Negativity

[Donnagirl]

Hi guys,

I said for a while that I appear to have been very lucky having not received any negative comments or attitude from anyone, well, all good things must come to an end.

Over the last week I have had some outright hostility and some veiled insults offered under the guise of advice. All has come from women and with the exception of one, women in the office. Not my staff, but those from affiliated work areas. I think the catalyst was my preparatory steps for shedding the boy at work, changing everything over to Donna.

Comments have varied from, "But you look so good as a male, why not stay male at work?", to the openly hostile, "don't think you're using my toilets!". One former boss and definitely now former friend, over a few texts basically called me 'bitchy' and 'a high maintenance ****'... What she based her comments on I'm not sure. Others have questioned 'my decision' to be a woman or suggested I should just 'get over it and stop wanting to change'.

I did expect this to an extent. Not sure if I'm a threat, usurping their birthright, or what...

Guess I'm going to have to start some pushback of my own!! Guess they're going to know what a bitch I can really be!!!

[phylis anne]

not sure what your labor codes are down under but here in the states what these people have done could surely land them in the unemployment line or worse,they truly are ignorant in that it is not just a simple thing to change back to what they want ,for those girls who fully transition it is not done on a lark , not doing it in some cases can be life threatning ,if you truly believe you must be a woman then go for it and the devil with them they do not have to live with the both the mental and emotional pain that comes from needing change tell them to bugger off (LOL) and full change ahead
hugs phylis anne

[stefan37]

Transition is a hell of a thing.

[PretzelGirl]

I tend to be proactive. Journal everything from work and save texts and emails that are aggressive or even microagressions. Hard to remember all the detail later if you need it.

[whowhatwhen]

"don't think you're using my toilets!".

Well that's just rude, but being a spiteful ****er I'd just never flush at that point and make a point to go #2 every day.

[Leah Lynn]

Yes, document and save everything that could constitute harassment.

The CEO of our parent company told me that anytime I feel I'm being harassed about my transitioning, I only need to tell my manager, and said person shall be fired on the spot. If not, I call the CEO's office. Then harasser AND the manager are to be fired. He and I discussed this in a private meeting, then he explained the company's Zero Tolerance policy to the rest of the shop. So far, lots of questions, but not one snide comment.

This should be the standard everywhere.

Leah

[Badtranny]

I think the catalyst was my preparatory steps for shedding the boy at work, changing everything over to Donna.

Things do tend to get real when you come out at work.

Transition is a hell of a thing indeed.

[Robin414]

This is why I don't think I'll transition (instead come to accept I'm a 'tween' and hopefully like it), I think it's better than going to jail on 'twisting a person into a pretzel' charge (yah, I can see a whole new charge made up for me! 😠 )

[Abby Kae]

As mentioned in another thread, I can see turning the tables on the naysayers a little bit. (But since I don't work with adults, take the following with a very large grain of salt - I tend to be much more aggressive than is tolerable.)

"Don't think you're using my toilets!"

"Okay, thanks. Could you send that to me in an email?"

Getting her to think about what she's saying in a trackable medium could very well set her back on her heels as to how absolutely inappropriate it is. "If you're not comfortable saying it electronically, maybe you shouldn't say it out loud either."

I'm sorry that you're getting this type of response. It's nothing short of harassment, and you shouldn't have to deal with it.

[Marcelle]

Hi Donna,

Sorry to read about this turn of events. However, as others have said coming out at work is when things start to get surreal and those who you thought were long time friends . . . meh . . . not so much. I agree with Sue that you need to document everything (especially e-mails . . . it never ceases to amaze me what people will commit to e-mail) and journal any other comments irrespective of how minor they seem. Do you have an HR section and TG policy at work (I can't remember if you said you did or not)? I would approach them first rather than trying to head off some of more direct harassment yourself.

I have been fortunate in that not much has been said to me (no accounting for what is said behind my back though) but there have been incidents akin to what you describe. I deal with the minor ones myself and try to educate the confused soul (if I can). If they don't listen to reason, I remind them of the harassment policy and give them a choice to either act professionally, keep their opinions to themselves or deal with the harassment complaint. If I ever received an e-mail like you did, I would hand that directly to the harassment folks.

The bathroom was a huge sticking point at work for me and there was some backlash but eventually the other women got used to it and realized I was just doing what nature intended . . . going pee. Hopefully the same will happen for you.

Cheers

Marcelle

[stefan37]

No disrespect to your accomplishments Marcelle, but the backseat Donna is receiving is what happens when tank can't be pulled. That's not too say that she won't resolve the issues, but it is much more difficult. In addition if upper level management is not on board. And they can make the work environment not very pleasant. You may be able to go to court and win. But why would you want to continue to work in such an environment.

Just ask those that were in such a situation the energy needing to be expended to have a successful resolution.

It's true transition is expensive and continued employment is desired. Transition also takes a considerable amount of energy. Splitting the tasks needed for transition in addition to the energy needed to survive a hostile work environment can make it very difficult to effect a successful outcome.

[Marcelle]

Hi Stephan,

In many of the instances I mentioned in my own experience I could not pull rank . . . they were either civilians or officers senior in rank to me. Yes rank makes it a bit easier but it is still a difficult fight and not everyone at work agrees with the way I have been accommodated both junior and senior management. My intent was to provide advice that if you are going to fight the fight, then you need to ensure you have the documentation available to go to the appropriate people.

Cheers

Marcelle

[stefan37]

Assuming the appropriate people are on your side.
I know some that had legal on their side. But management wasn't.

Coming out with your employment can get real very fast. That's when you realize the transitioner is serious about living as their target gender.

[mechamoose]

If you do something and experience fear, that shows.

If you do something with confidence, that also shows.

As one with over 20+ years as an IT consultant, I can attest to this. You can have all your sails in tatters but one, and keep pointing out how good that working sail is, people will believe you.

It isn't easy to do, but if you CAN do it, it works.

<3

- MM

[Pat]

Donna -- Sorry to read of your troubles. You've always been one of the folks who seemed to get on swimmingly. But all things in transition (not just gender transition) tend to get a little squirrelly until a new normal is achieved. I hope this is just turbulence. (Although my girlfriend who finished her transition more than a decade ago still has a neighbor who avoids her and pointedly uses her former name when he's forced to speak to her, so some people are irreclaimable.) Be strong, be prudent; you're on the right track.

[DeidraDee63]

Hi Everyone,
I do not post much but will on this one I will add that I support all of you and fully understand and sympathize; we all hit a rough stretch in the road from time to time on this journey. I also have been called a "b***h", I just smile, say thank you, at least I know my hormones are working and continue walking which usually shuts them up, just how I handle it.
I also thank you all for sharing you all have been very helpful to me and others.
Hugs all, Deidra

[Donnagirl]

We need to consider that we are putting a lot of colleagues outside their comfort zone. My behavior is far from perfect, I cannot expect perfection from everyone else.

[Kate T]

Donna
This may sound a little harsh and I dont mean to be judgemental, but as you say in your Tagline "0 to trans in 60 seconds" is probably what many of your work colleagues are thinking. It might be worthwhile considering that your work colleagues need some time and you are likely to have more acceptance if you let them come along on the journey with you. There is a difference between following and being dragged along on that journey. I think you recognise that.
Do you know much of Cate Mcgregors story?? If not I can highly recommend you look up her story, biography and tag appearances including Australian Story.
All that being said there will be some people who you cannot please. If you have to work with them then you may need to negotiate agreed boundaries, and they need to respect those boundaries as much as you do. If the boundaries and respect are continually broken then it is time for mediation and intervention.

[Eryn]

Guess I'm going to have to start some pushback of my own!! Guess they're going to know what a bitch I can really be!!!

Before you do that consider if it will net you a positive result. You don't want to prove your adversary's point!

[Nicole Erin]

Well that's just rude, but being a spiteful ****er I'd just never flush at that point and make a point to go #2 every day.
It would take YOU to come up with something like that.

The problem with doing that is women do not go #2. I mean it just does not happen.

[kathtx]

Did you take the comment "But you look so good as a male, why not stay male at work?" as an insult? I didn't hear it in context and don't know the person who said it, but just reading it as words on a screen I'd take it as clueless, but not intentionally insulting. I'd have responded by trying to educate rather than going into b**** mode.

One of my friends is lesbian but knew little of trans issues. When I came out to her, she said something similar to the comment you got: "You're a good looking man, and you're attracted to women, so why in the world would you want to become a woman?" I was surprised that someone in the LGBT world could be so unaware of what transsexuality is all about, but that's where she was at that time; all of the transpeople she'd met before me were MTFs attracted to men or FTMs attracted to women, so I didn't fit into what she knew. It took some explaining before she got the difference between gender identity and sexual orientation, but she got it.

I think of the comment you got as being similar to that from my friend: ignorant, but without bad intention.

[Rianna Humble]

Comments have varied from, "But you look so good as a male, why not stay male at work?", to the openly hostile, "don't think you're using my toilets!". One former boss and definitely now former friend, over a few texts basically called me 'bitchy' and 'a high maintenance ****'... What she based her comments on I'm not sure. Others have questioned 'my decision' to be a woman or suggested I should just 'get over it and stop wanting to change'.
You definitely need to document all of that and, as I found to my cost, you also need to make a complaint otherwise what you have documented risks being ignored.

I was subjected to low-level harassment by 2 colleagues for 12 months, generally in the form of unfounded complaints against me. In each investigation, I stated that I felt these were motivated by my transition. When they then lumped them all together in a complaint of unprofessional conduct and I pointed out my comments, I was told "you never made a complaint so we will not consider that aspect". Fortunately for me, the person investigating the amalgamated complaint came to the same conclusion as the people who had investigated each complaint separately, but it was not nice being under threat of possible sacking because of this campaign.


This is why I don't think I'll transition
Robin, if the risk of people being nasty to you at work is more important to you than the need to be congruent, then I would say that you do not need to transition at this time.

[PretzelGirl]

First I agree with Rianna. If possible harassment or anything else puts you in the mindset that you won't transition, then you are making a wise decision.

Donna, a clarification on my journalling comment. I wrote everything down (ended up being very little). But my intent was only bringing it to management or HR if it built up. I do think being viewed as trigger happy can work against you too. But if you have to do it, do it with conviction.