I think I found out what happened to all the youngsters.

[OCCarly]

I am 53, and I've noticed that the populations of this and other forums where I am a member have skewed mostly my age and older. Earlier this evening I went to Kaiser for orientation into their transgender program (a prerequisite to starting gender therapy) and I got the shock of my life.

I knew I was going to be in a group setting for orientation, and I figured that there would probably be a pretty even age distribution -- or at least, out of fifteen to eighteen people, there would be two or three or five that would be close to me in age, since that is what I am seeing in the forums.

No, wrong. Other than the therapist running the show, and one parent who was there with her transgirl daughter, I was the oldest person in the room by far.

Every other transitioner in the room was under twenty five. And several of them were already on hormones, and just going through orientation because Kaiser required it b/c they were moving in from out of state or switching from another insurer. So there I am dressed neck down. I didn't bother with a wig and makeup because I was going in there cold, and I wanted to get the lay of the land, so to speak. I was surrounded by five or six young, pretty transgirls, and six or seven young, good looking transguys, feeling a mixture of happiness and sadness. Happiness because all these kids are just transitioning and not letting anybody stop them or bother them about it, and sadness because I've missed so much and been through so much to get to this point.

The kids are not bothering with the web forums because they don't need them. For them, transitioning is just another part of life. They are just going out there and doing it, and getting on with their lives. I watched them walk out of the building afterward, and they are just being themselves. They don't have any of the cares or worries that us older folks have.

Society really is changing. For them it is a different world.

[Zooey]

They're all on reddit. The transgender subreddits skew MUCH younger than most of the "transgender specific sites", which tend to skew older.

[phylis anne]

Yes but we older ones should remember too that when we were kids the most likely happened when we tried to come out,
1got the girl beat out of us by our peers or scared family
2. got automatically sent to the shrink as we were considered sicko's
3.there were not many therapists to talk with on the subject
4. even bigger fear then of talking to family
5.no legal protections I/E jobs etc
that is just a partial list many have experienced more,so to me it is easier to see why there are more younger ones today ,current media and more social acceptance to bad many of us had to wait til now we have missed so much
hugs phylis anne

[rachael.davis]

and the only written resources were some disgusting magazines / newspapers that inflicted a massive level of guilt since they were very fetish oriented

[I Am Paula]

I dropped off the two biggest forums because they were all kids. I got really sick of one word posts 'Sup?'.
It's wonderful that young adults are realizing they can transition. It did not occur to me intill I'd passed the half century mark.

[Blossym]

I'm not super duper young anymore, but we have a lot of groups on Reddit (like another mentioned), and Facebook, and some of us just get together in person.

I go to a support group, which is usually people in their 50s on average, and they ask me this question all the time. They don't seem to understand how our social group functions, but really it's just a generational difference. I like to mingle in many different places so I can meet different people, and I found we all have different ways that we prefer to communicate.

[MissDanielle]

Yeah, Jane and I were talking about how this site is mostly older but there's a few young ones on here, too. Maybe not THAT young. Those that are in high school probably don't feel the need to come on here since they have resources where they live.

I went to a support group before moving, one was around my age, another was younger than me, and the other two were at least in their 50s. Three of us at the time had not started HRT.

[bimini1]

I've said before and will say again it's these trans kids that will lead a revolution out of these archaic times.

[Lauri K]

I hope these youngsters you are referring to move the trans revolution at warp speed or it may be too late for many of us on here, time is precious and we need progress NOW.

My tone of optimism has been beaten back a bit over the recent weeks due to the hateful laws of few southern states, but we will overcome this setback I know.

But still we cannot be silent in this movement.

[Zooey]

Yes but we older ones should remember too that when we were kids the most likely happened when we tried to come out,
1got the girl beat out of us by our peers or scared family
2. got automatically sent to the shrink as we were considered sicko's
3.there were not many therapists to talk with on the subject
4. even bigger fear then of talking to family
5.no legal protections I/E jobs etc
that is just a partial list many have experienced more,so to me it is easier to see why there are more younger ones today ,current media and more social acceptance to bad many of us had to wait til now we have missed so much
hugs phylis anne

I don't mean to imply that things are not better in a lot of ways, but... Read what these young people are saying on sites like Reddit. I do, and what I see makes me cry a lot of the time. There's a lot of hate getting slung at these kids, and for every supportive friend there's a disowning (or worse) parent. There's a tremendous amount of visible depression, and a lot of people seem to be constantly on the verge of breaking. Not everybody, but a lot of people.

It's not easy for anybody.

Look, by this forum's demographics, I'm on the younger end of things at 36. By reddit standards, I'm oooooold... I've had an easier time of it than a lot of people. HRT is being very good to me, and I'm very thankful for that. Never forget that even if the young have some cultural advantages, they ALSO have a tremendous number of disadvantages. Many of them are under the thumb of EXTREMELY ACTIVELY UNSUPPORTIVE parents. Almost none of them have the resources to just go independent. Insurance coverage for trans care is still spotty, and varies from state to state. While I could complain about the things that are worse for me at my age, I am fortunate to have a career and resources that make transitioning seem possible. 16 year old me, or even 24 year old me, would have just felt trapped. Trapped is hard.

[MissDanielle]

I know what you mean about being trapped! My parents still think I'm nuts.

I had planned to move to Chicago in June but I honestly don't think I would have made it until June. Not with all the hiding and stress from hiding.

I'm holding off until I can freeze sperm but even I have days after moving where its bad such as today for instance.

[Eringirl]

What Melissa (Zooey) said.....

[pamela7]

there is something to what OCC said though; our youngster f2m and his f2m partner aren't on any groups or sites, they're just getting on with translife as normal life.

[Jocee]

Dang...... and I am still dialing into the BBS out of Atlanta. And I was wondering why I was the only on there for the last 10 years :)

[Christie ann]

Jocee,

I was looking for the "like" button for your post. I remember the day I found alt.fashion. It changed my life.

[PretzelGirl]

I think there is something else to this. We who transitioned much later in life are very binary in general. Whether that is a natural thought or a "recoil" to holding back for years, older gender non-conforming individuals are the minority. Now with kids, they can explore earlier as they have more support. With the younger generation, I see far more non-conforming identities. I feel that non-conforming will slowly become the majority as everyone can be themselves outside of gender norms and it becomes more understood. And when you are non-conforming, are you really transitioning or do you just do it?

We just had a Queer Prom last weekend and it was for those 14-20 years old. Were there binary individuals? Absolutely. But the non-binary identities were in abundance.

[Brooklyn]

Most of my trans friends are early transitioners. While I'm often jealous of the physical results they achieve, I would not trade places with most of them. The stories some tell of abuse, homelessness, drug abuse, discrimination, multiple suicide attempts, and prostitution makes me respect the much harder journey they often have. Of course, it shouldn't be that way and some more fortunate kids are getting support and finding acceptance these days.

[Georgette_USA]

I don't know your friends or how EARLY they transitioned, are you talking age or years prior. Yes I have met some recently who have had some of that. Have met quite a few Trans Youth, and have had very supportive parents. Most TG support groups, for legal reasons, won't let youth under 18 to attend without a parent/guardian, so don't get to hear their stories.

When I transitioned in the 70s. I have been very lucky as I had none, except maybe discrimination, of that in my background. Of the few I knew, about 12 or more at that time, did not have most of those problems. Most were in the age of 40+. There were only a few like me in their 20s-30s.

[flatlander_48]

It would seem that a VERY important factor in deciding when to transition has to do with ones life circumstances at the time. In relative terms, it would seem to be easier at a younger age (not really entrenched in job, family, mortgage, etc.) or at a later age (reputation established at work, maybe the house is paid off, kids are out of the house, etc.). In between you'd have more involvements to deal with...

DeeAnn

[Rianna Humble]

I'm sorry, Dee, the decision of when to transition has very little to do with anything other than an overwhelming need

[flatlander_48]

Are you suggesting that everyone is in a state of blind desperation before they start to transition? I don't believe that to be the case and judging by some of the accounts here, there seems to be support for this.

I think doors open at various stages during ones life. Perhaps during those times we see through the layers of repression that we've held in place for so long. I think this is what can happen for older folks. A spark is set off by an experience at Halloween or a costume party. A door opens and there is reconsideration of ones past and present and vision for the future. The point is that we may be more receptive at earlier or later ages, but not so much between the two.

Clearly there are situations of overwhelming need. However, I would ask this question: could it be that staying in denial too long might lead to overwhelming need?

DeeAnn

[Megan G]

Dee,

Rianna is right on the mark, the decision to transition is not made because of a door that opened or being in a better social/economical position to do so. It is because of an overwhelming need to be authentic to ones self. The person is usually in so much pain/distress that they feel they have no other choice but to transition. Yes I am sure there are some people that never get to this stage when they decide to toss the grenade but from what I have seen (especially on here) it is the case most of the time.

[flatlander_48]

No, you both missed the point.

What I'm saying is that at certain points in our lives, we may have more slack to think about our lives introspectively and in more depth than at other times. Think about people who have transitioned in their 60's and 70's. They've been successful in suppressing their true feelings for 50+ years. So, if they've had those feelings all along, why didn't they transition sooner? Life circumstances allowed people space to think about what they wanted to happen next. For them, the timing was right to consider transition.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/08/fashion/for-some-in-transgender-community-its-never-too-late-to-make-a-change.html?_r=0

Some interesting passages are:

“I think it’s safe to say that the employment I had would prohibit any sign of cross-dressing or anything like that,” Ms. Swan said. “I would have lost my job. The main customer is the Department of Defense. It was totally out of order.”

But by 2000, she had retired. Her children were grown. Her parents were no longer alive. It was time, she decided, to make a change she had long dreamed of.


==================

Still, the pull to live as a person wants, even for a short time, even under reduced circumstances, remains powerful. Some people interviewed said they waited to retire before transitioning so as not to disrupt or destroy their careers. Others chose to push forward after the deaths of their parents or after their children had left the nest.


But invariably, they said that they had given enough, pretended enough, and wanted to claim the years remaining as their own. The entirety of their bucket list was to finally become themselves.


To me, this does not sound like desperation or a transition/suicide choice. It's the realization that the majority of things that might have been impediments either changed or just went away. Circumstances change and it opens a path.

Also, never underestimate the power of advancing age. You become too old to care. Personally, I think that was part of my reasoning behind coming out. While I don't have a level of dysphoria that would make transition a necessity and I have no plans to transition, it seemed to be a good time for DeeAnn to make a hometown appearance.

It's sad that so many have to actually hit the wall before making the decision about the rest of their lives. However, that doesn't appear to be the case for everyone.

DeeAnn

[Zooey]

I've told my story here, and I'm sorry if I gave you the wrong impression.

I was not suicidal or unmanageably depressed when I came to the conclusion that I needed to transition - I had not hit rock bottom. Make no mistake though, I WAS in free fall; transition was pulling my chute before I hit the ground.

[flatlander_48]

Actually the only thing that I had in mind was the story I listed from the New York Times last year. You're safe!

Anyway, just because a majority has a certain experience doesn't mean it is the only way a situation can occur. Sort of the flip side of "If your only tool is a hammer, every problem begins to look like a nail.".

DeeAnn

[Rianna Humble]

DeeAnn, you are of course, free to participate in any thread in these forums provided that you abide by the forum rules (as you have done so far here), but I cannot understand why you insist that your outsider's point of view trumps the knowledge and experience of all of us here who have transitioned?

Please allow that those who have first-hand knowledge of transition and of the fight that they had to put up to try to conform to expectations might actually know what they went through and that those of us who, in addition, support others who are going/have gone through the agonies of transition just might have some personal knowledge that does not chime with your theorising.

[Eringirl]

No, you both missed the point.

What I'm saying is that at certain points in our lives, we may have more slack to think about our lives introspectively and in more depth than at other times. Think about people who have transitioned in their 60's and 70's. They've been successful in suppressing their true feelings for 50+ years...


DeeAnn

Hi DeeAnn. I see the point you are trying to make. For me, and I can only speak for me, it depends on how you define "successful". If it is "staying alive", then okay, I was successful. If it is leading a happy and productive life all those years, well then, no...I failed miserably. I was NOT successful in "suppressing (my) true feelings"...

Having said that, since transitioning, I am now fulfilling the latter definition.....and good for me!!!

Erin

[Jennifer-GWN]

I know this is straying the op from topic a bit but to your point Erin... You've actually been successful in your career and many aspects of life despite the internal turmoil that tg brings and the impact on our lives. Perhaps some of the success is an aspect of overcompensation or a drive to find and deliver something good amidst the personal turmoil. I'd say the same thing to myself as well. Successful in my career yes... Mental struggles and personal impacts yes indeed but still consider myself successful and even more so can add HAPPINESS to the core now as well.

Apologies for the sidebar.

Cheers... Jennifer

[flatlander_48]

DeeAnn, you are of course, free to participate in any thread in these forums provided that you abide by the forum rules (as you have done so far here), but I cannot understand why you insist that your outsider's point of view trumps the knowledge and experience of all of us here who have transitioned?

For about 10 years I did a fair amount of personal introspection work in groups of various constituencies (Asians, Blacks, LGBT, raised poor, etc.). From that experience with human nature, 2 things become apparent: in a benign, non-judgemental environment, usually in about 5 minutes (or less!) you can tell what people are really struggling with and also that many things are more readily seen from an external perspective compared to an internal one. Also, is there even an experience that happens the SAME Way, every time? Considering the variance in the human experience, for any human experience, I would have to question that.


Please allow that those who have first-hand knowledge of transition and of the fight that they had to put up to try to conform to expectations might actually know what they went through and that those of us who, in addition, support others who are going/have gone through the agonies of transition just might have some personal knowledge that does not chime with your theorising.

I've NEVER said that what I offered was Either/Or. If you had that impression, then it was incorrect. The message was that it appears that some seemed to be on an alternate path as evidenced by the New York Time article. I don't know why their situations appear to be unique, but it is different. So, the question is what makes it different? How would you explain it? I don't know, but it suggests that there is more than one road to town. That's what I would like people to respond to.

DeeAnn

[Rianna Humble]

Sorry, you have taken this thread too far off topic. If you want responses to your media article. Create a thread in Media that follows the rules.

This thread is now over.