It's almost impossible to miss.

[Wildaboutheels]

Unless of course, you never bother to read other responses. And/OR, it's never come out of your own mouth. Something to the effect of , "I can't explain it" or "It just makes me feel right" or "It just feels right" Or "Dressing makes me feel whole" Or countless other variations.

Anything like that ever come off YOUR keyboard and end up here in this Forum?

And DID you or did you not at least pass through the O phase? Or are still in it?

If you did, has it ever occurred to you to connect the 2 dots? You don't even have to use a straight line to connect them. Feel free to use a curvy one or a long arc. There are no rules against connecting more/other dots either.

Or, do you think we Humans are way above "conditioning" and it just ain't gonna/can't happen? We are just way too smart for such silly foolishness. That Pavlov and his drooling dogs have absolutely nothing to do with at least SOME CDers [if not most] and their "affinity" with their clothes?

Aren't the chances at least "good", that unless you are one of the older members here, MUCH of the clothing you own, at least makes your mouth water a bit or puts a smile on your face or a spring in your..............step?

Or do you think dog whistles and what MOST CDers CHOOSE to wear have no connection whatsoever?

If you have have no earthly idea what I am talking about, and actually do wonder WHY the clothes make you feel "good" [just one POSSIBLE clue] you might want to Google Pavlov and his dogs.

Of course if you have NEVER been to O land at any point in time while [at least partially] dressed, you may have just wasted a full minute of your time reading this far. And you could have spent it answering a Panty thread.

It IS a safe bet, that as most CDers get older, the heels get shorter, and the dresses, skirts, etc., get longer.

Isn't it?

[Ezekiel]

Connecting crossdressing to sexual arousal? No, not me, sorry.

[Anna H]

I think it's been known and accepted for practically forever that
yes, for some it's directly related to sex.

Not all. So those remaining are the real mystery?

[Zylia]

Wild, you can try and push their buttons all you want, but you're not going to get a widespread acknowledgement here that we, human beings, are in fact sexual creatures, driven by sex (among other things) rather than side-tracked by it. We all know that men don't think about sex every five minutes, don't watch porn and do not masturbate at all, ever. Maybe the 'pigs' who stare at our (fake) boobs when we strut through the mall in our black miniskirt and 6-inch heels, but not us, cleanly shaven cross-dressers. To suggest that cross-dressing has (had) anything to do with sexual arousal for even a small group on this board is simply outrageous, even if any other gathering of cross-dressing individuals on the web proves otherwise.

Now it's time for you to get out of that ivory tower of yours and mingle with us commoners. You might even enjoy it :D

[Beverley Sims]

I read other responses but I am rarely swayed by them.
As fo explaining it, thinking takes up too much time.
I always feel right, that's why I havent bothered to see a therapist professionally.
They are all younger than me and don't know s much as I do. :)
In my role as an electrician O have touched live wires and sure you do get the "BIG O"
Not thrilling but a big "O".
I join two wires together, is that like connecting the dots?

I could throw you a curve ball.

I left Pavlov's dogs with Sheldon, he has more use for them than I.
I am a great believer in "conditioning" especially on a hot day.
It is one bit of foolishness I revel in.
Any fashionable, expensive, impractical clothing I have makes me wince, as I think of the money I wasted on it.
Most of it still has the labels on it when I take it to Goodwill.

Maybe you have seen it there. :)
Can't hear a dog whistle but I can see a dressed CD'er.
Oh yes, you are talking about airconditioning, deep thinking, pet dogs and electric shocks...
Aren't you?

I havent been to Netherland either, I have been to all the Disneyland s except the one in Japan so I am well versed on them.
IE. Paris Dizzyland is crap. The rest are worth a second visit.
My dresses remain short because I still have great legs, the face is falling apart and I wear 2 inch heels because they are practical.

Now I have vented I am going to ask you a personal question.

What color is the matching Bra/Panty set you are wearing today?

What in the hell are we all talking about here anyway? :)

[devida]

Oh I assumed it was just the decorum required by the board not denial of sexual arousal by the participants. The thrill I get if I wake up at night and feel my lace nightie and panties is at least partially sexual. Certainly it puts a smile on my face because it reminds me I am happy to be who I am but it also gives me a little erotic thrill as well as a little bit of sensual delight. Why would it not? I may be older but I remain a sexual being.

[Katey888]

Wild... If at first you don't succeed... :)

I refer my Right Honourable friend, the member for Tampa, to the UK's world leading National Survey of Sexual Attitudes and Lifestyles first undertaken in 1990 (in which your respondent took part) which surveyed some 18,876 adults aged 16-59. I recall that the results showed that a very high percentage - some 80%+ from memory - of males did, in fact, spank their monkey at least once a week...
And recent research in the USA from 2010 (Sexual behavior in the United States: Results from a national probability sample of men aged 14-94. Journal of Sexual Medicine) has a figure of around 60% for the same age range (references available on request).
I would strongly suggest that a significantly high percentage of these men do NOT crossdress and yet something else makes them do this...

Mr Speaker - if we were so Pavlovian in our behaviour, would the world not be awash with males only able to satisfy their desires by a connection with some thing that was present and available at the time of their first... eruption? And this clearly not being the case (as I for one have been able to undertake the aforementioned act in all sorts of circumstances, both clothed and naked, on several different continents and in many countries and time zones and sometimes with a participating partner) I would assert that the honourable member for Tampa is simply beating a dead horse again when he might be more productive 'charming a snake'...?

(Roars of laughter from the government benches and hoots of derision from the opposition)

Ours isn't called 'The Mother of Parliaments' for nothing... :D

Katey x

[ReineD]

We all know that men don't think about sex every five minutes, don't watch porn and do not masturbate at all, ever. Maybe the 'pigs' who stare at our (fake) boobs when we strut through the mall in our black miniskirt and 6-inch heels, but not us, cleanly shaven cross-dressers. To suggest that cross-dressing has (had) anything to do with sexual arousal for even a small group on this board is simply outrageous, even if any other gathering of cross-dressing individuals on the web proves otherwise.

LOL. Well put.

Wild, maybe a lot of members suffer from selective memory. They don't remember the sexual beginnings, or they don't acknowledge any, even if occasional, sexual outcomes as being tied to cross-gender expression. Maybe they just want to distance themselves from the topic because they feel it does not legitimate who they are today.

I personally do believe there is a connection. I also believe that things change.

Yes, Katey, men do spank the monkey, but non-CDs/TGs have different fantasies about it than do members of this community. :p

[docrobbysherry]

I'm older than nearly everyone here, Wild. And, at 70, wait patiently to become a dreary old dried up spinster.

But, while I'm waiting? I prefer to dress this way and see images like this in my mirror. Judging from the response to Sherry's FB page? Many guys get as excited by her look as I still do!:D

223597

As a side note: Sherry doesn't allow "monkey spanking" when she's around. She takes care of business the way any single, normal, and healthy GG would!:heehee:

[franlee]

Reine you have pretty well nailed it. I can't imagine anyone having a reason to go to the trouble to dress with out the desire to make a statement of sexuality and the end results what ever that may be. Denial is alright if it makes one feel better, but not all of us need to. CDing is something I do for me and I own it.

[LilSissyStevie]

More often nowadays I'm looking at this phenomenon as a form of emasculation or more specifically auto-emasculation. From that point of view things start to make sense. If one finds comfort in emasculating oneself (feminization just being another somewhat less accurate word for it) then it could be expressed sexually or non-sexually. It makes perfect sense to me that it could be sexual early in life and progressively less sexual as one ages. It also makes sense that it could have never been sexual for some people. It just doesn't work to try to stuff everyone into the autogynephilia box. Autogynephilia is just one type of auto-emasculation. The Pavlovian angle doesn't explain why we do it in the first place. The question we should ask is why would anyone want to escape, or just take a break from, the demands of trying to conform to idealized notions of masculinity? {yes, it's rhetorical}

[KaceyR]

Sexuality It's definitely a part. Heck... My own late slow start to CD was really first acted on with a piece of lingerie...
There are so many ties across the zones (gender, sexual, artistic,emotional) that CDing participates in or works with.
The tying aspect is that we as MtF CDers do is that were able to act on it to bring out the aspects of each that, as a standard guy, there wouldn't be consideration.
I mean...looking at my path.
1: started CDing by myself with lingerie. Definitely a sexual attractor.
Then 2: curiosity piqued, arranged up an entire outfit (maid). This however _felt_ good.. It felt right. It felt empowering oddly enough. So while not primarily sexual, now I bring in gender and emotional side to the equation. I felt a way to express myself way more than just as a guy.
3:So with the feelings there, I continued on beyond 'costumes'. And it continues. But by this time along with the emotions and such.. The artistry comes into play, perfecting or working on fashion, looks, makeup. I _love_ to dress! and I love to try to make my dressing as sexy as I can. While I don't go bar trolling,etc,(although I have gone to a bar with a group) I'd still be flattered and love it if I got complemented. I have 48 years of boring unsexy unflattering maleness to make up for. I think parts of this is why many CDers (me too I guess) sometimes/often dress a little bit younger than their age. Making up for lost time. And the aspect that our beauty in some ways has to be more manufactured maybe allows us more leeway to try to do so. And In looking at clothing,etc.. When I see women's clothes I can read a sexiness..and a quality and capability to play with styles to achieve this. When I try to think of mens clothes...and what would be interesting or sexy for that side...I just can't see it.

So I'll probably continue dressing a bit younger as I can, feeling empowered all the way. Actually expressing myself freely than just having on dead male clothes and 'existing'. And if I _really_ want to bring out the real sexy side... Well I have other stockings, and a corset or lingerie for that :heehee:

I like to try to follow my motto in my sig as much as possible :)

[Secret Drawer]

It always frustrates me when someone insist on painting everyone with the same brush. I suppose if any self identifying homosexual male crossdresser decided that all crossdressers whoever walked the earth throughout history were at least latent homosexuals they would be correct, because, just like the OP, if it is true for them then clearly it is true for everyone else as well.

[Wildaboutheels]

I would never embarrass anyone here by posting private email...

Private email is just that. PRIVATE.

FACT: Numerous times I have seen members post "It was never sexual for me". I wrote polite, respectful emails to 3 of these folks asking how that was possible? [given their posting history] It took no prodding at all. ALL three admitted [in the return email] that they posted "in error" when they used that word NEVER. I hope none of you are silly enough to make the assumption that "most" who say/claim it was never sexual for them are lying? Some of them HAVE switched teams, OR are in the process. Makes perfect sense that it wasn't ever sexual for THEM. Perhaps, [and it's just a guess] many were never turned on at all by women/women's bodies.

O's [like many drugs] are ADDICTIVE and release a flood of various chemicals into our brains. Male O's are VERY easy. They better be. MALE Os are what keep us on the planet. It's no accident that Female Os are basically irrelevant to keeping Humans going. Females just need to be willing to participate...and contribute the egg of course. [although some newer research shows that Female Os may help steer the sperm in the correct direction] Most men will use visual aids of one kind or another to get ready for a trip to O land. Or am I wrong about that? How many men here would enjoy having sex in complete darkness? All of this is very old news and is not changing anytime soon. ANYTHING that helps us get to O land our brains are not going to forget. It's really not very complicated.

The threads and topics that are always the most popular here,along with the flavor of the vast majority of what's found at the P&V gallery ARE accurate reflections of the masses here. Denying it won't change anything.

Will it?

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi WAH, Yes it was a minute of my life that I'll never get back.

I'm 71 and a lot of my Hi-Heels are still 4" to 5" and most of my skirts are above the knee.

[Gillian Gigs]

As far as I am concerned the Pavlov, or the conditioned response method of things works very well. If you do not believe it, take this challenge. Every day for the next 4 months tell yourself that you like some food that you never liked before. After doing this start to try that food saying that you like it, and increase your intake of it. I did something like this with my children. If they said they hated doing math, I would get them to say that they liked doing math every evening before eating supper. It was amazing how over the course of a year their marks improved in that subject! One of them ended up an honors student in a subject that they said they hated just 3 years earlier.
Now let us ask yourself this question, "how many times have we told ourselves that we love wearing panties...bras...skirts...etc?" Now what would happen if we started to say the opposite? Yea, yea, I can just hear the nay sayers saying it would never work, but the words of you mouth put you on a path that can and will lead you in a particular direction. Now what ever you do don't think about chocolate ice cream! ...........Got ya!

[Nadine Spirit]

I once had an "o" with a cantaloupe. Good thing that you took the time to explain to me why nowadays I eat cantaloupe.

Thanks.

[Rachael Leigh]

For me I will be honest that yes there was a sexual attraction to the clothes for sure and that in and of itself confused the crap out of me. I mean it made much more sense to be attracted to the girl in the clothes.
Now as one of the older CDs it's now an annoyance when there is a sexual thing going on when dressed, not saying I don't like it but it's not my purpose to dress to get that.

[Jenniferathome]

...you might want to Google Pavlov and his dogs....

Your post is mostly incomprehensible but your suggestion that conditioning, a la Pavlov, causes one or the other action (cross dressing / masturbation) is simply absurd. If you mean something else, I'll fall back to my "incomprehensible" comment.

[sanderlay]

Wild,

I'm not sure I completely understand your post... :sad: or what "O" means in your context. :eek: But... let me see if I can sum it up... :straightface:

My cross-dressing is Conditioned or Connected to "O"?

Going on that assumption...

Short answer...
No.

Long Answer...
For me... My sex, male, and my gender identity, male and female, are separate. My ability, or desire, to have "O" has nothing to do with my gender identity. They do not connect.

My attraction to the clothes was Before I ever had "O". I'm quite sure it was and is linked to my gender identity and my desire to identify with female clothes. :D

PS: Feel free to PM me, or post here for all to see, if I have assumed wrong. :)

[trishacd]

Im with you

[suchacutie]

We have seen over and over members posting that they were dressing well before puberty. For me, Tina's clothes were certainly sensual to start with, but that just made the process more exotic and forbidden. Tina's relationships are still platonic and my heel s have never gotten shorter. Tina will flourish regardless of my more prurient desires, and those desires have never needed Tina.

[Allison Quinn]

Why not just tell us what O is :|
what is the O phase

"It's no accident that Female Os are basically irrelevant to keeping Humans going. Females just need to be willing to participate...and contribute the egg of course." If you're talking about sperm and eggs honestly how can you say females are irrelevant when their egg is half of the whole thing sperm can't do anything by themselves

[Marcelle]

Hi WAH,

I concede that there can be a sexual component to CDing for some and perhaps not for others. I have always had a fascination with lingerie on women and my wife indulged that wish even though she is not a sexy lingerie kind of gal (bless her :)). So when I started dressing, I will admit the ability to wear some of that lingerie was shall we say O-kay :heehee:.

However I am not following your Classical Conditioning logic. In classical conditioning an "conditioned stimulus (CS)" which is a neutral stimulus (i.e., Pavlov's bell) is paired with a an unconditioned stimulus (US) which is normally biologically potent (i.e., the taste of food). The US causes the unconditioned response (UR - i.e., salivation) and repeated pairing would cause the individual to evoke the UR (now the conditioned response - CR) with each presentation of the CS.

So if we apply CDing to this logic what is your CS? I am assuming it would be for the sake of argument lingerie or women's clothing in general. I am assuming your US is sexual arousal via masturbation with UR being the big O. So repeated pairing now causes what . . . I experience the big O every time I dress? I get sexually aroused just putting on panties? I engage in masturbation each time I dress?

If I were classically conditioned, I would be walking around sexually aroused the entire time I was dressed - I would have no choice because the CR is now programmed in response to the CS . . . sorry that dog don't hunt (or salivate in this case :))

I am more inclined to believe yes we can get sexually aroused early as it new and exciting and allows us to explore a different area of our sexuality in an almost taboo kind of way. Some may continue to enjoy this feeling all the time, others not so much. Sorry to say, when I dress now it is simply that dressing. Even my choice of undies (sorry should save this for the what kind of panties are wearing thread :)) have gone from lacy and pretty to cotton/micro fibre and practical.

So do CDers derive sexual pleasure from dressing . . . sure thing. Is it a CR linked to a CS . . . IMHO no.

Hugs

Isha

[Lucy_Bella]

Wild,
I can not speak for most on this forum ,in fact, I can only speak for myself and why I do what I do..Like many I started at a very young age and long before puberty,I've also suppressed my urges for many years during marriage ..Only to end up alone lonely and still dressing with little or no desires to change my life or give it up, although the thought crosses my mind daily..

Where would I be today if it wasn't for this curse? Happier? No ,when I'm not able to dress I become depressed ...More of a sociable person and out going with many of friends ? Yes probable and I have done that but mid night struck and it was time to turn into a pumpkin again and return to my closet resorting back to the Hermit I was meant to be..

When I dress it is sexually and everything I own in feminine clothing is tied to that .The material ,lace cut ,fit and color is all sexually related in enhancing the sexually arousal and feeling I get while dressing and the more I add to the experience that helps me continue this curse the more that addition becomes a must in the next experience .. Things like the hair or perfume anything that enhances the experience or makes it become more real..

Why do I do this? Do I want to become a girl? No ,not at all not even during the experience ( because I am at that time her physically but not mentally ) ..I am a sick and twisted individual that causes no harm to anyone but myself during these experiences ,or am I am? No !! I dress yes but not for the same reasons as many others may ..I have goals yes but not the same as many others do.. My experiences have grown over the years to last longer and longer because I have grown to enjoy them and somewhat accept them, it's just easier that way..

I live two separate lives and I try not to let the two conflict with each other and keep a balance of normality when I am not living out my experiences and they tend to go away for short periods of time ,sometimes months, but they always return ..

[Christen]

We enjoy crossdressing because we have conditioned ourselves to? and it always has a sexual connection?
Sorry, I started crossdressing at 6 and have done so since then, enjoyed the sensations it gives me, since then. I wasn't forced to, I enjoyed it before any idea of conditioning could occur. I have had periods of up to two years where I didn't crossdress, but that conditioning didn't succeed longer term. Conditioning, nup! It's something else.
Sexual connections, oh sure my fantasies are maybe different to some. So what. Sure I had periods where dressing was pretty much a sexual act, but it isn't now, and it wasn't pre-puberty. So yes it can be, but not necessarily.
The more you try to put this business in a box the more incorrect you're going to be. And generalising about anything is a sure way to get a very skewed view. We're all connected in a way but we're all very different. Maybe we need to spend more time appreciating that.

[lingerieLiz]

I once was part of a very frank discussion with several women and myself. It was why I enjoyed wearing lingerie and women's clothes. They asked the same question that you did and had pre supposed ideas. I asked how many of then at one time wore sexy lingerie and clothes to be attractive. As we discussed it, all admitted that wearing sexy lingerie and clothes gave them a sense of excitement and a feeling of sexuality.

So, because as a CD I should not have the same excitement and sexual excitement? Lingerie is designed to provide sexual interest unlike men's clothes which is designed to be utilitarian.

[Ezekiel]

This doesn't explain me or others like me, I don't even like panties or bras, don't even use breast forms I'm all about the look of the cloths, aesthethic and expression of it. For some it might have a sexual component, for others it might be complete, but there are also those who have no connection to sexuality. Mostly about identity and expression. I don't even like sex to begin with.

[sometimes_miss]

And DID you or did you not at least pass through the O phase? Or are still in it?
I'm not sure what you're trying to say. so we'll have to guess. 'Still in the O phase'? What is that, perpetual orgasm? Perhaps while crossdressed? Now then.

Like some others, my crossdressing started way before I had any sexual feelings at all. So there was no connection to orgasms, still isn't. Sure, sometimes I masturbate while dressed as a girl, but it's pretty rare, mostly it's the pretty standard guy with a fantasy of whoever I saw in the most recent provocative state either in real life, magazine or movies. That's never changed since I was a kid; it's not real complicated, it's over pretty quick to satisfy an urge, then I move on and get back to work (boy would my employer hate to think about that going on while I'm 'on the clock'). However, I do understand the desire of people to want to feel as normal as possible, so they will often insist that what they experience, everyone else must have also experienced, or are simply in denial. Also, there are a lot of people here who will insist that 'they are born that way', because that excuses them from any responsibility at all of their predilection towards female feelings. Then you have the situations where there are mixed influences, and that's where it can easily get confusing. Be what you enjoy being, as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else. If your crossdressing involves sex, go for it. Get as wild and crazy with the clothes as you can, indulge in whatever fantasies put lead in the pencil! Life is way too short to worry about what other people's opinions are about our sexual enjoyment.
Oh. And as far as turning into little old asexual grandmas, ain't gonna happen. I've felt like a 14 year old girl now for almost 40 years, and don't think that's going to go away any time soon. While there are some guys who's testosterone levels deteriorate and the sexual desire goes away (and there are certainly times when I would love to not be distracted by the sight or smell of a hot babe while I'm trying to concentrate on something more serious) I dont see that ever happening. Pretty women, and thoughts of sex are too enjoyable to ever disappear just because I'm not as able to be the sexual athlete anymore.

[Lucy_Bella]

If your crossdressing involves sex, go for it. Get as wild and crazy with the clothes as you can, indulge in whatever fantasies put lead in the pencil! Life is way too short to worry about what other people's opinions are about our sexual enjoyment..

I can not speak for Wild on the point of the "o".. I do know that having an "
o" doesn't always mean masterbating ,in fact it's a rare occasion for me if at all most of the time now a days..

You can get the "o" feeling with out going through the typical stereo type method there is such a condition a "o" can last a long time and is different from ejaculation although they could or can happen at the same time..

Here is a link ..http://www.whitelotuseast.com/MaleSexuality.htm

[Wildaboutheels]

It becomes ever more clear.

What if I promise everyone here that watching just O N E episode of NGC's Brain Games, is not going to ruin your CDing life?

You started dressing when you were 5?

So WHAT!

IF you passed through the O phase and IF you felt shame and guilt, your HUMAN BRAIN in all likelihood will try to help you get rid of that guilt. Or brains do this many, many times a day.

It's not a matter of Opinion just good ol' Scientific FACT.

Orrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr, maybe you are one of those "special" people? You can see someone yawn and it does not affect you in the slightest way at all?

[sara lahna]

what on earth are you talking about???

[Eryn]

I think that most of us had some arousal connected with dressing at first. In my case it was because I confused my interest in feminine things with my normal male interest in females. My first teenage encounters with feminine things, particularly those forbidden intimate garments, did produce an arousal, but at that age just about anything and everything produced one!

Since I started dressing fully, in my 50s, I can say that CDing is not a sexual thing for me. No reaction at all, which is just as well as it would ruin a nice tuck!

[ReineD]

Here is a link ..http://www.whitelotuseast.com/MaleSexuality.htm

Thanks for posting this, Lucy. It's the best article I've read about male sexuality. I'll read the ones they have on female sexuality as well.

In the Excitement Through Plateau section, they describe the early stages of male sexual arousal and they say there is no limit as to how long this can last. This would explain the many descriptions here of being dressed as euphoric, thrilling, reaching a high, etc. (I've never understood why putting on clothing would make anyone feel this way.) Maybe you're correct, those who describe the dressing as a high, etc, don't believe it is sexual unless it ends in ejaculation when in fact, they may be in the early stages of arousal throughout the time they are dressing even if they don't get to stage 2.

At any rate, there is absolutely nothing wrong with being sexually excited about the CDing (for those to whom it applies), no matter the level. The word "fetish" used to have a negative, somewhat perverted connotation, but nowadays the experts are telling people to enjoy their alternate triggers and just define them as valid, alternate sexual attractions. The only time the 'alternate' attraction would be harmful is if it had a negative impact on someone's life, such as if it produced an inability to concentrate on work, or if it got in the way of a sexual relationship with a partner (who does not share the fetish), or if it caused a desire to isolate (stay home and be excited rather than go out and do things with friends).

[Ms. Alexis]

So which came first the Chicken or the Egg? Or did both arrive at the same time? The point is as many have said is that we are Sexual creatures (Thank God!)... From Birth, though it's expression is a bit delayed. And I personally believe that our Gender (Separate from the Hardware provided) is also at least predisposed if not determined before we are born. So the "Big O" going hand in hand with Dressing etc. should be a given. To carry this Idea a little bit further I personally think that making gender a Binary concept is ridiculous in the first place and more a societal control because of the fear of anyone who is outside of the myth of what the ruling class call "Normal". Gender is a line with infinite points on it between what we call Male and Female traits with infinite possibilities. Many cultures already recognize this, and even many Native American cultures speak of those who are "Two Spirited", placing them into a category of their own without prejudice. Even in nature there is variety in gender attributes regardless of Sex. The flip side is that humans are always trying to build a better high, so if it pleases you to dress and pleases you to orgasm why not get a two for one special? The problem arises when we condition ourselves to where we can no longer separate or it becomes excessive to the point that we are doing it to the detriment of other areas of our lives (not going into that whole can of worms with relationships etc.)... which is where we start crossing into the grey zone between healthy and addictive behavior unless we have determined that we are going to transition, which is a different scenario.

[sanderlay]

Reine,

Thanks for posting this link about Male Sexuality (http://www.whitelotuseast.com/MaleSexuality.htm). What's interesting is talking about the different phases of arousal. And in the early phase the brain is flooded with endorphins. Now endorphins by themselves are not necessarily for just arousal. They are also used in pain management. See this article - Understanding Endorphins and Their Importance in Pain Management (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3104618/).

So just suppose for a moment that a person, like myself, that feels this attraction to the clothing gets a dose of endorphins as a reward for putting on the clothes. And thus the high that is described.

Now if a person, like myself, accepts to wear the clothing on a daily basis they don't get that same reward. The reward I feel is feeling normal as it relates to my gender identity. How the brain communicates this I do not know. But I know how I feel as compared to only dressing as a man.

Now as a man I know what arousal feels like, orgasm and ejaculation. Feeling normal feels different when I wear the clothes and feeling wrong feels different. Now I grant you that if I have not dressed for a week or so I'll probably feel that endorphin rush when I wear the clothes. And I might take that feeling and run with it to stage two and beyond. I am a sexual person. But I also can say no. But I normally wear the clothes every day. I do it to feel normal... not aroused.

So the endorphins appear from the outside to be a part of wearing the clothes, but the wearer can choose if they wish to arouse themselves. A separation. But when they are worn everyday this response seems to disappear. The high is gone but the wearer feels normal instead of feeling wrong. An even larger separation.

[Jenniferathome]

from the article,"orgasm & ejaculation are in fact separate events, although they seem to occur simultaneously. It is important to note that either of these events can occur in the absence of the other."

Who knew?! Al lI can say is that I'm batting 1000. Never a misfire. Maybe that's a record? Gotta check with Guiness

[Wildaboutheels]

I'm willing to bet that "many" of the folks who have "picture taking sessions" at home, end it with a ......

Bang?

And then the "Illusion" that might have taken an hour or two to "fabricate" [for some here] might be completely UNfabricated in just a minute or two? And/or maybe another minute or two for makeup removal?

This behavior^^^ IS commonly reported here. "I couldn't get out of the clothes quick enough".

There is no right or wrong to dressing Or WHY.

Unless it is hurting a Relationship of course as many have rightfully pointed out already.

[raleighbelle]

Thanks for the 'Facts'! Facts are facts and one cannot let opinions override facts. It really is nice when we can take complex subjects and simplify them into facts like that. I didn't think I started having 'O's until puberty, but I dressed before I ever started going to grade school, so obviously I must have been having 'O's all the time then. They weren't quite so messy then though.

One thing I don't understand though. When I did start having 'O's' at puberty, I did not have access to any women's clothing for many years. Yet I felt this way. I did however have tissues with me that I used every single time I had an 'O'. Amazingly, I do not have a major fetish for facial tissues. In fact, I don't even get all that sexually attracted when I see them. What's wrong with me?! Does that make me some kind of pervert because I am not behaving like one of Pavlov's Dogs?

Anyway, I want to thank you for sharing your expertise and giving us the straight facts, rather then some kind of opinion like most of us express on this site. That pretty much settles it all. But now I am more confused than ever.

[mechamoose]

Dressing isn't sexual for me. By itself it's just how I express myself.

Now, I may /swish more when dressed, and that may be more attractive to my mates.. and then it gets sexual.

}:>

- MM

[Lygophilia]

It can be possibility as you claim for most. Not sure about the O part, but I admit being not that educated on sex due to it's complexity. Seeing the answers in the topic on nongender specific clothes a few days ago, I'm not really surprised that most in the world would disagree with it, because of gender bias, lacking a sort of "excitement" that applies to them, and to who they can attract with it.

[Kate Simmons]

As we get older we begin to realize that, yep, the shortest distance between two points is a straight line. :battingeyelashes::)

[NicoleScott]

I read the OP and then re-read it, and I'm still scratching my head wondering what's the point? CDers are human, and humans are sexual creatures. For some CDers, women's clothing arouses. As one who dresses for pleasure, I'm glad it does. But I take at face value those who say CDing is not sexual for them. Is that so hard to do?

[MsVal]

One more data point:

I started crossdressing late in life. My sexual activity did not change. This leads me to believe that, in this single isolated case, crossdressing has no sexual component.

Best wishes
MsVal

[Lucy_Bella]

I will never say that the subject of this post fits all cders.. To me there are two types of MTF Cders .. Pleasure Dressers and Identity Dressers..

[samantha rogers]

I thought about skipping this thread altogether, but...oh, what the heck...:daydreaming:
Yes, there was a time I thought it was sexual, and indeed, it almost always was... but...all the...well all the "things"... I have swallowed in the last four years... things I am not "allowed" to mention here :eek:... in order to grow breasts (which I have... your mileage may differ)... have so lowered my testosterone and changed my hormonal balance that my libido is now non-existent, to say the least...tee hee...and yet... I still dress.
In fact, the desire to dress and mingle with others, and fully express myself is, if anything, stronger (and for my money, better!) than ever.:eek:
Sex is not a part of it at all. Dressing is strictly an expression of gender now.
Which leads me to wonder if the expression of gender when I had a libido produced endorphins that created the euphoria which then led to sexual urges. In other words, the sexual side was a by-product of just feeling good about myself, rather than the reason for dressing in itself.
Or not. Whatever...
Frankly, it matters not one bit to me any more. I am who I am and I like it.....and that's good enough for me.:battingeyelashes:
Samantha... from somewhere in the middle, tee hee.:heehee:

[Sam-antha]

Never mind the heels, its the outfit that goes with them. At 85 there are still my minis, (Thanks be I can still wear them) and the longer ones for the street and the micros for the open wild lands.
~Samm

[Barbara Jo]

I once was part of a very frank discussion with several women and myself. It was why I enjoyed wearing lingerie and women's clothes. They asked the same question that you did and had pre supposed ideas. I asked how many of then at one time wore sexy lingerie and clothes to be attractive. As we discussed it, all admitted that wearing sexy lingerie and clothes gave them a sense of excitement and a feeling of sexuality.

So, because as a CD I should not have the same excitement and sexual excitement? Lingerie is designed to provide sexual interest unlike men's clothes which is designed to be utilitarian.

Exactly what I have been told by various females.

Most females wear clothes that make them feel more feminine....even sexy, just as most males wear clothes that make them feel more masculine, etc.

Susan Brownmiller wrote in her book "Femininity" that part of being considered feminine is being able to function in spite of all the restrictions of female clothing and come "to adore them". (the restrictions)

Dolly Parton once said that if she was not born a woman she would be a drag queen as she loves wearing sexy clothes, wigs and make up, etc so much. :)

[ReineD]

As we discussed it, all admitted that wearing sexy lingerie and clothes gave them a sense of excitement and a feeling of sexuality.

So, because as a CD I should not have the same excitement and sexual excitement


Exactly what I have been told by various females.

It's not the same thing. Women do not get turned on by clothes in the same way as crossdressers. We just don't.

When we feel sexy it is because we are aroused to begin with. This would happen whether we are wearing lingerie or jeans. In other words, it is not the lingerie that makes us feel aroused, it is our need for sex. If we are already aroused, then wearing the lingerie enhances it. But if we are not aroused, the lingerie won't do a thing for us.

It's the opposite for crossdressers. Thinking about feminine clothing or wearing them is what is arousing (for those of you to whom this applies), which is then followed (for some of you) with sexual gratification.

I know that many CDers like to think they react the same way as women do to sexy clothing, but this is rationalization.

[Tinkerbell-GG]

I agree Reine - clothing might make us look sexy and maybe we're in a sexy mood anyway, but the clothing itself has little to do with it. The way a man looks at us in that clothing...yep, that'll do it. I suspect this is why we wear all these uncomfortable little items in the first place! :)

[Lucy_Bella]

It's not the same thing. Women do not get turned on by clothes in the same way as crossdressers.

I would have to agree ,why would you?




I suspect this is why we wear all these uncomfortable little items in the first place! :)

This is part of the reason that drives the desire ,you have to feel the clothing ..Soft ,silky and cut for women not men..