Could it be that my wife is more observant and discerning than I imagined?

[Shawna]

As I've briefly shared, my wife doesn't know about the "Shawna" persona inside me. Or at least that's what I believed. Recently, (because of my drastic weight-loss over the past year as I work to really feminize my look) I was complaining about how my sweat pants were uncomfortably big and that I hated the draw-string variety anyway. She responded by giving me a pair of her workout pants saying, "I don't wear these anymore - why don't you take them?" I responded: "Aren't they women's pants?" To which she replied, "Does it matter? They're black and no one will be able to tell the difference!"

SCORE! They DO fit different with no pockets and no draw string - and I love them!

Next (and I posted this in another topic) - a couple of weeks ago, she advised me to start using a specific body butter for dry skin and overall skin care. Coincidence? Perhaps. Discerning that I have a softer side than most know about? More probable. After more than 20-years of marriage, it seems impossible that she hasn't picked up on a few tell-tale signs. We'll see where this leads, but I'm encouraged and hope that in the near future (although slow and steady) I can finally share all of me with her.

[alwayshave]

Shawna, I would not read to much into it. The workout pants and body butter are not a dress or a teddy.

[Shawna]

Jamie, you're right of course...perhaps just wishful thinking on my part...but time will tell - and if nothing else - it leads me to see that perhaps I can deliberately begin to drop certain hints of my true nature.

[Macey]

I find that our loved ones don't know us as well as think, but usually better than we'd imagine!

[Stephanie47]

It is remarkable to me that so many husbands think their wives are oblivious to what they do. Not saying she knows, but.............

[Nikkilovesdresses]

You're on safe ground for now. Advance carefully. They set traps you know.

[Alice B]

wifes always know more than you may think. Some will let you know right away, others will keep it to themself and a very rare few will openly accept. Time will tell, but don;t be too suprised or over think it.

[kimdl93]

Like others have said, don't read too much into it.It would be great if she was being coy, and simply giving you discrete encouragement. Even though she likely is more observant than you think, but those comments are pretty meaningless.

A more important question is how will she react/respond if and when she discovers Shawna. Are you willing to leave that to chance?

[Aunt Kelly]

Do not drop hints to "see how it goes". If she does not know now, she will eventually figure it out. That she comes to know about your nature may go badly, but it will be worse if she discovers your deception on her own. It will be worse still the longer that deception continues. But you know her better than anyone here. It may be that she is understanding and accepting. Let us hope so.

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi Shawna :hugs:, Go easy and be sure to read line #4 in my signature. >Orchid ..o:daydreaming:o..

[Shely]

sounds like a cat and mouse game to me. Wives always know more that we think they know, and seldom let on that they know more. IMHO!

[KatrinaK]

Shawna,

You probably don’t want to hear this, but:

1) she will find out. It’s a given
2) how she finds out will likely dictate the course of the rest of your marriage. You can either have that conversation eventually as a forthcoming honest husband or from a defensive position where you’ll need to address both this issue and 20 years of deception in tandem.

Tread carefully.

[Shawna]

Thank you and hugs to all my sisters for your advice. There is certainly a lot for me to think about, and I'm not taking any of it lightly.

[Becky Blue]

Unless there is a specific reason for her to suspect, then she most likely doesn't... in my opinion she will only find out if you choose to tell her or make a mistake.

[Teri Ray]

I agree with KatrinaK. If your wife does not now know (or suspect) she is likely to figure it out sooner than later. My thoughts come from my experience of thinking I was the most careful person in hiding my dressing passion. Of coursee I was no where near as careful as I believed. I was just lucky to have a wife who after she found out made the effort to be understanding. For me having my wife know turned into a blessing. Best wsihes to you and your wife.

[Shawna]

OK - so I'm really beginning to wonder...my wife just returned from shopping and bought me 3 pairs of workout pants just like the pair she gave me and 3 workout tops (one a very pretty coral color)...all from the ladies department...I really need to think about this...

[Beverley Sims]

I think your wife has an idea about you or likes seeing you in neat workout clothes, just wear what you are given and see what transpires.

[Shawna]

I think that's exactly what I'm going to do, Beverly...excited to see where this all leads...

[docrobbysherry]

I don't know your wife, Shawna. So, I don't have a clue.:straightface:

U know her better than any of us. So, if u don't know what's going on, why not ask her!?:thumbsup:

[Eemz]

We all see other people's relationships through a filter of our own past experiences, and I always acknowledge in these threads that mine was bad, but that said...

I think you should talk now before this thing gets too big in your head and you lose the plot. It doesn't have to be a big drama, just acknowledge that you've noticed she's buying you these things and that you appreciate it (she knows you do or she wouldn't have bought more, regardless of whether she suspects about Shawna or not). And see where it goes from there.

You said yourself you're "feminizing your look". She's not blind... it doesn't mean she knows about Shawna necessarily, but she knows *something* is going on and she loves you and wants to know what's happening in your head & heart. If you don't communicate she'll start to get hurt and angry, you'll start to get paranoid and that combination ain't going anywhere good. I think she is offering you a chance to talk and you should take it. I don't think it's a cat and mouse game yet, but it will turn into one if she starts to feel that you're hiding something and this is the only way she can find out what it is. Is it another woman? Are you on drugs? What's so awful that you can't tell me?

YMMV. My experience is that everyone gets paranoid if someone else is behaving oddly and won't say why.

[Ineke Vashon]

OK - so I'm really beginning to wonder...my wife just returned from shopping and bought me 3 pairs of workout pants just like the pair she gave me and 3 workout tops (one a very pretty coral color)...all from the ladies department...I really need to think about this...

If it were me I'd say "thanks sweetheart". Enjoy wearing them in front of her. Without necessarily needing to think about it. I would let nature takes its course. Your wife knows you are wearing garments from the ladies department. If she likes you in them she'll let you know. If she asks do you like wearing what I bought you I'd say yes, very much. And see what develops. The idea of 'hint', hint turns me off. Besides, that leaves you in the weaker position.

Good luck,
Ineke

[char GG]

Is there a specific reason you are keeping this secret from her? Do you believe that dropping “hints” will help your cause? Do you want her to figure you out on her own? Not sure why you are asking strangers on a forum rather than having a frank conversation with your wife.

From what you have shared in this post, it sounds like she cares about you a lot. Just my opinion, it would be the respectful thing to do to tell her what is going on. You know your wife best. Not sure how hurt she would be if you continue this charade and she finds out later.

[KatrinaK]

I think she already knows and is giving you an opportunity to be forthcoming. The pants are one thing because they fit you and you like them, but the tops from the women’s department feel like she’s giving you a big, open, opportunity to come clean in a safe environment. I agree with Char that there’s a lot of love there. You have to follow your gut about when the right time is, but it feels like you’re being given an opportunity here.

[DaisyLawrence]

Is there a specific reason you are keeping this secret from her? Do you believe that dropping “hints” will help your cause? Do you want her to figure you out on her own? Not sure why you are asking strangers on a forum rather than having a frank conversation with your wife.

From what you have shared in this post, it sounds like she cares about you a lot. Just my opinion, it would be the respectful thing to do to tell her what is going on. You know your wife best. Not sure how hurt she would be if you continue this charade and she finds out later.

:yt: That's your answer right there.

[Macey]

As a guess … I'd say by now your wife is signaling to you her knowledge of your crossdressing, giving tacit approval, yet graciously allowing you to maintain plausible deniability in deference to your feelings and out of concern that the topic might be difficult for you to openly discuss with her.

Might be time to open up to her directly and praise her sensitivity as you do. Clearly she cares about you a lot, whatever she knows or doesn't know. I say go for it. It might help her express any lingering questions she may have and also open up a new world for the both of you!

[Kas]

If she bought you women’s tops, then it is obvious she doesn’t care about your CDing. In my opinion you’ve been given the green light, so GO!!

[Micki_Finn]

Sounds like you’re hoping she’ll “figure it out on her own” so you won’t have to tell her yourself. 100% the wrong approach. Tell her before and things will go smoother.

[EllieOPKS]

I would suggest you tell her how much you love the clothes she bought you. She will most likely buy you more. I am speaking from experience. In a good relationship you both want to do things that pleases the other. I have for years bought my wife very sexy lingerie because she likes it. I also put on a pair of her panties after a Romantic encounter. I told her how good they felt and in a couple of days I had 3 new pair in my dresser. As far as telling her about the full Ellie, I don't think I personally could feel comfortable sitting across the table from her. But that's me. You have to decide where your own comfort level is at. But trust me if you want more clothes tell her how much you love the stuff she got you. 😉

[ambigendrous]

You need to take the quote in your avatar to heart - don't play with her! Be honest: most wives really appreciate honesty in their men...

[Maid_Marion]

It is best not to keep secrets. If she finds out on her own she will wonder what else you are hiding. Chances are, any limits she sets won't be any worse that the current situation.

[Alyssa Lane]

Sounds like your wife knows more then you think.

[Kas]

If she finds out on her own she will wonder what else you are hiding.

I don’t believe this is true at all. I think the majority of women understand how hard it is/would be, to come out about something like this. I doubt they would automatically assume you are hiding other things as well...

[Glenda58]

Don't read to much into it. My wife were on a trip on the another side of the state shopping. She went into a women's clothing store as I stood outside when it started to rain. I went in the store she was buying a rain coat for herself and told me to get one for me. They only had women things so I got a nice rain coat. I still have it but she doesn't like me wearing it with her. She has done this a few times also.

[confused_cathreen]

I don’t believe this is true at all. I think the majority of women understand how hard it is/would be, to come out about something like this. I doubt they would automatically assume you are hiding other things as well...

Oh gee, you couldn't be more wrong Kas, I am afraid. It's not an automatic assumption, it's the truth. You HAVE been hiding and you COULD be hiding a million things more. I haven't personally regained one gram of trust back for my partner and it's been 6 months now. This hide and seek you are playing up can have disastrous concequences the longer you are playing it. Of course I do understand his struggle now but that doesn't justify the deception. Oh, and in case you were wondering, I knew about the underwear for years. When he told me the extend of it, I was stunned. His excuses of thinking I knew sounded ridiculous. And they still sound ridiculous today. 99% chance your wife has no idea and if you approach this thinking she does, you got a rougher road ahead of you than you can imagine. Clear words explaining what you are, are the only way to ever come out to her. IF this is your intent, of course. If it's not, please do both of you a favour and stop thinking she's got an ulterior motive. Chances are, she doesn't and this is all in your head. I am sorry if I sound harsh but seriously, this has to stop at some point and those who choose to have a partner in their lives must respect their partners enough to give them a choice as well. Good luck whatever you choose to do.

[pamela7]

Yes, with modern society programmed to apply the rules of the game of "crime and punishment", once proven to have deceived, unfortunately nothing else is assumed true; more deception is assumed. Empathy and putting oneself in others' shoes are in short supply, so while yes some women can and do understand, most will not; not at all.

However, the OP's later responses show that their wife is at least tacitly acknowledging some level of crossdressing, and might well be "just giving enough rope for the truth to come out". As long as it is CD-only, I can imagine she will be fine with whichever, but if the deeper truth is transition, then all bets are off, imho.

[Elizabeth G]

If she bought you women’s tops, then it is obvious she doesn’t care about your CDing. In my opinion you’ve been given the green light, so GO!!

I hope this was response wasn't serious.

[Kas]

I hope this was response wasn't serious.
If your wife buys you a complete women’s outfit, for you to wear, then you would assume she is ok with you wearing women’s clothing (crossdressing), no?

[Eemz]

I don't know, I think I might feel like Cathreen on this... it's not even the thing itself at some point (unless it's a crime or something truly awful)... it's... do I really know you at all? How can I trust anything else you've ever told me? You're my partner and you've been keeping this from me for 10 years... how can I believe, well, anything? I could maybe get over it, but it would be a long climb back...

Note to the OP - I'm not saying that's what's happening in your case, just responding to Cathreen's thoughts in general.

[Maid_Marion]

In my case, she started it by suggesting I wear women's tops as boys and men's tops look terrible on my body. She was worried about my work clothes fashion and the difficulty keeping a job through middle age. Then "I just did it." I bought VS PJs online and wore them to bed as soon as they came in the mail. No hiding. Later, as our relationship changed due to her declining health, she was the one who brought up the topic of underdressing. I didn't act on it, but it was now an option for me. It certainly helped that I talked about my interest in transgender issues before we got married. Which is pretty much where the line in the sand was drawn. We need to talk before HRT.

[Aunt Kelly]

Cathreen has nailed it, IMO. Everyone should read her post and take it to heart.

[Kas]

Oh gee, you couldn't be more wrong Kas, I am afraid. It's not an automatic assumption, it's the truth. You HAVE been hiding and you COULD be hiding a million things more. I haven't personally regained one gram of trust back for my partner and it's been 6 months now. This hide and seek you are playing up can have disastrous concequences the longer you are playing it. Of course I do understand his struggle now but that doesn't justify the deception. Oh, and in case you were wondering, I knew about the underwear for years. When he told me the extend of it, I was stunned. His excuses of thinking I knew sounded ridiculous. And they still sound ridiculous today. 99% chance your wife has no idea and if you approach this thinking she does, you got a rougher road ahead of you than you can imagine. Clear words explaining what you are, are the only way to ever come out to her. IF this is your intent, of course. If it's not, please do both of you a favour and stop thinking she's got an ulterior motive. Chances are, she doesn't and this is all in your head. I am sorry if I sound harsh but seriously, this has to stop at some point and those who choose to have a partner in their lives must respect their partners enough to give them a choice as well. Good luck whatever you choose to do.

Sorry but I still disagree. Unless you asked your partner if he crossdresses and he said no, when in reality he does, then it is not lying or even hiding it. Maybe it’s just me, but I would like to think that if you are in a loving relationship with your SO, then a simple choice of clothing should not affect how you see them. Obviously, such as your case, you are not open minded about things like this, but many are and I know from experience.

If you found out your SO liked to eat a food that you were not aware they liked, according to you, they are HIDING that fact and therefore must be hiding a million other things too. Seriously, If you lose THAT much trust in someone you love, JUST because they didn’t disclose voluntarily their like in a certain type of CLOTHING, then that is not their problem. It’s yours.

Oh and by the way, I am lucky enough to have an open minded partner who accepts and supports me (unlike your partner). You know how she found out? I got caught. And you know what else? She didn’t care because it’s just clothing...

[confused_cathreen]

Sorry but I still disagree. Unless you asked your partner if he crossdresses and he said no, when in reality he does, then it is not lying or even hiding it. Maybe it’s just me, but I would like to think that if you are in a loving relationship with your SO, then a simple choice of clothing should not affect how you see them....

I got caught. And you know what else? She didn’t care because it’s just clothing...

So in your opinion, every relationship should include a set of interrogation questions, such as "did you cheat on me while you were out with your buddies?" every time one goes out or "did you happen to commit a crime while you popped out to the shops?" since if they are not asked, then no deception has happened? And I see that you failed to take responsibility for your actions since you got caught and not come clean. And still refuse to do so. Additionally, if it's just clothes, the simple choice of what you wear shouldn't affect how you see yourself. Please understand that my beef is not with you Kas, your right to live your life with whatever set of morals or lack of that you want (by the way, whether I am open minded or not was again an assumption on your part since you don't know me). I am trying to stop this perpetuating myth of "hiding is not lying" and "if they love you, clothes shouldn't matter". Any new member who sees this and is in the closet might be looking for any justification of why they should stay in there. And you are providing this justification. From a woman's point of view who never had a relationship with a crossdresser before, if you present as male, we assume that we get involved with a male in appearance and in identity. That's the danger of assumptions. So OP, think of this if you are going to make an assumption about whether your wife knows or not. Because if you get it wrong, the joke will be on both of you, not just on her.

[Crissy 107]

Shawna, There are signs that she knows, you need to talk sooner rather then later. I feel you will be better off for it. Crissy

[Kas]

And I see that you failed to take responsibility for your actions since you got caught and not come clean. And still refuse to do so.

Umm did you even read my last paragraph? Still refuse to do so? What???

Also, not sure if you’re aware, but many people actually WANT to stay in the closet for various reasons and there is no reason why we should be trying to persuade them to come out. It goes both ways.

I don’t have an issue with you either. It just bothered me that other members are saying that your opinion is the truth, when I know from first hand experience that it is not. I also do not want new guests or new members to come on here and get the impression that if you get caught dressing, your relationship is instantly ruined or has to change in any way.

[TiffanyTgirl]

My guess is she suspects something. To me, the ladies tops, one in an obvious ladies color. is the tip off. BUT, suspecting something and total acceptance are quite a distance apart. I hesitate to suggest how to move forward. It sounds like you want her to know, like driving in the rain, proceed with caution

[Shawna]

I want to thank everyone for voicing their advice, concerns and opinions to what has become a bit of a divisive thread. I know without a doubt that (if for no other reason than I love my wife) that I'll need to share my whole life with her. How and when is still a bit uncertain, but I believe that (knowing myself) I won't be ever be truly free as long as there is such a huge secret. So thank you again, my sisters... ALL of you, because I truly appreciate everyone's opinions and points of view.

[Aunt Kelly]

Sorry but I still disagree. Unless you asked your partner if he crossdresses and he said no, when in reality he does, then it is not lying or even hiding it.
Oh please... You can't seriously suggest that every crossdresser here, who has taken all the elaborate and deliberate steps which we hear so commonly in this forum, to keep that knowledge from their SO, is not hiding something? That is preposterous on it's face. "OMG! What are you wearing?" is a far cry from, "I didn't know that you liked liver and onions."

Congratulations on having such wonderfully accepting SO. I have one too, but I would never be so myopic as to assume that a deception such as the one were discussing will always end as it has for you.

[ellbee]

...JUST because they didn’t disclose voluntarily their like in a certain type of CLOTHING...

Not to nit-pick, but... :D


Many CD'ers here (and elsewhere) apparently love to get *completely* dolled-up. And that includes any or all of the following, in addition to the clothing: Wig, make-up, body-enhancers, jewelry, perfume, painted nails, shaved body, purses, etc.

Heck, some even "up" their game even more, to include voice, posture, movement, name, social media, whatever.


IOW, it's more than just the clothing, for those -- it's about taking on the full female presentation (or at least how they view that).

And at that point, it's more-or-less a new identity, of sorts... At least to an outside observer.


What you describe, with just a "certain type of clothing," IMO, is more of a MIAD situation -- and *not* your typical femmed-up CD'er.

So, yeah. There is a wee bit of a difference, there. ;)

And definitely one that may make a wife/GF a bit "concerned" about the whole she-bang.




Anyway, to the OP...


Take your situation for what it's worth. Nothing more, nothing less.

Sounds like perhaps she just likes your guy-self, but a bit more feminized. With work-out clothing from the GG section, at that. Maybe she likes how it looks on you, how it feels to her touch, how more relaxed it makes you, etc. Hey, as a bit of a women's activewear aficionado, myself, I can't say I necessarily blame her! :devil:


Heck, maybe it's even just a passing phase, for her. That it's a slightly different spin on things that she finds interesting & fun -- at least for the time being.

Of course, how she feels today about it, is no guarantee that she'll feel the same way in a year, in 3 months, or even next week! :heehee:


And, of course, there is a BIG difference between comfortably lounging around in women's activewear (in guy-mode) on a lazy Sunday afternoon at home -- versus getting all dolled-up to the nines on a Saturday night, ya know?

Might want to keep that in mind. ;)


Good luck! :)

[Alyssa Lane]

If your wife buys you a complete women’s outfit, for you to wear, then you would assume she is ok with you wearing women’s clothing (crossdressing), no?

You definitely can’t assume anything unless you ask, sure that could make the walls come tumbling down but that is just the fact of being a responsible adult. If she buys you things ask her why? It might get the ball rolling.
And yes, not disclosing large things can be a deal breaker, not just things you like, but just the image you put off, like if you hunt and she is a vegetarian, you can lead a horse to water but you can’t make it drink.

[sometimes_miss]

My ex wife once told me that my skin felt like sandpaper, and handed me a bottle of Vaseline skin lotion. This was not an endorsement of my crossdressing; it was a request to me not to feel like I was scraping her skin off every time I rubbed against her.

[KatrinaK]

100% agree with Cathreen. I've said it before and I'll say it again...

The ONLY position of integrity is to be honest and forthcoming with your spouse/SO in all aspects of your life, particularly this one.

[nancymo4242]

It could all be a coincidence. She might have just wanted you to have her spare pants, since pants like these are mostly unisex anyway, and she could have wanted you to have smoother skin. Sounds legit, right?
However...
I can bet money that she at least has had a couple of hints all over those 20 years, that you're dressing.
I do believe that women can spy and find things out about you better than the FBI or the CIA.
For real though, she must know something. But you shouldn't confront her about it just yet. Wait to see if she drops more clues, or just tells you to go dress up because you'll both go shopping for bikinis!
Just let it come naturally...

[Jenn A116]

I'm with the folks here that say its time to discuss this openly with your wife. There should be free communication between spouses on all subjects.

[nikkiwindsor]

My life has been much better since completely opening up to my wife about my feminine side...but it's not easy...that's for sure

[AKADonna]

I agree with Char GG! When my wife of 28 years caught me in panties, she had a real come-apart. At first, she thought I was gay, then that I had another lover, etc, etc. When she finally settled down (weeks later), we had the discussion about me wanting to explore my feminine side and she pretty much understood that. It turns out that she was far more upset about me keeping this from her for many years and not feeling comfortable enough with her to openly discuss it sooner.

I think that you need to find a way to open up a similar discussion, perhaps using the new workout pants and tops as a launching point, and be prepared to apologize to her for delaying bringing it up to her for so long. Handle that upfront! I think that doing this will give you the best possibility of success!