Question about semi-accepting (or 'tolerant') wives

[audreyinalbany]

This may be a familiar situation for some: my wife knows about my crossdressing. She's not thrilled about it, but she's come to accept that it's a part of me and, although she doesn't fight it, she doesn't really want to be involved or to see me dressed. There are an awful lot of girls here who want their wives to be their 'girlfriends', to go out together dressed, shopping, dining, clubbing or whatnot, to have their wives help them with make up or to buy them clothes. I've got to say that that's never really been a thing for me. I've very comfortable with the relationship my wife and I have now and am not particularly interested in rocking the boat. I'd love to have a couple of GG girlfriends to go out with for that shopping & dining thing, but don't think my wife necessarily needs to be one of them. Question is: anyone else here feel the same?

[bok4fun]

I think everybody would like to have girlfriends to go do things with. But an accepting SO is the ultimate goal in my opinion.

If if that's not possible, then friends would be the next best thing of course. But friends can present other issues with the SO.

Parish

[ReineD]

I think it just makes it easier when a crossdresser knows that his behaviors do not offend his wife or make her unhappy. Some crossdressers want to go out, and having a "not allowed to see me dressed" policy makes this difficult. But ultimately, I think that couples tend to find a balance that works for them, wherever this may be. I'm glad that you and your wife have found yours.

As to wanting a wife to help with makeup, buy clothes, etc, this tends to be short-lived among crossdressers who do manage to incorporate the crossdressing regularly in their lives. Eventually, the CDer will learn to put on his own makeup and buying clothes either in stores or online (people do figure out their sizes eventually) becomes much easier.

[reb.femme]

My wife accepts what I am and even helps me buying clothes. I can dress at home too, but we have had a recent reset on boundaries, as I was galloping away with 100% girl undies and painted toenails most days. So I've cut back on the days I underdress. I got my ears pierced in return. Sort of quid pro quo.

As to having girlfriends, no chance. I might as well ask for a divorce. It would be great in some ways, but I am heterosexual and it would be beyond the pale for me to ask if it was OK to knock about with GGs. She keeps a blunt set of secateurs for just such requests :heehee:. I would absolutely have reached nirvana if she would just touch me when I'm dressed. I couldn't ask for more from the woman that I love (echoes of Edward VIII and Wallis there).


Becky

[2B Natasha]

I don't get it. Why would you not want your wife to be your best girlfriend and go out and do things with her?

My wife and I do everything together just about.

How could a bunch of other GG ever replace her? Why would you want to replace her?

How much easier and fun is life when you can just shop what you want when you want. With her or without her. Discuss fashion and glamour. Bounce ideas about possible makeup looks.

Why would anybody not desire that? Hiding a piece of your life a way in plane site? If you had the choice of dadt and acceptance. Acceptance should win every time.

Or perhaps it's just me and I love hanging with my wife. I figured that's why I married her so she and I could hang out together as much as possible. But ok from Seattle and perhaps we are different. Well. I know we are different but that's a good thing.

[Teresa]

Audrey,
I have to say that just having a wife that accepts and understands without being too difficult would be ideal. I'm use to shopping for all my needs now and probably enjoy it more without her, I've just been to my first social meeting and was probably more at ease without her, the only thing I would like to be able to do is dress when I chose at home when she is there, it feels so natural now I just can't see the harm especially now my children know.
I don't think my wife would be too happy about me being with GG girlfriends to shop and dine with, she just wouldn't trust me and neither would I !

Natasha does make a good point about the problem of doing it alone or with someone else, you end living totally separate lives, I'm already feeling that now but as a CDer I can't see it changing. The problem is the more it happens the more my wife goes out socially with her female friends.

[prettytoes]

I am in almost the exact same situation, and I couldn't agree more. At first I thought it would be cool for my wife to participate...but as I thought about it I realized that it's really just my thing. I don't feel compelled to go out and share it with the world...I just do it for me. I am able to dress around her with some limitations. My toes are almost always colored, I rarely wear men's underwear, I sleep in women's PJ's or nightie, lounge in yoga pants or capris, and I always have smooth legs and pits. There are only a few who know, and I really like it that way.

[heatherdress]

I don't think many wives would enjoy, allow or understand their husbands having GG girlfriends - regardless of the circumstances. That would include wives who have husbands who crossdress, those who approve and support crossdressing, those who do not approve of crossdressing, and wives whose husbands do not crossdress.

[SHY KIM]

WOW Audrey, That's almost my situation to a T
My wife is a bit more active with "Kim" - will buy something or help teach me make up. I also wear panties, nylons to bed a few nights a week but that's the extent. Clearly stated she doesn't want to seem me dressed though (until I can pass) we'll see. Not sure if I'll ever get things that tuned in BUT- YOU NEVER KNOW - RIGHT?

I would love to have a GG "girlfriend to do those things with too. But like Beck pointed out, a GG friend would very likely lead to some nasty things!!!

[Laura28]

My wife knows about Laura and accepts her,she says she has no problem with me underdressing and even wearing my forms in the house when the kids are not around, she is fine with me sending pictures of Laura all done up, but aggreed to see me once dressed, she was ok with it but isnt something she really wants to see. She buys me things cloths make up etc... encourges me to get other items that i like or show her. But i cant really descreibe it but there is a part of me that wishes she wanted to see me dress especally when i get something new. But i love her and love that she is understanding and perhaps in time she will enjoy seeing Laura more and maybe someday go outwith her, until that time i am thankful for here and wont push it.

[threeheavenshigh]

I think we have a God-given desire to be honest with people. In this corrupt world, honesty is elusive, so we yearn for it. That's why I think a lot of us come here.

To be able to share this adventure with my wife would be amazing. We love one another immensely, and it makes both of us sad that there's such a wired core of me that she cannot abide.

I thought bringing my wife into this would bring us closer, and it has in some ways, but mostly it's just pulled us apart sexually and in our ability to be truthful. I've always been deeply honest with her, but the past few years have ushered in lies. It's to the point where she has been explicit in asking for omitted truths and even outright falsehood. It kills me to say "no, I haven't been dressing." I don't understand how that makes her feel better about anything.

So yeah, I miss those parts of my wife and would love to have them back. I want her to feel secure again.

[S. Lisa Smith]

I consider myself lucky. Although my wife allows me to dress and helps me buy things she doesn't want to see Lisa. So I can dress when she is not around. She has purchased things that I have asked her to get for Lisa, but that's it. I can live with this. I don't want upset her by having GG friends that I do things with. I'd love to go out with her en femme, but that's not going to happen. I can live with that.

[Sara Jessica]

There was a time when I used to wake up daily wondering if it would finally be the day that the love of my life would somehow find the ability to "accept" me more.

Acceptance meant participation back then.

Then after many years of futility (defined by going to sleep every night disappointed in the status quo), I came to realize that this was not to be and it was entirely OK. I have said before that at this point if my wife were to say "I want to go out to ____ with you presenting as a female", I'd probably be so horrified at the thought that I wouldn't do it.

I ended up making many friends in the TG community and actually have one natal female bestie who my wife is fully aware of. She has gone to DLV with me several times and if I say to my wife "hey, I'm going to hang out with Diana...", it is entirely a non-issue. Granted this is a rather unique situation and I'm sure part of the reason she is good with it is because from the time we met, both of us committed to maintaining the friendships we have cultivated over the years. She has a group of amazing friends and there is even a guy who does things with them from time to time. It goes both ways and for us it works out really well.

[NicoleScott]

To answer Nstasha's question "why wouldn't you want your wife to be your best girlfriend and do things together?", there are several reasons.
She is, and we do. And it doesn't require my crossdressing. A good marriage doesn't require that we do everything together, but some couples do and that's good if it works for them. We are different people with different interests in addition to a couple with common interests. If my wife was into square dancing (she's not) and made a similar statement ("why wouldn't you want to be my square dance partner?") where do I begin? I'm sorry, dear, but the joy of spending time with you doesn't trump all the reasons I don't want to square dance.
If she is into being your girlfriend, then it works for you. Many accepting or tolerant wives want her partner to be a man, however, and don't want a husband for a girlfriend or vice versa. So the answer to "why wouldn't you want......." is "because she doesn't want......"
For many (most?) of us, crossdressing is personal. Does the happiness, comfort, satisfaction, etc. we get from crossdressing require the participation of others?

[Rachel32533]

Well said Nicole! I am with you.

[jenniferinsf]

My wife is accepting and I dress at home. She encourages me to go to cd events but does not want to go.

We go the movies and ballet etc with me dressed.

Like many others, my life is with her, so I have only been to a couple of cd events. They were fun but if all you have in common is dressing up and makeup it feels, to me, less than fulfilling.

[Stephanie47]

Audry, that's my situation also. I would love to have a truly accepting wife who would feel comfortable with me dressing at home. I really do not need to venture out as a couple. Cross dressing is a private affair with me. I wish I could share my total being with her, but, I do understand her reasons for not wanting any of it. It's DADT. I really mean DADT. She never says a word. She never makes a comment about the issue when it is in the media. She has no idea of the extent of my wardrobe. As to having a GG friend to go shopping..no. I do not pass. I would like to have the opportunity to be involved with a local group of mature CD women. More than thirty years ago my wife suggested I join a support group, but, back then there was none. Now, the groups I hear of seem to be for younger women and not mature women of my age.

[2B Natasha]

Nichole scott and Rachel32533. You are both telling me that getting your girl side on is SO PROVATE and insulated. That you would actively shun your wife for being part of it. Huh. Interesting.

See. I don't believe that. Even from you two. It's a rouse to make you feel better about your situation. Equating square dancing and expressing who you are, are really apples and tomatoes. That she doesn't want to is an I different issue all together. Make due with your situation is also different situation.

That a wife wants a MANLY MAN for a husband is her prerogative. Don't care. She's not my wife.

Just so we are clear here. I do not call my wife my girlfriend when we are out in the town. She is my wife. She's my wife when we shop. When we dine. When we go the theatre. At the coat check and everywhere else we go. She's is proud to call me her husband and I'm proud to call her my wife.

And by the way. There are lots of things I do with her that I am a not particularly fond of. But she is. So I do them because it makes her happy. And that is the important stuff in his life.

[shawnsheila]

I would die and go to heaven if my wife want to to be gal pals... I feel like that would bring us to the ultimate closeness in our relationship... right now, me being TG is kind of a wedge where she tolerates it to keep a "normal life" for our family. My dream date would be just one weekend get away where we go out for just one evening and paint the town red as girls... I've told her this and she said she was not ready for that...

Maybe someday

[laurenp245]

Audrey, while I can see where you are coming from I don't think anyone in a committed relationship would be exactly thrilled at the idea of their SO having friends they are going to go out with without being invited along. From what you've written, it seems as if your wife is absolutely dead set against participating in anything regarding your crossdressing. That puts you in a tough spot for sure, especially wanting to get out and about into the world.

Despite the fact she doesn't want to be involved, she does need to know that having a group of friends to go shopping, dining, movies, etc. with is important to you. In my opinion, there isn't anything at all wrong with having a group of gals to go out with, whether they are accepting GG's or other CD's. Having a good group of friends is a wonderful and necessary thing for sure, but your wife needs to be aware of them and have the option to "opt out" before you do. Even if she decides not to participate and is still totally against the idea of you doing it, think long and hard about it before you do... as much fun as it would be to have a group of gals to go out with, having an at least somewhat tolerant wife is a thousand times more valuable. Doing it anyway could seriously jeopardize that.

<3 Lauren

[NicoleScott]

Natasha, nothing I said was a criticism of the relationship between you and your wife. I said (twice) that if it works for you, great. I was answering the question you posed "why wouldn't you want your wife to be your best girlfriend.....", and it's because we would respect her not wanting such a relationship. As for "actively shun your wife", you made that up. Using square dancing as an example is not equating it to crossdressing. Geez. Where do you get this stuff? Finally, for many of us (that means some, maybe a few, maybe a lot, but not all) crossdressing is a personal and private response to a personal internal drive that does not require the participation of others. For those who have a willing participating partner, good for you. Go for it.
You asked a question, I answered.

[Tina_gm]

I am thinking that for the majority of us, who would like our wives to participate, but they don't, the reason for us wanting that ultimately is someone, especially the one closest to us accepting every single bit of us. Tolerance- tolerating, is what people do when they want something else, or more, but "tolerate" something that isn't to their liking. Work, we tolerate it because we get paid.

Our S/O's who "tolerate" do so because of the other qualities we bring them. It is a situation that a majority of CDers face, and have to learn to accept, myself included. CDers who divulge the CDing later on are most typically the reason for the tolerance situation in the 1st place. Again, myself included. While there are definitely relationships with wives or other LTR's who found out much later on after a commitment was formed, and grew to not just tolerate, but truly love the CDing aspect of their partner. They either enjoy it, or at the very least do not mind it at all. Generally, we find that situation of a relationship is one where the CDing was known fairly early on and the relationship grew with it, not be learned about and dealt with much later on. Again, not that the early on ones are free from challenge or difficulty, or that the later on ones haven't in some cases grown into the more than tolerance. It is just the majority of the early on's have less struggle than the later on ones do.

We the CDers want to be loved, not just despite our differences, but that those differences are part of what is loved. All to often, and a big reason for discussion boards like this, is because the reality is for many of us, we are loved despite it, and the love is worked around it. It is better than not being loved at all though, which we usually realize, and deal as best we can with our given situation.

[ChristinaK]

I tried the GG thing and, no, my wife didn't like it a bit. Nope. Nada, nicht. Didn't go over well AT ALL.

However, I do wish SO bad that I could go out with my wife. It would be the ultimate and would most likely be a lot of fun if she could accept Christina. We would bond in a way we never have. I have fantasized about it, but there is no way she would EVER do that and has zero desire to see me dressed, although I used to wear nightgowns to bed and she tolerated that for quite a while. Now it's panties and women's PJ's, but at least she tolerates a little.

[Sara Jessica]

Nichole scott and Rachel32533. You are both telling me that getting your girl side on is SO PROVATE and insulated. That you would actively shun your wife for being part of it. Huh. Interesting.

See. I don't believe that. Even from you two. It's a rouse to make you feel better about your situation...

Do you believe me? I said something very similar.

And mine is no rouse to make me feel better about my situation. Fact of the matter is that many women, perhaps most, don't have it in them to embrace having a TG/CD significant other. They aren't wired that way, whether biology or societal it doesn't matter. And those women who cannot or will not be gal-pals with a TG/CD SO are not to be criticized as it is not their fault, just as it is not our fault that we are the way we are.

Mine is a Venn Diagram where there is just enough overlap with just enough communication to keep things positive. At this point I don't think I'd have it any other way.


I would die and go to heaven if my wife want to to be gal pals... I feel like that would bring us to the ultimate closeness in our relationship... right now, me being TG is kind of a wedge where she tolerates it to keep a "normal life" for our family. My dream date would be just one weekend get away where we go out for just one evening and paint the town red as girls... I've told her this and she said she was not ready for that...

Maybe someday

Be careful what you wish for. Even with my friend Diana, I find that I am hyper-sensitive to the reactions of others where I don't feel the same way when alone or out with other TG friends. This is because I find myself feeling like I'm not measuring up, like I'm somehow letting her down by being perceived as trans. And although she has told me this is silly, it is hard to overcome. Yet it does not and will not stop me from hanging out with her. She is way too important to me as a friend to think otherwise.

I have heard it can be difficult for SO's to witness any form of disrespect aimed at their spouse should the TG thing be perceived by others. Discussion as to how to handle those situations would be important beforehand. As adorable as you are Sheila, there aren't many of us who can navigate the outside world with the Muggles being completely oblivious to our TG being.

[2B Natasha]

No Sara Jessica.

I don't believe you either. I don't believe you that you wouldn't welcome the chance to just be the two of you. Which ever gender you wanted to present as. If your SO was genuinely all in. You would go with it and be super glad she was. I don't believe it from anybody unless they are a total recluse. And if they where. They wouldn't be here. I just don't. Because if you don't want. Your SO to participate in your activities why are you together? Did those wedding. Owe mean nothing to you?

That you don't feel like you measure up. Well that is a different subject all together. I was t aware of any litmus test regarding your TG status. Do you take that before you go out or while your out? ( tongue firmly planted in cheek )

[Sara Jessica]

There's the difference. I have many years invested in a wildly successful relationship. Though evolution over time, I have come to understand that my bride, the love of my life, is no less of a wife, partner or woman just because she doesn't wish to run around town with her husband presenting as a female. Yours is into that...hey, that's great. I do not begrudge (nor envy, I have outgrown that as I have stated previously) such situations but at the same time, I find it highly offensive that anyone would be so dismissive of a situation such as mine, or Nicole's, or Rachel's.

[lingerieLiz]

I'm lucky in that I have a not in favorite but tolerating wife. Even more we have had gg friends that enjoy shopping with the both of us. It was fun to go shopping with them and openly purchase fem clothes including lingerie. I always went in drab style women's clothes as a guy. I had one gg friend when my wife was away that I shopped with a few times. She was a close friend of my wife and certainly no threat.

[2B Natasha]

Sara

You can be how ever you want to be. You go for it. I feel the same as you. Totally misunderstood as to what I was getting at.

So go on and feel insulted. It's an illusion of a free world.

[Sara Jessica]

Sorry Natasha, your reply couldn't be any more condescending. What part of this statement am I misunderstanding?


See. I don't believe that. Even from you two. It's a rouse to make you feel better about your situation.

The reason this offends me is because just as this site features a cross-section in terms of how people express and manage their TG/CD nature, our SO's also represent a spectrum when it comes to their level of understanding, tolerance and/or acceptance.

OP presents a premise that several of us happen to align with. Your reply is entirely dismissive of our situations. The strength of our SO's and our respective relationships is not measured by their level of acceptance. My involvement in this discussion is to share with others that it is OK to keep things separate if our SO doesn't wish to be an active participant in this part of our lives, that a relationship can be strong in this situation (caveat that there be open & honest communication).

[Katey888]

----#### MODERATOR MESSAGE ####----

Back on track please everyone... :spank:

The relevant part of the OP was:


(I'm) very comfortable with the relationship my wife and I have now and am not particularly interested in rocking the boat. I'd love to have a couple of GG girlfriends to go out with for that shopping & dining thing, but don't think my wife necessarily needs to be one of them. Question is: anyone else here feel the same?

Clearly, some do, and some don't. Those of you that can't grasp that others may have a valid opinion that is different to yours, and the OP's, are not going to derail this by just shouting your opinion over and over again...

Keep to the OP please. If you don't feel the same as the OP, just say no and explain why - ONCE... :)

Katey
Moderator

[Beverley Sims]

When I was single, girlfriends were fine, being married changes the scene somewhat, the only women I associate with are those that are friends of my wife also.

Clandestine meetings are not needed if you have an open relationship. They will occur naturally and with trust.

[michelleddg]

A theme and so many variations. Here's mine:

o Wife and I had the talk before we got engaged. She closed with "do what you need to do but I don't want to know".

o 30 years of DADT followed with the elephant in the room growing from a cub to full size.

o Wife totally out of the blue wanted to know what this was all about. First extended discussion in 30 years, and for the first time ever I asked if she wanted to be involved. She said that might be possible but not in Houston where she is widely known. I proposed a Las Vegas get away, and she accepted.

o Las Vegas get away! We did spa days, meals out, roaming the Strip and Fremont Street. She was a total angel. Photos, critiques, discussions. Just wonderful. My hopes were definitely increased that a new dimension was being added to our relationship.

o A year later I proposed another get away. "No, that's your thing. You do what you need to do, but I don't want to be involved." So, I went, and we were in constant contact on non-CD related activities (where I went, what I saw, what I ate) but when I so much as offered to text a photo the response was noooooooooo...

o Which brings us to this year. What has become an annual outing is all teed up for next month. I offered her to come along but she flat out is not interested.

Yeah, I would love having my wife as an occasional gal pal but she's set her boundaries and it's not happening. I'm good with it, I think she's generous with what she tolerates, and we move forward with all the incredible stuff that constitutes our trip through life together.

Hugs, Michelle

[2B Natasha]

To those it may concern. Sara Jessica, et al.

After a long convo with my wife. We hashed out that there can be people who actually like to do the femme thing alone.

Still can't say that I understand but there is enough room for everyone and it is not my right to sit in judgement any more then it is anyone else's.

I hope you all are leading the happiest life you can and the life you want

Cheers

[MissTee]

My wife is supportive and accepting, and we often shop together. I do not go out dressed (my choice) but often do at home when we are together. That said, she would not be accepting of me having GG "friends" to go shopping with. She is a rather territorial lady in respects to me hanging out with other GG's (while she's not present) for any reason.

[BettyMorgan]

I have an understanding SO who I live with. I wear vintage slips to bed most nights. We share a large closet where she sees all my dresses, etc. but she doesn't want to see me in a dress with wig, full makeup and breast forms. And I understand why. She has been supportive and understanding since I came out to her and I would love to sit around the house in a dress but I won't push it. She is my GG on her terms and that's fine with me. And I know things will change as she becomes more supportive, she realizes how crossdressing is a big part of who I am.


Bottom line is I would love to go out dressed with her.

[Claire Cook]

Katey,

Thanks for getting this discussion on track. So to address the OP: Yes, I have GG friends that I go out with, usually when Sue or I are apart on business trips -- but these are GG friends that the two girls would go out with normally. No matter what I am wearing, Sue is my first choice. True, most of the time I'm in guy mode, but there are those times when the girls just have to do something together -- like getting our nails done, or shopping.

Then as to the rest of this thread: IMHO, no two of us have exactly the same relationship with our wives / GF's, and we have to appreciate that what works for some won't work for others.