Green eggs and Ham Question

[Briana90802]

On this forum there are many SO's that don't accept our CDing. But Why? What do you think is the reason that you're SO really doesn't like your crossdressing. After all the fact that we keep dressing means it isn't a fad. It isn't a sexual thing after a while and so on. So what reason can one person who loves you be so prejudicial towards the thing that brings you happiness?

[Jenniferathome]

Briana, because it is weird! You are writing as if cross dressing was like getting a new haircut. It's not. Not only is it weird, but most women have no foundation from which to even grasp the concept.

No SO should simply have to accept anything as ok. Cross dressing is way outside the norm and as such merits significant explanation and discussion to get one's SO to a point of even remote comprehension.

[Beverley Sims]

Brianna,
From Jennifer,

"Most women have no foundation from which to even grasp the concept."

And there is the crux of the problem.

[Valerie1973]

Yes it's weird. It's complicated. If wearing women's clothes is a "sexual" happiness is that your preference over her? This is what blows up their minds. Women don't want to be in any competition even if the other woman is you.

[Gillian Gigs]

Briana, I am going to quote you from another post. "I have never felt attractive as a guy, but as a girl I'm sexy and attractive, or at least I feel that way. And that feels good inside. Something that I rarely feel."

So how can your SO compete with the girl in your head? That girl is your ideal girl, in her life she has competed with other girls and probably knows how to, but she is at a disadvantage competing with the fantasy ideal of the girl in your mind. If she doesn't feel sexy and attractive at times, then what else is she thinking about. We live in a world full of commericals telling women what is hot and sexy, but 90% don't come close to this Holywood fantasy. Now add the competition with what is in your mind and it can get really messy really quickly. Do any of us know what our spouses esteem issues are? Do we know their insecurities? Do we know what the demons they battle with are? I can only guess what some of them are thinking, "but I'm the one who is supposed be the girl, he is supposed to be the guy, I can't take this".

When my closet door opened for my wife to come in she voiced her concerns. The first being she was afraid that I would look better than her. The second one had to do with sex. She wanted her man in the bedroom to lead and take control so she could be submissive, would apparel choices change this. That lead to the next comment which was about masturbation and why she didn't like it. Why, because I knew what I wanted, how to do it, and by how much, she said how can I compete with the ideal in your mind. All valid questions.

To quote Jennifer, "because it is weird!", well at least it is in their minds!

[Briana90802]

Briana, because it is weird! You are writing as if cross dressing was like getting a new haircut. It's not. Not only is it weird, but most women have no foundation from which to even grasp the concept.

No SO should simply have to accept anything as ok. Cross dressing is way outside the norm and as such merits significant explanation and discussion to get one's SO to a point of even remote comprehension.

It is weird because we think it is. Along time ago we ate horse meat in the USA, but now we don't and people think that eating horse is weird. So weird is just wierd for the sake of being weird. It's very cultural bias and egocentric.
As far as hard to grasp??? Why is it hard? women like women clothes, why can't a man. Men like jeans and yet women for great while never wore pants. It was taboo. So why is such a stretch that we would like women's clothing.

"The world works not in reality, but in our perception of reality."- Therefore we should change our perception of reality. We have this saying that "we are set in our ways." which translated means that we are too lazy to try and think in a new way.

[Karren H]

False advertising! She thought she bought a BMW and under the hood there was a Ford engine....... a pink Ford engine.....

[ReineD]

"The world works not in reality, but in our perception of reality."- Therefore we should change our perception of reality. We have this saying that "we are set in our ways." which translated means that we are too lazy to try and think in a new way.

The trouble is that crossdressers are in the minority and because of this, men who wear women's clothing will never be the norm.

If as large a chunk of men were to dress as women, as there were women who less than a century ago began to wear pants, there would be no issues. But most men do not want to dress like women.

[Jaylyn]

Briana I don't know that we are to lazy to think in a new way. I mean think about this how much time we spend getting our makeup on correctly.... A lot more time than most women. We spend a lot of extra time getting dressed to the nines and sometime only for an hour we get to wear what we may have spent two hours doing. Now some have to remove every trace of ever having makeup on and hide every bit of clothing. Even as far as folding a certain item correctly as it was before they touched it. That's not lazy. I think you mean instead of lazy folks don't want to accept in their mind what they feel is too much out of the norm. That is why I love seeing men's clothing getting more silky, more nylon, more comfortable. I would think the makeup companies and the clothing manufacturers would do well to start a uni sexual line of clothing and shoes. We could make this then become the norm after several years. Unfortunate though they probably keep more folks in jobs and more money catering to two sexes than just one unisex clothing and makeup.

[MsVal]

how can your SO compete with the girl in your head?
Thanks, Gillian for the very clear and obvious (to me, anyhow) explanation. It gives me quite a bit to think about. I am pretty sure that's the challenge I face and the unasked question I must preempively answer.

[Briana90802]

False advertising! She thought she bought a BMW and under the hood there was a Ford engine....... a pink Ford engine.....

This might be true if we were all cars that came with standard features, but we are people. Also we buy cars with things we want in them. A person comes with idosincracies that can change.

[Kate Simmons]

The simplest answer is that some women just want a man--period! :)

[Joanne f]

First of all you have this biological thing going on where the average female will look for a male mate which looks like a male and acts like a male and she will assume that this male will be attracted to her because she looks and acts like a female , then all of a sudden she finds out that her male likes to dress as a female and act as a female , well that is enough to confuse any average female , what is she to think , does my male want to attract males, does he think that he is a female, am I not feminine enough for him , yes there are plenty of exceptions to this which is quite normal as it is quite normal to assume that her male will dress and act like a male so it is not surprising that some have a problem with it and until like ReineD has said about dress's becoming the norm for males to wear it will probably stay this way and all this before you even get to the social side of things , so do not be hard on them as it can be difficult to fight a biological instinct.

[Lorileah]

If as large a chunk of men were to dress as women, as there were women who less than a century ago began to wear pants, there would be no issues. But most men do not want to dress like women.

Women had a logical and well thought plan of attack (something men are supposed to be good at). Instead of saying "I want to wear pants because they look nice" they found more reasons (also they didn't put on the pants and then try to get their husbands to play with no more reason than sex).

Comfort and practicality
we can claim that but until women buy it, it is a moot point. You see dresses still have a stigma of not being comfortable ("I can't sit this way or that way. I can't ride a bike or a horse. I can't fix the roof) We need to prove the comfort/practicality level of dressing.

They didn't listen to what others said
Well at the beginning the older women railed against button shirts and slacks. Using the same arguments we hear now. It has been that way forever, some religions say you can't do it, it is immoral, what's next? Smoking and cussing like a man? We can't argue the opposite (except religion...but that is hard no matter what you are discussing) Women stood up and said "Why can't we?" Eventually the argument died. And equality prevailed about all the bad things women picked up from men.

Fashion designers convinced everyone that women co9uld and should wear slacks.
They made them pretty, or sexy, or feminine. Most here have stated that if tomorrow it was OK and someone designed men's skirts (or heels or nylon underwear...OH gee those already exist) for men they would not want them. Yes women wore and still wear men's clothing, but hey do it for a reason. See above.

I agree with Reine on the numbers part but there was so much more to women getting to wear what they wear now. When we can prove logical reasons...PROVE them, then it will be easier to get to where anyone can wear what they like. Not gonna happen in our lives

[Leslie Langford]

Briana, because it is weird! You are writing as if cross dressing was like getting a new haircut. It's not. Not only is it weird, but most women have no foundation from which to even grasp the concept.

No SO should simply have to accept anything as ok. Cross dressing is way outside the norm and as such merits significant explanation and discussion to get one's SO to a point of even remote comprehension.

The reason that "...most women have no foundation from which to even grasp the concept..." is that in their world, the concept of crossdressing simply doesn't even exist. Some would even argue that an element of "female privilege" or "female sense of entitlement" enters the picture here.

For a GG, the idea of wearing men's clothing - or a watered-down, feminized version of same - is somehow empowering. How else to explain the popularity of "boy cut jeans", the "boyfriend jacket", "menswear", and "boy shorts" etc., etc., not to mention the "hotness" and fashion forwardness of wearing men's wristwatches - especially by younger GG's.

I think that there is also a subliminal sexual component to this practice. Despite the successes of the feminist movement and the great strides that women have made for equality, there is still a part embedded in their DNA from prehistoric times that sees the male as the female's primary protector, and wearing men's clothing not only somehow draws them closer to these men, it also provides a sort of symbolic shield against ever-present dangers to their person (real or imagined), and not unlike Ironman's body suit. Ever notice how many GG's love to wear their mate's oversized men's shirts when they are pregnant, even when there are plenty of feminine maternity clothes at their disposal. Makes them feel closer to their man. Coincidence? I think not...

Remember the masculine "Annie Hall" look from the 1970's popularized by Diane Keaton? Well guess what?...she trotted it out yet again after all these years when she accepted the Cecil B. de Mille Award on Woody Allen's behalf at the recent Golden Globes ceremonies.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/golden-globes-diane-keaton-accepts-670372

And not to be outdone, Salma Hayek quickly followed "suit" (no pun intended ;)) at a subsequent fashion event:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2542614/Salma-Hayek-follows-Diane-Keatons-lead-masculine-suit-attends-YSL-fashion-show.html

Would a man coming out on stage in a ball gown have elicited similar favorable "Oooh's and Aaah's"? James Franco tried that a couple of years ago at an Oscars awards ceremony and it was allegedly done for comic effect. Trouble was, he looked just too d#mned good, and the awkward silence and discomfort which that generated on the part of all audience members was palpable:

http://www.sheknows.com/entertainment/articles/835809/james-franco-dissects-the-oscars-me-in-drag-is-not-funny

But we're not allowed to call what Diane and Salma did "crossdressing" because that would be sooo wrong, and wait for it... just plain"weird" - unlike, of course how we are perceived when we like to wear clothing with a feminine flair.

A "tomboy" girl is free to be herself and is often praised for showing stereotypical male attributes such as toughness and independence; a more "girly" boy is called a "fag" or a "sissy" and is usually admonished to "man up" lest he have the crap beaten out of him.

I call it a double standard, pure and simple...

[kendra_gurl]

Briana; Gillian gave a great answer to you question but Jennifer nailed it. Men who cross dress are just weird in the view of most women and there is really nothing wrong with that.

It's up to us to convince them that some of our feminine qualities are what they found attractive about us in the first place.

I try not to be weird about my dressing only in that I always fully and completely dress while around my wife so as to give some sense of a normal looking female impersonation to her. One that she can accept. I have never been one to want to sleep in a bra and panties looking my typical male self as even I would consider that weird.

[Kimberly Renee]

False advertising! She thought she bought a BMW and under the hood there was a Ford engine....... a pink Ford engine.....

Spouses generally don't like finding out something they didn't know about you, if that something is something they would see in a negative light. Then the whole "I don't know who you are anymore" argument ensues.

[ReineD]

Women had a logical and well thought plan of attack

I'm no expert on this but I always took it that women wearing pants became more commonplace somewhere around WWII, when scores of women took men's places in the factories to help with the war effort while the men were off fighting. But I don't think there was a plan ... pants were simply more practical. Granted, women looked different in pants than men, due to their waist to hip ratio. :)



Fashion designers convinced everyone that women co9uld and should wear slacks.
They made them pretty, or sexy, or feminine.

And then came the 1950s when women could ease up and resume their feminine place in society. Their pants were sexy, because they followed the contours of the female waist, hip, and thigh. There's no way that these slacks were considered masculine. :p

http://www.fiftiesweb.com/fashion/fashion-wp.htm (scroll down)
http://vintagepatterns.wikia.com/wiki/McCall's_3414_A



Most here have stated that if tomorrow it was OK and someone designed men's skirts (or heels or nylon underwear...OH gee those already exist) for men they would not want them.

Totally agree with this. There are skirts for men (kilts, etc), there have been for a long time and in several cultures. But in cultures where kilt or sarong-like clothing is acceptable, I'll bet my last dollar that wearing men's kilts or sarongs does not satisfy a CDer's need to dress like a woman. CDers wear women's clothes because they are women's clothes.

So to the people who look wistfully at women's clothes and wonder why men can't wear them, please don't waste your time and energy. Instead just realize that most men do not want to wear them and instead embrace the fact that you are different. And try to help your wives realize that being different is OK, even if it means developing a thicker skin.

[Nadine Spirit]

The only thing I would like to add to other's points is that often it is how the cross dresser approaches the subject. Too often we hide what we do, which would indicate that there is a reason for hiding it, because there is something wrong with it. Thus what are SOs supposed to think when the truth finally comes out?

If we didn't hide ourselves then maybe all of society would be forced to recognize how many of us there are, and thus through sheer numbers alone we would be able to demonstrate our normalcy.

[Jenniferathome]

...Along time ago we ate horse meat in the USA, ... Men like jeans and yet women for great while never wore pants. It was taboo. ...
"The world works not in reality, but in our perception of reality."- Therefore we should change our perception of reality.

Brianna, your first comments are just apples and oranges arguments. If we put either on the weirdness meter, none rate above a 2. Cross dressing rates an 8. These are not comparable. Now, as for the other point that i captured, I agree completely that perception is reality. Unfortunately, the fanciful notion that "we should change our perception" is just fantasy. Everyone should be nice but they are not. Kids should be raised right, but not all are. Change will come just like evolution...over eons.

@Reine: you comment makes me wonder what would have happened to the Western film genre had men actually done what you suggest! Hard to picture John Wayne in a dress.

[Lorileah]

pants were simply more practical. That's my point..practicality. Someone show me where a dress or skirt in more practical in everyday life.

So to the people who look wistfully at women's clothes and wonder why men can't wear them, please don't waste your time and energy. Instead just realize that most men do not want to wear them

And try to help your wives realize that being different is OK,

:yt: I am glad both my soul mates liked the difference and celebrated the spontaneity and surprise of being with someone who didn't play by rules :)

[Wildaboutheels]

I'm not a GG nor do I have a non accepting SO, but I will make a guess.

If a woman [MOST women] could have a MALE brain for a day and experience what a male brain will do with VISUAL input, they would probably/likely be a lot more understanding. Not to say that understanding would necessarily lead to greater acceptance,

It's not going to change anytime soon.

The reason pantyhose and heels are ALWAYS such big hits is obvious. The Pic and Video Forum just adds fuel to the fire.

[Gillian Gigs]

ReineD quote, "And then came the 1950s when women could ease up and resume their feminine place in society. Their pants were sexy, because they followed the contours of the female waist, hip, and thigh. There's no way that these slacks were considered masculine."

I remember when I was in Grade10 in the winter of 66-67, if a girl came to school in pants, and it was not below -10F, she was sent to the Home Ec class room and given a horrible skirt to wear for the day. If it was below -10F then it had to be a pant suit, or the same thing would happen. By my grade 12 year it had totally changed.

ReineD quote, "There are skirts for men (kilts, etc), there have been for a long time and in several cultures. But in cultures where kilt or sarong-like clothing is acceptable, I'll bet my last dollar that wearing men's kilts or sarongs does not satisfy a CDer's need to dress like a woman. CDers wear women's clothes because they are women's clothes."

Ok, you caught me, guilty as charged, I have tried these other underwear options and they didn't do it for me. I am giving serious consideration to getting a kilt in my family tartan to wear in public. I have a work buddy who is in a drum and pipe band, his joke is that they are all closet Cd'ers who wear their kilts in public because they are too afraid to wear their skirts. Who knows?

[franlee]

I can atest to the fact that a light sundress and panties are a lot more partical on a hot day here in Fl. for almost anything that doesn't call for protection of the legs. When it's well over 100 degrees and the index is much higher with humidity in the 90's, believe me it's practical and as much more comfortable as any clothes can be, over nude.

[Ressie]

what reason can one person who loves you be so prejudicial towards the thing that brings you happiness?

There are quite a few reasons. If you put yourself in her shoes (not literally!) you will begin to see the reasons.

1) women have a romantic idealization of what real men are, and it ain't a guy in a dress!
2) What will her friends think?
3) It borders on her being bisexual in her mind.
4) It's weird!
5) she thinks you're gay
6) man's role is provider and protector of the family and any fem quality negates that image.
7) what will her family think?
8) she wouldn't be caught dead in that dress you're wearing!

[bimini1]

There are companies that make women's clothes designed for men. I have no desire to wear that or support them. Does nothing for me. I used to buy dancewear when I was a young lad just coming to terms with trying to buy my own stuff. A nice, Indian man owned the shop and would see me coming. I could tell he was totally perplexed by my prescence and what I was doing. One day I went in and he said "here", a showed me a male leotard. I was like, I don't want that at all.

CD is weird to society but it really should'nt be. Hell, if I was not a CDer it would be weird to me too because of the conditioning. But for me to see clothing, makeup all that is supposed to be for a woman and desire that, no, that should not be weird. I know it is, but it shouldn't be.

It took me a while to arrive at this conclusion, and there are days I second guess it but for the most part I am starting to feel more normality with what we do.

It should just be obvious that there are going to be men like us that exist. It is obviously part of the human mosiac, just look at the sheer numbers of us on this forum. Have you ever tried to go thru the members list, literally thousands. Millions more in the world that don't post here. Majority rules, but don't ever forget the majority has never been right on anything.
Eventually it might become commonplace to see us but not in our lifetime.

[Jillrox]

I can't come up w/ a logical answer why I dress so how is a SO suppose to under stand this? Now if I didn't ever encounter these feelings , I would honestly have a hard time understanding this behavior. So if years ago my ex-wife started wearing men's jeans and flannel shirts , I would of been asking her why? Now if she started wearing men's underwear , shortening her beautiful long hair or tried to grow facial hair we would of had big problems. I married a girl for a reason, I am very attracted to women . Many years ago , i dated a girl that sad only real men have hair on their chests. On a number of times while we were laying on the couch watching tv, she would put her hand up my shirt so she could run her fingers through my chest hair. Just as I had / have expectations for her I know they have them for me.

[AnnieMac]

Karen, the pink Ford engine is much faster and breakdowns less than the krautburner.

[Jorja]

Gosh, I just don't know. I'm taking my clothing choices and going home to have some green eggs and ham. Send me a text when you all get it figured out. If it's not too wierd, I might come out and play again tomorrow.

[kimdl93]

There are several pretty obvious and common responses...some view it as weird, as per Jennifer. Some have very rigid conceptions of appropriate gender roles, and some fear that supposedly slippery slope towards transsexualism.

It's seldom so superficial as disapproval based solely on inexperience is in the case of the green eggs and ham.

[Jenniferathome]

I'm with you on that Kim! There is always another layer to that onion

[Stephanie47]

Jennifer sums it up nicely and adequately. Unless the man has fully and I mean fully revealed the nature and extent of his cross dressing a woman is really blindsided by her husband declaring he likes wearing the clothing of a woman. And, if he desires to emulate and look as feminine as possible (wig, makeup and forms), that is really throwing her a societal curve ball. There are societal norms. There are societal expectations of behavior. There are expected roles. Roles, norms, expectations, etc may evolve and change, but, cross dressing is so far off the radar for most in society it does not compute.

I know there are many who say a woman should accept her husband's cross dressing and openly embrace it, as opposed to DADT or worse, but, then again, why should the man force his desire to wear women's clothing upon his wife? This is a two way street.

[daarleane]

As someone said, wearing a sundress on a hot day is a lot better than a shirt and pants. Also it is not the best of health for you male body parts to be constantly enclosed in a dark hot environment. research has shown this to be true. What has to change is perception. As long as when you look up crossdressing and find material that would only be found in adult bookstores, the perception is not going to change.

[heatherdress]

Fear. Although there are many reasons people don't "accept" crossdressing ("accept" is a broad term), I think some element of fear drives most opinions and feelings. It is not simply because it is weird. Spouses and significant others "accept" a lot weird behaviors and adapt/accept/support. I think there is fear associated with lack of understanding, feeling threatened, not knowing what may happen next, fear of discovery by others and possible embarrassment, etc.

I have an "accepting" wife and we have discussed why she supports my crossdressing. She is strong, confident, trusting, educated and open. She communicates and forces me to communicate. We talk, and share, and question and assure. She says she does not worry about me not loving her, and although she wants to keep my crossdressing discrete, she claims that she really does not care what other most people think. She says I am more important to her than others and she wants me to be happy. She does have a human behavior background and seems to understand that many other people do not accept people who do not look like them, act like them, worship like them or talk like them. She does not seem to worry about my crossdressing and actually enjoys the fact that I do crossdress.

Acceptance usually starts with understanding.

[Briana90802]

Brianna, your first comments are just apples and oranges arguments. If we put either on the weirdness meter, none rate above a 2. Cross dressing rates an 8. These are not comparable. Now, as for the other point that i captured, I agree completely that perception is reality. Unfortunately, the fanciful notion that "we should change our perception" is just fantasy. Everyone should be nice but they are not. Kids should be raised right, but not all are. Change will come just like evolution...over eons.

@Reine: you comment makes me wonder what would have happened to the Western film genre had men actually done what you suggest! Hard to picture John Wayne in a dress.

Sorry, the horse thing and the women wearing pants thing seemed like apples and oranges, but they are about the same thing. Perception. About how we view the world. As far as change I agree that "evolution" can change over eons, BUT human behavior can change overnight. Social politics can change in a generation. Women for more than 2000 years have been view as not equals. We didn't even give them equality in this country until after Afro-Americans. And yet in this generation the thinking of our society has changed to include gay rights.
So it would seem that facing those things that we think of as weird and talking about them with our family(ie SO) could help bring about the change that we need to be more social acceptable.


Jennifer sums it up nicely and adequately. Unless the man has fully and I mean fully revealed the nature and extent of his cross dressing a woman is really blindsided by her husband declaring he likes wearing the clothing of a woman. And, if he desires to emulate and look as feminine as possible (wig, makeup and forms), that is really throwing her a societal curve ball. There are societal norms. There are societal expectations of behavior. There are expected roles. Roles, norms, expectations, etc may evolve and change, but, cross dressing is so far off the radar for most in society it does not compute.

I know there are many who say a woman should accept her husband's cross dressing and openly embrace it, as opposed to DADT or worse, but, then again, why should the man force his desire to wear women's clothing upon his wife? This is a two way street.

First of all you should never just blind side someone with this. I recently shaved my head and I then went to visit my wife's family. She didn't tell them that I did it and I was upset that she didn't because change can be shocking.

Secondly "why should the man force his desire...upon his wife?" Why should a wife force her dislike for her husband's desires upon him? This is a two way street!

My boss recently got remarried. Into week two she made him sell is off-road motorcycle because she didn't like it. So the one thing that he loves and finds relaxing is the one thing she won't tolerate anymore. Hmmmm sound familiar?


The simplest answer is that some women just want a man--period! :)

They want a man? define man. Are we talking Marlboro Man, Super-man, The Brawny man or the "man" she has created in her mind or the one that society has made her believe she needs? You make us seem like we're just a hunk of meat. I seem to remember someone complaining we treat them as just sacks of meat.
Just because you like to wear women's clothing doesn't make you any less of a man; doesn't make you any less of provider; doesn't make you any less of a husband.


The title of this thread is Green Eggs and Ham, its meaning is to say that information is the key to understanding. It's about making an informed decision about the things we find weird.

[Jenniferathome]

...Also it is not the best of health for you male body parts to be constantly enclosed in a dark hot environment. research has shown this to be true.....

Research has shown that a penis needs a suntan?

[Tracii G]

I think it boils down to women wanting to be with the man they married.

[Caden Lane]

Last night while talking to my GF, I used the anaology; what if I had just told you I was a civil war reenact or and I dressed up on the weekends to do that? To me, dressing up is no different than putting on a costume. I'm the same man as I've ever been, but instead of putting on a super hero costume and going to Comic Con, or doing civil war reenactments, or putting on cave diving gear, I want to put on a blouse and dress and go get my nails done, go shopping, and have lunch. She didn't buy it, she said that the examples I cited weren't weird. I happen to think some civil war actors ARE weird...and I'm a history buff. I think cosplay kids are a little weird. I know other cave divers that are oddly obsessed. Normal isn't defined by some board of people who get to define it based on what they like and we are subject to their opinions. Normal is what works for us. Its the things we do that makes us happy and defines us. Its just another facet of our being. We all have many facets, and none of us can bepe fairly assessed by a single facet of our being.

[Wildaboutheels]

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?200217-The-Missing-Link-to-the-CDing-puzzle&highlight=

[Gillian Gigs]

Someone once said this quip. "Why does a woman marry a man, then spend 20 year to change him into what she wants, and then say this is not the man I married!

Why, because someone is still looking for what they consider to be the ideal in their mind. I know a 35 year old guy who is still looking for the perfect girl. The standard joke when we find out about why he dropped the last one was, "were her big toes too big?"

Briana quote; "My boss recently got remarried. Into week two she made him sell is off-road motorcycle because she didn't like it. So the one thing that he loves and finds relaxing is the one thing she won't tolerate anymore."

This sounds like what happened to my dad when he remarried after my mum died. On their first anniversary she told him that the honeymoon was over and things were going to change. They did and it became hell for him, but he was no great catch either. She had her meal ticket, he had his maid, that's about the way it ended up.

Personally, I think that if a guy just wanted to wear some panties, lingerie and a skirt, still looking like a guy, most women could get used to it. They are all just clothes, right! I see the problem being that most women can't wrap their head around a guy wanting to look and act like a woman. They have fought to get equal rights...yea sure they are totally equal, open your eyes and look. Do they get the same opportunities, same pay,etc? I speculate that they are saying to themselves, "I just got some freedom, rights and you are telling me that you want the best of my and your world"? As someone else said something about playing civil war soldier for the weekend, you get to go home at the end of the weekend, she doesn't, she is left to clean up your mess and smile while you talk about your weekend playing soldier. For her it's like living in the civil war all the time. Girls don't play glamour girl 24/7, so how many Cd'ers play just glamour girl when getting dressed? There is more to being a woman than putting on the clothes, maybe some Cd'ers are being more of an insult to their wives than they realise!

[Caden Lane]

I don't think any of us set out to insult womanhood as a whole. I've always felt that impression in the sincerest form of flattery. We envy what they have, what they wear. We no more want to insult them than anything. In the greatest form I think we idolize them and put them on pedastals. My intimation and anaology about the civil war reenactors was a way of saying, I'm dressing up, playing a role, and when i wipe the makeup off and take the dress off, I'm still me, my responsibilities are still there for me to meet. I'm still the man she fell in Love with.

I can see your point about us wanting the best of both worlds, and how that may be insulting. Sadly, there is nothing I can do about that, other than demand better than that of society. But deep down, I cannot help who I am, or fight my drive to dress.