Base Line hormones?

[traci_k]

Needless to say I won't go into all the difficulties I have with my wife trying to understand why I would want to transition. As a fundamentalist her belief is that it is just an addiction (the pink fog). So I asked my GP to write a script for serum estrogen and testosterone levels. From what I've been reading normal estrogen levels for a male should be between 10-50 pg/ml, and normal pre-menopausal women from 150-280 pg/ml or so. So I was surprised when my estrogen came in at 158 pg/ml. Still on the low end of normal for a woman but several times higher than for a normal male. Testosterone levels were in normal range for a male too but on the low end. I was wondering if anyone would be willing to share their baseline levels before starting HRT?

Thanks all!

Hugs,

[stefan37]

No idea what my estradiol levels were. My T level was 850.

[Katelyn B]

Pre HRT
my Oestradiol level was 120 pmol/L (32.69 pg/mL)
my Testosterone level was 30.7 nmol/L (884.72 ng/dL)
Hope that helps

[Michelle.M]

I don't have my actual numbers handy, but my estrogen was high. Higher than yours, and well into the female range. In fact, my endo stopped just short of accusing me of lying to him when I told him that I had not been self-medicating.

Looking back, I could imagine that if he'd simply put me on T-blockers my natural estrogen output probably would have feminized my body.

[LeaP]

T was 706 (average at my age appx 560, std. dev. 190) and E was 50 (normal range 14 - 62).

[Kaitlyn Michele]

I Started my hormone treatment with Dr McGinn in philly...prior to HRT my baseline Estrogen was 210 and my testosterone was in the normal range..

the only reason I mention mcginn was because she accused me of self medicating and when I told her I didn't (and I didn't!!) she never really believed and I fired her.

[traci_k]

Thanks for the replies girls.

Hugs,

[Rachel Mari]

I don't know what my E level was before HT, but my T was 325.

I've been on hormones for a little over 3 months and I'll be getting new blood work soon (within the next couple of weeks).

[ReineD]

Here's a wonderful male/female hormone references chart with explanations and given ranges:

http://www.hemingways.org/GIDinfo/hrt_ref.htm

[I Am Paula]

My endo doesn't care too much about baseline levels, it's the results that count. Each Dr. with considerable TS experience has their own methods, and I trust mine.

[Angela Campbell]

My Dr did not check levels, said it didn't matter what they start at he wants to know what it is after a period on them and then adjust as needed. As I pay out of pocket he didn't want me testing for things that would make no difference. He did check levels for liver, blood sugar etc...

[Leigh Wyndham]

I think if a Doc intimates that you have been self medicating after your denial is abhorrent. Docs have the ability to blood test for metabolites of estrogens and can tell you whether you have been self medicating and whether it is from injections or orals and even what kinds of estrogen were taken. It is all based on serum levels of estradiol metabolites resulting from the multi-pass effect or the single-pass effect throught the liver and the amounts and types of metabolites. Pretty easy to do.

[StephanieC]

My first reading was 342. Last year it was 27, recently 34. I don't have numbers for E.

[Michelle.M]

I think if a Doc intimates that you have been self medicating after your denial is abhorrent.

I didn't like it but I rolled with it. I figured he was practicing due diligence. And besides, I've seen trans women do all sorts of wacky things with their prescriptions without their doctor's knowledge, like doubling up on dosages, cycling and all sorts of nonsense. If I'm seeing this from my non-medical vantage point I can only imagine what doctors see.

And besides, although he doubted he gave me the same benefit of the doubt that I gave him. Now, if I'd gotten the same level of persistent disbelief that Kaitlyn Michele got I'd have been hopping mad.

[CharleneT]

That value is rather high, your doc should want to investigate the reason -- prior to HRT. Some gland in your body is producing a LOT more estrogen than it should - which could be a concern ?

[LeaP]

It could be a concern. Low T and high E can be associated with peripheral artery disease, for example.

[Michelle.M]

I didn't have low T and High E. I had normal T and high E. Besides, my (previously) male hormone level data has since been rendered inconsequential by GRS. Whole new ball game now.

[LeaP]

Sorry, Michelle, I wasn't clear. I was referring to the OP, who characterized the T level as at the "low end."

[traci_k]

Thanks for the tip Lea, my GP will be seeing the results Friday. I just have a good relationship with his office so they gave me a copy also. With a range of Total T of 270-1100, I just thought 320 was a little on the low side.

My GP will be seeing the results Friday and I'll talk to him about that. Normal range for total T is 270-1100 so I don't know if 320 is really that low, it was just my guess. I had the numbers run because my wife says it's all in my head and just an addiction. I wanted to see if there might be a hormonal aspect to the GD I've had since pre-puberty. I had already talked to the GP about seeing a gender therapist and getting approval for HRT so he readily wrote the script for the tests. After advising me to get transitioning ASAP. My dilemma is not wanting to lose my son who is 14. I had hoped to hold on until he was a bit older and might be able to understand.

Right now I'm very confused.

Thanks Again All!

[LeaP]

Chasing causes is not a good use of your time. There is NO consensus on the etiology of transsexualism, even among unbiased researchers. The bulk of the evidence points toward (primarily) pre-natal dimorphic, or sex-differentiated brain development. But it may not be the only cause. Hormone level causes or manifestations of the type you imply aren't likely - most trans people have levels normal for their biological sex.

Chasing causes is also a way of seeking justification for some people. It tends to be used to make excuses and try to coerce support. Frankly, you'd have better luck trying to convert a climate change sceptic to sign off on domestic energy taxes.

Cause doesn't make any difference to resolution. So you become the first to find a definitive cause ... OK, you still have to decide what to do about it.

If you would like a definitive opinion on YOUR brain vs some of the research findings, you are out of luck. Your brain will have to be dissected. There are some things worse than transition ...

[Angela Campbell]

I agree. It may be something that took place during gestation, it may be genetic it may be a little of both or it could be a combination the astrological sign you were born under and What your Grandmother had for dinner when she was pregnant. Who knows.

It is up to you to decide if you have dysphoria, and if it is severe enough to justify transition or even how far to go with transition. A therapist can help you to look at it objectively and help you to understand many things but you have to decide what it is for you.

I have to mirror what has been said here a million times. Don't transition, or take hormones if you do not have to, and if you do have to do not let anything stop you. Then again if it is bad enough nothing can stop you.

[traci_k]

Oh I completely agree that chasing cause is an exercise in futility, but try explaining that to a fundamentalist who believes the world is 6,000 years old and that God creates male and female and makes no allowances for what happens during gestation. The fact is nobody knows what causes this dichotomy. I was just hoping to get some idea of possible cause to try to explain to someone whose views are black and white.

Thanks all

Hugs!

[celeste26]

Free 'T' .86 ng/dl normal range is listed as .93-1.71 ng/dl
Total 'T' is 175.6 ng/dl 193-740 ng/dl
Estradiol is 59.6 pg/ml 7.6-42.6pg/ml (for a male)

All prior to HRT starting.

fwiw the dr. office I go to has an on line presence which lists test results and can offer messages back and forth it is a great convenience. I can also see comparisons from previous tests too.

[LeaP]

... the world is 6,000 years old and that God creates male and female and makes no allowances for what happens during gestation. ...

You can't argue with lunacy. And I don't mean religion per se. I mean ignoring the millions and millions who are born with all manner of defects and health issues to maintain that in this ONE area of biology that everything always goes 100% to plan. Oh, while saying in other contexts that everything that happens is according to plan, including all those millions of birth defects. It's lunacy.

[mikiSJ]

I recently visited a VA doctor for my first visit and told him of my gender issues. I was almost floored when we went into a nearly half hour conversation regarding my need to transition and what the VA can do.

Part of his conversation was regarding new research into in utero hormonol effects and the notable changes in DNA that are apparent in both MtF and FtM individuals.

I agree with those above who have been 'abused' by their physicians regarding self-medicating. I am also curious as to the comments by Dr. McGinn, herself a MtF woman.

Who do you go to if your doctor doesn't understand your hormonal levels are not the same as his/her last patient (rhet)?

[Bunny Girl Zoe]

My levels before hrt where E <60 pmol/l and T 16.7 nmol/l and 7 months on hrt are now E 117 pmol/l and T 6.4 nmol/l.