OK, I have to put this out there for comment

[ShelbyDawn]

I met a fairly nice lady for dinner a few weeks ago that I had met on an online dating service.
We were having a very nice time when out of the blue, she tells me a story about an encounter with a crossdresser that went into the ladies restroom while she was in there and how it made her uncomfortable.
I have no idea where the story came from as we were talking about coffee up to that point; she is a barista.

I immediately did a mental check - did I leave some polish on my nails or perhaps a remnant of lip stick or some clue but nothing.
I was dressed very masculine and very conservative.

Since I wasn't ready to go "there" and talk about my dressing, I made a weak joke that I wasn't sure she would want to see me in a dress(As I have mentioned before, I don't even come close to passing, so there as some truth to it as well) and turned the conversation to something else.
Anyway, after that point, she never made eye contact with me and the conversation became very stilted.
I keep wondering if perhaps her son or someone she is close to crossdresses and she was trying to scope out my position on the issue or something like that and I failed her test.

The discomfort along with a few other things, pretty much helped me decide not to call her again. I was just wondering if any of you have had a similar experience and what you think might have been her motive for telling me that story out of the blue.

Just curious about your opinions as I know too well, you all have them and don;t mind sharing.

[Stephanie47]

There's always the possibility she had sufficient information provided by the dating service to do a background check. That may have revealed information you did not want to reveal. I really have never heard of a woman on a first date mentioning meeting a cross dresser in the ladies room. Or for that matter any date. I'd be as perplexed as you are. It would seem somewhat premature for her to bring up she has a close relative who is a cross dresser. Yet, it may be she has a son who is a cross dresser who is out. You can always call her for another date as approach the subject again.

[Tinkerbell-GG]

Shelby, I'd bet she's had a relationship with a CDer before and was sussing out future prospects for the expected 'I would NEVER wear a dress; that's so gay' comment from the 'manly' men out there, as proof you don't wear a dress! Your comment might have been too polite and accepting? Who knows. Once you've had a relationship with a crossdresser you can spot the signs a mile away...I've noticed PLENTY since knowing of my H. Maybe we should start a thread on what the giveaways are!

Numbers here are often thrown around as lower than other forums where it's shown as high as 10% of the population. Whatever the statistics, I can tell you, there are MANY of you out there and even on this forum alone, I've had another GG tell me they left their CDH only to have a date with a crossdresser, and another here has a sister who is also married to a crossdresser. Given how different you all are, I think this says A LOT.

You were probably right to move on. x

[Teresa]

Shelby if you felt any attraction to her depite the conversation I would ring to see if she would go on a date again ! Also it would help you to know you can control a situation like that ! Even if she does have some connection with CDers she may have actually liked you and could be flattered if you rang her .

It was a strange coincidence that she brought CDing up but don't take it as some sort of test you failed ! Just try and pick up on something the agency says you have in common, if there is a next time !

[Marcelle]

To be honest Shelby . . . we can "what if" and "wax conjecture" all day long and never truly know what was going through her mind at that point. It could have been a simple comment on her part to spark conversation, she could have been trolling to see if you were CD or what your thoughts were on CDers. However we will never know because the scenarios are limitless. My recommendation before trying to guess and getting too spun up . . . go on another date. If she is still distant, simply put it out there (in a covert method) . . . something akin to "I noticed that during our last date you seemed a bit distant and still are was it something I said or did?"

Just my two cents :)

Hugs

Isha

[Kate Simmons]

This happened to me about 11 years ago when I was going out with a woman. We were riding in the car and all of a sudden out of the blue for no reason she told me that she went out with a guy who was a crossdresser before and that you don't do that do you? I just pretended I didn't hear her and she didn't bring it up again, so who knows where that seemingly random stuff comes from? :)

[Melanie B]

.... Maybe we should start a thread on what the giveaways are!

Yes please! I'm sure many/most of us like to think we hide it pretty well!

[SamanthaSometimes]

Once you've had a relationship with a crossdresser you can spot the signs a mile away...I've noticed PLENTY since knowing of my H. Maybe we should start a thread on what the giveaways are!

Tinkerbell, I agree with Melanie that it would be great if you GGs would start and comment to list the giveaways.

Best to all...

[aprilgirl]

Hi Shelby Dawn,

That happened to me once before, many years ago in the midst of a long distance relationship. We started talking about my moving there and getting a place together and the topic of deal breakers arose. Her first comment was "if you told me you like to wear women's clothes" and I asked her calmly if that would really bother her. She said its something she would have to think about. Before making the commitment of living together I told her and she accepted that part of me.

Sometimes random comments are just that.First date jitters, trying to make conversation and her bathroom incident may have occurred recently. I seriously doubt you gave off any cues or that she was trying to test you. I think its natural for us to have heightened senses whenever the subject of cross dressing arises. It does seem peculiar that afterwards her eye contact was stilted, perhaps she sensed your discomfort and felt bad herself? Just how bad was your joke anyway? ;-)

You started off that she was fairly nice and that the two of you were having a very nice time until the comment. If she is someone you would like to know better and spend time with, then ask her out again. If not, then don't. I just wouldn't put too much emphasis on that 30 second moment in your evening. Who knows, maybe one day the two of you can look back on that moment and share a laugh.

[Beverley Sims]

I often scope out people and get similar responses as yours.
It is 'pleased' to meet you and quickly move on.

[Alice Torn]

If you go out again with her, maybe mention that you read that Bruce Jenner seems to be a crossdresser TG, if she brings cding up again, for conversation.

[JudySinNY]

Interesting story. When my SO and I were still in the texting and getting to know each other phase (talking about our past, back stories etc...not just "hi howareya?") something inspired me to tell him a story about my ex that surprised me one Halloween by greeting me when I came home from work wearing my corset, garters, stockings heels..body shave....I was horrified! He was doing it as a gag and for shock value and he succeeded more than he had hoped lol. I left the room and couldn't even look at him. SO the question now becomes...of all the interesting stories I could tell him, what inspired me to tell him THAT one? I have no idea. We're there any tells? I look back even now and look at him even now and say no. No way would I have guessed. The ONLY thing that sets him somewhat apart is he is friendly with a lot of women, but that could easily be put off to his charisma and charm. No femme traits. He has asked me as well if he seems femme and nope. I don't see it. As for HIM? He tells me he panicked a little when he heard the story. Is that maybe why he did tell me right up front when we finally had our first date? Maybe. Who knows? I'm grateful though that it didn't scare him off. He could have given up and not pursued the relationship based on my reaction to that situation but he didn't. Now I'm not suggesting that's what the other poster should do...that was face to face and has its own vibe. Just food for thought. And a little perspective on "tells" and preconceived ideas perhaps.

[Jaylyn]

First of all she may have really met a CD in the GG restroom that made her very uncomfortable. I think sometimes we hear something in public said or mentioned about CDs and bam we let our minds start wondering to the worst case scenario. I am not out but CD usually several times a week. I have been with the guys just drinking coffee at the local restaurant and some here are very old fashioned, set in their way type guys. When a subject such as this comes up it always is shocking to the brain and our first thought is how does he know? I'm very careful to make sure I have a small beard stubble and wear my old work clothes in town to appear the macho rancher man, but I know what the first reaction is. The first thoughts we have that we are guilty of what some people think is weird and even a sinful act. It takes serious mind control to not show a reaction and not let anyone make you show a reaction to a statement.

[Sonya]

I have been separated for nearly 2 years now and haven’t dated anyone yet and I was just doing some research about online dating sites, I was reading a very well known and general forum (nothing related to gender or fetish). There was a thread about online dating and below is one of the posts:


""......... One couple I know who met online is a perfect match. Loads of relationships that started by other means rather than online, fail just as miserably as online ones.
I had a partner who I met through work, they ended up cheating on me with my best friend, and my sister, who he also knocked up. My sister was married at the time. And another ex of mine turned out to be just an absolute knob, he took a lot of my clothes with him when he left too. Any relationship has a chance to fail, no matter how you meet. I think you just have to wait to find someone suitable, not just take whoever shows interest, because you're lonely, and "they'll do". Sometimes the right one comes along when you've given up :) I now have someone who puts up with my craziness, and he doesn't steal my clothes or wear my shoes””


I think at first thought cross dressing will be a deal breaker for most women who do not know much about it or for women who had terrible experiences with a CD as above.

[cdterri]

Back in the late 70's I met a gal. in a biker bar. I was wearing my Harley gear, boots, jeans, t-shirt, leather jacket, 7 day beard, "and I have a very heavy beard" etc. within ten mins. she was telling me about her ex-husband being a cd and how none of it bothered her except the size 14 high heels which drove her crazy. What brought the subject up I'll never know.

[cassandra54]

Here story could have been true. Face it, if you were in the men's room and a woman dressed like a man came in, it might be a little awkward. She simply might have felt her privacy was jeopardized. Nothing more to it than that.

Being paranoid and wondering if there was some kind of a tell about you will just drive you crazy. However, approaching the subject again with a humorous quip the next time she goes into a restroom like, "Did you see any cross dressers?" Might give you a way to approach the subject.

One last thing, when I told my girl, I told her everything about it. And at least for me, when it came down to it, I'm just doing it for fun. I either dress all the way or not at all and yes I do go out in public. And yes we spend a whole weekday a few weeks ago, going to lunch and a movie. Her only issue was we couldn't hold hands.

Just remember, honesty is always the best policy. She may be the greatest gal in the world, but if you can't be honest with her about who you are and such, it may not be worth it to hide.

[Stephanie47]

Once you've had a relationship with a crossdresser you can spot the signs a mile away...I've noticed PLENTY since knowing of my H. Maybe we should start a thread on what the giveaways are!

Oh, please start a thread like that, please! Although I bet the ques will be different depending on ages.

[Gardener]

I think we need to be brave enough and sensible enough to follow our instincts. You did and I think you did well.

[DonnaT]

Shelby, I'd bet she's had a relationship with a CDer before and was sussing out future prospects
That was my initial reaction as well.

Your response indicated that you already know what you look like dressed, and she became uncomfortable with that perception.

[Lorileah]

or maybe she was in the ladies room and a CD came in an made her uncomfortable and she just needed to say it to someone. :idontknow:

[Annaliese]

Is there a enough their, interest wise, to give a second chance, if not, move on. If you do call her, ask her, about that night and that thing change about half way through the date, if there was something you said that change for her. Then if you do call she may not want to go out. Like so many have said that it could be so many thing's. Could be nothing at all, don't you want to know one way or the other, she could be the one or not. I would find out, that's just me.

[flatlander_48]

Human nature is fascinating. If you really listen to what people say, and not just the superficial words, often you will interesting insights into where things sit for them. I wouldn't be surprised if that the experience of seeing the person in the restroom was a window to some other, deeper experience. And, it could be that it had nothing to do with you. Perhaps she saw someone else in the restaurant that triggered the memory or maybe someone was wearing something similar. As they say, where there's smoke, there's fire...

[SO1Adam12]

Shelby, I'd bet she's had a relationship with a CDer before and was sussing out future prospects for the expected 'I would NEVER wear a dress; that's so gay' comment from the 'manly' men out there, as proof you don't wear a dress! Your comment might have been too polite and accepting? Who knows. Once you've had a relationship with a crossdresser you can spot the signs a mile away...I've noticed PLENTY since knowing of my H. Maybe we should start a thread on what the giveaways are!

Numbers here are often thrown around as lower than other forums where it's shown as high as 10% of the population. Whatever the statistics, I can tell you, there are MANY of you out there and even on this forum alone, I've had another GG tell me they left their CDH only to have a date with a crossdresser, and another here has a sister who is also married to a crossdresser. Given how different you all are, I think this says A LOT.

You were probably right to move on. x

From a GG perspective I agree with Tinkerbell. She picked up on something you think you have disguised. I think many CDers tend to over-exaggerate feminine mannerisms when they are en femme. Counter to that, when trying to hide their CDing probably over-exaggerate their masculinity. It's not as easy to switch body language when one spends a lot of time practicing feminine mannerisms.

She was screening you while letting you know this is not something she is looking for.

[Tina_gm]

Maybe she has had an experience in the past with a CDer and decided no thanks. maybe she has known others who have and doesn't want any part of it. Or maybe she just knows it exists and doesn't want any part of it. She was somehow bringing it up early on and was putting it out there that it was a no go for her. That is her choice and preference. Many women want nothing to do with it. It is just the way they are wired and there is nothing you can do about that just as there is nothing you can do about the way you are wired. Better just to move on.

[atlflygirl]

How in the world did she know how to categorize the crossdresser? The woman in there could have been transsexual, but many of us on here do not want to change our sex and want to date as our biological sex. I'd say if she is not comfortable with anything transgender, you should forget about her. Find someone who is open to dating guys who are a little different. What I don't quite get is why straight men go for such bland, uptight women sometimes. I guess it's the same reason why we gay guys go for bland, uptight men. They may be conventionally attractive, but it's the character that counts. I have learned after many years of dating that my next boyfriend may not be the next handsome guy off the shelf but rather the guy who's wearing shorts when everyone else is wearing tuxedos.

[MissTee]

Wow, that's a tough read for certain. Perhaps it was quite innocuous and she was just looking to spark an interesting conversation; or, indeed, she was letting you know she's been there and does not find it attractive or acceptable. I do also love Tink's thought for a thread.

[carahawkwind]

Find someone who is open to dating guys who are a little different. What I don't quite get is why straight men go for such bland, uptight women sometimes.

I think there is definitely something to this, based on what I've read here, I've usually had comparatively good experiences telling the women in the my life about my dressing, both the people I was dating and several of my friends, but all of them were strange, quirky, creative open minded women, one of which is now my wife. Of course my bland male self, while boring looking has a unique enough personality that that is the type of women I was guided to naturally even without thinking about the dressing side of things, so that made it easier.

[Tinkerbell-GG]

Trust me, few hetero women out there know anything about crossdressing. It's just something from that movie 'The Rocky Horror Show' or 'Ru Paul's Drag Race' and the men who do it are most certainly gay or about to transition. They don't think about it because they assume you're not in their dating pool. Why else do you think y'all get asked 'are you gay and do you want to be a woman?' as soon as you reveal your dressing to your spouse?

Those women who mention it likely KNOW of it. They've had some form of personal experience with it, whatever that is. Sure, it could have been a crossdresser in a restroom but I doubt it. I think I managed to shut down the entire forum discussing that very topic not so long ago, but the basic vote was most people don't notice or care. Most women won't connect a crossdresser in a restroom with a prospective date, UNLESS they've dated one before; known someone who dated one; have one in the family; or have been spending too much time on Wikipedia etc. Though, Wikipedia is actually pretty kind to crossdressers, so I'm betting on number 1. :)

And I'd love to start that thread I suggested but I fear retribution for making someone here feel bad. And yes, someone always does. So if anyone would like to start it, I'll happily chime in and hopefully so will some others. Maybe other GG's don't notice these things though? I'll suggest a couple I DO notice - manicured fingernails. Eyebrows (I can spot those that have only had the teensiest tweak!) Subtle comments other men wouldn't make: ie "that's a nice skirt". (Had this said to me the other day by a shop assistant) I then noticed my admirer's longish nails and groomed eyebrows and I just knew. My friend who was with me at the time knew nothing. Posture is another, and even feet placement when sitting or standing. I've even seen through a very masculine man because he lingered a little too long at the pantyhose aisle at a store, just a millisecond longer so that the Average Joe wouldn't notice, and I soon realised he had very smooth legs below his shorts. Otherwise, I'd never have known! You're cunning, you lot :)

I'm sort of in on this little secret now, I guess. It's not necessarily one I wanted to know, but you're not alone out there - that much is true. You are sneaky and you are MANY x

[carahawkwind]

Trust me, few hetero women out there know anything about crossdressing. It's just something from that movie 'The Rocky Horror Show' or 'Ru Paul's Drag Race' and the men who do it are most certainly gay or about to transition.

Speaking of cultural touchstones related to crossdressing, every woman I've told who reacted positively to it didn't care for the Rocky Horror at all, but all liked Eddie Izzard, who presents crossdressing in much more sane, masculine, less cartoonish sort of way.

[Tinkerbell-GG]

, every woman I've told who reacted positively to it didn't care for the Rocky Horror at all, but all liked Eddie Izzard, who presents crossdressing in much more sane, masculine, less cartoonish sort of way.

I love Eddie! Though, I suspect many people think he's just playing a part when he crossdresses, and I've also read that he fends off the 'you must be gay?' question, a lot. I think even Eddie struggles with relationships with women because of all the myths out there.

I'll also admit, he's sexiest as his guy self with a goatee and playing a bad guy. Why do British men make bad look so good?? Okay, off topic there...:)

[flatlander_48]

Trust me, few hetero women out there know anything about crossdressing. It's just something from that movie 'The Rocky Horror Show' or 'Ru Paul's Drag Race' and the men who do it are most certainly gay or about to transition. They don't think about it because they assume you're not in their dating pool. Why else do you think y'all get asked 'are you gay and do you want to be a woman?' as soon as you reveal your dressing to your spouse?

I would say that they don't think about it because they believe that they are right and there is no need to question anything. And that's where it gets dangerous. When you hear things like "It's a choice" or "There's no such thing as a bisexual" it's because people have already made up their minds that they know what's going on and there's no reason to challenge anything.

[SO1Adam12]

I would say that they don't think about it because they believe that they are right and there is no need to question anything. And that's where it gets dangerous. When you hear things like "It's a choice" or "There's no such thing as a bisexual" it's because people have already made up their minds that they know what's going on and there's no reason to challenge anything.

Well I can tell you I didn't know much about crossdressing, not because I think I'm always right (for a guy who professes to appreciate women so much he wants to dress like on - this sounds kinda bitter) but because I've never had a male to female CDer reveal themself to me until my current SO, and even at that when it became more and more prevalent I started doing some research and ended up here. Why on earth would we ever learn about something that is not a part of our personal life. I can't tell you a whole lot about jock itch because I've never had, nor would I expect to. I know it exists but that's about it.

I too assumed that CDers are gay and I consider myself a pretty open-minded person. I know several female to male CDers and all are lesbians so maybe that's part of it, but think about it; if a male to female CDer is so in touch with his feminine side that he has a NEED to dress like a woman, wear makeup, a wig and publicly be treated and accepted as a woman, why would we not assume that includes the bedroom?

There's lots and lots and lots of things we don't know about in this world and unless they effect us, there is no way to learn about them all. CDing, especially male to female has a LONG way to go before it will be accepted publicly. I personally think that because of the narrow-minded thoughts of homophobes disguised as Christians it will struggle for quite some time. Look at the fight for gay marriage. That is still being challenged in the courts, but throw in the added danger of homophobes who assume that because you are dressed as a woman you are trying to pick up a date with another man it faces a whole different kind of danger that gay men still worry about.

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi Shelby, I think that you made the right decision moving on.

[lingerieLiz]

I once had a girl friend who hinted that her dad had done something when lonesome for her mom with her mom's clothes. I left it alone and didn't question it, but she brought it up twice. Now I think he may have been a CD but who knows. Now I regret not digging deeper.