How many of us are there?

[Janet Bern]

I have been thinking about this for a long time. How many CDs are there
not counting the guy or occasionally puts on pair of panties. How many of
us actually have clothes and shop for them?

[Sarah-RT]

I do! Amazon and brick and mortar shops, always window shopping :D

Sarah x

[Krisi]

If you got on the phone and took a survey, would you expect honest answers? And how would you qualify someone as a "crossdresser"? We have some guys who throw on a dress or mini skirt and go to the fast food restaurant without shaving and we have those who go all the way and present female every day.

[Ceera]

Do you mean here in these forums, or in the world in general? In my home town I see at least a dozen MtF girls on a regular basis, though I have no way to know how many of them are 'just CD's' like me, or are starting or have completed the act of transitioning fully to female. I do know several drag queens here who have obviously had their breasts done, or have had HRT, because I've seen them scantily clad and they clearly have no need for breast forms.

Personally, I'm a definite CD, not considering ever transitioning fully to female or modifying my body beyond shaving face and body, and maybe eventually piercing my ears. I do my best to pass when I am out of the house en-femme. I have an extensive wardrobe - half my closet is female clothes, shoes, wigs and forms. I shop for girly things every week, either in drab in stores or on line. I get out en-femme about once a week right now, to a nightclub, and hope to do it about 50% of the time once I finish moving to a new state and town in the near future.

In about a week I'm planning my first day of mall shopping while en-femme! So excited! Going to treat myself to a full professional makeover, shopping for clothes and shoes, and dinner en-femme with my daughter, and then go to my favorite club all glammed up, to celebrate my birthday!

[Pat]

If you look back through older threads you'll see this topic addressed a number of times. If you think it's hard to get this community to agree on if crossdressers are transgender or not, it's nothing compared to getting them to accept population numbers. I swear there are some members who feel you can't count the fingers on one hand with any degree of certainty. ;) The Williams Institute at UCLA has a recent figure that transgender people (all, not just crossdressers) make up 0.3% of the general population of the US or about 900,000 people. That doesn't say how many crossdressers there are but it probably puts an upper limit on it at least for those people who meet the survey's definition of transgender. That number compares well with the Gallup Poll number that says 3.5% of the general population in the US identifies as LGBT, since I, at least, would expect the T number to be very small compared to the LGBT number.

[ChristinaK]

Wow, we really are perverts as my wife calls us. Since we are so rare in the population and not within social norms, we do pervert them when exposing ourselves t9 the public.

I feel so ashamed! (Not really ;-) I guess it's the pirate side of me to be different. I'm still working on that Southern Christian non-tolerant wife too.

[Kate Simmons]

To quote Carl Sagan, "Billions and billions....":battingeyelashes::)

[Alice_2014_B]

Definitely right here!
Love shopping!
Occasionally I'll hang around the house just in heels or dressed up from the waist on down. I've never sported the panties though, just not my thing.
But I'm definitely the one for finding deals at the store and online.
I'm also one for venturing out fully en femme, like many others.
:)

[Gerrijerry]

good question. I will go to all the people I see and meet and ask them.

[Jenniferathome]

As Brian responded to Reg about how much he hated the Romans," A Lot."

[ReineD]

Here's a Gallup poll from 2012 (US), apparently the largest up until 2012 that asked about LGBT identification.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/158066/special-report-adults-identify-lgbt.aspx

Out of 120,000 interviews, 3.4% said they were either L, G, B, or T. This is consistent with polls I have seen from other countries as well (anywhere from 3%-5%).

If the Gallup respondents represent the US population, this means that out of a total 2012 population of 314M, there are 235M adults (75%) x 3.4% = 8M LGBT.

Now comes the tricky part, which is estimating how many Ts there are in the LGBT. Judging by the percentage of "T"s I see when I go to LGBT events, to be generous I'll estimate that 10%-20% are T which means that 800,000 to 1.6M of adults in the US (2012) are T. So this extrapolates to having 3-7 people out of every 1,000 who identify as T in the US.

[Confucius]

From what I understand, most scientific literature use a 3% prevalence rate of the male population. This is based upon a single Swedish study. Langstrom, N., & Zucker, K.J. (2005). Transvestic fetishism in the general population: Prevalence and correlates. Journal of Sex & Marital Therapy, 31(2), 87-95.

The 3% prevalence rate sounds about right to me.

[ReineD]

The 3% prevalence rate sounds about right to me.

Here's the article mentioned by Confucius:
http://www.researchgate.net/publication/7879474_Transvestic_fetishism_in_the_general_popul ation_Prevalence_and_correlates

They contacted 5,250 randomly selected 18-74 year-olds in Sweden, in 1996. 2,450 individuals (1,274 men and 1,171 women) agreed to take the survey. This particular study shows the result of having asked the 1,274 men "Have you ever dressed in clothes pertaining to the opposite sex and become sexually aroused by this?”. The responses were no = 1,243 (97.2%) and yes = 36 (2.8%).

It's unclear what percentage crossdress for other reasons than sexual arousal, vs. those who only dress for arousal, but it's an interesting read.

[Eryn]

I really wish that somenoe could access a good database of shoe purchases. One could compare the distribution curve of women's foot size (which is likely a normal bell curve) against the distribution curve of the sizes of women's shoes sold (which undoubtedly has a bulge on the large size end of the curve) Guess what that bulge represents? Yep, us!

So, what I am saying is that the only person who really knows how many of us there really are is likely a statistician working for Payless Shoes! :)

[Pat]

It's unclear what percentage crossdress for other reasons than sexual arousal, vs. those who only dress for arousal, but it's an interesting read.

It is an interesting read. They do admit that they specifically chose not to include a temporal dimension in their selection -- that is, a respondent only had to have experienced sexual arousal from crossdressing one time in his lifetime to be counted as a yes -- it didn't have to be a pattern of behavior. Perhaps that's why their number is higher than most.

[Joansometimes]

I do too! In fact I let the sa know I'm buying for myself.

[Jenniferathome]

Here's a Gallup poll from 2012 (US), apparently the largest up until 2012 that asked about LGBT identification.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/158066/special-report-adults-identify-lgbt.aspx

Out of 120,000 interviews, 3.4% said they were either L, G, B, or T. ...

had they asked me, I would NOT self identify at "T" even though I am quite clearly a cross dresser. I just don't think of myself as transgender (and that has been debated here ad nausium). They really need a "C" in that alphabet soup. I wonder if I am the norm or exception and how would the data be affected. Probably not much. 3% doesn't seem crazy when you think about the numbers of members as well as new signups daily on the forum alone!

[kimdl93]

I have no idea. Nor, in all these years has any survey, Gallop or otherwise, ever asked.

[flatlander_48]

It is VERY difficult to get statistics on the LGBT population. There are people who self-identify. There are people who will not self-identify as they question the security and degree of anonymity of the survey. Further, it also depends upon how you ask the question. Self-identification is very different from just having same-sex attractions.

We've been trying to get our employer to put self-identification questions in our climate surveys for many years with only minimal success. Several years ago we managed to get it included for 1 division (the one where I work) out of then 5 and it only happened 1 time. It seems to be gathering steam once again, so we'll see. The thing is, unless you have that information, you have no idea as to how the LGBT population in the company is doing.

DeeAnn

[NicoleScott]

I have had several private chats with another member with whom I have much in common as far as crossdressing tastes go. She doesn't identify as TG but I do as a CDer, as I fall under the umbrella. As varied as the definitions of TG are here on the forum, certainly there must be differences in how outsiders see TG. If the poll doesn't define TG, the numbers don't tell us much.
Anyway, the OP question was about CDers, not TG.
My WAG, 5%.

[Maxi]

I love to go shopping, and have quite the nice wardrobe.

I got off a little early today, so I grabbed my daughter from daycare, and went to the mall in drab. I just came home with my first nice necklace. a nice double heart with diamond accent, on a 14k gold over silver chain, $130. When the clerk finished the sale, she said "I hope she likes it". My daughter asked if it was for me or mommy. I told her it was for me. The look on the sales lady's face was priceless. I showed her some pictures of me dressed, and she was fascinated with them. We talked a few minutes, and she thought is was neat that I bought the necklace for me.
Anytime I am wanting to look at jewelery, she would be more than happy to help me.

Another fun trip to the mall.

[franlee]

I believe there are far more Crossdressers than any poll will be revealing anytime soon. A lot of us are just to scared to admit it even to ourselves much less ay poll taker. Besides the ones that will not admit and own it aren't going to be contributing any effort towards fellowship much-less the understanding by outsiders, or even their own family and friends. It would be nice to know but I don't think we ever will!

[Kelli Ca]

Two types of cd. Those that do it and those that lie about it. Lol jk but good question I have often wondered while in the mall and I see men in women's section if they are shopping for themselves.

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi Janet, Only when the Government makes us register and places a special tax our clothes and heels, Then we will know how many.:hugs:

[Dana44]

I think way more than what is showed or calculated. I was born in 1951 and of the des related group of us kids grown into adults, 17.6 of males turned out to be males most of their lives. That means 84 percent was under the LBGT umbrella. I went to my 40 year reunion several years ago and there was about a third of the class dead. Quite a few died of aides, There was not a lot known back at that time. We were all just different kids and grew to be men not knowing why we did not fit the mold quite well.

[susan54]

As others have said, it depends on your definition. I would not include myself within LBGT - I am a heterosexual male who always identifies as male however dressed> Though for years I had professionally painted toes I have not touched them this year and only once last year. I wear the clothes more than ever but rarely go out because now that the adrenaline no longer flows when I go out I just feel 'wrong' presenting as a woman, though I am reasonably good at it. But in spite of this absence of female identification which probably puts me in a minority here I seem to have more women's clothes than most on this site. Most of them are also very good quality. Even by women's standards these are high quality clothes worn by a minority. I have been told I am the only cross-dresser the boutiques I frequent have encountered but all the department stores have had men trying on womenswear, as well as the chains like Hobbs and Phase Eight in the larger cities. So I think that while there could be a lot of men who have tried on womenswear maybe there are not that many who regularly wear this stuff and maintain a full wardrobe. The best suggestion I have heard is the shoe-related one, as you absolutely NEED shoes for a dress or skirt outfit and only a few will be able to borrow the right size. Comparing the purchases and women's sizes should give a statistical hint about numbers. Don't know how you account for the difference in number of pairs bought - but it is a start.

[Belle Cri]

I'll be mathematically snarky here, but with a real point. The answer to your question is that you take the number of men with wallets and divide that number into the number of men who buy panties, and you will have a very good percentage approximation of the answer - which of course is nonsense without valid input.

Here is my point - yours is the valid input. There may be other valid inputs such as close friends and loved ones, but the other variables are simply that, and therefore of no fundamental consequence to the balance you seek in this equation.

Omm. lol. Actually is a rather valid point if you think about it....

[pamela7]

think about stag nights, about rugby club outings, and you'll see many apparently straight men loving the chance to dress
with the social rules taken away, then our percentage might be really quite high

[Krisi]

I agree with Jennifer post #17). I don't think of myself as transgender (regardless of what others on this forum who don't know me might say) so wouldn't have selected that on a survey. I doubt such a survey would get mostly honest answers and as I posted above, one would have to define "crossdresser" before attempting to take a survey.

Also, I suspect the percentage of crossdressers (and those who identify as "transgender") varies quite a bit with the country they live in. The UK, the USA and Australia seem to be well represented on this forum but not Iraq, Iran, Russia, North Korea, etc. so the percentage in the first three mentioned is likely much higher than in the others.

[stacycoral]

My SO says i have more outfits than she does, sometimes a girl just need a new outfit to feel good.

[Tashee]

Lets say the definition is a proclivity to woman's clothes. If that qualifies it I'd say from experience a lot more than most think. Cannot tell you how many traffic stops the man has ladies shoes on some form of clothes etc. Or during a search the person is embarrassed because of....Or medical emergencies reveal...As one myself I go OUT OF MY WAY to not embarrass the sister.

So I say a bigger % is drawn to some form of cross dressing/ It just might not fit some foolish definition that we used to loathe as we were all lumped in one large stereo typical definition for years prior to the internet giving us a voice.

[sometimes_miss]

From the Gallup pole: "Exactly who makes up the LGBT community and how this group should be measured is a subject of some debate. Measuring sexual orientation and gender identity can be challenging since these concepts involve complex social and cultural patterns. As a group still subject to social stigma, many of those who identify as lesbian, gay, bisexual, or transgender may not be forthcoming about this identity when asked about it in a survey. Therefore, it's likely that some Americans in what is commonly referred to as "the closet" would not be included in the estimates derived from the Gallup interviews.
Which means they only included those who are willing to be publicly 'out' as they mention here, and then you have, " Thus, the 3.4% estimate can best be represented as adult Americans who publicly identify themselves as part of the LGBT community when asked in a survey context".
Which means, essentially, that they still have no accurate idea at all. They're still working on a 'best guess' basis. And, anyone can guess and have an equal chance of being right when you leave out a significant portion of the data. I'll guess 50%. As there's no data to prove otherwise, who knows, I could be right.

[joanna4]

Oh we're out there, like mutants in the X-Men universe, we're all different and special:)

[Rhonda Darling]

The answer is 42, which we all know is also the answer to the ultimate question of life, the universe, and everything.

[Belle Cri]

oh bloody hell, I'd forgotten 42. Call the mice.

[Jorja]

The answer is 3. Oh hell, I have confused it with the tootsie pop answer again.

[Belle Cri]

Stop. I'm terrible with math, really.

[Nolacdflorida]

All I know is that here in the deep south of the USA the level of homophobia is often scary. If I were to go out in my full dress I around here I would be singled out for some very different attention.

I honestly believe that most men are potential crossdressers and given the opportunity, encouragement and availability of clothing, I would not be surprised if over 75% of men have thought about donning their wife's, sisters or mothers underwear.

It would be so much easier if we would all just be OK to do what the hell we want when it comes to how we present ourselves, but of course that will never happen in our lifetime.

In the meantime we all just have to accept 42.

[Katie Thompson]

Fantastic discussion here. Just want to through in my 2 cents. I like to use TG (Trans Gender) as the umbrella term that covers all of us from those that only ever wear lingerie for bedroom play all the way past the CD (Cross Dresser like me) to the TS (Trans Sexual) where people live life every day expressing the gender that makes them feel the most themselves that differs from the gender that was assigned to them at birth. I also like to include the performers even though Drag Kings and Drag Queens sometimes have drastically different motivations than many of us, I still like to call them in our family. This way the numbers can be very high. Last year I got invited to help with a presentation to a gender studies class at Tufts University. I was able to share my CD perspective with the class and the wonderful TS who was the main speaker told us all that the present best numbers for TS are just under 1% of the total population (everybody not just people in the TG umbrella). Then she told us that the estimates for people who would fall into the CD category (actively dressing now and then or not) run at 5% to 8% (again of everybody). Imagine that... what if 1 out of every 20 men you ever know either dolls up now and then or at least very much wants to.

[Stephanie47]

I agree with Jennifer (#17) and Krisi (#29). I do not identify with the word "transgender." All my life I've heard that term strictly associated with "transsexual." The problem with surveys is a lack of definitions. I took a telephone survey during a Presidential election. The surveyor was barred from answering any questions I may have had as to the definitions of words in the questions. The surveyor could only ask the questions- period. Ask a cross dresser who does not participate in this forum what "transgender" means and I'm pretty sure many, if not the majority, would not include themselves as "transgender." Personally, I do not consider a man who buys and wears feminine panties, and only feminine panties, a cross dresser. I consider him to be a fetish dresser. My daughter as a teenager use to buy men's jeans because men's jeans had pockets. I would not consider her to be a FtM cross dresser. The issue I raise is the definitions of terms. Even appearing in women's clothing on Halloween would not qualify a man as a cross dresser, even if he were the envy of an cross dresser on this site. A one time lark does not make a cross dresser.

I think the general public and media have come to an agreement that MtF cross dressers have some sort of motivation to emulate or appear as a woman on a consistent basis, i.e., exclude the Halloween costumer.

I think there is some real bias against cross dressing men in most parts and cultures in this country. I really doubt, even if identity is really protected, you'll get 100% truthful answers.

As to me with reference to the original questions, yes, I'm an active, although closeted in home, cross dresser. I buy my own clothes; dresses, undergarments, hosiery, heels, wigs and makeup. When I have the opportunity and inclination I do venture forth in the evenings fully en femme for strolls. I am fully content being a man, and, have absolutely zero desire to become a woman. Why I do this? I haven't the slightest idea!

[docrobbysherry]

I don't know. But, I DO know this; Whenever a thread like this is run there r those that believe anywhere from 15% to 75% of males would try on fem clothes if "they could". This is wishful thinking to the Nth degree.:eek:

I was a vanilla man until I began dressing in my 50's. Altho I had many chances to try on my gf's and/or wife's clothes privately over the previous 30 years, I didn't. And, why is that?

Because the idea never entered my mind! And, that's how it is for most men. The only thot they have about women's clothes is how to get women out of them!:devil:

[Rachael Leigh]

I'm a a CD with all my own clothes, bought by me and shopped by me. One half of my closet is now women's clothes not to mention a few drawers of things

[Pat]

I agree with Jennifer (#17) and Krisi (#29). I do not identify with the word "transgender." All my life I've heard that term strictly associated with "transsexual."

OK. But what I read there is that you don't understand/accept the generally agreed upon meaning of the term 'transgender' and the meaning you do assign to the term is one you don't identify with. To me it sounds equivalent to "I consider the word 'apple' to refer to oranges, and I loathe oranges, therefore I refuse to be called an apple-eater even though I love to eat warm apple pie with cold apple juice." Vocabulary is crucial to communication. Where there is no agreement on vocabulary there can be no communication. You can continue to disagree about the meaning of the word 'transgender' -- that's your choice, but you can't use your definition to critique a study that was built around the other definition.

[Eryn]

It is VERY difficult to get statistics on the LGBT population. There are people who self-identify. There are people who will not self-identify as they question the security and degree of anonymity of the survey.

Very true. I'm even reluctant to state my ethnicity on forms, since for me there can be some decided disadvantages in doing so. If I don't verify a characteristic it is more difficult to hold it against me.

It is all kind of silly, though. Google and the NSA both have everyone completely defined, simply from watching our 'net activity. The brownshirts will have no problem obtaining this information the next time they come to power.

[Lorileah]

12...maybe 14. 6? definitely less than 47.

Now, two things. We all know there is no way we can ever ever ever know how many anythings there are in the TG world. Second...you make this a fight over labels again and it will be gone quickly.

[Tammy Lynn Tx]

I think there are more CDers than most folks would think. I have been buying and wearing my own clothes for more than 30 years. Now My wife and I are always surprising each other with clothes for over 25 years.

[Katey888]

3,432,869

give or take half a dozen...

And that's just in Lichtenstein... :eek:

My best, educated but unsubstantiated guess... and as the OP said: not counting one-off 'triallers'...

<0.5%

I think we're a very rare breed indeed - of course, wouldn't it be great to think this quirky gender thing is more widespread... :thinking: ...but the evidence is somewhat against us...

This site only represents a fraction of the CD/TG world as demonstrated by the multitude of sites that cater for hookups... but we're quite well subscribed amongst the TG 'Chattering Classes'... the 'intelligentsia', if you will. This site is outnumbered, what - 20:1 by those other sites..? Allow for a little crossover; multiple subs... say each site get around 15,000 distinct, individual entries... assume they're all English speaking... 300,000 individual CDs... but not everyone in the English-speaking world has access to the web... but say of 300 million (discount our non-native speaking friends) two thirds do... and about half of them are GGs... so that's 100 million all-male, rooting, tooting, paid-up members of the testosterone club from whom we draw 300,000 slightly more flouncy, flirty types...;) Ballpark that's only 0.3%...

Seems reasonable to me..

Katey x

(PS. The Lichtenstein thing was a joke - they're actually all a bunch of merchant bankers there...)

[Jackie7]

I've been socially out as a friendly, obviously male but also blendable CD, not TS, in the general vanilla world for about 15 years and have become comfortable answering people's questions. Occasionally I appear en femme to read at a literary salon in Philadelphia and similar events in NYC. This puts girly me in front of new people in a cocktail-party type of setting.

Over the years I observe that about one in about ten new men in any social setting will in some way signal to me their own Cd and gender-bending experiences. I've come to expect to be approached by a shy man with a question, a story to tell, or simply the desire to be seen... and be recognized. Sometimes we become friends, sometimes they and their wives want to talk to my wife, sometimes they just want a shopping buddy.

I wouldn't translate that into any general statistic since the people I am likely to meet are somewhat self-selecting, in that they decided to be wherever it was that we met, and it was a setting where I felt safe to be out. I am always surprised by how diverse we are, except for this.

[Judith96a]

I just don't think of myself as transgender (and that has been debated here ad nausium). They really need a "C" in that alphabet soup.

Jen, you've hit THAT nail fair and square! The problem with statistics is that the answer depends on what question was actually asked (and possibly how it was asked). Even though I am clearly a cross dresser, I'm not going to put "T" on any census form / survey that my wife might see!

[Jorja]

They really need a "C" in that alphabet soup. I wonder if I am the norm or exception and how would the data be affected.

So does the C stand for Crossdresser or Crazy?

[HelenR2]

How many are there?......
Bloody loads!

And it's growing.