Somewhere in the middle

[Tina_gm]

Hi everyone. Not any new development of myself, more of a gradual understanding really. My CDing itself isn't taking on any new dimensions. I am never desperate to dress. I never get depressed when I don't, or when I change back to men's clothing. But, nor do I ever feel a need for me to not dress, or change back either.

Dressing for me is never about any thrill. I don't get anything sexual from it. I don't become anyone different, or go into some other space in my head. It just feels comfortable, relaxing and natural when I do. To this day, I do not have any other name than my own. No female name attached to me.

I do get frustrated sometimes being a man and not a woman. I often feel I relate to women better than men. I sometimes do check the TS section and once in a while do make an occasional post, but there is not really where I feel I am most aligned to either.

I never actually get a feeling of "I am a woman." For me, it is more like I am more like them, at times. But so too at times, it will evaporate. I love to play golf. When I do, I am all guy on the golf course. I like to hit from the back tees. Hit it long, play aggressively. When I am playing golf, it is like TG doesn't exist for me. Most often too when I am with my kids. Sometimes too at work. (not always though)

Where some on here have goals to achieve, or pursue or be able to be more feminine, I do not. Femininity in as far as mannerisms all comes natural to me. I have to practice nothing at all. When I am at work or in other social situations, I have to sometimes work to keep those mannerisms hidden. At least not so obvious anyway. Sometimes it sneaks out, and I have heard occasional comments through my life.

While over time, I am coming to accept myself more, and be more comfortable with myself, the femininity seems to show itself more. But- my desire to dress seems to not increase either. If anything, I feel less of a desire?? I feel more comfortable than ever when dressed, but whereas when I made the initial plunge to self acceptance and allowed myself to dress, I remember going home from work and it would be the 1st thing I would do. Or if my wife would be gone to her sisters or friends. She would be pulling out of the driveway and I was already upstairs changing. Now, I do not get that type of feeling. But again as I said, when I am dressed, I am more comfortable now than ever before.

I guess I am just somewhere in the middle in the whole gender spectrum. Wearing male clothing does not bother me.... but NOT wearing female clothing sometimes does, if that makes any sense at all, because TBH, it doesn't for me. How can I be not bothered to be dressed as a male but be bothered to not be dressed as a female??

Either gender pronoun seems to equally fit me. Describe me as she, or he, and neither feels wrong. I am not in a state of crisis or turmoil.... but, so often though, the masculine and feminine aspects of myself sometimes do collide in ways. My nails are definitely borderline girl length. When they get long, I like it, but I don't like it. Make sense yet? or is anyone reading this have their head spinning as mine often does lol. I feel great when I shave my body, but then sometimes get a feeling like I am going to grow the hair back (I never do though) but it is almost like there are moments when I miss it. Yet, a few days of stubble on my chest or legs will drive me insane. I feel a sense of relief when I feel only smooth skin....

Anyway, I have no goals, no destination other than peace and happiness. Perhaps this place in the middle, or both is really where I need to be. I have no plans to go further, dress more, or less, feel any more or less of anything. I never really have. I am just slowly accepting myself for myself, and find myself more and more somewhere in the middle between male and female.

[sometimes_miss]

Okay. Sounds reasonable.

[Tina_gm]

I guess I am wondering how many others relate to this? I probably should have added that in the OP.

[Georgette_USA]

I can understand some of your story. I just don't identify with it. I am glad that you can accept both your sides.

When young <19 and at home. My parents did not believe in tight gender roles. My 3 brothers and I shared in all the chores. All my fathers yard work and things like wallboard and painting in the house. We did a lot of my mothers work also. Dishes - some baking - housecleaning. And later when my sister came along we helped with her, feeding - taking her on excursions in the neighborhood - some washing till she got older - mom still did the main diapers with pins and all. My mother wanted us to be independent and not have to rely on someone else.

In school would get bullied sometimes called sissy. Even driven to fight and than said to fight like a girl. I'm not sure what would prompt this as I didn't think I projected that.

One of the things that I argue with others are on these male activity things. Cannot a woman also play golf aggressive. We all learn to do different things in life, why do we need to call them male or female things. The only male/female thing is sex for pro-creation. Since woman can't create sperm on their own.

[pamela7]

i totally understand this, GM, tho i have factors which take me across the divide. A woman can also enjoy playing golf, physical power play as well. Your natural body-gesture femininity is something i also share, i get that. A person who can be comfortable as a feminine spirit in a male body is a rare and special being, able to flow wherever the situation desires. No reason to change, enjoy the experience! xx

[AllieSF]

I can relate to just about everything you have written. I am a late starter (2006) for this totally other side of me and my presentation of that. I love it and am very comfortable with myself with all of this. It all came to me like a perfect storm compared to what others have lived through and continue to live with on this site. I am mature (read old), single, had a successful battle with prostate cancer, live alone and retired. I have no one to answer to in my immediate house except myself and my cat, who thankfully accepts me totally! I am in the closet with my friends and family (no need to come out right now), and out to the world in general and go and do what I want as Allie when I want. However, I am starting to wonder if there is more to come?

PS: Yes, women can be aggressive in sports, including golf. I think it was a way for GM to say that she still has some of her old male identified self traits as she expresses them, and I believe that she also knows that many woman have those same traits.

[Tina_gm]

Pam7, I know there are women who play golf, I follow it pretty intensely and even a little of the LPGA. While they, and other female athletes do use physical power to achieve success, the mindset of the average woman IS typically different. What I am talking about is the domination factor here. Other than me being a 7 hdcp golfer, I have a somewhat Tiger Woods mentality when I play. I don't just want to win, I want to stomp my opponent into the ground lol. I do lose with grace though, I promise I am not a sore loser. Not outwardly anyway lol.

As for the ending compliment, thank you, although it is a frustrating way to be often times. There have been times I have thought to myself just pick a gender already IDC which one.

[Allisa]

I hear ya GM. That's why I say I'm gender fluid.

[JustWendy]

I can relate to much of what you say in your post, gendermutt. You are not alone. One difference, I do have a female name :o

Wendy

[Tina_gm]

I can sometimes relate to that term, but not always. When I play golf is just an example of when I am not feeling the feminine presence. Dual gender maybe for me, if there is a difference. Sometimes if flows evenly, sometimes it is more dominant on either side. It doesn't have a whole lot of pattern to it, other than golf and my kids. That is when TG for me seems to disappear, not the only times, but definitely those times. Other times, very random. Sometimes I am quite frustrated to not be a woman or at least dressed as one. Other times, I don't feel that way so much. And it seems to have little pattern to it.

[Tracii G]

I get where you are coming from GM.
In regard to myself I am more female than male and that is my normal mindset.I do have to hide my mannerisms around certain friends and continually watch how I react to things they say.

[Tina_gm]

Wendy, I have thought about a name, thought about a whole lot of them actually. I just can't seem to find one that makes me think or feel aha. So I just gave up trying.

[JustWendy]

GM, I went decades without even thinking about a name. But there were a couple of changes in my life about 8 years ago, I became more focused on my gender identity, I started thinking about what I would have liked to have been named if I had been born female. A couple of months before I joined this forum, it just came to me, and I knew it fit. Yours may sneak up on you the same way.

Wendy

[Dana44]

Gendermutt, That is like gender fluid definition. The only difference is the dysphoria is more present in us. But we have no goals or destination. Just to enjoy life and I think we are richer for it. Now on golf, we did go as girls on a golf outing at the Diva Las Vegas event. Every one of them said it was a blast being feminine out there on the course. We gender fluids are in the middle also.

[cdlove]

The Middle Is Where I Live And Where My War Starts.

I would agree that I relate somewhat to Gendermutt in terms of feeling like I lie in the middle of the TG spectrum. As I have mentioned before I don’t recognize myself as either male or female but rather in the middle. What Gendermutt is referring to could also be considered gender identification/fluidity on the spectrum. I have no desire to go through the transition to be a full blown women, and I am not a man’s man by any means. I relate more to the female side of things but can do the things that you would view as the full blown male task.

I can fix cars, do plumbing, etc. I can also tell you how to properly wear a bra what heels go with what, what line is in and such just as a woman would be able to do. I consider myself in the middle. I am not into sports the way the normal guys’ guy is I’d rather watch and follow Olympic sports. I love things with lace and in the color pink along with it being very feminine in dress, yet I also love a nice suit. I don’t possess anything that would make you think I have a very Fem side. I would have to work very hard to have female mannerisms other than my views from the outside I look like your normal guy.

The middle is where I live but it is also an area that causes me a mental war with myself because of my lack of acceptance that it’s ok to slide on the spectrum. So for me the middle is my life but it’s also a constant mental war that seems to not have a clear ending.

If you would like to read my blog where I dive into the question regarding the difference between cd and tg you can find it here: http://knockknockdepression.blogspot.com/

[audreyinalbany]

I'm with you 100%, GM. I have zero interest in transitioning, I like being a guy, but feel I relate way more to women. To me,it's a pretty good balance.I'm not all torn up about being a cd er, I've come to peace with it, but what Ido doesn't define who I am. I'm just a fella that likes to dress up like a gal from time to time.

[PattyT]

You do seem to be in the middle and have come to terms with this. It just shows that the whole CD phenomenon has a variety of aspects and being in the middle is one. I have always felt that there is a range of the CD phenomenon, going from the low key, part time CD, who dresses in closet is a few female items all the way to the very hard core CD who dresses every day. There is a huge variety of intermediate types. You are obviously a CD and fall somewhere in the middle. Nothing odd or wrong about that.

[ReineD]

Congratulations! You’ve achieved balance, which I dare say describes many other folks here including my SO. :)

But one thing I’d like to ask about:



Femininity in as far as mannerisms all comes natural to me. I have to practice nothing at all. When I am at work or in other social situations, I have to sometimes work to keep those mannerisms hidden. At least not so obvious anyway.

What feminine mannerisms, specifically?

I’ve read this many times here and it has always puzzled me. The differences I’ve observed between the average male or female are those related to how they’re actually built. Women generally have wider hips and therefore have a different center of balance than men, and so they walk differently. Men and women have different voices, different average heights, shoulder and head widths, different upper body strengths, etc, all due to their physical differences caused by their respective sex hormones. This makes sense. But differences in feminine and masculine mannerisms that are not accounted for by physical differences? I honestly cannot see any.

So I googled. An example I found is a pop culture article listing 5 ways that men and women behave differently in restaurants. Turns out they’re all stereotypes and they don’t apply to the people I observe around me every day. I’ll quickly tackle them one by one, just to show the difference between pop culture and reality:

http://www.marieclaire.com/sex-love/a4250/conversational-skills-gender-differences/

1) Women take longer to say goodbye. Does this mean that if my brother lingers to talk to an old friend for awhile, I’ll think he is acting in a feminine manner? Nonsense.

2) Women want to know what everyone is ordering. More nonsense. If a male friend wants to know what I’m having, I won’t think this is a feminine question. I’ll take it he is having difficulty making up his mind. Often, couples on purpose order two different things so they can each have a taste of the other. You cover more menu ground that way.

3) Women always want to try other people’s food. More nonsense. Wanting to try other people’s food relates to an interest in food and how it is prepared. Lots of guys are into cooking and when my son asks if he can try my sauce, I don’t think he is being effeminate. Also, if it’s a restaurant that people plan on returning to, it’s a good way to gauge whether or not you might want to order the other dish next time.

4) Women touch other people more. Really? I have a solid network of female friends and I can honestly say that we don’t touch each other during conversations. We’ll greet each other hello and goodbye by touching, but men do the same thing. And lots of men hug goodbye too.

5) The sexual element thing. This is true … there is more sexual tension between people who are potentially attracted to each other than between people who are not. But this is not a gendered difference … they do say, between a hetero, gay, and lesbian couples.

I'm not saying you're referring to these specific things, I only used them as examples. But, are you sure that others think you have female mannerisms, or do you just think you do based on pop culture or stereotypes. I’m not wanting to attack you, I truly am puzzled by all of this because I see around me every day a wide range of manners from both men and women, most that overlap, and none that generally make me believe that a particular woman is behaving suspiciously more like a man or a man is behaving suspiciously more like a woman. There is simply too wide a range of mannerisms among both males and females; their respective bell curves do overlap to a greater degree than they don’t.

[Mayo]

I think society gets too hung up people on being one or the other gender because non-binary folks don't fit well in our convenient mental boxes. It's a form of erasure, like bisexual erasure - people want you to pick one gender (or orientation) and stick with it so they can slap the associated labels and stereotypes on you and not have to think about things beyond that. Hopefully this will change.

[Tina_gm]

Hi again, and thanks for the replies. I would not suggest any congratulations of balance though, as IT is at times a struggle and always will be. Not in achieving it, because I think even from the very start of my journey of acceptance and me allowing myself to CD, which began about 3 and a half years ago I had balance. It is living with it. Dealing with it.

ReineD- as for the mannerisms I speak of, just everyday typical movements along with many thought patterns and some reactions. I would like to say 1st before I give my examples is that I wish many more people would view the world as you do, and not be so hypercritical of the perceived gender differences. Unfortunately, for a great many people both male and female, they do over scrutinize gender and its differences and what men and women are "supposed" to be.

Mannerisms I speak of, gosh just about anything I do really. It tends to have a feminine characteristic to it. hand gestures seem to be where it shows up a lot. I have even been told by a former GF that I smoke like a girl. (and you are probably thinking how does one smoke in a gender specific way) and that is sort of the point that I am making, many people will pick anything and attach a gender label to it. The way I waive, sit, stand, walk (to a certain degree) I do not have the hip waggle, but I have a smoother glide like gait than most men do. My gait has been described as graceful, which personally I feel is a compliment, but in today's hyper gender labeling world, and for most guys nowadays, it is an insult.

Women tend to talk more with their hands. They are more expressive with communication, which I certainly have a lot of. Besides hand gesture, women tend to be more facially expressive, and generally in a warmer way. More eye contact, nodding, or a head bob to the side.

While I am a leg crosser, and I feel that something like that has been robbed of younger men (it'd damn comfortable) I do not personally see it as a feminine trait, but in today's hyper gender world, it now is, and we have had several threads on here about leg crossing. Look at any older movie and guys routinely crossed their legs at the knee, even Sean Connery while playing Bond did so. Watch in person or on any show or movie any younger male characters or younger males in public and see how many cross their leg at the knee. You won't find many, although many men above age 40 still do, as in their time it wasn't considered to be feminine.

I also have a knack for a lot of talking, chatting in a way that would be more typical of women than men. Men tend to talk in a more brief less expressive colorful way. My wife has said that once while she was at work, at lunch actually I think, but I was talking to her and she had me on speaker phone and a co-worker made a comment about me being very chatty, like a girl.

I am glad you do not view these things to be so dramatic. I really wish a lot more people had this it ain't no big thing attitude. unfortunately, we who have feminine traits deal with a lot of society who view us negatively because of it. I do make a bit of an effort to keep these toned down a bit when I am at work, or with friends. I used to be very conscious of it. Now, eh, I am sort of not being so over cautious of it. It can be stressful. I guess in a way I am mildly allowing people to view me as "not manly" even though today, and with all of the supposed gender variance acceptance, I really feel there is more emphasis for guys to be "masculine" than there has ever been.

[mykell]

DohRa9lsx0Q


so after your examples i must be more feminine also, im a total chatterbox, i talk with my hands, and although i cross at the knee when dressed i dont tend to do so when male, but unlike you some seemed to learn of my secret when i was young (not as skilled at hiding it as thought) and it has followed me through life, so yes some folks made some remarks.

one thing i must admit is when cleaning up leaves in the fall i almost always catch myself with my arm to the side with the leaf-blower cord like my grandma when she vacuumed.

[Tina_gm]

hahaha Mikell, girly girl. Actually, my theory for us to have these feminine traits is two fold. One- is that we generally have a stronger connection to women, so their mannerisms wear off on us more. We see women do things a certain way and subconsciously emulate that. Secondly though is the hyper masculinity of recent times. Guys now for whatever reason, seem to be distinguishing themselves. I had written a post about it a while back. But I am seeing this more and more. Got to have a big bushy beard. Got to drive a truck, can't be crossing your legs or in any way appear to be feminine, period. I was just outside having a smoke and saw yet another guy.... more and more of it. He was walking, the beard, overalls.... manly man.... at first I thought I spotted sasquash. I mean this guy had a gait that was so lumbering and awkward looking. Either I am just realizing how fem I really am, or more and more, guys are becoming hyper masculine to prove to the world they are not TG.

[ReineD]

Oh ... you're talking about The Male Code? That's different. My son brought home a photocopy years and years ago, about 40 things that males do not do. Like share umbrellas or watch chick flicks. Must wear beard. Must drive truck. We had a good laugh.

Here's one of the versions: http://www.oocities.org/moore_brandon_54601/malecode.htm

Truth is though, as men get past their younger years and become more secure in themselves (less afraid of being branded a sissy?), The Code ceases to apply. Maybe it does continue in some male demographics, for example (and generally speaking) rural vs urban males? I cannot imagine two of my sons getting caught in a downpour and refusing to share the umbrella. Even so, among the male demographic that might believe in The Code well into their adulthood, I don't think that "sissy" has the same meaning as "feminine"?

If I have it all wrong, then I apologize. Men don't tend to show their homophobia in front of women as much as they might among themselves, so I have not been exposed to the same ultra-macho attitudes that you might have. But yes, I agree, if some of the ways you behave might be construed as "gay" by some rather narrow-minded men, I understand why you might not want to give that impression.

If you believe that The Code is gaining in importance among some males, then I dunno ... sometimes I think this country is going backwards. When I've gone to Europe I've seen lots of men hug, use bags, well groomed, enjoy a variety of the niceties of life, etc, without fearing that others might think them sissy.

Edit - Gosh, sorry Gendermutt, sometimes not all posts immediately appear when I've logged out and log back in and I am just now seeing your post #20. I don't mean to minimize what you're saying, but I observe a lot of detail and I've lived in many different places in both Canada and the US, in small towns and large cities. I've also travelled outside the continent quite a bit. There are indeed men who talk with their hands without people believing they are feminine. Sitting? Men cross their legs too. Expressive and animated? This again is not the sole domain of women. Maybe women do this more, but there is still tons of overlap between men and women. Same with eye contact, in fact I'd say a lot of men enjoy making eye contact. :) If you have wider hips than most males and this affects the way you walk, then you're just being true to how you're built. As to being a chatterbox, you should meet my youngest son. lol. None of these things would scream out "Oh look, this man is feminine". But, we all do perceive the world differently and since you believe that men and women behave in distinctly different ways with little overlap, then so be it. But I would like to encourage you to stop splitting yourself up into behaviors that you deem appropriate for male and female modes, and just be yourself.

When I first met my SO, he had a lot of gendered beliefs, for example that it was feminine to want to dance and enjoy art, and more masculine to be stoic and logical. (The particular ways that people gender things are different for everyone). But, this is not the case any more and I'm glad.

... I'd also like to point out that lots of women don't talk with their hands, do not have animated expressions, shy away from direct eye contact, etc ...)

[Nikkilovesdresses]

I'd love to see what would happen if you played golf en femme. Who knows? You might just hole in one.

For some reason that sounds indecent...

[NewBrendaLee]

When I get a chance to dress its not a sexual thing for me its who I am. I have to keep my mannerisms in check too. Actually I am more interested in female things than male activities. At times I wish that I was born female

[Tina_gm]

Reined- you are correct about Europe. I was stationed in Germany for 3 years back in the 80's and there was no where near the type of concern over appearing feminine or being perceived as gay. In fact, it was harder for me to tell a gay person from a straight person over there. In my ignorant youth, I figured there were just a lot more Euro gay men than here in the good ol U.S of A.

I at the time being largely scared to death of myself did everything I could to rid myself of these weird feelings. Denial so deep it cannot be properly put into words. I agree as well, urban vs. rural, you will definitely see it more. I have been to NYC enough times to see the differences, along with many other large cities, but due to my local, I use NYC as just the best example. Lots of well groomed business types. They don't look like or act like a somewhat evolved sasquash. BUT, where I am living now, I grew up. And, it has changed significantly. I asked my wife (she grew up here too) and even she said yes, definitely not what it used to be. Sorry for the term, but redneck just fits here. This is a city, not a particularly large one, but a city nonetheless, and you would think we were somewhere deep in Alabama.

I really have no problem about a guy who really is just the type who likes to be or is the lumberjack whatever type. The male version of a barbie girl. But, the male code, not using an umbrella and all of the other men do not.... yes, it lessens over times somewhat, but it has gotten to be so much more restrictive IMO. When I was in my late teens and early 20's, guys would dance. a lot of us would. In the service no less. I have on a few occasions picked up my step kids from downtown and now, very few guys are anywhere near the dance floor. Now, I am not saying ALL by any means, maybe not even half, but the number of guys who seem hellbent on being hyper masculine seems to be increasing by the day, at least around my area.

As for myself, I am somewhat cautious about how I am, among friends and at work, because they know me as they know me. When I am alone and not in a place where people really know me, I really could care less what people think of me, gay, fem, sissy whatever. I used to though. My most natural way of being I think is still not overly feminine. By today's standards probably more so than before.

Edit Reine- now I have to edit for your edit lol. I actually am not a strict believer in what a male should or should not be. Or that in reality there is this large canyon of divide between the genders. Not my personal belief anyway, but at least in much of the U.S. there seems to be an ever increasing divide now. As for the mannerisms, yes, both M and F do use their hands, females tend to be MORE expressive, and in a different manner. Generally speaking. That there ARE those that don't, or men that do, yes of course. but I am talking about the averages, the majority here. Like, most women wave differently than men do. More of an up and down with their fingers wave. Guys tend to wave side to side without moving their fingers. Small subtleties is what I am talking about. Stuff that you do not think much of, and again, I am grateful that you do not and wish more were like you.

Nikki- dressed fem or not, I would still have to clean my balls.....

[ReineD]

Gendermutt, again please just be yourself. You seem like a really nice person and I'm sure you have the love and respect of a lot of people. Honestly, it won't matter if you cross your legs, give in to your animated expressions, wave your hand the way you wave, etc. People will not think less of you. In fact, they might begin to perceive you as being more relaxed? When people make a concerted effort to alter the way they behave naturally, it shows. They just look uptight.

So we agree that the behaviors you describe are shared among both men and women? Trust that your friends have a wider frame of reference than you might believe and ultimately you are to them a friend or well-liked coworker more than a collection of either male or female stereotypical behaviors they are waiting to pounce on. :)

[Tina_gm]

Thank you Reine- I am working on it, being myself. For so many years, feeling I had to hide or be something other than who I am or how I feel natural. I think generally of most of my peers, they already understand I am not the most masculine of men. My days of drastic over compensation are over. Still though there is some, not so much a real change of how I am naturally, it is more of a subdued amount of that which is perceived as being feminine traits. I think too, my geographic area is being much harder hit than other areas, for whatever reason. Socio economics may play a part in this. I do think though that there is a trend of the modern man to be more masculine in appearance and manner of behavior in the USA. I personally do not even see it as more masculine, just more un-kept and uncouth. It looks more sloppy to me than masculine. I come from an era where men were more suave and cool. I would like to hope I am misreading this its about being lazy rather than masculinity being so limited to so much a guy can't do or be considered feminine. It sometimes makes me sad. Standing out in the rain getting soaked isn't masculine to me, just dumb.

[Alice Torn]

Gendermutt, Yes, i relate very much to what you write. When i am riding bicycles, fishing, working on the car, playing basketball, yard work, other things, i am guy, though a sensitive guy, even when i lose my temper! When i go into dress up mode, I experience the beautiful side. Sometimes in guy mode, i feel very sad, because no GGs want me, and if i was a GG, guys would be after me a lot. it is so lonely being an aging single guy. At times, i wish i was a GG, but i accept just being like one part time. Life is hard for GGs. because they get way too much unwanted male attention. Guys get way too little GG attention.

[Tina_gm]

I actually don't feel a lot of differences depending on what I may be doing. Golf just seems to be one where the fem side does not show up. I am quite competitive though in general, but just being competitive at any one thing does not make the fem disappear. Golf just does for whatever reason.

I do want to add for any others who play out there. Yes, I am usually quite competitive with golf. It is not typically a leisure activity for me. But, I do know how to throttle back when the situation calls for it. Say team match play and maybe all we need to do is make bogey. I am not going to be some clown out there. If its a tight dogleg, or a big carry over water to get home in to on a par 5, I'll lay back.

[S. Lisa Smith]

I guess I am like you Gendermutt. I love being Lisa, but I also love being the male me. So I suspect I am somewhere in the middle, but perhaps a bit closer than you to TS. That is not to say that I am TS, but I do miss dressing when I can't and I am reluctant to change back to my male me when I'm dressed. Other than that, when I'm Lisa, I love it and after I've changed into the male me (and waited a few moments) I'm glad for that also.

[Tina_gm]

Hi Lisa. I try not to compare myself or anyone as more or less of anything. Perhaps you are right about the TS thing in some regards. Then again, I don't have much of any change I make when dressing. I still feel pretty much the same, I don't change to or from anything other than the clothing. So I guess that may be a reason why I don't feel that downer many talk about, or a thrill type high when dressing??

I can't say either I have some feeling of enjoying being a male. It is frustrating for me often. I just don't quite feel fully connected a lot of times, but yet not always connected to being a female either. I feel "like" one often, and I guess like a male often too. I often wonder why they do this or that.... (either gender) I will find myself thinking, I don't get it. Why do they do this so much, or like that so much.... either gender. I seem to like things that are girly, but then still have several interests and do things more associated with men. I try not to box it all in, like the discussion I just had with Reine. I can't say I am not gendered either, I always feel some sort of connection to both male and female, but hardly ever does it get close to 100% either way. I would say that when it comes to mannerisms, general natural behavior, I am probably more on the fem side. According to my wife, she can tell sometimes how I am leaning, masculine or feminine either by my mannerisms being more overt, which I do not always recognize, but also she feels my brain will act more one way or the other, which again, I don't always recognize. I do recognize when I feel more one way or the other, but now how I am being perceived. Then there are times she had no clue, and I figured I was giving off a ton of clues to it.

[iGenny]

Anyway, I have no goals, no destination other than peace and happiness. Perhaps this place in the middle, or both is really where I need to be. I have no plans to go further, dress more, or less, feel any more or less of anything. I never really have. I am just slowly accepting myself for myself, and find myself more and more somewhere in the middle between male and female.

Hi Gendermutt,
First, I wish for you that you reach your destination of peace and happiness. The same wish goes to all of us.

I am also in the middle. I hadn't realized that until a few years ago. Until then, I thought I wasn't manly, not considering or wanting to consider if not manly, then what? Reading stories like yours and others certainly got me to start considering!

I have to say that I'm rather self-satisfied when I take those cheesy psychological surveys that tell you are you more masculine or feminine - I'm always dead in the middle. I suppose I like it there.

I behave like you've described, maybe a little different (hmm, we're all a little different, aren't we :) ? ) I shave the bottoms of legs all the time, and my chest above my bra cups. I have fine blond hair and that expression just isn't noticed. I've let my nails grow a little longer than I used to. I feel content and relaxed when I dress with no rational explanation as to why.

So I go with the flow, ride the wave, go where the winds take me (too early in the morning to come up with more or better cliches). I'm no sadder when I have to put my clothes away than I am when I have to put any of my hobbies away. I'm just happy I had a chance to play.

I see from all the replies to your thread (you got a lot of good discussion going, didn't you?) that we're not alone, in fact it's kind of crowded here in the middle. Cool. We knew that!

So when your Gender Supervisor asks you what your Gender Goals are and where you see your gender going in five years, just tell her to shush, you're watching the Golf channel and want to see what they're wearing at the LPGA. My Gender Supervisor doesn't even talk to me any more.

Hugs,
Genny

PS No, to all of you who might worry, I don't really have a gender supervisor talking to me in my head. It's a metaphor. Look it up. :smug:

[Tina_gm]

Hi Genny and thanks. There are other CD forums that may attract a bit different crowd. This one seems to be those who are more than just fetish CDers. (although I am sure we have some here too), and nothing wrong with that, but for most of us here topside, it is more than just fetish. A fairly healthy amount of TS that come to this place as well. So I guess I was searching for some similar experience. How to deal with it, go with the flow so to speak. I will never say it rises to the challenges of someone who is TS. But, there always seems to be a bit of a push pull going on with me. It gets frustrating along with my self imposed limitations on my gender expression. It is totally a choice, I never say I can't because. I don't because of the life I have and my desire not to disrupt it. Hopefully I will never have to.