So, how much spine have you got?

[mechamoose]

Off character for me, I'm not talking about courage. I'm talking about the differences between spine curvature between males and females and how that affects the perceptions of males on a female's 'attractiveness'.

Males tend to have a vertical spine. It bears loads and distributes stresses a particular way. Female spines have a significant curve at the lumbar, which helps present "booty" and has a real world effect on mobility while carrying a child.

Men prefer women with curved spines, suggests better FORAGING (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2979043/Why-Kim-Kardashian-s-booty-attractive-Men-prefer-women-curved-spines-suggests-better-FORAGING-food.html)

This is one of many links to this study, Google will show you more.

So, I wonder how much lumbar curve contributes to the acceptance of transitioners and CDs in general.

If true, I have *never* heard of a CD/TS/TG person doing anything to adjust their Lumbar curvature.

Doing *anything* to the spine is risky as hell. Is this an "Achilles Heel"?

Curious...

- MM

[AllieSF]

I probably have a normal male spine and have to make an effort to get a decent military "Attention!" posture, meaning chest out, shoulders back and butt out. As for being read, it may be another one of those subtle tell tales that help give us away when we are so close to actually appearing as a GG. Since not all women have that specific posture that you describe, yes ... they may have the significant, or not, lumbar curve, they still may not have a good posture, which could negate their ability to show off their booty and assets. Since us MtF's have so many other obvious or almost obvious male traits, I do not think that it has anything to do with our "acceptance", and more to do with blending, passing or being immediately recognized as a male in women's clothing. For probably most transitioners, I would think that they would love to erase, not just hide, all male features and traits, and having just a few may hinder their acceptance as a woman by skeptical others.

[Katey888]

Interesting perspective...

I've been focusing on losing the 'Christmas Pudding' that appeared as male lurv-handles a couple of months back by a fair bit of gym work (all stamina-based versus weights) and I've always included some yoga stretches for flexibility. I've always been more flexible than my wife (for example) but some of that has to be natural... so I can easily do an 'upward facing dog' (that sounds bad... :lol: it's a yoga stretch...) and also still get my heels on the back of my head (with a bit of huffing and puffing right now, but some of that admittedly, is this evening's wine...) - so I guess that makes me flexible, but as to curvature... hmm...

A quick inventory of pics with profile reveals the following (only one I could find quickly...) :battingeyelashes:

242082

Which looks to be about a 34 deg butt (according to the diagram in the article)

I'd never thought of it before - and I wouldn't know what to do to enhance it - it's all natural... :D

Katey x

[mechamoose]

I can still do a 'backwards arch'... hands and feet on the floor, belly pressed up to the sky. It is required for 'kip ups' and for tumbling.

(No way in hell I'm going to tumble unless it involves a big hill)

Just an 'interesting' difference that has little to do with things we can control.

Food for thought.

- MM

[AngelaYVR]

Women have more anterior rotation of the pelvis which is what gives the increased lordotic curve of the lumbar spine (when you're born you only have a single curve, the others develop as you as learn new skills). The best way to get more booty is make sure your hamstrings are flexible (to reduce posterior pull on the pelvis and also is good for your back) and perform exercises that focus on the glutes (whichever tickles your fancy, I like cycling)

[Alice_2014_B]

A young and attractive lady I worked with on my last deployment in Africa told me, and others, that I have a nice butt.
Though an ego-boost I did not let it get to my head.
:)

[Beverley Sims]

No beautiful curves in my spine.
makes interesting reading though.

[Tracii G]

Flat butt here but then again women have them too.
I go the padding route to make up for my lack in that area.

[Seana Summer]

It dose make sense and it is yet another physical difference between most GGs and me. Carrying a child and giving birth are two things that the female body is specially designed for. I guess if I were really wanting to pass as female, padding the caboose is something I would really have to think about to get the right look.

[Kate Simmons]

I'm just wondering why a CDer would want to have a curvier spine. Unless of course they were looking to get foraged? Just a thought. :battingeyelashes::)

[mechamoose]

Kate S: Because of presentation.

I have been trying to figure out the cues that tell a mundane that we are not natively how we present. I found this study quite interesting.

I have seen a number of women with 'male features', but that centered around the face. I hadn't considered this other 'unconscious' presentation element.

- MM

[Kate Simmons]

Oh okay. I kind of do that when I dance as I move my hips around a lot but not really doing it to attract. Just free movement. This is what I meant when I said previously that I "get away" with more dancing en femme. Most guys tend to be kind of stiff and use too much energy when they dance. ;):)

[mechamoose]

I had a *seriously* empathetic GF at one point, who chided me on how I danced. She thought I was 'waving it too much'. That I was sending out a booty call. I was just feeling the music and rocking with it.

I have to wonder if that was good or bad? If I'm a 'male', then that 'booty call' wiggle is one thing. ($lut) If I was a GG and swishing that around? Is that bad? (ok, maybe I'm still a $lut)

If I'm a girl in a boy body and swishing that? Is that "bad"? I can cite dozens of female 'hip wiggling' incidents that don't raise an eyebrow... they might raise other things, though.

If I want to be and feel sexy, then that is how I *feel*. If I'm shaking it for everyone to see, then maybe I *want* that. (actually, yes. Yes I do, otherwise I wouldn't be waving it around.) If you respond, then.. you respond. What makes you throb makes you throb.

(I'm still shakin' what my Momma gave me)

-MM

[mechamoose]

Seana:

"My Baby got BACK" (Apologies to Sir Mixalot)

Or she at least rented it...

As far as *why* one of us would want that.. isn't the core of this for many of us transformation? If this is a lynch pin, shouldn't it bear attention? Boobs? Ok. Hips? Ok. If your vertical spine betrays all that?....

- MM

[Stephanie47]

All that survey revealed is 300 men in Turkey had a preference. Were the 300 men all Turkish? What were the demographics of the men? Anyone ask 300 American men? Or, is there a study of 300 white men? Or 300 African-American men? You get the point. I can really see some women out there developing large butts at weird angles coupled with extremely large breasts to appease 300 men. I've seen some really really exaggerated angles on some women's butts, and, all I can think of is the pain they will endure in later life when their muscles holding everything together starts to give out. There's enough to worry about at the lumbar region than enticing butt admirers.

[pamela7]

Women come in all shapes and sizes, and so do men, as long as you look roughly in proportion and dress according to age/status and move femininely, and act as if all is normal, then probably no-one will look enough to notice.

At the risk of being politically incorrect, people don't stare-at nor study other people, especially if they're deemed unattractive or even super-attractive. There is no reason for someone to look closely at you - unless a) they're another CD'ers, b) they are the upset SO of another CD'er, c) passport security control :-)

PS regarding the butts, the ancient venus sculptures of the stone-age show a perspective from doggy-style, and this is a primal instinct in the male of the species triggered by that shape!

[mechamoose]

PS regarding the butts, the ancient venus sculptures of the stone-age show a perspective from doggy-style, and this is a primal instinct in the male of the species triggered by that shape!

Some old Indian sculptures are downright pornographic!!! Tab G into slot W!!!

The Venus of Willendorf has HUGE hips, I wonder how much of that was booty vs waist?

(Again, curious for argument/discussion/dissent)

- MM

[Leah Lynn]

A quick test is to lie on your back on the floor, relaxed. Try to put your fist between the small of your back and the floor. It's normal for a woman to do this. However, if a man can, he has unusual cur vature and will probably suffer from back pain later in life. I could do it easily at 23, and my back always aches. Arthritis doesn't help.

Leah

[Marcelle]

Just tried your suggesting Leah and I can put my fist under my back and I do suffer from back pain. I have always had an odd curve to my spine (it was picked up and still is on medicals). However, it does help with my posture for parades and the effect for dressing en femme is benefited as well. Here is a picture from last year side profile (no padding here).

Hugs

Isha

[Kate Simmons]

If someone stares at my bust or butt or spine curvature am I going to take advantage of that? You betcha baby. As my Mom used to say: "If you've got it, flaunt it." :)

[sometimes_miss]

If I'm a girl in a boy body and swishing that? Is that "bad"?
It means you're overdoing it, the same as when men try to make their voices sound feminine by altering the pitch to extremes. The female stereotypical 'wiggle' is subtly different from our own, they're not doing it intentionally. Much comes simply from the additional fat located in the butt, and with the physical difference in how we walk. And you can't simulate that easily with padding, because padding doesn't wiggle.