Long time male friends

[Gendersoul16]

Hi, Its Erin; I would like to open a discussion about cis gender male friends vs cis gender female friends comfort levels around crossdressing. My experience is that my long time friends, who have known me presenting as a man, are very different in their acceptance of me presenting as a female according to gender. My female friends by and large embrace and support me, but my male friends have difficulty. So far none of my male friends would like to go out with me while I present as a female. Most of my female friends are either open to going out or go out with me dressed. Any thoughts? Thanks!

I've just read some other similar posts and I am focusing here on the men.......Male dominated society and the phobia of men of their feminine side. I feel its a huge problem in moving society forward toward world peace and harmony. Women can embrace their masculine side. Its been really progressing in the last few decades. The men, who really need to drop their armor, have great difficulty letting go. That has been one of the wonderful healing results of me coming out and being feminine!

[SometimesKairi]

Think that's pretty much what you'll find from everyone.
Men are too scared to be seen out or around with a dresser. It'd destroy their 'tough manly image'

From my experience anyway

[Lana Mae]

You might find one or two but they would have to be very secure in their masculinity! IMHO Hugs Lana Mae (Transphobia and homophobia are usually a reflection of being insecure in your own masculinity!-for males!)

[Micki_Finn]

Not contesting your assertation, but playing a little devils advocate. Are YOU the same in both modes? Maybe when you're in girl mode you like doing different things than when you're in guy mode that your male friends just aren't into? If in guy mode you're all about 4-wheelin', football, and fixing cars, and in girl mode you like shopping, theater, and tea rooms, that's going to disincentivize your guy friends from hanging out.

Just a thought.

Another general thought on the subject: I would theorize that a lot of men are uncomfortable around it because of their OWN insecurity and not so much "I don't want to be seen with". They see a CD, it's a man in a dress, but hey those legs/hips/eyes/lips are pretty sexy... OMG AM I GAY????

[Gendersoul16]

I am pretty much the same, mentally........I am a little more feminine in body movements, voice and touch. However, with my old hetero male friends I am very aware NOT to be girly, touchy feely, like I can be with a lot of my female and CD/TG and bi/gay friends. That is what my accepting friends, female, CD/TG, gay/bi say about me.

Most of my interests are interchangeable...........

Kinsey's theory; Everyone is bisexual? Pansexual? In some preferential proportion...........

[ellbee]

At least in my case, I've found that gay & bi cis-male friends/acquaintances are fine with it. :strugglin


Just be sure to look absolutely fab, or they will rip your look to shreds -- and even then. :devil:


Some hetero guys are... okay... with it.

[Rogina B]

Another general thought on the subject: I would theorize that a lot of men are uncomfortable around it because of their OWN insecurity and not so much "I don't want to be seen with". They see a CD, it's a man in a dress, but hey those legs/hips/eyes/lips are pretty sexy... OMG AM I GAY????
And,if you are wearing something that "they have a thing for" that really adds to the attraction ! All works good until the clothes come off ! lol Seriously, I am not sure how you describe yourself. If you are a CD,then the girls enjoy that as it is a fun thing. If you tell all that you are TG,then they will see you as someone in this for the long haul..viewed differently for sure.

[GretchenM]

Definitely an accurate observation. Even hints of femininity bring out the traditional and stereotypical thinking in many men. In male mode I carry a bag with a women's wallet and what not in it. Even that triggers discernible attitudes in some men. No comments, but what they are thinking is clear as day. For some, compliance with social standards is so complete one would think the masculine-feminine divide is the law and has been for the last 2 billion or so years. At violating that law is a grave sin or just plain wacky.

But women and those who, as a group, have fought to gain some degree of equality with the masculine supremacy understand that change is not only possible but necessary. The rigidity is the one thing I dislike the most about stereotypical masculinity. Deny your emotions; avoid femininity at all costs as it shows weakness, blah, blah, blah. That said, it is getting a bit easier to deviate from the "true" path and be accepted, even by men. There is an age factor in it. In general, the older the more traditional the attitude. Not always true, but often true. Younger men are more respectful even if they are not accepting. That's progress.

[Sandin Meknickers]

Men are ace. Nothig wrong with us. Probably wouldn't invite my male freinds out to take the p!ss all night though.

Maybe you make them uncomfortable? I don't know how well you look when you're out but if you're not fooling anyone they might not want to be out with someone strange looking. Who might seem to have abandoned self respect and sanity? Just a thought. I mean ggs get ripped apart by each other for wearing the wrong thing etc. If you're making nice clothes look bad i would expect abuse as it's par for the course. And if you garner abuse or are likely to, why would thay attract others to your side?

This is just a thought idea while I'm shoving lunch iny face. Any yous and yours etc. Are simply shorthands and not directly assocoated to you personally.

[Beverley Sims]

With my male friends I was dressed in one of their sisters clothes and we all went out together.

being a gradual thing the dressed me more and more and I was accepted as a guy who could pass as a girl, tricking other boys in the group.

They never thought of me being a crossdresser though.

I also enjoyed the company of the girls more often and had a girlfriend.

If they realised I was a crossdresser I think they would have passed me by.

[Sandin Meknickers]

Perception is everything. They never saw me as a cross dresser says beverly. Why should they Bev? You're Bev aren't you lol?

[Jaylyn]

I can say this, some men that are not out in public but are CDs on here are protecting themselves. I say this as most folks are judged by others by the company you keep. My mom and dad both told that. I found out that is particularly true in the teen years and somewhat in adult years. Let me ask you a question if you are hanging with a criminal and law enforcement stops that criminal don't they also check your records as well since you are keeping company with them. Many people judge others by the company you keep. My mom always told me that. I'm not out in the world as a cd but I'm sure my male friends would think I've flipped my lid and lost my mind if they knew. Very few would probably still want to hang around me.
I know it's not right to judge others by clothes and I try not to. I do know many social clicks that do especially in the schools of our nation. This could be why bullying is happening. Growing up a male is tough, growing up a male that loves the soft women's clothes and dressing is even somewhat tougher.

[Teresa]

I can see so many things going on here, first of all they are going to concerned they might be labelled gay, when being seen with a Cder .
If they aren't Cders themselves they won't relate to your feelings and needs to CD.
They won't think you are interested in doing guy stuff.
They won't want to accompany you on any shopping trips , they certainly won't go and pick items for you .

If you are a CDer you enter a feminine World, I realise they may not all accept you , some will treat you like an alien.

I have had this response from my painting group the women members who know are all fine , the guys feel uncomfortable, one guy is bi-sexual and he's intrigued by my CDing so I'm not sure what's going on there , but he's a nice guy to know , we have some laughs about my pictures. He still doesn't get why we do it though ..

What you're experiencing is exactly why we struggle with our CDing , we basically know we are guys and have to come to terms with needing to dress in female clothes, we know society doesn't expect a man to behave like that but something inside is telling us different , if we struggle with it at times other guys who aren't Cders just won't want to know .

[lingerieLiz]

I think there are a couple things going on here. First is they might feel that it is a date, or others might think they are on a date with a guy dressed as a girl. Secondly they might not know how to act around you as a girl. Do they treat you as a girl or a fellow guy.

Women don't have the problem because you as a girl don't cause others to assume that they are gay. Women often go out socially with other women or groups.

When I was young I could easily pass. Actually looked more like a girl than guy. Anyway, I dated a few gay guys as a girl. I wasn't gay but was a cover date. I liked to dress and they wanted to be seen with a girl. The guys that I knew were not into CDs or Trans. They would tease me by flirting or sliding their hand up my nylons. But, none indicated they were wanting more. Nor was I.

[Alice B]

That is a very interesting problem. Most of my male friends have known me for years as a very macho male in actions and professions.I strongly believe they would not be comfortable with me if they knew, thus Alice remains in the bottle for them. One of them, who is one of my best friends has two sons who are gay and one has now become open about it. But my friend has never openly spoken of it, although many of us have known for years. I could tell him, but am certain he would tell others because that is his make up. Friendships of such a long duration are not worth risking.

[Amanda Katharine]

Not exactly the same but before I met my fiancée, I asked out a crossdresser that I truly thought was a woman because she looked that convincing. Once she told me she was a CD, I told her that I was only into GG's but that she looked very convincing. She told me I was the first person she'd told that to that had not insulted her. To me, it's not a question of being secure in your manhood, it's about being a decent human being and allowing people to live their lives as they see fit as long as it hurts no one.

[Sophie Yang]

Gendersoul

Google Kristen Beck. She was a Navy Seal. Navy Seals have a bond that most people will never experience. Some of her brothers support her after her transition and others do not. I suspect, that for the most part, those who fought with him side by side are more supportive than those who did not. But her story shows that even the most alpha-male types can be supportive.

[ginapoodle]

Hi Erin,

Excellent topic, and key in my decision to continue staying in the closet, and telling only very selected female friends. I believe if I did a general reveal, all but perhaps one of my male friends would abandon me. The opportunity cost is too high, as I highly value these male friendships. Rock throwers no need to say "well, if they were real friends..". Baloney. Other key reason is my wife's non acceptance. I am in my early sixties also, and my generational acceptance is pretty modest at best.

Best of luck. Remember to find your own path.

[SunHun]

I cannot ever imagine coming out to long time male friends. I have tested the waters by trying to start conversations related to these topics and they have almost always mocked everyone and everyone that falls out of straight and binary.