Sex Change, Disappointment and Murphy's Law

[Beth-Lock]

Murphy's Law states that if anything can possibly go wrong, it will. That is a more scientific even if joking way of looking at probs with your sex change than my initial conclusion that my sex change seemed jinxed. Even before surgery, I ran into a host of problems from one that was deadly threatening to my life, (luckily failed suicide attempt), through obstacles to accessing medical care, (I never did get HRT in large part due to a screw up in the appointment scheduling system), and pre-op unexpectedly needing major oral surgery, the infection dragging on for months, clearing up a mere two days before leaving for the surgical hospital. After a very successful surgery, bungled post-op care left me physically scarred. So I can speak from experience not jsut spouting the theory of how you should buck up and cheer up and all that silly advice someone with no immediate problems gives those mired in real and serious problems right now.

So, how do you deal with the bitter disappointment resulting from a sex change that seems to have if not exactly failed, been faulty and disappointingly fell short of your expectations? Certainly in the literature of counselling agenies as well as surgeons, they anticipate that a number of their patients will be disappointed that sex change did not give them a whole new and perfect life, or one so much of an improvement, that it is positively magical. You are no more likely to live happily ever after, than anyone else. The implication is that your new life will not be a fairy tale story especially if the way you had been living, was with such problems ranging from lack of a decent social life, to psychological problems in getting along with others or looking on the sunny side of life.

This does however try to soft pedal if not actually ignore the fact that your sex change can leave you scarred, emotionally and to put it bluntly, with good medical reasons to be disappointed. Like any complex surgery, there may be complications and things can go very wrong, especially in a world where the out-patient psychological preparation and too, post-op care, is in short supply and expensive. I had not planned for example on spending $3,000 immediately post-op on personal care workers partly becuase I had a rather thin social support network, one inadequate to provide friends to stay with me, when I needed someone to stay, for example, over-night. I was both lucky and happy I had the money at the time, to hire people from an agency and considered it well spent. But that was minor compared to my other probelms, ones that only massive sums likely could even attempt to fix.

Rather than fall into bitterness, the only healthy thing is to make the best of a difficult situation, including post-op problems that look like they are going to be chronic, (even when they turn out not to be, in my case one example being urinary catheterization which my visiting nurse thought might have been for life), and incomplete sex change. Money can solve a lot of those problems, in theory, but not necessarily all of them always. Even millionaires have been known to sing the blues over their frustrating, persistent problems with their sex change too. In the thread on poor people not having a fair chance at getting a proper and full sex change, the following observation on disappointment was posted.


Make the best with what you've got. It's not all about being perfect. No one is. Everyone dreams of being the BARBIE DOLL. But she's just ...Not real. ...(work) on the inside "you" first...worry about the outside later.
(Every parent knows what you should undersdytand about life) ...that sometimes you have to give up on part of what you want for the greater good ...

Perhaps this would be a good thread to discuss how one has been able to look on the sunny side and deal with difficult problems in your transition and/or sex change. How did you cope, or are coping with them? What is the best thing to keep in mind to keep you going when you must traverse the rough patches in your life as a transsexual?

Please keep your public posts here optimistic, and send your accounts of sad issues to me via PM.

[MsRenee]

Myself I havent thought about any surgeries.
I can say dont give up girl. Theres always going to be ups n downs in life. You made it past that bad part of your life and have made the transtion.Just give life a chance to catch up with you. Your still alive and kicking and thats a blessing by itself.
Keep smiling hun.
Hugs Renee

[Nicole Erin]

It seems your next step is to develop solid confidence in your new gender role instead of trying to "get there" with surgeries.

[Beth-Lock]

It seems your next step is to develop solid confidence in your new gender role instead of trying to "get there" with surgeries.

I guess there are two parts to confidence. The first part is mainly based on the physcial, to put it bluntly, being sex ready, physically and psychologically, and thinking/responding as a (GG) woman, something that proper female hormonal balance seems to depend on. The second part, is the purely psycho-social adaptation, if it is at all pure, and for this extensive sex therapy would be just one alternative route, and an expensive one, ($150-250 per 50 nminute hour, and many, many sessions, if you could get it in-town without trasvelling). As for the social psychological part of adapting to change from being a boy to a girl, to put it colloqialyy, which is most of the" gender" adjustment part, I have usually felt that my gender change and transition has been a complete success. Then the sex change failure started having psycho-social consequences, that fed into my gender adjustment, and I started to wonder if the physical failure needed to be cortrected by physical methods, not just by psychotherapy anyway.

The fact that I was never given HRT and have now been completely denied it, raises at least three issues each with various likelihoods of success in handling them and with each, their own problematic theoretical issues. The first would be to bypass those denying me the HRT, but this could be fairly expensive, as I would not accept a different opinion unless, sensibly, it was evidenc-based. I don't want to simply shop for a "yes" answer, for that would be dangerous. TS who try that die. Seeking an alternative medical opinion might be quite expensive $5,000 - $10,000, and of course would have no guarantee that it would not produce the same answer,(a no), in effect wasting the money. Since my funds are limited, and may need to be stretched over a lot of future procedures, this would be risky. I have mentioned too in other threads how the whole issue of HRT is likely to be more and more problematic for TS as the medical community seems to be in the process of turning against it, (HRT for TS, and GG's), judging it to be very risky, when they thought it was benign before.

Getting HRT, has both physical and psychological consequences, and nobody is sure exactly how this works, except a number of TS have posted on this board that for them it was more important than SRS in making their transition successful, though not perhaps by a big margin. (Even if nearly equal, it would be necessary for sex change, right?) Anyway, itjhas been considered for a couple of decades as essential for sex change, in the SOC for example.

One theory is that a lot of its effect is to convince one that one has indeed become a woman, since one will feel you are a woman, and have one's life changed in a variety of ways, all this reinforcing your gender change and anchoring it. The anchoring seems especially important to me, due to my instability. To take the conjecture one more step forward, the shock and awe, (similar to the placebo effect), of HRT adminoistration, would seem to be one major part of how it works. This means that if this effect does not take place in a window of opportunity when you are open to it and your gender psycholopgy is fluid, late commenvement, (it would be 2 1/2 years late if I started HRt tomorrow), might prove ineffective, a waste of time and money, a plus being a healt hrisk, especially if a light dose would no longer be effective and the dsee would have to be stepped up. I think the likelihood of the shock and awe theery of what makes HRT work, to a considerable extent, is right,and this makes solution by late commencement of HRT questionable.

Second issue is how to decide rationally. Another problem, is doctors tell me the decision to have HRT versus to not have it, depends on comparing the benefits tothe risks. I failed i my opinion to get a good enough medical evaluation of the risks, so far to my health. As for benefits, an evidence based medical decision would need to be based on studies of the usefulness of late administration of HRT, while any study scientifically reputable, has been based on timely administration, so the question is, whether it depends on the window theory, mentioned above. Bottom line, I am not playing a game of pure chance with my health! The consequences of the half of my sex change/gender change depending it seems, on HRT, going awry have been devestating and would be expensive to fix.

Third route is to try and fix the failed sex change by other indirect means,(non-HRT), surgical and psychotherapeautic. Cost $50,0000 plus to $100,000 or so. If I am going to go back to work to earn that, only one profession will do it, a time honoured one for TS, but I am damn well not taking up the oldest profession! A law suit wold be difficult and even if successful, would bring in the needed money, far too late to be useful.

Obviously, any critic could resond by poking holes in my arguments, but the business-like way of handling that would be their putting up a performance bond to back their views before I would be obligated to listen to them, $1,000,000 in escrow would do it, I think! If that would indicate that I am getting cranky due to hearing so many others with their bright ideas for my solving my problems, you would be right on. Please forgive me - I am under a great deal of stress, not having had sex for ...(but that is the problem, isn't it). :heehee::thumbsup:

[Kathryn Martin]

You keep talking about risks and a risk benefit analysis. I am not sure what risks you are talking about. I think both scientific and anecdotal evidence of hormone treatment outcomes show that it is a low risk treatment, provided you adhere to some very simple basic conditions of undertaking such a treatment. I am not even sure from your comments why it is that you cannot undertake hormone treatment. Is it the risks that made you decide not to try? Is the the doctor who refuses to prescribe?

You keep telling about the failed sex change but have yet to tell us what the failure of your sex change was. You keep referring to nebulous failures of the surgeon and the medical service community. I signed the same papers and waivers that you did. I had the same educational sessions and aftercare that you did. I had to complete the same routines that you did according to the same and very specific instructions.

So what is your problem that made the sex change a failure? You cast aspersions on every one who in some way helped you in your transition from the medical service community. I have yet to find anything in your posts that analyses what possible mistakes you might have made in this process. Under Ontario procedures, you would have gone CAMH in Toronto, would have received both diagnosis and clearance for both hormone treatment and surgery. So, what happened? And what did not happen?

[Angela Campbell]

I too have been wondering how the SRS was approved without a year of hormone therapy? It seems to be one of the pre qualifications all of the surgeons I have talked to insist on. The entire cost of this for me will be well less than $100,000 including things like hormones, electrolysis and legal. Perhaps being a little more clear on what has taken place and why, we can have a better idea on how to respond. There seems a lot not explained, and this may be really good info for the ones just beginning.

[Kathryn Martin]

Angela, I know, surgery $18,400.00, electrolysis about $15,000.00 by the time I am done and about $5,000.00 for a new wardrobe. So all in all I have paid $38,400.00 as an out of pocket expense for my transition.

[Beth-Lock]

I too have been wondering how the SRS was approved without a year of hormone therapy? It seems to be one of the pre qualifications all of the surgeons I have talked to insist on. ... There seems a lot not explained, and this may be really good info for the ones just beginning.

The psychiatrist, who is highly qualified in TS treatment, refused to authorize HRT fearing risk of a stroke. We negotiated and she suggested using her referral of me to an endocrinologist who handles TS cases, perhaps the best or even the only specialoist in TS cases, in our fine city. Then a bureacratic snafu ensued, my file complete withthe medical referral, getting lost apparently severaltimes. Tired of seeing my HRT in limbo, and SRS postponed by six months by then we took advantage of a change in SOC to allow exceptions of the need for HRT before SRS, assuming that HRT would soon be authorized, and only office inefficiency stood in the way. Silly us! :sad:
.



You keep talking about risks and a risk benefit analysis. I am not sure what risks you are talking about. I think both scientific and anecdotal evidence of hormone treatment outcomes show that it is a low risk treatment, provided you adhere to some very simple basic conditions of undertaking such a treatment. I am not even sure from your comments why it is that you cannot undertake hormone treatment. Is it the risks that made you decide not to try? Is the the doctor who refuses to prescribe?

Both the endocrinologist and my gynecologist, used this model of how to make the right decision. But in the end, the Doctors made the decision, over-ruling anything I might say. I have explained in my prior post that I respec the opinion of the doctors, enough to not want to challenge them on my own. That means I need to consult another Doctopr, eminent enoughand far enough removed from the others, (away from their influence), to give a final opinion. This means Europe and $3,000-10,000, depending on how long I must stay over for more tests.

Why not ignore what the Doctors say, and go around them on the basis of what I know or guided by my own emotions which impair my judgement? What do I know? Answer: Less than any Doctor who was not actually snoozing right through the lectures on hormones in medical school.


You keep telling about the failed sex change but have yet to tell us what the failure of your sex change was. You keep referring to nebulous failures of the surgeon and the medical service community. ..I had to complete the same routines that you did according to the same and very specific instructions. ..So what is your problem that made the sex change a failure?

I do not want to be specific because that gets into finding fault, and that implies blame, and I am reluctant to make anything like that public, unless it comes out in the course of a court action, as a legitimate verdict. And I am not going to sue, or press any criminal charges either, should they be indicated on a thorough legal cinsultation, (I an'myself see why), for one, as a matter of honour and respect for those working so hard in the unpopular work of helping TS get surgery or any other TS service.


I have yet to find anything in your posts that analyses what possible mistakes you might have made in this process. Under Ontario procedures, you would have gone CAMH in Toronto, would have received both diagnosis and clearance for both hormone treatment and surgery. So, what happened? And what did not happen?

I do not want to answer that question in front of any potential SRS candidates or TG contemplating transition. I am not turning this thread into something darkly negative. I also urged anyone posting to this thread not to do so themselves.


You cast aspersions on every one who in some way helped you in your transition from the medical service community.

I find this observation very troubling. Please tell me exactly where that is to be found in my posts, and I will delete it immediately. If you cannot, I will delelte the post in its entirety. I do not need the trouble that comes with that sort of statement, explicit, implied or misperceived but having made a strong impression on the part of anyone reading between the lines.

P. S. My bill so far, not including clothes, accessories, or other such things including minor redecoration of my apartment to make it nicer to my now, feminine eye, plus a few other incidentals, comes to about $31,000 plus so far. SRS was $18,040. After care via an agency, about $3,000. Tons of sanitary products, and possibly wearing out my washing machine, in washing re-usable items, prescriptions, hundreds of dollars on "personal lubricants," etc., etc., are not included either. Shortening of life via stress, worry etc., and darker hair colour to cover hair that went white from stress, also not even worth mentioning.:devil:

Next expenses: FFS, ($10,000?), BA, (8,000+), sex therapist $15,000. Psychologist ($20,000++), travel for medical tourism, (?), electrolysis, ($?), Minor counselling, (already begun, $4,500), +?


Was there such an urgency for SRS that you didn't feel like you could get all the ducks in a row first? ...Do you think that could have made any difference? ....What would you recommend to someone who is right now in the same position after what you went through?
I was worried worsening health would preclude SRS, if new probs turned up.... I don'y know what would have resulted.At least the SRS I hgot has cosmetic value. I can wear bathing suits ans short-shorts now. ...If youare Canadian and don't live in Toronto, or maybe Vancouver, don't get a sex change, or at least not before moving to a better served city.




Ok so you had SRS and maybe you thought it would solve all your problems. Or maybe it would magically transform you into a woman, but it didn't. What I think, is since I did not get a sex change, any failure complete or partial of what I had, can be blamed for failure of it to solve my GID problem, and it does not mean a full sex change would not have been enough of a success. Now I am basically intersexed, which has a lot of problems in itself. Also some of my GID is back, and I have to try an alleviate it all over again.



The best thing you can do now is go about with life, working best you can around your limitations and making the best of life. So SRS didn't seem to change anything. Look then at what you want out of life and work towards making it a reality. You will stumble at times, learn from it. Come back then with twice as much strength, slaughter and move on ahead. Transition, no matter how complete or limited, is but a small part of one's life. Some TS forget to live while they are obsessing over transition. .

You are right, and I decided some time ago, just to move on. Transition is not the only string I have on my bow. I lead a very active intellectual life, and enjoy dabbling in economical semi-gourmet cooking, among other things, including taking an interest in the education of the young, in math, science and technology, specifically now investigating the Stamp, Rasberry pi, and graphing calculators. I am currently reading what TH Huxley had to say on education and science, and taking Kung Fu for seniors.


...so sitting around regretting isn't an option.

Exactly! I am old enough that the reality that I may have rather little time left, is on my mind, and wasting time, not a goood idea if I am short of time as the grim reaper hovers, though of course nobody knows in advance how much time one has left.


Quick question. How is it possible to do SRS without hormones (estrogen or testosterone) afterwards. Isnt there a huge risk of osteoporosis and other diseases? Wouldnt this need to be weighed together along with the increased risk of stroke? Endo said osteoporosis is not a good reason to give HRT any more. But I seem okay there anyway. My hormone levels are within normal range for a post-menopausal GG woman. Charlene opinioned that one needs more testosterone or estrogen than those terribly low levels, for health. I simply don't know.

[Angela Campbell]

Was there such an urgency for SRS that you didn't feel like you could get all the ducks in a row first? Do you think that could have made any difference? Perhaps going outside the system and getting other doctors involved? I know there is a cost but sometimes there is a cost for not doing so. It really sounds like some really big problems which would have concerned me in going forward.

What would you recommend to someone who is right now in the same position after what you went through?

[Nicole Erin]

Ok so you had SRS and maybe you thought it would solve all your problems. Or maybe it would magically transform you into a woman, but it didn't.
The best thing you can do now is go about with life, working best you can around your limitations and making the best of life. So SRS didn't seem to change anything. Look then at what you want out of life and work towards making it a reality. You will stumble at times, learn from it. Come back then with twice as much strength, slaughter and move on ahead.

Transition, no matter how complete or limited, is but a small part of one's life. Some TS forget to live while they are obsessing over transition.

So even though you may have some health problems after SRS, you can either sit around with regrets or you can move forward while tending to the problems best you can but still living.
Not like SRS can really be reversed, so sitting around regretting isn't an option.

[docrobbysherry]

I am truly sorry for your issues, Beth. Altho I am a CD, and know nothing of the personal trials of becoming a female, I do know something of how SRS can change TS's lives.

I met 4 here on CD.com years ago. Then, met them all in person at the same SCC, about 5 years ago, before their surgeries. They were all expressive, intelligent, and accomplished, but frustrated and unhappy as men. All had planned surgeries that year. 2 years later, (about 3 years ago now), I returned to the SCC and met 2 of the 4 again. All 4 were now females. The 2 I met seemed pleased with their results and were obviously much happier. The other two r quite active on FB and now seem to be very politically and socially active females. They exude satisfaction and happiness in all their pics and posts.

None appear here anymore. I expect because they all r too involved with living their new female lives and their new partners, to have the time.

Of course, I'm sure there r others where things haven't work out so well. But, I'm not personally acquainted with any. I hope one day u will get past the medical and other issues u've faced since your transition and live the life u dreamed of, Beth!

Those of us that want to look like Barbie Dolls usually find that can be accomplished easily without hormones or sex changes, Dawnmarrie. None of the transitioned girls I mentioned r stunning beauties. (Altho I consider he youngest to be very attractive.) The others all appear to be fairly average looking middle aged females. I'm guessing that is all they wanted because they seem so happy now?

[Lilo]

Quick question. How is it possible to do SRS without hormones (estrogen or testosterone) afterwards. Isnt there a huge risk of osteoporosis and other diseases? Wouldnt this need to be weighed together along with the increased risk of stroke?

[LeaP]

. How did you get surgery without hormones? Who wrote the letters?

. You didn't get hormones because of an appointment screwup? What, you didn't reschedule? You didn't find another doctor somewhere else?… Even though you are considering to go to Europe to see doctors?

. "Never given hormones" comes across rather differently then an appointment screwup. Now you are "completely denied" them. That, Beth, sounds strongly like blaming the doctors.

. I understand your risk points, but don't understand your ongoing attachment to the physician model, given the issues you have had. In any event, your risk with hormones is your risk with hormones. It is what it is. The only question is whether you will do what it takes to get on them or not.

. I don't know where you get the bit that hormones will convince someone they are a woman. That sounds bizarre to me. Confirmation that the hormones agree with your constitution, your body and mind's expectations and need, is not the same thing at all.

. The idea that there is some magic window of opportunity for hormones is also strange. You referred to a theory. Whose theory? My own experience of the "shock and awe" effect (quite an overstatement, by the way) is that it is nothing more than a psychological boost that lasts a few months, at best. Trust me, it fades. As for windows of opportunity, you can talk to any post op who was on hormones and had to stop for surgery as to whether they ceased being effective in resuming them.

. You don't want to find fault or blame, because it might go to court… Yet you have no plans to go to court? What?

. You don't want to answer questions in front of any potential SRS or TG candidates? Again, what? I would think you would want to talk about your issues so others could avoid them.

. You said your funds are limited, yet "next up" is over $50,000 of additional expense?

. Your "now feminine eye?" I thought this was something you lacked because of the lack of hormones…

. You talk about deciding rationally. This is only me, but I have said and will continue to say again and again to anyone willing to listen – this is not something you can solve rationally. And I think most people would describe me as a rational and logical person.

Honestly, Beth, your posts seem to be a tangle of contradictions. Believe me, I sympathize with your situation – no one should have to go through that. But commenting in any helpful way is difficult because your posts and responses are like trying to grab a bar of slippery wet soap.

I think I might be cranky too, were I in your position. If you don't want other people's perspectives, however, you shouldn't put your thoughts out in public. And you seem to reject any responses that don't feed some unarticulated need of yours.

[Kathryn Martin]

Psychiatrists under the SOC do not refuse or allow hormone treatments in the context of their assessment to ensure both co-morbidity issues are ruled out and assessing patient knowledge of the risks involved. Then you go to the endocrinologist who will make you sign a form that you are aware of all of the risk factors. Then you get bloodwork done and your medical history is assessed and only then do you receive a verdict from the endo. As I said psychiatrists cannot make that determination. So why did your psychiatrist refuse, that seems to be the question.

Why Europe? could you not just go to Quebec, New York or some such place and have a medical assessment done for a second opinion. It's a car trip, one of about two hours the other five hours.

Your disappointment that SRS did not make you into a woman, your writing often makes what you have to say more negative than anything any one of us could comment. I am constantly confused about your posts and their content. And, what are feminine eyes?

[Rianna Humble]

This thread has been taken so far off course in the last 11 hours by members who should know better that you leave me no option but to close the thread.

If the OP asks, I will delete the off-topic posts and the personal challenges then re-open the thread.