your question, it is like everything else in life, we need to practice. Now, the timing of the practice is important if I understand correctly that you do not see your SO regularly (different work schedules or working out of town ....??). If that is the case and sexual relations are an important part of your relationship, for both of you, and you get to that part of the relationship only when he is home after a long absence, then that is a problem. Maybe you just need some shorter exposure moments over time to let yourself realize that the person in front of you is the same however dressed. It sounds like you need to come to grips with that. If you work hard not to have "that look" than maybe he will feel more comfortable dressing in front of you. I would try to stay away from the sex after situation as much as possible so that you will be in mood when you want to be in the mood and the opportune moment presents itself.

It will probably take some work to convince him to start your practice moments while he is dressed. Go slow and repeat when possible. Hopefully, one day it will work out for both of you. You also need some real good and honest communication during this period. Good luck.

[27th Jennifer]

Just keep in mind that our egos can be very fragile when CD'ing is involved, and just the smallest rejection in the early coming out period can be devastating. When you finally let out that secret you've been hiding most of your life (as is the case with most of us) to someone, it can be very difficult to process how the other reacts.....

Ana

[Stephanie47]

Greenie, I'm in a DADT marriage of forty plus years. Early in our marriage we experimented with lingerie in the bedroom, and, it was strictly bedroom play. When we discovered together that my interest in women's clothing was more than bedroom play, well, it did not sit well with my wife. My wife, although loving in any other way, wants ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with cross dressing Stephanie. Do I blame her? Nope! She married a man with a strong sense of what she expected in a man. Cross dressing does not factor into it.

I went through a period of pushing the envelope and hoping to gain some acceptance. It tortured her. I thought about it, and, decided it was not worth causing her discomfort.

Frankly, the more and more I read your threads, I'm feeling you're going to move away from the entire cross dressing aspect of your relationship. I'm reading here that he is questioning with great angst why don't you accept everything he throws out to you. If my wife told me today, "Honey, go put a dress and heels on, I want to see you!" I would NOT do it.

I guess I do NOT need my wife's acceptance of my interest in women's clothing. I also know she loves me in every other way, and, I am NOT willing to make her feel uncomfortable about my cross dressing. I'm also NOT going to throw a guilt trip on her for NOT feeling the way I do about a part of myself. Just my opinion!

The comment was made about to keep in mind about a CDers fragile ego. Well, a woman married to a cross dressing man can also have a fragile ego and periods of self doubt and deep reflection.

[Allison Chaynes]

Greenie,

My wife is back and forth. Most of the time she's fine as long as no one else knows about Allison, it's like our dirty little secret. I underdress 24/7 and wear whatever is comfortable when the kids aren't around, but I try NOT to do that for most of when she and I have time alone. She's a little different in that it's something that grew on her in the bedroom... when she's in the mood, she likes me being Allison. Even though she told me before we were married years ago that she was bi, this acceptance was not always the case- it's taken a few years to get to this point. It might help that her sister identifies as lesbian and has been dating a MTF TS for over a year now, and the subject has come up between them. I find that during periods of stress for her, she doesn't want to have a wife around. I DO find her more appreciative (and willing to be intimate) when I do things for her she isn't expecting, like help her with her side business or do something around the house to surprise her. I think she is seeing the benefits of having both a husband and a "wife" and is trying to accept it. I don't know if that helps, but that's our situation right now after 12 years of marriage and 5 1/2 years of her knowledge of Allison's FULL existence, not just lingerie.

[Beverley Sims]

Greenie,
I think your level of acceptance is satisfactory, considering your outlook.
Probably give Lucas a hug now and then, remain friends as girls and I agree it is hard to look at him sexually when dressed.
Try and rid the stigma of dressing in front of you so as things happen naturally.
My wife does not like me wearing perfume or kissing on the lips when I have makeup on.
We usually touch cheeks as two girls when greeting each other and I am dressed.
We do not hold hands in a crowded environment but will walking in lightly populated areas.
I have lived with similar restrictions all my life and little things do happen from time to time usually under a new or unusual situation.
It does not phase me at all.

[docrobbysherry]

Greenie, I have no idea what your SO's motivation is. However, there IS often a sexual component to our dressing. There certainly is with mine anyway. Not only would I not wish to have someone I'm intimate watch me become Sherry, I also have no interest in sharing her with an SO. When I'm with a GG I want to be a man.

What most dressers I've talked to would like, is to be girlfriends with their SO when dressed! I would like that, too. If I were u, I'd work on that with your SO. If he's not interested in that, refer to my 1st paragraph above. If u can't handle being girlfriends with him, u 2 MAY have compatibilty issues!

[Jacqueline Winona]

Part of me says, how I wish my wife thought like you and was willing to even accept me dressed as a friend. But part of me understands exactly what Lucas appears to think as well, knowing that this is a turn-off for a spouse hits pretty hard, and I suspect he thinks that you will think this way about him for weeks or months, not just hours, after you see him dressed. The last thing I want to do is kill the moment(s) for my wife, and knowing she is just never going to be into this makes me keep this out of sight, out of mind, for her. For advice, all I can say is give it time. Reine's advice is spot-on IMO. Let him come to terms with this part of himself, and if he knows you don't think less of him as a man (I'm thinking you don't based on what you post), this phase will pass.

[Greenie]

Thanks everyone for responding.

I think its actually even harder for lucas to understand because I am NOT a heterosexual woman. I am bisexual and do find interest in women. But I like masculine women as well. So just the idea of him being super feminine doesnt get me. Just because I find SOME women attractive doesnt equate to me finding him as a woman attractive. I find him incredibly sexy as a man.

I just am not used to this yet. I feel like this ping pong thing that happens to me is true for a lot of women.

Isha: I helped lucas with his makeup and have painted his toenails. Those times were great bonding experiences. But how you bond with a sister or friend. But talking about things in "both" forms is a good idea.

Nicole: I feel like intimacy while dressed must be very important to him. E.g. the reaction he has to me not wanting to kiss him while dressed.

Jennifer: I feel like that's a harsh thing to say to him. And while I love your comment. I don't know how that would fly. But I can try.

Amy: he is very adamant about ALWAYS being lucas. SO I am not sure that would work. maybe that's why this is so hard. he always see's himself as the same person. I do recognize he is not a different person, its just what he looks like at that point in time is not appealing to me. :/ This sucks.


Stephanie:
Frankly, the more and more I read your threads, I'm feeling you're going to move away from the entire cross dressing aspect of your relationship. What do you mean by this? I haven't posted a thread in quite while. So I am not sure the direction you are going with this?

DOCROBBY: I think we just need to work it out. But I still don't know how to convince him that if he doesnt give me the CHANCE how can I do it?

EVERYONE: thank you all for posting. I love getting your input. That's why I am here right!?

I mean I would never ask him not to do it. And I have been trying to show him that I am here for him.

[Lynn Marie]

I'm one of the fortunate few who have girlfriends who embrace us in both modes. She loves me dressed, either way. Sometimes she wants to go out with me as a girlfriend to rattle the local bar patrons and other times she's happy to be on my arm as hunkyboy's date. She's gorgeous and a little different! I'm very fortunate. I would never expect her to be intimate with me in girl mode. Actually seems kind of weird to me.

[Devi]

My GF and I have exactly this dynamic. To her, Devi is her girlfriend, and we're never intimate when I dress as a girl. I didn't seek intimacy 'en femme' to begin with, so this wasn't something I was bothered by. She was accepting and participated in transforming me from the start, and still does so.

In the beginning, she had the same concern with 'getting back to the guy', and we followed exactly what you did - avoid intimacy during the night after an afternoon or evening of girl time. Again, I didn't push matters with her. I know she struggled for a while to wrap her head around being back with me as a guy. We talked a lot during this phase, and even the question of being platonic girlfriends rather than being in a relationship as a normal couple, was raised. She's an amazing person, and I really didn't want to lose her to the friend zone.

Over time, though, things got much better. We still aren't intimate when she dresses me up, which doesn't bother me, but progressively her need for time to 'switch back' decreased, and we're intimate soon after a girl session, sometimes. This took a few months. I'm not sure I did anything, other than assure her of the fact that I'd listen to her and support her emotional needs. Also, every one of our girl sessions have been initiated by her. Perhaps that helped, because there was never any compulsion from me to do this. In fact, on a couple of occasions I declined to crossdress when she suggested it, because I preferred to go out and so some normal couple things instead.

All I can suggest is to focus on relationship building in the conventional sense. While crossdressing is a part of us, I treat it as just that - a part of us. It's something we do once every few weeks, and gets just that much mindshare. The dressing sessions are fun, and she sometimes seeks my girl presence when she feels the need for 'female' company. Personally, I think focusing on building our conventional relationship was what quickly addressed her emotional concerns and helped her get used to 'switching back' faster.

[MatildaJ.]

Just because I find SOME women attractive doesn't equate to me finding him as a woman attractive.

Yes, exactly.


I think focusing on building our conventional relationship was what quickly addressed her emotional concerns and helped her get used to 'switching back' faster.

That seems very perceptive to me.

[Lucy_Bella]

Greenie,
For me , my dressing was always sexual.. My Ex was like you from the start ( accepting ) but in time that slowly faded away..I will take my share of the blame it was partly my fault..Like you, my Ex did not want any type of intimate touching while I was dressed she found it disgusting and was very vocal about it..So that kinda defeated my purpose ( as far as my dressing went) around her..We wasn't communicating about any of it ,I just found it best to keep the dressing away from her because she found it as a turn off..

Now this was 25 plus years ago ,no internet and I knew very little about why I had the desire to dress in femm I just knew I needed to do it and it was very hard to control..So in time the issue became a problem ( mostly because I didn't involve her and we never talked about it ).. I did my dressing while she ws away or when she was a sleep and that really bothered her ( like I said neither of us knew about cding at the time) so a lot fighting started between us because of it..I would tell her it was something I needed to do and she wanted me to stop.. I would promise to stop ( I really thought I could) and I did for months at a time and then the urges would come back...My Ex thought she knew me so well that she started picking fights with me when she thought I was dressing and I really wasn't most of the time ( trust issues) ,You get the picture it became real ugly..

Advice,

I would ask him to be open to you about what really drives him to dress..Is it a Gender thing or a sexual thing? At the same time you should be more vocal ( in a polite way) how you feel about it.. Let him know that It's fine you have little issues over it until it becomes intimate.. I wish I could have had that chance to go back and correct my behavior .. Maybe this will help you since I can not go back and fix my mistakes.. If it's a sexual thing maybe agree to no dressing in the bed for those moments but leading up to it compromise..It took a lot of courage for me to share my dressing with my wife ,but I thought she needed to know from the start.. It was embarrassing and degrading ,I felt less of a man and for her to be turned off by it hurt me because I didn't want my woman to be turned off by me or what I was doing ..So most of my marriage I felt shame because of it and nothing was done to correct that feeling..

[ReineD]

Just because I find SOME women attractive doesnt equate to me finding him as a woman attractive. I find him incredibly sexy as a man.

A good friend of mine is bi and she said something similar. She likes her women to be women, and her men to be men. It's wrong to assume that just because a person is bi, they will also be OK with gender variance or cross-gender expression. Some bis are OK with cross=gender expression, and some aren't, just as some hetero women are OK with it and some aren't.

[TheMissus]

Just keep in mind that our egos can be very fragile when CD'ing is involved, and just the smallest rejection in the early coming out period can be devastating. When you finally let out that secret you've been hiding most of your life (as is the case with most of us) to someone, it can be very difficult to process how the other reacts.....

Ana

Now see, this is annoying. How is a heterosexual woman who's likely never been exposed to crossdressing before meant to react well to such a revelation? Newsflash - we can't. My H is guilty of this as even to this day he still feels bad about himself when he remembers how surprised and horrified I was when I finally knew what he was doing. Of course, the horror is something that ebbs with time, but unless you're someone who has been exposed to CD, the response is not likely to be good.

Anyway, Greenie, your H sounds like he's being a bit self conscious because he didn't work through all this before meeting you. It's not for you to fix - he needs to sort this out himself. You are not obliged to enjoy this side of him if you can't and he really needs to understand this. I prefer not to see my H dressed and when I do I'll be honest and say the sex is slim for a while! This is what I consider the 'aftermath' of all this. I love my husband but he's the one who ultimately brings this difficult dynamic to the relationship so if it kills my attraction for a period, he needs to own that. It's hardly my fault I feel this way - I'm entitled to feel attracted to masculinity, as are you,

Good luck x

[Jenniferathome]

This is exactly the reason why I don't go full fem. Cause I am a straight male that just happens to like what society has determined to be women's clothes. Going full fem would mean I would completely close the door on who I want to have a relationship with cause straight women are not attracted to women. So by just wearing the clothes and not doing the makeup and wig I keep a balance. I get to wear whatever the freak I wanna wear and yet I still look like a guy...

Ryenmatt, you are grossly over simplifying the matter. For a typical woman, a man wearing women's clothes is really weird.

[Angie G]

My wife is very accepting to the point of even buying things for Angie. But it's not a big thing in the bedroom.I don't need 24/7 dressing but I would like it. I'm glad to give my wife what she need her husband on the weekends. In most cases it can't be all one sided. Let your s.o. know it is O.K. to dress just give you time to get your head around it.:hugs:
Angie

[audreyinalbany]

I"ve never really been interested in being intimate with my while while I'm dressed. We're pretty much in a DADT, although she's kind of mellowed a little bit over the years (when she gets home sometimes she;ll ask in a teasing manner if I 'got dressed up today.") and I'm one of the ones is really okay with that. I've never really sought my wife's participation probably because I worry how it would impact her perception of me. Not having seen me, she can still kind of pretend it doesn't exist; I'm afraid that her meeting 'Audrey" would just alter the way she sees me irrevocably and after 32 years of a really happy marriage, I don't wanna rock the boat.

[suchacutie]

My wife is the picture of support for Tina. She has, quite literally, taught Tina how to be a girl.

On the other hand, we were married for 33 years before Tina appeared, so our pattern of intimacy was quite mature by then. We are both heterosexual, and since Tina is clearly a separate person with her own likes, dislikes, and personality, it seemed quite natural for the two girls to be girlfriends, and not intimates. More than that, I think it very much helped Tina's evolution not to be saddled with the details of intimacy.

Like Sherry has mentioned, I also am not comfortable to be socialable during the process of transformation from one gendered self to another. Given that, I'm sure you can see that intimacy would be difficult for Tina since the nature of intimacy would blur the lines between my gendered selves. That's not to say that we don't discuss where the boundry is. For example, we suddenly realized a few weeks ago that we haven't figured out how to greet each other. We need a way to greet that doesn't freak either of us out! We clearly will not kiss, but do we hug? Are airkisses ok/needed? Handshaking seems silly...do we touch at all? It seems to us that the questions are not the important thing, per se, but the fact that we have these kinds of conversations is...communication is so much the key. As man and wife, we have no uncertainty about how we greet each other in public or private.

So that gets back to the original question. Can he articulate what he feels, and can he "walk a mile in your shoes" metaphorically (he probably can physically). Also, if he considers himself the same person dressed or not, might calling him by his femme name during some portion of intimacy be enough to bridge the gap you are experiencing? After that he might be able to consider himself a platonic girlfriend when dressed?

No one ever said that a male with a femme self was uncomplicated :)

[~Joanne~]

Is this level of acceptance better than none at all?

I would say it is. Like you stated in your post, there are a LOT of girls here that don't even get the slightest bit of acceptance so I believe that is a situation that they can live with as lucas should.

Would that be something YOU as a CDer could live with from your SO?

Yes, and I do. While my SO is accepting, encouraging, and supportive, she will not kiss me while I am dressed other than the cheek and I can live with it. It funny though, because she will do "it" while I am dressed but the wig has got to come off lol I can live with this also. Thing is, My CDing is for me and me alone. It's not meant to be for her also so if she has concerns or a discomfort with anything, we can work around it. seeing that I do not dress all the time, most of it never becomes an issue for us.

[Lorileah]

You know, I'm wondering if he's projecting his own feelings of inadequacy as a man when dressed, onto you.
Ouch.

Now the he's projecting his own feelings, I agree with. Been there.

Now to Greenie's OP. How do you get around your feelings? :idontknow: You can train yourself to do things you normally don't like to do (like go to work in the morning). But is that what you really want to do? Maybe if you could see him as the person you love no matter what he is wearing it might help. Can you look through the trappings and see the love of your life? Personally, I think this is the key, to know it is the same person no matter how he presents. Kind of a really bad analogy( when I say bad I mean as icky awful) but what if...what if he somehow had something that happened the permanently changed him? You know the classic "Ruby, don't take you love to town" thing, maybe Phantom of the Opera thing. How could you get beyond that? I say love would conquer that, but is your love that strong? My wife had breast cancer surgery, it changed how she felt about herself, especially sexually. But it didn't change how I felt about her. She was still "her". I didn't see that lack of part of her. It wasn't why I wanted to be with her. Meh? I don't know if that makes sense because she didn't "choose" to express something that she could change at the drop of a hat. But I know men who won't have any physical relations with their wives until the defect is corrected. Why, because they don't see the woman anymore. I know couples who have broken up over this (and even more commonly...the man sees his wife age but he doesn't see himself age and that is why he leaves...rarely do you hear a woman say "well he got old and I wasn't attracted anymore"...which brings up a point, women do tend to adapt better than men do)

[MatildaJ.]

Maybe if you could see him as the person you love no matter what he is wearing it might help. Can you look through the trappings and see the love of your life? Personally, I think this is the key, to know it is the same person no matter how he presents.

If someone falls into a deep depression, or becomes alcoholic, is it helpful to tell their spouse -- 'but it's the same person under there'? The spouse still has to figure out if they like the person they're living with. As long as my husband behaves more or less like the person I married, then I don't care what he wears. But if he becomes really sulky and self-centered, or wants radical changes to our sex life, then does it really matter if he feels that he's still the same person in there? I still need to figure out if I can live with this person and be intimate together.

[kimdl93]

From what I've read hear, quite a few CDrs have wives who simply do not want or cannot feel sexually attracted to their SO when she's dressed. Its understandable, because even if a CDr isn't particularly passable, they certainly have the appearance and in some cases give non-verbal cues of femininity. Unless a GG is at least a bit curious ;) those may not be the sexual cues she responds to.

Can you learn to indulge this your SO's dressing within a sexual context? I don't see why not. Sex is part ingrained attraction and part learned behavior. If you're a bit adventurous, you could probably find a way to coax your SO to participate.

[Lorileah]

If someone falls into a deep depression, or becomes alcoholic, is it helpful to tell their spouse -- 'but it's the same person under there'?

that is so telling to me. You see Crossdressing as the same as depression or alcoholism. In other words you see it as a problem. And to answer the question, you would work to help that person right? I see crossdressing (or transgenderism or whatever you want to describe it as) as being the same person, just presenting in a different manner. It isn't an psychological problem nor an addiction. And therein lies the difference. It IS the same person. And if my SO became depressed or was an alcoholic, I would still love them and see the person I love, but I would want to help them.

[ryenmatt]

I am a simple man who likes simple things. :) :). Simplicity is my way of life.

That is why I am always up front with it as well so she knows right from the start what she is getting into. I figured they deserve that. Women are always talking about how they want a honest man and an open relationship. With me you get that from day one. There is no 3 years or 3 days or whatever down the road "oh by the way I am a crossdresser." Which is probably why I am still single. Aren't we suppose to be fighting to change that weird feeling. It was weird when women started wearing pants and men's clothes wasn't it?? Today it is commonplace and nobody thinks it is weird. Come to think of it how many gg do you see wearing skirts and dresses these days to begin with. I don't see many. Most of the GG's I see are wearing pants or shorts or leggings not very many wear skirts and dresses anymore. It was weird when gays started coming out more openly in public wasn't it??? It is weird when you see someone eating a snickers bar with a fork and knife isn't it??

[ReineD]

Ouch.

Now the he's projecting his own feelings, I agree with. Been there.

Just to be clear, Lori, I'm not saying that a CDer is less than a man (assuming that he identifies as a man, like Greenie's SO). I'm saying that some (many?) CDers feel that way until they've accepted the CDing. I certainly don't think that CDers are less than men. I've never thought that, not even when I didn't know any CDers.





Also, to go along with Jess (I think I see her point), it is not the CDing that bothers wives so much as some of the behaviors that can potentially be associated with it. For example, a husband may begin to get off on T-porn where this was not there before, and this takes energy away from his sexual relationship with his wife. Or, he may begin to spend A LOT of free time online looking at and buying clothes, bidding on eBay, etc, where before he would have watched a movie with his wife. Or, he might insist that his wife be OK with a femme presentation in bed while she is sexually turned off the image of being with a woman. Or, he might begin to spend a lot of time grooming himself, planning clothes for outings, going out a lot dressed, in other words to his wife it seems as if he is obsessed in comparison to before.

I have none of these issues with my SO now, even though she goes out on average twice per week. She has done a great job balancing it all. But there are CDers who stay in Pink Fogs for awhile and this can be really hard on a wife especially when she doesn't know what's coming up next.

[NicoleScott]

Maybe if you could see him as the person you love no matter what he is wearing it might help. Can you look through the trappings and see the love of your life? Personally, I think this is the key, to know it is the same person no matter how he presents.

Greenie never said she didn't love him when he's dressed, just that she doesn't feel like intimacy with him at that time. Her lack of physical attraction to someone looking like a woman is not hers alone to fix. It's not fair to lay this in Greenie's lap to "deal with it". It's like saying "Greenie, if you can't be intimate with him when he looks like a woman, just close your eyes. It's still him."

[Greenie]

Thanks for that Nicole. That's exactly what I was thinking.

I know that the man beneath the clothes is the sexy man I love. I KNOW that. Its just hard to get in the mood when he looks so awkward and silly. He also ACTS differently. And that is off-putting as well. But I really want to get past this. I really do. But I feel like I am the only one working to move past this, while he is upset that the results are not IMMEDIATE. He gets discouraged because when he is dressed it feels awkward. Instead of pushing through and working through it, he gives up. I have given him a small peck and held his hand while he was dressed. We sit on the couch and I lay my legs on top of his. Its not like there is NO touching. I just feel strange.

[Lorileah]

But how can I get used to it. If he won't let me?

Do any of you have any advice?

I didn't say it would not take time. I was just suggesting that looking beyond the physical may help (which is what I think was the OP question right...getting through the current mind set?). And I assume that Greenies SO isn't addicted to porn, abusive, drunk, mean, aggressive while dressed. (S)he is just overly feminine (how many times do we hear that here? Where CDs go way beyond what is needed). That in my mind is the issue. If (s)he were to act just like (s)he does when presenting in male mode Greenie wold have less of an issue. So, Greenie asked how she could get through this. I offered MY solution, most the rest of the posts here are just commiserating. She asked how she could work to get used to it. Sure her SO has issues all his own. He needs to work on those.

I remember two posts here saying that relearning is the key. I don't remember anyone offering Greenie other advice. So people how can Greenie "get used to it"? especially if he won't help. My suggestion was evidently "wrong", trying to see the person not in a dressing way, but as the person she loves. I await the answers.

[Lucy_Bella]

I await the answers.

Great question Lorileah... Apparently the dressing is causing Greenie to shy away from intimacy ..Other than that she is okay with the dressing.. This is a rough question to answer because her S.O. doesn't like to dress in front of her because he can see the disappointment in her eyes..Maybe Greenie doesn't realize the signals ( or the facial expressions) she gives out when he is dressed..Like I said it takes a lot of courage for some of us to ( be our true selves ) dress in front of S.O.'s ( wives) and maybe it could be her S.O. reads more into the facial expressions..

Greenie , you are on the right tract for setting up boundries ..I would keep the line of communicating open and maybe you two can find a happy medium that will suit the both of you especially when it comes time for the ( it it)..

[MatildaJ.]

he is upset that the results are not IMMEDIATE. He gets discouraged because when he is dressed it feels awkward. Instead of pushing through and working through it, he gives up.

If he gives up, then you being patient isn't going to help the situation. I think you've done your part. Your partner needs to face his problems, whether it's depression or anxiety or impatience or whatever. (Not the cross-dressing itself, but the poor relationship skills and/or poor self-image which lead to his sulking and discouragement.) Cognitive behavioral therapy can help with those issues, but only if he goes into it accepting that he needs to do some work and with an open mind. You can't do that work for him. This is part of growing up, and you can only hope that he's ready to do his part.


If (s)he were to act just like (s)he does when presenting in male mode Greenie would have less of an issue....So people how can Greenie "get used to it"? especially if he won't help. My suggestion was evidently "wrong", trying to see the person not in a dressing way, but as the person she loves. I await the answers.

Many crossdressers (or at least my crossdresser) don't act the same in male & female modes. You're definitely right to name that as part of the problem. As for finding answers, that's not something any of us can do as long as Greenie's significant other isn't interested in working toward a better shared life for the two of them.

(And just to address your earlier comment: I don't see cross-dressing as the same as depression or alcoholism, or smoking e-cigs, another comparison I made in a different thread. Those are all analogies, which means that I think they are useful comparisons, even though none of them are perfect. One could compare crossdressing to getting involved in role-playing games, or to taking up any time-consuming hobby...But the secretive aspect of this does affect the marriage differently. Here's another analogy: suppose one's spouse wanted to spend every evening wearing diapers or dressed as a pony. None of these analogies are perfect; they're just ways of talking about the issue a little differently, to change up the conversation that usually happens here.)

[Lucy_Bella]

Here's another analogy: suppose one's spouse wanted to spend every evening wearing diapers or dressed as a pony. None of these analogies are perfect; they're just ways of talking about the issue a little differently, to change up the conversation that usually happens here.)

Great analogy Jess :),

Now would the person dressed as a pony act like a pony? Would the person wearing a diaper act like a baby and want you to change their soiled diaper? You make a great point that could cover a large portion of CDer's.. But it still leaves the door open a bit as I pointed out with your analogy ( it was good one though:) )..Hope you don't mind if I extended it some..

If a cder is dressed as a female is he she expressing that gender while dressed in front of you or is he just a guy wearing a dress? Me I am the same person there is no girl mode other than how I dress..Kinda like just enjoy wearing diapers but I don't expect you to change me or acting the whole baby thing out .. ( I don't like wearing diapers by the way} ..

[Devi]

Its just hard to get in the mood when he looks so awkward and silly. He also ACTS differently. And that is off-putting as well. But I really want to get past this. I really do.
Whose desire is driving this ? Does he want you to be intimate while he's en femme, or do you want to surmount this and be able to be intimate, in order to please him/her ?

Something like this cannot be forced. My GF was aware I've been intimate in girl mode before. She considered herself openminded and had even dressed up a previous (non CD) BF for Halloween. But seeing me en femme in real ilfe did take her some getting used to. This was partly because - as she said - I looked and acted feminine. Another GG friend said the same, that I mirror actions and change mannerisms en femme, though none of this is practiced on my part. Further, she felt pressurized by the need to 'be more accepting' and do things she was clearly struggling to handle emotionally.

I told her to back of from pushing herself in this manner. I wasn't pressuring her to be intimate. I'm being very honest when I say that, despite the platonic interaction as girlfriends, I truly enjoy our girl time, because it's she who suggests the moments, and actively participates in them. I couldn't bring myself to enjoy it if I compelled her to do things. The most enjoyable aspect of this for me is that she's at peace with our girl time dynamic, and seeks it herself.

Just not imposing any sort of pressure on her, and more importantly, telling her not to feel compelled to strive for defined some arbitrary set level of acceptance, had worked very well. It let us both put aside any explicit or implied pressure in this interaction, and let us enjoy girl times better. I also think it contributed to her progressive comfort with being able to be intimate with me as a guy, right after a dressing date, as opposed to several hours later. Maybe in future it will extend to intimate times while we're having a girl date, but I don't want to lead it that way. If it happens, it will be because she reached a point when she could look at me en femme and 'see through it' and want to be intimate, entirely on her own accord.

People evolve over time. In my experience, that evolution towards a mutually satisfying comfort level requires not having any 'must have' requirements, beyond the basic foundation of the woman being able to acknowledge that her partner crossdresses and that he's still desirable to her. Every couple has their own comfort level. If you feel compelled to try to find her desirable en femme, you ought to back off a bit and instead focus on enjoying girl time without that hanging over your head. If your partner compels you to do so, it's important that he stop doing so and not force a level of acceptance of his definition.

[ReineD]

So people how can Greenie "get used to it"? especially if he won't help. My suggestion was evidently "wrong", trying to see the person not in a dressing way, but as the person she loves. I await the answers.

I went off on a tangent before. The behaviors that I described I'm sure do not apply to Greenie's SO.

How can Greenie "get used to it"? The only way that I've ever seen it work, is if both partners stretch beyond their comfort zones a bit.

Greenie's SO needs to slow down and allow Greenie to catch up. And Greenie needs to begin stretching one itty bitty baby step at a time. So Greenie, if just hanging out with your SO while he's dressed while putting your feet on his lap is a bit of a stretch for you, then you're doing what you can. If you do this a few times in a row, it might get comfortable enough and then you could maybe try watching a movie with your SO while you're mushed into each other on the couch (don't know how to explain it better). So do that until it feel comfortable, and then maybe a kiss that's more than a peck on the cheek. If you keep going at that rate, maybe in 6 to 12 months, you won't notice that he's dressed anymore, and he won't detect any changes in your mood when he does dress. This is when it will get easier.

And ask him to be patient with you while you ask all the questions that you need to ask, even if you ask the same thing in several different ways, because you are having a hard time getting it. I think that good communication does help to banish all the gobblins. And HIS job is to know that the more you talk, the easier it will get and also he needs to continue to appreciate you for your stretches.

Eventually, you'll both get on the same page.

Honestly I think that he just wants to feel as if you still love him while he's dressed, and for a guy this means some physical affection ... even if it is not going all the way in the bedroom?

Last Greenie, I'd try working on letting go of the dressing when it's over with and your SO goes to bed in guy mode. Try to not hang on to what transpired a few hours earlier, if you can.

EDIT - Just saw the bit about your SO acting differently. Yeah ... it's difficult when that happens. But it's been my experience that this sort of behavior does go away in time, the more your SO will integrate her feminine feelings into the rest of him.

[Diversity]

Hi Greenie,
In my humble opinion, you are fine in expressing your honest feelings. Don't change this. You also are very kind and understanding to allow Lucas his freedom of expression in dressing. It is totally understandable that you may never fully accept his CD'ing to the extent of it being something which you can become sexually aroused by. Lucas must understand this. The fact that you are willing to give this more time to see if you can further adjust, is the epitome of your love and desire to try to accept him. Lucas also must reciprocate in kind and understand that the desired outcome may never eventuate.
My advice is that you both continue to be honest and open with one another and never hide your true feelings about this situation. I do believe that eventually love will conquer all, and that you will both fine a happy medium, which will work best for you both. Good luck, and I wish you all my best for your future together.
It already seems to be heading in the right direction in that you appear to be very accepting and understanding of Luke's CD'ing.
Di

[Greenie]

Well the diaper thing and the pony thing got me laughing a little bit. I mean that seems a silly way to look at it, but yeah. Its hard because he keeps telling me that he doesnt want a feminine personality or name and that he wants to always be Lucas, just Lucas in a dress. Well If that is true.... Why does his body language get more "feminine". His whole personality changes. I guess in reality I am not just scared of what he looks like. I am scared of what this can turn into in the future.

I think that I haven't been totally upfront. Lucas and I lack intimacy even when he is in male mode. We both work a lot. We are always tired. We have opposite schedules. We don't have relations very often. Definitely not often enough. I would like to have it more. But there have been other issues in our lives that have led to this. I think that fear of intimacy while CDing is the manifestation of a lot. CDing is the physical representation of the lying, (the porn some one brought that up.. And yes it has been an issue in the past) and then the concern.

When we don't "mush together on the couch and makeout during movies" in regular mode, I don't know how we can do it in CD mode. I think that you all have offered me some really good advice. I think that in reality, we need to figure out

A.) what is important to him: I have tried but those conversations always go south because someone starts crying and then it goes no where. (its not always me btw ) :(
B) If he can give me another chance and dress in front of me. He needs to ALLOW me to have free reign of my feelings and not decide for me before hand what my feelings are going to be/look like
C.) Once he does, I need to try to look past the clothes, and he needs to try to act like regular lucas in front of me.
D.) I want to suggest female clothes that are not dresses and skirts. I know this doesnt normally do it for you guys, but jeans and a cute top for starters might help. (is this selfish to ask?)

[NicoleScott]

Its hard because he keeps telling me that he doesnt want a feminine personality or name and that he wants to always be Lucas, just Lucas in a dress. Well If that is true.... Why does his body language get more "feminine". His whole personality changes. I guess in reality I am not just scared of what he looks like. I am scared of what this can turn into in the future.



I would ask him to be open to you about what really drives him to dress..Is it a Gender thing or a sexual thing?

Or some of both or something else?
Greenie, I don't know how you can calm your fears if you don't get the answer to the question Lucy_Bella asked. He may not know for sure where this is headed, but he should level with you on where he is now, what drives him to dress, and where he would like this to go.
Many of us like being male but just like to dress up occasionally (or often). Others have posted that they hate being male. You have a right to know.

[Chickhe]

My wife is a little like that too. She said she is not attracted to crossdressers, but yet...here we are! ...but, what I think she means is that she doesn't like the image of partially male and female (beard and dress) ... but also if I am dressed fully, she is more factual about it than anything else...its more like she just wants me to look good and appreciates the effort I put in. But, if we do go out to a party, after that the IT you talk about is very good. I think its the thrill of living on the wild side once a year that does it. For us, its fun event, usually a party at halloween and otherwise I'm a normal guy the rest of the time living an average normal life (if I do dress its usually on my own).

Intimacy... had some issues with my wife too related to schedules and stuff. What it was for me, I felt pressure to be intimate. I would feel guilty because she would say I didn't love her...etc etc...I do, but sometimes you -are- just tired. The way we resolved it was to stop pressuring ourselves to be intimate.... just hold hands and hug each other sometimes, but only if you feel like it or just make sure you send some time together with no strings attached. Then your relationship grows better.

[DonnaT]

I don't wear my wig or makeup around my wife. She can't get used to it, and it has been 38 years, although she did like it at first.

However, if we were being passionate in bed, she would sometimes ask me to put on a nightie and even the wig.

I eventually began wearing a nightie every night.

[Allison Chaynes]

I want to suggest female clothes that are not dresses and skirts. I know this doesnt normally do it for you guys, but jeans and a cute top for starters might help. (is this selfish to ask?)

No, it isn't unreasonable at all. My wife seems more accepting when I wear something less feminine, even androgynous, like jeans. Believe it or not, some of us like wearing things our SO's pick out for us.

The only advice I'd give further to any SO on this topic is, don't purge your CD's things without their permission. We went through this once and neither of us was happy with the other afterward.

[OzSam]

I think that I haven't been totally upfront. Lucas and I lack intimacy even when he is in male mode. We both work a lot. We are always tired. We have opposite schedules. We don't have relations very often. Definitely not often enough.
Hmm. Lots of challenges there. Do you ever have a vacation with just the two of you, where you can both get plenty of sleep, and be on the same schedules? I have a busy job, and also run a crazy number of kms a week, so I am often exhausted, but we also work on making time for just us, and so trips away together have definitely helped. Might take some planning, but is your relationship worth it?

[ryenmatt]

Well if he acts differently when he is dressed then when he is not dressed then that definitely is a problem that needs to be addressed. I for one am the same person regardless of what I am wearing cause I see them as just clothes and nothing more cause that is all they are are pieces of fabric.

[Tina_gm]

Greenie, my wife feels somewhat the same. Her biggest obstacle to me cding is that she does not feel that she can view it right now. She does not know if she will ever be able to. Her reasons are that she is afraid that by seeing me she will not be able to get the image from her head.... and will not be able to look at me or feel the same about me. She knows that it would make things easier for the both of us if she could, but just isn't there yet. She, like many GG's does not find it a turn on. In fact it would be a turn off for her as well. So I am guessing that she feels it may ruin our intimacy. She is also worried that I will want to dress much more often if I do dress in front of her. I was honest in telling her that it would give me more time to dress . I cannot say for certain just how often I would dress if there was more opportunity other than I would dress more often.

[KellyJameson]

I'm not sure you can, particularly if you are aroused by extremely masculine looking men.

Your sexuality was shaped by the interplay of estrogen and progesterone when you were still in the womb that shaped the structure of your brain along genetic lines.

Think of yourself as being made up of two energies and one of these is dominant and the other submissive inside you which create a type of yin and yang effect and this is true for everyone regardless of who they are because the universe and everything in it is made up of a duality of polarities and with us it is made up of chemical polarities that energize and influence us.

Your sexuality is chemically created, not only by how these chemicals shaped your brain but how they continue to shape what you are sexually attracted to.

I will give you an example. Chest hair and muscles are powerful sexual triggers for certain woman and this would be an example of what I mean by a masculine appearance.

It does not surprise me in the least when men feminize their appearance and their wives lose interest sexually because sexual attraction is mainly subconscious so you have little control over what arouses you.

Breast growth must be a huge trigger for a woman because it would take her directly into the experience of being sexual with another woman. This must touch a woman at her very core sexually.

An aspect of sexual attraction for a woman is power and usually it is having this power move toward her and envelop her while she moves toward it as attraction.

His masculine energy "electrifies you" and 'excites you" by how he looks and acts but once again it depends on what kind of woman you are as your own "energy"

Some woman are repulsed or put off by this masculine energy and will seek out a more feminine looking or acting man such as a "pretty boy" and once again this is simply because of how you have been and are being shaped by sexual chemicals flowing through you.

It is well known that birth control changes the type of man a woman is attracted to and it also changes what type of men are attracted to her.

In my opinion everyone has a "natural sexuality" that is physically designed into them and you can only bend this so far without breaking it.

Women do have more latitude because they do not depend on an erection but it will still be difficult to hide "attraction" as your feelings that flash across your face and enliven your body.

If feminine men in the past sexually aroused you than you will not have to bend your sexuality as far as if very masculine men aroused you.

For me I would find a feminine looking or acting man to be a sexual turn off but I like them for friends because of their emotional sensitivity or at least until they get on my nerves because sometimes it becomes to much.

You would have to know yourself as your natural energy by what has sexually excited you in the past which is expressed as "attraction" to the masculine or feminine in a man by how he looks and or acts.

I cannot imagine a woman being attracted to a feminine man but I have a real blind spot there and intellectually I know many woman are but I cannot understand how they can be sexually excited by them.

[Lucy_Bella]

Well the diaper thing and the pony thing got me laughing a little bit. I mean that seems a silly way to look at it, but yeah.

Well let's use it some more..:)


A.) what is important to him: I have tried but those conversations always go south because someone starts crying and then it goes no where. (its not always me btw ) :( . This would wearing a diaper and wanting to be treated like a baby.. As other members mentioned already your S.O. brought this to the table she/he should be adult enough to discuss it with you openly, you have every right to know..I've been a memeber of this site for 5 years ( on and off) ..I have read plenty of threads about how a wife was okay ,at first, with the dressing .. But eventually it all fell apart.. From reading the replies of the long term relationships to these threads I have noticed a trend that made these long term relationships successful ..Communicating and not just talking to please each other half heartedly but serious ,open all out communication..

This type of communication allows you and your S.O.to know where you stand with the issue, how much you can take and when is the best time..Also being honest with each other even if it hurts at first, things like how far will this go and who needs to know..,



B) If he can give me another chance and dress in front of me. He needs to ALLOW me to have free reign of my feelings and not decide for me before hand what my feelings are going to be/look likeThat's good!! If you don't mind him/her wearing the diaper but do not like him/her acting like a baby ..That is your right ..It takes two and believe me I am sure he wants to dress in front of you again, no need to beg him/her just be patient ..:) Don't forget it's what he/she wants or needs to do,, not you ..

C.) Once he does, I need to try to look past the clothes, and he needs to try to act like regular lucas in front of me. So what I am reading here is..You are just "okay" with him "just "wearing the diaper..That is why you need to ask him /her what is driving the urge to dress ..If it's gender related than it may never be "just " only about wearing the diaper..



D.) I want to suggest female clothes that are not dresses and skirts. I know this doesnt normally do it for you guys, but jeans and a cute top for starters might help. (is this selfish to ask?)Now you might be taking the diaper completely out of the issue..What I mean by that is ..If it is sexual than it's the attraction of the type of clothing...If it's gender, I am sure most members here will agree that it is a very positive compromise and he/or she should jump right on that..

Thank you for reading and don't forget my tag line below ..I am only comment on my on issue and can not speak on behalf of others.. There are so many different type's of cding under one umbrella which is why communicating with your S.O. is so important ..

[nikkim83]

So I have a question.

I know a lot of you have supportive wives/SO's and a lot of you don't.

I consider myself "pretty accepting". But lucas and I got into a conversation about the limits to my acceptance.

When he is dressed. It feels like we are girls who are friends. Not a couple. I don't necessarily mind seeing him dressed, I just can't look at him sexually when he is. This normally continues on into the night. E.g. He dresses in the afternoon/ evening. That night, it (you know.. IT, IT.) is not really going to happen.

I am just not there yet. I will hold his hand, but I don't really like to kiss him while dressed.

So Lucas told me that he doesn't dress in front of me anymore because he doesn't like the way "I look" at him while dressed. He doesn't like not feeling like a couple.

But how can I get used to it. If he won't let me?

Do any of you have any advice?

What if I never can? Would that be something YOU as a CDer could live with from your SO? Is this level of acceptance better than none at all?

My wife is the exact same way. While I am more comfortable in a skirt than jeans, it isn't like I can fault my wife for how she feels. I am greatly appreciative of our girls night in. At the same time that is the one thing I miss when dressed up is how my wife looks at me, She doesn't like to kiss or be romantic, can't say that I blame her.

[Michelle55]

I appear to be in the minority here. My wife loves to be intimate with me in guy mode or as Michelle. She considers herself probably Bi, but has never had any intimate contact with a GG. I'd consider myself to be Bi too, but never been intimate with a guy.

So.... I guess I'm one of the few with extra options. Now the only problem is my wife's menopause. It has greatly reduced her desire and also has made being intimate uncomfortable for her. Yes, she talked to her gyno and other doctors. She's tried everything offered and still it's a problem.

Even though we have these problems I still feel I'm the luckiest person here. I can be Michelle any time I want as long as it doesn't interfere with making a living.

[Nyla F]

What if I never can? Would that be something YOU as a CDer could live with from your SO? Is this level of acceptance better than none at all?

This must be very scary. I know it is for me as a CDer, afraid that if I push my crossdressing to far I will alienate her. She is afraid too, I think she tolerates more than she is really ok with for fear of pushing me away. So we both have made compromises. It is worse when there is a general lack of intimacy, the whole relationship seems more fragile. We were stuck there for a very long time. Something miraculous happened a few years ago and we got the intimacy back. When people see us now they think we are newlyweds! The CD boundaries haven't changed dramatically, we still have those fears, but for me at least I can say that I have more satisfaction because of the intimacy. I can live with this arrangement.

[AmyGaleRT]

... he keeps telling me that he doesnt want a feminine personality or name and that he wants to always be Lucas, just Lucas in a dress. Well If that is true.... Why does his body language get more "feminine". His whole personality changes.

Hmm...I look at this and it seems to me that he actually does have a nascent feminine persona, even if he doesn't acknowledge "her" and hasn't named "her." This is the same sort of "switch" I do as I put on Amy's clothes; I "naturally" fall into a more feminine mode of walking and sitting, my voice clicks into Amy-voice, and so forth.

It may be that, as he feels more comfortable in the feminine role, he may be more willing to acknowledge this about himself. As I'm sure you've seen, for many of us, "building up" our femmeselves and turning them from mere shadows into three-dimensional identities can almost be a "rite of passage." But I can't speak for him on this, and I'm pretty sure he'd probably deny it, at least right now. :)

- Amy

[sometimes_miss]

Your sexuality was shaped by the interplay of estrogen and progesterone when you were still in the womb that shaped the structure of your brain along genetic lines.
And yet, there's no evidence that the structure defines our sexual identity or who we're attracted to.


Think of yourself as being made up of two energies and one of these is dominant and the other submissive inside you which create a type of yin and yang effect and this is true for everyone regardless of who they are because the universe and everything in it is made up of a duality of polarities and with us it is made up of chemical polarities that energize and influence us.
Well, not everyone. There's a lot more going on than just dom/sub feelings in most people.


Breast growth must be a huge trigger for a woman because it would take her directly into the experience of being sexual with another woman. This must touch a woman at her very core sexually.
So how do you attribute attraction to flat chested women?


It is well known that birth control changes the type of man a woman is attracted to and it also changes what type of men are attracted to her.
Never heard of those studies. Besides, unless she changes her appearance drastically, how would it change who's attracted to her; men are mostly visual creatures, as our initial attraction is on appearance?
(see bottom of this post for proof of this)
Unless you're talking about huge behavior changes taking a woman from a wallflower to the dancing on the tables type?


In my opinion everyone has a "natural sexuality" that is physically designed into them and you can only bend this so far without breaking it.
Are you referring to sexual gender identity of to the attractiveness of the individual?


Women do have more latitude because they do not depend on an erection but it will still be difficult to hide "attraction" as your feelings that flash across your face and enliven your body.
Most men can't read those IOA (indicators of attraction). I'm guessing most women can, but may not always know exactly what they are seeing, i.e., they're using 'woman's intuition' (a subconscious reading of another person's behavior and speech patterns to determine what they're feeling).


If feminine men in the past sexually aroused you than you will not have to bend your sexuality as far as if very masculine men aroused you.
Seems odd. Going in reverse, I'm attracted to feminine women. I don't find, nor can I imagine, being attracted to masculine women. I'd be interested in women (real women, GG's) chiming in on this one.


I cannot imagine a woman being attracted to a feminine man but I have a real blind spot there and intellectually I know many woman are but I cannot understand how they can be sexually excited by them.
Simple. For any given type, there will be someone, somewhere that is attracted to them. There may not be a lot of them, we crossdressers are a perfect example of a group who seem to outnumber those who are attracted to us by the millions.

Proof that we are basically attracted to appearance. Consider; You're going to a social party, you're single. You walk into the room; you look around. In that first sixty seconds, you already know which members of the opposite sex that you want to meet with regards to finding an intimate partner, and you know nothing about them other than what they look like. Sure, you'll whittle that number down as you get to know them, but your initial attraction was 100% physical, and you also ruled OUT a lot of people as well.

[luca]

I guess I really am just insecure about it. I don't need or expect any bedroom play when I dress in front of her, but I do let my insecurities affect me otherwise. If she seems put off I fear that the little time we get together is ruined for her and that we will be less intimate not only for the evening, but for an undisclosed amount of time afterward.I am (annoyingly so) the kind of person who looks at your facial expression when I'm showing you a video that I find funny. Without even realizing it I watch and determine whether or not it was a mistake and I wasted your time or something you enjoyed. When dressed in front of her I look to see if I'm ruining our precious time together.

I know that this is unfair and really just immature of me. We talked recently I just didn't even stop to think of how I didn't give her the chance to get used to it (as well as offer myself the chance to get used to this and let my self get used to having a different reaction from her than when I am her sexy man). I would like to think that I am different mostly (leaving room for other variables here) because I just sit with my insecurities and unrealistic expectations that she be super sweet and treat me with emotional kid gloves. For me there is a lot to take from this, but I feel like my first step is to just man up, pull on my.big girl underwear, and spend some time with her trying to let us get used to it and deal with it instead of deciding it's too much and letting my fears stop us from growing together.

I apologize, I get rambly when I write on the forum.

[Lucy_Bella]

.

I apologize, I get rambly when I write on the forum. Hi ...First off I think it's great you answered to this thread.. That shows progress ... I have been dressing for over 40 years on and off and to this date I know very little to why I do it..

Its because I clammed up mostly thought I was to macho to talk about it, even to my wife most of the time...I mean hell I am the man!! That's where I made my mistake..I thought I could bottle it up and it would go away ..Now it's come down to learning how to live with it and finding ways to accept it because I don't see it going away..

You are very lucky to have an accepting S.O. and I know I don't need to tell you that but the key is....Let her feel lucky to be able to share what you have with her and I know it's going to take some time and in small steps ..But you can do it I see that because you answered in this thread..

Good luck from here out I'm pulling for ya..

[Greenie]

I told luca about all the great advice I was receiving and how he should get back on the forum and read it. Looks like that happened. Now we have some tools to use in our next conversation about this, thanks to all of you lovely ladies.

I appreciate all of you.

And I love you hunny. :)

[Di]

You go through this ......you are finding your way......Greenie is finding hers and you will find what works for you both. It has to be about you both for it to work long term. :hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs::hugs:

[ReineD]

Luca, reading your post #66 and Greenie's post #51, I get warm fuzzies that everything will be OK between you. :hugs:

I'm so happy that you are hearing Greenie's POV just as I'm glad that Greenie is willing to go to the extra mile to understand and accept the crossdressing. This can be challenging for a lot of (most?) GGs. Please do pay particular attention to Greenie's A/B/C/D points in #51 and also, POST HERE more if you find that self-doubts and insecurities about the crossdressing will return. You'll find there are a lot of CDers who are just like you and who have gone through what you went through and lots of GGs who have gone through what Greenie is going through who can help you. There's no shame in reaching out to a community for help with something for which there really is no blueprint.

This place can be an invaluable (and free :)) resource if you use it properly, and many things related to the crossdressing really do transcend ages and generations.

Again, good on the two of you!!

:hugs: :hugs: :hugs:

[MatildaJ.]

I guess I really am just insecure about it... I feel like my first step is to just man up, pull on my.big girl underwear, and spend some time with her trying to let us get used to it and deal with it instead of deciding it's too much and letting my fears stop us from growing together

Yes, this is right on target. Baby steps are a good way to move forward. Just be together, do something you both find enjoyable (card game, surfing the internet, watching a fun movie, listening to some favorite music...), while you're dressed enough to feel happy & calm (or whatever emotion it brings out in you). Just spend a couple of hours that way. And later, maybe talk about it, or not, depending on how you like to process. Then plan another evening like that, but also plan some fun evenings with you in guy clothes. Great to hear how you guys are working things out together!

[PaulaQ]

I know that this is unfair and really just immature of me. We talked recently I just didn't even stop to think of how I didn't give her the chance to get used to it (as well as offer myself the chance to get used to this and let my self get used to having a different reaction from her than when I am her sexy man).

Well, it is unfair in the sense that you are most likely projecting your own thoughts and insecurities onto Greenie, since you can't truly know what she thinks. However, many TG people develop this habit as a survival mechanism. When you are trying to hide something from the world, you learn to "read" people's faces, because not doing so can be really dangerous to your emotional and sometimes even physical safety. I'm quite good at this myself. I don't think your tendency to do this is so much "immature" as it is "unhelpful" in your situation with Greenie. Hey, she's not the enemy, she's got your back, you don't need to walk on eggshells around her.