"I crossdress" vs. "I'm a crossdresser"

[Lily Catherine]

Just a totally random thought I had at lunch: these terms feel so close yet so far, at least in the context of those who have no intent to transition.

Many of us here likely see CDing as a key part of us, though some (and much of the Muggle world it seems) might choose to view – is 'dismiss' even an appropriate word with the Muggles? – it as a hobby.

Perhaps it's in the sense of "I drive" vs. "I'm a driver" as opposed to "I'm a basketballer" vs. "I play basketball"; something mundane to us.

Are we, or do we? Or do we do it because of how we are?

[Jenniferathome]

Who would cross dress but a cross dresser?

[SandraB]

A cross dresser that doesn't cross dress, while possible, I think highly unlikely. From previous experience and until I embraced it, I found it impossible to resist.
A person that cross dresses that is not a cross dresser, again possible, especially if there is another motive. For example a performer. I don't know if Brendan O'Carroll is a cross dresser but he makes a fine living as Mrs. Brown. I'm sure there are other examples.

[Marcelle]

Hi Iris,

This is kind of a "chicken and egg" question . . . What came first the crossdresser or the dress. I would posit that if you like to dress in women's clothing (irrespective of for fun or by necessity) it is innate in some way and as such we do it because of the way we are.

"I crossdress therefore I am"

Hugs

Isha

[TinaZ]

I'm guessing a good percentage of comedians who cross dress for comic effect are not cross dressers.

I've said it before, but I consider myself a noun (cross dresser), and the manifestation of that is the verb (cross dressing). If I found myself stranded on a deserted island, I'd likely stitch together a seaweed skirt before trying to start a bonfire.

[AllieSF]

I guess I don't get the subtleties of your question. If you crossdress, to me, you are a crossdresser. If you are a crossdresser, to me, you crossdreesss every once in awhile. I am a crossdresser that is closer to TS than just wearing panties. Does a baseball player play baseball? Please clarify.

[Teresa]

My crossdressing needs are deeply embedded in my brain, I know it's much more than a hobby, so I don't see it as some frivolous whim or an excuse to collect underwear ! Teresa is part on me and I dress to satisfy that part !

[pamela7]

Does a baseball player play baseball?

This nails it. I can play soccer, does it make me a soccer-player? it could make me an amateur (unpaid) or a pro (paid).
It all depends if you identify with the activity. I'm a cricketer, dad, soccer-player, squash-player, gardener, ... crossdresser, the list goes on, but these are nominalisations of activities ... i play cricket, i play soccer, .... i crossdress. WHO I AM is the unanswerable question (same person). What I am is a human being.

So the point of the question is whether you entangle your identity with the activity, or whether it is "just an activity".

[Khora]

All crossdressers crossdress, but not all who crossdress are crossdressers.

[VS Fan]

How much dress would a cross dresser cross, if a cross dresser could cross dress? Couldn't help it :)

I think that although I certainly AM a crossdresser, as in someone who crossdresses, I don't think of myself in those terms since it's not an overwhelming part of my day - I'm a lot of things, a father, a sports fan, etc, etc... and none of them accurately describe the WHOLE me... but I think depending on the situation all of them are appropriate including being "a crossdresser."

VS Fan

[Erica Marie]

A slightly different perspective. I crossdress by the terms of society, but Im not a crossdresser by my terms. Every day almost all the cloths I wear are womens. I wear casual work pants, which by the way took a long time to find just the right style, I wear womens tops and hoodies daily. The twist is I still present male in sort of a feminine way. Ok I hope you are all confused at this point, because I know I am. So basically I just get dressed each day, who cares if its mens cloths, womens cloths or a mix of both. So basically does a crossdresser have to present as the opposite gender to be crossdressing?

[alwayshave]

Starlight, I understand the point you are making. However, for most, I believe that it is a distinction without a difference. If the act of a man wearing, for example, women's clothes, is crossdressing, aren't they as well by that act, a crossdresser, despite the underlying reason for doing so. (e.g., Tom Hanks in Bosom Buddies)

[Paula DAngelo]

To me there is a big difference between the two statements "I crossdress" and "I'm a crossdresser". I think that the difference is about someone's self acceptance. If I state that "I crossdress", I'm stating that I participate in and activity but it's something I do because it's an activity that I enjoy or profit from. I may be a crossdresser or I might not, as in an actor that dresses opposite of there sex to play a part, but I don't consider it a part of what defines me. Now if I state "I'm a crossdresser", I'm stating that this is an innate part of me and is part of what makes me who I am, and that I've accepted myself.

Does it matter which of these areas we fall into, for the purpose of this forum, or for being part of the transgender community I'd say no, we all belong. Does it matter to the individual, I'd say yes, but only to the extent of them knowing/understanding themselves.

[Greenie]

Rectangle/ square. Very confusing to me. I think that often people who say they just crossdressers as a hobby, either haven't gotten to the place where they accept or understand themselves. There are of course one time situations, dares, comedy, etc. There are people who have crossdressers that are not "crossdressers" as an entity or identity. But I think that people who have crossdressing as a part of them, or identity, some times start off as describing it as a hobby.

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi Iris, I enjoy wearing ladies clothes, It's just who I'm, And it's just what I do !!:daydreaming:

[audreyinalbany]

I agree with Greenie: there may be the rare individual out there who cross dressed for Halloween once on a whim and has zero interest in ever doing it again. But the vast majority of us who cross dress are 'cross dressers' Embrace it.

[Kate Simmons]

You say neether I say nither. It basically becomes a word game sometimes. I say if you are happy with who you are it doesn't matter what they may call us. :battingeyelashes::)

[Jackie7]

A slightly different perspective. I crossdress by the terms of society, but Im not a crossdresser by my terms. Every day almost all the cloths I wear are womens. I wear casual work pants, which by the way took a long time to find just the right style, I wear womens tops and hoodies daily. The twist is I still present male in sort of a feminine way. Ok I hope you are all confused at this point, because I know I am. So basically I just get dressed each day, who cares if its mens cloths, womens cloths or a mix of both. So basically does a crossdresser have to present as the opposite gender to be crossdressing?

Erica I think I am trending in the same direction, at least at home and around the town on a daily basis. Sort of lesbian lumberjack needing a shave. But then I girl up to go out in NYC and Philadelphia. Nevertheless I do think of myself as a crossdresser, not an androgyne.

[Leslie Langford]

A good question from a purely philosophical perspective, but in many ways not unlike the abstract - and often times, pointless debate - that vexed so many medieval religious scholars when they agonized over how many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

At the end of the day, the whole concept of "crossdressing" is simply an arbitrary social construct. RuPaul said it best when she stated that "We are all born naked, the rest is just drag".

[CountessVF]

I think I see what you're wondering. If we say "I crossdress", it could just be a hobby that we don't include in our self image/identity.

However if it is an integral part of our lives, be it feeling natural or fetish, it is included in our perception of who we are and then justifies the statement "I am a crossdresser".

[NicoleScott]

Some will disagree, but to me a crossdresser is one who has the internal drive to wear the clothes AND wears the clothes. A person who wears the clothes for a theatrical or Halloween event but lacks the internal drive is not a crossdresser. A person who has the desire but for several reasons (career, religious, ...) has never worn the clothes can't be called a crossdresser.

On another thread, a member who identifies as TS said "...I can assure you that people who have finally accepted that they are transsexual do not cross-dress."

I get that. They are women who wear women's clothes. That's not crossdressing.

On Greenie's "Gender Stereotypes: thread: Greenie (GG/SO of a CDer) asked three questions specifically directed at CDers:
- Do you think the longer you identify as a cross-dresser...
- Do you think that being a CDer...
- Do you think that since you are a CDer...


At least two members who identify as TS answered. One who said "Answering from the rearview mirror of when I was a CD...". Apparently one can be a CDer and BECOME TS. The other, who among others, has told her story including statements such as "... I finally realized what I was all along."

Of course the forum rules allow any member to post, but why would a TS answer questions directed to crossdressers, that they claim NOT to be? Unless they claim "dual status".

It's pretty common here for people to reject standard definitions and substitute their own.

I am a crossdresser AND I crossdress.

[Lynn Marie]

Descartes immediately came to mind. "I think, therefore, I am".

[Lorileah]

why do I feel we need a Venn diagram?


Some will disagree, but to me a crossdresser is one who has the internal drive to wear the clothes AND wears the clothes. and THAT is YOUR opinion. Crossdress is a verb that means
to dress in clothing typically worn by members of the opposite sex. cross-dresser is the noun for the same (Maybe your dictionary varies)
A person who wears the clothes for a theatrical or Halloween event but lacks the internal drive is not a crossdresser. A person who has the desire but for several reasons (career, religious, ...) has never worn the clothes can't be called a crossdresser. By definition it must be clothing of the opposite sex. The "religious" argument is weak at best. That is weak. Why cannot a religious person who has never worn the clothing not think and believe they are crossdressers?Technically and if you look up "drag" theater actors are dressing in drag, but you have solid lines and by definition they are cross-dressing


On another thread, a member who identifies as TS said "...I can assure you that people who have finally accepted that they are transsexual do not cross-dress." and people who no longer drive race cars are still race car driver who do not drive race cars. Maybe they are owners now but they DID drive once. C'mon.


I get that. They are women who wear women's clothes. That's not crossdressing. by definition


On Greenie's "Gender Stereotypes: thread: Greenie (GG/SO of a CDer) asked three questions specifically directed at CDers:
- Do you think the longer you identify as a cross-dresser...
- Do you think that being a CDer...
- Do you think that since you are a CDer...


At least two members who identify as TS answered. One who said "Answering from the rearview mirror of when I was a CD...". Apparently one can be a CDer and BECOME TS. The other, who among others, has told her story including statements such as "... I finally realized what I was all along."

Of course the forum rules allow any member to post, but why would a TS answer questions directed to crossdressers, that they claim NOT to be? Unless they claim "dual status".
You trying to push buttons? Nicole we have discussed this many times. Are you saying that one cannot grow or change? Do you know how many TSs started as "Just crossdressers" or "just fetish dressers"? Take a poll. Search MY posts from 5 years ago even. Some of us even though we are TS have played the crossdress role. Now you can PM me if you want to take this deeper. Insidious and subtle prodding won't be tolerated.


It's pretty common here for people to reject standard definitions and substitute their own.

I am a crossdresser AND I crossdress.
which you have done marvelously (see definitions above)

[LilSissyStevie]

It seems like a trivial distinction...a distinction without a difference. But still it's one I make for myself. Cross dressing is just something I do.

[Beverley Sims]

I am a cross dresser, the noun......
I cross dress, the verb....

Is this a lesson in english?

So far I have only scored twenty percent.

[ReluctantDebutant]

I have crossdressed before I will probably crossdress again. I just crossdress I do not consider myself a crossdresser as if that is some separate special identity apart from the rest of my fellow human beings. Yes I cross-dressing is a part of me but it does not define me or is really all that important to me. Again I just crossdress.

[Leslie Langford]

With so many different inputs on the subject of crossdresser/crossdressing registered here at this point, maybe we should start re-framing the dialogue within the context of Jeff Foxworthy's well-known "You might be a redneck if..." comedy routine, with the word "crossdresser" being substituted for the term "redneck". ;) :eek: :heehee:

[Tina_gm]

Some guys go and play golf a couple times a year, company event, part of a bachelor party.... They are sort of just doing it because. They are not good at it and don't care to be good at it. PRobably won't ever be concerned if they never play again. But they probably will, and have played several times. Does that make them a golfer or just someone who plays golf??

I am not content here though, I want even more confusion hehehehe.... What about someone who for whatever social or religious family etc etc reasons, desperately desires to CD, feels deeply connected to the opposite sex, but does absolutely nothing other than deal with the internal desires.... does that make them a CDer? They could be classified as transgender due to internal emotions and desires perhaps, but they choose to do not express this externally in any way whatsoever.

I consider myself a CDer, in that I identify myself as being under the TG spectrum. It is my femininity that gives me the desire to wear women's clothing, thus I crossdress. I have known others that have crossed dressed for comedy, to get a rise out of people and I do not consider them to be cross dressers, personally.

[Diane1950]

I think there's a big difference between the two statements.

For example, if I wear my wife's panties in a pinch, or put on one of her flannel nightgowns on a cold night, or wear pantyhose during sex, and only indulge sporadically and randomly, then the statement "I crossdress" would apply.

But if I wear panties, bras, dresses and women's clothes in general, because I enjoy them, and/or identify with and embrace the feminine side of myself, then it would be true to say "I'm a crossdresser", which I am, and which I am proud of.

[JayeLefaye]

With so many different inputs on the subject of crossdresser/crossdressing registered here at this point, maybe we should start re-framing the dialogue within the context of Jeff Foxworthy's well-known "You might be a redneck if..." comedy routine, with the word "crossdresser" being substituted for the term "redneck". ;) :eek: :heehee:

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?218524-You-might-be-a-crossdresser-if/page8

Here ya go, Leslie:-)

Jaye

[NicoleScott]

A definition of crossdressing I saw in the past, one that I based my opinion on, added to the clothing part (which we all know, omitted here for brevity)..."for sexual or emotional reasons." To me, an internal motive is required, but not an external one, such as costuming. None of the sources I checked today made mention of motive, and wikipedia clearly excluded any motive or cause. If my definition is obsolete or not widely accepted, then it is the act alone that defines crossdressing that is the prevailing definition.
If that's the case, that crossdressing is defined only by the wearing of the clothing, then we cannot call a crossdresser one who desires to wear the clothes but for whatever reason, never has. To use the baseball example, if you never played baseball, how can you be called a baseball player?

[Tamara Croft]

Of course the forum rules allow any member to post, but why would a TS answer questions directed to crossdressers, that they claim NOT to be? This question isn't aimed at GG's either, so would you say that we're not allowed to submit a reply? it's not aimed at the FTM's either... they also not allowed to reply or submit an answer? Are you some kind of super crossdressing GOD who has a bloody answer for everything, therefore no one has actually got to answer, because you can just answer for everyone right? No one is allowed a different opinion? is that what you're saying?

Personally, imho... I think you're just being an argumentative troll... and you know what happens to trolls....

[flatlander_48]

why do I feel we need a Venn diagram?

I fell pretty confident that John Venn would NEVER have touched this subject...

DeeAnn

[Katey888]

Isn't this all just semantics...??? :thinking:


Semantics - the branch of linguistics and logic concerned with meaning. The two main areas are logical semantics, concerned with matters such as sense and reference and presupposition and implication, and lexical semantics, concerned with the analysis of word meanings and relations between them.

Or as my mate Sean used to be fond of saying:


That's all complete bollox and a waste of your time, my time, and more importantly, valuable drinking time. Now shut the 4#@£ up and let's get down the pub...

Or in my case I'm just going to bed... :)

Katey x

[Janine cd]

I am a crossdresser because I feel more comfortable in feminine clothes than male clothes. I have always believed that this is a result of some genetic phenomenon because I have always preferred feminine activites to anything masculine.

[Ceera]

I think I can give one very good example of someone who would say "I cross dress", but who would still adamantly say "I am not a crossdresser!" That would be cosplayers. I know a teenaged guy that will happily put on a wig and female costume for cosplay purposes and go traipsing around in it at an Anime or Brony convention. But that same guy would never, ever consider slipping into a wig and feminine clothes just for fun, when no one was around; or with the intent of going out in public where they might be seen doing it - outside of their cosplay venues. If they left the convention center while in the costume they could still justify it by their convention activity being in progress.

Comedians who cross dress as part of their comedy routine, or actors who take in a role that requires crossdressing, also would usually fit that mold, I think. Robin Williams cross dressed for his role in "Mrs. Doubtfire", and he may have done it for a few other movie roles or in a comedic routine. But I doubt he ever hung out around his home while wearing a skirt and wig, or went nightclubbing as a girl.

Personally, I am at the cusp of the two positions. Certainly it's true that 'I cross dress'. I think I do it rather well, and I enjoy it. I pretty much would agree with "I am a crossdreser" as well, but would qualify that with "Occasionally". My involvement is shallow compared to many who post here. I'm in the wading end of the pool, wearing panties under my male clothes and maybe doing a full "girl up" and going out just on Saturday nights, and not even every week.

[CD_Princess1234]

I am a cross dresser not just cross dressing. Rachael enjoys being out in public. I see myself as a person and a habit or obsession

[Alice_2014_B]

Very interesting; I never thought about it.
My wife knows, and supports, that I cross dress for entertainment purposes.
However, I consider myself a cross dresser.
Some entertainers will cross dress just for a part in a play or something.
Others, like myself, who really enjoy it will jump on any chance to cross dress; I would be the first to raise my hand!
:)

[Leslie Langford]

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?218524-You-might-be-a-crossdresser-if/page8

Here ya go, Leslie:-)

Jaye

LOL Jaye!

Clearly, great minds think alike. ;)

[Sarah Doepner]

From my view of things the difference is in self-identification and ownership of what you do. I used to crossdress and it caused me considerable frustration as I attempted to change or eliminate it from my life. Once I began to self-identify as a Crossdresser I was able to take ownership and move toward integration within my life. If you crossdress and it doesn't cause you any problems, fine. But if it does, it could be the need to think about who you are, not just what you do.

[Jaymees22]

Simply put I'm a crossdresser and I crossdress.

[Raquel Maire]

As stated before there is no difference. I'm both and enjoy every minute of it

[msniki48]

I am transgender, therefore i dress to feel as close as I can to being feminine or female.. if I had other options in my life at this moment to gain the same feeling I would probably do it... as Teresa has said this is a manifestation of something deep inside. there are many crossdressers that dress for the pure pleasure of the clothing...or for performances, or sexual gratification...and that is great for them.... so I do see a difference with the context of the words... " I crossdress " " i'm a crossdresser " I feel I am transgender, therefore I dress. if I really wanted to go deep...lol id say I crossdress when I am in male mode as I feel much more natural when in female clothes.

we sure have a lot of labels....you girls continue to make me think.

thank you

hugs niki