TG friendly states?

[kymmieLorain]

I wonder if there is a list or something on TG friendly states. We all know that NC isn't one of them. What about other states? Are more populated states more friendly?

Thanks

Kymmie

[dolovewell]

I live in Oregon right now, but I have lived in Wisconsin, Texas, Nevada, Florida and California and honestly every state has been the exact same in terms of attitudes. I lived in very very very liberal progressive Madison, Wisconsin and got humiliated at a mall. Meanwhile I went out in very conservative Abilene, TX and had zero trouble. The amount of risk presented is going to be the same everywhere. People's attitudes will generally be the same. Most people will be fine and tolerant, with a very small fraction who will not be. That small fraction will be the same everywhere. The only difference is token legislation. If you pick and choose places to live or visit based on "how TG friendly" they are you are doing it wrong.

I am also getting tired of the hate North Carolina gets. Too many act like there are just packs of roving bigots driving around in pickup trucks looking to bash in the brains of anyone who may be LGBT. It's really not that bad.

[Emily Ann Brown]

Thank you Dolovewell.....Ashville and Charlotte are very open to CDs and TGs. And Raleigh isn't back. Em

[Tracy Irving]

I lived in very very very liberal progressive Madison, Wisconsin and got humiliated at a mall.

Funny. Madison is one of only two places I was laughed at for taking a dress into a dressing room to try on. The other was at a Victoria's Secret in Milwaukee that I chronicled in a different thread.

[Lorileah]

From the ACLU

Q.Are there state and local laws that clearly prohibit discrimination against transgender people?
A.

Yes. California, Colorado, Connecticut, Delaware, Hawaii, Illinois, Iowa, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, Nevada, New Jersey, New Mexico, Oregon, Rhode Island, Vermont, Washington, and the District of Columbia all have such laws. Wisconsin New York and New Hampshire have protections for sexual orientation but exclude transgender persons. States not listed have no protections in place specifically for transgender persons and some that are listed may protect only certain things like housing.

As far as how people will treat you, that will vary from place to place and even neighborhood to neighborhood

[Tracii G]

I would say its probably the same any state you go to.
My city has a fairness clause that protects gay and trans people that goes for employment, treatment in stores, dining establishments, housing etc.

[Andrea Renea]

Write all the laws you want to.

In the end the people you interact with make the final decision. I've had no issues even in rural NC.

[SarahSerene]

Funny. Madison is one of only two places I was laughed at for taking a dress into a dressing room to try on. The other was at a Victoria's Secret in Milwaukee that I chronicled in a different thread.

Count me as a third who's had a negative experience in Madison! I got laughed at by three guys working a kiosk while I was walking from a department store into the mall itself. I put more detail about it into a separate post. Suffice to say though I have had numerous positive outings in Madison since. Also, MN is a pretty friendly place!

[CONSUELO]

My guess, based on limited experience, is that it is not so much the State as the locality. Some towns are more accepting than others and within those towns there are areas that are more CD friendly than others. I have read here of members being made to feel uncomfortable in Las Vegas even though it has a deserved reputation for being tolerant. I have dressed in Deming NM and Van Horn TX and not had any comments but that may have more to do with the folks being "stunned into silence" than with any objective measure of tolerance.

[Stephanie47]

Washington State law protects sexual orientation which according to the human rights commission includes heterosexuality, homosexuality, bisexuality, gender identity and gender expression in public accommodations, employment, housing, credit and insurance. Hate crime laws are also applicable for these groups. Hate crime laws are also applicable if a person acts in the belief a person is in one of these protected groups and is not. Seattle is a friendly place, however, Seattle also sees its share of crime against protected persons. Legal protections does not confer acceptance.

[DIANEF]

Slightly off topic but if anyone ever considers a visit to the UK Manchester is probably the most LGBTQ friendly place to go, Brighton is also good.

[Kaze_]

If you're going to be different you're going to get attention.

If you want be different and not get attention go to one of the places in the US where being different is normal.

You're going to be looking at the city/neighborhood level not state level.

Also,

Nothing wrong with NC, privately owned businesses should be able to discriminate against whoever they wish.

Other people have rights as well.

If you disagree with them, don't be a patron of their establishment.

Most businesses won't, especially large chains, simply because it's bad business.

[Vickie_CDTV]

I find it odd that NY state had more or less the same law as NC (as it applies to bathrooms on state property) and virtually no one said anything. Whenever I asked about it, I was told, condescendingly, "just use the bathroom which matches your presentation".

Parts of NY (downstate and upstate) are seen as "trans friendly", of course the cost of living and lack of jobs is pretty unfriendly to everyone. And anti employment discrimination laws in at-will states (like NY) are worthless.

[BeckyAnderson]

This is America folks! Government can and does pass all the laws they want to to chorale people in one direction or another, BUT, until general attitude changes to a more positive one (concerning us) there will always be good to bad reactions no matter where we are. I live in New Jersey and have been going out for so many years and have never had a bad experience but that certainly does not mean it can't happen. I like to be always on guard and prepared to avoid an unpleasant situation.

[Lorileah]

Nothing wrong with NC, privately owned businesses should be able to discriminate against whoever they wish.

Other people have rights as well.

now there's a can of worms. I don't like people with blue eyes. Do I need a sign?

[CONSUELO]

Lorileah makes a very important point. If you say discrimination is OK, then it is open season. Just pick your prejudice.

By the way I agree with Diane. Manchester UK Canal Quarter is a great place for cross dressers. Very open and accepting. I cannot think of an equivalent place in the US, except for possibly Providence, though I only base that on the description of others.

[Sally24]

New England, in the larger towns and cities is pretty good. All states there but NH have trans protection laws. I have been OUT for over 10 years and have gone anywhere I wanted to with little or no negative reactions. As always, it is best to not go out alone. Most women of any kind know that wise advise.

[Pat]

You have to differentiate between legal protection and just general attitude. In Massachusetts transgender people have wide-ranging legal protections, but there are still intolerant people. In North Carolina there are laws that are troubling, but as people have already noted, many individuals are just fine. My overall rule of thumb is that the majority of people are fine.

If you go near centers of liberalism -- universities, say, or art colonies -- there is often a local culture of tolerance. People who are out of step with local culture that get discouraged. In places that are less liberal, folks who want to make a scene are less inhibited by concern about how people will perceive them.

So it all boils down to the old advice: use your noodle. ;)

[I Am Paula]

Given the current climate, Canada and Mexico are excellent choices.

[Helen_Highwater]

Nothing wrong with NC, privately owned businesses should be able to discriminate against whoever they wish.

In the UK discrimination laws apply to ALL businesses. It has to be that way if people are to be protected. Are you suggesting it's ok for a small shop owner to refuse to serve someone because they're black? Also privately owned stretches to any business not floated on the stock market so that could easily be a chain of stores all in family owned hands. There have been several cases in the UK were gay couples have been refused goods or services and the justification has been that the vendor's religion says homosexuality is wrong. The courts have rightly thrown that defense out. Civil rights apply to all. Folks can't cherry pick which laws they want to observe.

Diane's comment about Manchester (UK) is a valid one. Having said that there are areas of Manchester I wouldn't go even in drab unless I had an armed guard! Hence while I've no experience of the US other that what I see on TV and read in the press I would guess that it's less about states and more to do with smaller districts. Bigger in terms of population probably has a correlation to openness and acceptance.

[Periwinkle]

Washington is pretty great! Specifically, Western Washington. The East side is a bit sketchy in terms of how they view people in the LGBT community. I live on the East side, but I think the only reason I've done so well here is that I pass most of the time. (Or so it seems.) I've also been fortunate enough not to run into anybody from work. Probably because I tend to get out of town when I want to take a stroll en femme. I'm way too nervous to do anything where I live.

[dolovewell]

I have an office in Spokane that I go to a couple times a month and have had no problems there. If I could live in Spokane, I would in a heartbeat compared to where I live now.

[DIANEF]

I
Diane's comment about Manchester (UK) is a valid one. Having said that there are areas of Manchester I wouldn't go even in drab unless I had an armed guard!

I think I must live in one of those areas LOL! Actually you could say that about any major city.

[LydiaL]

I say that no state or city, with or without laws, is really “TG friendly”. Lesbians and Gays are tolerated now in many places, and many countries. For example, due to their high numbers living in locations such as Santa Fe, NM (& perhaps Albuquerque), Lesbians and Gays are largely accepted. But TG/Crossdresser acceptance? Hardly (IMO).

Unlike Long Beach, CA, Las Vegas, NV, Detroit, MI (& others), there is really no TG friendly place yet in NM where the crossdresser community meets up to have opportunities to build friendships. Kinda keeps us in the closet.

[Acastina]

now there's a can of worms. I don't like people with blue eyes. Do I need a sign?

Indeed. What Kaze fails to grasp is that discrimination in public accommodations (which by definition includes "privately owned businesses"; that's the point of it) has been illegal under federal law since the mid-1960s. That's more than a half-century, and it's never been seriously challenged or even nibbled away at, legislatively.

What has changed that is relevant to us on this forum is that a number of progressive states and local governments have chosen to extend the protected categories beyond the list established in the original federal Civil Rights Act. Per the list above, all but Iowa are decisively "blue" states.

Private ownership is not a license to discriminate. The answer the courts have had when these protections are challenged is that, if one is not willing to abide by laws of general application in the regulation of commerce, one should not be in a business open to the public. It's the law, and it's been the law for decades.

After 50 years, still misunderstood.

Sigh.

[Krisi]

now there's a can of worms. I don't like people with blue eyes. Do I need a sign?

No sign, just don't associate with them. People have all sorts of biases, some logical, some not. Laws can't force you to like people with blue eyes. Education can change your attitude over time.

[Pat]

Laws can't force you to like people with blue eyes.

Very true. But they can require you to serve people with blue eyes in your business. That's because your business license comes from a government that's composed of all people, even the blue-eyed ones, and a condition of being granted that license is that you have to serve all of the people who granted it. But you're right -- you don't have to like them while you're doing it. ;)

[Aunt Kelly]

I have dressed in Deming NM and Van Horn TX and not had any comments but that may have more to do with the folks being "stunned into silence" than with any objective measure of tolerance. Trust me, that's exactly what it was. Those are some seriously conservative parts of the state. Not that there are not decent, tolerant people there. I am sure there are, but the odds are way, way against you encountering all three of them.
:)

[TrishaLake]

I have traveled allot and mostly lived in NY until 5 years ago..then I to Texas....well perception is not reality folks. IN NY I had a few places to go etc especially in long island...but there was only a feeling of hiding. In Texas I feel very free to be me. It is open to many things, has a few clubs, parties and groups. This has been the place for me.