"Pass, or Die"

[PaulaQ]

One of my girlfriends, who's also TS (about 4 months into transition), came over to my house sunday, to go swimming at the pool at the condominiums where I live. After swimming, she stayed over for a while, we watched some Orange is the New Black, and Game of Thrones. So it was pretty late when she left my condo. She lives in a really good part of town, in Northern Plano.

She got back to her condos, and found that the nearby parking garage was full. So she went to the next garage, a short distance away, and parked. She came out of the garage - she was wearing a pretty blonde wig, black blouse and skirt, black thigh highs, and 4" black heels. She actually looked really good, I thought. Hormones have been pretty good to her so far, but she still has a ways to go.

Well, as she walked by the swimming pool on the way to her building, she heard whistles, cat-calls, and shouts of "Hey baby! Come over here sugar!" from the patio of a condo across the parking lot. She ignored them, and kept walking. The guys (there were 4-5 of them) kept whistling at her and being annoying - and then one of the women that was with them said "I don't think that's a woman..." It was dark, so they couldn't see her well, but my friend is 6'2", and with 4" heels, she stands out. Also, her body is still that of a male athlete. It's getting better - but it's just not totally feminized yet.

Four of the guys keep shouting at her - but they jump the fence of the patio, jump a low chain fence, and start pursuing her! "Hey sugar! Come here! We just wanna talk to you a minute!"

She kicked off her heels, and started running for the nearest entrance and stairwell to lead to her condo. She gets to the door - they are gaining on her, gets through it (there's a coded electronic key fob needed to enter), slams the door and runs up the stairs. She runs up the stairs, and then pauses at the landing. She hears them struggling with the door as she waits at the top of the second floor stairwell. Then she hears the fateful sound of the door opening - one of them had a pass to her building.

She runs, they climb the stairs in pursuit, still calling after her - "Hey wait a minute sugar, we just wanna talk to you!" She sprints down the corridor - they are in hot pursuit. She reaches her condo, opens the door, slams it, and locks it. They see which hall she turns into though.

She leaves the lights off in the condo, and sits on her couch for a minute, gasping for breath. They stop in front of her door - she can see their shadows under it. They start pounding on the door, still shouting for her to come out for a minute so they can speak with her.

My friend freezes and waits. She hears another person come up after a while and say "c'mon, she's probably calling the cops, you should leave." They reply "Who cares? Who are the cops going to believe? The four of us, or that faggot in there?" Apparently though, the newcomer eventually convinced them to quit beating on her door, calm down, and leave, because after a while, they left.

My friend sat shivering on her couch for 45 minutes before texting me. "Got home had to park in the 5 story garage and had a problem occur walking home. Wished I stayed with u." I called her immediately, and got the story above. She sounded terrible - like she was in shock. She didn't understand why they chased her like that - she didn't say a WORD to them. She didn't even look at them - she was simply passing by. There was little doubt in my mind that the guys chased her because one of the women read her as trans, and that they intended, at a minimum, to beat her up. Of equal concern was that they knew where she lived, and had access to a pass from her building - maybe one of them lived there as well.

She reported it to her condo management - I insisted on that, and told her to file a police report as well. (She hasn't done that, and probably won't - I think she's afraid of police involvement - getting outed to her job, or who knows what else because of it.) The condo management was unhelpful - one of the women who worked there told her "Well, you really brought this on yourself! You are a MAN, not a WOMAN! And we don't approve of boys who have sex with other boys here - we're Christians here and that's just ungodly." So I'm not guessing she's going to get much help from them.

So I came to her place this afternoon, with another girlfriend, and we first calmed her down (she still seemed to be in shock - she wasn't real animated when we first arrived). We told her that she needed to break her lease, and move out - because those guys surely meant her grievous harm, and they know where she lives. I told her she could stay with me for 2-3 months while she looked for a condo or apartment in my neighborhood. I told her she had to leave her condos - they weren't safe. This was the second time something like this had happened to her there. I told her that a third incident seemed likely, and next time she was unlikely to get off lucky as she had the last two times, and would likely be injured badly. I didn't give her a lot of choice about moving in with me. It just isn't safe for her there. Her family has mostly abandoned her, and essentially all of her former friends bailed on her when she came out as trans. She doesn't have anywhere else to go - she talked about living in her car for a while, for God's sake!

She finally agreed to move in with me temporarily. It's not ideal - but she should be really safe down here in the gayborhood - at least from hate crimes.

Later this week she moves in with me and my grown son. (I talked to him about it already, he's OK with it, under the circumstances.)

[Saikotsu]

Wow. That was quite sobering. She's really lucky to have a friend like you, and lucky things didn't turn out worse.

[PaulaQ]

The really awful part is that I probably won't even bother relating this story to any of my cisgender family or friends. Many of them never believe these stories, even the ones that have happened to me personally. Almost none of them understand the truth of the matter - that some people simply don't consider a transgender person to be a human being, and that we are fair game as targets for their hatred and intolerance. We violate God's law according to some (although neither my friend or I asked for this), and getting rid of us is seen as a public service of sorts.

Of course the politicians and news media who help fan the flames of hate for these folks take no responsibility any of it.

[TinaZ]

How awful. Just ... Gut wrenching.

Thank goodness she has a good friend in you. Getting her out of there sounds like the best thing right now.

[Alexis.j]

Really sad story. Mind you, its actually sickening!
Why can't we just get left alone to do our own thing. ..
She has a great friend in you, and I hope everything comes right.

[Tinkerbell-GG]

We violate God's law according to some...

I'm so sorry for your friend :( I think though, that it's more animalistic than 'Gods law'. We like to think we're so sophisticated and above the animal kingdom, yet a few months back I watched a documentary about walruses and the male walruses would literally fight to the death another male walrus if his whiskers were different. As I watched this appalling reality, I couldn't help comparing it to our own lack of acceptance for each other's differences. We're nothing more than animals under all our intellectual BS.

Doesn't excuse the behavior, obviously, but it explains why it's not changing any time soon. The thing you need to remind your friend is that if this is God's law, then God made your friend and the walrus with the wonky whiskers and given he's apparently never wrong, your friend is perfect as she is. These idiots need to practice what they preach! x

[Katey888]

Paula - that is an awful tale and I'm sure not as rare as some here would want us all to believe... Yet another insight into the vulnerability of anyone, including GGs (who's to say that a single GG would not also have been pursued just for a different reason?) and, I suppose, one of those lessons in hindsight - how much easier and safer would it have been for her to stay with you? I've travelled extensively around the world and make a point of not being on my own walking, middle of the night in any big city... but it's not what you expect in your home town is it?

I'm appalled at the condo management comment (are they owners or just management? I'd complain to the owners...) - but I understand the challenges there... and she should file a police report. It's the reporting of nascent crimes that will eventually help get the law's attention - no-one should feel hunted in their own neighbourhood.

I'm afraid Tinks got it right about 'animalistic' behaviour - I have a very poor opinion of humankind as a whole, and it sounds like these guys were down there amongst the bottom-dwellers... You're doing a very fine service in supporting her in this way when she needs a friend - she's lucky you're around... :hugs:

Katey x

[trisha kobichenko]

I have one comment, not necessarily politically correct...self defense is paramount. We all have the right to live in our world, and those who would threaten that deserve to be thwarted, by any means necessary. Read into that what you will. I train in martial arts, crossdress, and possess skills that might prevent me being harmed by folks who find me 'offensive'. There are numerous other 'solutions' available to dissuade those who intend us physical harm--I encourage all of us to employ whatever means necessary for self-protection.
Hugs,
Trish

[Pink Susan]

Horrible story , I really feel for your friend Paula

As someone who can't defend herself, I'd be scared to death

[mechamoose]

I'm glad your friend is safe.

She did the right thing to run rather than to confront them. No telling what would have happened if she had done something differently. The big question I have is once they got inside, how did they know what unit to go to?

She *needs* to file that police report.

- MM

[Donnagirl]

Shocking... Truely shocking. Please post that police report and if you aren't satisfied push higher... People like that (and I use the term people in its widest and most generic obviously) need to be brought to justice. Profiles are built on multiple reports and these are needed before any serious action can be taken. If this had happened on my patch, well... I wouldn't be here typing out a post...

Please have your friend exercise extreme caution if returning to that area.

I only wish I could help more...

[Kate Simmons]

You were right in telling your friend to look for another place, that one is definitely hostile. Evidently "good Christians" like the management there have no problem seeing someone (one of their tenants) being attacked and beaten up or worse. It would be interesting if those self same people were attacked by those very thugs they then would be singing a very different tune. You are a good person for giving your friend a temporary place to stay. When we are vulnerable like that bad things can happen. Unfortunately when we are pursuing transitioning things like this are bound to come up in our RLT. Knowing how to fend for ourselves is a distinct advantage.:)

[bimini1]

I cannot begin to tell you how much this upsets me. We're Christians here!?! We get lulled into a false sense of security. This is the reality of it. And the reality is there is always going to be this segment of the society that thinks it's not only their right, but duty as well to persecute us with violence, bigotry. I'll be praying for all involved.

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi Paula, That story is so sad, It's so wonderful that your friend has such a special person to take her in.

[CarlaWestin]

I'm glad your friend is safe.

She did the right thing to run rather than to confront them. No telling what would have happened if she had done something differently. The big question I have is once they got inside, how did they know what unit to go to?

She *needs* to file that police report.

- MM

Yep, ditto the above. Since it is known where the morons were originally partying, a visit with a few officers to remind them of the legal consequences of bad behavior is in order.

Me personally, I would backdress in my most male attire and simply wait in the parking lot. Ball cap, baseball bat, evil smile. Sometimes morons just need a little attitude adjustment.

[CrossJess]

That's truly awful :sad:, but I can defiantly sympathise with your friend what with being a victim of hate crime too I've had my fare share of it what with being gay and all, if i can offer any help then Ill be more than happy to help, I got badly beaten up a few years ago because a group of guys didn't like the fact I was gay and dressed as a girl, the worrying part of it all was that I was just happily walking home at night minding my own business when these guys started calling me all sorts, lucky to escape with my life that night it makes you weary about going out I feel so vulnerable after that, my bf wont let me walk home alone anymore not after that, he's always with me now:) that's the only time I've seen him truly scared, the thought of loosing me in that way, left me shook up and scared for a long time, ill shut up now as it's up setting me a bit never really goes away:sad:, but Ill just say this, I know exactly what your friends going through, you have to remember that guys don't chase you like that just for a chat so she is bloody lucky she didn't get hurt, there is some truly nasty *******s in this world and you can only hope what goes around comes around

[NavyM2F_WAM]

That was a horrible story. I thank God (I'm a Christian) for protecting your friend.

[suchacutie]

I'm Christian as well and besides being incredibly angry at the actions of those hoodlums, the action of that manager is very far from Christian. Those people are condoning violence and hate.

Filing a police report is essential as I'm sure that gang will have a history of such actions. The truly Christian beliefs of tolerance and love for all people are not yet universal. Your story is truly frightening.

[devida]

Really a terrible story, Paula. She is lucky to have you as a friend. It sounds like the guys knew her, knew where she lived and were just waiting for an opportunity to beat her up, or worse. I think you were absolutely right to insist she move out. I understand her reluctance to call the police. Texas doesn't have any transgender rights. According to wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Texas) you can discriminate as much as you like against LGBT people there. That's pretty much true throughout the South though local jurisdictions more and more are taking matters into their own hands and passing local laws to protect LGBT people. Unfortunately too many men (and some women too) consider transgender people to be a threat to their own gender identity. This makes them believe that transgender people should be oppressed and even eliminated. They view trans folk as an existential threat! The statistics on violence to transgender people are horrible.

I know this sort of violence stopped pretty fast in Key West when gay men started returning the favor and beating the crap out of the gay bashers, but this is hardly a solution. In Florida your friend would have had the Castle Doctrine on her side and would have been exempt from prosecution if she'd shot through the door, but this is also hardly a solution. I am afraid that only when government, police, and the majority of American society recognizes transgender people as being at a special risk from violence and start prosecuting this kind of attack as a hate crime, only then are we likely to see a change for the better. You may remember that violence against blacks in the South was reduced by the Federal government deciding to prosecute offenders for human rights violations when local authorities refused to even arrest whites who had killed black men and women. We are still a long way from that but maybe we will get there.

[Rhonda Jean]

Very scary. The plight of a TS is impossibly scary. I'm sometimes a bit put off by the hierarchy of the ts vs. cd. This is just and example of where this rightfully comes from. I don't have to go anywhere or do anything I feel uncomfortable about. I can turn it off or tone it down as I see fit. As far as me personally, I only dabble in real life things when I want to. Obviously, the TS has no such option. I respect that. I almost always carry back-up male clothes. If this had been me, I might have changed in my car.

I think it bears saying that people like those who attacked your friend are so different from us that we can't begin to understand or predict their behavior, and there's more of them than there are of us. I've never had to kick off my heels and run, but I've had that option in my head. She was damn lucky to get away, and she has to get out of there now. We occasionally read on this board about girls in similar circumstances confronting people like this, or claiming that they would. I don't think she would have survived this encounter, at least not unscathed.

[Sc0rp10N]

Maybe this is out of place in this thread, but its all I was thinking while reading your story... She's still genetically male, she was an athlete (at least that's what I gathered from your description), understandably, more than likely not a winnable fight, but why not flip the guy switch, the athlete switch, that competitive nature switch and stand your ground? All fights = you win some, you lose some. 4-5 on 1 is a loss before it starts unless you're an MMA fighter, but maybe a little testosterone could have ended that whole scenario right then and there without leaving a lingering fear. Women are taught to be defensive and tough in situations like this, we men have in our blood, just because we wear skirts, doesn't mean its gone, but I can see how it may dull the reflex a bit. And I'm not trying to come down on your friend, this comment is more for the rest of us, there IS an alternative to living in fear, and its standing your ground, even in the face of overwhelming odds. Its not only a deterrent, its also a message.

[Amanda M]

Scorpion -if the odds are not on your side, it is also unbelievably stupid - and I don't care what martial arts skills you have.

You might send a message yes, but is it worth being hospitalized for?

[Aprilrain]

maybe a little testosterone could have ended that whole scenario right then and there without leaving a lingering fear. Women are taught to be defensive and tough in situations like this,

First of all, TS women are not men!

If she's on hormones she does not have the testosterone that a man has.

What is it exactly that you imagine this girl would have done to defend her self against 4-5 guys?

Even if she had survived the trauma of the assault would have been devastating physically, emotionally and mentally, there would be no victory.

Women be they GG or TS, get brutally raped and beaten to death by guys like this all the time.

Standing your ground is about the dumbest thing you could possibly do in a situation like this!

[mechamoose]

Even with a decade of Kung-Fu under my belt, I would be *very* concerned about taking on more than 2 opponents at once. Four or five? I'm running.

- MM

[Tracii G]

That is such a sad story and I'm sorry that it happened.
Truly sickening that the condo management assumed because she is trans the she has sex with guys.Not very Christian sounding to me.
I know what I would do file a police report on all involved including the woman.
To sit and cower to these lowlifes would not be an option for me.

[amyjacks2014]

^.^

As to: ""Well, you really brought this on yourself! You are a MAN, not a WOMAN! And we don't approve of boys who have sex with other boys here - we're Christians here and that's just ungodly." So I'm not guessing she's going to get much help from them."

I am a non-denominational Christian, and while the Bible, especially Romans 1 is especially grim on God's opinion on anything other than a one man/one woman relationship, as I tell my gay and lesbian friends, and I'll tell you here and now, NOWHERE IN THE BIBLE DOES IT SAY WE HUMANS ARE THE SWORD OF GOD!!

I tell the LGBT community that we need to watch, and not be intolerant of those who do not like our lifestyle, but the response your friend received reminded me that there are some people who THINK they are Christians, but kinda in a way that the Westboro people think they are Christians. If you can not understand the part of the Bible where Jesus talked about loving your neighbor, and let he who is without sin cast the first stone, then you are doing yourself and others a disservice, because you are stepping into the realm of those things that God reserves to do for himself, such as figuring out who was right and wrong whenever that matters.

And enough of the religiousity, which I only bring up because two non-Christians thought it necessary to judge someone else based on their own twisted version of the religion. It's one of my pet peeves.

I am glad that yourriend has people such as YOU in her life. You recognized the danger and refused to budge on making sure she was safe. Now, she WILL be safe, and she'll be around people who care for her and support her. It sounds like your neighborhood is a bit more diverse, and more open to having members of the LGBT community there. I will keep both of you in my thoughts, and send best wishes to both of you. I am assuming that you might be able to help her find a new place, and will kinda watch the situation to make sure she gets settled in someplace where this won't be an issue. You seem like that kind of strong person. :)


Amy M. Jackson

[typhoidmary]

it disgusts me that the people working there would use any excuse at all to stick up for four men bashing someone's door in. I can't imagine how frightened your friend must have been. at least she knows she has at least one person looking out for her. Also I definitely think she did the right thing, it sounds like some kind of confrontation was exactly what these idiots wanted, and getting the shit kicked out of you is never the best solution to anything.

[Marcelle]

Hi Paula. I am so saddened to hear about your friend's traumatic event. She did the right thing running an no good can come of an altercation with such odds. However I am even more disturbed about how the condo management dealt with it. It is great that she has such a good friend in you during this hour of need . . .well done on you sweetie for being such great support.

Hugs

Isha

[amyjacks2014]

^.^

Structurally I am still a male, and getting into guy mode for a second ....

... yeah, even with the baseball bat that I have for home defense, I would
think twice before taking on one drunk guy, much less four or five. I have only
had to use the bat once in eight years, and that was to go upstairs and ask the neighbors at
that time if there was something I could help them with something (bat only slightly
hidden behind my leg) ... the man and woman living there at the time had
gotten into a major fight, and I thought I'd heard him hitting her, and given how
my family was when I was a child, I was not going to stand for that. If the man
had made any move even thinking of anything suggesting violence, I would have
clocked him, but that was me while very psyched up. ..

OK, now back to normal, female mode ...

... I think the big thing in this situation was that your friend did not have full control
of her situation. Which is why you insisted she move. Since I have started cross-dressing
while out on errands or going to work, I am always aware of my surroundings. On the one
hand, I am in a rural setting, but on the other hand, even though it was NOT about LGBT issues,
the Matt Sheperd murder happened right here where I live, so I don't fool myself into
thinking I am totally safe.


Amy M. Jackson

[Judith96a]

Me personally, I would backdress in my most male attire and simply wait in the parking lot. Ball cap, baseball bat, evil smile. Sometimes morons just need a little attitude adjustment.

Anyone got an "attitude wrench"?! I'm with Carla!

[Desirae]

What a terrible story. It's just a sad state of affairs how many haters there are in this world. I don't see it getting better any time soon. It's just the way things are. You need to be able to take care of yourself and defend yourself. The police can't protect you. They come AFTER the assault, rape, murder, burglary, etc has been committed. You need to be able to protect yourself. You're the ONLY one you can truly count on. You're a good friend. I hope things get better for your friend.

[Tammy Lynn Tx]

Just remember if you are going to use a bat do NOT hit above the shoulders, that could be interpreted as intent to kill. Instead aim at shins, knees and use short swings or jabs don't swing for the fence. If possible take a self defense course, the instructors can teach you all kinds of debilitating hits.

[Rhonda Jean]

Maybe this is out of place in this thread, but its all I was thinking while reading your story... She's still genetically male, she was an athlete (at least that's what I gathered from your description), understandably, more than likely not a winnable fight, but why not flip the guy switch, the athlete switch, that competitive nature switch and stand your ground? All fights = you win some, you lose some. 4-5 on 1 is a loss before it starts unless you're an MMA fighter, but maybe a little testosterone could have ended that whole scenario right then and there without leaving a lingering fear. Women are taught to be defensive and tough in situations like this, we men have in our blood, just because we wear skirts, doesn't mean its gone, but I can see how it may dull the reflex a bit. And I'm not trying to come down on your friend, this comment is more for the rest of us, there IS an alternative to living in fear, and its standing your ground, even in the face of overwhelming odds. Its not only a deterrent, its also a message.

You've got to be kidding.

[PaulaQ]

Regarding Texas - yeah, for the most part, this is a horrible state to be transgender, with the exceptions of maybe Houston, Austin, and the City of Dallas. Dallas has some trans protections in its city ordinances - but only in the city. Not Dallas County, and in none of the adjacent cities or counties. My friend lives in Collin County - it is not trans friendly, although her condos are unusually hostile.

Regarding fighting - you know, when she weighed 350 lbs of mostly muscle, she might've had a chance against those guys. She'd have been hurt - but they wouldn't have messed with someone that size probably. At 220 lbs (mostly muscle mass loss), yeah, no way. Running was the correct response.

I want her at my house because I live in the City of Dallas, so we have some legal protection. At least we can go to the bathroom without harassment! The gayborhood is full of really accepting people - she won't have any problems down here - or at least she's WAAAY less likely too. She's way more of a femme than I am - they love her here in this neighborhood. She's a really girly-girl. (I've thought about getting her to join this site, some of y'all would really like her.)

[Katey888]

Members - I know we're all very angry about what has happened to Paula's friend (and rightly so) but please try to stay within rules regarding prohibited contents, specifically this excerpt:

The following content is NOT allowed ANYWHERE on the forum and will be deleted.
• Religion of any sort, no exceptions
• Use/sale of illicit drugs and drug paraphernalia or condoning any other illegal activity.
• Guns/weapons, using, buying etc.

Then we can keep the thread open... Thank you all
Katey
Moderator

[MatildaJ.]

There are things teen girls are told when they start getting male attention. Even if you go out for the evening looking hot, one can bring a pair of flats and some loose jeans to pull on when heading home. Dressing down doesn't prevent rape all the time obviously, but it tends to reduce the male aggression in the air.

I'm not blaming her, but just trying to pass along some of the gendered guidelines girls get.

[PaulaQ]

Thanks Jess. The jeans idea is a great idea, thanks!

I've given her some of the same advice, but not that one. She just refuses. She's really femme. She loves heels. When she's really dolled up, she can stop traffic down here in the 'hood. She loves the attention.

I've said, fairly bluntly to her:

"Buy some ******* flats!"

I have at least gotten her into skinny jeans (sometimes) rather than really short skirts all the time. Her idea of toning down her footwear has been to go from 5" heels to 4".

There's reasons I dress like a soccer mom most of the time. It's not that I don't like many of the same things as her - but sometimes invisibility is your friend. I think like a lot of us though, she'd rather die than be something other than her true self. Like a lot of us, she feels like she's missed most of her life as a woman. I think she'll be herself regardless of the costs.

I'll see if I can get her to consider that. Mostly, I think the best I'll be able to do just need to avoid the issue and get her out of hatersville...

[stephNE]

OMG! That is horrible, but I'm glad you are safe now. Be very careful.

[TinaZ]

Even with a decade of Kung-Fu under my belt, I would be *very* concerned about taking on more than 2 opponents at once. Four or five? I'm running.

- MM

I'm a third-degree black belt in a hard-style Korean martial art (Tang Soo Do), and I agree with MM 100 percent. Running to safety was the best way to handle this. No way I'd ever, EVER, stand my ground with 5-on-1 odds. And to be honest, the best lesson from years and years of training is this: AVOID A FIGHT AT ALL COSTS.

[Bria]

Paula, I'm so glad that you are able to take your friend into your home for safety. That is a really scary story, I'll remember both of you in my prayers!

Hugs Bria

[monica.missil]

She is lucky to have your friendship and support. Please let us know when you both are safer in your place. And kudos to your son for showing what a true man should do in this situation and be helpful in a time of need.

[Lorileah]

First filing a police report, while making the victim feel better would not do anything at this point. Still, I would have it on record in case something else happens later.

Next, the trans community is often left out of hate crime protection. This is the case in Texas
The Texas James Byrd Jr. Hate Crimes Act, passed in 2001, provides enhanced penalties for hate crimes motivated by a victim’s race, religion, color, sex, disability, sexual preference, age, or national origin. Though the Act includes provision for crimes of bias based on “sexual preference,” it currently does not include bias crimes motivated by gender identity and expression. Additionally, Texas has yet to see an effective implementation and enforcement of the Hate Crimes Act. Even then Texas is bad about enforcing any violation of a hate crime.


Hate violence targeting transgender people remains a regular reality in Texas. From 1970 to 2004, Texas ranked third in the U.S. for reported murders of transgender individuals, with 15 murders in 6 cities. One expert estimates that transgender individuals living in America today have a one in 12 chance of being murdered. In contrast, other Texans have about a one in 18,500 chance of being murdered. There ya go, being a TG in Texas is like being a varmint

I don't really care how good your self defense skills are, 4 men ganging up on you will be a losing proposition. Transgender people are often targeted for property crimes, threats, assault, and murder. Hate-motivated violence against people because of their gender identity or expression is often characterized by actions that law enforcement personnel refer to as "overkill": excessive force over what is necessary just to attack someone, and is characterized by brutal, vicious violence.

Texas state law does not protect employees from discrimination based on their sexual orientation or gender identity

Texas state law does not protect persons from housing or public accommodations discrimination based on their sexual orientation or gender identity or expression

Texas state law does not protect persons from insurance discrimination based on their sexual orientation or gender identity or expression.

Bottom line. We, the TG community, can complain all we want but when we don't press for these rights they will not be forthcoming. Texas, as many states, have newer protections for Gays and Lesbians, but specifically exclude TGs, One in 12 TG people will be murdered in Texas. If this was your city would you let that go? So go ahead, be angered by what happened to Paula's friend. But you need to stand up too. Paula puts her life at risk every day, but although so many here rally behind her, how many Texas members here are willing to petition for equal rights? Uh huh, you can put your hand down now the one of you who would

[Secret Drawer]

While this is indeed a scary story, and in no way would I ever defend this type of behavior, I write this for us to bear in mind;
Mix Fuel (alchohol), with male ego (bruised by the "mistaken gender"), and add a dose of bravado (three or four drunken friends) and you have an instant problem. There was no way for Paula's friend to know this was going to go down, but if any of these three ingredients are missing, then we have no horror story. Things like this do indeed happen, and worse! But it remains atypical and calling the police right then and there is what to do, no matter the repercussions later. Your life is the most important thing here!

[Jaylyn]

I'm sorry if this offends some but I'm a Texan thru and thru. I want to say if you don't think it can happen in other states you are mistaken. As long as there are macho alcoholics in groups the testosterone will flow. One summer we were heading for Jackson Hole Wyoming to elk hunt and stopped at a gas station to fill up in Denver, Colorado. There were four crazy males at the pump beside us. Myself and my son filled up and as we were walking inside to go to the rest room another punk got out of the car and yelled hey you Texas S ---s, Me and my friends want to F--- y'all up. I told my son who was only in high school to keep walking and if there was trouble here's the keys for him to run as hard as he could to the truck and lock the doors. I said I would hold them off and run jump into the back of the truck and for him to drive off fast. It's funny how when you need to pee and something like that happens all of a sudden you don't have to as bad. We turned and made a fast walk back to the truck and two more of the jerks had gotten out my son went straight to the truck and unlocked it then got in. I walked straight to the truck and they got between me and the truck. I jump around a pump and grabbed the handle and threw it back at them as hard as I could I jumped on the bumper and over inside the bed. My son and I speed off into the night. He stopped a couple blocks away I got into the drivers seat and told him if they chase us get your seat belt buckled, because I was gonna can them with the grill guard and keep on till they were mashed in the small car like a can of tuna.
My point we weren't dressed but common sense says we got the right to protect ourselves. It can happen anytime anyplace and one should always have a back up plan. You can pass as many anti laws as you want but in this situation and given the circumstances these guys wouldn't have cared what the law is. I do say it should have been reported as I worked five years in law enforcement to pay my way thru college.

[PaulaQ]

@Secret Drawer, Jaylyn

Violence against transgender individuals is really commonplace. I posted something about my own scary experience last week, and believe me, that's not been my only issue. I haven't been chased by a gang of men, unlike my friend, which is really lucky for me, as I'm handicapped and I wouldn't have escaped. I know transwomen who've been beaten, raped, verbally assaulted and harassed. I know women who've experienced housing and medical discrimination.

One of my other friends, who's been unemployed for a long time, and now is underemployed, showed me a picture of herself taken last week with a noose around her neck. She was thinking about ending her life - has been for some time. I try to help her as I can, too.

It's so bad that I don't even bother to tell my family and cisgender friends about it all. They simply won't believe it - it can't be like that in America! Or so they think. Sadly, it is that bad, and worse.

[Amy Fakley]

"Well, you really brought this on yourself! You are a MAN, not a WOMAN! And we don't approve of boys who have sex with other boys here - we're Christians here and that's just ungodly."

What an unbelievable load of crap!
So this lady thinks Jesus would have been just alright with your friend getting beat to hell in her own home for the crime of existing within eyesight of those fine young men?
But man-love, oh hell no!

I mean ... how ... I just can't even ...
... GRARR!! ...

people are such myopic a-holes sometimes.

Paula, you're a damn good person for being there like that. I know you had your own rough patches recently, but just know ... you are one of the good ones, never stop shining your light, girl! :)

I hope your friend manages to find a safer place to live soon, and can find some peace and quiet from jerks like that.

[mechamoose]

Not to mention conflating being TG with being gay.

:rolleyes:

- MM

[Saikotsu]

I replied earlier, but I've had some time to process this. As someone who has only just begun to explore the prospect of going out and about, who only 2 week's ago took my first outing, stories like this one are almost enough to make me want to stay hidden away in secret again. All I can think about is what the heck is wrong with those people? Seriously, what gives them the idea that violence is an acceptable course of action against a stranger? What did your friend do to them? And the management, ugh...
I am without words. They simply cannot express my disgust.

[amyjacks2014]

^.^

Saikotsu, ya have to remember that alcohol was involved,
and alcohol, while it is not an excuse, certainly explains
some of the actions.

The apartment managers had no such excuse, they displayed
a major bigotry, and used religion as a means.


Amy M. Jackson

[heatherdress]

Everyone has made excellent comments and have expressed our common outrage and sympathy. This was more than a fear-inducing chase of a cross dresser. It was an attack on human dignity and respect. Even the management's response was reprehensible - ignorance, prejudice, indifference. I won't suggest that any law will prevent this from happening again. I won't pretend that we can change bullies, and aggressors, and criminal behavior. But we should be never give up our right to live our lives as we want to - without fear. Maybe we need to be more careful. Maybe we can be better prepared to face threats. But we need to be strong, and never give up our dreams and principals. I was very sorry to read this. It touched my soul. And now I am angry. But I also feel closer to everyone who replied and shared our common feelings. Thank you all.

[Paula_Femme]

@ PaulaQ: There's some hellishly ignorant filth out there; pour some cheap beer down their throats and they just can't wait to prove how "manly" they are... UGH!!! :angry:

I won't second guess what your friend should have done regarding getting the police involved, it is "TexAss" after all - that crack was aimed at the Neanderthal lawmakers, not the Texans on this board - but I'm glad you were able to convince your friend to get out of Dodge, so to speak... she's lucky to have you in her life!!!

As for the "management" at the condo, vomiting up her religiously fueled bigotry and spite is beyond contemptible!!! :angry:

[sometimes_miss]

Maybe this is out of place in this thread, but its all I was thinking while reading your story... She's still genetically male, she was an athlete (at least that's what I gathered from your description), understandably, more than likely not a winnable fight, but why not flip the guy switch, the athlete switch, that competitive nature switch and stand your ground? All fights = you win some, you lose some. 4-5 on 1 is a loss before it starts unless you're an MMA fighter, but maybe a little testosterone could have ended that whole scenario right then and there without leaving a lingering fear. Women are taught to be defensive and tough in situations like this, we men have in our blood, just because we wear skirts, doesn't mean its gone, but I can see how it may dull the reflex a bit. And I'm not trying to come down on your friend, this comment is more for the rest of us, there IS an alternative to living in fear, and its standing your ground, even in the face of overwhelming odds. Its not only a deterrent, its also a message.
Yes, and the message is 'I'm an idiot' who doesn't have the sense to save myself from getting my ass kicked, and possibly killed.
On the other hand, perhaps this whole thread is a troll, because we hear over and over on this forum that all we have to fear is fear itself, that it's perfectly safe for us all to go out dressed as girls, because our western society has changed and is tolerant and accepting of everyone today; no one ever gets picked on, there is no longer any bullying, and the world is always a wonderful place.

This thread should be a sticky, right on top, as a public service announcement so no one ever forgets that WE ARE NOT SAFE OUT THERE.

[flatlander_48]

Once again, truth is stranger than fiction, sad to say. You just can't make this stuff up.

To my way of thinking, I place a lot of the blame at the feet of some of the more radical elements on various talk radio programs. They will all say that they abhor violence and do not advocate it, but on the other hand they will speak of those who are different from them in ways to discount and demean. In effect it legitimizes the behaviors that they claim not support. Mix that with alcohol and peer pressure and it is a very bad intersection.

The image below is me. While I don't often go out dressed like this, I could be subjected to the same behaviors with the additional facet of being Black. I sympathize greatly with this situation, but you know, there is a reason it is called The James Byrd Jr. Hate Crimes Act.

[docrobbysherry]

Thank u for posting this warning advisory to all of us that can't pass.

It's episodes like this that guaranty no matter how many times I go out dressed, if I'm alone at nite, even just walking a short distance from my car to a T friendly club in a "safe area", I STRESS! Dressing "to blend" helps. But, I probably fear that more than the hoodlums.

As for the, "---words of God"? Whether or not She said them is arguable. But, the self serving way that humans twist them to suit their neferious purposes to exclude or hate those "different" from them is NOT!

[ChristinaK]

This whole episode is extremely disturbing to me. I am a Christian, and the behavior of the people involved DO NOT reflect tolerant Christian behavior. Jesus would have welcomed your friend into His presence. Secondly, having spent (unfortunately) much of my life in the South, I totally understand the narrow-mindedness and bigoted Bull dogged approach to your friend. This is reminiscent of the way militant Blacks were treated in the 1960's. It is abhorrent behavior, yet there are those that cling to cave man behavior that we cannot control. In addition, I am a conservative. Being a conservative does not mean being bigoted, or racist. It simply means adhering to our countries values, which means religious freedom, freedom from governmental control, and TOLERANCE of other peoples values, whatever they are.

Personally, I would not have run the way your friend did, and would have been beaten to a bloody pulp. She did EXACTLY what she should have done. It is so sad that in today's world we must continue to be in fear of the common man. Unfortunately, we never know who the common man is. Makes one wonder how many of those fools were acting out of denial rather than true hatred...

[PaulaQ]

My friend V had to go to her mailbox today, so she did that in boy mode. She passed a couple of the dudes who'd chased her, and their girlfriends from that night as they were leaving the pool. They didn't recognize her, and she overheard them talking about "Chasing a big ol' tranny, going to put their boot up her a**, etc." They were indeed mad that she'd fooled them at first - one of the girls kept chiding them "See - I TOLD you it wasn't a woman!" She said they sounded really upset that there was "a tranny living in the complex."

She also talked to one of her few friendly neighbors, and found out that one of them had witnessed the guys outside of her condo, beating on the door.

Surprisingly enough, the condo management actually reported the incident to the police, which is what they were supposed to do. The police showed up, interviewed V, and told her that her height had almost certainly been what gave her away. (That's what I told her too.) The police corporal was really polite, but told her that "I wish I could tell you something different, but Plano is not a friendly place for LGBT people. You go out in women's clothes again, say in your two piece suit down to the pool, and you're likely to be injured before we can get to you. I'm not telling you to leave here because I want you to go, but I'm telling you that this city is just not very safe for you." He also told her that he was going to go over and talk to the people who'd chased her, and let them know that if they bothered her again, he'd arrest all of them. As he left, she saw him leave her building, and head over to theirs.

So while she was telling me all this on the phone this evening, she heard someone try to open her door, and she saw shadows of a couple of people outside her door. She looked out the peep hole, and sure enough, it was two of the guys. I told her to NOT confront them under any circumstances, and to hang up with me and call the police. She did, but I don't know yet if the police returned, or what else happened.

I'm thinking I may spend the night over there tomorrow night and until she moves out. I'm really worried about her being there alone.

On a somewhat related topic, apparently she was told by her ex wife (who lives in the same area), that V and I were big news around the little shopping village near her condo. She overheard a couple of women in Starbucks talking about the two transsexuals in Nicola's restaurant, one who was really tall and athletic (V), and one who was short and dumpy, but kind of cute (me.)

After she related all this to me, and before she hung up to call the police again, V just sounded really sad, and said "They really hate us, don't they? I mean, I never really believed that - but these people here, they hate us?" All I could tell her was "yeah, hon, some of them do."

[Amanda M]

Paula - thanks for being you. The people who abused V do not just hate transgendered folks, they hate anybody who does not conform to the male stereotype. All I wanted to say, really, is that you should be very proud of what you did, and what you are doing. If there were more like you around, I,m sure that Texas would be a better, safer place.
And, if I were to guess, I would think that every single member of this forum would share that view! Well done.

[freeindress]

She said they sounded really upset that there was "a tranny living in the complex."

From a male LGBT-hater's narrow mind, beeing next to a CD in real life or on a photo is one thing they can't accept, but if they just can't stand one leaving nearby, they really have a problem.

[typhoidmary]

it scares me how far some people are willing to go, just because they hate transsexuals, or any group of people for that matter... the fact these guys are willing to risk going to jail for it. seems like such a stupid thing to potentially throw away your freedom over. and yet for people like your friend who are on the other side, it's so traumatic and horrible to be put through, and for what reason? I'll never comprehend people like that.

[Michelle789]

Paula,

I'm really sorry this incident happened to your friend. I think it's best she stays with you, and stays in a trans-friendly area. I agree that Texas is a horrible state to be trans in. The worst part is in some of these transphobic places, even if she did fight, whether she wins or loses, she would probably go to jail and her attackers get away with it. I have heard stories like this before where the trans person goes to jail for standing up for herself.

You may want to contact transgenderlawcenter.org. I'm not sure if they only serve California or if they serve the entire country. But it's worth a try.

As for the condo management invoking the Christian argument, they are anything but Christian to say that. Shame on them. I think she'll be much happier in the gayborhood than that transphobic Christian wannabe environment.

I still waiver on transphobia being caused by Christianity or is it just part of our animal instincts. Maybe Christian doctrine is based on animal instincts too.



It is so sad that in today's world we must continue to be in fear of the common man. Unfortunately, we never know who the common man is. Makes one wonder how many of those fools were acting out of denial rather than true hatred...

I think some people might act like this out of peer pressure. It was one of the girls who clocked her thought, so women are not above reproach either. Both sexes can be horrible when it comes to transphobia.

P.S. She has every right to dress the way she does. I hope she can dress as herself in a safer environment.

[PaulaQ]

Well she got through last night. The cops came out, warned the dudes to stay away again. These guys are stupid.

[Princess Grandpa]

Last year, shortly after discovering/accepting this part of myself we attended the funeral of a young woman who frequented the club we attend. I didn't know her really. I only met her a couple of times but her murder really affected me. I'm glad your friend is safe so far. I hope she remains so and is able to move quickly. As my five year old granddaughter is so fond of saying "it's just not fair!" Please be careful! Both of you.

Hug
Rita

[Amy Fakley]

I still waiver on transphobia being caused by Christianity or is it just part of our animal instincts. Maybe Christian doctrine is based on animal instincts too.

All religions are tea leaves ... you see in them what you want to see.
I don't think Christian doctrine is particularly hateful to anyone ... but look at history, and how many times it has been cited as justification for all manner of horrible acts that in the end only serve the purposes of people who would have done those things anyway. Same goes for just about every other religion.

When someone says God hates something, you can almost always be certain what they really mean is "I hate something and would like to excuse myself from having to justify it".

Paula, I sure hope this ends well for your friend. The world is full of a-holes who cannot be taught a better way .. the best you can do is to avoid them, and try to leave the world a better place than you found it. Which it certainly sounds like you're doing :-)

[GeminaRenee]

What I get out of this thread (other than a nauseous feeling), is a clearer notion of how far we as CD/TG/TS/DQ folk have yet to go in order to live our lives freely, and without an undue sense of fear.

Unfortunately, I have the feeling that this thread is more likely to cause some of us to stay in and hide, which is not going to do anything to further our ability to lead unhindered lives. This is exactly why it is so important for us to be actively involved in bettering conditions around us, to be agents of change, and to assert our reality as one that isn't going to go away for those who are made uncomfortable, or would do us harm.

I'm not suggesting unwise confrontation of people like the individuals in question, of course. But I do think its fair to say that the ball is in our court, and that we face a choice of actively pursuing change and remodeling boundaries, though it may be at many times uncomfortable. But no-one is going to strike that gong for us. And if we decide to hide away and live in fear, then I don't see how any of us can expect a better, more tolerant future.

[Beverley Sims]

Paula,
We are all so complacent here in our own little world.

There is a false sense of security with us all having accepting stories to tell.

I am sorry, but we all need a heads up now and then to raise our awareness.

I hope the resolution for your friend turns out for the better.

[KellyJameson]

The sad reality is that it is extremely dangerous to be transgendered and every year hundreds are murdered and thousands marginalized all over the world.

I attended Southern Methodist Univ and Dallas actually as an active LGBT community but not in Plano.

It is dangerous for any woman to be alone and more so when you wear heels and short skirts or anything that "provokes sexual interest" and if you are T it almost seems to be OK to use violence against you "because you deserved it"

It is similar to how a woman who dresses provocatively was asking for it (rape) but more so because you "are not really a woman" in many peoples eyes so get what you deserve but "doubly so" as being a "sexual tease" and using "deceit"

I would go to clubs in Dallas with other T girls and the mixture of attention and danger was exciting but in hindsight it was really stupid because I was playing with my life and could have ended up a statistic.

Male sexuality has a really darkside because their identity is wrapped up in their sexuality so "homo phobia" can turn violent very quickly and these type of men see Tgirls as men, make no mistake about that.

It goes from rape to murder very fast and often it is both.

This is one of the reasons that Post-ops go stealth if they can.

Men can be very very dangerous which really is an obvious statement for anybody that is aware of what is going on in the world.

The world is unfair and unjust and unfortunately the burden is on women to keep themselves safe but those are the facts of life until the world is changed for the better.

[PaulaQ]

I wanted to let all of you know, first off, that I let V read some of your responses from this thread, and she started crying. She really appreciates the supportive words. When something like this happens, and you are threatened, you feel alone. For her, this is the first time she's felt vulnerable in her life - she used to be a 350lb pro athlete. NOBODY, messed with her back then. Now? Well obviously it's a different story, and she's in real trouble. Knowing that there are good people out there - other transgender folks who wish her well and are hoping and praying for her is really huge for her morale. I really appreciate it too, for what it's worth. Y'all are good people.

These folks don't seem to have day jobs. V ran into them again, checking the mail today. She was in boy mode, so they didn't recognize her. She confronted them, telling them she was armed, that she understood they'd been bothering "her girl", and that if they returned to her condo again, the police would be called to pick up their bodies. She was so angry with them. They were silent and walked off.

It was a really brave thing to do, but dumb as hell, because now they know to look for her in boy mode too. They may or may not know girl V / boy V are the same person, but I'm sure they'll pick on either one now. Maybe they'll be intimidated - V in boy mode is still a large person. I'm hoping they'll stay away, but fear she may have kicked the hornet's nest. We'll see. (I yelled at her a little about this - it was just such a bad idea.)

So me and one of my other friends are going to keep watch over her for the next couple of days, until she's out of there. One or both of us will be with her until she's safe. Without violating forum rules, I'll just say we can protect ourselves, and her. She needs one of us there - she's not very security conscious. She's not used to being threatened. I'd worry about that less if she was really actually able to defend herself. I don't think she could bring herself to really injure anyone, and unfortunately, with this lot that might be necessary.

Well, hopefully they'll think there's a big dude living with her, and between that and two police visits, they'll lay low long enough for us to get her out of there without further incident. We're getting her out Saturday morning. She can't really pack up her office (she works from home) until after work on Friday. We don't need her losing her job because of these guys. She's barely hanging on to it as it is.

I'll keep y'all posted. I'm hoping the next three days and nights consist of: "nothing happened."

Again, thanks everyone for your support.

[celeste26]

Forget any help from the Texas police, there is a"Stand your ground law" there shoot the first one and the rest will slither away. Cant even arrest you for it due to that stupid law. You feared for your life, then the law applies.

I'm not at all surprised at this sort of behavior. It comes with the territory. Or just never go there late at night especially if there is some other place you can rest until dawn. I would also sue all of them collectively and the apartment house too.

[flatlander_48]

Well she got through last night. The cops came out, warned the dudes to stay away again. These guys are stupid.

Repeat after me:

Prejudice does NOT require intelligence.

Never has; never will. Unfortunately, we who do have some degree of intelligence continue to try to rationalize prejudice and look for logic. Trust me on this: there is none.

[mechamoose]

I wanted to let all of you know, first off, that I let V read some of your responses from this thread, and she started crying. She really appreciates the supportive words.

We protect our own, hon. Stonewall started with drag queens.


She confronted them, telling them she was armed, that she understood they'd been bothering "her girl", and that if they returned to her condo again, the police would be called to pick up their bodies. She was so angry with them. They were silent and walked off.

It was a really brave thing to do, but dumb as hell, because now they know to look for her in boy mode too.

That was a reclamation of stolen power.

We expose ourselves and become deliberately vulnerable by throwing off our traditional images and presenting as who we are. It is risky. We know that and we do it anyway because it means being true to ourselves.


They may or may not know girl V / boy V are the same person, but I'm sure they'll pick on either one now.

If the situation is that predatory, then maybe buying a 'nanny cam' or the like would be a good investment.

My best wishes for your friend.

<3

- MM

[PaulaQ]

If the situation is that predatory, then maybe buying a 'nanny cam' or the like would be a good investment.


I may do that tomorrow - I thought about that too.

I'm unsure how serious these a**holes are about this. The fact they came back the same day the cops warned them not to, worries me. It's not a good sign. :(

[samantha rogers]

Paula, this story makes me positively sick with rage. I am so sorry for what your friend went through. Texas is generally one of a number of places where animal like behavior is not only accepted but applauded in some quarters. It goes to show how unsafe we all are in our "civilized" country. I am positively shaking with fury right now.
But, once more, you have shown what a wonderful and compassionate person you are and what a good friend to those rear and dear to you. I am so proud of you. It makes me want to cry.
Love, you sweetheart.
Hugs
Sammie

[PaulaQ]

Well, you gotta admit that if nothing else, us transgender folks are a great unifier - let's pick three groups that hate us right now:
- Southern Baptists
- Radical Feminists
- these jack offs across the parking lot

I submit that all of these people share VERY little in common except for their hatred of us! Extra-terrestrial invaders would scarcely be a better unifier of humanity!

[AmandaM]

three groups that hate us right now:
- Southern Baptists


I don't hate any of you. I think she needs to go old school, arm up first, then camera up. Detail who they are, file restraining orders, be at the ready in case of violence, and don't be afraid to point your gu..., er, I mean hairspray in their face.

[TeresaCD]

Such a good thing that she has you in her life, Paula.
I'm very glad that V is thus far safe, and on alert now.
Sad that we have to be that so often, and that some (not many) view us with such disrespect
And I am certainly hoping that the report of 'nothing happened' comes through, too.

[PaulaQ]

three groups that hate us right now:
- Southern BaptistsI don't hate any of you.

The Southern Baptist Convention throws transgender people under the bus. (http://www.patheos.com/blogs/johnshore/2014/06/the-southern-baptist-convention-throws-transgender-people-under-the-bus/)

Well, the SBC doesn't seem to think too highly of us, anyway!

As for last night - the three of us (me, T, and V) camped out in her condo, sleeping on the floor, as she'd moved out all of her furniture that afternoon. Nothing happened, which is wonderful. Maybe our friends across the parking lot finally got the hint.

@TeresaCD - the real danger is that a big chunk of the world simply doesn't view us TG folks as human beings. This is extremely dangerous, as the inhibition to violence against another person is usually MUCH higher than the inhibition to violence against an object. Since the message that we are not really people comes from so many different sources, people believe it because "everybody says it." Also, we make people really uncomfortable, for a variety of reasons that aren't very easily fixed. This really freaked me out for a while, but I'm getting used to it now. Some people are OK. Lots of people will act OK, but really aren't. Some number will be not OK to your face, and some will take action against you for being TG. It is what it is.

[Alice B]

That is an awful story and a truly close encounter with some truly stupid jerks. Once she has moved out she should contact the owners of the condos and let them know how their management handled the situation and why you moved out. This action will not come back to haunt her, but should result in some action by the owners to seek better management and alert them to some poor renter selection.

[PaulaQ]

@Alice - thanks, that's a good idea. We may also contact Lambda legal, although unfortunately, in Texas, transgender individuals basically have no rights. People are free to discriminate against us, with the exception of 2-3 municipalities.

The first hurdle is to get the complex to let her out of her lease without paying a cancellation fee of two months rent. I'm thinking about telling them that they should allow it - otherwise she'll stay, and we'll have a big ol' transgender pool party every nice Saturday, as is our right. This is liable to cause all sorts of problems with the other tenants, fights, property damage, etc. all instigated by others. Wouldn't it just be easier to let her leave where she's obviously not wanted?

[Stephanie Sometimes]

Hi Paula,

It’s a sad and demoralizing story you are telling of your friend V’s experience this week but I am glad that you have shared it with us here as we all need to be aware of the potential dangers of being out in public as transgender folks (and that’s both CD and TS girls). It’s all too easy to get a false sense of security and to forget that there are people around us that may hate us for just being who we are because it offends their concept of what is normal or acceptable and people who are just bullies and will direct violence at anyone they perceive as susceptible to public ridicule.

It’s great that you were able to help her safely move out of that place. The uplifting side of your story is how you have rallied to help your friend and provide moral and physical support for her. She is lucky to have you as her friend and you set a great example to all of us how we need to support our sisters when these situations arise.

I grew up in Texas and was glad to leave after 40 years for a lot of reasons, but it’s all too easy to blame the entire state, or any other particular place, and not to realize this kind of bigotry and the bullies that embrace it can exist almost anywhere. I notice that in at least one recent survey that Dallas and Austin rank in the top 20 most LGBT friendly cities nationwide. And just today I have read news reports of a 20 year old gay man being attacked and beaten in Detroit this week and last month a 28 year old lesbian was attacked nearby in Ann Arbor. We all know that some places or environments are more dangerous than others but Plano of all places. Amazing that even the police in Plano admit it’s a dangerous place for TG folks. Go figure how a middle to upscale class residential neighborhood like Plano on the North side of Dallas can evolve into a danger zone for certain categories of people.

Most of us know that in life we have to be careful and generally aware of ever-present risks (see my Helen Keller quote in my signature line) and we usually expect that we can evaluate the severity of risk by the environment around us but often the risk is not apparent (I practice situational awareness and no I don’t have a military background). But who would or should expect that kind of harassment in a nice apartment complex in Plano? I guess the haters are all around us but some localities may serve to enable them to action more that some other places.

As the LGBT movement has gained more acceptance in this country by the general public, it seems like the haters have become more aggressive and violent in their opposition to LGBT rights. As you mentioned, a major religious group has just voted to condemn gender assignment surgery and hormonal therapy. And a current candidate for the legislature in Oklahoma has publically stated that it would be right to execute gays by public stoning.

It is clear that the LGBT movement still has a long road to travel. But things change more rapidly in today’s world and if we stand proud and stay together and support our brothers and sisters, like you have Paula, then we can possibly someday achieve a higher level of equality. So thanks Paula for doing your part and sharing it with us here. Stay safe and give our support to your friend V.

Hugs,
Stephanie

[Michelle789]

Paula, if you have that party, I think you should enlist some of your former military TG friends, and arm them with shotguns. And yes, I believe you can legally invoke the stand your ground law against any of these predators.

[Rogina B]

LADIES... Incidents like the root story of this thread ARE the reason that local HRO's[Human Rights Ordinances] covering sexuality and gender expression are SO IMPORTANT! There would be no fear in reporting all of this to the Police,and the management company would have been OBLIGATED to help without judgement. Equality Texas has a real struggle on their hands and needs support on getting HRO's in place.It is truly worth the effort to support passage of gender inclusive HRO's wherever you are!

[flatlander_48]

There's a parallel here...

Some years ago, before I joined my current employer, there was a patent infringment case. Our security was very lax. Our building (engineering center) didn't even have restricted access at the back door. Anyone could walk in. The moral to this story is that is you have something to protect, legally it looks a lot better if there is evidence that you are trying to protect your intellectual property.

The parallel is this. It is important to make filings with the police. It documents what happened, it registers your fears of harm, establishes a pattern of behavior and officer's notes (assuming any sort of investigation) become part of the paper trail. With this chain of documents, it's much easier to show patterns of escalating behavior. It may seem pointless, but it can be very useful if worst comes to worst...

[Leelou]

Thanks for posting this PaulaQ. You're doing great in supporting your friend. I've read the whole thread, and I'm sorry but Texas sounds like a backward mess when it comes to the TS/TG community. The cop even says you're not safe, how f-ed up is that? We've read tons of stories from other members about their exploits out, and I've never heard one like this. I've always felt safe when out. My biggest fear has been being read and laughed at, which has never happened. I've been read, but never laughed at let alone attacked.

Thanks again for sharing. This was an eye opener. Best wishes to you and your friend--be safe.

[PaulaQ]

We moved all of V's furniture and most of her possessions out of her condo today. We'll get her work computer and printer from there after she finishes work tomorrow, and then she's gone. For tonight, she's safely ensconced at my Condo in the gayborhood, so we aren't on guard duty tonight. Hopefully we get the remainder of her stuff out of there tomorrow, with no further incident.

She was pretty sad tonight - what with being homeless and all. Without friends, she'd have no place to go. But she has friends. :) Still, she was pretty down about it all. All of the stuff she has in this world fits in a few boxes. :(

[jaleecd]

PaulaQ;
I have followed V's situation since you first shared it with us.The rightous anger and plots and plans to put the fear of God into these members of the shallow end of the gene pool just aches to be instigated. the problem is crawling into the scepic tank with them smears us with the same filth. the saner members are right in shining as much light on their stinking thinking as possible and hope that people will recognize that this is not a choice, any more than being red headed, freckled, left handed and cowboys fan.

[Jaymees22]

This is certainly a sad story but with you as her friend it will hopefully have a good ending. I'm afraid this type of incident could happen anywhere, we should always arm ourselves with common sense and a constant awareness of our surroundings. Good luck to both you and V. Hugs Jaymee

[Amy07]

Nice chat here. Really I don't believe it. I love the progressives here.

[PaulaQ]

We finished packing her up today, and moved her stuff to my place in the gayborhood. We didn't encounter the guys who chased her, but a woman who'd seen her en femme before muttered "faggot" as she passed us.

There's a bunch of good restaurants in her old neighborhood. I used to eat over there a lot in my old life. I'm thinking I'll dine elsewhere from now on...

Thanks again everyone for the support. We got V to safety.

[Michelle789]

Congrats Paula and V!!!! You will find new nice restaurants to eat in the gayborhood. In fact, even nicer places to eat, yay!!!!!!!

[PaulaQ]

There's a lot of restaurants in Dallas. Uptown is adjacent to the 'hood, and has a ton of good places. It's mostly straight folks there, but they are tolerant. I feel me and my girlfriends add local color to their dining experience. There's a couple of nice places in the 'hood, but mostly it's bars.

[Paula Siemen]

Itsunds by your descriptionthat the apartment building is a large comlex which tells me the manageent person your friend talkedto is nothing but an emloyee. Texas has some pretty strong laws against descrimination and harassment. I suggest that your friend contact the legal owners of the apartment comlex and pass along her explanation of the situation. Corporate owners of such properties really do not want the kind of problems your friend can bring them if she decided to persure legal action against both the individuals andtheapartmentcomlex forfailing toprovide a safe and secure residential property. The ownerscanbesued big time and they would likely have some verystrong words for their manament representative. Do not let this issue just go by unnoticed. I dont think the cityof Pano would like the negative and biggotted reputation that this could bring on their city.
Further, I think the city of Dallas TGBLT community has a legal organization (Legal Hospice) thatmay take some interest in your friends predicument.

[SusansWife]

I am so glad you got her out of there!! That is just horrible what happened to her. I don't understand people like that. They see anything non conforming to their prescribed "normal" as being less than human. But it is their behavior that proves who the less human ones are. Glad V is safe, and that she has a friend like you!

[flatlander_48]

Further, I think the city of Dallas TGBLT community has a legal organization (Legal Hospice) thatmay take some interest in your friends predicument.

This is a very important point and I touched on it earlier. Somewhere an incident like this MUST get recorded whether it is a public record of not. It is data that adds to the picture of what an area is like, what is really happening there and who is doing what. Sooner rather than later is best.

[trans0325]

What happened to her is unfortunately all too common in Plano or in almost any other part of Texas.

[sometimes_miss]

This all comes up under the topic of self preservation. If you're going to stay where people hate you, you will permanently put yourself at risking your life. The whole group of idiots here who recommend that she 'man up', whether that means fighting, getting a gun for protection, etc., have been watching too much action movies and TV, where the hero always comes out alive and safe. If someone really wants you dead, you're dead. While it's nice to assume that everyone will 'fair fight' you, the reality is that if you do defeat them in a fight, there's always the possibility that they will simply attack you from behind when you aren't ready, and then, well, you're dead (or worse, permanently disabled/blind/etc). It's really easy to kill people when you know how, and they aren't ready for it. This is not like being a soldier with your mates, aware that danger is all around you. It's a case where we simply don't have the situational awareness of possibly deadly danger 24 hours a day. At some point, you're going to be vulnerable. And that's when it happens.
You can talk about your rights all you want. And you'll be right. Dead right. And everyone will cry at your funeral, and life will go on.
The best advice is always the same. Remove yourself from danger first; fight the good fight from a safe distance, or you won't live to fight again. BTW, those who live on volcano hillsides are also idiots.

You can do the smart thing, or not. And live, or die, with the consequences. The local police advised correctly, they can't guarantee that they'll be there quick enough to help. At best, the victim will become a famous TG person who 'stood his ground', forever being out, in a community where it clearly isn't a good idea. If you enjoy confrontations, great, but remember, you rarely win an argument, you only get the other person pissed off at you more.


To my way of thinking, I place a lot of the blame at the feet of some of the more radical elements on various talk radio programs.
They're only voicing opinions that others have, but keep to themselves.

[PaulaQ]

@Lexi - truly no place is really safe for us. Some are better than others. Where I live now is relatively safe for Dallas for a transgender person. There is no "safe" though if you are transsexual.

As for talk show hosts and stuff - I don't agree with that. The unfortunate history of transsexualism is that there have been any number of extremely well educated and articulated individuals with quite a public following who've made very convincing arguments, based on their own prejudice, that help others dehumanize us, and rationalize their own fears and prejudices. The cruelty of some of these people is shocking - all the more so because they couch their arguments in terms that are meant to seem "merciful" to others who share their transphobia.

Even amongst people who accept us well enough to just leave us alone, there is very little sympathy for our plight.


And everyone will cry at your funeral, and life will go on.

Few enough outside of our community cry for one of us when we are slain. So very few care.

[flatlander_48]

They're only voicing opinions that others have, but keep to themselves.

Where the on air people get their opinions from, whether internal or external, is essentially irrelevant. The fact that they voice them is.

Case in point:

A while back, the news about doing SRS for transgender inmates had a lot of air play. Independent of the financial considerations, this is obviously a pretty serious matter for those people in that situation and possibly may have been a factor in the crime(s) for which they were convicted. I can't remember whose show it was as I just happened to hit it by accident as I was flipping through the stations, but I decided to listen for a while.

As you might imagine, there was no attempt to understand the specifics about the issue. Rather, it fueled a lot of negative comments and double entendres aimed at belittling those who are transgender in general and those who were in jail specifically. Simultaneously it puts people in the limelight and and in a bad light and that is just totally unnecessary.

There are Thoughts and there are Behaviors. We all have prejudices of one kind or another. And further, we can't really control thoughts of others, short of some sort of pharmaceutical intervention. However, it is behaviors that are significant. Demeaning, denigrating and discounting transgender people at every opportunity has the effect of lowering the bar for acceptable behavior.

Also, we have to remember that more often than not it isn't the intelligent end of the spectrum that will be involved in violence. The intelligent ones will get you fired, deny applications, etc. In short, they deal in the realm of plausible deniability. The others, even though they may have some degree of intelligence, they have difficulty in making appropriate decisions. This was clearly seen when after being told by the police to cease their threatening behavior, they continued. This is not rational behavior and speaks volumes about the people involved. You cannot deal with them in the same manner as people who are, in fact, rational.

[LillyAntayra]

I had read somewhere in the forums that Plano was not TG friendly, but I had no idea it would go to that extreme. This type of story makes my blood boil. I hope that this experience does not deter Miss V from continuing her transition, it sounds like she might be quite depressed. It's important to remind her that she has done nothing wrong.

[Paula_Femme]

Congrats Paula and V!!!!

I'll second Michelle, congratulations for getting V out of an intollerable situation, with your help I'm sure she can make a fresh start!

[flatlander_48]

Funny how the mind works. I had nearly forgotten about this on-air episode less than a month ago. Rochester, NY is about a 90 minute drive from my home.

At work, we are taught to not put anything in an E-mail or on social media that you wouldn't want your mother to see or would divulge sensitive corporate information. On-air personalities of this variety obviously have no Mom Test.

In my comments earlier about talk radio, I was referring to on-air personalities with a specific political bent. While I don't think the pair below had any particular political agenda, there was more than enough stupidity and insensitivity to go around...

http://www.lgbtqnation.com/2014/05/radio-hosts-call-transgender-people-nut-jobs-in-rant-over-city-health-coverage/

ROCHESTER, N.Y. — A Rochester radio station’s morning show hosts have come under fire for a transphobic broadcast in which they mocked a new policy to provide transition-related health coverage to transgender city workers, and insulted a caller who dialed in to tell them they were being offensive.

Rochester officials announced Saturday that the will extend transition-related health coverage to transgender and gender non-conforming municipal employees.

On Tuesday, local radio hosts Kimberly Ray and Barry Beck of WBZA Radio 98.9 characterized the new city healthcare coverage with rants such as, “The dude can look like a lady and the city is going to pay for it!”

“Does that mean then if women want a boob job they’ll pay for a boob job because that’s only right,” asked Beck.

“The services that will be paid for under the new coverage – gender reassignment surgery, psychological counseling, because you’re probably a nut job to begin with!” adds Ray. “That’s my opinion.”

“When he steps up to the plate, doesn’t he have two bats?”

One female caller criticized the hosts, telling them they were “incredibly disrespectful towards transgender people” and that they shouldn’t spread misinformation, even as a joke, to which one of the male hosts (identified as Chris Konya) replied: “Thank you, sir” as the others laugh.


http://www.advocate.com/politics/transgender/2014/05/22/rochester-ny-radio-hosts-fired-following-transphobic-rant (http://www.advocate.com/politics/transgender/2014/05/22/rochester-ny-radio-hosts-fired-following-transphobic-rant)

Following yesterday’s extraordinarily transphobic segment, Kimberly Ray and Barry Beck, hosts of The Breakfast Buzz on Rochester, N.Y., radio station 98.9 The Buzz, were fired by the station's parent company, Entercom Rochester.

"This morning Entercom fired Kimberly and Beck effective immediately," Entercom Rochester vice president and general manager Sue Munn said in a prepared statement. "Their hateful comments against the transgender community do not represent our station or our company. We deeply apologize to the transgender community, the community of Rochester, and anyone else who was offended by their comments. We are proud of our past work on behalf of the local LGBT community and we remain committed to that partnership."

The segment, which featured the hosts playing on a number of false and hateful antitransgender clichés, quickly drew the ire of local and national media outlets, along with many of the show’s listeners.

“It’s nonsense broadcasts like this that spreads harmful misinformation, encourages bullying, and shouldn’t be tolerated by radio stations nor its advertisers,” Andrea Raethka wrote in a Rochester Democrat & Chronicle editorial. “I plan on contacting the radio station to express my disgust as well as express my disappointment to their advertisers to let them know I’m not happy with them supporting such hateful, transphobic radio personalities.”

“Amid a stream of transphobic jokes, willful ignorance, and nasty slurs, Kimberly has the gall to suggest that she understands all the ‘sensitivities’ involved in transgender issues,” Slate’s J. Bryan Lowder wrote. “Of course, that’s only when she’s confronted by an impressively brave and eloquent caller who does their best to push back against the morass of prejudice with a little education — ‘[this is] incredibly disrespectful toward transgender people.’ Not that it does much good: Before kicking them off the air, another host, perceiving the caller to be female, says: ‘Thank you,sir.’”

LGBT media watchdog GLAAD was quick to address the issue, reaching out to the station, and posting a public statement.

“Transgender healthcare is not new or outlandish, and it isn't 'special' healthcare, as the sensationalized segment purports,” GLAAD media strategist Dani Heffernan wrote. “It's the same healthcare that non-trans people access everyday when they need it, but it is often denied to transgender people just because of who they are. The hosts should be held accountable for their irresponsible behavior, and at a minimum a formal apology should be issued. Furthermore, listeners of 'Breakfast Buzz' should be directed to resources that provide accurate, fair-minded information about transgender healthcare coverage.”

After initially tweeting, “Freedom of Speech includes the freedom to offend others. You aren’t granted a right to not be offended in this life #getoverit #ROC,” Ray deleted her personal Twitter account. Beck deleted his account soon after.

While the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution protects against the government taking legal action against anyone on the basis of their speech, it is not a license to say offensive things without consequences from individuals and employers.

[Michelle789]

I am really happy to hear that someone got fired for being a transphobe. It's about time.

I think it sends a powerful message that prejudice towards transgender people will not be tolerated. If there was a like button on this forum, I would like Entercom for this.

[PaulaQ]

Since we're off topic anyway. Actually the radio industry is horrendously transphobic. They just don't want you to know it's a good ol' boys club. I have a good friend who was a broadcaster for 30 years. She was highly successful, and did the same type of drive time stuff as the two who got fired, albeit without the hate. She worked in radio all over the US.

She was fired the day she came out as transgender at the station where she worked, and told them she intended to transition. She and her agent have contacted pretty much every radio market in the US. No one will hire her now. They don't even return her calls.

She's a receptionist now, and happy to just have a job, and I guarantee you Entecomm won't hire her either.

[Michelle789]

Paula, I think the radio industry is not only transphobic, but is extremely conservative. Fox would be considered liberals compared to most radio stations. Radio is seriously the worst of the worst when it comes to all kinds of conservativism. I'm not sure what Entercom had to gain by firing the transphobes, other than to keep the politicians in Rochester happy.

I also think that a lot of corporations, or people in general, who are or try to be trans accepting, do so out of peer pressure - to make themselves look good. Keep in mind that we're also becoming increasingly prejudicephobic in our society. In the 1800s it was socially acceptable to use racial slurs. Today white people in the south will beat you for saying the racial slur. So basically being a vocal transphobe (or expressing one through violence) is stigmatized in some parts of the world, and Rochester is one of them.

I think transphobia is also driven by peer pressure. A lot of people are neither transphobic nor trans accepting. They will just follow suit of what everyone else around them is doing to fit in. My guess is that Rochester is a liberal city in a liberal state, as New York is one of the most liberal states, along with California, Washington, Oregon, and most of the other Northeastern states. I'm sure that firing the transphobes wasn't so much that Entercom is actually accepting of transpeople, but rather the city of Rochester, their people, and their government are, and ultimately Rochester won this battle. Oh, and I forgot that politicians are concerned with their re-elections, and to them pressuring Entercom to fire the transphobes was likely a political move.

So I change my like from Entercom to City of Rochester.

I also think that there's a good chance that in the group of people that attacked V one of them doesn't really care about transpeople either way, but participated in the attack to fit in the group, while the rest were likely truly transphobic.

[flatlander_48]

No, not off topic. What I described above is just one mechanism for how misinformation gets spread and demeaning behavior is acceptable to some.

[PaulaQ]

@Michelle - I'm pretty sure that the reason the men who tried to attack V pursued her was that they were embarrassed by showing attraction to her with their catcalls. Sure, it's a really crude and offensive way to show attraction - but the second one of the women said "that's a man", they went after her. I think they felt the need to prove they weren't attracted to other men. Whether you want to file that under transphobia, homophobia, or something else I suppose it doesn't really matter too much - hate is hate.

[flatlander_48]

Remember that the point relates to Behaviors. We may or may not be able to effect change in what people think. However, we can damn sure make certain that there are consequences for untoward Behavior.

[Michelle789]

@Paula, I agree hate is hate. But I don't think that everyone inherently is hateful. I think there are lots of people who will hate no matter what. There are lots of people who will go with whatever way the wind blows. If they're surrounded by other haters they will show hate. If they're pressured into being accepting they will act accepting. Lots of people literally lack a spine and just follow what someone else does.

[ossian]

Damit. I'm sorry for all the hate towards us. But, this thread was the tipping point for me not going to my group this month. I'm gonna hide for awhile. I wish I wasn't me.

[Krystalina]

Damn shame that happened to your friend. It is a blessing that she is now safe. It is always been my personal opinion that dudes who chase after or insult transwomen are jealous that they can't be that honest with themselves; they cope by hiding behind male egoism and chauvinism.


@Paula, I agree hate is hate. But I don't think that everyone inherently is hateful. I think there are lots of people who will hate no matter what. There are lots of people who will go with whatever way the wind blows. If they're surrounded by other haters they will show hate. If they're pressured into being accepting they will act accepting. Lots of people literally lack a spine and just follow what someone else does.

Amen, Michelle789. Truer words can't be uttered. I see it all of the time, this hive mentality. Really gets on my nerves.

[Donniesr]

Even with a decade of Kung-Fu under my belt, I would be *very* concerned about taking on more than 2 opponents at once. Four or five? I'm running.

- MM

Heres someone with a decade of kung fu, that wouldn't have taken on these 4 or 5 guys. How could anyone else here have honestly said they would stand their ground? She was right to run, and she also is lucky to have such a good friend.
All the Chuck Norris, Steven Segal and David Carridine stuff is just Hollywood HYPE.
I also agree that she should file a police report. Also file a complaint against the management of the complex. There IS a difference between a Christian and a Hypi-christian.