Man, I feel like a

[Helen_Highwater]

So following on from Teresa’s post about the importance, or NOT, of passing I thought it might well be worth re-addressing something that arises on a regular basis, namely the notion that, “I feel like a woman”.

Let me start by saying that my personal opinion is we can never truly feel like a woman. We’ll never experience a monthly cycle, the menopause. There are things that will always separate us. That said, I do think we can however feel feminine.

The notion that, “if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, sounds like a duck, then it’s a duck” is often used here to illustrate the concept that it takes more than just facial features for someone to be seen and taken as a female. Mannerisms play an important role in just how we a perceived by an onlooker. Getting those mannerisms in effect takes a bit of role play. We enter into a different way of thinking. Yes for some it becomes second nature and that’s where it’s possible to say you feel more feminine.

I would also say that many of those mannerisms are also learned by GG’s but from a very early age. It’s nurture not nature, a way of behaving that’s passed down from mothers to daughters, older sisters to siblings, peer to peer. Hence it’s possible for us to do the crash course and assimilate many of those same skills.

Add to that the time spent getting the look right, the experience of seeing a shapely figure looking back at you in the mirror, learning to walk, with style, in heels, having those mini chats with SA’s, eating without spoiling your lippy, all can contribute to feeling femme.

I would argue that if we don’t change how we feel consciously or subconsciously then if we go out we’re going to look like John Wayne in a frock. You have to radiate that sense of style in order for the viewer to see what we want them to see. That comes from within. The outer cladding only goes so far.

My persona in drab is different to that when dressed. After all these years it’s automatic. I’m still the (i hope nice) person it’s just that enfemme I present and most importantly, feel differently. It would be a huge mistake to underestimate just how that effects how the muggles relate and engage with us.

Perhaps to sum it up, we can never feel like a woman but we can have huge empathy for their situation and many of the things that influence their lives.

[docrobbysherry]

Helen, after many years here I'm finally getting my head around the phrase, "I feel like a woman". And, the why's and wherefores folks here say and feel that! :battingeyelashes:

But, I still think the phrase should be, "I feel like what I think being a woman feels like." Because if you've never been one, how could u know?:daydreaming:

[CONSUELO]

Helen,

For almost all of us cross dressers/transvestites your statement is correct. We are not women genetically and cannot experience what it truly is like to be a woman because of both nature and nurture as you have pointed out. I was watching some young children playing the other day, a small boy and a girl. The girl was running and throwing and engaging in the game as enthusiastically as the little boy but she was in a dress and sandals and so her perspective of the game was fundamentally different. As you have pointed out, we can take a crash course in mannerisms but we have never had it drilled into our every waking moment for all of our life. We also lack the true maternal instinct which is driven hormonally and cannot be replicated in a male body despite all the pleasant feelings of longing for children and enjoying parenthood.

I cannot speak for transexuals. Their path seems to be different to the typical cross dressers pathway.

I like to think of myself as trying to achieve a passable facsimile of a woman. That is all I want and all I can really aim for.

[Beverley Sims]

I imagine I feel like a woman in a lot of ways, as I dress a lot some mannerisms come naturally to me.

I have talked with my hands for years as well as acknowledging smiles with other women.

[Teresa]

Helen,
The one point that stands out is your comment about radiating those inner feelings , I think that sums it up so well, no matter how I appear to others I feel I radiate through the outer appearance . A kind GG at one of our meetings where we were also dancing told me I make a stylish woman, I waved that aside but your comment brought that comment back for me. I wonder how many of us wouldn't dress if those feelings didn't come through , we may not be women but we still understand and need those feelings .

[Linda P.]

Is it possible that this phrase "i feel like a woman" is being taken more literally than intended? I don't think it implies that one feels just like a woman feels or knows what it feels like to be be a real woman, but rather that when dressed in women's clothing you have achieved an emulation of a woman's appearance and that womanly appearance creates feelings of identity with those who typically wear that clothing , and quite different than when dressed in men's clothes. We associate certain behaviors, under the general heading of "femininity" with women, so when wearing women's clothes we identify with the behaviors of those who typically wear the clothes, and we feel feminine or "like a woman."

[MiniRock]

I don't feel at all like a woman. But when I put on women's clothes, I do want to pose like one. That still surprises me. And it's harder to do in front of other people than merely putting on the frock and standing like a bloke. Strange eh?

[Lana Mae]

I understand that a genetic male can not feel like a female in many ways! I also agree that we can feel feminine if not like a female! My daughter told me that my wife told her that, "I think your father sometimes wishes he was born a female!" My wife had passed away so I could not confront her on this! I have noticed that I have some feminine mannerisms that just come naturally regardless of how I am dressed! Of course, when dressed I add a few more! No, we don't have the maternal instincts and other things but I think we can feel feminine to a degree! Just my $.02! Hugs Lana Mae

[Teresa]

Hi Minirock,
Welcome to the forum.

It does get easier to be dressed in front of the general public, just accept that no one is perfect and just be yourself .

[RainbowDash]

I feel like a woman when I crossdress, absolutely! I feel girly, feminine, and I like to think of myself as a real woman. But I remind myself that I was born male not female, and so I could never really be a woman, probably even if I became a t-girl. I like to think of it this way.... I feel like a woman on the outside, but most certainly not on the inside.

[Sallee]

l well said Doc I would agree we can only assume this is what a woman might feel like. But it is what I feel like now

[AllieSF]

I like Linda P's definition, and, Yes, many readers take the statement too literally. Dressed like a women makes us feel much different than dressed as a man.

[audreyinalbany]

not to be the contrarian here, but as genetically born man, I'm hard pressed to elucidate what it feels like to 'be a man.' I'm a jumble of contradictions, of feelings, anger sometimes, joy sometimes, sadness, confusion, frustration, longing, satisfaction. Good days. Bad days. Days when I feel like working; days when I feel like staying home. I think we're all buying in to a stereotype that women are somehow different creatures, that by virtue of chromosomes they are naturally more sensitive & caring, or shy or sweet or bitchy or whatever.I can't tell you what feeling like a man is like because I've never felt anything other than the way I feel. I'd be surprised if many genetic women could tell you what it feels like to be a woman, outside of the expected stereotypes of vulnerability or sensitivity or...fill-in-the-blank

[susan54]

A lot I can relate to on this thread. I feel elegant and 'nice' when I get dressed up and there is no feeling at all of being a woman - as others have said I would not know what that felt like. I love how I feel and how I look I these clothes. I do the body language and voice when out and about so that I fit in but I do not pass and do not care who reads me as long as they like my outfits. There is a feelgood element to wearing all these clothes and it really feels more comfortable than male clothing despite logic that says the opposite. So not like a woman - just GOOD

[Taylor Dame]

I also agree with Linda P. I do feel differently when fully dressed. When I venture out fully dressed into the world of muggles, I am acting like a woman. This changes my feelings and outlook so much that it makes me feel feminine.

[Rhonda Jean]

About these things that seem to come naturally... Until I started going out with my SO I really didn't realize how many things I did differently. Being out as a woman with someone who knew me as a male was a weird confluence of those two worlds. After decades of flying solo and having what I considered "natural" voice, mannerisms, etc., it felt as odd to go into girl mode as it did to stay in male mode. Took some getting used to.

So, how "natural" was it? Of course, I thought/think my adopted feminine mannerisms were completely appropriate and natural. I see pictures and videos of others who probably think theirs are equally natural. To anyone other than themselves, they don't appear natural at all. It follows that I may be fooling myself to the same extent. What I notice most often are exaggerated "feminine" motions and mannerisms that appear campy, not natural. Trying too hard, and trying to hard is as dead of a giveaway as not trying at all. I hope I don't, but it stands to reason I do, even when trying not to.

[Aunt Kelly]

The premise seems to be that one can not be a "true woman" without the right genetics. I disagree. There are more than a few TS women here who will tell you that, despite the plumbing, they are truly female.

[lingerieLiz]

I don't think you can feel like anyone else. What does it feel like to be a great athlete, small guy, sexy woman, or another person. We can enjoy the feeling of femininity in dress, but do we feel the same as women. No one has lived my life so how would they have the same feelings that I do?

[alwayshave]

Helen, Having never been a woman, I don't know what it feels like to be a woman. However, I do know how to feel pretty and feel soft feminine clothes against my skin.

[Shely]

All i know is that when i am dressed up all the way. I FEEL!!!! Can't say who women feel. But I feel special and super alive!

[Helen_Highwater]

What I notice most often are exaggerated "feminine" motions and mannerisms that appear campy, not natural. Trying too hard, and trying to hard is as dead of a giveaway as not trying at all.

Rhonda Jean,

That is a danger we all face and need to be aware of. A GG at a social group made exactly the same point to me a few years ago. She commented on overly exaggerated gestures merely made the person standout , as you say, campy, stereotypical effeminate gay. In using any hand and body gestures we certainly need to be subtle in our approach.


The premise seems to be that one can not be a "true woman" without the right genetics. I disagree. There are more than a few TS women here who will tell you that, despite the plumbing, they are truly female.

Kelly,

I would certainly place those who are TS in a different category. Feeling you were born in the wrong body, with the wrong plumbing puts a different perspective on things. I don't want to speak for everyone but I do believe that those who dress yet don't want to transition can feel feminine, are capable of behaving in a womanly fashion, but as I said in the post, can't ultimately feel what a woman feels.

[Krisi]

1) We can not feel like a woman. We don't know how a woman feels and more than likely, different women feel differently. We cannot know how it feels to have been raised female and look at life for our entire lives as a female.

2) Not all women are brought up to be overly "feminine". Women raised on a farm, women raised in poverty, etc. Too often, crossdressers see women as super models or TV actresses but he majority are not. They deliver the mail or packages, they work in factories or warehouses. The ones you see in downtown office buildings are the exception.

[t-girlxsophie]

I Know I can never feel like a woman feels in her heart and soul,but I try to portray myself womanly in best way I can in terms of mannerisms,dress and look,perhaps not always spot on but I do try to emulate them as much as possible

One things for certain I know I love feeling this way

[Helen_Highwater]

Not all women are brought up to be overly "feminine". Women raised on a farm, women raised in poverty, etc. Too often, crossdressers see women as super models or TV actresses but he majority are not. They deliver the mail or packages, they work in factories or warehouses. The ones you see in downtown office buildings are the exception.

Krisi,

Yes we need to keep ourselves rooted in reality and not have an idealized image of what a woman looks like or acts like. This ties in with Rhonda Jeans comment about OTT gestures and mannerisms. It's too easy to end up being seen as a caricature figure, a proximity to what a female really is. Again this goes back to being genuine, being yourself but with those subtle changes. That said I doubt any of us set out to be an unattractive woman.

[Teresa]

Helen,
After our late night shopping trip to an out of town complex, I couldn't help commenting to Carole with thoughts of your thread how do we feel. Comfortably walking across to the car park passing other shoppers I asked Carole how she felt ? All I know is do we feel that different to a woman in those circumstances , the fact is it doesn't feel like a man , we're not talking, acting or behaving like men . Our shopping consisted of all female items , no one was taking any notice , we were what appeared to be two females out for a shopping trip and a meet up with others for a coffee . We are in pitch fork country here in the Fens and yet no one is chasing us with one !

[Helen_Highwater]

Teresa,

As you say when out dressed we dont behave as males. We emulate female traits, we have empathy with things that women experience, walking in heels springs to mind, however fundamentally we can't truly feel what a woman feels emotionally, instinctively.

Presenting and behaving in a feminine manner allows us to pass through the world around us. We're able to shop, dine, travel while presenting feminine. We're able to experience much of what women experience even things like the intrepidation of being out alone late at night.

So I can accept we can share so much with women. There will however always be things that are alien to us.

I see nothing wrong in accepting we have limitations in what we're able to understand about the female condition. Who was it said a man should know his limitations?

[CarlaWestin]

Hmm? What it feels like to be a woman? I think with me this is what I want to experience. But, it is a bit of a contrivance from a genetic and nurtured male POV.
But, that's exactly what I want. I am male and I enjoy being male. Tool user and problem solver. No matter what the challenge.
You know, like makeup. I couldn't imagine taking on that art project every day all day.

290747

And when I'm experiencing my adventure in female portrayal, I'm generally the only one wearing a skirt and heels.
I would imagine the afterthought from my observers would go something like, "Gosh that homely woman was big. You know, I think that was a man!"

290750290751

[Lorna]

For me, there is a distinction between feeling physically as a woman feels (purely as far as wearing the clothes is concerned) and experiencing the psychological and emotional feelings of being a woman. I have never tried or wanted to do the latter. Of course, I recognise that even wearing the clothes cannot fully replicate the physical feelings a woman has when wearing those same items (because of physical bodily differences) but to the extent that clothes such as skirts, bras, stockings, slips, girdles, heels, etc generate very different sensations from men's clothes, I think I can get some limited idea of how it feels - purely physically - to be (dressed as) a woman. I don't look for anything more.