Mainstream acceptance: 1 thing?

[Toronto Kristen]

I was in my local supermarket this afternoon, wearing ladies boot cut jeans and booties with 2" heels, when the following question popped into my mind:

What one thing or item would you like to have mainstream society accept men wearing?

Women can wear mens'-style suits, loafer-style shoes, go without make-up, "boyfriend" shirts. There was this article last week: http://www.theguardian.com/fashion/2014/oct/29/is-this-the-end-of-gender-specific-underwear-or-just-a-load-of-pants

Now this does raise the question of whether you would want that acceptance.

[Leahann]

Skirts or dresses.

[Katey888]

Eyeshadow... :battingeyelashes:

I could play with eyeshadow forever... so many variations, so many options, so much fun!

And I could still be lazy and drab with the rest of the clobber... ;)

Katey x

[Ashley Lyn]

I'd go with eyeshadow as well..
Just can't understand the idea of a man wearing a skirt or high heels with guy clothes..
My ideal circumstance is totally dressed as a woman, and passing as such!.. or at least trying very hard!

[Melissa18]

I'd love to able to wear lipstick all the time, a different colour for a different mood

[Toronto Kristen]

Just can't understand the idea of a man wearing a skirt or high heels with guy clothes..

Well, my question is based on the premise that it is not seen as unacceptable or strange for men to wear stilettos with a suit (women do it all the time), or wear a dress suit.

[Zylia]

T-shirts with comic book characters. Don't get me wrong, I like my shirts and suits, but every now and then I just want to be able to go to a business meeting and wear something more laid-back :D

I'm really not interested in wearing skirts, dresses, makeup, etc. in 'guy mode'. I don't want to look like a guy in women's clothing, I want to look like a woman in women's clothing.

[Ashley Lyn]

Well, my question is based on the premise that it is not seen as unacceptable or strange for men to wear stilettos with a suit (women do it all the time), or wear a dress suit.I realized that after reading the 'quote', but even though women do it, I really don't see a place or time that it will be accepted in the mainstream for guys! Just IMHO, of course..

[Sara Jessica]

What one thing or item would you like to have mainstream society accept men wearing?

Nothing. Guys are fine just the way they are.

Ask "mainstream society" guys and they give no thought to the fact there are no dresses in their closets, no high heels on their shoes, no makeup in their morning repertoire. Not only are they all good with it but they are fully capable of looking the part of the kind of dude they want to portray without worrying about femininity invading their wardrobes or shaving kit.

[ReineD]

Women can wear mens'-style suits, loafer-style shoes, go without make-up, "boyfriend" shirts.

I think there's a difference between women's and men's suits, to use your first example. I looked up pin-striped suits to show you.

Women's: http://cdnpix.com/show/imgs/ede07b657b8d2db33210da2bedfe3eae.jpg

Men's: http://www.honeybuy.com/image/Black_With_White_Pinstripe_Wool_Men_Business_Suit_ Style__1__14773012085559888.jpg

There's a world of difference between the two, and if that female model were to walk around town wearing the suit that the male model wears, people would think she was odd. So it's not really true that women can wear men's things.

To your question, we've had many threads about how CDers on this site would react to wearing "man skirts". These "man skirts" take an item that has traditionally been designed for women, and adapt it to make it suitable for men by masculinizing it. (Which is the same thing as the pin-stripe suit above. They took what was originally an outfit designed for men, and they feminized it for women).

Anyway, most members here have said they do NOT want to wear skirts that are acceptable for men to wear, they actually want to wear the versions that are sold to females. For reference, here's the wiki article with pics on skirts for men: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Men's_skirts


There was this article last week: http://www.theguardian.com/fashion/2014/oct/29/is-this-the-end-of-gender-specific-underwear-or-just-a-load-of-pants


The article's title, "Why Women Are Buying Men's Underwear" is misleading. A few paragraphs down they say that women buy them for the men in their lives. I can't imagine a woman who is not F2M, wanting all that extra fabric out front where she doesn't need it. :p

But they do have a great idea! I'd love to have underwear that are long like some of the men's briefs. They show a feminine version in black lace, for women. This would totally eliminate panty-lines! As to the nude, comfy-looking underwear for women further down, I wouldn't wear them. They have two totally unnecessary seams in the front just to make them look like men's underwear, that might show through if I were wearing tight slacks. Who wants seams there?

[wannabeGirl84]

for me it would be shorts... :daydreaming:

[Jenniferathome]

..
What one thing or item would you like to have mainstream society accept men wearing?
...

I would argue that if mainstream society completely accepted some item as for both men and women, cross dressers would not want to wear it. If a cross dresser is not "cross dressing" by wearing some particular item, then that item is of no importance.

[Beverley Sims]

As a man I am quite happy, I just want to wear it all as a woman.

[Maria Blackwood]

Purses.

Pockets just ain't cutting it.

[Shayna]

Leggings. The most comfortable thing I wear.

[AngelaYVR]

I would argue that if mainstream society completely accepted some item as for both men and women, cross dressers would not want to wear it.

Jeans are the exception I think. Not my cup of tea, but I see that they are popular here.

[Samantha_Smile]

What's the point in having one thing be acceptable if you can't have the rest?
That's not acceptance....

....That is ​permission.

[mariehart]

The Guardian article was interesting but it seems to ignore the fact that 'boypants' have been around for a while. I wear some daily, complete with lines Reine!. They are clearly derived from male underwear and are most comfortable which is why they're popular obviously.

As for some female clothes becoming mainstream male. I think it does happen. Remember the eighties? I wore tight lycra jeans along with everyone else back then. Mainstream then, not now. Men's underwear too. It's perfectly acceptable to wear pants that are to all intents nearly identical to women's. All my male underwear was like that. In fact I suspect those are the exact types women in the Guardian article buy.

I think though if something is mainstream then wearing it is not crossdressing anymore thus less interesting to the average CD.

It is possible though to wear entirely male clothes that present a feminine look. Gay guys do it all the time. I even accidentally managed it a couple of times. It's not crossdressing but close.

[kimdl93]

I guess quite honestly that I would prefer to be accepted as a woman, rather than as a man wearing a particular thing.

[MsVal]

What one thing or item would you like to have mainstream society accept men wearing?

The thing that I would like to have society accept is not a garment. It's an attitude, a way of life, an expression of the "ME" that lives inside me.

Best wishes
MsVal

[Nikki A.]

Many good points made here and I agree that it would be nice to be able to wear whatever we felt comfortable in. However that really won't happen very soon.
As far as one female thing that I would like to able to use as a male, it would be make-up. Maybe not all out, such as mascara and eyeliner (not that I would be adverse), but a little foundation and powder just to even out the coloring and hide the dark spots. A neutral eyeshadow would be nice also. Just like women why shouldn't a man be able to look a their best.
Another thing that I would like to see a little acceptance for men is being able to wear a bra if it's really needed. I can wear a 40 c cup with out enhancements and there are times when I could use the support. However to wear one as a male is asking for problems.

[Tina B.]

If I could wear one thing with out any repercussions, comments, or insults it would be long polished nails, any color you want!
It sure is fun to fantasize isn't it? But Smile is right, that would just be getting permission, and what would be really great, is to not need permission.

[AndreaCD1963]

Nail polish (other than my toes which are colored 24/7) Or any makeup - why should GG's be the only ones that can attempt to hide the dark circles under their eyes :-)

[Jenniferathome]

Jeans are the exception I think. Not my cup of tea, but I see that they are popular here.

But Angela, we all know the difference between women's jeans and men's. They are not the same.

[Teresa Monsivais]

Heels as long as they looked like the ones we wear now. I don't care if they are labeled for men or women but they have to look like the ones I have. Some heels look nice with men's pants but I could be biased hehe

[Alice-V]

I'd go for skirts, too. They're so flowing, so free. A skirt beats shorts anytime during summer. And as far as fertility is concerned, a skirt is surely a bonus!

[Majella St Gerard]

skirts and dresses

[Pumped]

High heels!

[suchacutie]

Heels, for sure! I like the idea of eye makeup as a second choice, but heels with a suit is just super!

Reine, I really think your suit argument is not adaptable over the wide spectrum. I agree that well-tailored clothes should match the body on which they are draped, but the body spectrum is huge across both genders.

[Lorileah]

Many good points made here and I agree that it would be nice to be able to wear whatever we felt comfortable in. However that really won't happen very soon.

Why not?

Every time one of these threads come up the first thing in my mind is...who says you can't? Who decided? Pretty much the men decided they would not (notice I didn't could not) wear these things. Some from practicality, hard to ride a horse in a dress and some because they just gave it up.

But back why won't this change anytime soon? Because men aren't willing to stand up for the "right" to wear whatever? I wonder if in the thirties there weren't as many women saying "geeze I would love to wear slacks but that won't happen" All it took was a few women to decide they could...and they did.

[Sonya]

Very hard for me to choose just 1 thing! I will say high heels but my list is really extensive.

[mandm40c]

If I called pick more than one, I say heels and skirts. However, as you asked for one, I would say heels would rank higher on the list. No pun intended. LoL

[jjjjohanne]

When I go out, I present male. I am not interested in being female. I go out in public infrequently. I go out during the day, while kids are in school. I go to places where decent people are and try to avoid situations where people might act rudely toward me. With that said, in my experience, a guy can already go out dressed in whatever he wants. Skirts, dark hosiery, heels, dresses. I have tried it all. People look because it is uncommon. But, society allows me to be out and people pretend like I am not uncommon. I have read online where a few people have gone to church enfemme without incident. It seems like the only place that crossdressing is still outlawed is around our families (and perhaps only our spouses). BUT, that is an important someone! :)

[Chardonnay Merlot]

Most of the women's stuff I'd like to wear, I do anyway (especially jeans and slacks -- I love the way women's sizes and cuts fit on me)

What I want to wear -- skirts, tights and slouchy boots :)

[CynthiaD]

Definitely breast forms. I just don't look right without them. Second place would be purses. Actually, I'm thinking about carrying a purse all the time. Pockets are a pain.

[Rachael HK]

What would I like society to accept men wearing? Colorful clothes...but honestly I don't care too much. As a guy I wear what I want, but I don't have any interest in dressing in women's clothes, either partially or completely, and presenting to society as a man.

[Sarasometimes]

mariehart "It is possible though to wear entirely male clothes that present a feminine look. Gay guys do it all the time. I even accidentally managed it a couple of times. It's not crossdressing but close." I think them being gay is an assumption on your part or did you ask them if they are?

This here is the reason that I don't want to wear those types of men's clothes. I want to be viewed as having a feminine side not thought to be gay. Sexual orientation and gender expression are separate aspects of who we are!

Now if the OP means is asking me what I would like to be able to do publicly that would send a widely accepted message that I have a feminine side I think color on my nails and or lipstick.

I disagree with ReineD that women have the same limitation in how they express their masculine personality traits as we do with our feminine traits! The idea of a woman shopping for and wearing clothes straight from the men's aisle has been accepted for decades! I can't find the article but I recently read an article for women on how to pull off the menswear look and it said buy a men's blazer and dress it up with soft accessories and other pieces. A women does this she will not first be thought to be gay.
Find me an article that addresses the same for a guy...Not happening!

[Taylor Ray]

I would have to say tops. I often find myself wearing my jeans with a cute cami or top.

[carahawkwind]

I'd just like more fabulous and fanciful men's clothes. More guys should back to dressing like 16th century French nobility. Modern men's clothes are so boring.

[StephanieCLT]

For me, I'd say high heels. Partly because I love them, and partly because I'm short!

[Toronto Kristen]

My vote would be for high heels.

I have to say that I agree with Cara, men's clothes and shoes are boring.

[DebbieL]

I think there's a difference between women's and men's suits, to use your first example. I looked up pin-striped suits to show you.

Women's: http://cdnpix.com/show/imgs/ede07b657b8d2db33210da2bedfe3eae.jpg

Men's: http://www.honeybuy.com/image/Black_With_White_Pinstripe_Wool_Men_Business_Suit_ Style__1__14773012085559888.jpg

There's a world of difference between the two, and if that female model were to walk around town wearing the suit that the male model wears, people would think she was odd. So it's not really true that women can wear men's things.

The "Boyfriend Jacket" is a much better match.
http://images.asos-media.com/inv/media/3/3/8/5/3345833/black/image1xxl.jpg

And my ex-wife actually took ALL of my REAL boxer shorts, sewed the flies shut, and wore them out on the street.

I remember when my school allowed the students to vote in a change to the dress code, allowing the girls to wear pants. To make it palatable to the boys, they said "Girls can wear pants in the winter, and boys can wear pants in the spring". Winter passed, with 95% of the girls wearing pants almost every day, then spring came, and the few boys, including yours truly, were dragged across the pavement by their arms while face down, turning thighs and knees into hamburger, then pulled, face down, by their legs - turning chests into hamburger. The coach had promised favors and grade upgrades to any of the "Jocks" who took part in the assaults.

Four of the boys were hospitalized - after bleeding through 2 hours of classes - making an example for hundreds to see.


To your question, we've had many threads about how CDers on this site would react to wearing "man skirts". These "man skirts" take an item that has traditionally been designed for women, and adapt it to make it suitable for men by masculinizing it. (Which is the same thing as the pin-stripe suit above. They took what was originally an outfit designed for men, and they feminized it for women).

The Scottish military kilt is a good example of this. The Dervish skirt is also a good example. Masters of Aikido and Aiki Jitsu wear skirts. If you touch the skirt with any part of your body, you will experience humiliation at minimum, pain or death in war. During WW-I the Germans would try to avoid the Scotch soldiers, because they were very good at shooting to produce maximum pain, without causing death, allowing their victims to scream for hours, hoping for rescue that would never come. Those who did try to rescue, were just added to the suffering and increased the screaming from pain. The only group more feared were the black soldiers.

When Pershing figured this out, he would have pipers and black squads make their versions of music, which could be used to concentrate German troops, making them easier to bombard.

The Dervish rite of manhood, when the boy is finally "allowed" to wear a skirt, involves spinning while members of his extended family cut his skin, often hundreds of times. Once that ritual is over, he is allowed to carry his knives on his skirt. Anyone who comes close enough to touch the skirt will leave bleeding to death slowly.

In Aiki Jitsu is the military version of Aikido, in which you don't just throw your opponent off balance, you leave him blind with dislocated shoulder, elbow, and fingers - all in one flowing dance-like move.

Note that each of these cultures are "ultra-masculine" - wearing the "Skirt" is a sign that they are man enough to wear it. A very different conversation than what CDs do.


But they do have a great idea! I'd love to have underwear that are long like some of the men's briefs. They show a feminine version in black lace, for women. This would totally eliminate panty-lines! As to the nude, comfy-looking underwear for women further down, I wouldn't wear them. They have two totally unnecessary seams in the front just to make them look like men's underwear, that might show through if I were wearing tight slacks. Who wants seams there?

Are you talking about "boy shorts" - they are comfortable and easy to wear.

Jocky shorts are probably the grossest - essentially "training pants", for grown-ups. They have the fly to make it easier to pull out, but also to just drop back in. The thick padding in front is designed to catch the little "extra" between the prostate and the tip that comes out when tucked in. This is why most CDs will sit when dressed.

The thing to keep in mind is that men's fashions are generally "Uniforms", in some cases, down to common symbols or icons.
The tie became popular because it could go from being decorative to being a tourniquet, pressure bandage,

[Paula_Femme]

Heels, a la the ever wonderful Eddie Izzard! :)

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=236269&stc=1

A very close second for me would be acrylic nails! :battingeyelashes:

[CarlaWestin]

What one thing or item would you like to have mainstream society accept men wearing?

That's easy. Right from the start as a curious preteen, breasts!

[Anna H]

all thru the 70's and part of the 80's, i wore 2" heeled boots...(mens boots!)
had really long & styled hair, wore bright colored satin shirts. Just like all the
Glam rockers of the times. all my friends did too. it was the way to dress.

guys could actually be "pretty" and it was acceptable even here in the
redneck deep south. not anymore, though....:(

i'd like to wear my dresses & heels out, and if there were someplace that
was even remotely safe to do that near me, i certainly would.

[Sarasometimes]

Having given this post more thought and if I still had a head of my own hair it would be the 80's men's perm which i so loved to get and wore till the follicle count got just too too low.

CarlaW, I do also like your idea of breast which I'm guessing would require the bra to be accepted as well, right?

But since the hair ain't growing back i'll stay with pretty nail polish and lipstick!

[Vickie_CDTV]

Skirts, absolutely! Second would be high heels, but the skirt is the item I most desire to wear in either gender.



I remember when my school allowed the students to vote in a change to the dress code, allowing the girls to wear pants. To make it palatable to the boys, they said "Girls can wear pants in the winter, and boys can wear pants in the spring". Winter passed, with 95% of the girls wearing pants almost every day, then spring came, and the few boys, including yours truly, were dragged across the pavement by their arms while face down, turning thighs and knees into hamburger, then pulled, face down, by their legs - turning chests into hamburger. The coach had promised favors and grade upgrades to any of the "Jocks" who took part in the assaults.

Four of the boys were hospitalized - after bleeding through 2 hours of classes - making an example for hundreds to see.


Do you mean boys were allowed to wear skirts in the spring? (I'd assume pants were always required.)